WebGUI irc logs from: 2007-07.log

--- Log opened Sun Jul 01 00:00:49 2007
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Excess Flood]		00:14
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui		00:26
-!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ		00:26
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui []		00:35
+Radix_	Anyone about?	04:52
+Radix_	dw	04:53
+Radix_	2007/07/01 09:57:39 - WARN - mycompany.com.conf - main::[[undef]] - Couldn't call method edit on asset for url: style/read/templates/read-navigation-template Root cause: Can't locate object method "new" via package "HTMLTemplate" (perhaps you forgot to load "HTMLTemplate"?) at /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Template.pm line 252.	05:00
+Radix_	happens whenever I try and edit a navigation template I'd created.. yet if I keep clicking on edit then it eventually works and opens it fine	05:01
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		05:28
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		05:34
-!- SDuensin_ [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		06:32
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		06:39
-!- SDuensin_ is now known as SDuensin		06:48
-!- tichy [n=dirk@78.52.225.113] has joined #webgui		12:44
tichy	Could not set uid/gid on '/var/www/domains/rab2/uploads/temp/qy/qySOEpf2dOLv1rEeorBPZg/ZheCfsFTMBtiBlSe-oDoAw.storage'	12:54
tichy	whenn uploading a webui packages, but permissions seem to be right	12:55
-!- tichy43 [n=dirk@78.52.224.25] has joined #webgui		13:23
-!- tichy43 [n=dirk@78.52.224.25] has quit [Client Quit]		13:23
-!- tichy43 [n=dirk@78.52.224.25] has joined #webgui		13:23
-!- tichy [n=dirk@78.52.225.113] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		13:40
-!- tichy43 [n=dirk@78.52.224.25] has quit ["using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12"]		15:31
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		17:49
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui		20:43
-!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ		20:43
+MrHairgrease	rizen	20:44
+MrHairgrease	are you there?	20:44
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit []		20:55
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		20:57
-!- cap10morgan_ [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		21:13
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		21:13
@rizen	now i am	21:14
-!- cap10morgan_ is now known as cap10morgan		21:15
@rizen	for a few seconds	21:15
+MrHairgrease	ok	21:19
+MrHairgrease	the recent addons thingy seems to show only first revison of posts	21:19
+MrHairgrease	http://www.plainblack.com/wg/contribute	21:19
+MrHairgrease	untitled should be GoogleMaps Macro	21:20
@rizen	post a bug report	21:25
+MrHairgrease	ok	21:25
+MrHairgrease	will do	21:25
@rizen	oh and go get a hair cut, you hippie	21:25
+MrHairgrease	just got one last week	21:30
-!- MrHairgrease is now known as MrFood		21:30
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		22:47
--- Day changed Mon Jul 02 2007
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		00:21
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		00:22
+perlDreamer	You know it's bad when you don't pay attention to the bugs reported by your own tests...	00:53
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		01:02
-!- MrFood [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui []		01:25
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:11
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:11
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		05:07
-!- perlDreame1 [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		07:59
-!- perlDreame1 [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has left #webgui []		08:01
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		08:44
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		08:44
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:57
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:26
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:10
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@218.sub-75-205-105.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:59
SDuensin	Good morning.	16:01
ckotil	hello	16:11
ckotil	got an iPhone	16:11
ckotil	its great.	16:11
ckotil	had to fight with att all day saturday to 'port' my old cell number.	16:12
ckotil	i didnt know it was called porting until the 4th call, back and forth between carriers.	16:12
* SDuensin iGroans.		16:18
SDuensin	I'll wait until it's got a decent data network.	16:19
ckotil	yah	16:19
ckotil	web pages take about a minute to load, as do youtube videos	16:19
ckotil	its excellent on wifi tho	16:19
ckotil	i love being able to catch up on news while im on the toilet	16:20
SDuensin	heheheh	16:20
+Radix_	lol	17:11
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit []		17:12
+Radix_	http://www.tuaw.com/2007/07/01/prepaid-iphone-in-a-nutshell/	17:13
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		17:47
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		17:47
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui		17:57
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12"]		17:58
pjesi	I dont get the fuzz	18:03
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		18:35
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui		18:37
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		18:53
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		18:54
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		18:54
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		19:00
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui		19:18
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has quit []		20:56
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		21:59
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui		22:17
-!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ		22:17
