WebGUI irc logs from: 2008-12.log

--- Log opened Mon Dec 01 00:00:11 2008
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8723 /experimental/wgfs/ (lib/Filesys/Virtual/WebGUI.pm t/filesys-virtual-webgui.t):	00:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: better stat() mode calculation	00:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: bug fixes	00:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: changed root to root_path and added root_path() method to be consistent with other Filesys::Virtual drivers	00:34
* SDuensin dreams of the day he can directly open templates with Coda.		00:38
@rizen	will never happen	00:38
SDuensin	Says you. :-P	00:38
* rizen put an exclusion for Coda right in the driver		00:38
SDuensin	See, that's the problem with open sores. Any fool can edit it.	00:38
@rizen	you assume you can read my unintelligible code	00:39
SDuensin	Done it before. :-P	00:39
SDuensin	Is there a way to not use the quantity field in a product?	00:41
BartJol	maybe there's a default value for it	00:44
BartJol	maybe I've seen that	00:45
SDuensin	But my products have no quantity available. They're produced on-demand.	00:46
BartJol	no, that it WebGUI think with that vaule, the supply is endless or on demand	00:48
@rizen	SD you need to set it to 99999999	00:51
@rizen	it requires a quantity	00:51
BartJol	cd..	00:53
@rizen	ahah!	00:57
@rizen	or ah ha	00:57
@rizen	or ah hah!	00:57
@rizen	but not uh huh?	00:57
BartJol	? are you going insane? please do not	00:58
BartJol	I had the wrong window	00:59
* SDuensin will set it and edit it out of the display template.		00:59
BartJol	goodnight	01:01
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@rizen	booyah grandma!	01:05
@rizen	eureka	01:05
@rizen	pay dirt	01:05
SDuensin	Yes?	01:06
@rizen	we have working webdav	01:06
@rizen	i may just have to take the rest of my life off	01:07
SDuensin	YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES!	01:07
SDuensin	If I had time, I'd drive up there and kiss you.	01:07
@rizen	if you did, i'd smack you over the head with a hatchet	01:08
CIA-41	WebGUI: yung * r8724 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.6.4-7.6.5.pl: fixing a Matrix v2 upgrade bug	01:08
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8725 /experimental/wgfs/ (3 files in 3 dirs):	01:08
CIA-41	WebGUI: bug fixes	01:08
CIA-41	WebGUI: we have working webdav - wahoo!!!	01:08
SDuensin	So what's the DAV stuff do so far?	01:10
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@rizen	oh, only everything	01:14
@rizen	you can edit assets	01:14
@rizen	if you download an asset that is not a subclass of WebGUI::Asset::File	01:14
@rizen	then it gives you a json blob	01:14
SDuensin	Blob me, baby./	01:15
@rizen	if it's a binary file you can simply download and upload and it creates assets	01:15
SDuensin	You may be my new hero.	01:16
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@rizen	hardly, this is only step 1 of a lot of steps, before it's ready for any kind of real purpose	01:17
SDuensin	Yea, but it's getting there.	01:18
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CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8726 /experimental/wgfs/lib/Filesys/Virtual/WebGUI.pm: made the json blob pretty	03:12
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CIA-41	WebGUI: patspam * r8727 /branch/WebGUI_flux/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Merged yung-thingy-rfe	04:38
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patspam	pluggable user profile looks really sweet	06:27
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+perlDreamer	perlmonkey2!	06:54
+perlDreamer	You're up late tonight	06:54
+perlDreamer	well, at least your IRC client is	06:55
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CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8728 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: remove some old merge leftovers	08:59
CIA-41	WebGUI: patspam * r8729 /WebGUI/etc/log.conf.original:	08:59
CIA-41	WebGUI: Made log.conf.original comment consistent with what log4perl configuration	08:59
CIA-41	WebGUI: actually does (WARNings are not captured).	08:59
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CIA-41	WebGUI: yung * r8730 /WebGUI/ (7 files in 5 dirs): fixed UserList	12:57
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SDuensin	Morning!	16:43
BartJol	morning	16:44
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Guest54306	Hey, I'm not sure if I did this question before but I don't still have any answer so I ask you anyway	17:02
BartJol	ok	17:02
Guest54306	Anyone has worked with perl (or WebGUI) and auth memcookie?	17:03
BartJol	not me	17:03
Guest54306	:(	17:03
Guest54306	I really need this	17:03
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* SDuensin smacks preaction with anything other than a large trout		17:36
* rizen reminds SDuensin that preaction often wears the troutshield of protection, so he would have been immune to the trout had SDuensin used it		17:37
SDuensin	See? I out-thunk him!	17:37
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SDuensin	Satan created CSS.	17:47
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SDuensin	Did I dream there was a macro to display an image at an arbitrary size? Or am I having a flashback to 5.x?	18:02
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+perlDreamer	BartJol, welcome to PBWG	18:12
+perlDreamer	Still weird seeing you with hair, though	18:12
BartJol	thanks	18:12
BartJol	well, I cut it yesterday	18:13
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SDuensin	preaction lives!	18:16
@preaction	explains to me why updating Safari requires a full restart of OS X?	18:17
SDuensin	Yea! I wanna know too!	18:17
@preaction	also, SDuensin do you have an e-mail address?	18:17
SDuensin	Or updating the frickin' RAW filters.	18:17
SDuensin	Email? What's that?	18:17
@preaction	exactly	18:17
SDuensin	Work addy: scott@jaegertech.com	18:18
@preaction	hm. that was the one i sent to. anyway	18:18
SDuensin	Who was it from? I'll whitelist the address.	18:19
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+perlDreamer	SDuensin, can you please pastebin me some of the text that's causing the Product to error out?	19:16
SDuensin	Sure. I'll find exactly what killed it. Gimmie a sec.	19:16
+perlDreamer	I've tried pasting in stuff from OpenOffice, but no luck trying to recreate	19:16
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@rizen	preaction: for the same reason IE requires the same thing...apple stupidly integrated the browser into the OS	19:18
@preaction	but there's no way to reload just, for example, the window manager that is using those frameworks?	19:18
@preaction	i mean, kernel-level reboot should be only necessary for kernel changes	19:19
SDuensin	perlDreamer - http://webgui.pastebin.com/m436f596f - It's the quote after the 16 that kills it.	19:19
+perlDreamer	cool! Thanks. Now I can try to get it down to a specific test, or an upgrade of JSON.pm in the core	19:19
@rizen	preaction, but "it's just easier" to restart everything to to restart individual processes	19:20
@rizen	=)	19:20
@preaction	yeah, that's not a slippery slope or anything...	19:20
@preaction	"it's just easier to not check if a file was successfully copied before we delete it"	19:21
SDuensin	perlDreamer - YW	19:21
@rizen	preaction: it's just easier to kill your enemies than it is to negotiate with them	19:22
SDuensin	perlDreamer - FYI, it came from a DOC file that I loaded into TextEdit and pasted into FF.	19:22
Lisette	how to do to redirect to other page from a payDriver?	19:25
+perlDreamer	Lisette, look into WebGUI::Session::Http.pm	19:29
Lisette	thanks	19:32
Lisette	i'm going to see	19:32
+perlDreamer	particularly, the ->redirect method	19:33
Lisette	in any place there is an example?	19:33
@preaction	there are lots of places, but there is also documentation	19:34
@preaction	do a grep for "setRedirect"	19:34
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CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8731 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs):	19:43
CIA-41	WebGUI: Update POD for several methods.	19:43
CIA-41	WebGUI: Make getObject clone data for safety and update tests.	19:43
CIA-41	WebGUI: Make newObject always alter $address for consistency and update tests.	19:43
Lisette	and with this setRedirect i can send params?	20:10
@preaction	you can send a query string, yes. not POST params though	20:11
Lisette	i need with method post	20:12
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@preaction	why do the latest webgui has a "lastUpdated" field when there is already a revisionDate field?	20:31
SDuensin	So you know when you last updated the latest revision? :-P	20:31
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@Haarg	sometimes there are updates without new revisions	20:34
Bernd__	Hey everyone,	20:37
Bernd__	how is business going?	20:37
+perlDreamer	still hacking	20:38
Bernd__	Surprise, surprise :-)	20:39
Bernd__	Question: How can I post those "*" remarks to the chat?	20:39
Bernd__	I have seen them very often and want to be able to post them, too.	20:40
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@preaction	Bernd__: you mean "/me does something" ?	20:45
* preaction does something		20:45
+perlDreamer	Bernd__: you say slash me	20:45
+perlDreamer	preaction does a whole lot of things, really	20:46
* Bernd__ is having a cup of tea and enjoying the chat		20:46
+perlDreamer	including teaching perlDreamer javascript	20:46
Bernd__	Can I join the lesson?	20:46
Bernd__	I very much like that Ajax stuff.	20:46
Bernd__	Is that all implemented by using YUI	20:47
Bernd__	?	20:47
@preaction	yes	20:47
Bernd__	Difficult to learn?	20:47
@preaction	not really	20:47
@preaction	if you already know some JS it should be fine	20:47
Bernd__	Hm, I just have too little time for all the interesting stuff in the world :-(	20:47
Bernd__	Maybe I should start working as hard as rizen?	20:47
Bernd__	preaction, not at all.	20:48
Bernd__	I only know some Java.	20:48
Bernd__	But I am out of practice.	20:48
Bernd__	I think I am going to stay with pure HTML for the moment.	20:48
Bernd__	Thanks for the hint with "slash me", btw.	20:49
@preaction	best to think of javascript as having nothing to do with java, makes it easier to learn	20:49
+perlDreamer	SDuensin, I can duplicate your bug. And it's testable, too. That is very good news.	20:51
+perlDreamer	Haarg, I could use some utf8 help if you have a little time	21:09
@Haarg	sure	21:09
+perlDreamer	In the product, I used encode_json and decode_json	21:09
+perlDreamer	and it they throw an error on "wide characters"	21:10
@Haarg	yeah	21:10
+perlDreamer	I can fix that bug by using to_json and from_json	21:10
+perlDreamer	but will it still work with international, utf8 characters?	21:10
@Haarg	yes	21:10
@Haarg	i had that a bit confused for a while	21:10
+perlDreamer	so, in general, we should not use encode_json and decode_json?	21:10
@Haarg	basically, unless you are dealing with file i/o	21:10
@Haarg	you should use to_ and from_	21:11
+perlDreamer	cool	21:11
@Haarg	and not use ->utf8	21:11
+perlDreamer	has anyone looked through the codebase for that?	21:11
@Haarg	i've been meaning to	21:11
@Haarg	there are some places that do need to use encode_	21:11
@Haarg	the package system for example	21:12
+perlDreamer	One thing I'm confused about is testing	21:12
+perlDreamer	the code fails in apache, but not in the tests	21:12
@Haarg	which tests?	21:13
+perlDreamer	I jimmied up a test to throw in a wide character into a product collateral	21:13
+perlDreamer	and it does not die	21:13
+perlDreamer	Let me pastebin some code for you	21:13
+perlDreamer	http://webgui.pastebin.com/d63c6bc65	21:14
@Haarg	you sure it's actually a wide character?	21:15
+perlDreamer	yes	21:15
+perlDreamer	see the funny, backwards double quote next to 16?	21:15
@Haarg	you can't inline characters like that without 'use utf8' or similar	21:15
+perlDreamer	if you run the test, it does print out as funny	21:16
+perlDreamer	but I'll add the use utf8 line to the test to see what's up	21:16
@Haarg	it's probably just getting the byte sequence, not the character	21:16
@Haarg	i'd suggest using an escape code instead	21:16
+perlDreamer	something like \x{dddd} ?	21:17
@Haarg	yeah	21:18
@Haarg	use utf8 will probably work, but an escape will make it more obvious what you are actually doing	21:18
+perlDreamer	is there a lookup table someplace online for encodings?	21:18
@Haarg	nothing i know of	21:19
@Haarg	\x{201d}	21:20
@Haarg	is the quote you have there	21:21
+perlDreamer	yep, much better. Test go boom	21:22
+perlDreamer	How did you look that up?	21:22
@Haarg	use utf8 + Data::Dumper	21:23
+perlDreamer	SDuensin: it's fixed. 7.5.35 should be coming out this week.	21:33
SDuensin	perlDreamer - Sweet.	21:33
+perlDreamer	If you want it sooner, then you can pull it from svn	21:37
+perlDreamer	for the 7.5 branch, it's 8732	21:37
SDuensin	Na, not a problem. I just used a regular quote and it's fine.	21:37
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8732 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fix wide character handling in Product JSON collateral	21:39
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8733 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): forward port Product JSON collateral wide character fix	21:39
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8734 /experimental/Automat/lib/ (Automat/Customer.pm WebGUI/Asset/Automat.pm): added an email all hosting customers option	21:39
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carogray	hi all - Plain Black people - can you remind me what we tell people who are finally ready to direct their a records to the Plain Black server i.e. they want their demo site to now be live where do I find the info?	21:57
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CIA-41	WebGUI: frank * r8735 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Inbox/Message.pm: Updated the POD for some of the new and changes methods to make their use more clear.	22:06
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+MrHairgrease	haha	23:01
+MrHairgrease	anybody read this: http://developers.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1046193&cid=25935403	23:02
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SDuensin	Gotta love Perl.	23:04
+MrHairgrease	ah crap: http://developers.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1046193&cid=25937375	23:05
+MrHairgrease	still... gotta love perl	23:05
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@preaction	http://duartes.org/gustavo/blog/post/what-your-computer-does-while-you-wait <- interesting little thing on performance	23:36
--- Day changed Tue Dec 02 2008
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nuba	hey folks, this is totally offtopic, but here's me playing some ragtime-like guitar song last friday, at university, in a improvised gathering http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beKTgRUanp0	00:20
nuba	its a passable rendition to a awesome song, Clap, by Steve Howe, in his first album with the Yes band, early 70s	00:21
+perlDreamer	he can hack, pick and strum!	00:30
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+perlDreamer	Could a nice PB staff-type person please move this into the RFE board?	00:39
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/9180	00:39
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@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: done	00:48
+perlDreamer	thanks.	00:49
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* perlDreamer goes to run errands		01:07
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8736 /branch/wrebuild_0.8: putting wre 0.8 into mothballs	01:15
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8737 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Post.pm): Make Posts respect the email privacy setting. Fixed in 7.6 branch only.	01:15
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8738 /wrebuild/ (5 files in 4 dirs):	01:15
CIA-41	WebGUI: removed WDK	01:15
CIA-41	WebGUI: added --ia64 flag for custom processing on 64-bit systems	01:15
SDuensin	Is there a limit to the number of products a shelf will display? I'm only seeing a fraction of what I've entered.	01:17
SDuensin	Seems it shows the last 25 products I entered and gives up the fight.	01:20
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CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8739 /wrebuild/ (build.sh wre/docs/changelog.txt):	02:09
CIA-41	WebGUI: - Added the following components:	02:09
CIA-41	WebGUI: gnutils-2.6.2	02:09
CIA-41	WebGUI: libgcrypt-1.4.3	02:09
CIA-41	WebGUI: libgpg-error-1.7	02:09
CIA-41	WebGUI: libiconv-1.12	02:09
+perlDreamer	SDuensin, check for pagination controls in the Shelf template	02:40
+perlDreamer	25 is the default pagination size, so it's suspicious	02:40
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SDuensin	perlDreamer - Thanks. Will do.	04:01
+perlDreamer	SDuensin, the default shelf template does not have pagination controls. That's definitely the problem.	04:03
+perlDreamer	that's probably a bu	04:14
