--- Log opened Mon Mar 01 00:00:51 2010 |
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SDuensin_ | Greetings. | 16:31 |
+bartjol | morning | 16:33 |
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SDuensin_ | AH HA! Got rid of him! | 16:38 |
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Diggy | hi, folks. hope at least 1 webgui dev is here | 17:27 |
SDuensin | Probably more like a dozen. | 17:27 |
Diggy | Q - are there any plans to produce an up-to-date webgui VM? | 17:27 |
Diggy | a dozen! yikes | 17:28 |
Diggy | perhaps a VM for the 7.8 series? | 17:29 |
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SDuensin | Hey perlDreamer! | 17:29 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, you are excused from all current, future and past comments about LOI | 17:29 |
SDuensin | Diggy has a good question... | 17:29 |
+perlDreamer | Diggy, what's your question this morning? | 17:30 |
SDuensin | Any chance of the VM being updated for 7.8? | 17:30 |
Diggy | about plans for an updated webgui VM | 17:30 |
Diggy | last vm was done in early '09, IIRC | 17:30 |
bartjol | perlDreamer: so no more info needed, too bad... | 17:30 |
+perlDreamer | the VM can be updated manually by downloading the current one and running the webgui updater | 17:30 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, what's the red thing? | 17:31 |
bartjol | an expension barrel for the heating | 17:31 |
Diggy | unfortunately, my attempts at updating it have failed | 17:31 |
SDuensin | Diggy - Oh? How so? | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | how are you updating it, Diggy? | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | and what errors do you get? | 17:31 |
Diggy | with the wre. it's been a while since i last tried | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | you can only update via the WRE if you stay up to date with it | 17:32 |
Diggy | again, apologies, as it's been a while since i tried to upgrade | 17:32 |
+perlDreamer | otherwise, you have to manually download and upgrade | 17:32 |
+perlDreamer | it wouldn't hurt us to update that, though | 17:33 |
SDuensin | You should be able to run the webguiupdate script and then the testEnvironment script. | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | SD, not really | 17:33 |
SDuensin | No? | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | webguiupdate is not smart enough to stop at the right points | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | it downloads the latest and greatest and tries that | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | which will fail miserably | 17:33 |
Diggy | i did use the script. IRC channel users helped me, but in the end, failure :-( | 17:33 |
* SDuensin sighs | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | so, if you start at 7.6.32 | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | you update to 7.6.35 | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | then 7.7.33 | 17:34 |
+perlDreamer | then 7.8.13 | 17:34 |
SDuensin | Glad I had this little talk prior to going to 7.8.x. :-) | 17:34 |
bartjol | ah, scott, you need some other talks? | 17:34 |
+perlDreamer | I wonder if the wiki has that little gem of info | 17:34 |
+perlDreamer | there is an open bug to fix that | 17:34 |
SDuensin | bartjol, I need all the help I can get. :-D | 17:35 |
Diggy | are you recommending that i try that sequence? | 17:35 |
+perlDreamer | Diggy, sure | 17:35 |
+perlDreamer | also, Diggy, would you please file a bug about updating the VM? | 17:35 |
Diggy | ok. will try (as soon as time permits :-) ), and report back | 17:36 |
+perlDreamer | that will raise it to the attention of the proper people | 17:36 |
Diggy | sure, i'll file a bug report | 17:36 |
Diggy | thanks, and ttfn | 17:36 |
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SDuensin | There's too many interesting cool package formats out there. I want WebGUI in all of them for people! | 17:37 |
SDuensin | VMware appliance, OpenVZ template, that application standard thing - not to mention the usual DEB, RPM, etc. | 17:37 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, in the -930 picture, what are all those pipes for? | 17:42 |
+perlDreamer | doesn't a sink have hot, cold, and drain, and that's it? | 17:42 |
bartjol | eeeh, i'll have a look | 17:43 |
bartjol | and then make fun of you | 17:44 |
* perlDreamer braces for public humiliation | 17:44 |
bartjol | well, that's my heating thingy | 17:44 |
+perlDreamer | so that's not the bottom of the sink | 17:45 |
+perlDreamer | makes much more sense | 17:45 |
bartjol | so it has to have piping for gas, cold water (in), warm water (out) heating in and out | 17:45 |
bartjol | yeah | 17:45 |
* perlDreamer will take the children to school, and ponder more | 17:45 |
bartjol | 955 is the sink | 17:45 |
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+perlDreamer | bartjol: I knew that 955 was the sink, but 930 looks like it's from the same place, in the corner | 17:57 |
bartjol | it is more just above 952 | 18:00 |
bartjol | or better maybe: http://www.bartjol.nl/home/fotoalbums/fortos/klus20091116/dsc00678 | 18:01 |
+perlDreamer | ah, yes | 18:06 |
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+perlDreamer | we have one of those tankless water heaters, too | 18:12 |
+perlDreamer | very efficient | 18:12 |
SDuensin | Database design hurts my head. | 18:15 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r587f080 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Subscribable aspect should propagate result of purge, instead of always returning false. Fixes bug #11446 - http://bit.ly/97WdkX | 18:31 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rb462ce0 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Subscribable aspect should propagate result of purge, instead of always returning false. Fixes bug #11446 - http://bit.ly/bSzWKC | 18:31 |
+perlDreamer | preaction: ping | 18:42 |
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+perlDreamer | patspam, you up for a dev level idea bouncing talk? | 18:45 |
+patspam | shoot | 18:45 |
+perlDreamer | it's the spectre bug | 18:46 |
+perlDreamer | with the mail workflow | 18:46 |
+patspam | got the number on hand? | 18:46 |
+perlDreamer | two of them | 18:46 |
+perlDreamer | this is the "latest" one: http://www.webgui.org/use/bugs/tracker/11444 | 18:46 |
+perlDreamer | and here's the historical one: http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/10189 | 18:47 |
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+patspam | yep, I've experienced that too | 18:49 |
+perlDreamer | okay, so this is my theory | 18:49 |
+perlDreamer | Spectre recognizes that it's time to run the cron job | 18:49 |
+perlDreamer | and calls www_runCronJob in Operation/Cron | 18:49 |
+perlDreamer | www_runCronJob builds an instance of the workflow | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | and tries to talk to spectre | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | but it can't | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | the instance is NEVER cleaned up | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | so it sits in the db, blocking all further invocations, since it's a singleton workflow | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | the core problem seems to be that the return value of $instance->start(1) is not checked | 18:51 |
+patspam | I've never really trawled through the spectre code, but that sounds reasonable | 18:52 |
+perlDreamer | I'll see if I can outfit a few sites with some test code, and then disable their spectre restart cron cobs | 18:53 |
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+perlDreamer | if this is right, there's about 1 day of spectre relating hacking that needs to be done | 19:00 |
+perlDreamer | since none of the spectre comm code returns a status | 19:00 |
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+patspam | sorry, doing some bug triaging here too | 19:03 |
+patspam | the kind where people report something, and then when you look everything appears perfectly fine | 19:04 |
bartjol | but I thought Martin made spectre, how can there be errors? | 19:04 |
+perlDreamer | I thought JT wrote spectre, and that Martin just named it | 19:05 |
bartjol | mmm, that might be, explains a lot :) | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | ;) | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | patspam, I hate those kinds of bugs | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | we had one of those today | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | with deleting a wiki | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | if you delete a wiki and purge it, it works fine | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | but try deleting a page containing a wiki, and it's not | 19:06 |
bartjol | but it's laundry time, I am even looking forward to it | 19:06 |
+patspam | fun | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | martien, kimd, faxioman have definitely joined elnino in the bug reporting elite | 19:07 |
+perlDreamer | they are thoughtful, detailed, and patient | 19:07 |
+patspam | yeah that's awesome | 19:07 |
+patspam | I wish my clients were like that | 19:07 |
bartjol | actually testing, instead of getting back a year later with a mention that "it is all broken" | 19:08 |
bartjol | that'd be nice | 19:08 |
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@Haarg | perlDreamer, the getCache asset method can't be merged into webgui 8 directly. i was thinking of replacing it with a getViewCacheKey method. | 19:26 |
+perlDreamer | why can't it be merged? | 19:27 |
+perlDreamer | also, I thought getCache was a session method | 19:28 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rc0d45e0 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Remove workarounds in WeatherData. Fixes bug #11401. - http://bit.ly/drRnhH | 19:58 |
@Haarg | it can't be merged because it returns a cache object with a specific key. but you don't construct a cache object per key anymore. | 20:00 |
+perlDreamer | patspam: the TAP modules required by the Survey cannot be installed piecemeal, correct? You have to fully upgrade to Test::Harness 3.x | 20:01 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, it sounds like it can be removed, and replace by session->getCache | 20:02 |
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* perlDreamer goes out for errands | 20:34 |
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+perlDreamer | well, at least the guts of Asset->getCache could be removed. | 21:40 |
@Haarg | getting rid of the duplicate code is a good idea, it's just that the cache api is going to be very different. which is why i was thinking getViewCacheKey. | 21:42 |
@Haarg | although it would be better if the cache api was finalized | 21:42 |
@Haarg | we could have $asset->computeViewCache(sub { }, $timeout) | 21:43 |
@Haarg | or something along those lines | 21:43 |
+perlDreamer | anyway we can abstract that out, and keep it insultated from this change, and future changes, will help | 21:44 |
@Haarg | does computeViewCache sound like a good idea? or would there be a better name for it? | 21:45 |
@Haarg | or does getViewCacheKey sound like a better approach? | 21:46 |
+perlDreamer | if it's returning a key, it should have that in the name | 21:46 |
+perlDreamer | so I vote for getViewCacheKey | 21:46 |
@Haarg | well, computeViewCache would be returning the cache data | 21:46 |
@Haarg | or calling the sub if there was no cache data | 21:47 |
@Haarg | and storing the return from the sub in the cache | 21:47 |
+perlDreamer | yes, but in some view methods getCache is used to grab a cache object to stuff data into it | 21:48 |
+perlDreamer | not just access what might (or might not) be there | 21:48 |
@Haarg | i'm not sure i follow. that is exactly the case i am talking about. | 21:48 |
@Haarg | with computeViewCache, it would first try to get the cache data and return it if it was available | 21:49 |
@Haarg | if it wasn't, it would call the sub that was passed in to generate the needed output, then store that in the cache and return it | 21:49 |
+perlDreamer | ah, I missed the last part | 21:49 |
+perlDreamer | and the method used to generate the needed output would not be $self->view, but $self->view minus the permission checks, cache code, etc. | 21:50 |
@Haarg | yeah, basically | 21:51 |
+perlDreamer | seems odd to push down one level like that. Almost like we could replace prepareView with that, or something | 21:55 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg: how do I make a clone of the metaclass-roles branch to try and tinker with it? | 22:02 |
@Haarg | do you have my repo as a remote? | 22:02 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 22:02 |
+perlDreamer | but this: git checkout -b metaclass-roles --track haarg/metaclass-roles | 22:03 |
+perlDreamer | does this: fatal: git checkout: updating paths is incompatible with switching branches | 22:03 |
@Haarg | what about just git checkout -t haarg/metaclass-roles | 22:03 |
@Haarg | ? | 22:03 |
+perlDreamer | same thing | 22:04 |
@Haarg | git --version | 22:04 |
+perlDreamer | 1.6.3.3 | 22:04 |
@Haarg | git remote update | 22:05 |
+perlDreamer | updated, but the checkout still doesn't work | 22:06 |
+perlDreamer | maybe I misconfigured the remote? | 22:06 |
@Haarg | git branch -r | grep haarg | 22:06 |
+perlDreamer | haarg/bart-i18n | 22:06 |
@Haarg | git remote haarg | nopaste | 22:07 |
+perlDreamer | http://gist.github.com/318755 | 22:08 |
@Haarg | git fetch haarg | 22:09 |
+perlDreamer | k | 22:09 |
@Haarg | i'm really not sure why it isn't updating | 22:09 |
+perlDreamer | I'll go running and see if maybe it's some github transient issue | 22:10 |
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+perlDreamer | haarg, I figured it out | 23:55 |
@Haarg | oh? | 23:56 |
+perlDreamer | when I created the remote, I used the -t switch | 23:56 |
+perlDreamer | it would only use the bart-i18n branch | 23:56 |
+perlDreamer | so I dropped that remote and added a new one | 23:56 |
@Haarg | ah | 23:56 |
@Haarg | making an attempt at merging master into WebGUI8 | 23:57 |
+perlDreamer | good luck | 23:58 |
--- Day changed Tue Mar 02 2010 |
+perlDreamer | mlri's server, server36 | 00:25 |
+perlDreamer | every config file has that in it | 00:25 |
@preaction | perlDreamer: the ^StorageUrl(); macro can be given a storageId and will return a URL (for use in SQLReports and the like) | 00:37 |
+perlDreamer | really?! | 00:37 |
@preaction | yep | 00:37 |
@preaction | it's even got some nice config options for various things | 00:38 |
+perlDreamer | must be time for me to review all the macros again | 00:38 |
+perlDreamer | what if there are multiple files in the storage location, though? | 00:40 |
@preaction | it grabs the first one fsvo first | 00:41 |
@preaction | perlbot fsvo | 00:42 |
@preaction | perlbot fsvo is For Some Value Of | 00:42 |
@preaction | perlbot botsnack | 00:42 |
@preaction | perlbot fsvo | 00:42 |
@preaction | ... wtf | 00:42 |
@preaction | perlbot, fsvo | 00:42 |
perlbot | preaction: For Some Value Of | 00:42 |
@preaction | ah | 00:43 |
+perlDreamer | the first one "asciibetically", according to the POD ;) | 00:44 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * reea83d5 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Fix macro issues, missing FilePump, HASH entry. Fixes bug #11449. - http://bit.ly/9TSsZJ | 01:02 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r9256928 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Fix macro issues, missing FilePump, HASH entry. Fixes bug #11449. - http://bit.ly/dmMdVC | 01:04 |
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* perlDreamer has to go pick up the kids from school, back in 30 | 01:17 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg: http://gist.github.com/318965 | 02:07 |
+perlDreamer | it's almost like we have different versions of Moose installed | 02:09 |
+perlDreamer | those subs don't exist, and the options have different names | 02:09 |
+perlDreamer | this one's cleaner, and has more option corrections http://gist.github.com/318976 | 02:21 |
+perlDreamer | I love the Moose stack trace, but it would be so much nicer if the reference were pretty printed | 02:36 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg: this patch gets all the way down into the Shortcut asset, then dies due to a missing fieldType in a property http://gist.github.com/318994 | 02:44 |
+perlDreamer | the fieldType is defined in the property, and it's the first one called so it seems like someplace the fieldType is getting lost | 02:44 |
+perlDreamer | I think the problem is Definition::Meta::Class, _build_property_metaclass | 03:11 |
+perlDreamer | it's not setting the property metaclass correctly | 03:11 |
+perlDreamer | this causes everything to be stuck inside form | 03:11 |
+perlDreamer | and not get to the property, which then complains about not getting a fieldType | 03:11 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, I got it! | 03:28 |
+perlDreamer | I'll paste a patch after dinner | 03:28 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg: http://gist.github.com/319042 | 04:02 |
+perlDreamer | the last piece was, inside add_property, it was calling $prop_meta->meta | 04:02 |
@Haarg | where are you seeing the for vs for_class change needed? | 04:02 |
+perlDreamer | in the calls to the Utility methods | 04:02 |
+perlDreamer | it's in the patch | 04:03 |
@Haarg | looks like it should just be for given the Moose::Util::MetaRole docs | 04:03 |
@Haarg | what version of Moose do you have installed? | 04:04 |
+perlDreamer | 0.93 | 04:04 |
@Haarg | i have 0.98 | 04:04 |
+perlDreamer | let's change testEnvironment.pl, and I'll upgrade to your version | 04:05 |
+perlDreamer | with that change, the only change needed should be removing the inherited is from Meta::Property::Asset | 04:06 |
+perlDreamer | and the $prop_meta->meta thing | 04:06 |
+perlDreamer | I wonder if that's going to happen everywhere the sub names were different | 04:08 |
+perlDreamer | and option names | 04:08 |
@Haarg | option names? | 04:08 |
+perlDreamer | metaclass_roles vs class_metaroles | 04:09 |
@Haarg | http://search.cpan.org/~drolsky/Moose-0.98/lib/Moose/Util/MetaRole.pm | 04:09 |
+perlDreamer | we're going to have to watch Moose very carefully | 04:10 |
+perlDreamer | okay, now I'm getting exactly what you said earlier | 04:18 |
+perlDreamer | the property meta isn't being set correctly for Assets | 04:18 |
@Haarg | what happens with your full patch applied but the new moose version? | 04:18 |
+perlDreamer | don't know | 04:20 |
+perlDreamer | massive chaos, since the sub names and options are all from the earlier version | 04:20 |
+perlDreamer | that's what I would guess | 04:20 |
@Haarg | the earlier stuff all still works | 04:21 |
@Haarg | i'm trying to finish up this section of the merge i'm working on so i can test stuff out. | 04:21 |
@Haarg | perlDreamer, i applied your patch and it fails with the tableName problem | 04:42 |
+perlDreamer | that's running t/Definition/Asset.t | 05:02 |
@Haarg | yes | 05:03 |
+perlDreamer | Definition's init_meta gets called after Definition:Asset's init_meta | 05:06 |
+perlDreamer | unless that's a testing artifact | 05:07 |
@Haarg | Definition::Asset->init_meta calls Definition->init_meta | 05:08 |
+perlDreamer | yes, but it's getting called a 2nd time somehow | 05:10 |
+perlDreamer | and when it gets called the 2nd time, it's overwriting the applied classes, removing the ones set up by WebGUI::Definition::Asset | 05:13 |
+perlDreamer | WebGUI::Definition is a role | 05:29 |
+perlDreamer | and it's used by Definition::Asset; | 05:30 |
+perlDreamer | I think it's applying the init_meta to every class that uses Definition::Asset | 05:30 |
+perlDreamer | so that it gets called | 05:30 |
+perlDreamer | so it calls Definition::Asset, which calls Definition and then does it's specific configuration | 05:30 |
+perlDreamer | then it calls Definition's init_meta again, and that overwrites the base role and metaroles | 05:31 |
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elnino | hi! | 05:52 |
elnino | when you put in multiple anchors in an article, is there a GUI way to link to it from another article? | 05:53 |
elnino | does that make sense? | 05:55 |
+perlDreamer | it does, but there's no GUI way to link to any of them | 05:55 |
+perlDreamer | not that I know of | 05:55 |
elnino | ok. I didn't think so, but thought I'd ask anyway | 05:56 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, the second call to WebGUI::Definition->init_meta is being provided by Moose::Exporter | 08:08 |
+perlDreamer | it's like it's calling init_meta up the stack | 08:08 |
+perlDreamer | using linearized_isa | 08:08 |
@Haarg | well, it can't be that because there is no inheritance | 08:09 |
@Haarg | it's probably the 'with' | 08:09 |
@Haarg | sorry, 'also' | 08:10 |
+perlDreamer | removing also removes the sugar | 08:13 |
+perlDreamer | what I don't get is that we have an init_meta inside WG::D::A | 08:13 |
+perlDreamer | so why do we get 2? | 08:13 |
+perlDreamer | it's there because it's a role | 08:33 |
@Haarg | because what is a role? | 08:33 |
+perlDreamer | WebGUI::Definition | 08:34 |
@Haarg | not realy | 08:34 |
+perlDreamer | with no inheritance, how else could there be two of them? | 08:34 |
@Haarg | two of what? | 08:34 |
+perlDreamer | init_meta methods | 08:35 |
@Haarg | WebGUI::Definition's gets called because of the 'also' | 08:36 |
@Haarg | and because we explicitly call it | 08:36 |
+perlDreamer | I'm shot | 08:41 |
+perlDreamer | I'm going to call it a night. | 08:41 |
@Haarg | i've been confusing myself some | 08:41 |
@Haarg | paying attention to how the role is applied to the metaclass | 08:42 |
@Haarg | forgetting that it's the propery metaclass that is the problem | 08:42 |
+perlDreamer | that's okay, I'm still confused with how you get 2 init_meta methods in 1 package's namespace, without using inheritance | 08:43 |
@Haarg | in one package namespace? | 08:43 |
@Haarg | they don't get exported to the class they are used in | 08:43 |
@Haarg | they are called by import | 08:43 |
@Haarg | ok | 08:44 |
+perlDreamer | so it does keep track of the classes, and calls init_meta in each one | 08:45 |
@Haarg | i changed some other things and was getting the same failures | 08:45 |
@Haarg | remove the + from has 'property_metaroles' and everything works | 08:45 |
@Haarg | (almost) | 08:45 |
@Haarg | not really deep tracking | 08:45 |
@Haarg | WebGUI::Definition::Asset has also => 'WebGUI::Definition' | 08:46 |
@Haarg | so when WebGUI::Definition::import gets called | 08:46 |
@Haarg | it calls the generated $import method | 08:46 |
+perlDreamer | what other changes do you have, that aren't committed | 08:46 |
+perlDreamer | if I remove the +, I get missing fieldType warnings | 08:46 |
@Haarg | which calls init_meta in WebGUI::Definition::Asset because it is defined there, and init_meta in WebGUI::Definition because of the also | 08:47 |
@Haarg | i'm going to try to minimize the changes | 08:47 |
@Haarg | pushed my changes | 08:50 |
+perlDreamer | only 1 failing test | 08:52 |
+perlDreamer | way better than before | 08:52 |
@Haarg | yeah | 08:53 |
@Haarg | that one is likely something i broke when making changes | 08:53 |
@Haarg | some places where it was doing ->isa and i had to do the checks different because ->does and ->does_role weren't working right | 08:54 |
@Haarg | they only work on Moose classes and it seems like some of the metaclasses end up getting created as Class::MOP classes | 08:54 |
@Haarg | and don't have the extra tracking for roles | 08:54 |
+perlDreamer | is that due to the anonymous classes that are created? | 08:56 |
@Haarg | something like that | 08:56 |
@Haarg | if you have a Moose class and apply a role to it that stuff is tracked, but it seems like some of the metaclasses don't. | 08:57 |
+perlDreamer | you think it's a bug? | 08:57 |
@Haarg | i'm not really familiar with cmp_deeply, but it will need to do a different type of check than an isa | 08:57 |
@Haarg | i have no idea | 08:57 |
@Haarg | also, i don't really love the _property_metaclass thing i have in there, but it worked so i left it | 08:59 |
+perlDreamer | we'll have to build something for cmp_deeply, it only provides an isa method by default | 09:04 |
+perlDreamer | but we should be able to construct something that does ->can fairly easily | 09:04 |
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SDuensin | Morning. | 16:38 |
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+bartjol | hi | 16:51 |
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+perlDreamer | bartjol: definitely | 17:03 |
+bartjol | ah, bien | 17:05 |
+bartjol | because I suppose, my part fixes the part of getting the correct language and the replacement of the files the other stuff | 17:06 |
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+bartjol | perlDreamer: my fix works, but might it not be better to create the i18n object, which should be able to provide the abbreviation? | 17:09 |
+perlDreamer | yes, that would probably be better | 17:10 |
+perlDreamer | do you want to alter your patch to do that? | 17:10 |
+bartjol | yes | 17:12 |
+bartjol | I was going to that, but Koen interrupted me by telephone :) | 17:13 |
+perlDreamer | that's what you get for giving him your phone number | 17:16 |
+bartjol | well, it was the number of procolix | 17:18 |
+bartjol | well, it can be very short: | 17:23 |
+bartjol | my $sessionLanguage = $i18n->{_language}; | 17:24 |
+bartjol | my $language = $i18n->getLanguage($sessionLanguage,"languageAbbreviation"); | 17:24 |
+bartjol | the i18n object is already created before :) | 17:24 |
+bartjol | useless to copy that code from sub new in international.pm | 17:24 |
+perlDreamer | there's a way to get ->{_language} through the object, too, yes? | 17:25 |
+bartjol | well, the line I posted | 17:25 |
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+bartjol | you can skip the first line and replace $sessionLanguage in the second line by $i18n->{_language} | 17:26 |
+bartjol | that's the shortest | 17:26 |
+bartjol | and | 17:26 |
+bartjol | the lines with the unless ($language} are obsolete I believe | 17:27 |
+bartjol | new defaults to english I believe | 17:27 |
+perlDreamer | I mean, there must be a way through the API to get $i18n->{_language} without peeking inside the object | 17:27 |
+bartjol | oh, you mean like a real get method | 17:27 |
+bartjol | not sure, I was trying to find that | 17:28 |
+perlDreamer | there isn't | 17:29 |
+perlDreamer | I see | 17:29 |
+bartjol | ah, and I was wrong about new | 17:29 |
+perlDreamer | we don't need to pass the language in | 17:29 |
+bartjol | we need the abbreviation | 17:30 |
+perlDreamer | $language = $i18n->get('', 'languageAbbreviation'); | 17:30 |
+bartjol | oh | 17:30 |
+bartjol | sure | 17:30 |
+bartjol | indeed | 17:30 |
+perlDreamer | which means the language should be the 2nd argument | 17:30 |
+bartjol | mmm, maybe there are other circumstances where the 1st is better | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | there shouldn't be, the property name is required, and the language is optional | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | hash based would work okay, too | 17:31 |
+bartjol | well | 17:31 |
+bartjol | I can't really overview the complications | 17:32 |
+bartjol | my $language = $i18n->getLanguage($i18n->{_language},"languageAbbreviation"); looks nice and readable to me though | 17:33 |
+bartjol | and it works | 17:36 |
+perlDreamer | I think the unless code is there to handle broken language packs, without making the rich editor crash | 17:36 |
+bartjol | and spanish isn't my best alnguage | 17:36 |
+perlDreamer | no, it doesn't have any TinyMCE translations | 17:37 |
+bartjol | the default stuff is there | 17:37 |
+bartjol | but not webgui plugin stuff | 17:38 |
+bartjol | but, are we gonna renew all getLanguage calls? | 17:39 |
+perlDreamer | renew? | 17:39 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rbeb1337 / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/RichEdit.pm): Make the RichEditor obey the new session overrides for language settings. Fixes bug #11443. - http://bit.ly/d2uvmd | 17:40 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r85dd7cc / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/RichEdit.pm): Make the RichEditor obey the new session overrides for language settings. Fixes bug #11443. - http://bit.ly/8YBGSn | 17:40 |
+bartjol | if you wanna swap language and the translation ID | 17:40 |
+perlDreamer | oh, no. That would have to happen in WebGUI 8 | 17:41 |
+perlDreamer | and for all I know Haarg has plans to completely change that | 17:41 |
+bartjol | yeah, well, I grepped throuh the code, it's only about 10 entries | 17:42 |
+bartjol | but still | 17:42 |
+bartjol | ok | 17:42 |
+perlDreamer | yes, we could fix the core, but completely break all the custom code out there | 17:42 |
+perlDreamer | which, might help with budgets in the future, but would not make customers happy | 17:43 |
+bartjol | customers? since when are those important? | 17:43 |
+bartjol | well that seems fixed in my site | 17:45 |
+perlDreamer | I went with '' instead of $i18n->{_language} | 17:45 |
+bartjol | and less code in total | 17:45 |
+bartjol | I saw it in git | 17:45 |
+perlDreamer | time to take the kiddos to school | 17:45 |
+bartjol | have fun | 17:45 |
+perlDreamer | okay, kids are taken care of | 18:02 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol is happy | 18:02 |
+perlDreamer | time to work with rogier | 18:02 |
+bartjol | but, any specific reason to let out the $i18n->{_language} ? because it is shorter or quicker? | 18:03 |
+bartjol | just interested | 18:03 |
+bartjol | it is not better readable | 18:03 |
+bartjol | sorry for reopening :) | 18:03 |
+perlDreamer | it breaks object encapsulation, and isn't needed | 18:04 |
+perlDreamer | it's better to use the bad API design than to peek inside the object like that | 18:04 |
+bartjol | I believe you | 18:04 |
+bartjol | not sure why yet | 18:04 |
+bartjol | it is only looking | 18:05 |
+bartjol | it's a matter of not being best practises I suppose | 18:06 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 18:07 |
+perlDreamer | peeking inside objects (when not needed) is bad | 18:07 |
+perlDreamer | because if the object changes, your peeking may break | 18:07 |
+perlDreamer | and then you have to hunt all through the code base to find the breakage | 18:08 |
+perlDreamer | because we don't have enough tests to cover all the code | 18:08 |
+bartjol | doesn't rogier's bug solution also indicated that or used tempalted can't be deleted, or automatical setting change at removal | 18:08 |
+bartjol | ah, ok | 18:08 |
+perlDreamer | there should be a fallback for "critical" operations | 18:08 |
+perlDreamer | so that users don't break their sites badly | 18:09 |
+perlDreamer | so we fix the login templates, but create account and the others will just stay broken | 18:09 |
+perlDreamer | since you could login and fix those | 18:09 |
+bartjol | yeah | 18:10 |
+bartjol | just a way of preventing people like rogier to lock themselves out | 18:10 |
+bartjol | :) | 18:10 |
+bartjol | I suppose I'm one of them cruel sysadmins | 18:10 |
+bartjol | time to go | 18:12 |
+bartjol | thanks for the explanation perlDreamer | 18:12 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * rc31110d / (4 files in 3 dirs): Try to fallback to a default login template if the configured one won't work. Fixes bug #11450. - http://bit.ly/9Ucgvs | 18:51 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r119d513 / (4 files in 3 dirs): Try to fallback to a default login template if the configured one won't work. Fixes bug #11450. - http://bit.ly/9zFOpo | 18:52 |
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dionak | Hi all | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | hey, dionak! | 19:05 |
dionak | how are things in WG land? | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | not too bad | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | we just released 7.8-stable | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | WebGUI 8 work continues on | 19:06 |
dionak | yes, i noticed that. congrads! | 19:06 |
dionak | speaking of upgrades & releases. Quick upgrade question. I'm upgrade a site from 7.5.40 to 7.7.20. I'm following what I think is the prescribed upgrade path. 7.5.40->7.6.35->7.7.20. Did I miss any step? | 19:07 |
dionak | i'm getting the following error: Adding comments asset aspect...DBD::mysql::st execute failed: Table 'assetAspectComments' already exists | 19:07 |
+perlDreamer | how many times did you go through the upgrade? | 19:07 |
dionak | a couple now. i've restored the database and the lib & doc files when starting over | 19:08 |
+perlDreamer | at which step in the upgrade does that happen? | 19:08 |
dionak | copied a fresh version from production (7.5.40) | 19:08 |
dionak | hrspotlight_com 7.5.40-7.6.10 | 19:08 |
dionak | the script makes several db alters before failing on this one | 19:08 |
+perlDreamer | in the 7.5.40, does the assetAspectsComments table exist in the 7.5.40 database? | 19:09 |
+perlDreamer | the other thing that can happen is that when restoring the database, it has to be dropped. | 19:10 |
+perlDreamer | because importing the backup will not delete the newly created tables | 19:10 |
dionak | ah, that's the issue. | 19:10 |
dionak | thanks. i'll make a note | 19:10 |
+perlDreamer | we should stick that in the wiki somewhere | 19:11 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, spent most of the morning doing core bug fixing | 19:17 |
+perlDreamer | I'll have a go at the wg8 tests when I come back from the gym | 19:17 |
@Haarg | cool | 19:18 |
@Haarg | the good part of that test failure in the roles stuff is that it is only a rest failure and the code itself is working afaik | 19:18 |
dionak | i stuck that note in a wiki entry. thanks for the pointer perlDreamer | 19:20 |
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dionak | another question. while running the upgrade from 7.6.35-7.7.17 I get: Reverting use packed... Invalid asset id 'pGyXTw9lAizHICubVyYqEQ' requested! at upgrade_7.6.35-7.7.17.pl line 1448 | 19:50 |
dionak | Is there a utility tool anywhere to check the validity of assetIds? | 19:50 |
dionak | or method? | 20:05 |
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+perlDreamer | dionak, we need a tool like that | 20:40 |
+perlDreamer | it should be a Cron job that runs weekly and alerts admins to broken assets in their sites | 20:41 |
+perlDreamer | that way, they can fix them _before_ doing upgrades | 20:41 |
dionak | yea, that would be handy. i'll keep that in mind | 20:49 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, it would be nice if the classes were sane, but I agree that it's better that they're functional then pretty :) | 20:59 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg: here's the test patch-> http://gist.github.com/319799 | 21:02 |
+perlDreamer | after this, can we merge and start role hackery? | 21:03 |
ckotil | where are you using roles? | 21:05 |
@preaction | the old AssetAspects are becoming Moose::Roles | 21:06 |
ckotil | ah. ive never heard of either :) | 21:06 |
+perlDreamer | AssetAspects provide things like RssFeeds | 21:07 |