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@218.sub-75-205-105.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:51
--- Day changed Tue Jul 03 2007
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has left #webgui []		00:08
-!- besonen_mobile_ [n=besonen_@71-220-233-253.eugn.qwest.net] has quit ["Leaving"]		00:19
-!- besonen_mobile [n=besonen_@71-220-233-253.eugn.qwest.net] has joined #webgui		00:34
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui []		01:07
@preaction	http://www.ohloh.net/projects/103 <- interesting website about OSS	01:07
@preaction	says that webgui would take about 10 million USD to build from scratch	01:09
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:23
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		02:30
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		02:30
-!- bobnn [n=bobn@71.194.17.95] has quit ["Leaving"]		02:34
+perlDreamer	rizen: I need a consult for a deprecation notice.	02:36
+perlDreamer	We're not allowed to add new session variables, but the current ones are okay?	02:36
+perlDreamer	That's from Asset::Template::Parser, line 37 or so	02:37
+perlDreamer	But in the docs themselves it says bluntly that session vars are deprecated, wholesale.	02:37
+perlDreamer	Which is it?	02:37
@preaction	current ones are okay i think, new ones are a bad idea	02:42
@preaction	i imagine they should be added somewhere else	02:42
@preaction	or macros	02:42
+perlDreamer	That's what I was thinking, too.	02:42
@preaction	is there something that requires them?	02:42
@rizen	current ones are ok now, but will eventually be eliminated	02:42
+perlDreamer	So they should be marked and doc'ed as deprecated.	02:43
@rizen	yes	02:43
+perlDreamer	In that case, I'll rework the example in Style Template without them.	02:43
@rizen	they will eventually be replaced with something else	02:43
@rizen	like a macro or something	02:43
+perlDreamer	cool	02:44
SDuensin	Hi rizen, perlDreamer, preaction.	02:44
+perlDreamer	thanks, rizen (and you too preaction)	02:44
+perlDreamer	It's good to know y'all are on the same wavelength.	02:44
@preaction	that's what JT's magic hammer is for	02:45
* preaction nurses a few bruises		02:45
+perlDreamer	You should be glad he used the blunt end :)	02:46
+perlDreamer	Hey, SD.	02:46
SDuensin	My brain hurts.	02:49
+perlDreamer	SDuensin: are you using an iPhone?	02:53
SDuensin	Frack no.	02:53
+perlDreamer	Then what's the cause of your cerebral distress?	02:53
SDuensin	I'm trying to learn cross-platform real-time 3D rendering.	02:54
@preaction	OpenGL? SDL?	02:54
SDuensin	Depends on the platform. :-)	02:54
SDuensin	Ogre3D is the graphics thingie. Lots of other code involved, too.	02:54
+perlDreamer	rizen, preaction: what do y'all think of this: http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/view-profile	02:56
+perlDreamer	bug or RFE?	02:56
@preaction	sounds like a site style issue to me	02:56
@preaction	oh, it's logged against plainblack.com	02:56
+perlDreamer	It's small enough that I was thinking we should just stick do it.	02:56
@rizen	i'll send steve an email	02:57
+perlDreamer	preaction: it is style based, but I think a lot of the navs and styles suffer from it.	02:57
@rizen	steve's bug to fix	02:57
+perlDreamer	okay.	02:57
SDuensin	Hey rizen - does PB do any charity stuff?	02:58
@rizen	rarely	02:58
@rizen	what is it for?	02:58
+perlDreamer	Do you mean like giving away their software for free? :)	02:59
SDuensin	Ok. Just curious. I donated server space and WebGUI hosting to a new foundation for a guy who died in a triathlon. They have no idea how to manage it. Wondered if you'd be interested in kicking them a couple Primers or something.	02:59
* SDuensin is doing his best to teach them.		02:59
@rizen	some guy died?	03:03
@rizen	that doesn't seem like much of a charity	03:03
SDuensin	Yes. And to be honest, I don't know where they're sending the money they raise. If I had to guess, it'd be to LiveStrong, but that's just a guess.	03:05
SDuensin	It's been a rough week. Dude was a coworker of mine.	03:05
SDuensin	http://www.kevinmhuntfoundation.org	03:06
SDuensin	Horribly ugly site. Done in 2 days by my poor boss who is trying to learn WebGUI as she goes.	03:06
SDuensin	Hehe - looks like she just figured out two column layouts. :-)	03:07
@rizen	i'll have to say i pass. i'm sure he was a great guy and all, but 14,4000 people die on the planet every day. i can't set that sort of precident	03:07
SDuensin	That's fine dude. Never hurts to ask, so I figured I would. :-)	03:07
SDuensin	I really hope she changes that "logo". It screams of Windows Paint.	03:11
+perlDreamer	Haarg: I found knowmad's template editing bug.	03:20
+perlDreamer	The Help has an autogenerated list of template parsers, based on the config file.	03:20
+perlDreamer	It stomps on the config file entry, because it's a reference.	03:21
@preaction	you're joking	03:21
+perlDreamer	No	03:21
@preaction	god damn it	03:21
@preaction	nice	03:21
+perlDreamer	I know, I suck	03:21
+perlDreamer	It's probably not the only one, either. I'll check the other autogenerated docs as well.	03:22
+perlDreamer	Macros are okay	03:27
+perlDreamer	Assets are okay	03:28
+perlDreamer	Workflow Activities are okay	03:29
+perlDreamer	It's just the template parsers.	03:29
+perlDreamer	I didn't make a copy, just dereferenced.	03:29
+perlDreamer	and then altered $_ inside the loop of a map, which changes the parent, which is what config points to	03:29
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:35
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:36
+perlDreamer	when is 7.3.20 scheduled for release?	04:00
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:04
+perlDreamer	I'm almost ready to commit a fix	04:06
+perlDreamer	It looks like it could cause the bug, but I don't see a way for the config variables in one session variable to be leaking into the session var for the next request.	04:06