+perlDreamer	g	04:14
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8740 /WebGUI/ (193 files in 16 dirs):	04:17
CIA-41	WebGUI: Adding tinymce language support for arabic, portugeuese,	04:17
CIA-41	WebGUI: danish, french, russian, spanish, german, dutch, norway,	04:17
CIA-41	WebGUI: hungarian and italian.	04:17
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8741 /WebGUI/www/extras/tinymce/jscripts/tiny_mce/ (16 files in 15 dirs): add polish language support to tinymce	04:17
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SDuensin	perlDreamer - Well, I'm good at breaking things. :-)	04:33
+perlDreamer	well, that's also two shop related bugs in 1 day	04:37
+perlDreamer	not too bad	04:38
SDuensin	Is the pagination just a template change? That one is a big deal for me.	04:38
+perlDreamer	it is, but it's also a bug	04:38
+perlDreamer	if you post it, I'll fix it	04:39
+perlDreamer	actually, I'll probably have it fixed before you post it	04:39
+perlDreamer	but it would be nice to have it documented.	04:39
SDuensin	I'll post it real fast.	04:39
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8742 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (209 files in 16 dirs): backport language pack support for tinymce	04:40
SDuensin	Posted.	04:41
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+perlDreamer	You beat me	05:50
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patspam	perlDreamer++ # implementing an RFE that was submitted for me while I was asleep, and finishing it before I woke up, that's fast	05:58
+perlDreamer	well, we aim to please at perlDreamer Consulting	05:59
+perlDreamer	it's out new psychic interface	05:59
elnino	hello! If I have an article who calls the ParentPageURL macro and I make a short cut of that article and put it on a page layout, who's ParentPageURL is it going to get?	06:00
elnino	it appears to be going into a loop and getting confused.	06:00
patspam	perlmonkey2: you still awake?	06:00
@perlmonkey2	yo	06:01
@perlmonkey2	patspam:	06:01
patspam	word	06:01
patspam	I'm thinking plenty of people will want a simple "congrats, you finished the survey" on their survey exit page	06:02
@perlmonkey2	an exit section or have the exit url got to a page with that message.	06:02
patspam	was just musing that people could put survey_url?msg=my%20message%20goes%20here	06:02
patspam	and get survey to print out msg form param if it exists	06:03
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8743 /WebGUI/docs/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Add basic pagination support to the default Shelf template.	06:03
patspam	would save people from having to create an article containing the message	06:03
@perlmonkey2	seems like it might be easy enough to do	06:05
patspam	ah, but you're right, an exit section is probably better	06:05
patspam	hadn't thought of that	06:05
patspam	I was thinking about it in the context of exitUrl for survey timeouts, since we probably need to tell the user what has happened	06:06
patspam	in my case I want to force users to restart the survey with a message telling them that they timed out	06:07
@perlmonkey2	yeah, I wondered what else it should do.	06:07
@perlmonkey2	So I guess I should break out the check of if the survey has ended to return different codes + messages.	06:08
+perlDreamer	elnino, could you set up a demo site (with standard credential) and post the link back here please?	06:08
patspam	yeah, and we could offer a drop-down of what to do on timeout: go to exitUrl, restart, etc..	06:09
+perlDreamer	if it's a bug, post it as a bug then I can use that as a test bed for fixing it.	06:09
@perlmonkey2	patspam: just make it a asset setting?	06:12
patspam	yeah	06:12
+perlDreamer	DataForm has an acknowledgement template and message	06:12
elnino	perlDreamer. hmm. I guess ParentPageURL is a user contrib. I guess I can't really expect you to fix it even if I do find a problem. It's more complex, I'm calling parentPageURL from a macro I created from a shortcut on a page layout.... So maybe I should ask if there is a way to do what I want to do..=)	06:13
elnino	All I want to do is. Grab the last part of the url: /url/path/to/this.. I want just "this"	06:13
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@perlmonkey2	patspam: you'll have to forgive me, i'm not really with it today. I was attacked by a tree Yesterday and the tree won.	06:15
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: how do you not spend all your time here: http://www.sparkfun.com	06:15
elnino	keeping in mind that it's called from an article that has been shortcutted and placed on a pagelayout. And I'm looking for the last part of the pagelayout's url.	06:16
patspam	pm2: damn trees! do you have scars that tell the tale?	06:16
@perlmonkey2	patspam: heh, no, just a nice red line across my face.	06:18
patspam	ouch. how did you manage that?	06:19
@perlmonkey2	was driving a truck out around a lake. I backed into a tree, heard some squeeking and turned to look just as a branch flipped free of the truck by swinging through the window and into my face. Was quite comical after I realized I hadn't been blinded.	06:21
* perlDreamer is a dedicated Make blog reader, perlmonkey2		06:27
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: yeah, I ordered the ardrino starter book today.	06:28
@perlmonkey2	should be fun stuff.	06:28
@perlmonkey2	I used the OOPic for my last UAV.	06:28
@perlmonkey2	but it was fairly limited	06:28
+perlDreamer	I built two PICs at Maxim	06:28
+perlDreamer	snif	06:28
* perlDreamer grieves quietly but bravely		06:29
@perlmonkey2	yeah, but when you say you "built a PIC", you don't mean you soldered some IC's to some transistors, do you?	06:29
+perlDreamer	No, I mean from the ground up.	06:29
+perlDreamer	We started with the instruction set	06:30
+perlDreamer	and ended up with a PIC	06:30
+perlDreamer	built the ALU, RAM, ROM, EEPROM	06:30
@perlmonkey2	nice	06:30
+perlDreamer	two digital interfaces (1-wire and SPI)	06:30
@perlmonkey2	1-wire++	06:30
@perlmonkey2	don't know what SPI is.	06:30
+perlDreamer	I even hacked the gnupic tools to do our compiling for us	06:30
@perlmonkey2	heh, cool	06:31
+perlDreamer	SPI is also called I2C?	06:31
@perlmonkey2	oh, okay	06:31
@perlmonkey2	making specialized controllers?	06:31
+perlDreamer	yes	06:31
@perlmonkey2	industrial stuff?	06:31
+perlDreamer	no, smaller projects	06:31
@perlmonkey2	When my buddy got out of EE, he started a consulting business doing what he had done at work, and then did software on the side, and then sold his software business for millions.	06:32
@perlmonkey2	Not that you should do that, as I think everyone is happy you are doing software as your main business :)	06:32
+perlDreamer	brb	06:33
@perlmonkey2	patspam: shoot me an email on if you like the url encoded exit message or having a way to set messages for different exit scenarios.	06:44
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+perlDreamer	No, I'm confused again. SMB == I2C. SPI is a 3-wire interface	06:52
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8744 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/docs/ (2 files in 2 dirs): backporting default shelf template pagination template fix	07:17
+perlDreamer	elnino, please try ^PageUrl(); and see what it gives you.	07:17
elnino	Thanks. I actually figured it out,I ended up writing my own macro that took the env(path_info) and striped everything except what i wanted.	07:18
elnino	although env seems buggy, at least it doesn't return what I think it should return. I'll write a bug for that.	07:19
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+perlDreamer	Session/Env doesn't do much with the environment hash. It might be more of an Apache thing.	07:27
elnino	yep. I got the idea from the loginbox macro - it's the only place I saw i used. It picks up HTTP header variables.	07:28
+perlDreamer	I'm glad you found a solution	07:29
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CIA-41	WebGUI: yung * r8745 /branch/yung-thingy-rfe/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Added rfe 9128: Thingy fields subtext and pretext now have max length of 1024.	12:13
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CIA-41	WebGUI: yung * r8746 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.6.4-7.6.5.pl: fixing matrix upgrade bugfix	13:07
CIA-41	WebGUI: yung * r8747 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/ (MatrixListing.pm Wobject/Matrix.pm): fixed a bug in Matrix deleteAttribute method	13:34
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Lisette	how to get the address in a payDriver?	15:21
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Lisette	how to get the address in a payDriver?	15:32
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SDuensin	Morning.	15:52
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@perlmonkey2	when dealing with non-utf8 chars, would you use to_json or encode_json? encode has the implied utf8=>1 flag.	16:44
@perlmonkey2	and why do people still leave their system settings to a locale, instead of universal utf8?	16:44
SDuensin	People leave it where it defaulted during the install.	16:45
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@perlmonkey2	Haarg: when do you build the beta release?	17:57
@perlmonkey2	Trying to see how much time I have to resolve the utf8 issue.	17:57
@Haarg	which utf8 issue?	17:57
@Haarg	probably early afternoon?	17:57
@Haarg	... that was supposed to be a statement not a question	17:58
@perlmonkey2	survey on beta isn't working. Think it is the to_json vs the encode_json issue.	17:58
@Haarg	ah	17:58
@Haarg	for survey, use to_ and from_ everywhere, or don't use ->utf8 if doing oo	17:58
@perlmonkey2	it uses encode/decode	18:00
@perlmonkey2	which convert to utf8	18:00
@perlmonkey2	but with wide non-utf8 encodings, they break.	18:00
@perlmonkey2	or at least wide points which don't fit into utf8. Of which I believe there are only a few edge cases which don't.	18:01
@perlmonkey2	The windows backticks I believe don't fit.	18:01
@perlmonkey2	and commas	18:01
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@Haarg	you don't want to use encode_ and decode_	18:05
@perlmonkey2	yeah, we'd hate to assume utf8.	18:06
@Haarg	it's not that simple	18:06
@Haarg	we do assume utf8	18:06
@Haarg	but that is handled elsewhere	18:06
@Haarg	actually, wait	18:06
@Haarg	are you dealing with writing or reading files?	18:07
@Haarg	that gets a bit trickier	18:07
@perlmonkey2	nope	18:07
@perlmonkey2	just encoding and decoding user entered text	18:07
@Haarg	basically, everything going out or in from apache is utf8	18:07
@Haarg	but you don't have to care	18:07
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@Haarg	same for the database	18:07
@Haarg	in the perl code, you just always treat it as character strings	18:08
@perlmonkey2	yeah, but anything that doesn't fit into the utf8 space is just left as a bad wide char.	18:08
@Haarg	which is what to_json/from_json do	18:08
@Haarg	if you use encode_json, it tries to encode the characters into utf8	18:08
@perlmonkey2	so if you have a multi-byte with the first byte not having the correct byte count, you have a bad space that is just quietly passed along.	18:08
@Haarg	but that is already done by the db layer	18:08
@perlmonkey2	Haarg: right, and it is strict in its encoding.	18:09
@Haarg	so it causes problems	18:09
@perlmonkey2	no silent failures.	18:09
@Haarg	but you don't want to encode at all	18:09
@Haarg	because that is done elsewhere	18:09
CIA-41	WebGUI: perlmonkey2 * r8748 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/ (Survey/SurveyJSON.pm Survey/ResponseJSON.pm Survey.pm): Minor fix. JSON no longer assumes proper utf8, but uses whatever off-brand locale a luser wants to use.	18:10
@perlmonkey2	hmm, but if we take their windows encoded (or whatever) and just assume utf8, then when we show it back to them, the page encoding will be labeled utf8, but their browser will see non-utf8 wide encodings that don't fit and give them the bad wide char char.	18:10
@Haarg	it doesn't come in as the windows encoding	18:10
@Haarg	it comes in as utf8	18:10
@Haarg	non-utf8 wide characters doesn't make much sense anyway	18:11
@perlmonkey2	let me try that on the beta server and see what happens.	18:11
@Haarg	wide characters are always going to be utf-8 or utf-16 or something like that	18:11
@Haarg	the windows encoding (or whatever other encoding like that) are all single-byte	18:12
@perlmonkey2	http://beta.webgui.org/demo1228147391_379/home/untitled?func=editSurvey why does that work but we get utf8 errors when you try to take the survey? maybe a yui widget is failing.	18:12
@Haarg	isn't that using encode_json/decode_json?	18:13
@perlmonkey2	yes. I only just now changed it.	18:13
@perlmonkey2	not on beta though.	18:13
@Haarg	using encode_json/decode_json is the problem	18:15
@perlmonkey2	I need a non utf8 encoded point that does't fit into the utf8 space to test this.	18:16
@Haarg	i don't know of any characters like that	18:17
@Haarg	that's the whole point of unicode	18:17
@Haarg	that it has all of the characters	18:17
@perlmonkey2	yes, but there are some significant bit code points in say Western that don't translate to utf8. Their byte claims to be a multibyte char in utf8, but they aren't.	18:19
@Haarg	i don't really understand what you mean	18:20
@Haarg	the characters in western all exist in utf8	18:20
@Haarg	because utf8 is just an encoding scheme for unicode	18:20
@Haarg	it doesn't really matter what the encodings are in western, because the browser sends them in utf8	18:21
@Haarg	and if the browser didn't send them in utf8 we wouldn't be able to deal with them anyway	18:22
@perlmonkey2	I just used an Eastern (don't know which ISO) and cut and pasted into the demo survey. I can't belive it. was cut off at "I can" as the ' was probably a 11 byte, but the next byte also had a significant bit	18:24
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@Haarg	are you seeing any cases that are broken now that you've changed it to to_json/from_json?	18:26
@perlmonkey2	Haarg: yes	18:28
@perlmonkey2	when I send the eastern encoded string, it is not sent back correctly to the editor. But it is stored and sent back to the presentation correctly.	18:28
@perlmonkey2	and how would the high bit Western encodings fit into UTF8? And western point that starts with 1, would be a bad wide char.	18:29
@perlmonkey2	Well, not a western point, but a western byte.	18:29
@Haarg	again, everything comes in as utf8	18:29
@perlmonkey2	then why would encode and decode break?	18:30
@Haarg	because the database already does encoding	18:30
@Haarg	so you are double encoding stuff	18:31
@perlmonkey2	how would the database know which encoding was coming in? Wouldn't it just assume utf8 is being passed in?	18:32
@Haarg	ok	18:33
@Haarg	browser has characters	18:33
@perlmonkey2	yeah, are those bytes or points?	18:33
@Haarg	it encodes them to utf8 to send	18:33
@Haarg	doesn't matter	18:33
@Haarg	characters	18:33
@Haarg	apache gets the utf8 strings, gives them to webgui	18:34
@perlmonkey2	well my Latvian I can't belive it. didn't get encoded correctly	18:34
@Haarg	webgui (WebGUI::Session::Form) decodes the utf8 to characters	18:34
@Haarg	inside webgui everything treats them as characters	18:34
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@Haarg	when you save to the database, it send encodes them to utf8 for storage	18:35
@Haarg	and decodes them back to characters when it pulls them out	18:35
@Haarg	in webgui (excepting i/o), we always should just be treating them as character strings	18:36
@Haarg	i may see the problem though	18:36
@perlmonkey2	I'm thinking the to/from fixed the issue. Looks like a template error.	18:37
@perlmonkey2	the template value isn't surrounded with quotes.	18:37
Lisette	how to do to get the address in a payDriver?	19:10
@rizen	opinion: I'm working on WRE 1.0	19:29
@rizen	opinion needed, that is	19:29
@rizen	and i'm thinking about upgrading MySQL	19:29
@rizen	5.1 came out	19:29
@perlmonkey2	5.1?	19:30
@rizen	and it has a lot of bug fixes	19:30
SDuensin	Bleeding edge, baby. I can take it.	19:30
@perlmonkey2	I just read a short review that said it should probably still be called beta.	19:30
@rizen	stuff that isn't ever going to get patched in to 5.0	19:30
@rizen	cuz they appear to have end of lifed 5.0	19:30
@rizen	i read the monty blog post too	19:30
@rizen	and he's clearly conflicted	19:30
@rizen	he said that the new features are clearly beta	19:31
@rizen	but also that there's lots of bugs fixed in 5.1 that aren't going to be fixed in 5.0	19:31
@rizen	including several fairly major crash bugs	19:31
@rizen	so...could i hear your thoughts and opinions, so i can roll them around in my head for a little while	19:31
@perlmonkey2	just as long as the business logic layer doesn't creep into triggers and stored procs, its all good.	19:32
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CIA-41	WebGUI: perlmonkey2 * r8749 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (2 files in 2 dirs): added an epochDate field to the template for CS RSS items. The ^D(); + macro can then format the epoch date.	19:37