+perlDreamer | Installability | 21:07 |
+perlDreamer | Subscribability | 21:07 |
+perlDreamer | etc. | 21:07 |
+perlDreamer | in WebGUI8, they do all that, and more | 21:07 |
@preaction | reusable bits of asset functionality | 21:07 |
ckotil | ah cool | 21:08 |
+perlDreamer | preaction: what's involved in update the VM for WebGUI? | 21:25 |
@preaction | i don't know, never made one | 21:26 |
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@preaction | perlDreamer: my real solution to that login template problem is to put the default webGUI templates on the filesystem, so that they simply cannot be edited OR deleted | 22:49 |
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+perlDreamer | we could just lock them down in the database so they can't be deleted through the UI | 22:55 |
@preaction | yeah, but still annoying to edit default templates and no way to patch / track | 22:55 |
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+perlDreamer | preaction, in 7.9 I'm planning on adding testHarness 3.17 to testEnvironment.pl. Any issues, concerns, worries, directives or comments? | 23:52 |
@preaction | as an optional install correct? | 23:52 |
+perlDreamer | parts of the Survey won't work without it | 23:53 |
@preaction | okay, go ahead | 23:53 |
@preaction | if it's necessary for normal operation it's required, if it's only necessary for testing, it's optional | 23:53 |
@preaction | that should be true for all our requirements | 23:53 |
+perlDreamer | well, in that case | 23:54 |
+perlDreamer | it's used for testing the Survey, from inside the Survey | 23:54 |
@preaction | right, but it's an end-user utility | 23:54 |
+perlDreamer | instead of t/test.t | 23:54 |
+perlDreamer | got it | 23:54 |
@preaction | we've got five types of users: Devs, Admins, Designers, Content Managers, and Visitors. only Devs are concerned about the unit tests, and only devs will take the time to learn how to install the optional components | 23:56 |
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@preaction | we should just Do The Right Thing when it comes to Admins, Designers, Content Managers, and Visitors | 23:56 |
@preaction | Admins should never have to concern themselves with Dev problems, Designers with Admin problems, Content Managers with Designer problems, etc.. | 23:56 |
* preaction should draw up a UI guideline document someday | 23:57 |
+perlDreamer | definitely | 23:57 |
+perlDreamer | documentation is good | 23:57 |
@preaction | we'd be able to simplify the UI if we specified the rules under which certain things should happen | 23:57 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r8128f54 / (4 files in 4 dirs): WebGUI now needs Test::Harness 3.17 or higher for the Survey. Fixes bug #11402. - http://bit.ly/aPGJYt | 23:59 |
@preaction | wait, is that really a bug? | 23:59 |
@preaction | if it's a bug, we can add the additional requirements to the 7.8 series | 23:59 |
+perlDreamer | it was supposed to go into 7.8, but was added late | 23:59 |
--- Day changed Wed Mar 03 2010 |
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+perlDreamer | so the change was backed out, with the condition it could go into 7.9 | 00:00 |
+perlDreamer | so not really a bug | 00:00 |
@preaction | ahh | 00:00 |
@preaction | ok | 00:00 |
+perlDreamer | but I didn't want to forget it, so I posted a bug about it | 00:00 |
+perlDreamer | I did something similar with WeatherData | 00:00 |
@preaction | yeah, that's no problem. just making sure | 00:00 |
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+perlDreamer | speaking of the man himself! | 00:01 |
+perlDreamer | yo, patspam | 00:01 |
+perlDreamer | Did you detect a disturbance in the Survey? | 00:01 |
+perlDreamer | I need to go pick up the kids from school | 00:04 |
+perlDreamer | bbl | 00:04 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * r13b7538 / (5 files in 4 dirs): start of conversion to metaclass roles - http://bit.ly/abUtee | 01:35 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * ra2f0cbe / (6 files in 3 dirs): fix more things for metaclass roles - http://bit.ly/aByuWi | 01:35 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * r12fcdf2 / (6 files in 5 dirs): almost working using metaclass roles - http://bit.ly/bSq7DV | 01:35 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * ra5f54a7 / (4 files in 3 dirs): mostly working definition roles - http://bit.ly/9m9rC4 | 01:35 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, the tests work, but Asset.pm is not in good shape | 01:54 |
@Haarg | what kind of problems are you running into? | 01:54 |
+perlDreamer | around blocks, and mixing property and has | 01:55 |
+perlDreamer | http://gist.github.com/320132 | 01:56 |
@Haarg | when are you getting that? | 01:57 |
@Haarg | i just updated WebGUI8 and i'm not getting errors like that | 01:58 |
@Haarg | perl -Ilib -mWebGUI::Asset -wce1 works fine | 01:58 |
+perlDreamer | that's perl -wc -I /data/WebGUI/lib Asset.pm | 01:59 |
@Haarg | re-including the same file is what is messing it up | 02:00 |
@Haarg | does that normally work for you? or does it normally work but with errors? | 02:01 |
@Haarg | err | 02:01 |
@Haarg | but with warnings | 02:01 |
+perlDreamer | it normally works, with no syntax errors, sometimes I get warnings about subroutines being redefined | 02:01 |
+perlDreamer | but all the Asset modules include one another incestuously | 02:01 |
@Haarg | yeah, but that is fine | 02:01 |
@Haarg | the problem is that you are giving it just the file | 02:02 |
+perlDreamer | I'll rewrite my vim bindkeys | 02:02 |
@Haarg | so it goes through Asset.pm, which includes WebGUI::AssetLineage, which includes WebGUI::Asset, which perl doesn't know it loaded already | 02:02 |
+perlDreamer | how do I use the new/improved Definition to build a role now? | 02:03 |
@Haarg | that's a good question. | 02:03 |
+perlDreamer | you mean the goal of doing this wasn't to make making roles possible? | 02:06 |
@Haarg | it was | 02:06 |
@Haarg | it's just not complete yet | 02:06 |
@Haarg | the first problem is that it tries to apply WebGUI::Definition::Role::Asset to the role class | 02:10 |
@Haarg | http://gist.github.com/320151 not perfect but at least gets RssFeed compiling | 02:20 |
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+perlDreamer | what causes the metaclass of RssFeed to be different? | 02:24 |
@Haarg | it is a role | 02:24 |
+perlDreamer | ah, use Moose::Role | 02:24 |
@Haarg | i can't get Asset::Wobject to load right now | 02:25 |
+perlDreamer | is that because it uses extends? | 02:25 |
@Haarg | possibly | 02:25 |
@Haarg | is something broken with extends? | 02:26 |
+perlDreamer | can't use extends with roles | 02:26 |
+perlDreamer | I think | 02:26 |
@Haarg | oh. you can't use them in roles | 02:26 |
@Haarg | but you can still have inheritance with your non-role classes | 02:26 |
@Haarg | asset itself works | 02:27 |
@Haarg | but all subclasses are borken | 02:27 |
@Haarg | man that's a seriously screwed up error | 02:29 |
+perlDreamer | could you commit the gist patch? | 02:30 |
@Haarg | yeah. i want to clean that up eventually but it's a good enough start. | 02:30 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * r38e2e09 / (lib/WebGUI/Definition.pm lib/WebGUI/Definition/Asset.pm): apply correct roles/metaroles to roles - http://bit.ly/c6UmhX | 02:31 |
+perlDreamer | thanks :) | 02:32 |
+perlDreamer | wait a sec | 02:33 |
+perlDreamer | the thing with extends should only fail if Asset.pm is a Role | 02:33 |
+perlDreamer | which it isn't | 02:33 |
@Haarg | exactly | 02:33 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * rd932543 / lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject.pm : clean up Wobject includes - http://bit.ly/cJN2Pt | 02:35 |
+perlDreamer | when you say it won't load, what does that mean? | 02:35 |
@Haarg | Asset::Wobject (or any other Asset subclass) fails to compile | 02:36 |
+perlDreamer | perl -I/data/WebGUI/lib -mWebGUI::Asset::Wobject::Article -wce1 | 02:36 |
+perlDreamer | like that? | 02:36 |
+perlDreamer | Article compiles for me | 02:37 |
+perlDreamer | and until the most recent commit, Wobject compiled okay for me too | 02:37 |
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doc777 | I seem to have gotten 2 sites that have "cross linked" themselves. Each seems to be looking for files in the "other" domains folder and cannot find them. using the latest wre. Any clues as to what I have done wrong? | 02:44 |
+perlDreamer | check the config files | 02:45 |
+perlDreamer | uploadsPath | 02:45 |
doc777 | ok, thanks :o) | 02:45 |
doc777 | uploadsURL is /uploads should that be something else? The uploads path looks correct. But site A looks for files in site B dir according to modproxy-error. | 02:48 |
+perlDreamer | uploadsURL can be anything | 02:49 |
@preaction | DocumentRoot in the modproxy files? | 02:50 |
* perlDreamer takes the kids to piano lessons. I should be back online at 6pm or so | 02:52 |
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doc777 | They seem correct. Everything was fine on site A, then I added site B and suddenly noticed site A was wrecked. Checking the log file show that site A is looking at site Bs upload folder. | 02:53 |
doc777 | I think it is this: RewriteRule ^/(.*) http://127.0.0.1:8081/$1 | 02:55 |
@preaction | oh, old WRE | 03:06 |
@preaction | you need ProxyPreserveHost On | 03:06 |
doc777 | Ah, let me check that out :) | 03:09 |
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* patspam emerges from under a rock | 05:06 |
@preaction | yay! | 05:06 |
@preaction | how was it? | 05:06 |
+patspam | cosy :) | 05:06 |
+patspam | I installed linux based firmware (dd-wrt) on my router today, yay! | 05:07 |
+perlDreamer | patspam: no more TAP hacks in Survey | 05:07 |
+patspam | tell me more | 05:07 |
+perlDreamer | well, we have WebGUI 7.9 now, so I made Test::Harness 3.x a requirement | 05:10 |
+perlDreamer | so no more eval { require TAP::MOD } or show_error_message; | 05:11 |
+patspam | sweet! | 05:12 |
+patspam | dang, I just transcoded a dvd of old family footage and the resulting avi file was bigger than the original vob files | 05:13 |
+perlDreamer | oy | 05:17 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r644b74c / docs/create.sql : Ready for 7.8.14 release. - http://bit.ly/by7wyx | 07:09 |
+perlDreamer | all done | 07:37 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * rca0d7cc / (4 files in 4 dirs): Ready for 7.8.15 development. - http://bit.ly/b5rt3E | 07:37 |
-!- Radix_ changed the topic of #webgui to: [7.7.33-stable | 7.8.14-stable | WRE 0.9.3] Before you ask, check the wiki: http://wiki.webgui.org | Pastebin: http://webgui.pastebin.com | 07:41 |
+perlDreamer | thanks, Radix_ | 07:42 |
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+perlDreamer | bartjol, you are internationally happy today? | 17:03 |
+bartjol | eeeh, hevan't looked yet | 17:06 |
+bartjol | oh, I did | 17:06 |
+bartjol | but only at the macro | 17:06 |
+bartjol | and I had all stuff installed already | 17:06 |
+bartjol | richedit is great too | 17:07 |
+bartjol | and i18n still at 100% | 17:10 |
SDuensin | Hey gang. Does the new 7.8.14 upgrade correctly? | 17:18 |
+bartjol | mine did | 17:18 |
SDuensin | I know it had missing packages or something last time, so I waited. | 17:18 |
+bartjol | haven't found any yet | 17:18 |
+bartjol | but I installed them with the script | 17:19 |
+bartjol | so that is not complete certainty | 17:19 |
+bartjol | i.e: I took another route | 17:19 |
SDuensin | I'll quit asking you then. :-P | 17:20 |
SDuensin | I fear upgrades enough as it is. | 17:20 |
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+bartjol | but what you can do | 17:22 |
+bartjol | to copy my path | 17:22 |
+bartjol | is upgrade to 7.8.13, run the packages script and then upgrade to 7.8.14 | 17:23 |
+bartjol | SDuensin: just as easy :) | 17:23 |
SDuensin | True. | 17:24 |
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+bartjol | and don't follow rogiers directions on login templates | 17:25 |
+perlDreamer | 7.8.14 is all fixed up | 17:27 |
+perlDreamer | the missing templates are added back in | 17:28 |
+perlDreamer | and yeah, don't let rogier muck with your login templates | 17:28 |
+perlDreamer | otherwise bartjol the mean admin will laugh at you | 17:28 |
+bartjol | I know, but I just didn't test it the "normal" way | 17:28 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, do you have the screen program installed on your servers? | 17:29 |
+bartjol | oh, yeah, you asked silly questions, let me ponder on how to lay my wrath opun you | 17:29 |
SDuensin | perlDreamer - So pop to the latest 7.7.x and then on up? | 17:29 |
+bartjol | bart@host116~> which screen | 17:29 |
+bartjol | /usr/bin/screen | 17:29 |
+bartjol | I do apparently | 17:29 |
SDuensin | SCREEN! | 17:29 |
* SDuensin loves that program. | 17:30 |
+perlDreamer | SDuensin, what version are you on now? | 17:30 |
SDuensin | Uh. Looking. | 17:30 |
+bartjol | but maybe not all | 17:31 |
SDuensin | 7.7.32 | 17:31 |
+bartjol | today is a day of dumb people asking questions | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | so, upgrade to 7.7.33 | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | then go to 7.8.13 | 17:31 |
+bartjol | bbiam | 17:31 |
SDuensin | 7.8.13? | 17:32 |
+perlDreamer | 7.8.13 | 17:34 |
+perlDreamer | well,7.8.14 | 17:34 |
+perlDreamer | but the upgrade path is 7.7.x to 7.7.33 to 7.8.13 to 7.8.14 | 17:34 |
SDuensin | Ok. Didn't know there was a stop at 13. | 17:34 |
+perlDreamer | there's not a stop, but instead of going from 7.7.33 to 7.8.0, it will shunt you up to 7.8.13 | 17:36 |
SDuensin | ok. | 17:38 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r53d63bc / (docs/create.sql docs/previousVersion.sql): Fix SQL scripts for the next beta release. - http://bit.ly/aCFPNU | 18:23 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, why does WebGUI::Definition::Meta::Class need to install the properties into a new anonymous class? | 19:18 |
+perlDreamer | and oose.pm is just evil | 19:18 |
@Haarg | it needs to have an instance of the attribute metaclass to check for which sub-attributes to stick in 'form' | 19:28 |
+perlDreamer | so, before the recent set of patches, Moose was building one for us? | 19:30 |
@Haarg | we weren't using a role but specifying a class. so there was no need to construct the class, we already had it. | 19:38 |
+perlDreamer | would it be easier to duplicate the Definition code in another class that is the base class for Roles, instead of trying to build a dual purpose solution? | 19:43 |
@Haarg | possibly | 19:44 |
@Haarg | having the if condition i added in seems to work for that part though. | 19:45 |
+perlDreamer | sure. I was just thinking about the Asset subclasses not being able to load the anonymous meta classes | 19:47 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r122bd26 / (lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm t/Asset.t): Add keywords accessor for looking up Asset keywords. - http://bit.ly/deCsLs | 21:04 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, did you try using any of the Asset subclasses, or just syntax check them? | 21:06 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r0a0b655 / lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm : Eval and error handling for processTemplate. - http://bit.ly/dn2zKg | 21:10 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r44c6048 / t/Asset/Wobject/Shelf.t : Update test for exception handling. - http://bit.ly/a48MoX | 21:10 |
+perlDreamer | I just realized I've been running wobject tests for the last 20 minutes | 21:10 |
@Haarg | looks like maybe i'm only getting warnings | 21:10 |
+perlDreamer | I saw the same thing, and figured they were errors | 21:11 |
+perlDreamer | shelf works, btw | 21:11 |
@Haarg | very strange warnings though | 21:12 |
@Haarg | and if i try to load WebGUI::Asset::File i get a warning | 21:12 |
@Haarg | but if i try to load WebGUI::Asset::File::Image i don't | 21:12 |
+perlDreamer | I see that, too | 21:13 |
+perlDreamer | ZipArchive has warnings | 21:14 |
@Haarg | what i'm wondering is why Asset is getting an anonymous superclass | 21:39 |
* perlDreamer quotes Bart Simpson, "I didn't do it!" | 21:41 |
+perlDreamer | shouldn't the anonymous superclass be the class for the role that is added? | 21:41 |
@Haarg | i guess | 21:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * rd7b0d93 / (lib/WebGUI/Definition.pm lib/WebGUI/Definition/Asset.pm): Apply Definition roles properly to eliminate warnings - http://bit.ly/8Y0ouh | 21:49 |
@Haarg | Collaboration is compiling with RssFeed as a role. haven't tried to do any testing though. | 21:50 |
+perlDreamer | testing I can do | 21:52 |
+perlDreamer | brilliant API design and implementation I leave to my betters | 21:52 |
+perlDreamer | however, right now I'm leaving my betters to go running | 21:52 |
@Haarg | 'brilliant' may be stretching it a bit. at this point i'm hoping i haven't invented something too complex. | 21:53 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rb4a790a / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt sbin/fileImport.pl): Fix handling filenames with space with overwrite=1 in fileImport.pl. Fixes bug #11453 - http://bit.ly/dxU23B | 23:28 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r446403c / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt sbin/fileImport.pl): Fix handling filenames with space with overwrite=1 in fileImport.pl. Fixes bug #11453 - http://bit.ly/9bMUUN | 23:28 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg: the role seems to be adopting the table of the consumer | 23:30 |
+perlDreamer | but that may be an artifact of the way I wrote write | 23:31 |
+perlDreamer | http://gist.github.com/321054 | 23:32 |
kimd | preaction, do you have time for a quick JS question? | 23:52 |
kimd | How can access the id of an element? | 23:52 |
kimd | el.id doesn't work. | 23:52 |
kimd | Or does someone else know? | 23:54 |
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@Haarg | perlDreamer, probably because of the way the get_all_tables method works | 00:04 |
kimd | Ok, I got it. No need to answer. | 00:04 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, it's both | 00:27 |
+perlDreamer | since roles inject themselves into the class | 00:27 |
+perlDreamer | inspecting the class metas is flawed | 00:27 |
+perlDreamer | I think someone mentioned that to me at one point | 00:27 |
@preaction | version tags serve two purposes: staging content and history/rollback, correct? | 00:39 |
@preaction | for the most part, users don't want staging content unless they actually know they want it, then they could take an extra step or two to create a "stage" | 00:40 |
@preaction | and history/rollback can be done without staging content | 00:41 |
@preaction | three purposes: approval | 00:42 |
+perlDreamer | approval is a side effect of staging | 00:42 |
+perlDreamer | and has little to do with the tags themselves | 00:42 |
+perlDreamer | at least, that's the way that version tags are built today | 00:43 |
@preaction | right | 00:43 |
@preaction | i'm just thinking that websites keep evolving, everybody wants to add content and admins want that content added in a structured way | 00:45 |
@preaction | and if we could do it all again... what would we do? | 00:46 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg has this idea about versions versus revisions | 00:47 |
+perlDreamer | right now an asset can contain both | 00:47 |
+perlDreamer | well, not really versions versus revisions, but versioned and non-versioned data | 00:47 |
+perlDreamer | and that you should be able to access them independently | 00:47 |
@preaction | well, in a DBIC world there'd be a DBIC::Versioned or whatever | 00:48 |
@preaction | or a WebGUI::Model::Role::Versioned | 00:49 |
@preaction | and in a perfect world i'd have a pony | 00:51 |
+perlDreamer | in a perfect world, I'd give you the pony | 00:52 |
+perlDreamer | I think WebGUI's version system works okay | 00:52 |
+perlDreamer | it could be implemented better though | 00:52 |
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+perlDreamer | and it would be nice if it versioned everything | 00:53 |
+perlDreamer | but I know that's much more challenging | 00:53 |
@preaction | would anyone object if Folder had a checkbox to "Commit added files automatically" | 00:54 |
+perlDreamer | how about if it has a user selectable workflow in the edit properties? | 00:55 |
@preaction | of course it would need that | 00:55 |
+perlDreamer | it won't work | 00:55 |
@preaction | but then what about subfolders? | 00:55 |
+perlDreamer | they inherit from the parent, or you can override | 00:56 |
+perlDreamer | it won't work because the children don't check the parent for the autocommit tag | 00:56 |
@preaction | this just opens a nice big huge can of worms | 00:56 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 00:56 |
+perlDreamer | what that person wants is per branch configuration of commit workflow | 00:56 |
@preaction | why does it always seem like i could reduce WebGUI to like 5 assets? | 00:58 |
+perlDreamer | they'd be 5 very fat assets, not like the beautiful ones we have now :P | 00:58 |
@preaction | which ones are those? | 01:00 |
@preaction | we'd need a Folder, a Calendar, a RawContent, a RichContent, and a File | 01:00 |
+perlDreamer | What about Sku's? | 01:00 |
+perlDreamer | and the DataForm? | 01:01 |
+perlDreamer | or forum? | 01:01 |
@preaction | Form of course | 01:01 |
@preaction | forum is a folder of folders of richcontents | 01:01 |
@preaction | gallery is a folder of folders of files | 01:01 |
@preaction | blog is a folder of richcontents | 01:01 |
@preaction | richcontent would have useful, individually-placed attachments | 01:02 |
@preaction | wiki is a folder of richcontents editable by anyone | 01:02 |
+perlDreamer | Poll? | 01:03 |
@preaction | form with a proper set of reporting features | 01:03 |
+perlDreamer | Sku? | 01:04 |
@preaction | would have to be its own asset as part of shop, but that's an entire subsystem of its own | 01:04 |
@preaction | and a subclass of RichContent, of course | 01:04 |
+perlDreamer | Sku is a role | 01:06 |
+perlDreamer | so that you can buy or sell any of the other ones | 01:06 |
+perlDreamer | I wouldn't doubt that you could do what you're talking about | 01:10 |
+perlDreamer | I think we'd end up with "deep" sets of assets, instead of "wide" ones | 01:10 |
+perlDreamer | where there are lots of subclasses, instead of siblings | 01:10 |
+perlDreamer | preaction: how about a CommitMyChanges macro? | 01:16 |
+perlDreamer | that would work outside of TurnAdminOn | 01:16 |
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@preaction | they're normal users though, they don't know about version tags or committing or anything like that | 01:17 |
+perlDreamer | you could make the label say anything | 01:17 |
+perlDreamer | You must check-in your files after uploading | 01:17 |
+perlDreamer | or whatever | 01:17 |
+perlDreamer | the thing is, what the user really needs is access to the commit link | 01:17 |
@preaction | well, what the user really needs is for the Gallery to allow any file uploads | 01:18 |
@preaction | or to use a Collaboration System, or something | 01:18 |
+perlDreamer | could you style a gallery to look like a folder | 01:19 |
+perlDreamer | without albums and thumbnails and the like? | 01:19 |
@preaction | of course | 01:19 |
+perlDreamer | wel | 01:22 |
+perlDreamer | Folder is such a nice, small, Asset though | 01:22 |
+perlDreamer | Gallery is big! | 01:22 |
@preaction | yes, but Gallery is only big because it has to deal with normal user input and versioning. if Folder had to, it would be big too | 01:24 |
+perlDreamer | can you deep nest albums, like Folders? | 01:25 |
@preaction | if we let anyone add files to a folder, we have to control it, filter it, secure it, and etc... | 01:25 |
@preaction | no, but that's not out of the question as a feature | 01:25 |
@preaction | just, nobody asked for it. nobody ever asks for it | 01:26 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg: new write method for Asset -> http://gist.github.com/321187 | 01:27 |
+perlDreamer | I need to expand the tests to consider roles | 01:27 |
+perlDreamer | preaction, it seems to be a dance between implementing so many features that we're too big to use, and not having enough features for people to get work done | 01:31 |
@preaction | yes. we add too little for the feature to matter to people to want to use it | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | I'm not sure about that | 01:35 |
@preaction | i've heard a dozen times people don't use Gallery simply because they can't nest albums | 01:36 |
+perlDreamer | they why don't they file an RFE to get it done? | 01:38 |
+perlDreamer | or pay to get it done? | 01:38 |
+perlDreamer | or just write it themselves? | 01:38 |
@preaction | because they aren't invested enough, they'd rather go find something that works | 01:38 |
@preaction | they'd rather get their job done instead of merely telling someone else to do it | 01:39 |
+perlDreamer | then we have to be psychic enough to know what people are going to need before we write stuff | 01:40 |
@preaction | that's easy though: look at what everyone else is doing | 01:40 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r4d3d031 / lib/WebGUI/Definition/Meta/Asset.pm : remove copy/paste variable names. - http://bit.ly/ahADuf | 01:46 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rf88c18e / lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm : Fix the write method to iterate over each property to get the table names instead of looking in the class metaproperties. - http://bit.ly/aQbbjK | 01:46 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r3d52c45 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Changes to Post and Collaboration, for new Asset instanciators. - http://bit.ly/auSYje | 01:46 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rda57427 / asset_status.ods : Collaboration tests are passing now. - http://bit.ly/9Yl3Ke | 01:46 |
+perlDreamer | everyone else is using PHP :D | 01:46 |
@preaction | but we can copy their features | 02:02 |
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+perlDreamer | t/00_compile.t can be run! | 02:32 |
+perlDreamer | github is down | 02:33 |
+perlDreamer | a large portion of developers all leave for coffee | 02:33 |
+perlDreamer | on the way out, they smile sadly at their boss and say, "Sorry, boss. But with github down we can do any work." | 02:35 |
+perlDreamer | and the Boss scratches his head and says, "I thought that GitHub allowed offline work, which is why they spend all that time in the coffee shop...' | 02:36 |
@preaction | and then they remember that git is distributed and allows pushing directly to production | 02:36 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r814c2af / (55 files in 6 dirs): Change calls to new to newById across Asset/ - http://bit.ly/c9rLvt | 02:41 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r8f6c20d / (3 files in 3 dirs): Fix lots of syntax errors and bad definition configuration. - http://bit.ly/d8XcR7 | 02:41 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r65a5053 / lib/WebGUI/Asset/WikiPage.pm : Fix a missing label in the WikiPage - http://bit.ly/9xWi9c | 02:41 |
+perlDreamer | Today is a big day, preaction | 02:41 |
+perlDreamer | t/00_compile.t runs clean | 02:41 |
@preaction | yay! | 02:42 |
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+perlDreamer | I think that in 2-3 weeks we could use an alpha server up and running for wg8 | 02:43 |
+perlDreamer | is that doable? | 02:43 |
@preaction | we also need every action a user is allowed to do to be configurable... because that is eventually what they want | 02:43 |
+perlDreamer | in wg8? | 02:44 |
@preaction | no, 7 | 02:44 |
* perlDreamer is having a hard time with the context change | 02:44 |
+perlDreamer | what kind of actions, and what kind of configurability? | 02:44 |
@preaction | sorry, i'm approving RFEs, since we're unfrozen again | 02:44 |
+perlDreamer | I warned you about those german language RFEs | 02:45 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r9b4a9be / (7 files in 2 dirs): Remove usage of Class:C3 in favor of roles. - http://bit.ly/bkzcjG | 03:59 |
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@preaction | so many things are easy to do when you're first building an app, and absolutely impossible when you've got it deployed | 04:10 |
@preaction | and so braindead as to wonder WHY it wasn't added in the first place | 04:10 |
@preaction | i swear to god one day i'm gonna burn this place to the ground | 04:16 |
@preaction | wonderful. i can't approve any other RFEs because i Can't find them. HelpDesk doesn't save sorting through pages | 04:31 |
+perlDreamer | sounds like we should fix the sorting bug in the HelpDesk, sooner rather than later? | 04:38 |
@preaction | frodwith will be doing so once he's finished with automat, so hopefully April | 04:42 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r7e673d4 / lib/WebGUI/Role/Asset/RssFeed.pm : Don't need no stinkin' strict anymore! - http://bit.ly/ajKdGK | 04:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r5dc0299 / (4 files in 3 dirs): First cut at moving Subscribable to an Asset. - http://bit.ly/cffoTM | 04:43 |
@preaction | that's the new tack: make paul do it | 04:45 |
+perlDreamer | can you wait that long? | 04:46 |
+perlDreamer | in any case, while we're working on the helpdesk, we need to display the time that a ticket was submited | 04:47 |
@preaction | yeah, nobody's gonna be putting anything into 7.9 anyway | 04:47 |
+perlDreamer | I think you may be surprised about that... | 04:47 |
+perlDreamer | Luke Robinson's Login form code is a nice addition | 04:47 |
@preaction | i know arjan has a couple things | 04:47 |
+perlDreamer | and I may have a few pDC things to add as well | 04:47 |
+perlDreamer | like the Folder DataForm template | 04:48 |
@preaction | folder dataform template? | 04:48 |
+perlDreamer | I'll get you a URL | 04:48 |
+perlDreamer | http://www.webgui.org/bazaar/file-manager-style-template-for-folder | 04:49 |
+perlDreamer | the other thing I'd like to work on is the Asset manager pop-up menu rewrite | 04:49 |
+perlDreamer | where we use 1 menu and pop it up in the right place, instead of making 25-50 of them | 04:49 |
+perlDreamer | should really speed things up for loading | 04:49 |
+perlDreamer | whaddya think? | 04:51 |
+perlDreamer | (about the folder) | 04:51 |
@preaction | sounds fine to me | 04:51 |
+perlDreamer | also, knowing patspam, I wouldn't doubt there's something that couldn't be worked in wG 7.9 from SDH | 04:53 |
+perlDreamer | maybe the template usage search and replace code | 04:53 |
@preaction | heh, yeah, not seeing that happening | 04:54 |
@preaction | webgui 7 just needs to go away | 04:54 |
@preaction | and 8 too | 04:54 |
@preaction | we need WebGUI X | 04:54 |
@preaction | (that's 10, not Ecks) | 04:54 |
+perlDreamer | 8 will be good stuff | 04:57 |
+perlDreamer | I just hope we don't get the huge turnover that happened with 6-7 | 04:57 |
+perlDreamer | I think we should do 1 high profile RFE, though | 04:58 |
+perlDreamer | even if we have to do it off hours | 04:58 |
+perlDreamer | it was a promise PB made to the community | 04:58 |
@preaction | but WebGUI 8 has to be ready, period | 04:59 |
+patspam | I'm hanging out for wg11 | 05:01 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * ra37b1c7 / lib/WebGUI/Role/Asset/Subscribable.pm : Cleanup for moose accessors. - http://bit.ly/dhSLHD | 05:02 |
+perlDreamer | I don't think there will ever be a WebGUI bigger than 8 | 05:02 |
+perlDreamer | Gooey is out of tentacles | 05:02 |
@preaction | if i have complete authority for 2 major versions, i can make something totally awesome | 05:05 |
+perlDreamer | If you'd make a Trait for JSON in an Asset property that would be totally awesome now | 05:10 |
@preaction | but i don't like JSON in assets | 05:11 |
@preaction | would even go so far as to say i hate it | 05:11 |
+perlDreamer | how would you do it differently? | 05:11 |
@preaction | normalized | 05:13 |
+perlDreamer | see, you're using one of those CS terms that I don't understand | 05:15 |
@preaction | a joined table | 05:15 |
+perlDreamer | Is the Installable AssetAspect used anywhere? | 05:16 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r2b39e16 / (4 files in 2 dirs): Rough conversion of Comments and Installable to Moose. - http://bit.ly/bs75wc | 05:22 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r36b6081 / (3 files): Update 3 Form plugins for Asset instanciators and exceptions. - http://bit.ly/anQQE5 | 05:31 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * ra62e7b7 / lib/WebGUI/Session/Style.pm : Update Session for new Asset instanciators and exceptions. - http://bit.ly/aLKgIO | 05:35 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r4137b19 / lib/WebGUI/Account/Inbox.pm : Update Account/Inbox plugin for new Asset instanciators and exceptions. - http://bit.ly/bKZK8f | 05:38 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r913802f / lib/WebGUI/Account/Inbox.pm : And again... - http://bit.ly/c9OvDh | 05:39 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * raab930a / lib/WebGUI/Content/AssetDiscovery.pm : Update Content handlers for wg8. - http://bit.ly/bx3kSX | 05:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r19d4e6d / lib/WebGUI/AdminConsole.pm : Update AdminConsole for instaniators. - http://bit.ly/dpzvbo | 05:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rd9e2816 / lib/WebGUI/Operation/Help.pm : Update Operation/Help for new asset instanciators. - http://bit.ly/bcHo2a | 05:44 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * red58eba / lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm : More instanciator cleanup in Asset.pm - http://bit.ly/bN71T4 | 05:48 |
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+patspam | night all | 06:15 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * re759890 / lib/WebGUI/Workflow/Activity/TrashExpiredEvents.pm : Update TrashExpiredEvents to wg8. - http://bit.ly/bNahwL | 06:45 |
+perlDreamer | select assetId from EventsCalendar_event where eventEndDate < ? | 06:45 |
@preaction | sounds awesome | 06:47 |
+perlDreamer | aside from the table not existing | 06:47 |
+perlDreamer | I'm guessing this is another one of those low usage workflow activities | 06:47 |
@preaction | probably | 06:48 |
+perlDreamer | I want to convert all the other classes over to Moose now | 06:49 |