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		04:29
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		04:46
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		04:48
-!- cap10morgan_ [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		04:57
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]		04:58
-!- cap10morgan_ is now known as cap10morgan		04:58
-!- cap10morgan_ [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		05:18
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		05:21
-!- cap10morgan_ [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit []		05:57
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		06:07
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		06:07
+perlDreamer	preaction: there's no code to prevent you from using the WebGUI database link that I can find.	06:19
@preaction	it's supposed to	06:19
@preaction	i thought there was, to prevent exactly what that caused that bug	06:19
+perlDreamer	there's code to remove it from the select list, but that's it	06:20
+perlDreamer	if you update the db manually, or hack the form it would work fine.	06:20
@preaction	we might have to ask martin about it	06:20
+perlDreamer	I'll try to catch him tomorrow.	06:20
+perlDreamer	btw, do you know when 7.3.20 is due to be released?	06:21
@preaction	probably wednesday	06:22
+perlDreamer	the 4th?	06:23
@preaction	oh	06:23
@preaction	uhm... durno then	06:23
+perlDreamer	You have any plans for the 4th?	06:24
+perlDreamer	Family, gf, bbq, blow things up?	06:24
@preaction	nope, i imagine i'll be working	06:24
+perlDreamer	later	06:37
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		06:37
vayde	rizen, you going to be around Sunday night? I'll be in town. Wanna grab a brew?	07:25
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		08:01
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:02
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		15:00
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@108.sub-75-206-161.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:37
SDuensin	Good morning!	15:41
-!- Leon [n=leon@195.158.107.185] has joined #webgui		15:56
Leon	hi	15:56
Leon	any one can help me out ?	15:56
-!- Leon [n=leon@195.158.107.185] has quit []		16:02
+Radix_	not in 6 minutes, no	16:05
* SDuensin chuckles		16:05
ckotil	heh	16:07
ckotil	i think i got an iPaperWeight	16:07
ckotil	battery seems like its bad.	16:07
ckotil	its not going a full day, with minimal use.	16:07
SDuensin	Dead battery? That'll be $85 please.	16:08
ckotil	yarly.	16:08
SDuensin	You using the WiFi or just letting it sit?	16:08
ckotil	i turned off wifi and email check.,	16:09
+Radix_	replacement battery from apple = return the device and they'll solder a new one on for you for $$$	16:09
ckotil	man..id be so pissed off if they charge me.	16:09
ckotil	as if i hadnt paid enough already	16:09
SDuensin	Yea. Apple announced the battery is $85.95.	16:09
ckotil	and we learned yesteray about how much this thing costs apple.	16:09
ckotil	its under $300.	16:09
SDuensin	I'd think you're well within whatever sad warranty they offer.	16:09
ckotil	omfg.	16:10
ckotil	id thihnk since i just got it, they'd give me a nwe phone.	16:10
ckotil	ya.	16:11
+Radix_	if they still have stock to give you one	16:16
* SDuensin has a RAZR. It sucks, but it plays DOOM!		16:21
+Radix_	I have an o2 atom which rocks.	16:21
nuba	o2 atoms dont rock, they oxidise	16:24
nuba	and actually its not o2 atoms, o2 its the entire molecule	16:26
+Radix_	Umm.. yeah	16:29
nuba	in fact its all wrong. you write O2, no chemical element is written with the first letter in smallcaps	16:36
nuba	let me see, did I left anything out of the nitpicking ?	16:37
nuba	:)	16:37
+Radix_	http://www.seeo2.com/product/XdaAtom/template/XdaAtomProductInfo.vm	16:37
-!- Irssi: #webgui: Total of 14 nicks [3 ops, 0 halfops, 2 voices, 9 normal]		17:08
xdanger	hmm.. Is it possible to edit a CS submission before Approving it?	17:09
xdanger	We have a user updated list, and sometimes they have badly formated text or something like that... But we have to approve it first so that content managers can edit it...	17:10
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		18:26
@rizen	radix, are you here?	19:35
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		20:08
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		20:08
+perlDreamer	(Time appropriate greeting), folks	20:09
+perlDreamer	preaction: can you give me a pointer to the DBI grant code that you mentioned a while ago?	20:48
* perlDreamer hates log file gaps		20:55
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has joined #webgui		23:49
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@108.sub-75-206-161.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:51
--- Day changed Wed Jul 04 2007
-!- sbaur [n=sbaur@130.157.145.37] has joined #webgui		00:34
+perlDreamer	Things are hopping in the channel today	00:46
+perlDreamer	Must be because of the holiday	00:46
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:25
+perlDreamer	Hola, SDuensin	01:26
SDuensin	Yo	01:26
+perlDreamer	What's up nt he java desktop world?	01:30
SDuensin	WonderGrid is almost ready to ship! It's an awesome database editor.	01:52
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui		02:13
cap10morgan	so, http proxy assets rewrite form fields so they have HttpProxy_ as a prefix	02:14
cap10morgan	do you basically just have to modify the script that they post to to handle the new names?	02:14
cap10morgan	or can you turn that rewriting off?	02:14
+perlDreamer	No idea.	02:15
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:18
-!- sbaur [n=sbaur@130.157.145.37] has quit []		02:25
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has quit []		02:50
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has quit []		03:11
+Radix-wrk	ckotil: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/07/03/iphone_hacking_progress/	03:59