@perlmonkey2	Doesn't look like any of the listed bugs are show stoppers	19:42
@perlmonkey2	Although it would be nice if transactions every became something stable enough to be usable.	19:42
@rizen	thanks for the opinion...anybody else have a thought? cap10morgan preaction Haarg khenn_ anybody?	19:45
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@preaction	i would say provided there are no regressions with 5.1, go for it	19:46
@khenn	I agree with preaction	19:46
* SDuensin likes new software.		19:46
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+cap10morgan	rizen: i assume you won't have webgui magically start using 5.1-only features when it's running in wre 1.0, so it seems like a good idea to me	19:48
@Haarg	since the bugs seem to mainly be in the new features (which we aren't using) upgrading seems fine	19:49
@rizen	nope, we won't be using any 5.1 features	19:49
@rizen	because the API backward compatibility guarantee applies through-out the 7.x series	19:49
@rizen	MySQL 5.0 is the base	19:49
@rizen	as is Apache 2.0 and Perl 5.8	19:50
@rizen	So even though we're upgrading to Apache 2.2 and Perl 5.10 in the new WRE, we won't be able to make use of any of those new features either	19:50
@rizen	only the performance enhancements and bug fixes	19:50
@rizen	ok, so it sounds like everybody is for moving to 5.1, so I'll add that	19:50
@rizen	cap10morgan: as promised, WRE 1.0's primary new feature is going to be 64-bit support	19:51
+cap10morgan	oh, nice!	19:51
SDuensin	MORE BITS! Whoo!	19:51
+cap10morgan	now that i know more about the ins and outs, that's mainly nice for the mysql component. but that's pretty important.	19:52
+cap10morgan	but the pre-fork apache processes could already use more than 4GB of RAM amongst themselves since each one gets its own address space, as you explained to me before. so that relieves most of the pressure on our end.	19:53
@rizen	well it's nice for more than memory. theoretically native 64-bit calculations should be faster due to higher through-put	19:55
@rizen	so that affects apache, perl, mysql, etc	19:55
+cap10morgan	cool	19:56
@perlmonkey2	rizen: you finally got it compiled on 64 bit? swa-eet.	19:56
@rizen	no	19:57
@rizen	that's just what i'm working on for wre 1.0	19:57
@perlmonkey2	oh, may the 64 bit gods smile upon your endevors then.	19:57
@rizen	i've gotten tips from mrhairgrease, koen, and knowmad, so hopefully i can now make it work	19:59
@rizen	plus i'm upgrading to the latest versions of everything, so hopefully that helps as well	19:59
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+perlDreamer	Haarg, are you releasing today?	20:01
@Haarg	yes	20:01
+perlDreamer	cool. I'll be watching for your release notice then to stop committing to the 7.5 branch.	20:05
+perlDreamer	meantime, could someone please move this into the RFE category: http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/9023	20:06
+perlDreamer	the cart template never had a page title	20:06
@Haarg	today is 7.6 release	20:18
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: is that really an RFE?	20:19
+perlDreamer	I think so, but I could be convinced otherwise	20:19
+perlDreamer	Should the view cart page have a title?	20:19
@perlmonkey2	good question	20:21
+perlDreamer	To me, that's what it boils down to.	20:22
+perlDreamer	shop comes before Asset in the content handler, so I was thinking (but didn't check) that the session asset would not exist yet	20:22
+perlDreamer	that would rule it out	20:22
+perlDreamer	I guess we could put a static title in it	20:22
+perlDreamer	View Cart	20:22
+perlDreamer	but the bug mentioned wanting to be able to change it, which sounds like user config	20:23
+perlDreamer	the user config is out of scope for the Shop right now	20:23
@perlmonkey2	I can find no flaws in that	20:24
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@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: done	20:26
+perlDreamer	thanks, man.	20:26
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8750 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/lib/WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Add Help for new epochDate CS RSS template variable.	20:37
ckotil	RFE: include DENY in the subject for denied version tags.	20:42
ckotil	thoughts?	20:42
ckotil	hell include APPROVED for approved version tags as well	20:43
ckotil	bc right now its not apparent just by looking at the subject wheather or not a tag was approved/denied	20:43
+perlDreamer	I like it, ckotil	20:43
@perlmonkey2	I like it too	20:48
ckotil	cool, i just about have the RFE written up and submitted	20:48
ckotil	I think we will just need to modify the Notify about version tag Workflow Activity	20:48
+perlDreamer	Haarg, rev 8081 actually fixes a bug in 7.5	20:52
+perlDreamer	is it safe to back port it to 7.5?	20:53
+perlDreamer	https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/revision/?rev=8081	20:53
ckotil	http://www.plainblack.com/rfe/request-for-enhancement/9209	20:53
+perlDreamer	I thought about doing just the Calendar part, but the CS, Gallery, and Wiki are also affected. So we'd be heading off bugs by doing it that way.	20:57
@Haarg	there have been a couple bugs introduced by that change	21:18
@Haarg	so i'd prefer not backporting it	21:18
@Haarg	what is the 7.5 bug?	21:18
+perlDreamer	when you copy a calendar, it creates version tags for each child event	21:22
@Haarg	ah	21:22
+perlDreamer	most likely because getParent returns nothing useful	21:23
+perlDreamer	actually, I can work with that	21:23
+perlDreamer	if getParent isn't defined, I'll have it return undef	21:23
+perlDreamer	inside of getAutoCommitWorkflow inside Event.pm	21:23
+perlDreamer	actually, what kind of bugs are you seeing in 7.6 related to that?	21:24
@Haarg	they were fixed, but there was an issue with the email -> CS workflow	21:24
+perlDreamer	hm	21:25
@Haarg	i don't know of any related bugs that still exist	21:25
+perlDreamer	maybe I should just do the Calendar/Event fix then	21:25
@Haarg	but given how large of a change it is and that there have been bugs with it already i'm just not certain about backporting it	21:26
+perlDreamer	I'll see if I can find a different/better solution then	21:26
* perlDreamer bows to Haarg's experience and wisdom		21:28
@Haarg	it looks like i used a different solution for how to keep recurring events in the correct tag for 7.5 vs 7.6	21:30
@Haarg	don't remember why	21:30
+perlDreamer	well, if getAutoCommitWorkflow return undef, it uses VersionTag->getWorking, which seems to be the right solution to me	21:31
+perlDreamer	that's what I'm going to try and emulate in 7.5	21:31
+perlDreamer	Also, before you commit, would you please see if you can duplicate my RTE bug for 7.5?	21:32
+perlDreamer	it's really strange	21:32
+perlDreamer	in that there's been no changes to that code, but it stopped working	21:32
+perlDreamer	I'm hoping it's just my browser version	21:32
@Haarg	you have a link?	21:33
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/9170	21:33
@Haarg	i think i know the problem	21:34
+perlDreamer	my error console says (method \|\| 'p').toLowerCase is not a method	21:34
+perlDreamer	or something very similar	21:35
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8751 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (2 files in 2 dirs): fix badge viewing issue in the EMS	21:35
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8752 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): forward porting ems badge viewing permission fix	21:35
@Haarg	i should probably report the bug in tinymce for that one	21:36
@Haarg	fix committed	21:36
+perlDreamer	does that fix also prevent the RTE from wrapping everything in paragraph tags?	21:38
@Haarg	kind of	21:39
@Haarg	it wraps in paragraph tags unless you set the option to use br tags	21:40
+perlDreamer	well, then I think you may have fixed two bugs...	21:40
@Haarg	well, the bug fix for that broke it	21:41
@Haarg	so now the brokenness is fixed	21:41
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/9130	21:41
+perlDreamer	I'll close my bug, and then test the other one to see if it's fixed, too.	21:41
+perlDreamer	and the fix, it codes around a bug in tinymce by not sending the option at all, versus sending JSON::true?	21:42
@Haarg	sorry for not posting something on that bug	21:42
+perlDreamer	it's okay, I know you're busy	21:42
@Haarg	yeah	21:42
@Haarg	i was told about the bug through different channels, and didn't know it was posted as a bug until later	21:42
@Haarg	heh, i didn't document it because the bug was introduced in the same version	21:57
+perlDreamer	I'm not sure I followed that Haarg.	22:00
@Haarg	that bug was never in a released version	22:00
@Haarg	doesn't really matter though	22:00
+perlDreamer	and it brings us one closer to < 3 pages of bugs	22:01
+perlDreamer	it also didn't fix the other RTE bug that I mentioned. But I'll try to close down the Calendar version tag bug first and then try it	22:02
+perlDreamer	I've been shying away from Bazaar and Helpdesk bugs	22:02
+perlDreamer	there are really only a handful of core WebGUI bugs posted	22:02
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8753 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/lib/WebGUI/Asset/RichEdit.pm: fix rich editor	22:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8754 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: document RTE bug fix (useBr workaround)	22:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8755 /wrebuild/ (build.sh wre/docs/changelog.txt): (log message trimmed)	22:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: - Upgraded the following components to these new versions:	22:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: aspell6-en-6.0-0	22:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: aspell-0.60.6	22:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: awstats-6.8	22:07
CIA-41	WebGUI: expat-2.0.1	22:07
CIA-41	WebGUI: ImageMagick-6.4.6-8	22:07
@Haarg	was this fix put into 7.5? http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/9155	22:08
+perlDreamer	No.	22:08
@Haarg	ok	22:08
+perlDreamer	rizen thought it was too radical for 7.5 at this point	22:08
@Haarg	the changelog entry was added for it	22:08
+perlDreamer	it was?	22:09
+perlDreamer	I'll fix that	22:09
+perlDreamer	I originally developed it in 7.5, then had to port it over to 7.5	22:09
+perlDreamer	7.6	22:09
nuba	perlbot: paste	22:09
perlbot	Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl http://erxz.com/pb or http://p3m.org/pfn/perl and #Perl will be able to view it.	22:09
+perlDreamer	I must not have cleaned it up	22:09
@rizen	what is too radical?	22:10
+perlDreamer	the headblock/extra head tags change	22:10
@rizen	it should have only been put into 7.6	22:10
+perlDreamer	it was	22:10
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@rizen	ok, then what's the problem?	22:11
+perlDreamer	I forgot to remove the changelog notice	22:11
+perlDreamer	(from 7.5)	22:11
@rizen	ok	22:11
@rizen	so no problem	22:11
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+perlDreamer	Ever since you got me canned, I've been very careful to do _exactly_ what you say.	22:11
+perlDreamer	except for that jalapeno juice cure for colds	22:12
nuba	hah	22:13
nuba	nasty	22:13
* perlDreamer goes to the gym		22:16
+perlDreamer	Haarg, I have no pending/halfway commits, so please don't hold the release for me	22:16
@Haarg	ok	22:17
@Haarg	perlDreamer, did you end up doing anything with that calendar copy problem?	22:24
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8756 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: undocument bug that is not fixed in this version	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8757 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Storage.pm): - security: A problem was discovered and fixed in which users could email executable attachments to a collaboration system and then when viewed online, could execute them.	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8758 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (lib/WebGUI/Form/Textarea.pm t/Form/Textarea.t):	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: use proper method of formatting text for display in Textarea form	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: control	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8759 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Storage.pm):	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: - security: A problem was discovered and fixed in which users could email	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: executable attachments to a collaboration system and then when viewed online,	22:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: could execute them. We recommend immediate upgrade for all 7.x users.	22:36
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+snapcount	anybody see a problem with changing line 439 of WSClient.pm from if (!$@) { to if (!$@ && defined $aref) {	00:35
+snapcount	I'm not sure what the process is for submitting patches these days so I figured I'd start here	00:35
+snapcount	I was getting an error when I used the WSClient and that fixes it	00:36
+snapcount	DEBUG - www.hdpublishinggroup.com.conf - WebGUI::Macro::process[142] - Stack trace for ERROR Can't use an undefined value as an ARRAY reference at /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/WSClient.pm line 440.	00:36
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+perlDreamer	Haarg, no changes to calendar yet. My return undef if !$parent fix did not work.	00:59
@Haarg	i'm not really sure how the changes i made in 7.6 dealt with the issue	01:00
+perlDreamer	it's gotta be in there somewhere	01:00
@Haarg	the problem i saw right off when looking at it	01:00
@Haarg	is the duplicate method on the calendar	01:00
@Haarg	it doesn't use skipAutoCommit	01:00
@Haarg	on its addChild calls	01:00
@Haarg	also, it probably needs to override duplicateBranch	01:01
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@Haarg	since it is already doing that behavior	01:02
+perlDreamer	yeah, I noticed that, too	01:02
+perlDreamer	the copy icon in the asset toolbar now has a dropdown if you have children	01:02
+perlDreamer	allowing you to copy only the asset, or the asset and children, or asset and descendants	01:02
+perlDreamer	and since calendar always copies children, copy only asset does not work	01:03
@Haarg	yeah	01:03
+perlDreamer	but I don't know why preaction did that in the first place, so I was hesitant to do anything with that	01:03
@Haarg	it may just be best to remove the extra handling calendar has	01:03
+perlDreamer	except the skipAutoCommit you mentioned?	01:04
@Haarg	no, the default duplicateBranch includes that	01:04
+perlDreamer	okay, now I'm officially confused	01:04
+perlDreamer	in the 7.6 branch, Calendar's duplicate does not do skip auto commit	01:04
@Haarg	yeah, i don't know why it works in 7.6	01:05
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+perlDreamer	I'll start by tracing it in 7.5, and then comparing against 7.6	01:18
+perlDreamer	There has to be a good reason for it	01:18
+perlDreamer	Your unconscious programming skills are quite envious, Haarg :)	01:19
@Haarg	it's probably the hasBeenCommitted check	01:20
@Haarg	the newly created parent hasn't been committed	01:20
@Haarg	so it doesn't get an auto commit workflow	01:20
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8760 /experimental/Automat/lib/Automat/Site.pm: redundant line	01:24
+perlDreamer	that would make sense	01:24
+perlDreamer	but don't we _want_ it to auto commit?	01:24
+perlDreamer	the problem is that it's going through a manual commit	01:25
+perlDreamer	or do I have it backwards?	01:25
@Haarg	we don't want it to autocommit	01:26
@Haarg	because for copy, the commit process is handled elsewhere	01:26
+perlDreamer	so, if I backport just hasBeenCommitted and use that, it would fix it	01:26
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@Haarg	maybe, but i think fixing duplicate would be better	01:27
@Haarg	fixing/eliminating	01:27
+perlDreamer	okay, then let me play it all back	01:27
+perlDreamer	well, there's a problem with that, too	01:27
+perlDreamer	if we eliminate duplicate, then in the Asset Manager when you copy a calendar, it won't copy all the events like it does now	01:28
+perlDreamer	I'm cool with that, as long as y'all are okay with the new behavior	01:28
@Haarg	for now keeping the existing behaviour is probably better	01:29
+perlDreamer	so in 7.5, I'll just add the skipAutoCommit	01:30
+perlDreamer	and in 7.6...?	01:30
+perlDreamer	nuke dupe?	01:30
@Haarg	that seems ok	01:30
@Haarg	also, i think calendar (7.5) should have a duplicateBranch method	01:31
+perlDreamer	what does it need to override in the one from AssetVersioning?	01:32
+perlDreamer	uh, AssetBranch	01:32
@Haarg	the one is AssetBranch duplicates children	01:32
@Haarg	since duplicate already will be doing that	01:32
@Haarg	duplicateBranch should not	01:32
+perlDreamer	That seems backwards to me.	01:33
@preaction	I HATE THE CALENDAR	01:33
@preaction	i just thought i should mention	01:33
@Haarg	how so?	01:33