+perlDreamer | well, either that or write tests for 6 weeks non-stop | 06:50 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r1706747 / lib/WebGUI/Workflow/Activity/TrashExpiredEvents.pm : Fix this completely broken Workflow Activity. - http://bit.ly/bZIsPc | 06:50 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r3471f62 / lib/WebGUI/Workflow/Activity/TrashExpiredEvents.pm : Fix this completely broken Workflow Activity. - http://bit.ly/ceCmlw | 06:50 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rcd2c1f5 / lib/WebGUI/Workflow/Activity/GetSyndicatedContent.pm : Update workflow activity for wg8. - http://bit.ly/9eHw7P | 06:53 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r2147d7f / lib/WebGUI/AssetTrash.pm : Update getAssetsInTrash method for wg8 instanciations and exception handling. - http://bit.ly/bXXPG2 | 06:55 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r3e7e2c4 / lib/WebGUI/AssetTrash.pm : And again. - http://bit.ly/bCsrWR | 06:56 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r03427ee / lib/WebGUI/ProgressBar.pm : Update ProgressBar for new wg8 instanciators. - http://bit.ly/cHZT0a | 06:57 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * recc71d4 / (6 files in 3 dirs): Update Shop for new instanciators and for exception handling. - http://bit.ly/9QH7bt | 07:08 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rdfc388f / (2 files in 2 dirs): More Subscribable fixes. - http://bit.ly/9SPg94 | 07:08 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rbf1cb7b / (7 files in 2 dirs): Aspect to Role renaming - http://bit.ly/cO4Ytq | 07:10 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r26e50b9 / lib/WebGUI/Role/Asset/RssFeed.pm : Fix POD typo. - http://bit.ly/a0GpLn | 07:26 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, preaction, the SC asset is currently broke in wg8. I'll be fixing it tomorrow. | 07:26 |
@preaction | it's okay, nobody's gonna use the SC asset in WG8 for a while | 07:26 |
+perlDreamer | hopefully not too long | 07:29 |
+perlDreamer | of course, there's still all the editing interfaces to work on | 07:29 |
+perlDreamer | but building wg8 may be one of the best things to ever happen to wg7 | 07:29 |
+perlDreamer | since we're literally crawling through all the code | 07:29 |
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SDuensin | Greetings. | 16:44 |
+MrHairgrease | Greasings | 16:45 |
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+patspam | morning perlDreamer | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | howdy, patspam | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | big milestone in WebGUI 8 last night | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | the syntax check ran clean | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | and Roles seem to be working for the most part | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | needs more testing though | 17:32 |
SDuensin | Whaaa? Cool! | 17:32 |
+perlDreamer | and ahead of us, is the new CHI caching infratructure | 17:32 |
+perlDreamer | and change to automated form building in all assets | 17:32 |
SDuensin | Is there a roadmap anywhere? Just curious as to what you're planning for 8. | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | there was a roadmap presented at the WUC | 17:39 |
+perlDreamer | it's changed since then, though | 17:39 |
+perlDreamer | you could try asking preaction, or searching through the Black Blog for the older announcements | 17:39 |
SDuensin | I know how that is. My roadmap changes direction like a flag in a thunderstorm. | 17:39 |
+MrHairgrease | SDuensin: http://www.webgui.org/use/wgtv/wgtv/2009-state-of-webgui#idgV-xaRzZhRqX-3hbNo5Jhw | 17:40 |
SDuensin | Thanks! I was just headed to the TV area to look around! | 17:40 |
+MrHairgrease | I think that the initial wg 8 roadmap was reveiled there | 17:40 |
SDuensin | (Buffering!) | 17:41 |
SDuensin | This is kind of an obvious URL, now that I see it... http://www.webgui.org/roadmap | 17:42 |
ckotil | heh | 17:47 |
SDuensin | I like this statement: "WebGUI 8 is about strengthening the platform for the future, and about improving the user experience." | 17:48 |
SDuensin | The hardest part I have in selling WebGUI to people is the appearance. Not to be cruel, but the default look is ugly at best. | 17:48 |
SDuensin | You put an out-of-the-box WebGUI next to something like Liferay and it just makes WebGUI look old. | 17:49 |
SDuensin | Unfortunately, people don't realize the "problem" isn't a problem until they've run off with something else and find out it sucks. :-/ | 17:50 |
+perlDreamer | gosh, that turd sure looked purdy | 18:00 |
+MrHairgrease | hmmm | 18:00 |
* MrHairgrease is not sure he wants to know... | 18:01 |
SDuensin | hehe | 18:01 |
+MrHairgrease | and what is purdy | 18:01 |
SDuensin | People like all the snazzy AJAXy crap. | 18:02 |
+perlDreamer | purdy is slang for pretty | 18:03 |
+perlDreamer | with a southern drawl | 18:03 |
* ckotil plucks the banjo | 18:03 |
+MrHairgrease | oh if it's pretty then I'm all ears | 18:04 |
+MrHairgrease | tell us about the pretty turd | 18:04 |
+perlDreamer | well, gosh, it has that nice thing where it gets all blinky | 18:04 |
+perlDreamer | and when I start to type, it already knows what I'm going to say | 18:05 |
+perlDreamer | all the corners are roundy | 18:05 |
+perlDreamer | it just looks cool | 18:05 |
SDuensin | Yes! Roundy! | 18:05 |
* SDuensin wrote a roundy corner thing for WebGUI. | 18:05 |
+perlDreamer | I couldn't get it to do anything useful, but it's sure purdy | 18:05 |
+MrHairgrease | seems like general eurotrash to me | 18:06 |
+MrHairgrease | =) | 18:06 |
+perlDreamer | that would be a euroturd | 18:06 |
+MrHairgrease | hehe | 18:06 |
SDuensin | Look! Roundy test! http://allplay.jaegertech.net/ | 18:06 |
+bartjol | what, is there a generic solution for that? | 18:08 |
+perlDreamer | yes, it's called CSS | 18:08 |
SDuensin | I'm trying. | 18:08 |
+MrHairgrease | hmm, the style seems to be a mix between modern realism and postapocalyptic neopurdyism | 18:08 |
+bartjol | that'll put 30% of all webbuilders without work | 18:08 |
+bartjol | which css? | 18:09 |
+perlDreamer | WebGUI itself doesn't care what it looks like | 18:09 |
+perlDreamer | it's all just styling | 18:09 |
+MrHairgrease | bart: http://allplay.jaegertech.net/purdyroundies.css | 18:09 |
+bartjol | nice | 18:10 |
SDuensin | It's some javascript/css stuff I found and then I did an article template that lets you easily set the style. | 18:10 |
+perlDreamer | I'm surprised someone hasn't come up with a business of selling WebGUI style packages | 18:10 |
+perlDreamer | SDuensin, sounds like a great thing to put in the Bazaar | 18:10 |
SDuensin | Once it no longer sucks, sure. :-) | 18:10 |
+perlDreamer | ah | 18:11 |
+perlDreamer | I put up the sortable DataForm template before it was done | 18:11 |
+perlDreamer | and some people actually fixed the bugs for me | 18:11 |
SDuensin | Freaky. | 18:11 |
+perlDreamer | Don't sit on it until it's perfect, otherwise it'll never get done | 18:11 |
SDuensin | Right now, you put the extra style details in the "Summary" field of the article. | 18:12 |
SDuensin | Just feels "hacky" to me. | 18:13 |
+perlDreamer | why not put it in the extraHeadTags? | 18:13 |
+perlDreamer | or in the template itself? | 18:13 |
SDuensin | Because it's per-article. | 18:14 |
SDuensin | WTF is Swiftysite? Google doesn't know them. | 18:14 |
+perlDreamer | Swiftysite is someone peeling off the top of WebGUI, restyling it, and selling cheap website in the Netherlands | 18:14 |
+perlDreamer | very, very nice people | 18:14 |
+perlDreamer | you should come to a WUC and meet them | 18:14 |
SDuensin | I'd like to. But they should talk to Google, too! | 18:15 |
+perlDreamer | well, if any of the guys come into the IRC room, I'll point that out to them | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | hang on | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | when I type in swiftysite into google, it's the first result | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | alphamegahosting.com | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | that's them | 18:18 |
+MrHairgrease | here as well | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | maybe SDuensin has thick fingers or something | 18:18 |
SDuensin | Really? Trying again! | 18:19 |
SDuensin | Ok, you guys just added it. :-P | 18:20 |
+bartjol | yeah, we plugged into googles db | 18:20 |
ckotil | swiftysite is powered by webgui? | 18:21 |
ckotil | that's awesome. ive used it a time or two. dont understand a lick of it, but it makes great websites | 18:21 |
SDuensin | hehe | 18:21 |
+perlDreamer | yay! slow support day. I'm going to get tons of hacking done | 18:24 |
SDuensin | HaCkInG! | 18:25 |
+perlDreamer | well, for me, it is haCKing | 18:26 |
SDuensin | The Wrath of Koen! | 18:26 |
+perlDreamer | I try not to begrudge Calvin Klein the use of my initials | 18:26 |
+bartjol | we lumberjack with it | 18:26 |
ckotil | pd! you to? | 18:26 |
+MrHairgrease | well, have fun with your purdy turds | 18:27 |
* MrHairgrease is off! | 18:27 |
* bartjol follows him on the feet | 18:27 |
+perlDreamer | me, too ckotil | 18:27 |
+perlDreamer | later, you Nederlanderin | 18:28 |
+bartjol | we're male | 18:28 |
ckotil | we share initials with the mild manner Clark Kent too | 18:28 |
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+perlDreamer | MrHairgrease, should I have said Nederlanderer? | 18:29 |
+MrHairgrease | Nederlanders | 18:30 |
+MrHairgrease | and now | 18:30 |
+MrHairgrease | its | 18:30 |
+MrHairgrease | time | 18:30 |
+MrHairgrease | to GO and enjoy my free time! | 18:30 |
+MrHairgrease | woot | 18:30 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r35e1e8c / lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/SyndicatedContent.pm : Fix SC use of RssFeed role. - http://bit.ly/bRsiNQ | 18:38 |
SDuensin | Free time? Wazzat? | 18:40 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rf17fc5c / (12 files): Update Macros for wg8 instanciators. - http://bit.ly/be1S8Z | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | that's when you work on Free Software projects and drink beer | 18:48 |
SDuensin | Must be nice. | 18:49 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r360acb5 / lib/WebGUI/Role/Asset/Subscribable.pm : Use wg8 instanciators. - http://bit.ly/ak9xmy | 18:51 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r3d9006b / (3 files in 2 dirs): Update Auth system for wg8 instanciators. - http://bit.ly/bR4sER | 18:53 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rd5dd260 / (2 files in 2 dirs): More instanciator cleanup. - http://bit.ly/9iW39m | 18:55 |
SDuensin | There he goes talking about WebGUI FS again. Evil tease! | 18:56 |
+perlDreamer | ah, quit griping, break out yer keyboard and start hackin' | 18:56 |
SDuensin | I know, I know! | 18:57 |
SDuensin | I have a list of things I want to do to WebGUI that's a mile long. | 18:58 |
SDuensin | Run CNN.com through the story manager? Does CNN know about this? :-) | 18:59 |
mducharme-work | holy | 18:59 |
mducharme-work | when did 7.8 go stable | 18:59 |
SDuensin | Last week, I believe. | 19:00 |
mducharme-work | I've been out of it for a few weeks and suddenly everything changes | 19:00 |
mducharme-work | any gotchas for upgrading from 7.7.30 up through the current 7.8? | 19:00 |
+perlDreamer | any known ones where fixed in 7.8.14 2 days ago | 19:01 |
SDuensin | Yes. You have to make a stop at 7.7.33, I believe. Whatever the last 7.7.x is. | 19:01 |
+perlDreamer | we need more brave souls to test upgrading on live sites for us | 19:01 |
SDuensin | I was going to be brave last night, but the kids had other plans. | 19:01 |
+perlDreamer | preaction: I'd really like to use Test::Sweet, but prove doesn't like i | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | it | 19:05 |
mducharme-work | ok, upgrading to 7.7.33 | 19:13 |
+perlDreamer | SD, if you want a project to help WebGUI out, start a wiki page with a list of all known upgrade points and stop versions. | 19:15 |
SDuensin | That'll be a short list. I only remember 7.7.33! | 19:16 |
mducharme-work | hrm | 19:25 |
mducharme-work | I'm trying to install Locales::Country like mentioned in the gotchas | 19:25 |
mducharme-work | cpan says no such package found | 19:25 |
mducharme-work | is that the wrong name for it? | 19:26 |
@preaction | mducharme-work: just use testEnvironment.pl, if that works, Webgui will work | 19:27 |
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mducharme-work | 7.8.3 -------------------------------------------------------------------- * WebGUI now requires Locales::Country 0.05 or higher to use the UPS shipping driver. | 19:30 |
mducharme-work | guys, that is a typo in the gotchas | 19:31 |
mducharme-work | that should say Locale::Country | 19:31 |
mducharme-work | I think | 19:31 |
mducharme-work | because I'm able to install "Locale::Country" but "Locales::Country" does not exist | 19:31 |
mducharme-work | should I open a ticket for the typo? | 19:33 |
* SDuensin sighs - the roadmap wants to move configs out of the database and into the config files. Go the other way! | 19:36 |
mducharme-work | oops.. not a typo, a newer gotcha says that was replaced with an older one | 19:36 |
SDuensin | :-) | 19:36 |
mducharme-work | this really should be simpler | 19:36 |
mducharme-work | I hate parsing manually through gotcha files desparately trying to make sure I do not miss any perl module requirements | 19:36 |
mducharme-work | 7.8.14 here I come | 19:40 |
SDuensin | :-) | 19:41 |
mducharme-work | any new storymanager templates in 7.8.x by any chance?? | 19:42 |
* SDuensin has no idea. | 19:46 |
mducharme-work | woo, everything works | 19:46 |
mducharme-work | upgrade went very smooth | 19:47 |
mducharme-work | now to upgrade my other client's server | 19:47 |
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SDuensin | Sweet! | 19:59 |
mducharme-work | all done | 20:07 |
mducharme-work | all my servers are at 7.8.14 now | 20:07 |
SDuensin | Nice! Now you're making me feel lazy! | 20:09 |
+perlDreamer | mducharme-work, Locales::Country should have been replace by Locales... | 20:28 |
+perlDreamer | let me check on that | 20:28 |
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mducharme-work | perldreamer yeah it was but the old gotcha is still there | 20:36 |
mducharme-work | thjat says to install Locales::Country, so I was trying to do that | 20:36 |
+perlDreamer | hm, perhaps the newer one should be made clearer | 20:36 |
mducharme-work | I go through the gotchas in sequence from oldest to newest when I am looking at what to upgrade | 20:36 |
mducharme-work | so I saw the older module before the newer one | 20:37 |
+perlDreamer | I'll put a note about the change next to the older one, as well | 20:39 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r109f06c / docs/gotcha.txt : Make the replacement of Locale::Country with Locales more clear, w.r.t the 7.8.3 gotcha. - http://bit.ly/ciTQVf | 20:54 |
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kimd | Evening, everyone! | 21:47 |
+perlDreamer | yo, kimd | 21:47 |
kimd | perlDreamer, I like your WNN! | 21:49 |
kimd | Subscribed to the RSS feed yesterday. | 21:49 |
kimd | Keep on writing! | 21:49 |
+perlDreamer | thanks :). Unfortunately, it's languished for a long time. | 21:49 |
kimd | You should advertise it a bit more. | 21:49 |
+perlDreamer | When I started a year ago, I did | 21:51 |
kimd | I must have missed that. | 21:52 |
kimd | No readers? | 21:52 |
+perlDreamer | no, just lack of time | 21:53 |
+perlDreamer | when my wife started school full time, I lost lots of my spare time | 21:53 |
kimd | Hm, spare time is a precious good. | 21:54 |
kimd | I wished I had more. | 21:54 |
kimd | But now to something completely unrelated: | 21:54 |
kimd | Is there a switch statement in perl? | 21:54 |
+perlDreamer | in 5.10 there is | 21:54 |
@preaction | there is in 5.10, given/when | 21:54 |
+perlDreamer | and in 5.8, there is a perl module called Switch, but it's a source filter and can suffer from performance and other issues | 21:55 |
kimd | Does that mean I should not use it? | 21:56 |
kimd | I mean, the Switch module? | 21:57 |
kimd | We are still using 5.8 in the wre, correct? | 21:57 |
@preaction | 5.10 actually | 21:57 |
@preaction | but we only require 5.8 | 21:58 |
@preaction | WebGUI 8 can require 5.10 | 21:58 |
kimd | I assume that means I should not use given/when yet? | 21:59 |
+perlDreamer | if you want to make custom code for your own server, go ahead and use it | 21:59 |
+perlDreamer | but any 5.10 specific features have to wait until WebGUI 8 | 21:59 |
+perlDreamer | no say, smart match, given/when, regexp improvements, etc | 21:59 |
kimd | I see. Thanks for your answer. | 22:00 |
+perlDreamer | it's a bummer, for sure. which is why we should all work hard on getting WebGUI 8 out as soon as possible | 22:02 |
kimd | Just having my first git experience. | 22:21 |
kimd | Why did we switch from svn to git? I found that svn was alright. | 22:22 |
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kimd | Now I have to learn the next versioning tool. | 22:22 |
kimd | Not that I want to complain... | 22:23 |
kimd | It's all about flexibility these days. | 22:23 |
+perlDreamer | that's one of the reasons we switched | 22:23 |
+perlDreamer | git is very flexible, and it's incredibly fast compared to svn | 22:24 |
+perlDreamer | there are some very nice tutorials for svn users who want to switch to git | 22:24 |
kimd | Well, since I have no choice... Learning keeps you young, doesn't it? | 22:28 |
+perlDreamer | Yeah, it does | 22:40 |
+perlDreamer | although sometimes it can make you prematurely old | 22:41 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r669f803 / t/Definition/Asset.t : check for get, set, update in Definition/Asset.t - http://bit.ly/crtio9 | 22:45 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, somehow in Definition/Asset we're losing get, set and update from Definition::Role::Object | 22:46 |
+perlDreamer | I committed a test to check that | 22:46 |
+perlDreamer | and will soon be converting the Definition tests over to Test::Class for more robust testing up and down the chain | 22:46 |
@Haarg | http://gist.github.com/322094 does this help? | 22:48 |
+perlDreamer | no | 22:50 |
+perlDreamer | and I'm kind of glad it didn't, because that would mean no composite roles | 22:51 |
* perlDreamer takes a lunch break | 22:52 |
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kimd | A question for the template experts: | 23:07 |
kimd | What happens if a hash value set to undef is passed to template processors. | 23:08 |
kimd | Will that cause problems are just result in an empty template var? | 23:08 |
kimd | I am asking because I have a template var previousFile that may be empty if there is not previous file. | 23:09 |
kimd | no | 23:09 |
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kimd | Ok, let's leave this question open for today. | 23:29 |
kimd | Good night everyone! | 23:29 |
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--- Day changed Fri Mar 05 2010 |
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+perlDreamer | yo, rizen | 01:14 |
@rizen | howdy | 01:25 |
@rizen | sorry for the delay, just having a chat with stevan | 01:26 |
+perlDreamer | no sweat | 01:28 |
+perlDreamer | I was almost ready to ship you a liver | 01:28 |
@rizen | ooh, me like liver. at least if it's from a child of no more than 12 years | 01:29 |
+perlDreamer | this one is 11, so a little old | 01:29 |
@rizen | still tender though | 01:29 |
+perlDreamer | what happens at 12? | 01:29 |
@rizen | they go sour | 01:29 |
@rizen | at that point just grind them up and make dog food | 01:29 |
+perlDreamer | well, the current liver owner is shaping up, so perhaps I'll have to order and the Frau some takeout Thai food | 01:31 |
@rizen | amazing, i was just thinking that myself | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | lean a little closer to the screen, and I can tell you what you want, too | 01:33 |
+perlDreamer | no, closer still | 01:34 |
+perlDreamer | Sarah wants Pad Thai | 01:34 |
+perlDreamer | hm | 01:34 |
+perlDreamer | something interfering with the pickup | 01:35 |
@rizen | actually she doesn't | 01:35 |
@rizen | she's been getting other stuff lately | 01:35 |
@rizen | i think she must be sick | 01:35 |
+perlDreamer | definitely | 01:35 |
@rizen | the pad thai is sooooooo good | 01:35 |
+perlDreamer | Pad Khee Mao is better | 01:35 |
@rizen | next time i'm in oregon i'll make you prove it | 01:35 |
@rizen | gotta go | 01:36 |
+perlDreamer | You're on. | 01:36 |
@rizen | ttyl | 01:36 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rf5f1839 / (t/run_asset.t t/tests/Test/AssetBase.pm): Begin converting t/Asset.t over to Test::Class - http://bit.ly/aZZ7a4 | 01:37 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r006bda8 / t/tests/Test/AssetBase.pm : More Test::Class tests for AssetBase.pm - http://bit.ly/bykELB | 02:08 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r053b5a8 / lib/WebGUI/Definition/Meta/Asset.pm : Rework get_tables to check each and every property. - http://bit.ly/dajC5c | 02:08 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg: even if I just try to apply Definition::Role::Object in Definition/Asset, it still doesn't provide get/set/update/etc | 02:09 |
+perlDreamer | they're not applying in Definition.pm, either | 02:12 |
+perlDreamer | at least it's consistent | 02:17 |
+perlDreamer | it was the d7b0d93a commit | 02:23 |
+perlDreamer | so now we have no warnings, but no roles, either | 02:23 |
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+patspam | how advanced is wG's static html exporting capabilities/ | 03:40 |
+patspam | ? | 03:40 |
@preaction | pretty advanced, the entire US embassy websites use it | 03:41 |
@preaction | what do you need? | 03:42 |
@preaction | there's even the Widget macro to get little parts of dynamic content inside all the static content | 03:42 |
+patspam | sorry phone rang | 03:58 |
+patspam | can it export a tree of page layouts and articles? | 03:58 |
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@preaction | of course | 04:05 |
* patspam reads AssetExportHtml.pm | 04:06 |
+patspam | one day I should sit down and scan the source code from top to bottom, there's lots of stuff in here i never knew existed | 04:06 |
@preaction | heh, yeah, there's a whole lot in there that i forget about ;) | 04:15 |
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+perlDreamer | MrHairgrease, I thought you might be at the Dutch perl workshop today | 18:06 |
+MrHairgrease | I was planning on going | 18:07 |
+MrHairgrease | but I ended up staying in Delft | 18:07 |
+MrHairgrease | Better luck next year | 18:07 |
+MrHairgrease | and I _am_ going to the yapc | 18:07 |
+MrHairgrease | eu that is | 18:07 |
+perlDreamer | where is it this year? | 18:10 |
+MrHairgrease | Pisa! | 18:11 |
+perlDreamer | Do you drive, train or fly to get there? | 18:14 |
+MrHairgrease | If I attach my vacation I'll prolly go by car | 18:15 |
+MrHairgrease | otherwise I'll fly | 18:15 |
+MrHairgrease | it's about a two day drive I gues | 18:15 |
+perlDreamer | 13 hours, 9 minutes | 18:17 |
+MrHairgrease | too much for one day anyway | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | gotta go and help Kathy, bbl | 18:18 |
+MrHairgrease | oki | 18:18 |
+MrHairgrease | bye | 18:19 |
+perlDreamer | she lost her phone at the train station | 18:45 |
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@Haarg | finally figuring out POE a bit better. using it for a silly personal project. | 19:14 |
@frodwith | POE++ | 19:21 |
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+perlDreamer | What do you all think of that post on the webgui.org forums, about the site redesign for the dating site? | 20:19 |
+perlDreamer | SPAM, or legitimate request for help? | 20:19 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, what does the init_meta method do? | 20:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r3c790d9 / t/Definition.t : Add Role presence tests. - http://bit.ly/coUsoK | 20:29 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * recd3158 / (lib/WebGUI/Definition.pm lib/WebGUI/Definition/Asset.pm): Applying class metaroles before the other roles seems to do the right thing. - http://bit.ly/bjIRXl | 20:29 |
@Haarg | it initializes the metaclass instance for the class | 20:30 |
+perlDreamer | that's the problem | 20:30 |
+perlDreamer | we can't apply roles yet | 20:31 |
+perlDreamer | there's no meatclass | 20:31 |
@Haarg | by the time our code gets called, there is a metaclass. but altering it definitely could interfere with the roles. | 20:32 |
+perlDreamer | well, when I applied the metaclass roles first, it started working | 20:32 |
+perlDreamer | tests pass | 20:32 |
+perlDreamer | I'm going to add some role analysis code to the Definition tests | 20:33 |
+perlDreamer | next question has to do with JSON in the database. | 20:34 |
+perlDreamer | The subscribable asset does this by interfering with get and update | 20:34 |
+perlDreamer | I was thinking that perhaps a Trait would be better | 20:34 |
@Haarg | probably | 20:36 |
@Haarg | not sure the best way to do that though | 20:36 |
+perlDreamer | me either. | 20:39 |
+perlDreamer | we could use around around each property that stores the JSON | 20:40 |
+perlDreamer | but that seems like a hassle | 20:40 |
+perlDreamer | coercion and via look nice, but they're only one way | 21:32 |
+perlDreamer | you can put it in as a datastructure, but you get back JSON | 21:32 |
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@frodwith | Trait that arounds the accessor sounds like the way to go to me. | 22:56 |
@frodwith | why is it a hassle? | 22:57 |
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@Haarg | i probably need to do some extra work for that. traits on properties don't work right now. | 23:16 |
@Haarg | shouldn't be too bad to fix though. | 23:16 |
+perlDreamer | as long as the trait puts it around the property, that's fine. | 23:54 |
+perlDreamer | if I have to do it one by one, that's not so fine | 23:54 |
--- Day changed Sat Mar 06 2010 |
+perlDreamer | I had a different idea while cooking dinner | 00:00 |
+perlDreamer | if properties had a trait called 'should_serialize', then the write method would query the property, and then it would know whether to call the standard accessor, or the serialized accessor | 00:00 |
+perlDreamer | that way, you can get to the raw data, and not have to jump through hoops with the write method needing to manually serialize the data | 00:01 |
+perlDreamer | I was thinking of Moose::Meta::Attribute::Native::ArrayRef::JSON | 00:01 |
+perlDreamer | and similarly for HashRef::JSON | 00:02 |
+perlDreamer | and then we have something we can give back to the community via CPAN | 00:02 |
+perlDreamer | any way, I need to go pick up my sons at school | 00:02 |
+perlDreamer | see you all later | 00:02 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rb5e03dd / lib/WebGUI/Asset/WikiPage.pm : Remove dead method with the same name as a property. - http://bit.ly/afusHD | 00:42 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r6f9b891 / t/tests/Test/AssetBase.pm : Convert more tests over to Test::Class - http://bit.ly/bFsCFd | 01:17 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r029655d / asset_status.ods : Add a sheet to track Roles. - http://bit.ly/9KVKsz | 01:17 |
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Getty | before i do something bad, can i install it via CPAN? cause the webpage "recommends" to use that but i dont know if that includes cpan way of install | 03:39 |
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+perlDreamer | Getty, you cannot install WebGUI from CPAN. | 05:09 |
+perlDreamer | you can download a full VM, you can download the WRE (which is basically application level install with full software stack) or you do a "source install" where you download the WebGUI source, install the modules, configure apache, mysql, set up the filesystem and run it yourself. | 05:10 |
Getty | the middle version, please, where is the exit? ;) j/k | 05:11 |
Getty | ok so i got already a running environment | 05:11 |
Getty | then i should prefer the source install if i know what i do in general? ;) | 05:12 |
Getty | i wanted to install it via CPAN on a local::lib path for the webserver vhost, so that would be then source install of modules + local::lib with the same result, right? | 05:13 |
Getty | or is there anything special that blocks that plan? | 05:13 |
+perlDreamer | for the WebGUI modules, no | 05:16 |
+perlDreamer | but several of the support scripts expect to be close to the lib directory | 05:16 |
+perlDreamer | as in ../lib only | 05:16 |
+perlDreamer | if you know what you're doing in general, you can do a source install | 05:16 |
+perlDreamer | although one other reason to use the WRE is performance | 05:16 |
+perlDreamer | it sets up two different servers, one small one as reverse proxy and static file server, and one "heavy" one to handle mod_perl | 05:17 |
Getty | but it would collide with my personal install? | 05:17 |
+perlDreamer | you can set your environment to keep them separate, except for MySQL | 05:18 |
+perlDreamer | it depends on what you want to do with it | 05:18 |
+perlDreamer | if you want to tinker, a source install is best | 05:18 |
Getty | actually microsite, private, no hits | 05:18 |
Getty | i just want to use a perl CMS | 05:18 |
+perlDreamer | a source install is right up your alley then | 05:18 |
+perlDreamer | download WebGUI | 05:18 |
Getty | and start doing what i prayed now on the cebit for 1 week | 05:18 |
+perlDreamer | untar it in /data | 05:18 |
+perlDreamer | run /data/WebGUI/sbin/testEnvironment.pl to check for requirements and/or install them | 05:19 |
+perlDreamer | http://www.webgui.org/wiki/source-install | 05:20 |
+perlDreamer | that page has all the gory details | 05:20 |
Getty | cool | 05:22 |
Getty | a little bad that noone actually told me about WebGUI before the CeBIT | 05:22 |
+perlDreamer | Why? | 05:22 |
Getty | cause the "CMS" stuff was a theme from time to time and we didnt had any suggestion beside Bruccolage or how its written | 05:23 |
Getty | i was there representing perl | 05:23 |
+perlDreamer | our promotional efforts for WebGUI wax and wane | 05:24 |
+perlDreamer | two years ago they did the whole conference tour in the US | 05:24 |
+perlDreamer | and came to YAPC EU in portugal last summer | 05:24 |
Getty | oh cool, so that isnt that bad for you | 05:24 |
+perlDreamer | no, but more users is always better | 05:24 |
Getty | yeah but CeBIT is actually really big as you know probably | 05:24 |
Getty | actually we took lots of contacts with us of people and companies who wanna do more with perl | 05:24 |
Getty | and now i got WebGUI as something to show, actually with that installer process you said its really an awesome idea | 05:25 |
Getty | but i must dive into it to REALLY value it, cause i also do own CMS activities (which i didnt promoted on CeBIT ;) ) and do the CMS agency business since the stuff is there, i'm very critic | 05:26 |
+perlDreamer | well, feel free to come back with questions, comments and criticisms | 05:26 |
Getty | i stay here :-P | 05:26 |
* Getty never leaves ;) | 05:26 |
+perlDreamer | well, feel free to say here and ask questions, too ;) | 05:27 |
Getty | hehe ;) | 05:27 |
Getty | its 4:30 here, at 8:30 i must getup for the "last breakfast" with all other perl dudes of cebit before we leave hannover | 05:27 |
Getty | and i didnt slept more then 4-5 hours the last 5 days | 05:28 |
Getty | i'm so wasted | 05:28 |
+perlDreamer | is that pretty common for a CeBIT? | 05:28 |
Getty | if you want to promote perl AT ALL COST, yes | 05:28 |
Getty | i did many contacts via drinking at the after show parties | 05:28 |
Getty | that was actually my speciality of the crew | 05:28 |
Getty | but that way i opened up a dialog to IBM, lets see whats come out there | 05:29 |
Getty | and russia and macedonien | 05:29 |
+perlDreamer | cool. Someone was been adding to the Russian WebGUI translation recently, but it is still low in overall coverage | 05:29 |
Getty | on russia i got mainly contact to research and development of russia, dont know how much "CMS" they actually need | 05:30 |
Getty | we are also more there to open a dialog | 05:30 |
Getty | its about knowing what is missing for more perl on business | 05:30 |
Getty | btw: http://search.cpan.org/dist/Perl-Staff | 05:30 |
+perlDreamer | cool, open-source conference staffing | 05:36 |
Getty | i made the t-shirts and will make more for other events | 05:37 |
Getty | i like webgui, i mean the presentation is awesome | 05:42 |
Getty | i need sleep n8 | 05:44 |
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elnino | so. I have an article asset, with a flv and a jpg attachemnt. I was hoping I could get the flv by using attachment.url and the image by using image.url, or do I have to use the attachment loop, and chech for isimage and assume that when false, it's the flv? Make sense? | 07:51 |
@preaction | heh, CeBIT sounds like the last WUC I was at | 08:41 |
* preaction only missed 4 hours of presentations due to hangover | 08:41 |
@preaction | which reminds me i have to register for the next YAPC | 08:41 |
@preaction | elnino: use the loop, it's more reliable | 08:42 |
elnino | ok. thanks preaction. | 08:42 |
* preaction wishes you could just put those attachments inside the article yourself | 08:42 |
elnino | I remember such conversation not to long ago. | 08:42 |
@preaction | yeah, it still hurts | 08:43 |
elnino | =) | 08:43 |
@preaction | it will hurt until it gets fixed | 08:43 |
@preaction | if i could nuke all of WebGUI 7 and 8 and rebuild it all from scratch... | 08:43 |
@preaction | oh wait, i'm already doing it... http://github.com/preaction/modern-webgui | 08:43 |
elnino | you are a very busy person. | 08:44 |
@preaction | not really, haven't worked on that in 3 months :'( | 08:47 |
elnino | perhaps that is true at github, but I know here you are. | 08:48 |
@preaction | well, yeah i'm working on other stuff | 08:48 |
elnino | I'm calling it quits. Too much fun for the weekend. Putting video site together using flowplayer. kinda cool. | 08:49 |
@preaction | heard good things about flowplayer, but yeah, it's sunday now, get some rest sheesh | 08:49 |
elnino | so is github the new sourceforge? | 08:49 |
@preaction | pretty much yeah | 08:49 |
@preaction | git is soooooo much nicer than svn | 08:49 |
@preaction | like ten thousand percent nicer | 08:50 |
elnino | hmm. I'll look at git later.. Good night! | 08:52 |
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Getty | so... finally home from cebit, now i can checkout webgui and check if i can make a webpage with blog in an hour ;) | 20:05 |
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doc777 | Hello friends. We recently upgraded to 7.7.33-stable and all our log in boxes, most of the user profile boxes, and the create account boxes are at 100 pixels now. They scroll off the side of the page. This seems to be the case in admin settings as well. Did I miss something? | 21:24 |
Getty | LOL that is really purposed that if i do: perl testEnvironment.pl --help i get the source in my viewer? ;) | 21:38 |
Getty | ah no, i see, its a debian workaround for people who dont have perl-doc, so ok :) never came to that | 21:41 |
doc777 | Anyone know why our username boxes all went to 100 px after our upgrade? The text boxes scroll off the side the page :o) | 22:23 |
doc777 | I upgraded to 7.8.14 to see if it would help but they are still the same looks like. | 22:24 |
Getty | damn it, the parser cant read my config | 22:58 |
doc777 | lol, there is a setting in the Admin > setting >ui now for Text Box Size and it was set to 100. After an hour of digging through templates and macros I found it :o) | 22:59 |
Getty | bad question: does it actually require 5.8? or does it also work with 5.10 | 23:01 |
doc777 | What are you trying to do? :o) | 23:03 |
@preaction | Getty: 5.10 is fine | 23:03 |