@preaction	and again i must point out that they are talking about CRACKERS not hackers...	04:32
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		04:56
-!- nuba [n=nuba@hq.imaterial.org] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		05:44
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		06:18
-!- nuba [n=nuba@hq.imaterial.org] has joined #webgui		06:31
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		07:09
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		07:09
* vayde waves to perlDreamer		07:11
+perlDreamer	yo, vayde!	07:12
+perlDreamer	The daughter of a friend of mine is taking martial arts.	07:13
+perlDreamer	"uwe..." something	07:13
vayde	Cool. What style?	07:13
+perlDreamer	Means the formless way?	07:13
+perlDreamer	Shapeless way?	07:13
+perlDreamer	Basically, she's going to be a tough street chik	07:13
vayde	Ude perhaps	07:14
vayde	good	07:14
vayde	ladies need to be touch	07:14
vayde	er tough	07:14
+perlDreamer	they need both, but only on their terms :)	07:14
vayde	lol	07:15
vayde	sadly I've not met an adult woman who hasn't felt she was tossed around or at some guy's mercy at some time in their life	07:16
vayde	It's nothing sinister. Men are, on average, larger. You judge the world by yourself. Force you think is appropriate is too much for a smaller person.	07:17
+perlDreamer	Looking at the bug list, you would never guess that we had it down to 6 bugs	07:21
+perlDreamer	I'm going to crash out. Catch you later, vayde	07:24
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		07:24
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		07:47
nuba	anyone ever got this error when trying to start httpd.modperl ? Fatal error 'Spinlock called when not threaded.' at line 83 in file /usr/src/lib/libpthread/thread/thr_spinlock.c (errno = 2)	10:00
nuba	this is in a freebsd 5.3-RELEASE running the latest wre	10:01
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:41
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		12:17
nuba	morning folks, if anyone has any idea on this 'Spinlock called when not threaded.' error, please let me know	15:53
nuba	i've found about freebsd's /etc/libmap.conf, but it seems it isnt changing anything :/	15:54
+Radix_	Sorry nuba - never encountered it before	16:01
+Radix_	I've also never used freebsd tho	16:02
nuba	ok, thx anyway	16:08
@rizen	nuba, contact len@ilance.nl	16:43
@rizen	that's Len Kranendonk, i think you met him at the WUC	16:43
@rizen	he uses FreeBSD in webgui hosting	16:43
@rizen	he may have an answer for you	16:43
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		17:46
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		18:11
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui		19:33
-!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ		19:34
nuba	back	22:16
nuba	cool, thx rizen, yeah i remember len	22:17
nuba	very cool guy	22:17
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		23:48
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		23:48
+perlDreamer	MrHairGrease!	23:48
+perlDreamer	Just the guy that I need to talk to.	23:49
+perlDreamer	MrHairgrease...?	23:49
+MrHairgrease	perldreamer	23:50
+MrHairgrease	talk!	23:50
+perlDreamer	I have some SQLForm questions for you.	23:50
+MrHairgrease	oh	23:50
+MrHairgrease	ok	23:50
+perlDreamer	1) Where is the code that prevents you from using the WebGUI database.	23:50
+MrHairgrease	shoot	23:50
+MrHairgrease	there is no such code	23:51
+MrHairgrease	the sqlform only drops the default db link from the list	23:51
+MrHairgrease	so you can use the wg db by creating an extra db link	23:51
+perlDreamer	Somebody nuked their site using the SQLForm	23:51
+perlDreamer	http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/webgui-stops-working#wl1NfdrT4VgFU_KC1eg3cQ	23:52
+MrHairgrease	and they did that by using the default dblink	23:52
+MrHairgrease	id=0	23:52
+MrHairgrease	?	23:52
+MrHairgrease	yeah	23:52
+MrHairgrease	i read the report	23:52
+perlDreamer	Did you read the other bug report about the SQLForm permissions?	23:53
+MrHairgrease	prolly	23:53
+MrHairgrease	mostly i skim through the bug reports	23:53
+perlDreamer	they specified a wildcard in the grant for the database name	23:54
+MrHairgrease	yeah	23:54
+perlDreamer	why do permissions need to be checked?	23:54
+MrHairgrease	i didn't even know that you could do that	23:54
+perlDreamer	me either	23:54
+MrHairgrease	b/c if you don't have the right perms	23:55
+MrHairgrease	wg will fatal error	23:55
+MrHairgrease	and leave half an asset dangling in the tree	23:55
+MrHairgrease	and all that crap	23:55
+perlDreamer	ew. So you think that the SQLForm should handle the wildcard search?	23:55
+MrHairgrease	i guess so	23:56
+MrHairgrease	well	23:56
+MrHairgrease	actually i think mysql should ditch those wildcards in db names	23:56
+MrHairgrease	=)	23:56
+MrHairgrease	or even better	23:56
+perlDreamer	I think the DBI should provide a way to tell if a user has certain permissions in the database.	23:56
+MrHairgrease	create a generic meachnism to query perms	23:56
+MrHairgrease	and return those in one way	23:57
+MrHairgrease	yeah that too	23:57
+MrHairgrease	but it doesn't	23:57
+perlDreamer	no	23:57
+MrHairgrease	I actually spent a lot of time on figuring out a better way to do it	23:57
+MrHairgrease	but I failed	23:57
+perlDreamer	It's really pretty robust, but it has some edge cases.	23:58
* MrHairgrease retract into a corner and cries		23:58
+MrHairgrease	did you see my googlemaps macro btw?	23:58
* perlDreamer pats MrHairgrease on the head and hands him a scotch on the rocks.		23:58
+perlDreamer	Yes.	23:58
@preaction	i personally think we need to get rid of RaiseError in the DBI connections and handle all the errors ourselves (that way it would be possible to recover from things like that)	23:58
+perlDreamer	Very nice. I even voted for it.	23:58
+MrHairgrease	wow	23:58
+MrHairgrease	recognition =)	23:59
+MrHairgrease	yeah	23:59