@Haarg	in 7.6, we're eliminating duplicate, so it isn't an issue anymore	01:34
+perlDreamer	In a perfect world, duplicate branch would copy children, and duplicate would only duplicate the calendar.	01:34
@Haarg	which is what we want to do in 7.6	01:34
+perlDreamer	exactly	01:34
+perlDreamer	but didn't you just say that in 7.5, duplicate branch should _not_ duplicate events?	01:34
@Haarg	no	01:35
+perlDreamer	(03:31:59 PM) Haarg: duplicateBranch should not	01:35
+perlDreamer	I'm probably taking that out of context	01:35
@Haarg	in 7.5, Calendar::duplicateBranch should not duplicate children itself	01:35
@Haarg	it should just let duplicate copy the children	01:35
+perlDreamer	I see	01:35
+perlDreamer	that makes more sense	01:36
+perlDreamer	thanks for straightening me out	01:36
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+perlDreamer	is it safe to commit, Haarg?	01:42
@Haarg	yes	01:42
@Haarg	i'm working on test failures	01:43
+perlDreamer	we haven't had any automated smoke tests in two days.	01:46
+perlDreamer	do you want some help with the tests?	01:46
@preaction	it's been more than two days	01:47
@preaction	the SVN version is broken for some unknown reason	01:47
+perlDreamer	yeah, but the stable branch was working up until the 30th of November	01:47
@preaction	now that's not working either? god...	01:48
+perlDreamer	testing has high costs in maintenance	01:48
@Haarg	i think i have the tests basically dealt with	01:49
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8761 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (2 files in 2 dirs): fix duplicate handling by the Calendar.	01:50
@rizen	perlDreamer, do you have 7.6 checked out?	01:50
+perlDreamer	I have an up to date copy from SVN. Is that what you mean?	01:51
@rizen	yeah	01:51
@rizen	go to the admin console	01:51
+perlDreamer	let me switch over to 7.6 form 7.5	01:51
@rizen	is it hosed for you?	01:51
+perlDreamer	Admin console in the admin bar is okay	01:53
+perlDreamer	admin console from an operation, however, looks messed up	01:53
+perlDreamer	I'm missing the admin bbar	01:53
+perlDreamer	but from other places it looks fine, like from User	01:55
+perlDreamer	groups is okay	01:56
+perlDreamer	so offhand I'd say it's just the AssetManager and admin console/admin bar together	01:57
+perlDreamer	Haarg, Calendar buttoned up in both branches.	02:04
+perlDreamer	phew	02:04
+perlDreamer	rizen, do you have more 7.6 questions?	02:07
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CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8762 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs):	02:19
CIA-41	WebGUI: Fix Calendar copy behavior. By default, duplicate will only copy	02:19
CIA-41	WebGUI: the Calendar. duplicateBranch must be called to copy it _and_ its	02:19
CIA-41	WebGUI: children.	02:19
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@rizen	sorry pd, had to take care of some stuff quick	02:30
@rizen	for me, the admin console wrapper is fubarred everywhere	02:31
@rizen	almost like the css is missing	02:31
@rizen	actually, it's a js error:	02:31
@rizen	Can't find variable: initAdminConsole	02:31
+perlDreamer	let me double check that I'm up to date	02:32
+perlDreamer	yep, fully up at 8762	02:32
+perlDreamer	rizen, I'm about 10 minutes away from a bugfix for Tavis. Let me wrap it up and I'll help look at the adminConsole.	02:34
@rizen	you don' t need to i was just trying to see if it's a local thing or not	02:35
@rizen	if you're not seeing the problem, then it must be on my box	02:35
+perlDreamer	which workflow should collateral uploaded through the RTE image manager use	02:38
+perlDreamer	should it be autocommitted?	02:38
@Haarg	should be the same as anywhere else i would think	02:38
@Haarg	i'm doing the 7.6.5 release right now btw	02:40
+perlDreamer	I'm working in 7.5, I'll hold off forward porting 'til you're clear	02:40
+perlDreamer	right now the image manager does an addChild, but no kind of commit processing	02:40
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8763 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/Form/Textarea.pm t/Form/Textarea.t):	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: use proper method of formatting text for display in Textarea form	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: control	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8764 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Session/ (Form.pm ErrorHandler.pm): Make sure SQL parameters are stringified (for overloaded entries) before converting to json for debug output	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8765 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/FormValidator.pm: FormValidator doesn't need to handle defaults, the Forms API already does that	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8766 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/HTML.pm): fixed: filtering of rich text areas very slow for large content	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8767 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fixed: international characters are corrupted on export	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8768 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Search/Index.pm: don't need to decode content before indexing it, it's already decoded	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8769 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 6 dirs): removing WSClient	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8770 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey/SurveyJSON.pm: fix some POD errors	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8771 /WebGUI/ (t/Asset/File.t lib/WebGUI/Storage.pm t/Macro/Thumbnail.t): some fixes after Storage and Storage::Image merge	02:44
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8772 /WebGUI/docs/create.sql: preparing for 7.6.5 release	02:44
+perlDreamer	The WSClient is dead?	02:46
@Haarg	we aren't supporting it anymore	02:47
@Haarg	it'll get its own repo like SQL Form	02:47
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+perlDreamer	what to do with WSClient bugs in the tracker?	02:52
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@Haarg	well, if we can fix them in 7.5 that would be nice	03:04
@Haarg	but it is so painful to work with that i'd consider them very low priority	03:05
+perlDreamer	gotcha	03:11
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8773 /experimental/Automat/sbin/ (findSites.pl createSitesForServer.pl): bringing sites from servers into automat	03:14
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8774 /releases/WebGUI_7.6.5-beta: Release 7.6.5-beta	03:14
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8775 /experimental/use-at-own-risk.txt: use at your own risk	03:14
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CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8776 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): preparing for 7.6.6 dev	03:41
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+perlDreamer	rizen: Did you find out what's up with Admin Console on your box?	05:05
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8777 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Wobject/Survey/SurveyJSON.t: Add wide character JSON encoding test.	05:06
@preaction	would a report that only gets updated by a workflow activity be a useful thing?	05:10
@preaction	so the user could navigate the report, but the data inside it is only updated by a workflow activity at a certain schedule (configured in the asset)	05:10
+perlDreamer	sure	05:11
+perlDreamer	Is this a DataForm feature?	05:15
+perlDreamer	uh, DataTable	05:15
@preaction	no, this would be added to the Report framework	05:17
@preaction	which is... damnit... kind of similar to the DataTable	05:18
@preaction	no, it's not. DataTable is for DataSources, which may be mutable	05:33
@preaction	Report is for immutable data	05:33
CIA-41	WebGUI: patspam * r8778 /branch/WebGUI_flux/ (321 files in 56 dirs):	05:33
CIA-41	WebGUI: Merge branch '7.6.5-beta' into flux	05:33
CIA-41	WebGUI: Conflicts:	05:33
CIA-41	WebGUI: lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm	05:33
@rizen	perlDreamer: i think you broke plainblack.com	05:50
@rizen	=)	05:50
@preaction	i don't know if it was him, the extra head tags are indeed there	05:50
@rizen	huh?	05:51
@rizen	i'm talking about style templates	05:51
@rizen	and technically, it's not him that broke it	05:51
@rizen	but rather steve, for designing the site like that	05:51
@preaction	oh, i was trying to figure out why the SWFObject script was erroring, i suppose i never actually looked at the HTML being spit out	05:52
@rizen	but that means that when we push this upgrade out to the public we should try to "fix" their borked templates for them	05:52
@rizen	that is, if this is indeed the error	05:53
@preaction	http://www.plainblack.com/home/homepage?func=edit;proceed=manageAssets <- this has some Extra <head> elements, but they aren't in the HTML being generated	05:56
@rizen	ah well that would do it	05:56
@rizen	i'm also restoring an old copy of the pb database	05:56
@rizen	to see if there are any style templates that have a headblock with something in it	05:57
@rizen	boom	06:03
@rizen	you are a genius	06:03
@preaction	but what was the fix? i can't find anywhere these things were supposed to get included in any way	06:03
@preaction	nm, i see it now	06:05
@rizen	the worst part about it is that i think i may have inadvertantly told him to remove that line	06:07
@rizen	because i didn't understand what he was asking me	06:08
@rizen	anyway...all better. back to watching WALL-E	06:08
+perlDreamer	woe is me	06:13
+perlDreamer	what do we need to do to fix the code, preaction and rizen?	06:13
@preaction	perlDreamer: i believe it's all fixied now	06:14
@preaction	i removed the two instances from processStyle, and JT added it back to prepareView	06:14
SDuensin	Do you people ever sleep?	06:14
+perlDreamer	sleep?	06:15
+perlDreamer	preaction can't sleep, it's in his contract	06:15
SDuensin	Yea. It's the dark part between bugs.	06:15
+perlDreamer	and I've got a business to launch, so I'm trying to stay busy	06:15
@preaction	i've been there ... once...	06:15
SDuensin	Me too, bud. I hear that.	06:15
@preaction	there were people talking	06:15
@preaction	i didn't like them	06:15
SDuensin	preaction needs to sleep. I'm going to bug him tomorrow. :-)	06:16
@preaction	oh no, i'll be up bright and squirrelly in meetings	06:16
+perlDreamer	preaction: with those code changes, will other views also get extraHeadTags?	06:17
+perlDreamer	or only view?	06:17
@preaction	perlDreamer: okay... how did this EVER work before?	06:17
SDuensin	Well, I'm going to bed. This PB stuff is stressing me out. I need my beauty rest so I can do a good job tomorrow. Unlike today.	06:18
+perlDreamer	SDuensin, good night. Hack on tomorrow.	06:18
SDuensin	I will. I'm still super-excited to get to do this!	06:18
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8779 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm: readded a line that i think i accidentally told colin to remove	06:19
CIA-41	WebGUI: doug * r8780 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (Asset/Wobject.pm Asset.pm): cleaning up the rest of the extra head tags	06:19
CIA-41	WebGUI: doug * r8781 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (Asset/Wobject.pm Asset.pm): dum dum dum dum dum	06:19
@preaction	but doesn't this mean that they'll get added twice by view?	06:21
+perlDreamer	possibly	06:21
+perlDreamer	probably	06:21
+perlDreamer	I'll fire it up and check	06:22
+perlDreamer	yup, it comes out twice	06:27
@preaction	yay!	06:28
+perlDreamer	Do we fix it tonight, or tomorrow?	06:38
* perlDreamer votes for tomorrow, when fingers are fresh and heads are not befuddled		06:39
@preaction	yes, tomorrow	06:40
@preaction	when testing can be written so this little mishap doesn't hap again	06:40
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CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8782 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs):	07:12
CIA-41	WebGUI: Make copy use safe references.	07:12
CIA-41	WebGUI: Add tests for remove, and copy.	07:12
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wgGuest71	Hi All	12:43
wgGuest71	hope someone here can help me	12:43
wgGuest71	embedding perl in pages - tried the MasonScript - seems to be a bit outdated	12:44
wgGuest71	anyone had any luck with this	12:44
wgGuest71	just need to be guided in the right direction	12:44
BartJol	sorry, I can't help you	12:45
wgGuest71	no prob	12:48
wgGuest71	tx for reply	12:48
BartJol	most people here live in the US and willl wake up in three to 4 hours	12:50
BartJol	so you might wanna try again later	12:50
wgGuest71	much appreciated, Ill do that	12:50
BartJol	glad to be some sort of help	12:54
CIA-41	WebGUI: yung * r8783 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Matrix.pm: matrix bugfixes and code improvements	13:09
wgGuest71	another question if I may, I went to the bazaar, and wanted to buy the latest version of ruling webui, but I don't see it there. Am I looking at old forums? Does this manual still exist?	13:23
wgGuest71	not bazaar I mean this link https://www.plainblack.com/store/	13:29
wgGuest71	should I be looking at the developers guide?	13:30
BartJol	wgGuest71: well you have the primer that you can download	13:52
BartJol	but for more explanation of programming and the use of the api, the developers guide is the thing	13:52
BartJol	so it depends on what you wana do	13:54
wgGuest71	gone through that, want to get more into the nitty gritty, and in the forums ruling Webgui was mentioned, the manual I got is for 5.4 though, do not sure if that has changed	13:55
BartJol	if you have a 7.x version, you can consider ruling WebGUI as obsolete	13:55
BartJol	there has been many changes	13:56
BartJol	I think that the content managers guide is most similar to ruling WebGUI	13:56
wgGuest71	awesome, so a purchase of the content guide and the developers guide will be most valuable.	14:26
wgGuest71	once again, thanx for the info	14:26
BartJol	That's my opinion, but as long your not a designer, those two boomks should do the trick	14:28
wgGuest71	tx	14:28
BartJol	np	14:29
CIA-41	WebGUI: yung * r8784 /branch/yung-thingy-rfe/ (2 files in 2 dirs): added rfe #w9099: Thingy field-copy function	15:10
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CIA-41	WebGUI: martin * r8785 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fixed: #8775: Miscount in number of replies in CS Thread.	17:05
SDuensin	Greetings.	17:06
+MrHairgrease	Greasings!	17:06
SDuensin	No, no greasing yet. Not made it to McDonalds.	17:08
BartJol	I understood that all american food is greasy	17:08
SDuensin	Not all. Just the good stuff. :-)	17:11
+MrHairgrease	when you fix something for 7.5.35 and then forward port it to 7.6 does it have to be in both the 7.3.35 and 7.6 changelog?	17:19
@preaction	MrHairgrease: no, just the 7.5 changelog	17:24
@preaction	i believe we'll merge the changelogs when 7.6 goes stable	17:24
@perlmonkey2	preaction: ack, I've been putting everything in both changelogs. Oh well.	17:25
+MrHairgrease	ok, makes sense	17:26
+MrHairgrease	i guess it would look weird to see the same bug fixed twice	17:26
+MrHairgrease	very back to the future	17:26
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+perlDreamer	I'd like to point out that BartJol should be voiced because he's PBWG.	18:06
+perlDreamer	Also, famous, talented, good looking and generous.	18:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: martin * r8786 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Merging fixed #8775: Miscount in number of replies in CS Thread.	18:06
+perlDreamer	and, should Koen get out of control, he's "our last, best hope".	18:06
* SDuensin just started watching B5. Very timely.		18:07
BartJol	perlDreamer: uh?	18:11
+perlDreamer	just blush and accept the compliment, dude	18:11
BartJol	ok, thanks	18:12
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SDuensin	preaction / Haarg - When one of you has some time, I need a bit of guidance.	18:15
@preaction	SDuensin: sup?	18:15
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@preaction	BartJol: rejoin the channel please?	18:16
SDuensin	I got your mail last night (dunno WTF happened before). Basically you need the old thing ported to the new thing?	18:16
BartJol	preaction: why?	18:17
BartJol	I'm here	18:17
@preaction	BartJol: so that the server can auto-voice you and i can see that it works correctly	18:17
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@preaction	er...	18:17
@preaction	breathless anticipation!	18:18
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+bartjol	preaction: it worked	18:19
@preaction	yay!	18:19
+MrHairgrease	welcome to the big boys bart	18:20
+bartjol	joohooo!	18:21
SDuensin	hehe	18:21
+bartjol	dec 2008 is my nonth for WebGUI it seems	18:21
+bartjol	and that while I just messed up a upgrade process, so Koen had to stay longer than he wanted...	18:22
+bartjol	or is bugging Koen considered positive?	18:23