Getty | http://paste.debian.net/63039/ | 23:04 |
Getty | i dont get it, what he has as problem, the json itself looks fine | 23:07 |
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@preaction | Getty: paste your config file | 23:13 |
Getty | yeah mom | 23:14 |
@preaction | trailing commas is usually the culprit | 23:14 |
Getty | http://paste.debian.net/63043/ | 23:14 |
Getty | the last trailing comma? | 23:14 |
Getty | cause i put it in cause it was also on the page | 23:14 |
@preaction | that's your entire config file? | 23:15 |
Getty | i do a source install | 23:15 |
Getty | going after the help in the wiki | 23:15 |
@preaction | yes, but you have to start from WebGUI.conf.original | 23:15 |
@preaction | otherwise here you have no assets, no admin console items, no nothing really | 23:16 |
Getty | AH! i missed that step | 23:16 |
Getty | ok thta would explain it probably ;) | 23:16 |
@preaction | also, the entire thing is a hash, so it should be surrounded with { ... } | 23:16 |
Getty | true, but my brain is just half working, i just went after the doc | 23:17 |
Getty | and missed one step ;) | 23:17 |
Getty | classic | 23:17 |
@preaction | it happens. problem is that most of this stuff is easy to determine (or easy to ask for), so we should really have a script to create site configs (and generate apache or other configs from a wg site config) | 23:18 |
Getty | yeah its all a bit shacky, but you guys seem to concentrated on the features ;) cause it took hours to install all the modules ;) | 23:20 |
Getty | for example i was confused that this preload script really needs a fix of the path | 23:21 |
@preaction | yeah, that's my biggest pet peeve | 23:22 |
Getty | OH! | 23:22 |
Getty | now i got a problem | 23:22 |
Getty | jhehe | 23:22 |
Getty | i now have it working, and it directly startups the config (logical).. and i made that all on my live site hehe | 23:23 |
Getty | i mean i stopped it now | 23:23 |
Getty | aehm.,... mmhh.. must allow my ip only.. baeh stress.... | 23:23 |
Getty | or wait, can i force that with the adminip? | 23:23 |
Getty | so that noone else get the admin? | 23:23 |
Getty | i mean that init stuff | 23:23 |
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@preaction | i think that's what that is for | 23:24 |
Getty | ok lets see | 23:24 |
@preaction | and when you change config, remember to restart apache | 23:24 |
Getty | bad to test hehe | 23:25 |
Getty | its stopped right now anyway | 23:25 |
Getty | spectre actually only uses spectre.conf right? | 23:25 |
Getty | so restarting of him is not often required? or what is the regular way to go for him? | 23:26 |
Getty | dont know what that daemon does | 23:26 |
@preaction | no, it reads the other configs to know where to go, but unless you change the sitename or spectreIp or spectreSubnets you don't need to restart spectre | 23:26 |
@preaction | spectre is the offline execution engine, like cronjobs but also things that take too long to do in realtime with the user waiting for a page response | 23:26 |
Getty | ah nice idea | 23:27 |
Getty | does it really use IKC? cause i saw that module on the list of required stuff | 23:28 |
@preaction | yes, in order to pull status requests from outside (using the same spectre.pl script you can get the status of spectre) | 23:28 |
Getty | it doesnt work with the admin subnet | 23:31 |
Getty | i tried it with lynx on the server and still so the init config :-/ | 23:32 |
@preaction | oh, the admin bar doesn't work with lynx, it's javascript-only | 23:32 |
@preaction | admin mode requires javascript | 23:32 |
@preaction | however, a quick ssh tunnel could fix that up for you | 23:32 |
@preaction | that's usually what i do when i need to get around The Big Firewall to administer some stuff | 23:33 |
Getty | wait wait | 23:35 |
Getty | i'm still at the config | 23:35 |
Getty | first startup | 23:35 |
Getty | that i wanted to have blocked to a specific IP | 23:36 |
Getty | cause i do that all here on a live system (my private site, so who cares) | 23:36 |
Getty | but i got regulary hits | 23:36 |
Getty | dont want someone else to config my stuff ;) | 23:36 |
Getty | now i made allow/deny in the apache2 | 23:36 |
Getty | wowowowowoowowowowoww | 23:47 |
Getty | that stuff is heavy | 23:47 |
Getty | awesome work | 23:47 |
Getty | i'm impressed | 23:47 |
Getty | right now i just got total overflow, now idea where to start really | 23:49 |
Getty | but ok it runs... ;) | 23:49 |
Getty | but the admin menu is totally confusing and actually now i got even an error about the display | 23:52 |
@preaction | https://www.plainblack.com/services/training/webgui-primer <- free webgui primer might help | 23:55 |
@preaction | but the error, pastebin that and i'll see what's up | 23:55 |
Getty | its just displaying error, the cascading failed, or it was just to slow loading, dont know, didnt happened so far | 23:58 |
Getty | but the menu is confusing, that always the left side "goes away" and you stand in the middle of nowhere | 23:58 |
Getty | actually i have totally no idea how i edit the menu so remove add new files there or delete the existing one | 23:59 |
Getty | ah that is no error | 23:59 |
Getty | if i watch the navigation emnu .. yeah ok.. i get it | 23:59 |
--- Day changed Mon Mar 08 2010 |
Getty | ey is there a "make anything empty" button? ;) lol | 00:00 |
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Getty | re good morning and all :) more activity now? | 10:36 |
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SDuensin | Greetings. | 18:13 |
+perlDreamer | Hey, SDuensin | 18:14 |
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+perlDreamer | preaction: what kind of evaluation did you do with HTML::Packer when used with HTML::Template? | 19:02 |
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+perlDreamer | bartjol: I did some remodeling work this weekend. | 19:26 |
+perlDreamer | I still hurt | 19:26 |
+perlDreamer | No pictures are available, either | 19:27 |
+bartjol | ah, | 19:27 |
+bartjol | how did it hurt? | 19:27 |
+bartjol | on your eyes? | 19:27 |
+perlDreamer | no, crawling on rafters in the attic | 19:28 |
+perlDreamer | hands, knees, elbows | 19:29 |
+perlDreamer | neck, back, legs | 19:29 |
+bartjol | aah | 19:31 |
+perlDreamer | I needed to reroute some electricity to a new outlet | 19:32 |
+perlDreamer | for a new microwave | 19:32 |
+bartjol | in the big hole in the wall | 19:32 |
+perlDreamer | because we killed the old microwave by putting it on a heavily loaded circuit | 19:32 |
+perlDreamer | fortunately, no big holes | 19:32 |
+bartjol | I thought you made the hole, to fit the microwave in | 19:33 |
+perlDreamer | we took out part of a cabinet | 19:33 |
+perlDreamer | this weekend, during the install, I'll take some pictures | 19:33 |
+bartjol | nice | 19:34 |
+bartjol | I mainly stuggled with a driver today, but I won! | 19:34 |
+perlDreamer | driver? Van, bus, bicycle or car? | 19:37 |
+bartjol | bluetooth computer driver | 19:38 |
dionak | are you remodeling your kitchen perlDreamer? | 19:38 |
+perlDreamer | we are adding a new microwave over the stove | 19:38 |
+bartjol | but I'm off, have fun | 19:38 |
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dionak | we're prepping to gut our entire kitchen at home. maybe starting april or may | 19:44 |
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dreamersgirl | it's quiet today. | 20:13 |
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+perlDreamer | dionak, we'd like to do that too | 21:04 |
+perlDreamer | something about rough finished plywood cabinetry from the '60s is just not that appealing anymore :) | 21:04 |
dionak | yea, we're feeling the same perlDreamer. | 21:06 |
dionak | must have been cool & hip at the time | 21:06 |
* perlDreamer is thinking "cheap", "quick" and "easy" | 21:07 |
+perlDreamer | none of the cabinet or drawer faces have trim work. so the plywood has chipped | 21:07 |
dionak | we've already done the cheap, quick and easy. it's time to do a bigger overhaul so we can quit getting annoyed by not being able to walk through the kitchen when the fridge is open. ;) | 21:13 |
dionak | it's going to be an undertaking to say the least.. | 21:13 |
dionak | quick question... | 21:13 |
dionak | could the upgrade of WebGUI be enhanced to check to see if tables exist before trying to create them? | 21:14 |
dionak | seems like that would make upgrading easier | 21:14 |
+perlDreamer | it would certainly help with repeating upgrades, or handling hand backported code | 21:15 |
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+perlDreamer | and it would be more of an enforcement check than anything | 21:16 |
+perlDreamer | since so many different authors contribute code | 21:17 |
+perlDreamer | we'd have to review the table insert code by hand | 21:17 |
dionak | you mean table create? | 21:17 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 21:18 |
dionak | true... | 21:18 |
+perlDreamer | are you still having upgrade hiccups? | 21:18 |
dionak | i'm thinking that before anything is done, a sub should execute to check that any table creations do not already exist | 21:18 |
dionak | yes | 21:18 |
dionak | damn thing is working now when it should be broken. ;) | 21:19 |
+perlDreamer | I hate it when that happens | 21:19 |
dionak | lol, yea | 21:19 |
+perlDreamer | like when I do electrical work at home, and it works the first time | 21:19 |
+perlDreamer | I don't know whether to be proud, or suspicious... | 21:19 |
dionak | exactly! | 21:19 |
dionak | or if it will come back to bite me later | 21:20 |
+perlDreamer | yeah | 21:20 |
+perlDreamer | Am I having deja vu, or didn't we talk about this last week or so? | 21:20 |
+perlDreamer | the solution was to drop the database before rerunning the upgrade | 21:20 |
+perlDreamer | since importing the backup code will not remove the new tables | 21:21 |
dionak | yea, we did. this is the first chance i've had to work on it. it's more of a data corruption issue with orphaned assetIds in the db | 21:21 |
dionak | i've been writing a script to find orphans so i can address them and either 1) find a home or 2) remove them | 21:21 |
dionak | .. by either | 21:21 |
dionak | e.g. - there's an entry in assetData but not asset for an ID | 21:22 |
+perlDreamer | seems like there are so many cases | 21:22 |
+perlDreamer | asset, but not assetData | 21:22 |
+perlDreamer | assetData, but not Asset | 21:22 |
+perlDreamer | ... not Wobject | 21:22 |
dionak | yes | 21:22 |
+perlDreamer | or not table specific | 21:22 |
+perlDreamer | or in those tables, but not asset; | 21:22 |
+perlDreamer | and the worst will be Photo, or Newsletter | 21:23 |
dionak | why's that? | 21:23 |
+perlDreamer | since they are Asset/File/GalleryFile/Photo (4 tables) | 21:23 |
dionak | ugh | 21:23 |
+perlDreamer | Asset/Wobect/Collaboration/Newsletter (also 4 tables) | 21:23 |
dionak | ok, now you're just pushing me away perlDreamer :/ | 21:24 |
+perlDreamer | no, I don't mean to do that | 21:24 |
dionak | kidding | 21:24 |
dionak | it's a pita | 21:24 |
dionak | (not kidding) | 21:24 |
+perlDreamer | exactly | 21:24 |
+perlDreamer | one of the wg8 suggestions was to flatten the tables | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | and make them non-, uh | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | hm | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | unnormalized | 21:25 |
dionak | what about innodb? | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | innodb is slower in performance, I believe | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | the goal of this was actually to speed it up | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | by not spreading the data across several tables and thereby dropping the joins | 21:26 |
+perlDreamer | I want to say it was 8x faster | 21:26 |
dionak | how much slower is it to work with given the added complexity? or does it make it simplier? | 21:26 |
+perlDreamer | it's simpler | 21:27 |
+perlDreamer | writing only writes to 1 table | 21:27 |
+perlDreamer | and reading only reads from 1 table | 21:27 |
+perlDreamer | no joins | 21:27 |
+perlDreamer | searching is now much more difficult | 21:27 |
dionak | ls | 21:27 |
dionak | oops | 21:27 |
dionak | i definitely think that asset and assetData could collapse | 21:28 |
dionak | theoretically | 21:29 |
+perlDreamer | wouldn't it be weird to have versioned and unversioned data in the same table? | 21:31 |
dionak | hm, you're right | 21:33 |
dionak | i have a script now that mostly figures out orphaned data. going to test it on a staging server now | 21:33 |
* dionak needs coffee | 21:36 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rd0884af / (10 files in 3 dirs): Do not remove newlines from Templates (or Snippets) since HTML::Packer does not handle newlines with H::T syntax. Fixes bug #11458 - http://bit.ly/du0jQ9 | 21:39 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r1e4fb86 / (10 files in 3 dirs): Do not remove newlines from Templates (or Snippets) since HTML::Packer does not handle newlines with H::T syntax. Fixes bug #11458 - http://bit.ly/ayCW6v | 21:39 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, it happened again, only backwards this time | 21:41 |
+perlDreamer | on the 7.7 upgrade, since there was no import node in the package none of the isPackage or isDefault properties were set | 21:42 |
+perlDreamer | now, since there is an import node, EVERY asset below import had isPackage turned off, and isDefault set to 1 | 21:43 |
+perlDreamer | what we need is metadata out of the package | 21:45 |
+perlDreamer | a list of all assetIds that it touched | 21:45 |
+perlDreamer | and then we post process those alone | 21:46 |
+perlDreamer | so it no uses lineage at all | 21:46 |
+perlDreamer | we could also add more options to importAssetData, like "clearPackageFlag" and "setDefaultTemplate" | 21:53 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, preaction, I'm leaning pretty heavily toward adding options. In lieu of any feedback, I'll decide when I come back from a run. | 22:01 |
@preaction | the options sounds fine to me | 22:01 |
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--- Day changed Tue Mar 09 2010 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Luke Robinson master * rc61e745 / (8 files in 4 dirs): An Ajax check on the username field at registration - http://bit.ly/9aF0WD | 01:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Luke Robinson master * rc03bcc3 / (3 files in 3 dirs): | 01:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: use the FormHelper instead of the Auth system for the Ajax check | 01:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: on Username - http://bit.ly/az9kKr | 01:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Luke Robinson master * r240eb10 / www/extras/form/fieldCheck.js : call getWebguiProperty('extrasURL') - http://bit.ly/ckBI7A | 01:25 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Doug Bell master * rc8ad650 / docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt : added changelog entry - http://bit.ly/9OFNuE | 01:29 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * rcf43e5e / (6 files in 3 dirs): Reset the isDefault flag on core assets only, and provide a final way fix this crap once and for all. - http://bit.ly/9KUaFI | 02:32 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r3113905 / (3 files): Prune duplicate code for post package work. - http://bit.ly/9GqmMQ | 02:32 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r84704d2 / (4 files): Fix syntax errors, and remove duplicate code from the skeleton. - http://bit.ly/9Lebud | 02:32 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rfe31cc9 / (5 files in 3 dirs): Reset the isDefault flag on core assets only, and provide a final way fix this crap once and for all. - http://bit.ly/dBPDML | 02:37 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rdf31846 / (2 files): Prune duplicate code for post package work. - http://bit.ly/ahh2Zb | 02:37 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r2053d3e / (3 files): Fix syntax errors, and remove duplicate code from the skeleton. - http://bit.ly/dbNxFm | 02:37 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r35492ca / (3 files in 2 dirs): Remove old WebGUI 7.7 files - http://bit.ly/9yt3Vo | 02:37 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r8f95101 / (3 files in 3 dirs): Allow the default Search root to be overridden by a form variable. Adds RFE #11460. - http://bit.ly/bPBryq | 03:09 |
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SDuensin | Greetings. | 16:25 |
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+bartjol | morning scott | 16:30 |
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+bartjol | cool, someone tried to sell us virtual servers | 17:59 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, you _need_ virtual servers | 17:59 |
+perlDreamer | they are so much better than real servers | 18:00 |
+bartjol | well, we need them allright, otherwise we haven't got anything to sell | 18:00 |
+bartjol | oh, and a conscience question: which bathroom looks better, mine, or Tavis's? | 18:01 |
+perlDreamer | I've never been in Tavis's bathroom, so I couldn't say | 18:02 |
+perlDreamer | is he advertising it somewhere? | 18:02 |
+perlDreamer | you bathroom is much better than any of mine, however | 18:02 |
+bartjol | it was also on facebook | 18:02 |
+bartjol | any of yours.... | 18:03 |
+bartjol | patser | 18:03 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, I don't have a facebook account | 18:03 |
+bartjol | your wife has | 18:03 |
+bartjol | just hack into her account | 18:03 |
+perlDreamer | afaik, hacking (even into a wife's account) is illegal | 18:04 |
Getty | legal, illegal.... | 18:04 |
Getty | "details" | 18:04 |
+bartjol | smetails | 18:04 |
+perlDreamer | legal, illegal | 18:04 |
+perlDreamer | good, evil | 18:04 |
+perlDreamer | matter, antimatter | 18:05 |
+perlDreamer | polar opposites | 18:05 |
Getty | jedi, sith | 18:05 |
+perlDreamer | now, dead vs partially dead is about details | 18:05 |
Getty | its not all black & white, be darth vader! | 18:05 |
+perlDreamer | or should I say "mostly dead" | 18:05 |
Getty | hey, i installed btw webgui now | 18:05 |
+bartjol | mostly harmless | 18:05 |
Getty | directly run into one big "security" problem | 18:05 |
+bartjol | ah | 18:05 |
Getty | about first time install | 18:05 |
+bartjol | which is? | 18:05 |
Getty | i'm a geek, so i used my own live site for the direct install, so.... must i talk further? | 18:06 |
+bartjol | mmm | 18:06 |
Getty | i had to make Allow/Deny stuff | 18:06 |
Getty | to prevent others from reaching my vhost | 18:06 |
Getty | the admin-network setting doesnt work for the install | 18:06 |
+bartjol | in modproxy you mean? | 18:06 |
Getty | with apache stuff, is that modproxy? dont know | 18:07 |
+bartjol | yes | 18:07 |
Getty | <Directory /> Deny.... | 18:07 |
Getty | you know what i mean | 18:07 |
+bartjol | yeah | 18:07 |
Getty | i tried before with the admin-network setting in webgui | 18:07 |
Getty | and tested | 18:07 |
Getty | but this doesnt protect it | 18:07 |
+bartjol | is that a default apache directive? | 18:09 |
Getty | no no i mean in webgui.conf | 18:13 |
Getty | there i can setup an admin-network-range | 18:13 |
Getty | this is ignored for install, which is bad if you do it directly on a known site | 18:13 |
+bartjol | well, if you set such a thing, you want it to work | 18:15 |
+bartjol | I haven't used that option yet | 18:15 |
+perlDreamer | except it doens't cover that | 18:15 |
+perlDreamer | "admin network" is the network setting that allows/prevents people to go into Admin mode | 18:16 |
+perlDreamer | it does not cover setup/install | 18:16 |
+bartjol | ooh | 18:16 |
+perlDreamer | but that sounds like a good feature to add | 18:16 |
+perlDreamer | Getty, development for our next version is currently open, so if you want to file an RFE at webgui.org/rfe, it will be considered | 18:16 |
+perlDreamer | of course, RFEs filed with patches are much more likely to get added more quickly | 18:17 |
+bartjol | well, since that is always on a port 60834, we open that only in our firewall for ourselves, which might not be very save as default | 18:17 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, this is WebGUI install, not wreconsole | 18:17 |
+bartjol | ah | 18:17 |
+bartjol | I thought that used the same port, learned something again | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | no, all that stuff is served over port 80 via a content handler | 18:18 |
+bartjol | ah | 18:18 |
+bartjol | well, then it isn't a very save feature | 18:19 |
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+perlDreamer | maybe we should consider it a bug | 18:19 |
+perlDreamer | it seems low risk, since you have a limited window of opportunity | 18:20 |
+bartjol | but I always do a "mail to all" when I install webgui | 18:20 |
+bartjol | sorry | 18:20 |
+bartjol | time of day I suppose | 18:21 |
Getty | perlDreamer: i'm involved into many projects and go more and more into the "oh dudes i fill up your bugtracker all day so that you will hate me" dude, even tho i dont see much wrong on your side so far | 18:22 |
Getty | the other "big problem" i see and which you probably already know is your <censored> admin interface | 18:22 |
Getty | its totally confusing where to find what and if you edit something its different again, that is a bit chaotic | 18:23 |
Getty | i think this has historical reasons ;) | 18:23 |
Getty | but dudes, when i started this stuff now, i want to startup clean, or lets say, i want to setup step by step what i want, that premade site confuses me.... i worked with some commercial CMS with generally followed your concept of coordination for the data, so its all very clear i think when i get into the first steps | 18:25 |
+perlDreamer | Getty, I'm not sure what you mean by "when you edit something it's different again" | 18:26 |
+perlDreamer | and we never hate people who file bugs | 18:27 |
+perlDreamer | if more people filed bugs, WebGUI would be better | 18:27 |
+bartjol | perlDreamer loves to solve bugs, he eats them for breakfast | 18:27 |
Getty | yeah and i will fill bugs, but i think its a good choice, even tho i got my own concepts running, WebGUI should be something that gives a "second leg" | 18:27 |
Getty | hehehe | 18:27 |
Getty | yummie | 18:27 |
+perlDreamer | the only problem we've had in the past is what some people consider bugs are really enhancements | 18:27 |
+perlDreamer | and if so, we move them to the RFE board instead of the bug board | 18:28 |
Getty | oh i think i will make the definitions right at that point, doing that stuff long enough | 18:28 |
Getty | but so tell me... how i would actually get my site empty and can start defining "first page"? or probably i could say what i want in final cause i dont need much | 18:28 |
Getty | but i made so much contacts on the cebit and need definitly fast a good page best with a perl CMS so that i can also promote that i did it with WebGUI | 18:29 |
Getty | someone else just suggested me FosWIKI and i dont want to go with kindergarten stuff, i'm enterprise (even for my homepage) hehe | 18:29 |
+bartjol | in the settings you can define your homepage | 18:29 |
+perlDreamer | to clear the default content, log in as an admin | 18:29 |
+perlDreamer | turn on admin mode | 18:29 |
+perlDreamer | go to Assets | 18:29 |
+perlDreamer | go to the Root node | 18:29 |
+perlDreamer | select the home page | 18:30 |
+perlDreamer | and trash it | 18:30 |
Getty | sounds like a plan | 18:30 |
+perlDreamer | that will remove all the default content | 18:30 |
+bartjol | and empty the trash, that's looks nice for your lineage | 18:30 |
Getty | good :) | 18:30 |
+perlDreamer | and frees up the URLs, too | 18:30 |
+perlDreamer | good call bartjol | 18:30 |
+bartjol | Getty: you will get stuck with those articles on each site you add | 18:30 |
Getty | mh? | 18:31 |
Getty | dont get that you wanna say with this? | 18:31 |
Getty | oh | 18:31 |
Getty | yes | 18:31 |
+bartjol | ah, that every time you add a site | 18:31 |
Getty | you mean its there on every startup | 18:31 |
Getty | yeah logical :) | 18:31 |
+bartjol | those articles will be there to be deleted | 18:31 |
+bartjol | indeed :) | 18:31 |
Getty | but i think i can bring on a WebGUI module which gives me the chance to say: hey i want my own startup definition, right? | 18:32 |
+bartjol | sure you can make that | 18:32 |
Getty | see, problem solved | 18:32 |
Getty | technology owns! | 18:32 |
+perlDreamer | you'd have to alter create.sql | 18:32 |
+perlDreamer | so it's a little more complex than that | 18:32 |
+bartjol | but after an upgrade the default file is overridden | 18:32 |
Getty | i would actually modify the install procedure that way | 18:32 |
+perlDreamer | it would be better to run a post-install script that does the dirty work for you | 18:32 |
+bartjol | well, I considered that part as logical for a geek :P | 18:33 |
+perlDreamer | removing the default content, and installing some other package | 18:33 |
+bartjol | that would be a lovely script | 18:33 |
Getty | well as professional i would consider as most luxury if i could define my own "install procedure way" which also automatically installs the DB tables without doing any create.sql insert by my own | 18:33 |
Getty | yeah i'm the one with the evil wishes | 18:34 |
+perlDreamer | no, other people have wished for that as well | 18:34 |
Getty | can we actually do this with a module? | 18:34 |
+perlDreamer | no | 18:34 |
Getty | or would that go to deep? | 18:34 |
Getty | so its a bug | 18:34 |
Getty | lol | 18:34 |
+perlDreamer | the default content is installed with create.sql | 18:34 |
+perlDreamer | along with the default users, groups, templates, css, settings, etc. | 18:35 |
* bartjol is thinking utility script | 18:35 |
Getty | yeah but i dont want to put the create.sql myself | 18:35 |
Getty | i'm lazy | 18:35 |
+perlDreamer | that's what the WRE is for :) | 18:35 |
Getty | i want to give him database user/password and he does that for me | 18:35 |
+perlDreamer | addsite.pl | 18:35 |
+bartjol | he? JT? | 18:35 |
Getty | yeah but i'm also offering it on my own facilities ;) | 18:35 |
Getty | even tho i LOVE the idea of WRE | 18:36 |
+perlDreamer | that's the tradeoff you make | 18:36 |
Getty | its awesome | 18:36 |
+perlDreamer | but I'm sure the WRE utilities could be changed to work outside the WRE | 18:37 |
+bartjol | but goodday to you sirs | 18:38 |
Getty | ok i will go to the bank now and then get some red bull | 18:38 |
+perlDreamer | later, house-hacker | 18:38 |
Getty | then i will try that with cleaning up the content | 18:38 |
Getty | andstartup my site | 18:38 |
+bartjol | someone elses house today | 18:38 |
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Getty | perlDreamer: you stay here? ;) | 18:39 |
* perlDreamer will be in and out all day long | 18:39 |
+perlDreamer | I go the gym, then work | 18:39 |
+perlDreamer | eat lunch, then work | 18:39 |
+perlDreamer | pick up the children from school, then work | 18:39 |
+perlDreamer | fix dinner, then work | 18:39 |
+perlDreamer | it's PWM for employment | 18:39 |
Getty | i'm fat, no gym | 18:40 |
Getty | i got a dude who cooks for me, eating at computer | 18:40 |
Getty | i dont have kids | 18:40 |
Getty | and i also work from home | 18:40 |
Getty | so.. actually | 18:40 |
Getty | why i stand up? oh yes toilet | 18:40 |
+perlDreamer | and to get red bull | 18:40 |
Getty | yes! | 18:40 |
Getty | but thats flying ;) | 18:40 |
Getty | so back on track | 18:52 |
Getty | ok i startup the WebGUI again on my site | 18:52 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * rf4f3f0c / (2 files in 2 dirs): Handle the edge case when a subscription group has been deleted, but the the Subscribable entry has not been cleaned up. Fixes bug #11456. - http://bit.ly/b9aiWr | 18:52 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rf55acec / (2 files in 2 dirs): Handle the edge case when a subscription group has been deleted, but the the Subscribable entry has not been cleaned up. Fixes bug #11456. - http://bit.ly/aOVFUI | 18:53 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r58c25e3 / docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt : Fix changelog formatting. - http://bit.ly/daFOmB | 18:53 |
Getty | now its suddenly german?! | 19:02 |
Getty | i dont get it, when i installed it, i choosed german, then it was german, then it was suddenly english everything and now its german again... mh | 19:02 |
+perlDreamer | Getty, language settings are user dependent | 19:03 |
Getty | i just used one user so far | 19:04 |
Getty | on the default install | 19:04 |
Getty | what is the root node? isnt it "getting started"? | 19:04 |
Getty | cause deleting that one wasnt any effect | 19:04 |
+perlDreamer | no, go into the Admin Console and select Assets | 19:04 |
Getty | yeah | 19:04 |
Getty | i am there | 19:04 |
+perlDreamer | On the top there's a crumb trail. Choose Root | 19:05 |
Getty | AH! | 19:05 |
Getty | a bit small ok get it | 19:05 |
Getty | Home then delete ok | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | then Admin Console->Trash | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | then select and purge | 19:05 |
Getty | wait | 19:05 |
Getty | its still there | 19:05 |
Getty | yeah tried it again | 19:06 |
Getty | no effect | 19:06 |
Getty | clicked on "Home" then Delete | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | check your log files | 19:06 |
Getty | and he does something | 19:06 |
Getty | you say that so easy mom | 19:06 |
+perlDreamer | sorry, standard user debug flow | 19:07 |
Getty | webgui.log doesnt throws an error | 19:07 |
Getty | i had to search where i have put the logfile ;) i did the install 2 days ago | 19:07 |
+perlDreamer | it's the log level, it's set too high | 19:07 |
+perlDreamer | the problem is that /home is set to be the default page for the site | 19:07 |
+perlDreamer | create some other page for now, in the Settings, choose the other page | 19:08 |
+perlDreamer | then it will let you delete the default content | 19:08 |
Getty | ok | 19:08 |
+perlDreamer | either that, or just delete all content below the home page | 19:08 |
+perlDreamer | takes more clicks | 19:08 |
Getty | ok i made a new page | 19:09 |
Getty | but it doesnt have the "+" | 19:09 |
Getty | i think that is what it needs, or? | 19:09 |
Getty | ah no that is just there is something under it, ok | 19:09 |
Getty | now i'M getting it | 19:10 |
+perlDreamer | right, + means the asset has children | 19:10 |
+perlDreamer | have you downloaded and read the WebGUI Starter guide? | 19:10 |
Getty | http://www.raudssus.de/ :D | 19:11 |
Getty | i want to ;) | 19:11 |
+perlDreamer | that gives me a 403 error | 19:12 |
Getty | oh yes wait | 19:12 |
Getty | reload ;) | 19:12 |
+perlDreamer | much better | 19:15 |
+perlDreamer | now, go to the marketplace page on webgui.org and download a good looking style to install | 19:16 |
* perlDreamer goes to the gym for punishment | 19:16 |
Getty | have fun | 19:16 |
Getty | mh | 19:18 |
Getty | where to upload it now | 19:18 |
Getty | i always get error on extracting :-/ | 19:26 |
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+perlDreamer | Getty, if the package is very old, it may not work on recent WebGUI's | 20:17 |
+perlDreamer | also, it would be good to examine the log files to see what the problem was | 20:18 |
+perlDreamer | a very common user problem is permissions on the upload directory | 20:18 |
+perlDreamer | the upload directory and all children need to be writable by the apache process owner | 20:18 |
Getty | i had it now with 2 themes | 20:21 |
Getty | actually the only 2 themes which i like really | 20:21 |
Getty | mh ok probably its just that | 20:21 |
Getty | let me check log | 20:22 |
Getty | yes it is that ;) | 20:22 |
Getty | AH! wait! | 20:22 |
Getty | he suggest wrong path | 20:22 |
Getty | ok got it | 20:22 |
Getty | damn it again | 20:23 |
+perlDreamer | a whole series from Damian about vim scripting: http://blogs.perl.org/users/ovid/2010/03/whats-the-mad-doctor-doing.html | 20:28 |
Getty | i dont get this step: Click on the "class icon" of the page layout asset that is your home page. The Layout asset is very similar to a page and has an icon on the far left side of the edit toolbar that resembles a piece of paper. If you hover over this icon, it will say "Page Layout". This icon is called the "class icon" | 20:28 |
Getty | i'm at the page layout asset, and edited it but i dont see that piece of paper icon? | 20:28 |
+perlDreamer | It's a little obtuse | 20:31 |
+perlDreamer | The class icon is displayed with the other toolbar icons | 20:31 |
+perlDreamer | cut, copy, paste, delete, make shortcut, edit | 20:31 |
+perlDreamer | if you actually edit it, you won't get the class icon with the drop down menu | 20:31 |
+perlDreamer | that will be changed in WebGUI 8 | 20:31 |
@preaction | did we fix the bug that puts "HASH(0xDEADBEEF)" : null, in the config files? | 20:37 |
@preaction | looks like it's in the macros part | 20:38 |
@preaction | there's also a "null" in the workflowActivities part | 20:38 |
+perlDreamer | we did fix that bug | 20:39 |
@preaction | you know, why the hell do we define which macros and workflow activities ARE in the config, when we should be defining the ones that AREN'T | 20:39 |
+perlDreamer | it's just historical | 20:39 |
Getty | i still cant see it, but i must reboot my PC now have to cleanup my mess of desk, i be back in 5 minutes, if you could have a screenshot which links to the icon it would be awesome LOL ;) | 20:40 |
Getty | so bbl | 20:40 |
+perlDreamer | if you want a "lean site", you'll exclude a lot | 20:40 |
+perlDreamer | it's just another aspect of the same problem | 20:40 |
@preaction | but most people don't want that, ever | 20:40 |
@preaction | the most likely configuration is "everything installed" | 20:40 |
+perlDreamer | I wouldn't assume that | 20:41 |
+perlDreamer | preaction, which site are you seeing the bad config data? | 20:41 |
@preaction | our config file has 715 lines in it | 20:41 |
@preaction | this is for PIRG | 20:41 |
@preaction | over SEVEN HUNDRED LINES in the config file | 20:41 |
+perlDreamer | that's because they have a bunch of CDN stuff in it | 20:42 |
@preaction | WebGUI.conf.original has over 1000 lines | 20:42 |
+perlDreamer | the macros HASH bug was fixed in 7.8.14 | 20:42 |
ckotil | 662 /data/WebGUI/etc/globalnoc.iu.edu.conf | 20:42 |
+perlDreamer | that's with documentation | 20:42 |
@preaction | the point being if this was a perl module, i'd be ripping it to shreds right now | 20:43 |
@preaction | and to hell with debian's default editor of "nano"... | 20:46 |
+perlDreamer | The Underground style from the bazaar is very nice | 20:48 |
@preaction | don't thank me, thank the guy who designed it. i just put it into webgui | 20:48 |
+perlDreamer | that's another bummer bout the bazaar, no attribution of authorship | 20:50 |
+perlDreamer | at one point, wasn't there a "more by <username>" link? | 20:51 |
Getty | re | 21:00 |
Getty | btw are you guys actually interested bringing WebGUI to a (Free) Cloud Service? | 21:00 |
+perlDreamer | WebGUI is already being used in a Cloud Service | 21:01 |
+perlDreamer | people run it on EC2 | 21:01 |