+MrHairgrease	fatals on sql queries are a pain in the ass	23:59
+MrHairgrease	otoh we now know when the db's getting messed up =)	23:59
+perlDreamer	I've been having this idea for a website, and I need exactly that kind of functionality, but wrapped in an Asset.	23:59
+perlDreamer	The db will mess itself up, without our help.	23:59
--- Day changed Thu Jul 05 2007
+perlDreamer	db corruption sucks	00:00
+MrHairgrease	yeah	00:00
+MrHairgrease	but that' partly due to the lack of referential integrity in the wg schema	00:00
+MrHairgrease	i don't think there are any foreign keys in the db	00:00
+perlDreamer	no	00:01
+perlDreamer	no foreign keys	00:01
+MrHairgrease	so we have to rely on our leet haxor skills	00:01
+MrHairgrease	to keep it together	00:01
+perlDreamer	I need to learn SQL, because I don't know what a foreign key is.	00:01
+MrHairgrease	and i think we are doing a good job at that	00:01
+perlDreamer	It could be easier?	00:01
+MrHairgrease	i hear ya brother	00:02
+MrHairgrease	i'm in the same league	00:02
+perlDreamer	Okay, so it sounds like the SQLForm will happily let you shoot yourself in the foot. No fix	00:03
+MrHairgrease	yeah	00:03
+perlDreamer	But we should handle wildcard database names.	00:03
+perlDreamer	I can write tests for that.	00:03
+perlDreamer	I'll mock the DBI, and force it to send back data that I can shove into the _dbPermissions sub from SQLForm.	00:04
+MrHairgrease	it's just almost impossible to detect the actual db's that are in a link	00:04
+MrHairgrease	ok that'll be cool	00:04
+MrHairgrease	i'm really very busy with my graduation thingy	00:05
+perlDreamer	Is it related to your LED paper?	00:05
+MrHairgrease	but I'll be on my way to France by next monday	00:05
+MrHairgrease	no	00:05
+MrHairgrease	tunneljunctions	00:05
+MrHairgrease	i'll show you some stuff at the wuc	00:05
+perlDreamer	Cool!	00:06
+perlDreamer	Maybe I should bring some 1-wire parts, with the SHA-1 inside.	00:06
+perlDreamer	wait, tunnel junctions.	00:06
+MrHairgrease	cool	00:06
+perlDreamer	Are you doing EEPROM/Flash stuff?	00:06
+MrHairgrease	i won't be bringing parts though	00:07
+MrHairgrease	just images	00:07
+perlDreamer	okay	00:07
+MrHairgrease	you mean for my graduation?	00:07
+MrHairgrease	relating to the flash stuff	00:07
+perlDreamer	yes	00:07
+MrHairgrease	no	00:07
+MrHairgrease	it's more physics than electronics	00:07
+perlDreamer	ok	00:08
+perlDreamer	_databaseLinkHasPrivileges really belongs in DatabaseLink.pm, don't you think?	00:09
+MrHairgrease	yeah	00:09
+MrHairgrease	i think i discussed that with jt some day	00:09
+perlDreamer	On IRC?	00:10
+MrHairgrease	could be	00:10
+MrHairgrease	prolly	00:10
+perlDreamer	we need a dedicated logger in the channel with a search engine.	00:10
+MrHairgrease	or otherwise on the devlist	00:10
+MrHairgrease	yeah	00:10
+MrHairgrease	irc is quicker	00:10
+perlDreamer	much quicker	00:10
+MrHairgrease	but i kinda miss the devlist	00:10
+MrHairgrease	espescially since i'm in another tz	00:11
+perlDreamer	This is true.	00:11
+MrHairgrease	and lately i'm not on the channel very much	00:11
+perlDreamer	I'll throw the question out there, then you can reply and sound all sage and wise since we've already talked it through here :)	00:11
+MrHairgrease	ha	00:11
+MrHairgrease	i'll just paste my irc log	00:12
+MrHairgrease	easy money =)	00:12
+MrHairgrease	s/money/sageness/	00:12
+perlDreamer	I don't suppose Joeri is sitting around nearby?	00:13
+MrHairgrease	no	00:13
+perlDreamer	It should really be SQL.	00:13
+MrHairgrease	he isn't on msn either	00:13
+MrHairgrease	joeri should be sql?	00:14
+perlDreamer	No, there should be a SQL way of determining user rights.	00:14
+MrHairgrease	i agree	00:14
+perlDreamer	One that wraps the internal engine's API.	00:14
+perlDreamer	in a consistent, external query.	00:14
-!- MrHairgrease is now known as MrAfkGrease		00:15
+perlDreamer	bug --	00:25
+perlDreamer	perlbot: karma bug	00:25
perlbot	Karma for bug: 1	00:25
+perlDreamer	perlbot: karma bugs	00:25
perlbot	Karma for bugs: -2	00:25
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		00:25
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		00:57
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Connection timed out]		01:05
-!- MrAfkGrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui []		01:10
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:45
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:45
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		05:28
preaction_	question for those who go to geek meetings (perl mongers, LUG)	05:35
preaction_	would a porn joke be considered "out of line"?	05:35
preaction_	i'm thinking making a folder called XXX and putting a bunch of work documents, quipping "That's the name of the folder for stuff I don't like to look at"	05:35
vayde	I don't consider that out of line, but I'm not yr average geek	05:37
preaction_	i suppose it might be ... sexist, and we already have a big enough problem with women in the CS field...	05:38
vayde	I would use that, and far worse in the course of my classes	05:38
preaction_	i've got a two-hour presentation due in 8 days. i think i'm a little ... screwed	05:38
preaction_	but i work better under pressure ;)	05:39
vayde	If I can help, just holler	05:39
vayde	but I think that remark is pretty tame	05:39
preaction_	i googled for "perl one-liners" and found a wealth of material, just gotta cut it down and make it flow	05:39
preaction_	a one-line HTTP server: perl -MIO::All -e 'io(":8080")->fork->accept->(sub { $_[0] < io(-x $1 ? "./$1 \|" : $1) if /^GET \/(.*) / })'	05:40
vayde	nice	05:40
preaction_	you wouldn't happen to have any favorite modules to use in one-liners?	05:40
preaction_	i mean, LWP::Simple, CPAN, File::Path perhaps	05:41
preaction_	ooh, totally forgot about File::Path, I hate having to create deep directories1	05:41
vayde	not me. I'm not much of a one liner guy. I'll ask one of my guys	05:41