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+MrHairgrease	sure why not	18:25
CIA-41	WebGUI: ernesto * r8787 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/lib/WebGUI/ (4 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed)	18:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: * Make WebGUI work with any kind of LDAP URI (ldap, ldaps and ldapi).	18:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: The fix consists on making every connection use the URI _without_ the base.	18:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: This requires rebuilding the URI parameters using scheme, host and port as	18:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: taken from the original URI stored in WebGUI's or User Preferences,	18:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: passing it as_string() to Net::LDAP->new(), and stripping any other	18:34
CIA-41	WebGUI: parameter to the constructor.	18:34
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+MrHairgrease	time to go	19:00
+MrHairgrease	later	19:00
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+bartjol	bye from me too	19:02
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SDuensin	Ok, explain this one. I was working on a little Nokia 800 tablet last night. Somehow, I hurt my pinkie! It still hurts like hell! Capital letters are painful!	19:07
+perlDreamer	It's all that java typing with no sigils	19:13
+perlDreamer	It's weakened your sinews	19:13
SDuensin	Apparently.	19:13
SDuensin	Seriously. It hurts like hell.	19:14
SDuensin	I need one of those foot pedal shift key things.	19:14
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rjacobsen	good afternoon all	19:24
SDuensin	hey	19:24
rjacobsen	I was wondering if maybe there were some scripts available to where I could use the script to import a package to multiple sites within webgui and one to delete multiple assets in webgui	19:25
rjacobsen	uploading packages to 50+ websites is taking forever.....	19:26
SDuensin	Sounds like something that'd be handy. Don't know of such a beast though.	19:26
rjacobsen	it would be awesome	19:27
rjacobsen	how much would I have to pay for someone to write me such a script?	19:27
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8788 /experimental/Automat/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Automat.pm: fixed search	19:27
rjacobsen	guess no one wants to make any money :(	19:31
SDuensin	Hehe	19:32
@preaction	rjacobsen: if you want a quote from plainblack, send an e-mail to sales@plainblack.com	19:32
rjacobsen	well is there not such a script available?	19:32
@preaction	rjacobsen: alternatively, fill out this form: https://www.plainblack.com/store/services/development/portfolio/quote	19:32
+perlDreamer	rjacobsen, no there isn't	19:32
rjacobsen	gotcha	19:33
rjacobsen	ok then	19:33
@preaction	rjacobsen: you can look in the https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/tools section, i think the packages one might be there	19:33
+perlDreamer	it is	19:42
+perlDreamer	does demo.webgui.org have several hosts on the same ip, or is it clustered?	19:46
@preaction	several hosts on the same IP	19:47
@preaction	demo.webgui.org is plainblack.com afaik	19:47
+perlDreamer	I'm working on Tavis's RTE upload problem. The problem is that it sometimes grabs a different site cookie with the same IP. That gives it a different session, and therefore scratch vars and version tag.	19:47
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@preaction	uh... so it's a site configuration problem?	19:48
+perlDreamer	I think so. The only way I can duplicate it is to access my dev site via an IP address, versus the site's name	19:49
+perlDreamer	this bug could go all the way back into apache, or mod_perl, or site config	19:49
+perlDreamer	I'll make sure the HTTP environment vars are the same for all requests	19:50
+perlDreamer	well, I found the bug and it's not Apache or mod_perl	19:56
+perlDreamer	but I'm still confused	19:56
+perlDreamer	Form::HTMLArea used $session->url->getSiteName to get the name of the site	19:57
+perlDreamer	accessing it by IP address isn't in the list of sitenames, so it uses the first sitename	19:57
+perlDreamer	that's a different site from the original, so you get a new session	19:57
+perlDreamer	(via a different cookie)	19:57
+perlDreamer	but that doesn't fully explain the demo site yet	19:58
@preaction	perhaps something to do with gateways and using multiple demo sites at the same time?	19:58
@preaction	the cookie is named the same, and maybe it's only linked to the domain and not the path?	19:58
@Haarg	demo.webgui.org is on cold	19:59
+perlDreamer	that sounds right, preaction. But then I'd expect it to be random. And this is very, very repeatable.	20:00
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@Haarg	perlDreamer, what are the steps to reproduce this?	20:03
+perlDreamer	Log in as admin	20:03
+perlDreamer	Edit anything with an HTMLarea	20:04
+perlDreamer	Hit the Insert WebGUI Image button	20:04
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8789 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/lib/WebGUI/ (4 files in 3 dirs): reverting 8787 due to compile errors	20:04
+perlDreamer	upload an image	20:04
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+perlDreamer	Hit the select button next to the image	20:04
+perlDreamer	In the thumbnail error, you will see the string ERROR	20:04
+perlDreamer	If you leave the edit screen, you'll see that a version tag was created	20:05
@Haarg	hrm	20:05
@Haarg	i'm not seeing an error	20:05
@Haarg	on a demo site	20:05
+perlDreamer	I've done it on several demo sites over the last few days	20:05
+perlDreamer	and, I can do it on a dev site, if you access it via IP address rather than site name	20:06
+perlDreamer	maybe it's tied to a particular browser?	20:06
+perlDreamer	this is the demo site I'm using now: http://demo.plainblack.com/demo1228325826_275/home/welcome?func=edit	20:07
@Haarg	i see	20:07
@Haarg	it works on demo.webgui.org	20:07
@Haarg	but not on demo.plainblack.com	20:07
@Haarg	i could fix this on the server side probably	20:11
@Haarg	i'm just not certain if that is the best fix	20:11
+perlDreamer	There's an alternate fix, I think. I just can't try it on a demo server	20:11
@Haarg	it should probably be adjusted to use urls that are relative to / instead of having the full url	20:11
+perlDreamer	Inside Form/HTMLArea, I took out the getSiteUrl part of the image url	20:11
@Haarg	yeah	20:11
+perlDreamer	okay, I'll commit that	20:12
@Haarg	it's just an issue with having two different domains for one site	20:12
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CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8790 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Form/HTMLArea.pm): have imageTree use relative urls to handle sites with multiple sitenames	20:31
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8791 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Form/HTMLArea.pm):	20:31
CIA-41	WebGUI: Remove 7.5.34 changelog that snuck into the 7.6 branch.	20:31
CIA-41	WebGUI: Forward port imageTree thumbnail relative url fix for sites with multiple hostnames	20:31
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SquOnk	Hi	20:49
@preaction	hello there	20:49
SquOnk	I saw my patch 8787 to 7.5 reverted because of compilation errors. I wonder what those compilation errors are, since I'm not seeing them.	20:50
SquOnk	(The patch is in production in my servers since monday, that's why I'm curious)	20:50
@preaction	perlDreamer: you reverted that patch, can you fill in?	20:51
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+perlDreamer	All my logs are wiped. I do that when working on bugs to keep the paging down	20:52
+perlDreamer	I'll merge that patch back in later today, and try to recreate it	20:52
+perlDreamer	I remember missing my's, and issues like that	20:52
@preaction	i'll run the syntax_check.t against that revision	20:52
SquOnk	preaction: Please do, and let me know what's wrong. As I said, this patch is in production with no errors or warnings at all.	20:53
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wgGuest15	Hi All, I had a question earlier about embedding perl in an html page layout in webgui. I tried using MasonScript to no evail. It seems a bit out-dated, can anyone steer me in the right direction?	20:55
wgGuest15	your response is much appreciated in advance	20:56
@preaction	SquOnk, perlDreamer: looks like syntaxCheck.t passes	20:57
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8792 /experimental/Automat/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Automat.pm: better linking between objects	20:57
+perlDreamer	SquOnk, I owe you an apology then	20:57
+perlDreamer	Would you like me to add the patch back in?	20:57
SquOnk	perlDreamer: Yes, please.	20:58
SquOnk	perlDreamer: ...so it makes it into the next release.	20:58
@preaction	wgGuest15: firstly i would not suggest what you're trying. secondly, look for PerlOutputFilterHandler maybe?	20:59
SquOnk	perlDreamer: Hold on.	21:00
SquOnk	perlDreamer: JT wrote an e-mail to me. And he's right about me not being aware of the feature freeze, so I guess the patch should not be committed yet. I need to do a better job :-)	21:00
+perlDreamer	SquOnk, it's probably just a matter of timing.	21:01
SquOnk	perlDreamer: It always is :-)	21:01
wgGuest15	preaction:Tx for the response, why would you advice against using the method (embedding)? I will do a bit more reading on what you have recommended	21:02
@preaction	wgGuest15: because putting Perl code in that layer opens up a whole bunch of security holes	21:02
@preaction	wgGuest15: you could try making a new template plugin for mason, that might work better and be more secure	21:02
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apeiron	Well, you could switch over to the TT plugin and use its PERL directive.... but not advisable regardless.	21:05
@preaction	that might be better than anything i've yet suggested	21:06
wgGuest15	preaction:I agree that would be the best approach. However, I am pressed for time at the moment (aren't we all these days) and have a deadline to meet.	21:06
Petruchio	Hey, anyone here work for Plain Black?	21:07
@preaction	Petruchio: all the ops here	21:07
Petruchio	Ah.	21:07
wgGuest15	Let me look into the TT plugin, thanx for the assistance.	21:07
wgGuest15	btw, Great product, really like what I have seen so far	21:08
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+perlDreamer	In the rich editor, enabling the buttons in the toolbars is sometimes not enough to enable functionality.	21:14
@preaction	that's... kinda weird	21:14
+perlDreamer	For example, you may also have to update the Valid Elements property for the rich text editor	21:14
@preaction	hate the tinymce. i want to go to the YUI one	21:14
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/8774	21:14
+perlDreamer	I'm thinking about just updating the hover help for the toolbars sections	21:15
+perlDreamer	but I'm wondering if instead I should change the default forum editor to allow all elements let the toolbar control what's going on	21:15
+perlDreamer	any suggestions from the PB crew?	21:15
@preaction	i think just updating the help and docs	21:17
@preaction	or... what if enabling the button would also add (using a bit of client-side scripting) the element(s) to the list of enabled elements?	21:17
@preaction	perhaps with a small pop-up warning saying "oh, btw, i just did this"	21:17
+perlDreamer	that sounds like more than I want to do in 7.5	21:18
@preaction	not sure i like the idea, seems overly complicated	21:18
* perlDreamer goes running		21:32
+perlDreamer	We're under three pages of bugs now	21:32
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WebGUI	hi there	21:35
ckotil	Any plan to allow multiple groups be allowed to view/edit an asset? without doing groups of groups	21:35
@preaction	ckotil: patspam has been working on a thing called "Flux" that might handle what you want. otherwise there's no plan for it yet. perhaps an RFE for it?	21:35
ckotil	cool. yeah, might as well	21:36
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8793 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (2 files in 2 dirs):	21:54
CIA-41	WebGUI: Note that adding an RTE toolbar button does not guarantee that	21:54
CIA-41	WebGUI: the functionality it provides will work. The Valid Elements	21:54
CIA-41	WebGUI: property also needs to be updated.	21:54
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8794 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): update RTE docs for adding toolbar buttons AND Valid Elements	21:54
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+perlDreamer	snapcount, for your WSClient patch, what do you want the attribution to be in the change log?	23:56
+perlDreamer	Roy Johnson, ExploreOS?	23:56
+snapcount	huh?	23:59
+snapcount	oh	23:59
--- Day changed Thu Dec 04 2008
+snapcount	actually HD Publishing Group, Inc.	00:00
+perlDreamer	since you provided a patch	00:00
+perlDreamer	will do	00:00
+snapcount	or Death, Inc.	00:00
+perlDreamer	not Guitar Hero Wannabe's of Florida ?	00:00
+snapcount	hahah	00:00
+snapcount	I have not given up on our plot to take over all of the nation's Papa Johns	00:01
+perlDreamer	with the new Shop, it will be easier	00:01
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+snapcount	thanks for getting that in Colin, I appreciate it	00:03
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+perlDreamer	You're welcome.	00:03
+perlDreamer	I won't miss the WSClient, but I'm glad you find it useful.	00:04
+snapcount	we have a little SOAP service that returns sales statistics	00:04
+snapcount	and we use it in the footer of our intranet to show everyone how we're doing for the day	00:04
@preaction	my question is, we're getting rid of it, sure, but can it be fixed at all?	00:06
@preaction	i mean, is it possible, given the scope of the thing?	00:06
+snapcount	well it works for our specific instance with that patch	00:07
+snapcount	it probably won't work for anything else though lol	00:07
+snapcount	perlDreamer I'm coming to OSCon this year	00:07
+snapcount	and the WUC	00:07
+perlDreamer	cool. I wish I could	00:07
+perlDreamer	OSCON, that is	00:07
+perlDreamer	but it's in California in 2009	00:08
+snapcount	yeah that's still close man	00:08
+snapcount	=)	00:08
+snapcount	road trip!	00:08
+perlDreamer	we'll see how perlDreamer does this year in business	00:08
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CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8795 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (2 files in 2 dirs): patch to stop WSClient from dying if there is no data to show	00:24
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8796 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fixed: international characters are corrupted on export	00:24
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8797 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/HTML.pm): fixed: filtering of rich text areas very slow for large content	00:24
CIA-41	WebGUI: graham * r8798 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/lib/WebGUI/FormValidator.pm: FormValidator doesn't need to handle defaults, the Forms API already does that	00:24
+snapcount	so is using && not PBP or is that one of them numerical -vs- string operator deals perlDreamer?	00:35
+perlDreamer	I was lazy and my fingers typed and	00:36
+snapcount	oh ok haha	00:36
+perlDreamer	I didn't download and apply the patch	00:36
+snapcount	I don't get to program as much anymore	00:36
+perlDreamer	that's a bummer	00:36
+snapcount	wanted to make sure I'm not slacking on my Perl =)	00:36
+perlDreamer	I'm programming a lot, so it probably balances out	00:36
+perlDreamer	why doesn't mysql like `users.userId` ?	00:37
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apeiron	snapcount, && , and are different, to be used in different cases. They differ in terms of predence, meaning that expressions bound to && are evaluated first.	00:40
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+perlDreamer	rizen: would it be very bad to have the Asset Aspect comment text area use WebGUI::HTML::format so that newlines are obeyed, and other unsafe characters are commented out?	00:45
@rizen	no, i thought i made it do that	00:45
@rizen	go ahead	00:46
+perlDreamer	thanks :)	00:46
@rizen	not on save though...on display	00:46
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+perlDreamer	right, only on display	00:51
+perlDreamer	I've never looked in the Aspect code before. It's very clean.	00:59
Mech422	yawn morning all	01:01
Mech422	perlDreamer: I'm finally getting back to work after the holidays, and had a question..	01:02
+perlDreamer	ask away, Mech422	01:02
Mech422	perlDreamer: I need to make a change so that editing a user profile fires a work flow event..	01:02
+perlDreamer	I remember this talk...	01:03
Mech422	and preaction mentioned there was some code in place already to fire an event when the admin made changes	01:03
Mech422	right...	01:03
Mech422	so I'm looking in /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Account	01:03