Getty | ah ok, the cloud service i talk about is making it very easy to manage anything, its really cool kodingen.com | 21:02 |
Getty | its at the startup, but they have "drag & drop" install of stuff (like wordpress, drupal and so on) | 21:03 |
Getty | i just imagined if there would be a drag&drop for WebGUI ;) | 21:03 |
Getty | i already made a link to the developers and they already offered a dedicated server where we can "setup" the required setup and they can analyze it for integration into the cloud | 21:03 |
Getty | even tho its not really a cloud service so far, more an open platform for web | 21:04 |
+perlDreamer | hey, if it lets people use WebGUI, that's great | 21:07 |
Getty | they wouldnt block it, the question is what is required | 21:09 |
Getty | i think a standard user cant get WebGUI running on this env for easy | 21:09 |
Getty | but we could tell them an easy way to make it one of the "one click installer" gadgets | 21:10 |
Getty | dont know, i'm not a webgui dude | 21:10 |
Getty | but they offered testing environments if we need | 21:10 |
Getty | wait must restart my pc.... again..... | 21:10 |
@preaction | WebGUI requires a shell and root access to install | 21:10 |
@preaction | but to run, just needs the prereqs | 21:10 |
Getty | yeah, lets talk about this in 2 minutes ;) | 21:11 |
+perlDreamer | preaction, we need to do something about webguiupdate.pl | 21:19 |
+perlDreamer | it lets people nuke their sites by skipping the upgrade steps | 21:19 |
Getty | re | 21:19 |
Getty | so.. where is this icon now? | 21:32 |
Getty | i see the assets before me, so admin console => assets | 21:32 |
+perlDreamer | Getty, what is it you're trying to do? | 21:33 |
+perlDreamer | Apply the style template to the site? | 21:33 |
Getty | about using the page layout | 21:33 |
Getty | yes | 21:33 |
Getty | so i need to find that "class icon" | 21:33 |
+perlDreamer | okay, the class icon is right on the main page | 21:33 |
+perlDreamer | on the left | 21:33 |
+perlDreamer | next to the big red X icon | 21:34 |
+perlDreamer | you don't need to go into the Admin Console to do this, although you can if you wish | 21:34 |
Getty | i feel stupid, i dont know what you mean with main page | 21:34 |
Getty | AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH | 21:35 |
Getty | NOW i get it! | 21:35 |
Getty | yes yes ok | 21:35 |
Getty | no... | 21:35 |
Getty | i mean | 21:35 |
Getty | i see the icon now | 21:35 |
Getty | but when i click i just get a dropdown | 21:35 |
Getty | what function i must click now? | 21:36 |
+perlDreamer | Edit Branch | 21:36 |
+perlDreamer | which instructions are you following? | 21:36 |
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Getty | Aha! | 21:36 |
Getty | there it is | 21:36 |
Getty | i used the on the wiki about adding theme | 21:36 |
Getty | just need to reopen it now | 21:36 |
Getty | but now i get it | 21:36 |
Getty | its a bit confusing to find it | 21:36 |
Getty | but now i get the concept more | 21:37 |
+perlDreamer | you can access the same set of instructions from the Asset Manager | 21:37 |
+perlDreamer | in the Asset manager, there are two labeled links | 21:37 |
Getty | its on! :) http://www.raudssus.de/ | 21:37 |
+perlDreamer | Edit, which allows you to edit the asset | 21:37 |
Getty | yeah i was in that menu before, but didnt knew i was right | 21:37 |
+perlDreamer | and More, which drops down the same menu as the class icon | 21:37 |
Getty | the way bringing people to the "class icon" is probably a bit hard | 21:37 |
+perlDreamer | it's faster to use the class icon | 21:37 |
Getty | yeah but if you are new you think more of the admin interface | 21:37 |
Getty | then really clicking into the page | 21:37 |
Getty | if you want to change the complete layout | 21:38 |
Getty | its not logical to click something on the "content" of the page to change the "complete page" | 21:38 |
Getty | or lets say, that confused me ;) i was on the page searching the icon, but i searched it "at the border of the page" | 21:38 |
+perlDreamer | maybe the wiki needs some images to clarify it | 21:39 |
Getty | or that, yes | 21:39 |
Getty | definitly | 21:39 |
Getty | ok......... now i see there is no blog content right out of the box | 21:41 |
Getty | but i suggest there is some plugin right? :;) | 21:41 |
+perlDreamer | to build a blog, you use the Collaboration System | 21:41 |
Getty | or should i use some other content module which has the same resulting effect like a blog? | 21:41 |
Getty | ok | 21:41 |
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Getty | ok so just for understanding, i just go to the homepage and add the collaboration system? | 21:41 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 21:42 |
+perlDreamer | then, configure it to use the Weblog templates | 21:42 |
+perlDreamer | it's not a beautiful blog, but it works | 21:42 |
Getty | mh | 21:42 |
Getty | i'm a bit confused | 21:42 |
+perlDreamer | what is "mh"? | 21:42 |
Getty | but ok i will first add it and then see | 21:42 |
Getty | mh is an empty word | 21:42 |
Getty | its like "mh" => i think about something, "mh!" => i got an idea, "mh?" => what you say? | 21:43 |
+perlDreamer | ah, like "hm" in english | 21:43 |
Getty | yes | 21:43 |
Getty | we german just do it just other around | 21:43 |
+perlDreamer | we can forgive you for that. We owe you for landjaegerwurst | 21:44 |
Getty | heheheh | 21:44 |
Getty | and beer | 21:44 |
Getty | without our high quality beer you all would be dead already! | 21:45 |
+perlDreamer | I'm more of a fan of the high quality wurst and baked goods, but since beer is made with grain we can call it good. | 21:51 |
Getty | lol | 21:51 |
Getty | i dont drink beer actually | 21:51 |
+perlDreamer | you should, German bier is great! | 21:53 |
+perlDreamer | especially when it's chasing down some bierwurst, kartoffelsalat und brotchen | 21:53 |
Getty | i prefer vodka | 21:56 |
Getty | made much business with vodka | 21:56 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, I think I'm going to move uiLevel from define to a property, since I want assets to be able to inherit the default uiLevel. | 22:03 |
+perlDreamer | actually, that's another good delimiter between the two. | 22:04 |
+perlDreamer | properties are inheritable, while defines are not | 22:04 |
+perlDreamer | in any case, I'm off for lunch | 22:05 |
Getty | can i get a more full fledge RTE? | 22:39 |
+perlDreamer | Getty, the RTE to use is configurable in the Collaboration System | 22:41 |
Getty | ok | 22:51 |
Getty | so... the intropage of the collaboration system "s***", that "table" with the entries | 22:51 |
Getty | can we make it more blogstyle? or just that he lists the entries? | 22:52 |
Getty | no idea, something to customize | 22:52 |
+perlDreamer | Getty, that would be another template :) | 22:53 |
+perlDreamer | have a look at perlDreamer.com/blog | 22:53 |
Getty | mh ok i dont wanna do anything for now | 22:53 |
Getty | i got my first blog entry | 22:53 |
Getty | cool | 22:53 |
Getty | gimme that! | 22:53 |
Getty | ;) | 22:53 |
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+perlDreamer | it's just a default template with my site's style added. | 22:58 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * ra3614f5 / (3 files in 3 dirs): Move uiLevel from a define to a property so it can be inherited. - http://bit.ly/cp1QD2 | 22:59 |
Getty | perlDreamer: and which default template? i mean i use the default collaboration system | 23:01 |
Getty | is yours not the same? | 23:01 |
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+perlDreamer | nope, it's a different template | 23:01 |
+perlDreamer | try the "weblog" template | 23:01 |
+perlDreamer | whoa! | 23:02 |
+perlDreamer | wgd works with WebGUI8 | 23:02 |
+perlDreamer | nice work, Haarg | 23:02 |
+perlDreamer | well, to be specific, wgd ls root/import/collaboration worked fine | 23:03 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * ra3aeae9 / (8 files in 2 dirs): Continue change from define uiLevel to has uiLevel. | 23:07 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r3b0e893 / (4 files in 3 dirs): Add T::C tests for File and Snippet. | 23:08 |
Getty | oh man i feel a bit fixed | 23:16 |
Getty | having own application framework and doing all stuff self normally, means always "taking back yourself" if you want to use another system | 23:16 |
Getty | actually i just do it to promote perl, i need to use something from perl ;) | 23:16 |
+perlDreamer | we all suffer from that | 23:17 |
Getty | let me guess | 23:17 |
Getty | cause i used this design now | 23:17 |
Getty | having a sidebar | 23:17 |
Getty | would be a more complex act | 23:17 |
Getty | right? | 23:17 |
+perlDreamer | it would be a different style template | 23:18 |
+perlDreamer | it depends on what content you want in the sidebar | 23:18 |
+perlDreamer | it it's a navigation (like used in Underground), it's fairly simple | 23:18 |
+perlDreamer | if it's more complex, like an RSS feed, twitter stream, etc. | 23:19 |
+perlDreamer | then it takes a little bit more work | 23:19 |
Getty | mh | 23:19 |
Getty | i dont know | 23:19 |
Getty | i dont know what i want at all somehow now | 23:19 |
+perlDreamer | if you want a different layout (two column, three column,), that's another template used by the Page Layout | 23:19 |
Getty | being forced to make a webpage makes sick ;) i dont have a target | 23:19 |
+perlDreamer | and no change to the Style at all | 23:20 |
Getty | ah ok | 23:20 |
Getty | so i can make it 2 col now? | 23:20 |
+perlDreamer | sure | 23:20 |
+perlDreamer | Edit the Page Layout | 23:20 |
+perlDreamer | Select the Display tab | 23:20 |
Getty | ok wait | 23:20 |
Getty | i think i dont do it | 23:20 |
Getty | and try to make a footer stuff... or more menu points | 23:20 |
Getty | dont know | 23:20 |
Getty | nah i got my blog that is for first something | 23:20 |
Getty | i still got a problem about your URLs... | 23:20 |
Getty | i got my first "SEO-cry" | 23:21 |
Getty | / and /root/home are the same | 23:21 |
+perlDreamer | why is some bot crawling though the root node? | 23:22 |
Getty | i mean, there is no redirect | 23:22 |
Getty | one should redirect to the other | 23:22 |
Getty | no matter which direction | 23:22 |
Getty | cause there shouldnt be 2 urls with the same content | 23:22 |
+perlDreamer | remember the default asset that we talked about earlier? | 23:22 |
Getty | yeah | 23:22 |
Getty | there i explicit didnt set an URL | 23:23 |
+perlDreamer | that's what causing that | 23:23 |
Getty | aha? | 23:23 |
+perlDreamer | I think not | 23:23 |
+perlDreamer | there's another function | 23:23 |
+perlDreamer | Not Found Page | 23:23 |
+perlDreamer | the url /root/home does not exist | 23:24 |
+perlDreamer | so WebGUI is redirecting you to the page it was told to in the Settings | 23:24 |
Getty | mh | 23:24 |
Getty | but the headline is linking to it | 23:24 |
+perlDreamer | which headline? | 23:24 |
Getty | http://www.raudssus.de/ | 23:24 |
Getty | the headline links to /root/home | 23:24 |
Getty | and /root/home shows the same page again | 23:25 |
+perlDreamer | try this... | 23:25 |
+perlDreamer | Admin, Turn Admin on... | 23:25 |
+perlDreamer | Admin Console, Settings | 23:25 |
+perlDreamer | wait | 23:25 |
+perlDreamer | Admin, Turn Admin On | 23:25 |
+perlDreamer | Edit the main page | 23:25 |
+perlDreamer | change the URL to just home | 23:26 |
+perlDreamer | now, Admin Console->Settings | 23:26 |
+perlDreamer | Default Asset => home | 23:26 |
+perlDreamer | now /home and / will be the same asset, and no root | 23:26 |
Getty | in which tab is that? | 23:26 |
+perlDreamer | 2nd or 3rd? | 23:27 |
+perlDreamer | from the left | 23:27 |
Getty | ah got it | 23:27 |
Getty | Standard Homepage its translated | 23:27 |
Getty | but still the problem | 23:29 |
Getty | i think you dont get really what i mean | 23:29 |
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Getty | i did lots of SEO stuff in my last companies, actually it was so deep that i was puking all day caring about the details | 23:29 |
Getty | one important detail is that one page is not allowed to have 2 URLs, that everything should be unique | 23:29 |
Getty | so right now i got 2 URLs (/ and /home) which gives the right content | 23:30 |
Getty | that "lowers" the value for google a little bit | 23:30 |
+perlDreamer | so if a page works as /index.html and /, that's bad too? | 23:30 |
Getty | yes | 23:30 |
Getty | correct | 23:30 |
Getty | you have to optimize that away | 23:30 |
Getty | (if you want to be "TOP" SEO) | 23:30 |
+perlDreamer | that's ridiculous | 23:30 |
Getty | dont tell me ;) | 23:30 |
Getty | i just tell what i was told | 23:30 |
Getty | for example | 23:30 |
Getty | you know ?page=1 ? | 23:30 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 23:30 |
Getty | ?page=2 ?page=3 ?page=4 | 23:31 |
Getty | there is alos the same | 23:31 |
Getty | you got: /list and /list?page=1 which shows the same | 23:31 |
Getty | so you have to code your list to NOT give a link to ?page=1 | 23:31 |
Getty | instead always to /list | 23:31 |
Getty | elsewhere => 2 urls same content | 23:31 |
Getty | an SEO optimizer will critic that | 23:31 |
Getty | so best would be if the internal stuff is really redirecting | 23:31 |
Getty | for example the "not found" asset of course generates TONS of that | 23:32 |
Getty | so you MUST redirect to the not found page actually | 23:32 |
Getty | so technical i think its easy for WebGUI to optimize that in | 23:32 |
Getty | it just needs to redirect to the asset | 23:32 |
Getty | instead of loading it internal | 23:32 |
+perlDreamer | I think you'd be surprised... | 23:32 |
+perlDreamer | but if you really want that, the Requests for Enhancement board is over at webgui.org/rfe | 23:33 |
Getty | i actually dont care much, if i dont make a webgui "top seo" site so far, but i think i mention it for you guys cause its some stuff that an SEO company would tell the company that uses WebGUI and this makes bad reputation again :-/ | 23:34 |
Getty | the people give companies 5000 EUR < or more to make a report that just is full of that shit | 23:34 |
Getty | and the so called "double content" mistake is always "on top" | 23:34 |
Getty | i will add it to the RFE so that its "listed | 23:35 |
Getty | " | 23:35 |
Getty | but i already see the 32746243278 comments who says "that is bullshit" | 23:35 |
Getty | if i wouldnt have been in that mess, i would comment the same ;) | 23:35 |
+perlDreamer | they won't do that | 23:35 |
Getty | hehe ok | 23:35 |
+perlDreamer | we have several people who sell WebGUI for SEO | 23:35 |
+perlDreamer | they'll probably vote for it | 23:36 |
Getty | wow a totally open registration? no approval link? no check? :) | 23:37 |
+perlDreamer | nope, we trust you | 23:38 |
Getty | http://www.webgui.org/rfe/request-for-enhancement/11462 | 23:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r87c00d4 / (8 files in 3 dirs): appending to an attribute must quote the + - | 23:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rbc71165 / (6 files): Add T::C tests for Redirect, RichEdit,Shortcut,Sku, Template and Wobject. - http://bit.ly/9apyrS | 23:44 |
Getty | is it allowed to make negative comments about the webpage layout of webgui.org? ;) | 23:49 |
+perlDreamer | sure, as long as they're accompanied with patches :D | 23:51 |
Getty | hehehe | 23:51 |
Getty | i could give you a really really cool hint... | 23:51 |
Getty | there is a tool out there | 23:51 |
Getty | which... lets say.... | 23:51 |
Getty | "kicks ass" in making layouts | 23:52 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rffb7945 / (5 files in 3 dirs): Remove leftover definition sub stubs. - http://bit.ly/d1tKmJ | 23:52 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rb60149d / (3 files in 2 dirs): Tests for Image, ZipArchive - http://bit.ly/bFPWyg | 23:52 |
Getty | of course its not the tool for very flexible design and the special ones, but it gives out minimum layouts which are a bit nicer then this one you got ;) | 23:52 |
Getty | its called Artisteer, you probably heard of | 23:52 |
+perlDreamer | I hadn't heard of it, but I'm very perl centric | 23:53 |
Getty | i integrated it somehow in my framework, so we can make artisteer templates, just copy the css/images and then define the "layout metastuff" in some config | 23:53 |
Getty | its just a tool, you use it gets html and done, actually its even not free or opensource | 23:53 |
Getty | but its just to good | 23:53 |
Getty | but just a fast suggestion, actually i thought that if you support some much web, someone would have sponsored a better layout :) | 23:55 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rdb60905 / (t/run_asset.t t/tests/Test/Asset/File/GalleryFile.pm): Add a test for GalleryFile - http://bit.ly/aJkUB2 | 23:59 |
--- Day changed Wed Mar 10 2010 |
* perlDreamer will be back in a bit | 00:01 |
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@preaction | Bad Idea of the day: We should lock certain template namespaces to only allow Template Toolkit templates, paving the way for WebGUI to do TT only | 00:04 |
Getty | dont do that | 00:06 |
Getty | just a big small whatever warning, dont force yourself to TT | 00:07 |
@preaction | why not? | 00:08 |
@preaction | H::T is a horrible template engine, H::T::E even moreso | 00:08 |
Getty | i just say that TT is not the end of the line | 00:08 |
Getty | actually at the CeBIT we had the TT theme | 00:09 |
@preaction | TT allows developers to give objects directly to template, forgoing the necessity for translation | 00:09 |
Getty | and i found 2 other perl dudes who also see the problem that TT is mostly a template language for developers not for the designers | 00:09 |
@preaction | i will agree there | 00:09 |
Getty | oh in other languages that is normal for template engines, so actually its just that one step TT does right which others does right all the time | 00:09 |
Getty | so you cant take this argument and say TT is the most awesome, there will be another one | 00:10 |
@preaction | well, the other "standard" perl template engine is H::T, which is complete crap | 00:10 |
Getty | right now i took one of those dudes and we want to make Template::Toolkit::Smarty, to make TT be parseable like Smarty | 00:10 |
Getty | (to bring over PHP coder and also gain advantage of the knowledge that many template developer already invested in the smarty concept) | 00:10 |
Getty | could be that this must be splitted up totally | 00:10 |
Getty | i agree that anything beside TT in the perl world is crap | 00:11 |
Getty | but i tell you that TT will not stay alone longtime | 00:11 |
Getty | it will not attract people, as i said, its made from developers for developers | 00:11 |
Getty | probably the only point the "stupid php coders" can do better, just cause they arent real developers | 00:11 |
@preaction | looking at smarty's syntax, i'm not a fan. it doesn't seem much better than TT's syntax | 00:12 |
Getty | there are slightly differences which just make it more easy for many people in that sector | 00:12 |
Getty | checkout "Dwoo" | 00:12 |
Getty | which is a next-step of smarty | 00:13 |
@preaction | {section ... loop=$theloopvar} <- really? | 00:13 |
Getty | LOL! | 00:13 |
Getty | section is deprecated | 00:13 |
Getty | its just historical there | 00:13 |
Getty | still they are stupid php coders ;) | 00:13 |
Getty | its not about the functions | 00:13 |
@preaction | uh... so then why is it in the "Crash Course" | 00:13 |
Getty | its about the syntax | 00:13 |
Getty | cause they are lazy coders, the crash course was made very ver early and noone made a new one i guess | 00:14 |
Getty | actually i dont have read the crash course at all | 00:14 |
Getty | and i also dont care, smarty developers are very closed | 00:14 |
Getty | the gag is, i can introduce smarty to a non-developer faster then TT (i actually had the chance to test this several times) | 00:14 |
Getty | one big problem is the missing $ | 00:14 |
Getty | $var is something non-developers understand more then just put in var, especially if they do the same for a command, it just confuses them | 00:15 |
Getty | of course its "cool" | 00:15 |
Getty | but just for a developer who anyway switch just the "internal brain parser" for templates | 00:15 |
@preaction | okay, now i'm looking at Dwoo and it looks like TT with different characters | 00:15 |
@preaction | sigils would be nice in TT, yes | 00:15 |
Getty | yeah thats why we think it gets easy to make a TT with Smarty/Dwoo syntax | 00:15 |
Getty | we just need that $ | 00:16 |
Getty | that is what the other dude is working on | 00:16 |
Getty | i personal HATE TT i must say | 00:16 |
Getty | i worked with smarty now several years, and TT just S*** for me... | 00:16 |
Getty | i see the power, i dont say its bad | 00:16 |
@preaction | provided you just add sigils, that'd be perfect | 00:16 |
Getty | its just bad for ME ;) | 00:16 |
Getty | you could help him, or probably help us bringing that in | 00:16 |
@preaction | well, i think a lot of times developers don't think about how their objects will be used in the template | 00:16 |
Getty | actually on PHP the people use objects to massive | 00:17 |
Getty | cause for example | 00:17 |
Getty | there is one big problem with objects usage in template | 00:17 |
@preaction | i can't replace H::T in webgui yet. it's an 8+1 thing, not an 8 thing | 00:17 |
Getty | one very very big | 00:17 |
Getty | template parsing cant have proper error handling | 00:17 |
@preaction | well, obviously one can't have a template cause a side-effect, ever. never direct db access | 00:17 |
Getty | so if your object triggers a DB call and the DB call fails it would be a very "fucked up" moment inside the template | 00:17 |
@preaction | uh... why not? you shouldn't be able to do anything to CAUSE an error, that's the thing | 00:17 |
Getty | yeah | 00:18 |
Getty | but lets think in a bigger scale | 00:18 |
Getty | you got 100 developers | 00:18 |
@preaction | you should never be able to write to the DB, and reading should be through existing methods | 00:18 |
Getty | and now you change a common function of an object | 00:18 |
Getty | to use the DB | 00:18 |
Getty | another coder might not know | 00:18 |
Getty | and use that function of the object in template | 00:18 |
@preaction | there's the wrong thing right there. you should probably be using an ORM | 00:18 |
Getty | wait wait | 00:18 |
Getty | forget ORM forget anything | 00:18 |
Getty | replace DB with "otherServiceThatCouldCauseError" | 00:19 |
Getty | its a general thing | 00:19 |
Getty | the Object can do whatever the object wants todo | 00:19 |
Getty | if you hang it into the template | 00:19 |
Getty | you can never CONTROL that | 00:19 |
@preaction | i understand, i do. laziness causes deferred errors | 00:19 |
Getty | cause its job of the object | 00:19 |
Getty | what would be cool | 00:19 |
Getty | and perfect | 00:19 |
Getty | is 2 objects | 00:19 |
Getty | like you got one and if the object goes to template it gets converted | 00:19 |
Getty | OR | 00:19 |
Getty | you make a "switch" inside the object concept | 00:19 |
Getty | i thought about both once | 00:19 |
Getty | but both are a bit "crazy" | 00:19 |
Getty | but it would be important to define a "rule" for that | 00:20 |
Getty | so that this never can happen | 00:20 |
Getty | "out of concept" | 00:20 |
Getty | (beside someone breaks the concept) | 00:20 |
Getty | if you just say "use objects in template" you cant prevent that problem | 00:20 |
Getty | there must be a bit more of a ruleset for that | 00:20 |
Getty | so that both sides (people who uses object just before the template and the people who uses it in template) never run into that error | 00:20 |
@preaction | i've thought the same, most likely i'll have the Model objects have a method to tell the template which bits are available, which are not, etc... | 00:20 |
Getty | one way | 00:20 |
Getty | which is most easy | 00:21 |
Getty | would be ->TemplateFunction() | 00:21 |
Getty | so if you call: $obj->function() in template | 00:21 |
Getty | it calls: $obj->template_function() | 00:21 |
Getty | if its not there it calls ->function() | 00:21 |
Getty | so you can "block" functions out | 00:21 |
Getty | which would cause active action | 00:21 |
Getty | or other around | 00:21 |
Getty | you can deny that he search for ->function() | 00:21 |
Getty | and you need to define what is exported | 00:21 |
Getty | that was my smallest solution | 00:21 |
Getty | so be very very careful about what you "propagate" | 00:23 |
Getty | if you once start to push massivly on the object into template train | 00:23 |
Getty | you cant stop it | 00:24 |
Getty | it is like giving people PHP | 00:24 |
Getty | more and more code goes into the template (or is called at template level) | 00:24 |
@preaction | except for, as mentioned, templates will never be able to modify anything. a template on one page request cannot affect any other page request | 00:24 |
@preaction | that's the rule | 00:24 |
Getty | if you "just have object" inside the template | 00:25 |
Getty | you cant prevent it | 00:25 |
@preaction | getters, not setters | 00:25 |
Getty | you cant prevent it | 00:25 |
Getty | (sadly) | 00:25 |
@preaction | it's a translated object, but translated automatically | 00:25 |
Getty | yeah but then you can just call ->toArray() on all objects | 00:25 |
Getty | that is what i do inside my framework, i dont assign objects (only "Text" objects) | 00:25 |
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@preaction | so yes, there is a translation to set up, a TT context or what-have-you, but the idea is that to the Developer, it's done automatically, and to the Designer, it just works | 00:26 |
Getty | yes of course, but then its not more or less then arrays in the template | 00:26 |
Getty | even tho, if you "think perl" its just a blessed hash ;) and this is an object so.. yes ok | 00:27 |
Getty | if i think other around its more logical | 00:27 |
Getty | it just needs a special way of objects | 00:27 |
Getty | like XX::XX goes to XX::XX::Template | 00:27 |
Getty | so that you can add custom function to the template object | 00:27 |
Getty | if you dont have ::Template, then its just a hash | 00:27 |
Getty | this would be something very acceptable in my eyes, and very powerful | 00:28 |
Getty | if that was something you thought about | 00:28 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r4beab18 / lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Folder.pm : Fix uiLevel in Folder. - | 00:58 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rffe4e7f / (13 files in 4 dirs): fix uiLevel tests, and loading multiple sessions. - | 00:58 |
@preaction | perlDreamer: you were gone: any opinion on making certain template namespaces TT-only | 01:12 |
+perlDreamer | why? | 01:12 |
+perlDreamer | in 8, or 7? | 01:12 |
@preaction | so we can do things in the templates that only TT allows | 01:12 |
@preaction | in 8, for the Admin Console template | 01:12 |
+perlDreamer | I had thought that the TT conversion was dropped for 8? | 01:13 |
@preaction | it is | 01:13 |
@preaction | that's why i want this, so I can make a new template that is TT only and use TT features | 01:13 |
@preaction | and we can slowly move our templates to TT-only, and then finally remove the other engines | 01:14 |
+perlDreamer | that sounds more painful than doing it before the release | 01:14 |
@preaction | there are two "floating features" for the 8 cycle. TT and Auth | 01:14 |
+perlDreamer | brb | 01:15 |
@preaction | what about it sounds painful? i need dissenting opinions | 01:15 |
@preaction | it is a little bit of work up-front, but it enables us to start making our new apps and templates TT-based, and then shove everything old into TT-land | 01:16 |
+perlDreamer | so the plan would be to have new namespaces, that only TT templates could be placed into | 01:18 |
@preaction | correct | 01:18 |
+perlDreamer | and on every site, we're going to enable the TT plugin via templateParsers | 01:19 |
@preaction | correct, TT would now be absolutely required to run WebGUI | 01:19 |
@preaction | considering 8 as a transition period | 01:20 |
@preaction | which is really what it is, and always has been | 01:20 |
+perlDreamer | if I was a user, and you told me I had to learn two template systems for 2 years, I'd be frustrated | 01:20 |
@preaction | just like 6 was, only hopefully not as chaotic | 01:20 |
@preaction | yeah, that would be a down side | 01:20 |
* perlDreamer opines for all or none | 01:21 |
@preaction | so is that the problem? our default templates are H::T and the cargo-culting is keeping us locked in? | 01:22 |
+perlDreamer | no, doing a two-year transition on something difficult like a templating language | 01:22 |
@preaction | so do it quickly like pulling off a band-aid | 01:23 |
+perlDreamer | right, all, or none | 01:23 |
+perlDreamer | there's a fairly good H::T translator out on the net, already | 01:25 |
+perlDreamer | the missing piece is the variable translation | 01:25 |
+perlDreamer | but I'm confident that since we know the namespace, and the user of the namespace that it can all be fixed, automatically | 01:26 |
@frodwith | i thought the difficulty is that we have a huge legacy codebase of H::T templates that we don't want to convert | 01:26 |
+perlDreamer | any custom template, yes | 01:27 |
@preaction | we Do want, we don't have time for right now | 01:27 |
+perlDreamer | right | 01:27 |
@preaction | well, yes, custom templates as well | 01:27 |
+perlDreamer | the core templates are easy | 01:27 |
@frodwith | oh I see the difficulty | 01:27 |
@frodwith | we'd have to at the very least provide an automated converter to people | 01:28 |
@preaction | it's either this, or during 8.1, 8.2, 8.5 we make all the default templates into TT templates and then say "yeah, fix your templates cuz 9 will make TT only" | 01:28 |
+perlDreamer | if we do that, I think we'll lose users by the droves | 01:28 |
@preaction | i want to give them TT template examples or some INCENTIVE to migrate before we drop the hammer | 01:28 |
+perlDreamer | the TT conversion alone is going to be difficult, but forcing them to use both at the same time? | 01:28 |
+perlDreamer | it'll drive them nutso | 01:28 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r4fa1e00 / (10 files in 2 dirs): Add Wobject tests. - | 01:30 |
@preaction | well, for example we had the Shop migration in 7 | 01:31 |
@preaction | and we're planning on the same for Auth in 8 | 01:31 |
+perlDreamer | but that's all in 1 shot | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | not staged in pieces | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | we didn't part of Shop | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | then another part | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | and then a 3rd part | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | imo, people think about the templates as 1 chunk, not broken out by namespace | 01:32 |
@preaction | right, but there are 100x more custom templates than there are custom shop or auth modules | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | sure | 01:32 |
+perlDreamer | undoubtedly | 01:33 |
+perlDreamer | maybe it could be done in 2 chunks | 01:34 |
+perlDreamer | admin console templates | 01:34 |
+perlDreamer | and asset templates | 01:34 |
+perlDreamer | but I don't think it can be done namespace by namespace | 01:34 |
@preaction | right, but you're also saying that we shouldn't make the default set TT and still allow H::T | 01:34 |
@preaction | in one shot | 01:34 |
@preaction | this isn't something we got to figure out now, i just wanted to get to use some of the TT features. nobody changes the AC template, mainly because it's easy to break | 01:35 |
@frodwith | it doesn't really matter what the default is, does it? | 01:35 |
+perlDreamer | If I came across that way, I apologize. What I meant to object to was a long transition period between the 2. I think it should be one point release. | 01:35 |
@frodwith | point is as long as we support H::T, our TT implentation must be crippled | 01:35 |
@preaction | but you still feel that it could be an 8.x release | 01:36 |
@preaction | yes, i'd be bypassing the WG::A::T::TemplateToolkit | 01:36 |
+perlDreamer | sure, like 8.0.5, or 8.0.6, but not more than one point | 01:36 |
+perlDreamer | the TT implementation will always be crippled, until we decide which path we're going to take | 01:36 |
@preaction | well, it'd probably have to be a minor release, not a bugfix point | 01:37 |
+perlDreamer | do we put logic in the template, or not? | 01:37 |
@preaction | and Auth is still on the table for a minor release of its own | 01:37 |
@preaction | "logic" is a misnomer, there's always logic in the template | 01:37 |
@preaction | it's the policy of "no side effects" | 01:37 |
@preaction | but even that... we allow Macros to have side effects :p | 01:37 |
@frodwith | well, TT templates can happily munge data | 01:37 |
@frodwith | H::T can't do much in that area. | 01:38 |
@frodwith | so you have to mangle your template variables to make it happy | 01:38 |
@preaction | and munging is fine, good even. anything in the template should not affect any other page request ever | 01:38 |
@frodwith | if we threw out H::T support, we could stop mangling our template vars. | 01:38 |
+perlDreamer | how are the template variables "mangled"? | 01:40 |
@preaction | instead of having to make all the year, month, day, monthDay, dayOfWeek, etc... we could just give a Date object (or whatevz) | 01:42 |
@preaction | we also have to translate from arrays into arrays of hashrefs, because that's all H::T can do | 01:42 |
@frodwith | [ { key => 'foo', val => 'bar'}, { key => 'baz', val => 'qux' } ] instead of { 'foo' => 'bar', 'baz', 'qux' } | 01:42 |
@frodwith | comes to mind | 01:42 |
@preaction | it can't do hashes, or just normal arrays | 01:42 |
@preaction | there's also more laziness we can do, instead of generating everything even if nobody ever uses it | 01:43 |
@frodwith | not to mention the horrific things you have to do in H::T in that situation if you want to access something in there by its key | 01:43 |
+perlDreamer | how many users do we have doing that? | 01:43 |
@preaction | ah yes, the "field.noloop.<fieldname>" | 01:43 |
@preaction | the DataForm does it everywhere | 01:43 |
@preaction | Thingy also comes to mind | 01:44 |
@frodwith | before I talked hDP into switching to TT for all their stuff, it was all over their stuff | 01:44 |
@preaction | ooh, didn't know about that one | 01:44 |
@frodwith | I mean, it's not like it takes too much time to compute that stuff, but it makes the code more complicated than it has to be. | 01:45 |
+perlDreamer | and moves that code into the templates | 01:46 |
+perlDreamer | where users have to deal with it | 01:46 |
@frodwith | in what way? | 01:46 |
+perlDreamer | I don't think that's a good solution | 01:46 |
@preaction | no, the code is still in the module, it just only gets evaluated when the template wants it | 01:46 |
@preaction | but in any case: I will not be adding a namespace-locking to allow me to get around our current horrible template practices | 01:47 |
@frodwith | the only reason we create the noloop crap and the arrays of hashes stuff is to get around H::T being unable to represent them. | 01:47 |
@frodwith | you wouldn't have to include the logic in the templates, you'd just use the hashes directly | 01:47 |
@frodwith | (or the arrays, or what-have-you) | 01:48 |