preaction_	perl -MFile::Path -e'mkpath "this/is/a/deep/directory"';	05:41
vayde	you're doing a presentation on one liners?	05:42
preaction_	yup	05:42
vayde	that's pretty cool	05:42
preaction_	http://madmongers.org/calendar/quick-and-dirty	05:42
preaction_	if i do nicely i might ask if one or more of the local LUGs would like to hear it (more converts for the fire)	05:43
vayde	very cool	05:43
preaction_	i think it's more of a rite-of-passage into complete nerd-dom. trial-by-fire and all that jazz	05:44
vayde	yeah, well, certain folks we both know like that kind of stuff	05:44
preaction_	if andy'll be there, he's already given a presentation on this, so i imagine i'll have some experts to ... assist in my... baptism	05:45
vayde	You'll do fine	05:45
preaction_	who do you think told me i had to do this ;)	05:45
* vayde nods, rolling his eyes		05:45
preaction_	it's not the presentation part i'm too worried about, i've got an actor's mentality to public speaking	05:45
vayde	how much public speaking/presentation experience do you have?	05:45
vayde	ahh, good	05:45
preaction_	it's that i'm going to be faking a lot of knowledge i won't have	05:45
preaction_	but i imagine "i don't know, but i can guess..." will be okay for this group	05:46
preaction_	or "i don't know, but i know where you can find the answer to that..."	05:46
vayde	so don't fake it. present what you know concisely	05:46
vayde	that will be fine I'm sure	05:46
vayde	one of the coolest and most liberating things about being a teacher in any capacity is the ability to say 'I don't know'	05:47
preaction_	a lot of it will be CPAN modules, so there's an out ("look on CPAN for the X::X module")	05:47
preaction_	but then again, learning while writing this thing is the main reason i'm doing it	05:48
vayde	should be fun	05:49
preaction_	i hope so. plus i imagine JT'll be there, so not entirely hostile audience (someone I can bounce bad jokes off of)	05:49
vayde	Or at least hide behind if the crowd gets too surly.	05:50
vayde	big dude like that will block many thrown objects	05:50
preaction_	i dunno, if they start chucking laptops i think i'm going to have to find something female to distract them while i make a break for it	05:51
preaction_	i'll bring the GF!	05:51
vayde	Are you in Madison?	05:51
preaction_	no, Oshkosh is about 90 minutes away	05:52
vayde	I'll be in town on Sunday	05:52
vayde	Hmm I'll have to look at a map, if it's not too far off the path, maybe we can grab a brew?	05:53
preaction_	it's up hwy 151 (60 minutes) until hwy 26 (30 minutes)	05:53
preaction_	what time would you be thinking?	05:54
vayde	I'm done about 5-ish	05:54
vayde	I'll need to eat something, and then head for home	05:55
preaction_	ah	05:55
vayde	I'll have some time though. Just have to be back in time for work on Mon	05:56
preaction_	iirc i was planning on going to Wild Rose sunday during the day, which would put me closer to madison than oshkosh.	05:57
preaction_	the issue being my gf would be coming with, and she's not yet of the age to go bar-hopping	05:58
preaction_	i imagine there're decent bar/grills around madtown though	05:58
vayde	honestly, I probably shouldn't do a lot of drinking witha 4 hr drive ahead of me	05:58
preaction_	which would work better anyway	05:58
vayde	last I heard, my gf is coming along too, we could at least have dinner	05:58
preaction_	4 hrs? why do you need to be in madison?	05:59
vayde	I have students there.	05:59
preaction_	so once a month or bi-weekly or something?	05:59
vayde	I don't really want to drive 4 hours each way and spend my only down day in a seminar, but the kids are so dedicated	05:59
vayde	monthly	05:59
vayde	at least in theory	06:00
preaction_	ahh	06:00
vayde	It was less of a problem when I didn't have 2 jobs	06:00
vayde	or when the second job was technically IN madison	06:00
vayde	hey preaction_, did JT finish the new version of the wre?	06:36
preaction_	i'm not quite sure if it's finished yet, we've been busy	06:37
preaction_	i think that was his hope this week, but right now he's at the origins games expo thingy	06:37
preaction_	but it was also his hope last week, and iirc the week before too	06:37
vayde	hmm, my wre is incompatible with the latest version of wg.	06:37
preaction_	7.4 requires 0.8 i think	06:37
preaction_	at least, the modules that come with 0.8	06:38
preaction_	might have to run sbin/testEnvironment.pl	06:38
vayde	is that whats in the repo right now? 7.4?	06:38
preaction_	that's the trunk, yes	06:38
vayde	yeah, that would explain the errors	06:39
vayde	but wre 0.8 isn't out?	06:39
preaction_	not that i'm aware of yet	06:39
preaction_	major changes from what i hear, and the abolishment of a separate windows WRE	06:39
vayde	wild. be interested to see how that was accomplished	06:41
preaction_	i'm more interested in the new features, apparently a perldoc server has been added	06:42
preaction_	to view perldoc of WebGUI modules	06:42
vayde	cool	06:42
vayde	god I miss wG	06:42
vayde	I keep thinking once things settle down a bit I'll be able to do some more development here	06:43
preaction_	word. it's hard to believe that just a few weeks ago the bug list was down to 6 :(	06:43
vayde	lol	06:43
vayde	I haven't looked at it	06:43
vayde	any of them with the email password recovery?	06:44
preaction_	not that i remember	06:44
vayde	that's nice.	06:44
vayde	I can't make heads or tails of the new site. It's pretty, but I can't find anything.	06:45
vayde	where's the buglist?	06:45
preaction_	http://webgui.org/bugs	06:45
vayde	ahh, now I see	06:46
vayde	that's the nice thing about wG. I'd actually like to solve probelms with it, learn more about it	06:46
vayde	with the crap I'm working on right now. It's hard to care	06:46
vayde	It's kinda like diagnosing problems on windows: Step 1) use something else	06:47
preaction_	lol	06:47
vayde	the only good note is it's just temporary. We all hate it.	06:48
preaction_	indeed	06:48