Mech422	but I don't see anything in Profile.pm or User.pm that appears to check for admin priviledges or fire an event ?	01:04
+perlDreamer	It would be (or was in) Operation/User.pm	01:04
Mech422	what does 'event firing code' look like in webgui ? ($self->event->first('update') ? Ahh... i'm looking in the wrong spot....	01:04
@rizen	thanks for the compliment perlDreamer	01:05
+perlDreamer	in WebGUI, most forms are two parts	01:05
+perlDreamer	www_{action}	01:05
+perlDreamer	and www_{actionSave}	01:05
+perlDreamer	it's the second that you're looking for in Operation/User.pm	01:05
+perlDreamer	www_editUserSave	01:05
+perlDreamer	look around lines 516	01:06
Mech422	perlDreamer: yeah - I saw code like that in Account.pm and User.pm... I thought those were the ones	01:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8799 /branch/WebGUI_7.5/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Make UserList handle profile fields with spaces in their field names	01:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8800 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): forward porting UserList profile field name bug fix	01:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: colin * r8801 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/AssetAspect/Comments.pm): Have AssetAspect comment format its content as HTML, not text.	01:06
+perlDreamer	there's workflow code for a new user, and an existing user	01:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8802 /experimental/Automat/ (lib/WebGUI/Asset/Automat.pm sbin/getmaildomains.pl): script to link everyone.net mail servers to automat sites	01:06
Mech422	perlDreamer: oh - Operation/User.pm is deprecated...	01:07
Mech422	perlDreamer: it says to use Account::Profile instead	01:07
Mech422	stupid irc client... make that Account: : Profile	01:07
+perlDreamer	sure, but that's where to find the code that you're looking for	01:07
@rizen	you may need to talk to khenn about that...he may have forgotten to put the triggers back in when i was rewriting all the account stuff	01:08
+perlDreamer	then you can add that to Account::Profile to do what you wish	01:08
+perlDreamer	the triggers are still in there	01:08
@rizen	ok	01:08
@rizen	nevermind then	01:08
Mech422	perlDreamer: ahh - ok	01:08
+perlDreamer	line 516	01:08
+perlDreamer	and I don't see any deprecation notices in Operation/User.pm	01:08
+perlDreamer	where are they?	01:08
+perlDreamer	gotta run a quick errand, I should be back in 30 minutes or so	01:09
Mech422	perlDreamer: got it... sweet :-) .. Thanks :-)	01:09
Mech422	perlDreamer: sorry - it was profile.pm that was deprecated	01:10
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Mech422	(my up-arrow (command recall) nabbed the wrong file :-P )	01:10
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+perlDreamer	back	01:29
+perlDreamer	THINGY SUCKS	01:32
Mech422	perlDreamer: eh? I thought thingy was the new 'golden boy' webgui plugin ?	01:33
Mech422	perlDreamer: btw - I think I found a small bug with this event code	01:33
+perlDreamer	oh? Cool! Do share.	01:33
Mech422	perldreamer: in user.pm line 516+/- its firing the runOnAdminCreateUser and runOnAdminUpdateUser events	01:34
Mech422	thing is - it might not be the Admin thats doing the updates	01:35
Mech422	its actually just anyone for which CanEdit($session) is true	01:35
Mech422	(or canAdd($session) is true )	01:36
Mech422	so user 'steve' editing 'steve's user profile would fire the runOnAdminUpdateUser event ?	01:36
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+perlDreamer	Mech422, that's actually by design	01:42
+perlDreamer	there are several groups of people who can edit users through the admin interface	01:42
+perlDreamer	just check out the canAdd and canEdit methods for the details on it	01:43
Mech422	ahh - in that case - I don't need to do anything	01:43
+perlDreamer	no, it should be fine	01:43
Mech422	I can just add a workflow on the runOnAdminUpdateUser event	01:43
+perlDreamer	No.	01:43
Mech422	and it will get fired even if 'steve' modifies 'steve's profile ?	01:43
+perlDreamer	When Steve modifies his own profile, it comes out of Account/Profile.pm	01:44
+perlDreamer	the code in Operation/User.pm is for Admins only	01:44
Mech422	ahh..	01:44
+perlDreamer	so you need to build in a trigger for Account/Profile.pm	01:44
+perlDreamer	and then you'd also add a new setting in Operation/Setting	01:44
Mech422	ok - so should I create a new 'event' in Profile.pm or just use runOnAdminUpdateUser ?	01:44
+perlDreamer	to allow admins to choose which workflow is run	01:45
+perlDreamer	Workflow::Instance->create({})->start is the "event"	01:45
+perlDreamer	now you have to tell it what data to run	01:45
Mech422	ok - I see the @fields stuff for 'workflow' in settings..	01:48
Mech422	I can just add an arbitrary key ( name => 'runOnUpdateUser') there, or is there some 'schema' somewhere that needs it as well ?	01:49
+perlDreamer	to add a new setting, use the settings sub object in $session	01:50
+perlDreamer	$session->setting->add(name, defaultValue);	01:51
+perlDreamer	then, you can add code to Operation/Settings to handle the UI for it	01:51
+perlDreamer	actually, hold on a second	01:51
+perlDreamer	Account plugins can have their own edit screens	01:51
+perlDreamer	it would be better to add the UI code in Account/Profile.pm	01:53
+perlDreamer	so, to review.	01:53
+perlDreamer	1) Build an update-type script that adds the setting to the db	01:53
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+perlDreamer	2) Modify Account/Profile to add the UI to pick the workflow	01:54
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+perlDreamer	3) Modify Account/Profile to add the firing code inside www_editSave, if there are no errors	01:54
Mech422	Hmm ...	01:57
Mech422	this whole db thing is gonna take some getting used to	01:58
Mech422	Do you have some sort of deployment script you use for making sure you don't forget to run lil one-off scripts like this when you deploy a live site ?	01:59
Mech422	or do people just dump and restore the DB when they migrate/deploy a site ?	02:00
+perlDreamer	Mech422, see docs/upgrades/upgrade_v1_v2.pl	02:04
+perlDreamer	also, I'm sure that rizen and crew have provisioning scripts for handling custom code along with merging in new code from the core.	02:05
@rizen	mech422 what do you mean "migrate" / "deploy" a site?	02:06
Mech422	perlDreamer: its nice there's an update skeleton in that dir :-)	02:07
Mech422	rizen: we generally build sites on a 'dev' server, and deploy the finished sites on a seperate production server	02:08
@rizen	interesting	02:08
@rizen	when you say "build" are we talking site content, or code	02:08
Mech422	rizen: also, if we update a site (other then trivial css type changes)	02:08
+perlDreamer	Haarg: did you fix this bug already?	02:09
Mech422	we pull the site back from the production server to a 'dev' server	02:09
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/thingy-next-page-broken-on-initial-page	02:09
Mech422	rizen: typically - both...	02:09
@rizen	Mech422: with webgui i wouldn't recommend using your old model	02:09
Mech422	rizen: mostly its for the code, skinning etc	02:09
@rizen	do all content on the production server all the time	02:09
@rizen	templates are content as far as webgui is concerned	02:09
@rizen	that's why there is a versioning system	02:10
Mech422	rizen: but that generally requires getting some content in just to see how stuff looks/works/etc	02:10
@rizen	again, that's why there's a versioning system	02:10
@rizen	the problem you'll have if you do what you're saying	02:10
@rizen	on anything other than a brochureware site	02:10
@rizen	is syncing content that gets updated on prod	02:10
@rizen	to your dev server	02:10
@rizen	and back	02:10
@rizen	like forums	02:10
@rizen	wiki pages	02:10
@rizen	poll results	02:10
@rizen	etc	02:10
+perlDreamer	user profile data	02:11
Mech422	oh yeah - thats a given	02:11
@rizen	that's why you should do all content changes only on the production server	02:11
Mech422	you don't expect the dev server to stay in sync if your updating a 'live' site	02:11
@rizen	now, if you do have something you want to change on a dev server, make a package from the production server	02:11
@rizen	deploy it on dev	02:11
@rizen	edit	02:11
@rizen	export from dev	02:11
@rizen	and import back into prod	02:11
@rizen	but you shouldn't often need to do that	02:12
@rizen	as far as code changes are concerned...absolutely you should use a dev server	02:12
Mech422	could I update a production site with these user profile changes using that method ?	02:12
+perlDreamer	no	02:12
@rizen	no	02:12
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@rizen	only content is versioned	02:12
@rizen	user accounts and profiles aren't versioned	02:12
@rizen	and therefore isn't packagable	02:12
@rizen	you can only package assets	02:12
+perlDreamer	but you could apply code patches from your dev site to the production site.	02:13
+perlDreamer	but not data, just like rizen said	02:13
Mech422	right - or VCS	02:13
+perlDreamer	sure	02:13
@rizen	we absolutely do sync prod sites down to dev servers so that we can test on "real" data	02:13
@rizen	and in those cases, we just take a backup file (created by the wre) and restore it on the dev server	02:14
@rizen	but we only use dev servers for code changes	02:14
@rizen	testing out content migration processes	02:14
@rizen	new plugins	02:14
@rizen	etc	02:14
Mech422	I'll have to work this out in more detail as I go along... yeah, I don't expect to deal with content that way	02:15
Mech422	I just meant we end up with some 'testing' content on the dev. boxes	02:16
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Mech422	I basically need to come up with a quick and easy way to migrate site code bases from one place to another - sounds like a vcs system plus 'install' script would be the way to go	02:17
+perlDreamer	yes	02:18
Mech422	so I can hg clone myclientsite ; cd myclientsite ; ./setup_webgui ; echo "done - go get lunch" :-)	02:18
Mech422	anyway - gotta add this bit of fluff in before I worry about that	02:19
+perlDreamer	rizen, does the Dev Guide talk about handling custom code?	02:22
Mech422	perlDreamer: not from what I could see.... (as a newb )	02:23
@rizen	i don't think so	02:23
@rizen	i mean it talks about how to create it	02:23
@rizen	but not how to manage it	02:23
@rizen	Mech422 what we do is check out our custom code into a folder in /data	02:23
@rizen	like /data/Automat	02:23
@rizen	then we add /data/WebGUI/sbin/preload.custom	02:24
@rizen	we put that folder in there	02:24
@rizen	so it loads in the code	02:24
@rizen	but is not mixed in with WebGUI	02:24
@rizen	and is still attached to the version control system	02:24
Mech422	that makes sense	02:24
@rizen	so we can just do "cd /data/Automat; svn update"	02:24
@rizen	and yes, we write install / upgrade scripts for those	02:25
Mech422	and then I could keep my 'install' script in there - to do whatever db updates are necessary for the custom code	02:25
@rizen	they are usually in /data/Automat/sbin	02:25
@rizen	for example	02:25
@rizen	exactly	02:25
@rizen	perlDreamer: you're right, i should write a chapter on that	02:26
+perlDreamer	it will give you something to write this year, before the WUC	02:26
@rizen	yeah, i want to put out new versions of all our books before the wuc this year	02:27
@rizen	or rather, release them at the WUC	02:27
@rizen	we're already working on the next design guide	02:27
@rizen	and kristi will be putting out the 7.6 version of the CM guide in february	02:28
@rizen	and the 7.7 version at the WUC	02:28
@rizen	but the commerce, dev, and admin guides should all be updated for the wuc as well	02:29
patspam	perlmonkey2: ping	02:43
+perlDreamer	arrrgh!	02:43
+perlDreamer	User profiling is broken.	02:43
+perlDreamer	It doesn't handle spaces in the field names	02:43
+perlDreamer	it doesn't tell you if you duplicate a field	02:44
@rizen	blame Haarg. he's not here to defend himself	02:53
+perlDreamer	khenn is my usual go to guy.	03:01
+perlDreamer	He always makes me eat my words :)	03:02
+perlDreamer	and he did do the last profile related work with Account	03:02
+perlDreamer	so even though the bugs are in 7.5, he must be responsible for the	03:02
+perlDreamer	m	03:02
@rizen	true, but he can actually defend himself	03:02
@rizen	though i never tell him that	03:02
@rizen	pretty much every conversation i have with him ends with him saying "i hate you"	03:03
@rizen	but in a good way	03:03
+perlDreamer	hate is only orthogonal to love, not an full opposite	03:03
CIA-41	WebGUI: patspam * r8803 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm:	03:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: Survey bug fix - showProgress, showTimeLimit and timeLimit should not be	03:06
CIA-41	WebGUI: stored at the response level (they are global to asset instance)	03:06
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CIA-41	WebGUI: patspam * r8804 /WebGUI/www/extras/wobject/Survey/administersurvey.js:	03:32
CIA-41	WebGUI: Fixed some curly Survey js type casting bugs so that	03:32
CIA-41	WebGUI: questionsOnSectionPage, everyPageText and everyPageTitle work as	03:32
CIA-41	WebGUI: expected.	03:32
CIA-41	WebGUI: patspam * r8805 /branch/WebGUI_flux/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Cherry-picked latest Survey bug fixes from master	03:32
@khenn	I don't accept blame for anything	04:11
@khenn	it's all rizen's fault	04:11
@preaction	heh, we all know whose fault it really is	04:51
@preaction	JAMIE VRBSKY	04:51
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patspam	does the template syntax highlighter resizer work for anyone in any of the recent betas?	05:03
@perlmonkey2	patspam: pong	05:03
@preaction	it's ... weird	05:04
@preaction	you have to click it, then drag mouse, then click to drop it	05:04
patspam	lol, two of use here just went "ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh"	05:05
patspam	use/us	05:05
patspam	perlmonkey2: hey man	05:06
@perlmonkey2	patspam: word yo	05:07
patspam	I'm going to change the <font color="red">*</font> for required fields to use CSS so that it can be skinned	05:07
@perlmonkey2	sounds groovy	05:08
patspam	I was going to ask you something before... oh yeah	05:09
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patspam	showProgress, showTimeLimit and timeLimit were being stored at the response level, which was kinda confusing if you changed them at the asset level and then wondered why some users who were halfway through a survey didn't see the change	05:10
patspam	i switched them over to just use $self->get('showProgress') etc.. rather than storing/retrieving at the response level, didn't seem to be any need to have them there	05:10
patspam	just wanted to check there wasn't some subtle ninja reason for having them stored on a per-response basis	05:12
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CIA-41	WebGUI: patspam * r8806 /WebGUI/www/extras/wobject/Survey/ (survey.css administersurvey.js):	06:16
CIA-41	WebGUI: Flagging of invalid Survey fields now uses CSS classes instead of <font> tags	06:16
CIA-41	WebGUI: (for skinnability)	06:16
@perlmonkey2	patspam: I did that so that there wouldn't need to be an additional DB query.	06:17
@perlmonkey2	patspam: I'm not sure why you would change the time limits in the middle of an open survey. And if you did change the time limits, would you want the changes to affect people already in the middle of a survey? Plus you get the extra DB call.	06:22
patspam	yo	06:23
patspam	not following on why there would be an extra db query?	06:23
@perlmonkey2	is the ->get call not hitting the DB? Or are the asset's params loaded into memory upon creation?	06:26
patspam	yeah i think Asset.pm pulls them all in at once	06:27
@perlmonkey2	hmm, it does appear to do so. cool then, sounds good.	06:31
patspam	I think I'm going to have to name my first born child git	06:35
patspam	i just got sent a link to a zoomerang survey, interesting to check out the competition :)	06:37
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CIA-41	WebGUI: translation * r8807 /translations/German/German/ (9 files): Update from translation server	09:56
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sduensin	Hello -- sorta!	17:46
npinansky	Is there a specific API i should query to get the status of workflow instances?	17:51
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@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: do you know anything about those IRS rebate rules? Is that just a tax writeoff?	18:33
+perlDreamer	I think it's a tax rebate.	18:33
@perlmonkey2	That will be brilliant then :D	18:34
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: What's the part that regulates the AC current from the turbine into 110/220? That's another expensive part I might be able to find cheaper.	18:35
+perlDreamer	Good question. It may be called an inverter.	18:36
+perlDreamer	Everything I've done for the past 13 years has been all DC current.	18:36
nuba	is this some space rocket DIY project youre doing in your garage?	18:36
+perlDreamer	No AC or power work.	18:36
+perlDreamer	It's one of the reasons I went into microelectronics	18:36