+perlDreamer | if that's the extent of it, just variable access, that doesn't sound that bad | 01:48 |
@preaction | http://gist.github.com/327301 <- here's an example based on WebGUIx::Form and editing assets | 01:48 |
@frodwith | well, TT buys us some other stuff (being able to pass in coderefs or locked down blessed objects, which is very handy) | 01:49 |
@preaction | forms <- all the forms. forms.edit_asset <- the asset edit form | 01:49 |
@frodwith | none of which we can use while we support H::T because of lowest-common-denominator. | 01:49 |
@frodwith | here's a stupid idea: we could provide a set of backcompat variables for the core classes that we'd like to change, as mixins or roles or something, and tell everyone to change them because those are going to go out of date in X point releases | 01:51 |
@frodwith | and then eventually just drop them | 01:51 |
@frodwith | or stop distributing them anyways | 01:52 |
+perlDreamer | if time is important, I don't think we should spend it refactoring the code into addons that we're just going to drop. | 01:52 |
+perlDreamer | we should spend that time doing translation | 01:52 |
@preaction | yeah, if we're really gonna shake up the core of WebGUI in 8+1, we may not even have a translation path at all | 01:53 |
@frodwith | i guess no one is forced to upgrade until they can fix their templates | 01:53 |
+perlDreamer | we've always helped people with that in the past | 01:54 |
+perlDreamer | would you want to hand edit 100's of templates? | 01:55 |
+perlDreamer | or even dozens? | 01:55 |
@frodwith | no, ugh. | 01:55 |
@preaction | and we'll help them in the future, but depending on how drastic the internal changes it may be difficult | 01:55 |
@frodwith | well. what about this: mechanically translate everything to TT without changing any of the variables in one release | 01:56 |
+perlDreamer | that sounds good | 01:56 |
@frodwith | and drop support for H::T. that gets us all using TT at least. | 01:56 |
+perlDreamer | we can always make individual changes in other releases | 01:56 |
@frodwith | yes. | 01:56 |
+perlDreamer | and do it one at a time. DataForm, Thingy, Profile, etc | 01:56 |
+perlDreamer | just one at a time, and all in the same system | 01:56 |
@frodwith | *nod* | 01:56 |
+perlDreamer | but that's back to what preaction said that we don't have the time to do | 01:57 |
@frodwith | mechanical translation from H::T to TT is automatable | 01:57 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rfe5085f / (3 files in 2 dirs): Tests for Gallery and HttpProxy - http://bit.ly/9Gsf8s | 01:58 |
@frodwith | and we could provide a service for people to do their custom templates with, as well. | 01:58 |
+perlDreamer | when you throw in the variable translation (taking out the dots) it becomes more difficult | 01:58 |
@preaction | well, we can have 8.1 do the TT conversion, 8.2 do CS, Thingy, DataForm, 8.3 do Layout, Article, etc..., 8.4 do ..., 8.5 ... etc... | 01:58 |
@frodwith | I have a script that managed it for all of HDP's templates that works remarkably well | 01:58 |
@frodwith | with just regexes | 01:58 |
+perlDreamer | then it sounds like we're done :) | 01:58 |
@frodwith | I'm sure there's cases where it breaks, but generally speaking | 01:59 |
+perlDreamer | wait a sec | 01:59 |
@preaction | but that still leaves me at using H::T for the new AC templates | 01:59 |
+perlDreamer | we've only been talking about two of the axes | 01:59 |
+perlDreamer | we also need to handle H::T::Expr | 01:59 |
@frodwith | none of the core templates rely on that little bastard, do they? | 01:59 |
+perlDreamer | no, but it's a core plugin that we've encouraged people to use in the past | 02:00 |
@preaction | no, the AC template is one of those "Hyre Be Dragyns" one | 02:00 |
@preaction | ohh, hte | 02:00 |
@frodwith | ah, so lots of people use it, meaning we'd want to provide a mechanical translation for that as well | 02:00 |
+perlDreamer | that was the original goal, complete mechanical translation of H::T{,::E} to T::T with variable name changes | 02:00 |
@frodwith | that doesn't sound too technically difficult, you could get it perfect if you wrote a real parser | 02:01 |
@frodwith | variable renaming is just dots to underscores, right? | 02:01 |
+perlDreamer | preaction: I think you could design a new AC template using TT, but it would have to use the existing variable set, or be prepared to upgrade custom templates (SwiftySite, etc.) | 02:01 |
+perlDreamer | frodwith, I think so | 02:02 |
+perlDreamer | i was going to use the list of template variables in the Help/ to figure out what needed to be translated, for efficiency | 02:02 |
@preaction | the new AC template is not compatible with the old, at all | 02:02 |
@frodwith | that's where you were going with namespace locking, eh preaction? | 02:02 |
@preaction | yes | 02:02 |
@frodwith | Can't use H::T for AC templates | 02:03 |
@preaction | exactly | 02:03 |
+perlDreamer | we've done things like that in the past, haven't we? | 02:03 |
* perlDreamer looks in the gotchas | 02:03 |
@frodwith | well, if first release of 8 was TT only, here's a translator for your old templates | 02:03 |
@frodwith | you could do AC temnplates in whatever style you pleased | 02:04 |
+perlDreamer | check out the note in 7.7. | 02:04 |
+perlDreamer | 7.7.5 | 02:04 |
@frodwith | since new AC isn't backwards compatible with the old one at all | 02:04 |
+perlDreamer | in 7.6.4, we deleted all custom profile templates in favor of the new Account system | 02:05 |
+perlDreamer | in 7.6.3 we reworked the SC, and migrated templates | 02:05 |
+perlDreamer | 7.5.0 changed the Event templates and didn't translate | 02:06 |
@frodwith | and there's expectation for some breakage in a new major rev | 02:07 |
@frodwith | even outside of the history | 02:07 |
+perlDreamer | yeah, I think you can nuke the old AC templates | 02:07 |
+perlDreamer | just be sure to update the template variable help | 02:07 |
+perlDreamer | frodwith, re breakage, I submit the WebGUI 6.x series | 02:08 |
* preaction vomits uncontrollably at the mention of 6.x | 02:08 |
* frodwith hasn't been around that long, thank God. | 02:08 |
+perlDreamer | where we lost a large fraction of developers | 02:08 |
+perlDreamer | and I don't know how many customers | 02:08 |
@preaction | neither was I, but i've dealt with the fallout | 02:08 |
+perlDreamer | and the difficulty in upgrading 5.x to 7.x sites | 02:09 |
@frodwith | well there's -some- breakage and there's breaking everything gratuitously | 02:09 |
+perlDreamer | totally | 02:09 |
@preaction | well, we're also stating outright exactly what is going to break and how | 02:09 |
+perlDreamer | maybe all of my thinking isn't as generous as I'd like to believe | 02:09 |
+perlDreamer | just not wanting to have to get stuck doing it myself | 02:10 |
@frodwith | do we have a lot of folks customizing the AC extensively? | 02:10 |
@frodwith | he asked curiously? | 02:10 |
@preaction | no, they shouldn't ever. it's not really possible without breaking things | 02:10 |
@preaction | the new one will be less fickle than that | 02:10 |
+perlDreamer | I wouldn't doubt that AMH does | 02:11 |
@frodwith | who? | 02:11 |
@preaction | but that's because the template will be loaded once, then everything will happen inside of it | 02:11 |
+perlDreamer | AlphaMegaHosting | 02:11 |
+perlDreamer | the SwiftySite folks | 02:11 |
@frodwith | oh | 02:11 |
@preaction | they did the SwitfySite | 02:11 |
@preaction | eah | 02:11 |
* preaction is slow | 02:11 |
+perlDreamer | preaction: why not break out the partner's list and ask? | 02:11 |
@frodwith | yes, probably. but they're also really smart. | 02:11 |
+perlDreamer | muy | 02:11 |
@preaction | no, it's not an "ask" thing. it's happening. no matter how i have to do it the AC is being rebuilt | 02:11 |
@preaction | they've all known since last year | 02:12 |
@preaction | there were the specs released and everything | 02:12 |
@frodwith | oh, preaction. So young, so naive. | 02:12 |
+perlDreamer | true, but at that point they also thought we were doing a full automated translation | 02:12 |
@frodwith | "If I warn them a year ahead of time, they can't possibly complain!" | 02:12 |
@preaction | uh... to what? | 02:12 |
+perlDreamer | H::T{,::E} to T::T | 02:12 |
@preaction | frodwith: not that, but there's no "asking". they were told, i don't ask anymore | 02:13 |
@preaction | ah, well, that... is just unfortunate | 02:13 |
@preaction | complaints can be directed to the nearest brick wall, which will be more responsive than I | 02:13 |
+perlDreamer | maybe we need to give the community at large an update in changes to plans? | 02:13 |
+perlDreamer | to remind and reset expectations? | 02:13 |
@frodwith | that's probably the least customized set of templates, I'd imagine | 02:13 |
@preaction | perhaps a "State of Eight"? | 02:13 |
+perlDreamer | sure | 02:14 |
+perlDreamer | also, isn't it WUC announcement time? | 02:14 |
@frodwith | but then, I haven't worked with most of our users. | 02:14 |
* perlDreamer hits the showers, I'll backlog later | 02:14 |
@preaction | wait, i think one of our customers changed the blue in the AC to the older blue because people didn't like the new, darker blue | 02:14 |
@frodwith | that's not even a template change, is it? | 02:15 |
@frodwith | just css? | 02:15 |
@preaction | right, but the only way to get to it is the template | 02:21 |
@preaction | yay! | 02:21 |
+perlDreamer | just wait til TWG gets their hands on it | 02:42 |
+perlDreamer | they'll fix it | 02:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r8806883 / docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.8.13-7.9.0.pl : Fix a synax error in the upgrade file. - http://bit.ly/9s2ArF | 02:47 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, I could use some help with uft8 issues in 7.9 | 03:01 |
+perlDreamer | going to see if I can duplicate it with the WRE | 03:01 |
+perlDreamer | but on Ubuntu, we added a new test failure this week | 03:01 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r8e253e5 / t/Content/SiteIndex.t : Remove unused diagnostics. - http://bit.ly/bzWKIF | 04:46 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r4df0c51 / t/Content/Setup.t : Finish clean-up testing. - http://bit.ly/caXmDg | 04:48 |
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+perlDreamer | I think it's funny that the Apache request object has an assbackwards method | 05:08 |
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+perlDreamer | SynQ_: do you have your new car? | 05:22 |
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elnino | since when was there a separate login template? - is there a way for it just to defaul to the site's template? | 06:19 |
elnino | oh. they really messed this up. I see.. | 06:22 |
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+perlDreamer | unless there are any objections from the floor, I'm going to release 7.9.0 | 07:01 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r7b40c8b / (3 files in 2 dirs): fix upgrade script, and SQL scripts. - http://bit.ly/bK82PX | 07:08 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * ref81e69 / docs/create.sql : Preparing for 7.9.0 release. - http://bit.ly/9GW8wH | 07:08 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * reccf6a5 / (4 files in 4 dirs): Ready for 7.9.1 development. - http://bit.ly/9gKUSq | 07:45 |
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-!- Radix_ changed the topic of #webgui to: [7.8.14-stable | 7.9.0-beta | WRE 0.9.3] Before you ask, check the wiki: http://wiki.webgui.org | Pastebin: http://webgui.pastebin.com | 08:29 |
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SDuensin | Greetings. | 16:23 |
+bartjol | morning | 16:36 |
+bartjol | SDuensin: do you perhaps know where I could have found that the 7.8.13->14 upgrade wasn't very wise to do, if I want to go beta? | 16:40 |
+bartjol | not that I didn't manage offcourse | 16:41 |
+bartjol | but it takes more troubles | 16:41 |
SDuensin | No idea bud. I think going beta at any time is trouble. | 16:41 |
+bartjol | well, it is only for my test server | 16:41 |
+bartjol | so I know what problems to expect later | 16:42 |
+bartjol | and become less of a problem | 16:42 |
+bartjol | pro-active error making :) | 16:42 |
SDuensin | :-) | 16:42 |
* SDuensin has still been too lazy to even get to 7.8. | 16:42 |
+bartjol | Ah, I wanted that awesome language features | 16:43 |
+bartjol | the guy that made those must be a superhero | 16:43 |
SDuensin | Other than English, I only speak programming languages. | 16:43 |
SDuensin | :-P | 16:43 |
+bartjol | ah, but you can practise to speak webgui in 4 languages, not very convenient in bars... | 16:44 |
SDuensin | hehe | 16:45 |
+bartjol | hey baby, Enter the attribute that should be used for each record in LDAP to uniquely identify a user. This field is used for auto creating user accounts for users already in your LDAP repository when they attempt to log in and for finding users who sign up for the site via the anonymous registration feature if it is enabled. In almost all cases this attribute is 'dn' and should be entered as such. | 16:46 |
+bartjol | nope, not a very catchy opening phrase | 16:46 |
SDuensin | Yea, but if she understands it - keep her! | 16:47 |
ckotil | heh | 16:47 |
-!- Diggy [~dyioulos@65.105.102.162.ptr.us.xo.net] has joined #webgui | 16:48 |
Diggy | hi, all | 16:48 |
SDuensin | Hey Diggy | 16:49 |
Diggy | a few weeks ago, i got on the channel to ask about plans for a new VM version of webgui | 16:49 |
Diggy | i've had problems upgrading my VM version | 16:50 |
* SDuensin remembers | 16:50 |
* bartjol not | 16:50 |
Diggy | some kind soul on the channel suggested upgrading to v. 7.6.35 first | 16:51 |
Diggy | today i'm trying that, and have run into problems | 16:51 |
+bartjol | what kind? | 16:51 |
+bartjol | what version are/were you at before? | 16:52 |
Diggy | get through the upgrade process, but when firing off spectre.pl --daemon, got the following: | 16:52 |
Diggy | "Use of uninitialized value $pidFileName in -e at spectre.pl line 104. No pidfile specified in spectre.conf" | 16:53 |
Diggy | huh? | 16:53 |
SDuensin | Yea. That's actually a known issue. | 16:53 |
Diggy | can i fix? | 16:53 |
SDuensin | You need to find the conf file for it and add that line. | 16:53 |
* SDuensin doesn't remember offhand where it is. Will try and find it! | 16:53 |
+bartjol | /data/WebGUI/etc | 16:54 |
+bartjol | for the conf file | 16:54 |
Diggy | btw, going from v. 7.6.20 to v 7.6.35 | 16:54 |
+bartjol | and WebGUI must be able to write where you put the pid file | 16:54 |
+bartjol | the webgui user that is | 16:54 |
SDuensin | Yea. Open /data/WebGUI/etc/spectre.conf and add a line... | 16:55 |
+bartjol | maybe root writes it | 16:55 |
SDuensin | The last line in mine prior to the new one is "ignoreEnvProxy". Put a comma at the end of that line... | 16:55 |
SDuensin | On the next line, put: | 16:55 |
SDuensin | "pidFile" : "/tmp/spectre.pid" | 16:55 |
SDuensin | The last line in the file should just be a closing brace: } | 16:56 |
Diggy | no, WebGUI writes to it | 16:56 |
Diggy | beautiful, that worked! | 16:57 |
Diggy | thanks so much | 16:58 |
* SDuensin cheers! | 16:58 |
+bartjol | we are awesome | 16:58 |
SDuensin | Our pleasure. | 16:58 |
Diggy | now, can i upgrade 7.6.35 to the very latest? | 16:58 |
Diggy | and you a r awesome! | 16:58 |
+bartjol | well there is at least a stop at 7.7.33 | 16:58 |
SDuensin | I think so. Might want to snapshot that VM first. :-) | 16:58 |
Diggy | ok. any gotchas? | 16:59 |
+bartjol | probably | 16:59 |
SDuensin | OH! I misread that! 7.6.x to latest, no! What bartjol said. | 16:59 |
Diggy | great ;-( | 16:59 |
+bartjol | look in github at 7.7.33 | 16:59 |
Diggy | ok. thanks for the tip on snapshotting the vm. didn't think of that :-0 | 17:00 |
+bartjol | http://github.com/plainblack/webgui/blob/webgui-7.7/docs/gotcha.txt | 17:00 |
Diggy | will do. this is a giant step for me-kind, tho | 17:00 |
SDuensin | hehe | 17:01 |
SDuensin | WebGUI is worth the effort. | 17:01 |
Diggy | i agree! that's why i've been so bummed at my inability to upgrade | 17:01 |
+bartjol | oh, i see that in that gotcha it only goes to 7.6.11 | 17:01 |
+bartjol | so there'll be an overlap | 17:01 |
Diggy | i do like the rapid development afforded by the vm | 17:02 |
Diggy | i don't understand bartjol's point | 17:02 |
+bartjol | that there will be some steps that you've already taken | 17:03 |
+bartjol | in that gotcha | 17:03 |
Diggy | so, those are behind me then? | 17:03 |
+bartjol | yeah, but only partially | 17:03 |
+bartjol | so get the 7.6.35 and 7.7.33 gotchas next to each other and compare | 17:04 |
* ckotil takes note. | 17:04 |
ckotil | im at 7.6.35 | 17:04 |
ckotil | been stuck for a while | 17:04 |
Diggy | looking at gotchas for 7.7, i see that a fair number of perl mods have changed/are required | 17:06 |
Diggy | scary, ew scary :-) | 17:07 |
+bartjol | we've heard some problems about testEnvironment not installing modules probably | 17:07 |
+bartjol | so manual might be better | 17:07 |
SDuensin | Really, bartjol ? | 17:08 |
+bartjol | yeah | 17:08 |
+bartjol | afraid so | 17:08 |
+bartjol | some forum posts I believe | 17:08 |
SDuensin | :-/ | 17:08 |
+bartjol | not sure, maybe that is for specific wre buiilds | 17:08 |
Diggy | erm, does that mean that if i do a manual install 0f 7.7.33, that testEnvironment wiil fetch the proper modules (sorry if that's a dumb*ssed question) | 17:09 |
+bartjol | it should | 17:10 |
Diggy | i might as well give it a rip | 17:10 |
+bartjol | but you have to run it :P | 17:10 |
Diggy | ok | 17:10 |
+bartjol | if it failes, switch to manual | 17:10 |
Diggy | uh, sorry again, i don't understand. i'm prepared to do a manual install of 7.7.33 | 17:11 |
+bartjol | no, manual perl module installation | 17:11 |
Diggy | yeah, of course | 17:11 |
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SDuensin | Just try it and see what happens. If it doesn't work, we can help you with cpan. | 17:12 |
Diggy | hopefully, Dag repo has them. CPAN can be a PITA at times | 17:12 |
Diggy | appreciate the offer | 17:12 |
SDuensin | Dag? | 17:12 |
Diggy | yeah. well known repo for CentOS/RHEL packages | 17:13 |
Diggy | aka rpmforge | 17:13 |
Diggy | you could look it up :-) | 17:14 |
+bartjol | oh, the build-essentials package is essential for debian | 17:14 |
SDuensin | Oh. I don't do RPM. :-) | 17:14 |
+bartjol | for the make program | 17:14 |
Diggy | ah. well, the webgui vm appears to be built on CentOS 5 | 17:14 |
+bartjol | ah, I don't have any routine with that | 17:16 |
Diggy | a repo RPM is available from the repository. it creates the repo file needed for yum to get to Dag repo | 17:17 |
Diggy | then "yum install pkgname" | 17:17 |
Diggy | or,, grab individual perl modules (if available) manually, and use rpm to install | 17:18 |
Diggy | quite simple, really | 17:18 |
Diggy | ok, so i've got the 7.7.33 tarball | 17:19 |
Diggy | ready to try manual install (cheers and encouragement :-) ?) | 17:20 |
SDuensin | Is that the next stop point? | 17:21 |
* SDuensin doesn't know. | 17:21 |
Diggy | you mean, is 7.7.33 the next stop point? from what bartjol said above, it is | 17:22 |
* bartjol thinks so | 17:22 |
SDuensin | Then rock on! You're very safe with a snapshot. Remember the snapshot? :-) | 17:22 |
+bartjol | if there isn't anything else in the gotcha | 17:22 |
Diggy | snapshotting as we speak | 17:25 |
+bartjol | hey patspam, wre 0.9.4 is being copied | 17:26 |
SDuensin | Oh no! That means more upgrades! :-P | 17:27 |
+patspam | bartjol++ | 17:28 |
+bartjol | SDuensin: that is a trial version, only for nice people :P | 17:28 |
SDuensin | Oh, I won't be nice then. :-D | 17:28 |
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@Haarg | patspam, what kind of condition is your plack webgui in? i've been messing with plack a bit recently and was thinking about spending some spare time on that. | 17:38 |
+patspam | hey haarg | 17:38 |
+patspam | I started playing with it again the other day | 17:38 |
@Haarg | i looked around at the code a bit but wasn't sure how close to fully working it was | 17:38 |
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+patspam | the Plack::Request api changed, so the old version was broken | 17:38 |
+patspam | but Plack::Request is stable now | 17:38 |
+patspam | for PlebGUI I localised the changes as much as possible | 17:39 |
+patspam | most of wG still thought it was using Apache2::Request etc.. | 17:40 |
+patspam | for wg8 we should rip out a lot more of the guts | 17:40 |
@Haarg | yeah, i gathered there was a lot of compatibility code which we will hopefully do away with | 17:40 |
+patspam | it's going to be mostly straight forward | 17:40 |
+patspam | the only time consuming part I found was trying to find documentation on what the APR methods do, to try to map them to equivalent Plack::Request methods | 17:41 |
-!- perlDreamer [~colink@pool-98-108-135-77.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui | 17:42 |
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+patspam | I'll push up what I've done recently | 17:42 |
+patspam | the other thing is | 17:44 |
+bartjol | for next time, where is it announced that there will be an upgrade script from stable to the first beta, I can manage to get it done easily, but I do have to read the scripts to see what is already done | 17:44 |
+patspam | plebgui was branched off 7.8.1 | 17:44 |
@Haarg | luckily most of the large scale webgui 8 changes have been in assets so merging shouldn't prove too difficult | 17:45 |
Diggy | update - d*mn CPAN barfed! --> "Install of CSS::Minifier::XS failed!" | 17:45 |
Diggy | shall i try to install from CPAN shell with "force"? | 17:46 |
SDuensin | Be nice about it first. :-) | 17:46 |
@Haarg | was that in the CPAN client or through testEnvironment? | 17:47 |
Diggy | yes (sorry for the swearing :-) - sanity thing | 17:47 |
SDuensin | "Tension breaker! Had to be done!" | 17:47 |
Diggy | oh, sorry, testEnvironment | 17:47 |
Diggy | true dat | 17:48 |
@Haarg | frodwith, i should probably file a bug for it but the tests for POE::Component::Server::PSGI seem to fail on windows | 17:48 |
@Haarg | try installing it with the CPAN shell, and if it fails pastebin the results | 17:48 |
Diggy | ok, trying now | 17:49 |
Diggy | eek. first CSS::Minifier::XS u=install barfed because YAML wasn't installed. did that. | 17:53 |
Diggy | then it barfed for some other reason. see pastebin/ieAzYujw | 17:54 |
@Haarg | you have an actual link i can use? | 17:57 |
@Haarg | either that or it didn't post correctly | 17:58 |
Diggy | sorry about that. try freebsd.pastebin.com/rVsKFfA9 | 18:02 |
+MrHairgrease | you don't have a c compiler | 18:02 |
Diggy | really | 18:03 |
+MrHairgrease | what distro are you on | 18:03 |
SDuensin | MrHairgrease - It's the WebGUI VM. | 18:03 |
SDuensin | CENTOS | 18:03 |
Diggy | CentOS 5.x. This is the WebGUI-provided VM | 18:03 |
+MrHairgrease | oh | 18:03 |
+MrHairgrease | i see | 18:03 |
+MrHairgrease | you can try 'which cc' | 18:04 |
+MrHairgrease | but that'll prolly tell you you don't have one | 18:04 |
Diggy | i note that gcc is not install. will do that now and see if it helps | 18:05 |
+MrHairgrease | yup | 18:05 |
+MrHairgrease | that would help =) | 18:05 |
Diggy | i'm so exited | 18:05 |
Diggy | ok, a little exited | 18:05 |
+bartjol | i just can't hide it | 18:05 |
+MrHairgrease | you can from me bart | 18:05 |
Diggy | those'd make snappy tune lyrics :-) | 18:06 |
+MrHairgrease | biertje baidewai? | 18:06 |
+bartjol | njou, dasj lekkah | 18:06 |
+MrHairgrease | oki hang on | 18:06 |
Diggy | just out of curiosity, what language is that? | 18:07 |
+bartjol | very terrible dutch | 18:07 |
Diggy | i knew that ... no | 18:08 |
+MrHairgrease | terrible indeed... | 18:08 |
+MrHairgrease | but then again it's passed 5 so who can blame us | 18:08 |
Diggy | i wouldn't know terrible dutch from good dutch, so i'm impressed :-) | 18:09 |
+bartjol | yeah, we speak it fluently | 18:09 |
+MrHairgrease | Most Dutch people don't know the difference either | 18:09 |
Diggy | ok, gcc is installed. should i try installing CSS::Minifier::XS via CPAN shell, or try testEnvironment again | 18:10 |
+MrHairgrease | hey perlDreamer: remember those Moose attribute problems I had? | 18:10 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 18:11 |
+MrHairgrease | I made a moosex trait for it | 18:11 |
+perlDreamer | sweet | 18:11 |
+MrHairgrease | http://github.com/martink/moosex-slaveattribute/blob/master/lib/MooseX/SlaveAttribute.pm | 18:11 |
+MrHairgrease | Moose is awesome | 18:11 |
Diggy | mint, CSS::Minifier::XS installed. now, shoudl i run testEnvironment again? | 18:12 |
Getty | Moose owns | 18:12 |
Getty | its the best method to bring java dudes to perl ;) | 18:13 |
+MrHairgrease | Diggy yes | 18:13 |
Diggy | and leave the poor moose alone! (i couldn't resist) | 18:13 |
+MrHairgrease | Getty, I don't think Java dudes can handle the dynamic sweetness that is perl =) | 18:13 |
Getty | hehe they can, they can | 18:13 |
Getty | its just that they didnt know about it ;) | 18:13 |
Getty | but there are some that dont | 18:14 |
+MrHairgrease | Diggy, you have mooses enough in Norway | 18:14 |
Diggy | I'm north american. plenty here, too | 18:14 |
+MrHairgrease | what's the pluar of Moose anyway? Meese? | 18:14 |
+MrHairgrease | Oh, my bad | 18:15 |
SDuensin | Moosi | 18:15 |
+MrHairgrease | you're connected to a freenode server in Olso | 18:15 |
Diggy | moosi | 18:15 |
Diggy | the world is flat! | 18:15 |
+MrHairgrease | no | 18:16 |
+MrHairgrease | the world is round... | 18:16 |
+MrHairgrease | ...like a pancake | 18:16 |
Diggy | hey, ur helping me, so i won't argue the point :-) | 18:16 |
+MrHairgrease | hehe | 18:16 |
SDuensin | Smart lad. | 18:17 |
Diggy | mama didn't raise any fools | 18:18 |
Diggy | gonna step away for a cig (don't judge me) while CPAN does its thing | 18:21 |
SDuensin | JUDGEMENT COMEITH! | 18:21 |
Diggy | hey, it's the opiate of the masses | 18:21 |
SDuensin | My is coffee. | 18:22 |
+perlDreamer | My wife is in school to be a nurse. | 18:23 |
+perlDreamer | This term she is doing oncology (cancer treatment) | 18:23 |
+perlDreamer | all of her patients are smokers or ex-smokers | 18:23 |
+MrHairgrease | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCZPPGlVS6s | 18:23 |
+MrHairgrease | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWXbVsMkz1U | 18:25 |
Diggy | i said "don't judge me", didn't i? :-) | 18:28 |
+MrHairgrease | I'm not judging anyone | 18:28 |
+bartjol | MrHairgrease has smoke coming from every orifice of his body | 18:30 |
+MrHairgrease | Funny, never noticed that | 18:31 |
+bartjol | well, that invisible smoke yesterday almost killed Roberto and me | 18:32 |
+MrHairgrease | hehe | 18:32 |
+bartjol | roti, yeah right, Colin Powell has pictures of you! | 18:32 |
+MrHairgrease | hmmm, roti... | 18:33 |
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Diggy | update - upgrade seemed to work. but when i try to go into admin mode, i get a "Problem with Request" page | 18:36 |
+MrHairgrease | did you restart modperl? | 18:36 |
+bartjol | a lot of times | 18:36 |
+bartjol | oh, sorry | 18:37 |
Diggy | as in restart apache? | 18:37 |
+bartjol | not me | 18:37 |
+MrHairgrease | yup | 18:37 |
+bartjol | no | 18:37 |
+bartjol | only apache isn't enough, is it? | 18:37 |
+MrHairgrease | /data/wre/sbin/wreservice --restart modperl | 18:37 |
+MrHairgrease | or /data/wre/sbin/wreservice --restart modperl specre | 18:38 |
+MrHairgrease | err | 18:38 |
+MrHairgrease | /data/wre/sbin/wreservice --restart modperl spectre | 18:38 |
Diggy | many thanks, that did it! | 18:41 |
+MrHairgrease | no problem | 18:41 |
Diggy | i'm psyched, oh yeah. i'm psyched, oh yeah (does a liitle dance) | 18:41 |
Diggy | NOW can i upgrade to latest and greatest? | 18:42 |
Diggy | Yes? No? (everyone must have gone out on a cig break ;-) ) | 18:46 |
+MrHairgrease | i dunno what version you're at | 18:47 |
+MrHairgrease | so I cannot tell | 18:47 |
Diggy | 7.7.33 | 18:47 |
+bartjol | what, I actually had some work to do | 18:47 |
+MrHairgrease | I guess you can then upgrade to th e7.8 series | 18:47 |
+bartjol | I try to avoid that, but hey | 18:47 |
+bartjol | yes | 18:47 |
+bartjol | maybe some perl modules | 18:48 |
+MrHairgrease | just look in the gotchas.txt file if there are some extra stoppoints on th eroad | 18:48 |
+bartjol | read the 7.8 gotcha | 18:48 |
+bartjol | maybe 7.8.13 | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | you can upgrade from 7.7.33 to 7.8.14 with no hiccups | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | just extra module requirements | 18:48 |
+bartjol | ah | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | we're trying to minimize mid-stream hiccups on the shunt path | 18:48 |
+bartjol | but if you want to go to beta, stop at 7.8.13 | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | but going to 7.9.0 is for heffalumps and woozils | 18:49 |
+bartjol | like me | 18:49 |
Diggy | oh yeah, work. ok, i'll give 7.8.14 a whirl | 18:49 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol is a jagular | 18:49 |
Diggy | and, bartjol, take it easy on yourself :-) | 18:50 |
+bartjol | I will, but I had some moments today that I took pride in myself too much | 18:50 |
+bartjol | gotta keep the balance | 18:51 |
Diggy | been there. then i do something completely idiotic, and it slaps me back to reality | 18:51 |
+perlDreamer | I worked with a guy who said, "All those atta-boys are killed by one aw shit." | 18:51 |
+bartjol | yeah, but for the few seconds it lasts, it is nice | 18:51 |
Diggy | and, as we all know, reality bites | 18:52 |
+bartjol | therefore, I wear steel underwear | 18:52 |
Diggy | yeah, a brief endorphin rush | 18:52 |
Diggy | perlDreamer, that one is going into my book of notable quotes | 18:54 |
+perlDreamer | I miss working with Jim, he was a good guy | 18:56 |
Diggy | update - i'm now running the latest-and-greatest WebGUI!!! | 19:02 |
Diggy | except for a couple of angst-filled moments, it was all pretty painless | 19:02 |
Diggy | that is, thanks to your help | 19:03 |
Diggy | i have 2 more questions: | 19:03 |
+bartjol | yes we wear skirts | 19:03 |
+bartjol | oops | 19:03 |
+bartjol | go ahaid, yhat 1 beer hit a spot | 19:04 |
Diggy | 1. as part of the upgrade process, the instructions, i'm to restart apache | 19:04 |
+bartjol | well, mainly modperl | 19:04 |
Diggy | but when i try, i get an error saying that httpd.conf can't be found | 19:04 |
+bartjol | that is a mention in the output of the update script | 19:04 |
+bartjol | ah | 19:04 |
+bartjol | did you set the environment? | 19:04 |
Diggy | oops, so much for RTFM | 19:05 |
+MrHairgrease | are you restarting the system apache? | 19:05 |
+MrHairgrease | beacuse you shgouldn't do that | 19:05 |
Diggy | don't honestly know | 19:05 |
+bartjol | well he seems to try that | 19:05 |
Diggy | anyway, seems benign | 19:05 |
+bartjol | perl wreservice.pl --restart modproxy | 19:05 |
+MrHairgrease | if you use /data/wre/sbin/wreservice you don't have to worry about those things | 19:05 |
+bartjol | that wreservice indeed | 19:06 |
+MrHairgrease | it's better to hjust run it as /data/wre/sbin/wreservice | 19:06 |
Diggy | 2. somewhere i saw that i can check the WebGUI version from the admin console | 19:06 |
+MrHairgrease | that way you don't need to set the environment in advance | 19:06 |
Diggy | but i don't see where | 19:06 |
+bartjol | it's in the statistics | 19:06 |
Diggy | and, ok to answers for #1 | 19:06 |
Diggy | (sheepishly) i haven't really set up the site yet. is "statistics" in the admin console? | 19:07 |
SDuensin | yup | 19:08 |
Diggy | it's probably staring me in the face | 19:08 |
SDuensin | Little picture of a bar graph. | 19:08 |
+bartjol | it's somewhere at words that start with an "S" | 19:08 |
Diggy | uh, oh, i don't see that | 19:09 |
+MrHairgrease | are you admin? | 19:09 |
Diggy | yup | 19:09 |
+bartjol | you're not at the new content, are you? | 19:09 |
Diggy | see, my installation luck was too good to be true :-) | 19:10 |
Diggy | yes, new content | 19:10 |
+bartjol | that is not good | 19:10 |
+bartjol | sorry | 19:10 |
Diggy | ah, NOW i see it. arrgh | 19:10 |
SDuensin | :-) | 19:10 |
+bartjol | 1 click away | 19:11 |
CIA-58 | WebGUI: translation * r12450 /translations/German/German/ (4 files): Updating German on translation server | 19:11 |
+bartjol | perlDreamer: have you recomitted dutch to? | 19:11 |
Diggy | hmm, odd. says WebGUI Build Version 7.7.33. Latest version available 7.8.14 | 19:11 |
+bartjol | too? | 19:11 |
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Diggy | i just installed 7.8.14 (didn't i?) | 19:12 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, I just did German as a test | 19:12 |
+MrHairgrease | ok, have fun with your new wg install, I have to go to the bar | 19:12 |
+bartjol | ok, want another test? I won't touch it then | 19:12 |
+perlDreamer | Diggy, you can check the WebGUI version from any page | 19:12 |
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+perlDreamer | I'll commit yer stuff, bartjol | 19:12 |
+perlDreamer | go chase after MrHairgrease | 19:12 |
Diggy | if i were there, i'd buy you a tall frosty one | 19:12 |
+bartjol | eeeh, beer | 19:12 |
+perlDreamer | there you go | 19:13 |
* SDuensin is closer, Diggy. :-P | 19:13 |
+bartjol | duck, you suckers, eeeh, I mean: so long dear people | 19:13 |
-!- bartjol [~bartjol@kantoor.procolix.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] | 19:14 |
Diggy | what a nice person | 19:14 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol is good people | 19:14 |
Diggy | perlDreamer, any idea why i'm not seeing 7.8.14 as installed? | 19:15 |
SDuensin | I think I need cheeseburgers. | 19:15 |
SDuensin | What do you see? | 19:15 |
+perlDreamer | SDuensin: u can haz cheezbrgrz | 19:15 |
Diggy | 7.7.13 is the Build Version reported | 19:15 |
SDuensin | Uh oh. | 19:15 |
Diggy | i could stand a burger, too | 19:16 |
+perlDreamer | Diggy, what's the version in /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI.pm ? | 19:16 |
+perlDreamer | right near the top of the file, first 10-15 lines or so | 19:16 |
Diggy | and what do you mean, "uh, oh". not a confidence builder | 19:16 |
SDuensin | :-) | 19:16 |
+perlDreamer | SDuensin: u can haz cheezbrgr | 19:16 |
SDuensin | perlDreamer: Yea, but I gotta go get cheezbrgr. | 19:17 |
+perlDreamer | but only if you stop scaring the newbies | 19:17 |
Diggy | yeash, stop scaring the newbies! WebGUI.pm says "our $VERSION = '7.8.14'" | 19:18 |
+perlDreamer | okay, Diggy, here's what you need to do | 19:20 |
+perlDreamer | Log into the site as Admin, Turn On Admin, Admin Console, Cache, clear cache | 19:20 |
+perlDreamer | clear the cache in your browser | 19:20 |
+perlDreamer | restart modperl again | 19:20 |
+perlDreamer | turn around three times while chanting "WebGUI ROCKS!!" while holding a small purple octopus over your head | 19:21 |
Diggy | used an armadillo for the dance, instead. it worked! | 19:23 |
SDuensin | I've done that. It works. | 19:23 |
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Diggy | if i had the octopus, i'd have eaten it | 19:24 |
* SDuensin bought one to watch over his server. | 19:25 |
Diggy | first of all, to be completely semi-serious, thank you all so much for your help and your patience | 19:25 |