vayde	there we go. dev environment is back up	06:50
vayde	now I better go back to the fun stuff	06:50
preaction_	goodluck	06:50
vayde	you should see the autoloader on this bastard	06:51
vayde	I'd post it, but that might violate something	06:51
preaction_	mmmm NDAs	06:51
preaction_	proprietary systems	06:51
vayde	no NDA	06:51
preaction_	trade sekrits?	06:52
vayde	that kinda surprised me	06:52
vayde	I'm sure somebody thinks so	06:52
vayde	they've been surprisingly lax	06:52
preaction_	i imagine you signed your rights to your code away? like responsible colleges do to professors on fellowship?	06:52
vayde	no, nothing	06:52
preaction_	huh	06:53
vayde	I had to sign more to work with PB than I did to work for usbank	06:53
vayde	I've signed _nothing_	06:53
vayde	gf is not coming, but we could still grab dinner if you like preaction_	07:51
vayde	do you have my cell?	07:51
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: @Haarg		07:53
preaction_	uhm, i'd like to but it looks like wild rose is a bit further from madison than I anticipated (2 hrs.), and the idea with going to WR is to introduce the GF to the mother (and hopefully the siblings)	07:58
preaction_	is it always the first weekend of the month? that's rocky weekend	07:58
vayde	naw, depends on when all involved are free	08:04
vayde	there'll be another time	08:04
vayde	I'll be back on the 12th of August	08:04
preaction_	was just wondering, if you had a place to stay the Velvet Darkness does their thing the 1,3,5 saturday at 11:30p at the Orpheum	08:05
preaction_	another time, then	08:05
-!- Netsplit over, joins: Haarg		08:05
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		08:05
vayde	cool. I'd come out Sat. night if I had somewhere to stay, but as it is, I'll just drive out early and drive back in late	08:07
preaction_	ah	08:07
vayde	I'd stay with my students, but they have dogs, and you know me... delicate	08:07
preaction_	yes... delicate	08:07
vayde	http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/incorrect-content#ALpxo5ydXhwsVd9c6ySbuw	08:13
vayde	that's not much of a bug	08:13
vayde	recon you can squash it real quick. I don't have access anymore	08:14
preaction_	eh, i could if i weren't doing other things	08:14
vayde	just lettin you know...	08:14
preaction_	actually that's a wiki page, everybody should be able to change that. and those two tutorials should be in the wiki somewhere already	08:17
vayde	I'll see what I can do	08:17
vayde	new site is slicker than snake snot	08:24
vayde	you ever check out vimperator?	08:29
preaction_	nope	08:30
vayde	It's pretty cool. turns firefox into vim mor ore less	08:30
vayde	keybindings, commands, etc	08:31
preaction_	nice	08:31
vayde	pretty cool, doesn't play nice with wG though apparently.	08:31
preaction_	would be interesting, i find myself using vim commands in firefox on a regular basis (space to page down, / to find, ctrl+b to go back a page, etc...)	08:33
vayde	check it out	08:34
vayde	actually, it's pretty easy to get it to play with wG now that I find the trick	08:35
vayde	can I close the bug? or do I have to tell someone to do it?	08:36
preaction_	i think you'd have to tell someone to do it	08:38
vayde	someone other than you?	08:39
preaction_	nono, i can do it	08:39
vayde	lol	08:39
vayde	no worries, sooner or later someone with the power will look at it, and take care of it	08:39
-!- preaction_ is now known as preaction		08:56
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		08:56
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		09:02
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		09:04
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		09:04
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:46
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		10:25
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		10:26
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		10:26
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		10:49
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		10:58
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		12:05
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:03
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@131.sub-75-207-134.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:36
SDuensin	Good morning!	15:36
ckotil	hello	15:38
SDuensin	Hi ckotil	15:40
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12"]		18:13
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit []		18:39
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui		19:36
-!- cap10morgan_ [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui		19:39
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has quit [Nick collision from services.]		19:40
-!- cap10morgan_ is now known as cap10morgan		19:40
* pjesi misses news on the frontpage		20:32
* cap10morgan does too		20:36
@preaction	like release news?	20:46
pjesi	for instance	20:59
pjesi	it is now only on the commercial site	20:59
@preaction	anyone know who wrote the new user invite thing for 7.4? was it perlDreamer?	21:26
@preaction	as a side note, i like 7.4 and think it will be teh awesome. a lot of RFEs went into this one	21:31
@preaction	first release in 2 weeks	21:32
@preaction	maybe 3	21:32
* pjesi does not yet had a look at it		22:02
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		23:03
perlmonkey2	Is it possible to do a passthrough on a cgi directory?	23:03
@preaction	passthrough tells webgui to ignore it, you'd have to tell apache what to do with it, but it might be better to have that directory bypass webgui entirely using a <Directory> or a <Location> directive (either that or you have to do both, i forget which)	23:04
perlmonkey2	What do you mean by directory bypass?	23:39
@preaction	perlmonkey2: http://www.webgui.org/community-wiki/how-to-get-passthruurls-to-work	23:48
@preaction	i imagine you can SetHandler cgi-script .pl .cgi after SetHandler None (to remove the mod_perl handler)	23:49