+perlDreamer	You can't really get hurt by most 5V sources	18:36
+perlDreamer	I worked for Freightliner for 6 months.	18:36
+perlDreamer	I was told once not to touch an insulated stud connected to several large wires	18:37
+perlDreamer	When I asked why, I was told there was 300 amps going through it	18:37
+perlDreamer	it kind of killed my interest in high power applications	18:37
+perlDreamer	I know it's silly, but I have this thing about fatal electrical burns	18:37
* perlDreamer goes to the gym, bbl		18:38
nuba	I can simpathize with that	18:38
sduensin	Gym??? Some geek you are.	18:38
nuba	not with the gym	18:38
nuba	sympathize with the high power thing	18:39
sduensin	Oh yea. I dont play with that crap either.	18:40
sduensin	This frickin drive upgrade is taking too long... I got code to write!	18:41
nuba	on the other hand, being close to these things contribute to less dull moments in the job	18:43
nuba	not to mention internal jokes and pranks like "hey, can you stick this post it there for me, please!" among the staff	18:43
nuba	pretty lively	18:44
sduensin	Hehehe	18:44
nuba	and deadly	18:44
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sduensin	Well, yea. But as long as its funny. :-)	18:46
@perlmonkey2	nuba: this is for a DIY wind turbine project :)	18:55
nuba	whoa	18:55
nuba	impressive	18:55
nuba	this is surely going to blow people's socks off! :D	18:56
@perlmonkey2	nuba: we'll see. My dad and uncle and I are going in on all the welding supplies, but we've yet to find a good enough deal that we all agree on it.	18:58
ckotil	Calendar feed updates are giving me lots and lots of version tags.	19:01
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SDuensin	Back.	19:15
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sandraqu	hi	19:27
SDuensin	howdy	19:27
sandraqu	would someone guide me in using putty to login as a root user via SSH?	19:27
nuba	in the host field, add the name of the machine or ip address	19:28
sandraqu	hi sduensin	19:28
nuba	port is most likely 22	19:28
nuba	connect	19:28
nuba	you'll be asked to confirm the server's key fingerprint	19:28
nuba	then you'll see a blank term window while putty handshakes the server and gets a connection going	19:29
nuba	then you'll be asked to provide the username	19:29
nuba	then the password	19:29
nuba	and if you do it right	19:29
nuba	next thing is a shell prompt at the box	19:30
sandraqu	what if i can't find the root and passwd. i know that sounds sketchy	19:30
nuba	well, if you have a non-root account there	19:30
nuba	you can use that account and use sudo, if it was configured for you	19:30
nuba	by a sysadmin	19:30
sandraqu	could i get the cmd prompt to list them without being logged in?	19:30
nuba	of the box	19:30
nuba	cant get a cmd prompt without valid user account	19:31
sandraqu	is there a generic user/pass?	19:31
nuba	get in touch with the box's sysadmin	19:31
nuba	nope	19:31
sandraqu	is root usually root?	19:31
sandraqu	admin?	19:31
nuba	LOL, no	19:31
nuba	that'd be a security hole like the meteor crater in arizona	19:31
nuba	thres no such ting	19:32
nuba	theres* thing*	19:32
nuba	contact the box's admin	19:32
sandraqu	...	19:32
sandraqu	nuba, short of calling webGUI, i'm one of the admin's	19:33
sandraqu	i just dont' use ssh all that often, especially webGui's	19:33
nuba	oh. well, you should contact the admin who's got the root pwd	19:34
sandraqu	yes	19:34
nuba	and ask him to help you get your account going	19:34
sandraqu	it's a her	19:35
SDuensin	Hers have passwords, too.	19:35
sandraqu	:]	19:35
nuba	be nice to her	19:35
nuba	ask politely	19:36
nuba	she might even give you the root pwd	19:36
nuba	:D	19:36
SDuensin	hehe	19:36
sandraqu	alright	19:36
sandraqu	off i go	19:36
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nuba	that was funny	19:36
nuba	needs to improve his social engineering skills, tho	19:37
SDuensin	Reminds me of the time I got a call from someone on the third floor having problems logging in... In a two story building.	19:38
nuba	SDuensin: want to know the universal 'Hers' password?	19:38
nuba	get close to her and whisper '75% OFF'	19:38
nuba	she'll go mad and overflow	19:38
nuba	:D	19:38
SDuensin	hehe	19:39
SDuensin	Not my wife. She'd be like, "Of what? What are you buying NOW?" :-)	19:39
nuba	actually thats from a standup comedian, dont remember her name now...	19:39
nuba	here, wife agreed yesterday to friendly divorce	19:40
nuba	gotta act swiftly, before she changes her mind..	19:41
SDuensin	Sorry to hear that. I think.	19:41
SDuensin	My wife rocks. (I do buy a lot!)	19:41
nuba	well, it'll be different, but I'm looking forward to it	19:41
nuba	have for some time now	19:41
SDuensin	As long as you're happy, I'm happy for you. :-)	19:42
nuba	we were fragile as a relationship a year ago. then she brought my mother-in-law to live with us. and the rest, they say, is history...	19:42
SDuensin	Ooo. Yea. I can see how that'd be bad.	19:42
SDuensin	Actually, I quite like all my wife's family. They're a lot like mine. Got lucky, I guess.	19:44
nuba	probably	19:44
nuba	if its working, and fulfilling, I'd say 'stick with it'	19:44
SDuensin	That's the plan, man.	19:44
@rizen	i don't even like my own family, let alone my wife's	19:45
nuba	heh	19:45
SDuensin	Although, I need to get this laptop back where it belongs before she gets home. :-D	19:45
SDuensin	rizen lives!	19:45
@rizen	just every other thursday	19:45
@rizen	the rest of the time i'm undead	19:45
SDuensin	Oddly, I believe that.	19:46
SDuensin	"Never could get the hang of thursdays."	19:46
nuba	here we had a regular Saturday From Hell	19:50
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sandraqu	hello again	19:51
nuba	when everybody would be aroun, and things would crash-n-burn	19:51
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sandraqu	i'm in. have a bash prompt. i want to install a macro :]	19:51
sandraqu	do i have to use sudo?	19:51
nuba	that was fast	19:52
SDuensin	Depends on a lot of things.	19:52
SDuensin	Are you in as root?	19:52
sandraqu	dunno	19:52
sandraqu	i'm in though	19:52
nuba	type whoami and press <ENTER>	19:52
sandraqu	the username is not root, if that's your question	19:52
nuba	or id	19:52
sandraqu	it returns the username i provide	19:52
sandraqu	d	19:53
nuba	which was	19:53
nuba	...?	19:53
sandraqu	my bosses	19:53
nuba	well it doesnt matter	19:53
SDuensin	No offense, but I think you need to brush up on your UNIX skills quite a bit before you go installing or altering anything.	19:53
nuba	you would have noticed if it were 'root'	19:53
sandraqu	SDue... don't worry	19:53
sandraqu	i crash things all the time	19:54
sandraqu	crash n learn, is what i like to call it	19:54
nuba	heh, sounds like me back in the days...	19:54
SDuensin	You can do a lot of damage as root. Just be sure the box is expendable. :-)	19:54
sandraqu	so nuba, since your more adventurous, should i just try to install the pm?	19:54
nuba	when I was a wise fool .. er.. guess Im still one... some things never change...	19:54
sandraqu	see if it works?	19:54
nuba	so, sandraqu, first rule of business	19:54
sandraqu	i guess.. is the bash prompt ok?	19:55
nuba	make a backup of what you have	19:55
nuba	so if you crash	19:55
nuba	you can CTRL+Z	19:55
nuba	and make your bosses happy again	19:55
sandraqu	nuba, i won't crash. i am not that much of a newbie, just not an everyday shell user	19:55
nuba	you know how to do a .tar.gz archive	19:55
nuba	?	19:55
nuba	and a mysqldump?	19:55
sandraqu	the system is backup up	19:55
nuba	check that	19:56
sandraqu	check the dummp?	19:56
nuba	you reall y want to watch your back	19:56
nuba	yeah, check if the backups are doing fine	19:56
sandraqu	we pay plainback to watch it for us	19:56
nuba	oh..	19:56
nuba	hey, youre a plainblack customer?	19:56
sandraqu	yes	19:56
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sandraqu	i know they can do this	19:57
nuba	maybe you could have them holding your hand in the process...	19:57
nuba	if its in your support plan	19:57
nuba	check with your customer representative	19:57
sandraqu	ii'm just trying to speed thngs up. if you would prefer.	19:57
sandraqu	alright nuba. you're not helping me anymore. thanks	19:57
nuba	wow youre quick to burn bridges	19:57
nuba	i didnt say that	19:58
sandraqu	oh	19:58
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sandraqu	sorry	19:58
sandraqu	nuba, i'm just trying to do this myself so that i can try out a macro	19:58
sandraqu	i have a monday deadline	19:58
nuba	okay, well what macro are you trying to install?	19:58
sandraqu	i have a guide, but thought to inquire here	19:58
sandraqu	the mail encode one	19:59
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nuba	if i recall correctly, you have to unpack it under /data/WebGUI	19:59
nuba	and enable it on your site's config file	19:59
nuba	which hangs at /data/WebGUI/etc/	19:59
sandraqu	yes	20:00
sandraqu	hmm	20:00
sandraqu	nuba, i'm at the bash prompt though.	20:00
sandraqu	i think i have to do be root	20:00
nuba	'sudo -s' will get you a root's shell, but that depends on how sudo is configured in the box	20:01
nuba	otherwise you can 'su -' too	20:01
nuba	but for this one you'll need to know the root's pwd	20:01
nuba	maybe you dont need the root's pwd	20:01
nuba	check your site's /data/WebGUI/etc/yoursitenamehere.conf	20:02
nuba	ls -l /data/WebGUI/etc/yoursitenamehere.conf	20:02
sandraqu	nuba... it now has a # isntead of $ at the end of the prompt (with sudo 0-s	20:02
nuba	see if its owned by your boss' user	20:02
nuba	type whoami	20:02
sandraqu	root	20:02
nuba	okay, youre root now, as you may have realised	20:02
sandraqu	yes	20:02
nuba	heh	20:02
nuba	so, unpack the macro	20:03
sandraqu	now. i have the pm downloaded locally	20:03
nuba	under /data/WeGUI/	20:03
nuba	if it was nicely packaged	20:03
sandraqu	is there an address i can type in the shell prompt to drag the pm from the bazaar into here?	20:03
nuba	it will extract something under /data/WebGUI/docs	20:03
nuba	for you to read	20:03
nuba	and it will extract the macro itself to /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Macro	20:04
nuba	its the .pm file	20:04
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nuba	if you need to install any additional modules, it should be saying so in the docs that came with it	20:05
nuba	otherwise you may peruse the .pm file yourself and use CPAN to install the modules	20:05
nuba	or just try to use it and see what error messages it'll spill out	20:05
nuba	and a crash-and-learn adept im guessing youll go with choice #3	20:05
sandraqu	nuba. ok. lemme try all those things	20:06
sandraqu	:]	20:06
sandraqu	i'll be back	20:06
SDuensin	We'll be here.	20:06
nuba	I might not be around, but im sure SDuensin will love to hint you in the proper path again, if needed ;D	20:07
nuba	right, SDuensin ?	20:07
SDuensin	Oh sure, run off and leave me.	20:07
nuba	LOL	20:07
+perlDreamer	ckotil, that bug has already been fixed. Check the bug board or changelog for which release it is fixed in.	20:07
+perlDreamer	well, a bug that sounds like that has been fixed.	20:09
sandraqu	hello - is there a way to copy the pm from my local machine onto the server via SSH?	20:09
nuba	scp file.pm me@remote.box.com:/path/there/	20:10
@preaction	sandraqu: yes. man scp	20:10
sandraqu	is there another way?	20:11
nuba	why dont you download it there?	20:12
+perlDreamer	sandraqu, it totally depends on the software installed on both machines	20:12
+perlDreamer	are you working with windows as your desktop?	20:12
nuba	instead of downloadin in your box and then having to figure out how to send it upstream?	20:12
sandraqu	perlD - windows right now	20:12
SDuensin	Might I add...Eww. :-)	20:13
+perlDreamer	sandraqu, nuba is right. It would be easier to download it right to the server.	20:13
nuba	putty has a scp thingy but its not very friendly	20:13
sandraqu	hey - i'd much rather be on my Mac	20:13
+perlDreamer	find the URL for downloading the macro that you want to install	20:13
nuba	do a wget http://url.here/foo.tar.gz	20:13
@preaction	windows has a GUI called "winscp"	20:13
+perlDreamer	exactly	20:13
sandraqu	nuba.. k	20:13
SDuensin	I gotta have Cygwin loaded if I'm in Windows.	20:14
sandraqu	pre - lemme try wget	20:14
sandraqu	Cygwin is good	20:14
nuba	if you dont have wget, try 'curl -O http://etc.etc./file.tgz'	20:14
nuba	ascii: my preferred SCP client on win32 is SSH.com's, but Im not finding it for download in their website anymore.	20:16
+perlDreamer	in perl, what binds tighter, parentheses, or logical OR ?	20:16
nuba	perlDreamer: youre asking for who has precedence?	20:17
ckotil	perlDreamer: ah, thanks	20:17
+perlDreamer	sure, like if I said return (this && that) \|\| other	20:17
nuba	parentheses are always used to override default operator precedence	20:17
@preaction	it would return 1 \|\| other depending on this && that	20:18
sandraqu	nuba - wget did the trick	20:18
sandraqu	be back	20:18
+perlDreamer	preaction, and not (return 1) \|\| other	20:18
@preaction	it's possible it could return that \|\| other	20:18
@preaction	oh, dunno	20:18
+perlDreamer	sounds like more testing is in order	20:19
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nuba	bbiaw	20:22
sandraqu	hello,	20:26
sandraqu	so i have the pm in the pm directory	20:26
sandraqu	now, i nkow i have to add it to some other file	20:26
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+perlDreamer	sandraqu, is the macro.pm file in /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Macro/ ?	20:28
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sandraqu	yes	20:29
+perlDreamer	okay, next check the permissions on the file.	20:29
+perlDreamer	it should have the same permissions as the other files in that directory	20:29
+perlDreamer	otherwise the web server won't be able to open it	20:30
sandraqu	same as most other	20:30
sandraqu	mostly read, unless owner	20:30
+perlDreamer	okay, the next thing to do then, is to edit the webgui config file	20:30
sandraqu	ah	20:31
+perlDreamer	it will be in /data/WebGUI/etc/	20:31
sandraqu		20:31
sandraqu	how many layers out is the from where i was?	20:32
+perlDreamer	is this server using the WRE?	20:33
sandraqu	perl... dunno	20:33
sandraqu	what is WRE?	20:33
+perlDreamer	do you have a directory called /data/wre ?	20:33
+perlDreamer	WRE is the WebGUI Runtime Environment	20:33
+perlDreamer	If you're using a plain black server, it is highly likely that you are	20:34
sandraqu	we are, so let's presume, yes	20:34
+perlDreamer	well, we can check by looking to see if you have that directory I mentioned above	20:34
sandraqu	perl, i do. i went tinot data/webGUI/lib/WebGUI/Macro	20:35
sandraqu	i went out too far though	20:35
sandraqu	i'll begin again	20:35
sandraqu	or - how can i print where i am?	20:35
sandraqu	print directory	20:36
+perlDreamer	try doing ls -ld /data/wre and see what it says	20:36
sandraqu	got its listing	20:36
sandraqu	one	20:36
sandraqu	only one, that is	20:36
+perlDreamer	good, that's what we told it to do	20:36
sandraqu	so im in /data/WebGUI	20:37
+perlDreamer	cd etc	20:37
sandraqu	oh	20:37
sandraqu	oh.. good	20:38
+perlDreamer	inside there should be your webgui config files	20:38
sandraqu	good	20:38
sandraqu	yes	20:38
sandraqu	vi config file?	20:38
+perlDreamer	yes	20:38
+perlDreamer	you know vi. That is very good.	20:38
sandraqu	perlD, enough :]	20:38
sandraqu	i mean, i know it well enough	20:39
sandraqu	i see, so under macros	20:40
sandraqu	brb	20:40
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8808 /experimental/Automat/ (5 files in 3 dirs): mail server management	20:41
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8809 /experimental/Automat/sbin/ (23 files in 2 dirs): a little cleanup in aisle 4	20:41
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8810 /experimental/Automat/sbin/migration/ (updatedns.pl createdns.pl): forgot to add these scripts	20:41
CIA-41	WebGUI: jt * r8811 /experimental/Automat/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Automat.pm: removed legacy code	20:41
+perlDreamer	just add an entry, like the others, for your new macro	20:42
+perlDreamer	be sure to put a comment at the end, unless it is the last macro in the list	20:42
sandraqu	perlD - the first part is the call i make from webGUI? and the latter the actual pm filename (sans the pm). yes?	20:43
+perlDreamer	yes	20:43
+perlDreamer	you should see the one for the gateway macro	20:43
+perlDreamer	as an example	20:43
+perlDreamer	"/" : "Slash_gatewayUrl",	20:44
+perlDreamer	so perhaps like this:	20:44
sandraqu	:wq ?	20:44
sandraqu	write quite	20:44
+perlDreamer	when you're done, yes	20:44
sandraqu	do i get to test now?	20:44
+perlDreamer	no	20:44
+perlDreamer	now you have to restart the server	20:44
+perlDreamer	for that, you need root permissions	20:44
sandraqu	hmm	20:45
sandraqu	i have	20:45
+perlDreamer	okay, first: cd /data/wre/sbin	20:45
sandraqu	i thnk i willnow defer to plainblack	20:45
sandraqu	the server drives many sites	20:45
sandraqu	perlD, what does sbin do?	20:46
+perlDreamer	inside sbin is an environment script which will guarantee you're using the WRE components, instead of the system defaults	20:46
+perlDreamer	as root, you should do: . ./setupEnvironment.sh	20:46