Diggy | not only do i have a working latest-and-greatest, but i've had fun getting there | 19:25 |
+perlDreamer | awesome :) | 19:26 |
* SDuensin cheers! | 19:26 |
CIA-58 | WebGUI: translation * r12451 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (Asset_SQLReport.pm Form_Username.pm Form.pm): Updating Dutch on translation server | 19:26 |
SDuensin | See? You should hang out. We're fun. | 19:26 |
Diggy | i'd like to drop in every once-in-a-while to do just that | 19:26 |
+perlDreamer | Diggy, here's a little more advice | 19:26 |
+perlDreamer | browse the wiki | 19:26 |
Diggy | ? | 19:26 |
Diggy | ok | 19:26 |
+perlDreamer | download the WebGUI starter guide from plainblack.com and read it cover to cover | 19:27 |
SDuensin | Yea. What he said. | 19:27 |
+perlDreamer | report bugs when you find them, and answer questions to your bugs promptly | 19:27 |
Diggy | reading! oh, no. | 19:27 |
+perlDreamer | search the forum for questions/answers | 19:27 |
SDuensin | Hehe | 19:27 |
SDuensin | It has pictures! | 19:27 |
Diggy | whew | 19:27 |
+perlDreamer | if you do these things, the WebGUI support community will smile and bless you | 19:27 |
Diggy | i can use all the help i can get! | 19:27 |
Diggy | i'll do as advised | 19:28 |
Diggy | now that i have a brand spankin' new install, i'll go at it in earnest | 19:28 |
Diggy | ... i don't think earnest will mind | 19:28 |
SDuensin | SNAPSHOT IT! | 19:29 |
SDuensin | :-) | 19:29 |
Diggy | will do | 19:29 |
* SDuensin loves VMs. | 19:29 |
+perlDreamer | run your backups daily | 19:29 |
Diggy | so does Diggy | 19:29 |
Diggy | wait a minute here, there's real work involved here :-) | 19:30 |
+perlDreamer | the WRE is setup to run backups for you | 19:30 |
+perlDreamer | just setup the correct cron job | 19:30 |
Diggy | good to know | 19:30 |
Diggy | i can do that | 19:31 |
+perlDreamer | I think the list of cron jobs is in the wiki | 19:32 |
Diggy | the wiki seems like a must | 19:32 |
Diggy | i'm just kinda noodlin' around the admin console now. how kewl | 19:32 |
Trex | Hi folks. I have some simple questions about using preload.custom -- questions that appear not to be anwered in the wiki. | 19:33 |
Diggy | well, back to work | 19:33 |
SDuensin | Take your time. Don't get frustrated. | 19:33 |
Diggy | as i said earlier, reality bites | 19:33 |
SDuensin | Frustration leads you to do dumb things. Like when I installed Drupal and Joomla. | 19:33 |
SDuensin | OK, I'm going for food at last. Back soon! | 19:34 |
Diggy | SDuensin, i learned a long time ago that if u want to success in IT, u have to be patient | 19:34 |
Diggy | anyway, thanks to all again | 19:34 |
Trex | For example, I want to add a couple template variables to Calendar.pm, specifically to the month view... | 19:34 |
Diggy | ttfn | 19:34 |
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Trex | To do this with preload.custom, do you have to copy the entire Calendar.pm file over, or just the subroutines that you wish to modify (like viewMonth)? | 19:35 |
Trex | In other words, does preload.custom replace everything within the original Calendar.pm file if it sees it in the custom directory, or does it give you more fine control over specific subroutines? | 19:37 |
+perlDreamer | Trex: you'd subclass Asset/Wobject/Calendar.pm, and just override the subroutines that you need to | 19:37 |
+perlDreamer | custom.preload just adds directories to @INC | 19:38 |
+perlDreamer | everything else is vanilla perl | 19:38 |
+perlDreamer | what kind of variables do you want to add? | 19:38 |
+perlDreamer | if you just want more date formats, I would use a Macro instead of changing code | 19:39 |
Trex | Thanks, pearlDreamer. I don't suppose you could point me to a simple example that would show the syntax for how you would sublcass something. I can do some damage in Perl, but I'm hardly an expert. :) | 19:40 |
+perlDreamer | it's pretty simple | 19:40 |
Trex | What I would like is a "previousMonthUrl" and "nextMonthUrl" variable. Right now you just get a loop of months and links to them, so it seems a bit complex to try to build a marco that would generate these links from the available template variables. | 19:40 |
+perlDreamer | use base qw/WebGUI::Asset::Wobject::Calendar/; #for sub classing | 19:41 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r1427692 / (4 files in 4 dirs): Fix direct linking to posts and threads when their pagination is set to 0. Fixes bug #11464. - http://bit.ly/aH0GC5 | 19:45 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r21e3210 / (4 files in 4 dirs): Fix direct linking to posts and threads when their pagination is set to 0. Fixes bug #11464. - http://bit.ly/cEWaYy | 19:45 |
Trex | With subclassing, would I then be making an entire alternate variation of the Calendar (a whole new asset) in which my changes would be available, or does this make the changes available within the standard WebGUI Calendar asset? | 19:59 |
+perlDreamer | well, if you subclass, it's a whole new asset | 20:01 |
+perlDreamer | but if you monkey-patch, it would alter the default Calendar | 20:01 |
Trex | Monkey-patching referring going into the API and modifying it yourself? | 20:01 |
* perlDreamer suggests just patching the regular Calendar, and making an RFE to move the code into the core | 20:01 |
+perlDreamer | in monkey patching, you overwrite subroutines in another module | 20:02 |
+perlDreamer | it's kind of like pulling weeds in your neighbors yards | 20:02 |
+perlDreamer | it gets rid of the weeds, but isn't the best thing to be doing | 20:02 |
Trex | I was hoping that preload.custom was a way to create custom mods that would apply to the core, but would be outside the upgrade path. | 20:02 |
+perlDreamer | it is, but only as new assets, not by changing existing ones | 20:03 |
Trex | And yes, I was planning on submitting an RFE, but wanted to test my code first under the preload.custom model -- at least how I thought it worked. | 20:03 |
SDuensin | What about this? http://www.webgui.org/wgtv/the-swiftysite-technique (Or is that "monkey patching"?) | 20:04 |
+perlDreamer | I'm not sure how they built it, SD. I didn't attend that session last year | 20:06 |
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SDuensin | It's interesting. Some Perl-fu I've not seen before. (Which isn't hard to find.) | 20:06 |
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Trex | Thanks for the help, perlDreamer! I must be off again. | 20:14 |
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+patspam | Haarg: I pushed up the Plack code as the "plebgui" branch | 20:44 |
+perlDreamer | patspam: my son Peter says there is good wine tasting on the trains at Mt. Hood | 20:46 |
+perlDreamer | I'm not sure if he's trying to get a ride out of it, or wanting to try some wine (kid is only 10!), or authentically trying to be helpful | 20:47 |
+patspam | either way... totally awesome! | 20:47 |
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@preaction | patspam: does that mean plebgui is ready for prime-time? | 22:16 |
+patspam | well.. | 22:16 |
+patspam | I think I hacked it back to functional post-Plack::Request api changes | 22:16 |
+patspam | but the next step would be to rewrite it | 22:17 |
+patspam | ripping out Apache::Request altogether | 22:17 |
+patspam | lib/WebGUI/Session/Plack.pm fakes the parts of Apache::Request API that webgui uses | 22:19 |
@preaction | ahh | 22:19 |
+patspam | really we should rip the guts out of WebGUI.pm, use middleware instead of content handlers, and refactor $session->request to be more naturally PSGI | 22:20 |
@preaction | oh yes, but that would be far outside the scope of 8, and that is my plan for eventually (which, if i have my way, means 9) | 22:21 |
@preaction | though that means we're once again playing catchup | 22:21 |
+patspam | how much is within scope? | 22:22 |
@preaction | ripping out Apache::Request is fine, i don't think that any asset-level custom code should be using $session->request. so any changes to that should be fine | 22:23 |
@preaction | but using plack middleware not as fine, it's another set of changes and stuff we don't have time for | 22:24 |
@preaction | though having a way to use plack middleware would be fine, then we could migrate at our leisure | 22:24 |
@preaction | the main thing is we need to start having preview releases of WG8 in the next 3-4 months | 22:25 |
+patspam | ok, so we keep support for content & url handlers in WebGUI.pm | 22:26 |
@preaction | for now, yes | 22:26 |
+patspam | I started converting the core handlers to middleware for plebgui, it's mostly an easy translation | 22:26 |
+patspam | middleware will be possible as soon as we support PSGI | 22:27 |
@preaction | okay | 22:27 |
@preaction | anything to get rid of apache as soon as possible | 22:27 |
@preaction | well, not apache, but modperl, but whatevz | 22:27 |
+patspam | what's the plan for modproxy? | 22:28 |
+patspam | did you say something about nginx + wgaccess the other day? | 22:29 |
@preaction | nginx, yes | 22:29 |
+patspam | sweet | 22:29 |
@preaction | i'd really really really like to see if we can make WebGUI entirely async, but that might be more of a research project for a GSOC or something | 22:29 |
+patspam | now you're talking! | 22:29 |
@preaction | JT wanted carrier grade, I want to deliver ;) | 22:30 |
+patspam | sweet. I've been playing with tatsumaki quite a bit lately | 22:30 |
@preaction | interesting | 22:32 |
+patspam | I'm bolt bussing to boston tonight (4hrs), I might see about ripping out Apache::Request | 22:32 |
+patspam | the thing that was slowing me down was not knowing where to look up docs for the APR api | 22:32 |
+patspam | I can never find the damn methods in cpan | 22:33 |
@preaction | yeah, you gotta go to modperl.apache.org or whatever | 22:33 |
+patspam | it's so annoying that you have to guess which package the method is in | 22:36 |
+patspam | Apache2::RequestRec, Apache2::RequestUtil, .. | 22:36 |
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+patspam | I don't know if there's any sane way to keep the content and url handlers API | 22:39 |
+patspam | because they're coupled to Apache request | 22:40 |
@preaction | oh, right, of course | 22:41 |
@preaction | well, URL handlers can go | 22:41 |
@preaction | better idea: just make it a Plack::Request object instead and we'll make people change | 22:42 |
+patspam | yeah that's much more preferable | 22:42 |
+patspam | Asset is the only content handler that is coupled to Apache | 22:43 |
+patspam | for streaming uploads | 22:43 |
@preaction | ah, yeah that'll have to change | 22:43 |
+patspam | but apart from that, we can preserve the contentHandler api | 22:44 |
+patspam | url handlers will be so much nicer as middleware anyway | 22:44 |
@preaction | indeed | 22:44 |
+patspam | the one ugly hack i can remember in plebgui is that it buffers output | 22:45 |
+patspam | but once we rip out Apache::Request I think we can fix that | 22:46 |
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+perlDreamer | patspam, there's some apache module which will tell you in which other modules the docs live | 23:20 |
+perlDreamer | it was posted to the dev list a long time ago | 23:20 |
+patspam | hmm can't find it | 23:25 |
+patspam | well, with any luck I'll have internet access on the bus, so maybe chat to you guys later on | 23:30 |
* patspam heads to boston | 23:30 |
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* perlDreamer heads off to pick up the kids | 23:32 |
+perlDreamer | then I'll see about finding that Apache documentation module | 23:33 |
+perlDreamer | it was perl -MApache:::Something -e 'find method_name;' | 23:33 |
+perlDreamer | very simple | 23:33 |
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+perlDreamer | ha! found it | 00:53 |
+perlDreamer | http://perl.apache.org/docs/2.0/api/ModPerl/MethodLookup.html | 00:53 |
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Getty | stupid question, someone asked me, can WebGUI run as (Fast)CGI? i dont think so, or? | 01:06 |
+perlDreamer | no | 01:12 |
+perlDreamer | right now it only runs as modpel | 01:13 |
+perlDreamer | modperl | 01:13 |
+perlDreamer | in WebGUI 8, it might run as FastCGI through the magic of Plack | 01:13 |
+perlDreamer | but we shall see | 01:13 |
@preaction | Getty: if you want to help patspam with the plack translation, i'm sure he'd be appreciative (and so would i) | 01:19 |
@preaction | if you can backport it to 7.x that'd be wonderful as well. | 01:19 |
Getty | magic of Plack... ok ;) | 01:20 |
Getty | nah, just curious.... is there mod_perl for lighttpd? so far i avoided mod_perl in general cause it made very strange errors in the past | 01:20 |
+perlDreamer | we've been using it for quite a while now | 01:21 |
+perlDreamer | and aside from using lots of memory, it's been fine | 01:21 |
@preaction | it's not mod_perl so much as Apache::Request <- that's the big part | 01:21 |
Getty | (for example long time mod_perl had the bug to disable parsing off .htaccess files with a path longer then 128 chars, whatever mod_perl was active for the vhost/dir or not) | 01:21 |
Getty | if you had such kind of bugs you avoid that software for a longer time ;) | 01:22 |
@preaction | the WRE puts a mod_proxy instance in front to serve static content or normal CGI stuff, the idea being to get rid of the problems of mod_perl from standard serving | 01:22 |
@preaction | you could use lighty or nginx as the proxy | 01:22 |
Getty | varnish and/or lighttpd should be the highest front | 01:22 |
Getty | varnish + ESI... owns... | 01:22 |
Getty | you REALLY should dive into this if you dont know it | 01:22 |
Getty | its the concept akamai works on | 01:23 |
@preaction | it's something to look at, but first we have to get rid of the reliance on apache | 01:26 |
Getty | actually, if you use varnish + esi you could not care about that anymore | 01:27 |
Getty | seriously | 01:27 |
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Getty | patspam: we just talked about you :-P | 01:28 |
@preaction | apache/mod_perl really hampers us when it comes to performance, real performance | 01:28 |
+patspam | I felt my ears burning | 01:28 |
+perlDreamer | it was better than CGI | 01:28 |
+patspam | yay for bolt bus interwebs | 01:28 |
Getty | preaction: yeah but you gain so much performance with that concept... you know it at all? i always wanted to set it up but my newest employer is actually not in the size for the requirement ;) at my old one they was to less into new technology (thats why i left) | 01:29 |
@preaction | the ESI stuff would probably require a whole bunch of work, and may not even be viable for our model, where an entire page can be completely dependent on the user who is viewing it (not RESTful, but we've never enforced it in the past) | 01:29 |
Getty | the caching of specific layers is something that already boosts much | 01:30 |
Getty | even tho i know what you mean | 01:30 |
@preaction | i'm not saying we can't do it, i'm saying we've got priorities, and our internals are so horrible that i'd rather straighten those out than try to build something on top of it | 01:30 |
Getty | understandable | 01:30 |
Getty | i just say that its worth to have a deeper look at it before you do some more internal rework | 01:31 |
@preaction | i'd love to just scrap the entire project and build something fully modern on a completely async stack with sharding and caching and replication in mind on the full backend, but... well... | 01:31 |
Getty | i know what you mean, 100% | 01:31 |
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Getty | but i'm a rapid developer and i always tell: have one proof of concept so that you got it in mind, and probably "something happens" | 01:31 |
Getty | and you guys are actually the best targets for that concept with that massive control about the env with WRE | 01:32 |
@preaction | well, that's what the Plack stuff is for, to reduce our deps on WRE. that being said, I still want the WRE to be the "Best Way To Deploy WebGUI" | 01:33 |
Getty | yeah it is | 01:33 |
@preaction | but it'd still be nice to "cpan> install WebGUI" | 01:33 |
Getty | yes of course | 01:33 |
Getty | "whatever the user fits best" | 01:33 |
Getty | but its awesome that you even THINK (thought) about WRE | 01:33 |
Getty | that you made it | 01:33 |
Getty | and see it as something that you can offer the user | 01:33 |
@preaction | but then we're back to "so much to do, no manpower" | 01:33 |
Getty | that is really "nextgen" in my eyes | 01:33 |
@preaction | you'd be surprised at the naysayers, even i don't run WRE on my dev box anymore (lib incompatibilities with standard OS X stuff) | 01:34 |
@preaction | but local::lib and perlswitch might work nicely with what we have | 01:34 |
Getty | my resources i give out are mostly concentrated on Padre and lower level libraries (like Webframeworks where you build stuff like WebGUI ;) ) | 01:34 |
Getty | yeah | 01:34 |
Getty | i use it that way | 01:34 |
Getty | no wait, i lie i dont | 01:34 |
Getty | but it owuld work | 01:34 |
Getty | no libs you use are incompatible with local::lib | 01:35 |
@preaction | well, WebGUI is its own framework (which i'm trying to fix, see http://github.com/preaction/modern-webgui | 01:35 |
Getty | i just wasnt sure how i use local::lib + mod_Perl and i didnt wanted to try out | 01:35 |
Getty | of course you got your own framework :) | 01:35 |
Getty | i didnt suggested anything else | 01:35 |
Getty | :) | 01:35 |
@preaction | i mean, i like Cat, but it doesn't mesh with the ideas of CMS very well (imho) | 01:35 |
Getty | oh.... i will now start official my learning of Catalyst to port my (dont say one word) PHP Webframework to Perl | 01:36 |
Getty | cause actually i still use it cause there is nothing like that on CPAN ;) | 01:36 |
@preaction | new door | 01:36 |
@preaction | (wow, that joke might be way too inside for anyone to get) | 01:37 |
Getty | and i thought: whatever i do, i should make it on top of Catalyst, cause its made by some of the most experienced CPAN developers and so it should be a good base | 01:37 |
@preaction | new door is an anagram for "one word". | 01:37 |
Getty | sounds like you also like good tea ;) | 01:37 |
@preaction | indeed. it's an app framework, and a CMS could be considered an app | 01:37 |
Getty | catalyst is an app framework? | 01:37 |
Getty | i totally considered it so far as framework | 01:38 |
@preaction | well, web app framework | 01:38 |
Getty | well wait... | 01:38 |
+patspam | Getty: I used local::lib to deploy plebgui on shared hosting | 01:38 |
Getty | mh where i can say the porder | 01:38 |
Getty | aehm border | 01:38 |
Getty | lets say i define an app framework more like something that does something even if you does nothing | 01:38 |
Getty | if you get what i mean | 01:38 |
Getty | even tho i must insist that definition is not that good, even tho its hard to make a REAL border | 01:39 |
@preaction | ah, yes. WebGUI without the core asset set | 01:39 |
@preaction | Catalyst is a framework | 01:39 |
Getty | yeah you need to code an app with it | 01:39 |
@preaction | Django is an app framework (has the admin stuff built-in) | 01:39 |
Getty | yeah | 01:39 |
Getty | that is what i meant | 01:39 |
Getty | my framework does also nearly nothing when you dont do anything | 01:39 |
Getty | but it gives you an error which template is missing ;) so you directly know where to start | 01:39 |
Getty | hehe | 01:39 |
@preaction | modern-webgui is heavily django-influenced (<3 django, but it really needs to start adding to the "app" part) | 01:40 |
Getty | but its just the content template, the complete structure of the page in standard divs is already there blabla you know what i mean | 01:40 |
Getty | its more "app" | 01:40 |
Getty | i got an awesome form management, which now definitly needs refactoring, and i said: fuck that shit i directly convert now to perl | 01:41 |
Getty | my boss is also hot for perl | 01:41 |
Getty | so.... we defined 1 day / week i go now for the perl startup so that we got something in some weeks | 01:41 |
Getty | its so ugly situation if you got something awesome to work with and its just in the wrong language... but its my fault so i cant blame anyone | 01:41 |
Getty | my only big problem still is that i need smarty syntax templates... its still p.d. the best non-coder syntax style, i know you can bend TT much to behave much like that but it seems impossible to make it "$var" instead of "var" | 01:42 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * r913fa9a / (58 files in 20 dirs): clean up Tie::IxHash imports - http://bit.ly/bBzkwl | 13:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * ra22162b / (11 files in 4 dirs): clean up Tie::CPHash imports - http://bit.ly/anYS7t | 13:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * r2af4c4d / (47 files in 15 dirs): clean up WebGUI::Utility imports - http://bit.ly/atTsk0 | 13:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * r45ca61b / (6 files in 2 dirs): more import cleanups - http://bit.ly/cZk5IY | 13:25 |
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SDuensin | Morning. | 16:19 |
+bartjol | hey scott | 16:22 |
SDuensin | Hey bartjol | 16:24 |
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+bartjol | oh, yeah, a customer called | 16:55 |
+bartjol | strange people | 16:55 |
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+perlDreamer | morning, folks | 17:34 |
SDuensin | Hey perlDreamer | 17:35 |
@Haarg | morning | 17:36 |
@Haarg | is there any reason to keep the 7.7 upgrades in WebGUI8 i'm not thinking of? | 17:39 |
+perlDreamer | none | 17:43 |
+perlDreamer | I just got through pruning the 7.7 upgrades out of 7.8 and 7.9 | 17:43 |
SDuensin | Crap. Out of coffee. | 17:43 |
+perlDreamer | taking kids to school, be back in 20 | 17:43 |
* SDuensin will still be here. | 17:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop WebGUI8 * rb24978e / (182 files in 23 dirs): removing old upgrades - http://bit.ly/bfFTRX | 17:46 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, what do you think about removing the form magic from property, and requiring people to put things into form directly? | 17:56 |
@Haarg | i was thinking about that. the magic is becoming more problematic. | 17:57 |
@Haarg | but it also seems like it should work fine to continue having the magic | 17:58 |
+perlDreamer | what about the thing with adding traits and the meta_property? | 17:58 |
+perlDreamer | it seems like we need to have a class with the trait applied to see what the attribute will do | 17:59 |
+perlDreamer | so then we're building some anonymous throwaway metaclass just to do that | 17:59 |
@Haarg | kind of | 17:59 |
@Haarg | but it caches the metaclass it builds | 18:00 |
@Haarg | based on the traits applied | 18:00 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, in order to apply the roles to the anon class, I need to get it inside the buidler for _property_metaclass | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | but builder methods don't get arguments, other than $self | 18:18 |
+perlDreamer | I think that means we need to flatten it into add_property | 18:19 |
+perlDreamer | "it" being _property_metaclass | 18:19 |
@Haarg | yeah, we might just want to do away with _property_metaclass | 18:20 |
+perlDreamer | are you going to talk about Moose at the WUC this year, Haarg? | 18:27 |
@Haarg | no. i don't remember if someone else was planning on talking about it. | 18:28 |
@Haarg | ugh i hate UNIVERSAL::(isa|can) so much | 18:37 |
+perlDreamer | yeah | 18:39 |
+perlDreamer | if it would just shut up, it would be a little more tolerable | 18:40 |
@Haarg | i would be fine with the warnings if they weren't all false positives | 18:40 |
@Haarg | like this | 18:41 |
@Haarg | Called UNIVERSAL::isa() as a function, not a method at /usr/local/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.10.1/UNIVERSAL/can.pm line 43 | 18:41 |
+perlDreamer | any thoughts on this: http://gist.github.com/329325 | 18:45 |
@Haarg | where is that trait supposed to be from? | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | Moose::Meta::Attribute::Native::Trait::Array | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | I think that's the problem | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | there's magic in traits to expand Array into Moose::Meta::Attribute::Native::Trait::Array | 18:48 |
@Haarg | yeah | 18:49 |
+perlDreamer | $perlDreamer->invoke('dispel magic', 'WebGUI::Definition::add_property'); | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | crud | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | You have to be a level 3 magic user to do that | 18:50 |
+perlDreamer | or was it level 5? | 18:52 |
+perlDreamer | it's been too long ago | 18:52 |
@Haarg | that may be the best way to go | 18:57 |
@Haarg | there are two other alternatives. first is using Moose::Meta::Class->interpolate_class(_and_new)? to make the metaclass object | 18:58 |
@Haarg | and the other 'better' solution that we don't have time for, which is making traits for all of the form types | 18:58 |
+perlDreamer | that would mean that I'd need to build a form type for handling JSON in the db, for things that never send the JSON to a form | 18:59 |
+perlDreamer | but I agree that we need a type system, and have our forms interact with that | 19:00 |
+perlDreamer | and, personally, I think we should base it on native Moose type, and build around that, rather than the other way around | 19:00 |
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+perlDreamer | I think that's a typo | 19:04 |
+perlDreamer | I don't see an interpolate_class in Moose::Meta::Class | 19:04 |
@Haarg | i guess it isn't in the pod | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | it's not in the code, either | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | it's actually in Moose::Meta::Attribute | 19:05 |
@Haarg | err | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | and it does resolve trait names | 19:05 |
@Haarg | yeah, that's the one | 19:05 |
+perlDreamer | the farther back we push into Moose, the more susceptible we're going to be to future change | 19:06 |
@Haarg | especially for undocumented methods | 19:07 |
+perlDreamer | that's just a typo, I'll track down their repo and submit a doc patch | 19:08 |
@Haarg | typo? | 19:08 |
+perlDreamer | in the docs, it says to call Moose::Meta::Class->interp.... | 19:09 |
+perlDreamer | it should be Moose::Meta::Attribute->interp | 19:09 |
@Haarg | Moose::Meta::Attribute->interpolate_class is undocumented though | 19:09 |
+perlDreamer | right, the only one that's documented is interpolate_class_and_new | 19:10 |
* perlDreamer goes to the gym | 19:13 |
@Haarg | unfortunately, interpolate_class is the one we want | 19:20 |
@Haarg | perlDreamer, completely untested but i was thinking something like this http://gist.github.com/329395 | 19:32 |
+perlDreamer | it looks exactly right, codewise | 20:17 |
+perlDreamer | I'll see what the tests say | 20:17 |
+perlDreamer | maybe a quick pop into #moose to ask about that method? | 20:17 |
+perlDreamer | 'cuz I'd be happy to make them a doc patch for it | 20:17 |
Getty | whats the problem? | 20:18 |
+perlDreamer | and to find out if it's going to be, expected to be deprecated | 20:18 |
+perlDreamer | this method: Moose::Meta::Attribute->interpolate_class | 20:18 |
+perlDreamer | is not documented in the POD | 20:18 |
+perlDreamer | from previous, painful experience, that means it might not be wise to use it, Getty | 20:18 |
Getty | there are many not documented in the POD cause they are used internal or shouldnt be used by users who have no idea | 20:18 |
Getty | yeah | 20:18 |
Getty | those functions are 99% sure to be changed or dropped | 20:18 |
Getty | i even think that i know of interpolate_class that its not the right way | 20:19 |
@Haarg | not the right way for what? | 20:24 |
@Haarg | perlDreamer, i think i have my WebGUI::Paths branch working properly. the only things that still refer to the WebGUI lib directory are the POD/Perl::Critic tests. api breaks on WebGUI::Session->open and WebGUI::Config->new. | 20:28 |
+perlDreamer | those are low usage API methods, and we're in 8 anyway | 20:28 |
@Haarg | yeah | 20:28 |
+perlDreamer | Haarg, does changing ownership of a file leave a timestamp somewhere I can check? | 20:29 |
+perlDreamer | in the filesystem? | 20:29 |
@Haarg | don't believe so | 20:29 |
@Haarg | why? | 20:29 |
+perlDreamer | Getty, why is interpolate_class the wrong way to do it? | 20:42 |
Getty | its just somehting that pops into my mind if i remember | 20:42 |
Getty | i must check into it what it does again, then i probably remember my case | 20:42 |
Getty | but i did some deeper stuff in moose and that is function-ape-jungle-hopping ;) | 20:43 |
+perlDreamer | I think I'll do some googling, then ask in #moose real quick | 21:07 |
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+perlDreamer | hey, tavisto! | 21:17 |
@tavisto | hey brotah | 21:17 |
@tavisto | er brotha | 21:17 |
@tavisto | how's life? | 21:18 |
+perlDreamer | very busy | 21:18 |
+perlDreamer | kids, jobs, wife | 21:19 |
+perlDreamer | cooking, cleaning, laundry | 21:19 |
+perlDreamer | remodeling, electrical work, appliance installs | 21:19 |
@Haarg | hey tavisto, did you see that steam + valve's games are coming to mac? | 21:22 |
@Haarg | no more rebooting needed for tf2 | 21:23 |
@tavisto | yeah, been busy here too. Craziness. hehe I've been working on my house a lot as well. | 21:23 |
@tavisto | Just finished my taxes so that's a good thing to check off my list. And no I hadn't heard about steam coming to mac.. That rocks!!! | 21:24 |
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@tavisto | Haarg, you enjoying your MBP upgrade? I like this sooo much better. | 21:32 |
@Haarg | it is quite nice, yeah | 21:32 |
@tavisto | really nice when I have to jump into windows on VMware | 21:33 |
@tavisto | Does anyone know why my ^AdSpace(); macro would just print out on a style template rather than showing an ad? | 21:33 |
@tavisto | I'm sitting here thinking... there's nothing to it.... or am I just having a brain fart | 21:34 |
@Haarg | not sure. where is this? | 21:34 |
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+perlDreamer | the Ad in the AdSpace could have a problem | 21:35 |
@Haarg | i hope they make 85W power adapters with the new connector at some point http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC461LL/A?fnode=MTY1NDEwMQ&mco=MTMzODAwMDI | 21:35 |
@Haarg | would be much more convenient than the current ones | 21:35 |
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@tavisto | Haarg, perlDreamer it's on the TGC Forums (bugs) | 21:39 |
@tavisto | instead of rendering the ad, it just prints out the macro on the page | 21:39 |
@tavisto | I'm 99% sure that macro is enabled by default | 21:39 |
+perlDreamer | we can check that | 21:40 |
+perlDreamer | nope, it's not | 21:41 |
+perlDreamer | you want it added, tavisto? | 21:41 |
@tavisto | oh crap then that's why | 21:42 |
@tavisto | could you enable that on TGC | 21:42 |
+perlDreamer | sure | 21:42 |
@tavisto | thanks, I'm sitting here wondering what the heck is going on | 21:42 |
+perlDreamer | okay, please give her a retry | 21:43 |
+perlDreamer | oh yeah | 21:45 |
@tavisto | booyah grandma | 21:46 |
+perlDreamer | normally we don't do support for clients over IRC, but we always make an exception for you, tavisto | 21:48 |
@tavisto | gee thanks | 21:53 |
@tavisto | I have a special support package | 21:53 |
+perlDreamer | It's the Brazilian BBQ+ package | 21:54 |
+perlDreamer | speaking of which, it is definitely time for lunch | 22:04 |
+perlDreamer | bbiaw | 22:04 |
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+perlDreamer | Haarg, that returns a meta class of the class Moose::Meta::Attribute | 23:21 |
+perlDreamer | and technically, it only returns a class name | 23:22 |
+perlDreamer | and now Definition.t passes: http://gist.github.com/329691 | 23:38 |
+perlDreamer | I'll try the others next | 23:38 |
+perlDreamer | all right! | 23:44 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rf4467cb / lib/WebGUI/Definition/Meta/Class.pm : Attempt #1 to pass traits through property. - http://bit.ly/91yb6D | 23:44 |
+perlDreamer | we have traits | 23:44 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r570eea7 / t/Definition.t : Add test for passing through traits. - http://bit.ly/atojzC | 23:44 |
+perlDreamer | now I just have to write some | 23:44 |
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CIA-58 | WebGUI: translation * r12452 /translations/ (201 files in 3 dirs): Updating Czech on translation server | 10:58 |
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SynQhome | bah | 14:33 |
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SDuensin | Morning. | 16:17 |
+bartjol | hey scott, learned dutch already? | 16:20 |
SDuensin | Voorjen! | 16:23 |
SDuensin | That close? | 16:23 |
+bartjol | voorjen? what kind of dialect is that? | 16:25 |
SDuensin | It had double vowels and a J in a strange place. Looked Dutch to me. :-P | 16:26 |
+bartjol | it looks like it, but does not sound like it, so it is not a duck | 16:29 |
SDuensin | Then it's not a witch. | 16:30 |
SDuensin | Oh! Amazing! I get IE7 on March 15th! | 16:31 |
* SDuensin can't stand stupid corporate America. | 16:31 |
+bartjol | eeeh, where are you located? | 16:31 |
* bartjol means : where in time | 16:31 |
+bartjol | and they're not going for the full ie8 in one go? | 16:32 |
SDuensin | In time? 2010. :-P | 16:32 |
SDuensin | Government contractor dude. I'm surprised I get 7. | 16:32 |
SDuensin | (Although I already have 8 and Chrome on my machine.) | 16:32 |
+bartjol | it is an improvement, and soon I will get the browser choice screen microsoft update | 16:33 |
+bartjol | european regulations++ | 16:33 |
SDuensin | hehe | 16:33 |
+bartjol | mmm, 500 karma left to spend from my pile of karma | 16:38 |
+bartjol | and, I spend it all | 16:40 |
SDuensin | Got an odd question... Ever lock down WebGUI pages based on the browser's user-agent? | 16:40 |
+bartjol | well, I wanted to one time, but I never came around to do so | 16:40 |
+bartjol | actually, when using ie, i wanted to show a solitair jumping cards video and a text: use another browser, or go play games | 16:41 |
SDuensin | I'm building a rather interesting service and wanted to use WebGUI to provide a lot of the generic functions (user management, billing, forums, etc) but I don't want them being accessed outside my custom client. | 16:42 |
SDuensin | Hehe | 16:42 |
+bartjol | mmm, that does a bit like monopolising | 16:42 |
SDuensin | I used to embed a script in all my sites that helped people get away from IE6 if they were using it. Then the bastards at Microsoft bought the domain that was doing the anti-IE6 campaign and took the script down! | 16:43 |
+bartjol | what, even microsoft wants people to upgrade, stupid mrrpprgfffpowhfp | 16:43 |
SDuensin | Well, I'm not going to lock down the entire site. Just the pages that require my browser to properly render. | 16:44 |
+bartjol | and when they use the wrong browser they got redirected to a site that says, please use <my browser> for viewing this page | 16:46 |
+bartjol | ? | 16:46 |
SDuensin | No, just back to the home page of the site. | 16:46 |
+bartjol | well, that are details | 16:46 |