+perlDreamer	that's <dot> <space> <dot> <slash> setupEnvironment.sh	20:47
+perlDreamer	and then you can run a script which will restart the servers	20:48
+perlDreamer	but I agree that deferring to the experts is much safer and wiser	20:48
sandraqu	perlD. thank you for sharing your knowledge with me	20:49
+perlDreamer	you're welcome, sandraqu.	20:49
sandraqu	thanks to nuba too	20:49
sandraqu	and SDuensin	20:49
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sandraqu	no crash yet. lots o learn :]	20:49
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sduensin	Oops. Wrong button!	20:57
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@perlmonkey2	Yay for Paranoid::Debug freak'n me out and making me rush to see if my machine had just been turned into a smtp proxy.	21:06
+perlDreamer	awfully selfish of you not wanting to share your machine ;)	21:07
@perlmonkey2	awful paranoid of me to see a bunch of emails from my machine at the same time I'm trying to install a debugging module.	21:13
@perlmonkey2	hmm, I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that wre 8.5 isn't compatiable with 7.3.17.	21:14
apeiron	hi, JSON 2.0	21:15
sduensin	8.5 is from the FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUTURE!	21:15
@perlmonkey2	apeiron: yeah, nothing made me happier than to look into my logs and get a fun dose of the past with those neat-o JSON errors.	21:15
apeiron	perlmonkey2, I'm pretty sure there's a wiki page somewhere on how to get them to coexist...	21:16
@perlmonkey2	yeah, I probably remember off the top of my head. Just more fun to bitch about it here.	21:16
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nuba	back	21:55
@Haarg	perlmonkey2, if you have to deal with old versions of webgui, i would recommend using the Parse::PlainConfig off backpan instead of from cpan	22:03
@Haarg	there is a way to get the new JSON to play nice with the old code, but it only works to a certain extent	22:04
@perlmonkey2	Haarg: 8.1 with a few force installs made things easier.	22:04
@perlmonkey2	And I really don't need it to work well. Just work well enough that I can run upgrades against it.	22:05
@Haarg	yeah	22:05
@Haarg	i just didn't have a lot of luck with Paranoid	22:05
@Haarg	for json, doing something like sub JSON::autoconv { return shift } sub JSON::skipinvalid { return shift } in preload.perl or similar may be enough to get old code working with JSON 2.0	22:07
@perlmonkey2	hmm	22:08
@perlmonkey2	interesting	22:08
Bernd_	Any German native speaker online?	22:09
Bernd_	I do have a translation question.	22:09
+perlDreamer	Bernd_: Aren't you a native german speaker?	22:14
Bernd_	Yes!!! But still I am unable to come up with an appropriate translation for "tags".	22:15
Bernd_	Is it synonymous with "keywords"?	22:15
Bernd_	What's your opinion, perlDreamer?	22:15
+perlDreamer	Bernd_: tag in the context of "version tag", for example?	22:16
Bernd_	No, tags for photos in the gallery.	22:16
+perlDreamer	in that context, I think keywords is appropriate	22:17
Bernd_	Good. "Keyword" I am able to translate. Thanks!	22:18
+perlDreamer	as to the other usage, what do you call the pieces of paper on clothing that lists the price?	22:18
Bernd_	Etikett?	22:19
Bernd_	Preisschild?	22:19
Bernd_	Etikett might do as well.	22:19
+perlDreamer	version tag would have that kind of context	22:19
Bernd_	But I think it is rather unusual and what confuse most users.	22:19
+perlDreamer	something descriptive stuck onto something else	22:19
Bernd_	would	22:19
Bernd_	I think you got me wrong. I know what a tag is.	22:20
+perlDreamer	oh, sorry	22:21
Bernd_	I just think there is no equivalent word in the context of tagging photos.	22:21
Bernd_	No problem.	22:21
Bernd_	It is an honor to be taught by perlDreamer ;-)	22:21
+perlDreamer	thanks :)	22:21
Bernd_	You are welcome!	22:21
Bernd_	How is hacking going?	22:21
+perlDreamer	it's going okay	22:26
+perlDreamer	I'm staying very busy	22:26
+perlDreamer	fixing bugs, and writing tests for the Survey	22:26
Bernd_	Leave something to the others :-P	22:27
+perlDreamer	unfortunately, there are no lack of bugs to be fixed, or tests to be written	22:27
+perlDreamer	although, perlmonkey2 is making it very hard to find bugs in his code	22:28
@perlmonkey2	yeah right	22:28
@preaction	that jerk	22:28
@preaction	he should make more bugs so they're easier to find	22:28
+perlDreamer	indeed	22:28
Bernd_	Ugh, for a moment I was worried that plain black would run out of work ...	22:28
+perlDreamer	uh, no. They still have other coders to insert bugs.	22:29
Bernd_	Are they doing it on purpose?	22:29
Bernd_	Because I suspect so!	22:29
Bernd_	Or why are there so many?	22:29
+perlDreamer	partially due to the Bazaar, and the Helpdesk applications	22:29
+perlDreamer	they are very new, and people really like to use them	22:30
Bernd_	The HelpDesk is indeed buggy.	22:31
+perlDreamer	it should get a little better today. I fixed a bug in some of the core code that it uses.	22:31
Bernd_	Or was at least.	22:31
+perlDreamer	so at least it will format comments nicely	22:32
Bernd_	Will I be able to open bug views again?	22:32
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Bernd_	Cool, did you include some link-recognition?	22:32
Bernd_	I had suggested that to rizen already.	22:33
+perlDreamer	No, but it will handle newlines, and escape unsafe characters	22:33
Bernd_	There is a CPAN module for doing that.	22:33
+perlDreamer	link recognition would be a nice feature, but that would be an RFE	22:33
Bernd_	Should not be too difficult.	22:33
@perlmonkey2	Haarg: in the upgrades, the site I'm upgrading is using latin1 as table encoding and collation. I should switch that to utf8, right?	22:33
Bernd_	And would be very helpful indeed.	22:33
@Haarg	in the upgrades?	22:33
@perlmonkey2	Haarg: the special upgrade I'm doing.	22:33
topsub	can asset proxy's be relative?	22:34
@Haarg	the 7.5 upgrade should handle that	22:34
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SDuensin	BACK AT LAST!	22:35
+perlDreamer	perlmonkey2: please give commit 8813 a quick once over and let me know if that refactor is okay?	22:50
@perlmonkey2	k	22:50
@preaction	topsub: no	22:50
+perlDreamer	https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/revision/?rev=8813	22:50
@preaction	topsub: but you can do: ^AssetProxy(<tmpl_var url>/something);	22:51
+perlDreamer	topsub, but since url's are strings, you can use macros to build relative urls	22:51
+perlDreamer	also, see the RootUrl macro in the Bazaar	22:51
topsub	ah, alright we are running multi sites from 1 webgui and looking at how to solve each site having different theme	22:52
topsub	without having to redo the URLs everytime you want to setup a new site with a theme	22:52
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+perlDreamer	It may be dangerous to hack while in a recliner	23:04
@perlmonkey2	preaction: looks good, but I thought I was using the correct perltidy template. Did you correct those by hand or with perltidy?	23:04
@perlmonkey2	perltidy config I mean	23:04
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: I mean, not preaction	23:05
+perlDreamer	The correction is inside a test. Your code looks fine	23:05
+perlDreamer	I needed less vertical space	23:05
+perlDreamer	so i could see the whole data strucutre	23:05
+perlDreamer	on 1 page	23:05
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: this seemed interesting though: my @types = $self->getValidQuestionTypes();	23:06
@perlmonkey2	Just trying to prettify things?	23:07
+perlDreamer	well, sort of =)	23:07
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+perlDreamer	I didn't want to duplicate the list of valid question types	23:07
@perlmonkey2	oh, good call.	23:07
+perlDreamer	so by refactoring it out, I can call it in the test to get the list	23:07
+perlDreamer	although, I did do all the basic data types by hand, so going forward changes have to be made in both places.	23:08
+perlDreamer	I don't really like doing that, but it's a great reminder to update template variables and the like	23:08
+perlDreamer	when the code behind them change	23:08
@perlmonkey2	maybe if this thing every gets settled down, the questions can be pulled out into Form and then the Form entries can have their individual templates and JS attached to them. Would be nice to pull all that logic out of the Survey.	23:09
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+perlDreamer	would we reuse it elsewhere?	23:09
+perlDreamer	and the corresponding parts of the updateQuestionAnswers depends on those	23:10
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: I can see the ajax'd form types being pulled out of the survey and being very useful elsewhere.	23:11
@perlmonkey2	but there would have to be be some surrounding framework devised. Sounds like something that needs to be grown iteratively rather than designed.	23:12
+perlDreamer	I see	23:13
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@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: I don't know, am I wrong? Is there already an agreed upon framework for implementing ajax'd forms?	23:19
+perlDreamer	No, there's no framework yet. I was responding to the evolved vs designed idea.	23:19
+perlDreamer	I like it	23:19
+perlDreamer	sometimes things can be overdesigned	23:20
+perlDreamer	or not extensible enough	23:20
+perlDreamer	rizen: the bummer about Plain Black shirts is that they don't hide pumpkin soup stains	23:30
@rizen	do any shirts hide pumpkin soup stains?	23:30
SDuensin	Orange ones.	23:31
+perlDreamer	some plaids do well	23:31
SDuensin	Tie-dye!	23:31
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@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: why would anyone waste a perfectly good pumpkin on soup? Is there such a plethora of pumpkin pie, that you would squander them on soup? Sir, I think not.	23:38
SDuensin	perlmonkey2, we're talking about rizen here.	23:38
+perlDreamer	You'll have to convince Koen and my wife of that. I am only a consumer of locally, produced, freely available food here :)	23:38
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@rizen	given the choice between pie and soup, i take pie every day of the week	23:40
+perlDreamer	chicken noodle pie, mmmmmm	23:41
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--- Day changed Fri Dec 05 2008
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@preaction	two questions for those at home:	00:32
@preaction	1) Would storing prepared SQL statements so they don't have to be prepared ever again during the current request count as "caching" and should "disableCache" disable this functionality?	00:32
@preaction	2) Is a performance increase that is only significant when caching is disabled still a performance increase? It's in WebGUI::SQL::buildArray and WebGUI::SQL::buildArrayRef	00:33
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+perlDreamer	I don't see any performance increase in buildArray	00:38
+perlDreamer	or buildArrayRef	00:39
@preaction	it's not committed yet	00:39
+perlDreamer	if it slows wG down overall, it doesn't seem like an increase to me	00:39
+perlDreamer	the common case is with caching?	00:39
@preaction	it doesn't, in speeds up wg overall, but just slightly	00:39
@preaction	when caching is off you see the real benefit	00:39
@preaction	otherwise the new code rarely gets hit	00:40
@preaction	because there are caching mechanisms in front of it	00:40
@preaction	for a single page view, it's a 1/3 performance increase (60s to 40s)	00:40
+perlDreamer	40 second page view?	00:41
+perlDreamer	no way	00:41
@preaction	for the routines themselves, it's a 2fold increase	00:41
@preaction	caching is disabled	00:41
@preaction	you'd be surprised how slow wg is with caching disabled	00:41
+perlDreamer	I don't think that storing statements counts as caching	00:41
+perlDreamer	since it would return different data with different params, or at different times	00:41
+perlDreamer	and does all this code have tests? and will it violate the 7.6 feature freeze?	00:42
@preaction	it's deep in WebGUI::SQL, so i suspect it has tests, if not i'll have to do it	00:43
@preaction	no, performance increases aren't features	00:43
@preaction	the API isn't changing at all, just how the work gets done	00:43
* perlDreamer pastes that one for future reference ;)		00:43
@preaction	it depends on how the performance is getting increased	00:44
@preaction	if i started moving features around and changing APIs and stuff, then i would consider making it beta for a while	00:44
@preaction	especially if i was working with untested stuff	00:44
@preaction	i really need to get Coverage reports working. JT says he'll write tests if he can see a number	00:45
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+perlDreamer	if you're tied for time, just send me the script	00:47
+perlDreamer	coverage tests should be about 20 characters of change or so	00:47
@preaction	one sec	00:47
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+perlDreamer	but be warned, coverage tests for all of wG will be BIG and SLOW	00:47
@preaction	how big? too big to upload via WWW::Mechanize?	00:48
@preaction	i was thinking making it a ZipArchive asset	00:48
+perlDreamer	12 Mb	00:48
@preaction	ha, the test box is DOWN, which might be why tests aren't getting run	00:48
+perlDreamer	look in the dev list, I may have uploaded a copy last year about this time	00:49
+perlDreamer	zipped, about 12 Mb.	00:49
+perlDreamer	perlmonkey2: strongly resisting the temptation to add easter eggs to survey type answers	00:49
+perlDreamer	Would redneck come before or after conservative in Ideology?	00:50
@preaction	i would consider them equal and awful	00:50
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@preaction	perlDreamer: you have a login to my systems	00:50
+perlDreamer	PM me a hostname, username and passwd, please	00:50
apeiron	redneck is more a lifestyle, independent of ideology.	00:51
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+perlDreamer	Do people who send out SPAM know they're scum, or are they just ignorant?	02:47
@preaction	money, they get money, so they're okay with themselves	02:50
@preaction	i've thought about it	02:50
+perlDreamer	really?	02:50
@preaction	money for nothing, sure why not?	02:51
+perlDreamer	well, then you'd get the chicks for free	02:54
+perlDreamer	that ain't working	02:54
@preaction	that's the way you do it!	02:54
+perlDreamer	indeed	02:54
@preaction	I WANT MY EMPTY-VEE	02:54
@preaction	i also want pandora to stop screwing around	02:55
+perlDreamer	pandora?	02:55
+perlDreamer	she opened the box	02:55
+perlDreamer	what more do you want?	02:55
@preaction	www.pandora.com <- only the greatest free music service EVAR	02:55
+Radix-wrk	last.fm?	02:56
@preaction	paltry in comparison!	02:56
+perlDreamer	perlmonkey2: SurveyJSON has 96% test coverage	02:56
+Radix-wrk	pandora.com goes to a blank page for me	02:56
@perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: all the rednecks are covered?	02:56
+perlDreamer	yup	02:57
@preaction	Radix-wrk: pandora seems down atm, it will come up shortly i suspect	02:59
+Radix-wrk	must be reeeallly good then if they can't even keep a server up ;)	02:59
@preaction	yay! it's back up!	03:04
@preaction	perlDreamer: Devel::Cover is installed on the test box now. the date was completely wrong which was causing the makefile to get regenerated	03:04
apeiron	preaction, You forget that those outside of the US may not be able to access it.	03:04
@preaction	it thought it was March 05, 08	03:04
+perlDreamer	March was good	03:05
* apeiron shakes fist and spits at the RIAA		03:05
+perlDreamer	I was employed then	03:05
@preaction	apeiron: i hope not	03:05
@preaction	it's got a lot of foreign music on it	03:05
apeiron	preaction, No, it's certainly true.	03:05
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patspam	would one of the PB folks be able to create a survey-rfe branch where we can put new survey features until the feature freeze is lifted?	04:42
patspam	actually, the WebGUI_Survey2 branch still exists, maybe we should just use that?	04:43
@preaction	patspam: you have committer access, you can just: svn mkdir https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/branch/Patbranch	04:43
patspam	ah cool, thanks preaction	04:44
patspam	good/bad idea to hijack the WebGUI_Survey2? I don't think it's being used any more by perlmonkey2?	04:45
@preaction	if he's not using it he should probably delete it, just for the history's sake	04:48
patspam	ok, cool. I'll create a new branch for the new stuff	04:48
patspam	https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/branch/survey-rfe lives!	04:56
patspam	perlmonkey2: ping	05:00
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@perlmonkey2	patspam: pong	05:59
patspam	hey man!	06:00
+perlDreamer	I'm out for a while, being Daddy dentist...	06:00
patspam	been talking to people today about advanced survey branching	06:01
patspam	just drafting up an rfe for it now	06:01
@perlmonkey2	anything interesting?	06:01
patspam	yeah, although you might have already thought of this	06:01
patspam	we want to let the survey creator enter an expression made up of section/question/answer vars to define the branch condition