SDuensin | Only way they'd ever even be able to try and access one of those custom browser pages with a different browser is if they're poking around and doing things they shouldn't be doing. :-) | 16:47 |
+bartjol | eeeh, I am think of a contenthandler that sets scratch variable, and when it exists on the page there is a macro that redirects you | 16:48 |
+bartjol | but that may be to late | 16:48 |
+bartjol | you'l get a blink of the scrteen | 16:48 |
SDuensin | What about even before WebGUI gets it? Make Apache do the filtering? | 16:49 |
+bartjol | off course, but I was thinking more generically | 16:49 |
SDuensin | Generic is good. :-) | 16:50 |
+bartjol | because, you'll have to set each url | 16:50 |
+bartjol | my way, you can make a template: | 16:50 |
+bartjol | <tmpl_if my_scratch>then redirect<tmpl_else>all my cool html</tmpl_if> | 16:50 |
+bartjol | but | 16:51 |
SDuensin | Interesting. | 16:51 |
+bartjol | problem | 16:51 |
+bartjol | you only want to do that once per session | 16:51 |
+bartjol | so | 16:51 |
+bartjol | only at first access | 16:52 |
SDuensin | Where would "my_scratch" come from? | 16:52 |
+bartjol | the first request in of the session must call the method to set it | 16:53 |
+bartjol | which requests meddling in the session code | 16:54 |
+bartjol | eq "undesirable" | 16:54 |
SDuensin | Yea. That'd be bad. | 16:54 |
+bartjol | don\'t fiddle with session or die; | 16:55 |
+bartjol | well | 16:55 |
SDuensin | I'd rather tweak Apache than WebGUI code. | 16:56 |
+bartjol | yeah | 16:56 |
+bartjol | thinking of a contenthandler that always is called, but does nothing if sessioncookie exists | 16:56 |
+bartjol | that already sounds better\ | 16:56 |
SDuensin | For the most part, I can just "hide" the URLs. However, I know some goober out there is going to snoop them with a proxy of some kind and go poking around. | 16:57 |
+bartjol | but you'll have to set each apache request to use that handler, and also be able to caal other handlers | 16:57 |
+bartjol | arg | 16:57 |
+bartjol | people like me | 16:58 |
SDuensin | What about just using rewrite to bounce requests targeted for a specific sub-folder of the site? | 16:58 |
+bartjol | in apache? | 16:58 |
SDuensin | Yea | 16:58 |
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SDuensin | Hey perlDreamer | 16:59 |
+perlDreamer | morning, SDuensin | 16:59 |
+bartjol | well, during thinking of other solutions, this is starting to sound better and better | 16:59 |
+perlDreamer | what's up? | 16:59 |
SDuensin | bartjol - hehe | 16:59 |
+bartjol | SD wants to lock out ie6 users | 16:59 |
SDuensin | perlDreamer - Trying to make WebGUI do things it's not intended to do. :-) | 16:59 |
+perlDreamer | et tu, SD? | 16:59 |
SDuensin | Actually, I want to lock out *ALL* standard browser users. | 16:59 |
+perlDreamer | why? | 17:00 |
SDuensin | You're in the USA, right? Ever hear of "Steam"? | 17:00 |
+perlDreamer | Yeah, some game company, right? | 17:00 |
SDuensin | Well, Valve is the company. Steam is their client. But yea... | 17:01 |
SDuensin | Basically, half their client is delivered as HTML. Makes it very easy for them to update content... | 17:01 |
SDuensin | I'm doing the same thing and don't want non-client users poking around on the special pages intended to be rendered inside the client software. | 17:01 |
+perlDreamer | should be very easy to do | 17:03 |
+perlDreamer | add browser rejection via a URL Handler | 17:03 |
SDuensin | So enlighten us, oh master. :-P | 17:03 |
* perlDreamer will ponder briefly | 17:03 |
+perlDreamer | it was a very long night last night for support calls | 17:03 |
SDuensin | NP | 17:04 |
SDuensin | No rush. Domain isn't even online yet. | 17:04 |
SDuensin | This is a brand-spankin' new project. | 17:04 |
+perlDreamer | I think the best way to do this is actually via Apache | 17:10 |
+perlDreamer | where you put rules in the vhost section that requires a certain client to access the site | 17:11 |
SDuensin | That's what I was thinking. Just wanted more opinions. | 17:11 |
SDuensin | And it's not even the entire site - just a branch of it. | 17:11 |
+bartjol | oh, I thought it were some random pages throuhout | 17:16 |
+bartjol | a branche makes it better | 17:16 |
SDuensin | Nope. I can contain them into one area. | 17:16 |
* bartjol is getting very good at thinking of too complicated solutions | 17:17 |
SDuensin | Hehe | 17:17 |
SDuensin | You might be perfect for this project! | 17:17 |
+bartjol | well, you can hire me probably | 17:17 |
SDuensin | Sure. I pay $0 a day. | 17:17 |
+bartjol | ah, Koen will not agree with that | 17:18 |
+bartjol | how much by the hour? | 17:18 |
+perlDreamer | $0/8 | 17:18 |
SDuensin | :-) | 17:18 |
+bartjol | that would be a very nice cooperation, I think of too complicated solutions all day, and you'll do it with the easy one in 5 minutes | 17:19 |
+perlDreamer | are you going to submit a WUC talk, bartjol? | 17:29 |
+bartjol | well | 17:30 |
+bartjol | I'd like to, but | 17:30 |
+bartjol | not sure whether I can come yet | 17:31 |
+bartjol | I'd actually thought of webgui cluster building | 17:31 |
+bartjol | which might be a bit too easy maybe | 17:31 |
+bartjol | and to linux focussed | 17:31 |
SDuensin | Bah. Who cares about Windows hippies. :-) | 17:32 |
+bartjol | or apples | 17:32 |
+perlDreamer | I wouldn't worry about linux focus, few people run WebGUI on windows anymore | 17:32 |
+bartjol | yeah | 17:32 |
+bartjol | well | 17:32 |
+bartjol | first see whether I can come | 17:32 |
+bartjol | some organisational limits I'm bumping into | 17:33 |
+perlDreamer | I think someone spammed the Czech translation on the server | 17:39 |
+bartjol | may very well be | 17:40 |
+perlDreamer | try translating the notes.txt file | 17:41 |
+bartjol | mmm, what is submitted looks quite normal to me | 17:43 |
+bartjol | are it not just the files being added? | 17:44 |
+perlDreamer | no, some of the files have actually been translated, and they're okay | 17:45 |
+perlDreamer | brb, have to take kids to school | 17:45 |
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+perlDreamer | back | 17:55 |
SDuensin | Me too. :-) | 17:55 |
* SDuensin lost his tether. Thanks, AT&T. | 17:55 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r953df35 / lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/GalleryAlbum.pm : Remove duplicate accessor method. - | 18:07 |
* bartjol knows that html is not css and has done his best to brak the news in a subtle manner | 18:07 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r3ea797b / (7 files in 2 dirs): Wobject tests, through letter M. - http://bit.ly/bLH3MC | 18:07 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol: who is the recipient of the bad news? | 18:08 |
+bartjol | a very well appreciated colleague of mr patspam | 18:10 |
+bartjol | well everybody's got his own comfort zone | 18:11 |
+perlDreamer | I need some bash command line help | 18:14 |
+perlDreamer | I want to do this: | 18:14 |
+perlDreamer | for file in (`ls /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject`) do; cp template $file; done | 18:14 |
SDuensin | So do it. :-) | 18:15 |
SDuensin | May want to toss a "-1" (dash one) behind the ls. | 18:15 |
+perlDreamer | -1 ? | 18:15 |
+bartjol | small L> | 18:15 |
+perlDreamer | whenever I've piped ls into anything, it's always done that for | 18:17 |
+perlDreamer | me | 18:17 |
SDuensin | "dash one" just gives a list of filenames, no other output. | 18:19 |
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+perlDreamer | time to take some time to read Ovid's complete Test::Class tutorial | 18:23 |
+perlDreamer | because there must be an easier way than listing each test class in the run script | 18:23 |
+bartjol | mmm, custom workflow giving errors | 18:32 |
+bartjol | debug code can be removed after debugging | 18:34 |
+perlDreamer | or use $session->log->debug('debug comment'); | 18:35 |
+perlDreamer | then you can leave it in, and enable it via log.conf | 18:36 |
+bartjol | well, i just made a comment to see whther it run at all | 18:36 |
+bartjol | it does apparently | 18:36 |
+bartjol | just a bit lazy | 18:37 |
+bartjol | ok, now for Unable to load WebGUI::i18n::English::Dutch | 18:38 |
+MrHairgrease | The correct class name for that module would be WebGUI::i18n::Denglish | 18:39 |
+perlDreamer | You sure it isn't WebGUI::i18n::Engutch? | 18:40 |
+MrHairgrease | No, we call the Anglified Dutch Denglish in the NL | 18:40 |
+MrHairgrease | Just like we have Chinglish for Chinese-English | 18:41 |
+bartjol | I'm not doing that translation as well | 18:41 |
+MrHairgrease | holy crap | 18:41 |
+MrHairgrease | both perldreamer and patspam commenting on blogs.perl.com! | 18:41 |
+perlDreamer | huh? | 18:41 |
+perlDreamer | who, me? | 18:41 |
+MrHairgrease | yeah you | 18:42 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * re0e71a5 / t/run_asset.t : Add Navigation, Poll, ProjectManager to run script. - http://bit.ly/9PQGEz | 18:42 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r8209de7 / (23 files in 4 dirs): Add tests for most other wobjects. Block broken code in Role/Asset/Comments. Refactor run_asset.t - http://bit.ly/cV7l7P | 18:42 |
+MrHairgrease | on the 100% test coverage thread | 18:42 |
+perlDreamer | yeah, 100% test coverage is misleading | 18:42 |
+perlDreamer | I wrote 2000 tests in the last 3 days | 18:42 |
+MrHairgrease | wow | 18:42 |
+MrHairgrease | you have been busy... | 18:42 |
+perlDreamer | I cheated | 18:42 |
+perlDreamer | I used Test::Class | 18:42 |
+bartjol | mmm i tried loading dutch twice | 18:44 |
+MrHairgrease | double ducth | 18:44 |
+bartjol | it sure is | 18:44 |
+perlDreamer | where is patspam's comment on blogs.perl.org? | 18:45 |
+MrHairgrease | http://blogs.perl.org/users/sawyer_x/2010/03/measuring-the-progress-of-ui.html#comments | 18:45 |
+MrHairgrease | last comments | 18:45 |
+MrHairgrease | s/s// | 18:45 |
+bartjol | so long, it's beer o clock | 18:49 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r2997471 / (3 files in 3 dirs): fix assetName calls for Asset and Wobject. - http://bit.ly/auNa6s | 18:55 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rf56523c / lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/Asset_Wobject.pm : add lastUpdated stamp for mobile style labels. - http://bit.ly/9Tewlr | 18:56 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * rc57e40e / lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/Asset_Wobject.pm : add lastUpdated stamp for mobile style labels. - http://bit.ly/b97AIA | 18:56 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r85121c5 / (98 files in 8 dirs): Move Test::Asset* to Test::WebGUI::Asset* - http://bit.ly/bkHoqU | 19:01 |
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elnino | good evening! | 06:49 |
elnino | I'm trying to implement this: http://javascript.internet.com/miscellaneous/browser-correct-download-instructions.html | 06:49 |
elnino | but instead of getting the strings that I'm supposed to be getitng, I get: /*<![CDATA[*//*]]>*/ as the output | 06:49 |
elnino | I created a snippet to create the download.js, cache 1 second | 06:50 |
elnino | type javascript/text | 06:50 |
elnino | and put the script in the head | 06:50 |
elnino | and then copied the call to the function in another snippet, cache 1 sec. | 06:50 |
elnino | I've done things like this before, but getting CDATA is throwin gme for a loop. | 06:50 |
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CIA-58 | WebGUI: translation * r12453 /translations/German/German/Asset_Survey.pm: Updating German on translation server | 16:55 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Patrick Donelan psgi * rad176a9 / (4 files in 3 dirs): Ready to start thinking about IO bound delayed response - | 18:32 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rf7589e6 / (48 files in 5 dirs): Refactoring to remove putting className into each test class. WIP. - http://bit.ly/9E5vxG | 06:06 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r20507ee / (47 files in 5 dirs): Calculate class to load. Remove class method from each test file. Fix typos. - http://bit.ly/bGVefh | 06:06 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r790ccbe / t/run_asset.t : Fix script to work and load the utility test module. - http://bit.ly/cxDw0I | 06:06 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r41fffba / (46 files in 4 dirs): Remove FindBin from test class sub-modules. - http://bit.ly/ayCAOm | 06:06 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rd4eae41 / t/tests/Test/WebGUI/Asset/File/GalleryFile/Photo.pm : Add a test for Photo - http://bit.ly/c2HWxl | 06:23 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * r3a2f94f / (4 files): Test for some Sku's. - http://bit.ly/9JevaZ | 06:27 |
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CIA-58 | wgdev: Graham Knop master * r38fba2d / (34 files in 11 dirs): update copyright year - http://bit.ly/bBJ2t6 | 15:49 |
CIA-58 | wgdev: Graham Knop master * r8dfd618 / lib/WGDev/Command/For/Each.pm : add for-each command - http://bit.ly/8Z4RJ6 | 15:49 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie WebGUI8 * rae31597 / t/tests/My/Test/Class.pm : Forgot the custom test subclass. - http://bit.ly/9PXPOr | 18:04 |
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+patspam | preaction: ping | 00:27 |
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@preaction | patspam: sup | 03:07 |
+patspam | I am knee-deep in psgi | 03:07 |
+patspam | about halfway through ripping out apache and re-psgi-ifying webgui8 | 03:07 |
@preaction | yay | 03:08 |
+patspam | the really juicy question is what to do about streaming | 03:08 |
@preaction | okay, what's the problem and what are our options? | 03:09 |
+patspam | I'm tempted to steal the Tatsumaki approach, which supports both blocking streaming and asynchronous streaming, with a unified API | 03:09 |
+patspam | but I'm trying to be conservative | 03:10 |
@preaction | so the problem is our "ability" to stream files through WebGUI | 03:10 |
+patspam | just content at this stage, not files | 03:10 |
+patspam | e.g. ProgressBar | 03:10 |
@preaction | ahhh | 03:11 |
+patspam | e.g. for (1..10) { $session->output->print($_); sleep 1 } | 03:11 |
@preaction | well, that's a solution to a different problem. if there's another solution we can implement it will be fine | 03:11 |
+patspam | yeah true | 03:12 |
@preaction | i hate to go this way, but would tying ourselves to POE be a bad thing? | 03:14 |
@preaction | actually, JT might have some insight | 03:15 |
@preaction | he mentioned dealing with the async/blocking problem when developing SimpleDB::Class | 03:15 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Patrick Donelan psgi * rb63d1eb / (6 files in 6 dirs): mid-way commit - http://bit.ly/aywoIR | 04:10 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Patrick Donelan psgi * r76d8ecf / (8 files in 7 dirs): Demo site loads - http://bit.ly/c0BVvB | 04:10 |
+patspam | preaction: I think using AnyEvent is the preferred approach | 04:10 |
+patspam | anyway, enough for today, talk more tomorrow | 04:10 |
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SDuensin | Greetings. | 15:19 |
+bartjol | might it oh, hi scott | 15:29 |
+bartjol | mmm, SDuensin, I submitted an rfe, but I'm wondering whether I wouldn't call it a bug | 15:37 |
+bartjol | mm, better ask colin later, he has the power to move that stuff | 15:38 |
SDuensin | I like bugs. Bugs get fixed. RFEs get whined over. :-) | 15:39 |
+bartjol | well, missing POD might be considered a bug | 15:46 |
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+bartjol | morning colin | 16:21 |
+bartjol | I was wondering whether my rfe might be considered a bug: http://www.webgui.org/rfe/request-for-enhancement/11474 | 16:21 |
+perlDreamer | definitely | 16:22 |
+perlDreamer | let's fix it now | 16:22 |
+perlDreamer | upload the docs you want, and we'll include it in the next WRE release | 16:22 |
+bartjol | ah | 16:23 |
+perlDreamer | this last batch of remodeling went very well | 16:23 |
+bartjol | cool | 16:23 |
+bartjol | pictures? | 16:23 |
+perlDreamer | forthcoming | 16:23 |
+bartjol | well, I've read the code a bit, but I'm not sure yet what the input should be exactly | 16:24 |
+bartjol | A line which says: | 16:25 |
+bartjol | # Put your dir names that should not be included in the backup below. Just the dir name and 1 per line. | 16:25 |
+bartjol | I'm not sure whether the path can be included | 16:25 |
+bartjol | reading wre:file.pm now | 16:28 |
+bartjol | ah | 16:29 |
+bartjol | I see, it uses the tar --exclude-from option | 16:30 |
+bartjol | so patterns are excluded | 16:30 |
+bartjol | something like: # Put in patterns, one per line, that should not be included in the backup. These options are passed into the --exclude-from option from tar. Therefore a complete path is not needed. | 16:35 |
+perlDreamer | will it exclude lines with comments in there, or do they need to be stripped out? | 16:37 |
+bartjol | yeah, I was wondering that | 16:37 |
+perlDreamer | maybe we should put it into the POD for backup.pl, if there is any? | 16:38 |
+bartjol | well, backup.pl --help doesn't do anything, I'll have a look | 16:38 |
+bartjol | hmpg: :~$ perldoc /data/wre/sbin/backup.pl | 16:39 |
+bartjol | No documentation found for "/data/wre/sbin/backup.pl". | 16:39 |
+perlDreamer | since it's in the WRE, we should assign it to SynQhome | 16:40 |
+bartjol | added a note with the proposed comment (slightly altered) | 16:41 |
+bartjol | he isn't at home | 16:41 |
+bartjol | I changed the wiki on the site | 16:41 |
+perlDreamer | if you have a bit, can you try to duplicate this bug: http://www.webgui.org/use/bugs/tracker/11473 | 16:42 |
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+perlDreamer | I don't know how he's doing it, but I'm not able to hit it in 7.9 | 16:42 |
+bartjol | sure | 16:42 |
+bartjol | mmm, at first I cannot reproduce it either | 16:46 |
+perlDreamer | martien's bug hit rate is about 60% (subjectively), and he runs custom code in the core | 16:46 |
+bartjol | aaah wait | 16:46 |
+perlDreamer | going to have to discount this one, probably, or ask him how he does that | 16:46 |
+bartjol | I have seen that | 16:46 |
+perlDreamer | brb, have to take kids to school | 16:46 |
+bartjol | mmm, I believe it is the isDefault field in the template table | 16:57 |
+bartjol | which is 0 in the duplicated template | 16:57 |
+bartjol | but I have seen this behaviour | 16:57 |
+perlDreamer | I remember a bug about it, but it was a long time ago | 17:01 |
+perlDreamer | not in recent code | 17:01 |
+bartjol | mmm, I believe I mainly ignored those messages | 17:10 |
+bartjol | martien posted something | 17:10 |
+bartjol | ah, well, I must wait till 7.9.1 | 17:11 |
+perlDreamer | it's a duplicate of an earlier bug, #11459 | 17:15 |
+perlDreamer | the upgrade to 7.9.0 marked every template as duplicate by accident | 17:16 |
+perlDreamer | which was the opposite of the upgrade to 7.8.0, which marked no new templates added by WebGUI as duplicates. | 17:16 |
+bartjol | ah | 17:17 |
+perlDreamer | and I think I've fixed both problems from here on out | 17:18 |
+bartjol | duplicate? not default? | 17:19 |
+bartjol | why should a template been marked as duplicate anyway, from the duplication on, it is just an asset | 17:21 |
+perlDreamer | sorry, not as duplicates, but as default | 17:21 |
+bartjol | you're just trying to confuse me | 17:23 |
* perlDreamer is sleep deprived due to daylight savings changes | 17:25 |
+bartjol | was that this weekend? | 17:29 |
SDuensin | yup | 17:30 |
+perlDreamer | ugh, yes | 17:30 |
SDuensin | I say we all boycott when they try and change back. | 17:31 |
+perlDreamer | yeah, why go back to daylight wasting time? | 17:31 |
SDuensin | I have no idea dude. Government decision. | 17:31 |
+bartjol | we first have to get rid of timezones | 17:34 |
+bartjol | daylight saving only starts at the 28th of march | 17:40 |
+perlDreamer | President Bush extended it, so that it starts earlier and goes later in the year for us | 17:42 |
+bartjol | what a genius mind | 17:43 |
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SDuensin | I'm rocketing into the future today! I get XP Service Pack 3! | 17:50 |
+perlDreamer | watch out for whiplash, SDuensin | 18:05 |
SDuensin | IE7, here I come! | 18:06 |
+bartjol | you employer doesn't really care about safety, does he SDuensin? | 18:09 |
SDuensin | My employer is a contractor to the government. Stupid is as stupid does. | 18:10 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, bunch of calendar i18n coming your way tomorrow | 18:42 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rce08b3d / lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/Asset_Wobject.pm : Fix a syntax error in the wobject i18n file. - http://bit.ly/aTh6C5 | 18:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rc4b3e1e / (3 files in 3 dirs): Add the calendar month template variables. Fixes bug #11472. - http://bit.ly/cIk03W | 18:43 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * re4299c6 / (3 files in 3 dirs): Add the calendar month template variables. Fixes bug #11472. - http://bit.ly/dmIoF8 | 18:44 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r1637840 / lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/Asset_Wobject.pm : Fix a syntax error in the wobject i18n file. - http://bit.ly/9o7D0N | 18:44 |
+bartjol | ah | 18:46 |
+bartjol | np | 18:46 |
+perlDreamer | 8-12 new entries, and 4 edits | 18:46 |
+bartjol | there goes my morning | 18:48 |
+bartjol | at least, half an hour of it | 18:48 |
+bartjol | maybe | 18:48 |
+perlDreamer | I can make some tweaks to the transalation CGI if you want it to take more time | 18:49 |
+bartjol | no thanks | 18:51 |
+perlDreamer | as you wish | 18:51 |
+bartjol | I finally spend all ning's karma | 18:51 |
+bartjol | and, does backup.pl already has POD? | 18:52 |
+perlDreamer | no | 18:52 |
+bartjol | why not? | 18:53 |
+bartjol | and now? | 18:54 |
+perlDreamer | because you haven't written it yet? | 18:54 |
+perlDreamer | :) | 18:54 |
+bartjol | ah | 18:54 |
+bartjol | well, there I go | 18:54 |
+perlDreamer | that's why we should file a bug and assign it to SynQ | 18:54 |
+bartjol | I can do that at home tonight | 18:54 |
+perlDreamer | do you have commit access to that repo? | 18:56 |
+bartjol | of copurse not | 18:57 |
+bartjol | but I can make it, and give it to someone who does | 18:57 |
+bartjol | I don have any commit access | 18:57 |
+perlDreamer | post it as a bug, or drop me an email and it will be added | 18:59 |
+bartjol | can you move rfe? to bug status, and assign it to me | 19:00 |
+bartjol | ? | 19:00 |
+bartjol | that link I pasted | 19:00 |
+perlDreamer | yes | 19:02 |
+bartjol | excellent | 19:03 |
+bartjol | well, I suppose it? feeding time | 19:06 |
+bartjol | I must change my keyboard settings... | 19:06 |
+bartjol | pod writing tonight | 19:08 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r4fa04a2 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Fix CSS and HTML errors in the Event Edit template. Fixes bug #11471. - http://bit.ly/dw2WMV | 19:25 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r5869cfe / docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt : Proper bug annotation. - http://bit.ly/dxCJAN | 19:26 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r5efa9bc / (2 files in 2 dirs): Fix CSS and HTML errors in the Event Edit template. Fixes bug #11471. - http://bit.ly/bnuK6B | 19:27 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * rea3d7e0 / docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt : Proper bug annotation. - http://bit.ly/aGEf0o | 19:27 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r5463f96 / (2 files in 2 dirs): Move the package to the right directory - http://bit.ly/dddnGK | 19:27 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r0a00583 / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/AssetPackage.pm): Force inheritPermissionsFromParent to work in all import scenarios. Also, fix handling of clearPackageFlag and setDefaultTemplate. - http://bit.ly/aSiDVR | 20:22 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * rb526340 / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/AssetPackage.pm): Force inheritPermissionsFromParent to work in all import scenarios. Also, fix handling of clearPackageFlag and setDefaultTemplate. - http://bit.ly/bDzpR7 | 20:22 |
+perlDreamer | deleting a remote tag is surprisingly difficult | 20:41 |
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@Haarg | really? | 21:04 |
@Haarg | can't you just git push origin :tag-name ? | 21:05 |
+perlDreamer | nope | 21:10 |
+perlDreamer | oh, wait | 21:10 |
+perlDreamer | I didn't try with a colon | 21:10 |
+perlDreamer | I had to do this: git push origin :refs/tags/v7.8.13 | 21:10 |
+perlDreamer | but I didn't try git push origin :v7.8.13 | 21:11 |
+perlDreamer | bopbop: why do you think there should be a red X next to the attachment in a post? | 21:12 |
@bopbop | because otherwise I have to save the post in order to get it to delete | 21:13 |
@bopbop | so it gets emailed out again | 21:13 |
@bopbop | then I have to edit, reattach, and save again | 21:13 |
+perlDreamer | the X used to be there? | 21:13 |
@bopbop | so it gets emailed out yet again | 21:13 |
@bopbop | I believe so | 21:13 |
@bopbop | before, you confirmed you wanted to delete the attachment then clicked the red X | 21:13 |
@bopbop | the attachment went away and the browse field returned | 21:14 |
@bopbop | all in the same screen... no saving | 21:14 |
+perlDreamer | I'll start checking old versions and see what happened | 21:14 |
@bopbop | check in 7.5ish | 21:14 |
+perlDreamer | okay, it's not in 7.6 for sure | 21:15 |
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+perlDreamer | No X in 7.5.40 | 21:17 |
+perlDreamer | but there is an X next to an article | 21:18 |
+perlDreamer | article attachment | 21:18 |
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+perlDreamer | hm, but there's a note about it being removed | 21:20 |
+perlDreamer | from the Post | 21:20 |
+perlDreamer | apparently I pulled it out because it bypasses revision control | 21:21 |
+perlDreamer | but that's the rub | 21:21 |
+perlDreamer | if it starts obeying revision control again, then it will send out notices when the attachments are updated | 21:21 |
+perlDreamer | bopbop: this is the bug in question: http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/9260 | 21:22 |
@bopbop | well, I think it was a mistake | 21:23 |
@bopbop | I don't think it needs to be deleted from the uploads directory | 21:23 |
@bopbop | just the cs post | 21:23 |
+perlDreamer | the cs post stores its attachments in the uploads directory | 21:24 |
+perlDreamer | all attachments go in there | 21:24 |
@bopbop | well, I can go ahead and do it how it has to be done now, I just don't appreciate the backlash from the users who are going to email me with "stop spamming my email" replies | 21:24 |
@bopbop | after they get the email three times so I can change the image | 21:24 |
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+perlDreamer | try changing the commit workflow to commit with approval | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | that may not send out the notification until it's approved | 21:25 |
+perlDreamer | and would let you edit it several times | 21:25 |
@bopbop | alright... I understand why this particular person wanted it changed, but I think the "fix" had larger implications for other users | 21:26 |
+perlDreamer | We can always ask Doug to look at the larger situation and decide if we should change it. | 21:29 |
* perlDreamer goes for a run | 21:30 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * r16a2e4e / www/extras/wobject/Survey/editsurvey.js : Fix some more surve JS i18n. - http://bit.ly/9Y815T | 23:21 |
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CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r6e5a437 / www/extras/wobject/Survey/editsurvey.js : Fix some more surve JS i18n. - http://bit.ly/bRXmyf | 23:31 |
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Edlik | can anyone recommend a free hosting service for webGUI or does anyone know if 000webhost.com can host it? I havent been able to find out what os they use. | 14:23 |
+bartjol | ah | 14:25 |
+bartjol | well, there aren't many free webgui hosters I'm afraid | 14:25 |
+bartjol | I don't know about 000webhost.com | 14:25 |
+bartjol | root access isn't mentioned | 14:26 |
+bartjol | So Edlik, I'm afraid you'll have to look somewhere else | 14:28 |
+bartjol | you at least will have to go for the 5$/month, ssh access is included | 14:34 |
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SDuensin | Morning. | 15:31 |
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+bartjol | hey scott | 15:49 |
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+perlDreamer | good morning, good WebGUI folks | 17:15 |
+bartjol | hi | 17:22 |
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+bartjol | perlDreamer: I'd like somefeedback on the implementation of the documentation I made | 17:39 |
+perlDreamer | did you want informed feedback, or do you want me to wing it? | 17:40 |
+bartjol | eeeh, the first sounds better, but "wing it" is unfamiliar to me | 17:40 |
+bartjol | if it means "take over from you" that's ok ofcourse :P | 17:41 |
+bartjol | no, I'll finish the stuff | 17:41 |
+perlDreamer | wing it == shoot from the hip == improvise | 17:41 |
+perlDreamer | for the wre.conf examples, this is what I would do | 17:42 |
+perlDreamer | I would describe each option stand alone, which no hash syntax | 17:42 |
+bartjol | I, I improvised | 17:42 |
+bartjol | ah | 17:42 |
+perlDreamer | then I would show a sample pieice of wre.conf in the correct format | 17:42 |
+bartjol | so a bit like I did, but without the out-of-place hash syntax | 17:43 |
+bartjol | and an examle | 17:43 |
+bartjol | well, it is better than it was | 17:43 |
+perlDreamer | totally | 17:44 |
+perlDreamer | just having the POD is 80% of the solution | 17:44 |
+perlDreamer | in fact, I can take what you wrote and do the tweaking that I'm suggesting | 17:45 |
+perlDreamer | sound okay? | 17:45 |
+bartjol | oh, well | 17:47 |
+bartjol | depends whether you're looking for work or not | 17:47 |
+bartjol | maybe for just one | 17:48 |
+bartjol | so we have a nice cooperated example | 17:48 |
+bartjol | and I can alter the rest of the scripts in wre/sbin | 17:48 |
+bartjol | from POD view those are crap | 17:48 |
+perlDreamer | okay, I'll do the backup one and commit it | 17:49 |
+bartjol | great | 17:49 |
+bartjol | I won't have the time for it till thursday | 17:50 |
+perlDreamer | okay | 17:54 |
+bartjol | but it is missing for years | 17:54 |
+bartjol | I dunno when the next official release of the wre will be | 17:55 |
+bartjol | I should ask Koen I suppose | 17:55 |
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+bartjol | he Tiler Parker | 17:56 |
+perlDreamer | bartjol, maybe instead of putting wre.conf POD into lots of scripts, we should make one POD file for the whole wre.conf, and only document script options in each script? | 17:59 |
+bartjol | I agree that the explanations might as well be in the conf | 18:01 |
+bartjol | only, even with no options, you'll need a redirect from the POD of the script files | 18:01 |
+perlDreamer | yes, we'll have to say something like | 18:01 |
+perlDreamer | please see the BACKUP options part of wre.conf.pod | 18:01 |
+bartjol | very large | 18:02 |
+bartjol | that'd be ok | 18:02 |
+perlDreamer | I'll pull the wre.conf stuff out of backup.pl, and start a wre.conf.pod file | 18:02 |
+perlDreamer | then we can add to it pieces when needed | 18:02 |
+bartjol | ah, that wre.conf file pod will be large :) | 18:03 |
CIA-58 | wrebuild: Colin Kuskie master * r9250085 / wre/sbin/backup.pl : Add baseline POD to backup.pl - http://bit.ly/dtZB6d | 18:08 |
+perlDreamer | okay, POD added | 18:08 |
CIA-58 | wrebuild: Colin Kuskie master * r1f146da / wre/sbin/wre.conf.pod : Begin documenting the wre.conf file. - http://bit.ly/cClgyr | 18:08 |
+bartjol | cool | 18:10 |
* perlDreamer goes to the gym. I'll add the other files when I come back | 18:15 |
+bartjol | oh well, I have to go too | 18:16 |
+bartjol | I'll see the results, but don't overdo it | 18:16 |
+perlDreamer | yes, sir! | 18:16 |
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CIA-58 | wrebuild: Colin Kuskie master * r78edb05 / (wre/sbin/logrotate.pl wre/sbin/wreconsole.pl): Add POD to logrotate and wreconsole scripts. - http://bit.ly/bNevDR | 19:46 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie master * rfb14f13 / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Layout.pm): Add labels to the Layout templates so they show up in Shortcut overrides. Fixes bug #11476. - http://bit.ly/cYdKzw | 20:05 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Colin Kuskie webgui-7.8 * r2465da4 / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Layout.pm): Add labels to the Layout templates so they show up in Shortcut overrides. Fixes bug #11476. - http://bit.ly/ddqrDa | 20:05 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop master * r1919973 / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Post/Thread.pm): fixed: Unable to add threads with permission to edit CS but not in post group - http://bit.ly/bafugN | 20:21 |
CIA-58 | webgui: Graham Knop webgui-7.8 * r34967f7 / (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Post/Thread.pm): fixed: Unable to add threads with permission to edit CS but not in post group - http://bit.ly/9Sf1tT | 20:21 |
+perlDreamer | nice find, haarg | 20:28 |
@Haarg | i finally added a thing to wgdev for running across multiple sites | 20:43 |
@Haarg | so if you had a package to install on every site, you can do wgd for-each --exec="wgd package -i ~/fix.wgpkg" | 20:44 |
+perlDreamer | nice! | 20:46 |
+perlDreamer | I really want to install wgd on the servers I have to maintain | 20:46 |
+perlDreamer | at least for the ease of saying wgd db --config myConfig.conf | 20:47 |
+perlDreamer | I hate having to find the db auth info in the config files | 20:47 |
@Haarg | ./Build distexec && scp wgd-v0.5.0 server:wgd | 20:48 |
@Haarg | i usually end up sticking the single-file version on servers i'm working on | 20:48 |
+perlDreamer | it's not the mechanics, it's the permissions issue | 20:48 |
@Haarg | how so? | 20:49 |
+perlDreamer | well, I just don't know whether or not I'm allowed to install software on the sites that I maintain | 20:49 |
@Haarg | ah | 20:49 |
@Haarg | well, that's why i just stick it leaving it in my home directory | 20:50 |
+perlDreamer | that would work | 20:50 |
+perlDreamer | did you get my reply about Paths? | 20:51 |
@Haarg | i got a reply and responded | 20:52 |
+perlDreamer | so for people who are not WRE users (and there seem to be more and more of these), they'd just need to setup PERL5LIB themselves | 20:53 |
@Haarg | yes | 20:53 |
+perlDreamer | in that case, I don't have any other questions or issues | 20:53 |
+perlDreamer | just impatient to get it! | 20:53 |
@Haarg | and the apache config would need to be adjusted somewhat | 20:53 |
@Haarg | but it's basically just setting the perl include path | 20:53 |
@Haarg | instead of setting the WebGUI root path | 20:54 |
+perlDreamer | that's not bad. It should be in the migration instructions | 20:54 |
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