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@131.sub-75-207-134.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:49
perlmonkey2	Weird, it was the sethandler none that worked. I had sethandler PerlScript and that just gave me the .pl code.	23:51
@preaction	that's an apache issue, #apache can help, but might i suggest SetHandler cgi-script .pl	23:52
perlmonkey2	preaction: no, sethandler none fixed it. now it works. just strange.	23:52
--- Day changed Fri Jul 06 2007
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@204.17.142.86] has joined #webgui		00:00
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		00:00
+perlDreamer	preaction: you were looking for me?	00:00
@preaction	do you have any idea why the value for a required on registration element would be "HASH(0xblah)"?	00:01
@preaction	i've got one site from unitedknowledge that's doing this	00:01
@preaction	and i have so little information about what's going on there that i can't figure it out	00:01
@preaction	i can't reproduce	00:02
+perlDreamer	Is that part of User Invite, or the password recovery stuff?	00:02
@preaction	http://arjan.unitedknowledge.nl/?op=auth;method=createAccount <- this	00:02
@preaction	i noticed some weird code in the createAccount sub: $emailField = {}; but later it's treated as a scalar (when getting the e-mail from the invite code)	00:03
+perlDreamer	that might explain the email address, but not the second field.	00:04
+perlDreamer	Hm. With user invites turned off, the hash ref leaks through.	00:06
+perlDreamer	That's a bug.	00:06
@preaction	oh, it happens when it's turned OFF... god	00:07
+perlDreamer	How do you pull an old rev out of SVN?	00:08
@preaction	svn up -r<revision>	00:08
@preaction	i was thinking that too, it might be a bug already fixed	00:08
+perlDreamer	No, I'm running on head and it's still in there.	00:10
+perlDreamer	And there's the other bug, stomping on the required fields.	00:11
@preaction	wtf why does it not show up on my site?	00:12
+perlDreamer	Do you have user invitations turned on?	00:12
@preaction	i tried it turned on, i tried it turned off	00:12
@preaction	neither	00:12
+perlDreamer	what rev are you running?	00:13
+perlDreamer	And do you have profile fields set as required?	00:13
@preaction	i'm running HEAD, and i set them as show on registration, i'll check required	00:14
@preaction	email is: visible, editable, required, and show at registration	00:14
+perlDreamer	The fix is very simple	00:15
+perlDreamer	vim Auth.pm	00:15
+perlDreamer	s/emailAddress = \{\}/emailAddress = undef/	00:15
@preaction	oh god, i couldn't see it because i had fixed it already	00:16
+perlDreamer	Dude, you're psychic!	00:16
@preaction	christ...	00:16
+perlDreamer	Commit the fix and remember to chastise me thoroughly in the commit log	00:16
@preaction	k	00:17
+perlDreamer	why does Config->set have to write the config file?	01:41
nuba	whoa, i've just received the June edition of IEEE's computer magazine	01:47
nuba	there's a nice article about this tool called Koala	01:47
+perlDreamer	what is it?	01:47
nuba	being developed by IBM, targetting web scripting for the masses	01:47
nuba	you go to a website, use it, fill a form, submit, do stuff, etc.	01:48
nuba	all that gets recorded by a firefox sidebar	01:48
nuba	in plaintext format	01:48
nuba	you can share that script, edit it, etc	01:48
nuba	it recognizes the places in which you have to fill for stuff and asks the user for it	01:48
+perlDreamer	like HTTP::Recorder ?	01:49
nuba	really cool when it comes to automating using websites	01:49
nuba	from what i understand, HTTP::Recorder works like a proxy, right ?	01:49
+perlDreamer	Yes. If you combine it with WWW::Mechanize, it would do what you're talking abuot	01:50
+perlDreamer	but requires hacker-level proficiency, not typical-user	01:50
nuba	but the researcher there states the goal of this tool is to help "small teams easily automate their own idiosyncratic workflows"	01:50
nuba	and to build a community of people sharing these automations on the web	01:50
nuba	yeah im familiar with www::mechanize	01:50
nuba	you really have to see the screenshots of the sidebar with the script to get the gist of it	01:52
+perlDreamer	Is it online publicly?	01:52
nuba	its sooo like stuff my parents would be able to use	01:53
nuba	just a sec..	01:53
nuba	yeah here you have it: http://www.computer.org/portal/site/computer/menuitem.eb7d70008ce52e4b0ef1bd108bcd45f3/index.jsp?&pName=computer_level1&path=computer/homepage/June07&file=invisible.xml&xsl=article.xsl&;jsessionid=GN2rhtFcSdyv4pLTT1TCdBH4v9vm3ngJT0j81y1kLvL29kZ9g2vS!1599257154	01:54
nuba	or http://tinyurl.com/3eyk4x	01:54
nuba	i went to IBM's website right away but its not yet available	01:55
+perlDreamer	You're right. It's very social. Kind of like a scripted, interactive HOWTO.	01:56
+perlDreamer	But I also see where it could be used to browser level test automation.	01:56
nuba	notice in one of the images, this toolbar: "open in sidebar" "run" "edit" "duplicate" etc.	01:56
nuba	and below the script, the comments from other usres	01:57
nuba	users*	01:57
nuba	this pic: http://tinyurl.com/3a5vh8	01:57
nuba	yeah this would make writing automated tests also very easy	01:58
nuba	i have some problems with www::mechanize, mostly because of javascript editing the dom	01:58
+perlDreamer	The interface reminds of VB macros in Microsoft Office.	01:58
+perlDreamer	Yeah, I've looked a little at Selenium to handle problems like that, but it seems like a steep learning curve.	01:59
nuba	well when that happens with me i have to grab the html from the mech, edit it as needed myself, and feed it again to the mech	02:00
nuba	so that means coupling www::mechanize with firefox's webdeveloper and livehttpheader extensions	02:00
nuba	its really messy	02:00
nuba	looking at selenium now	02:02
+perlDreamer	Doea Koala require installing a plug-in, or does it work entirely in Javascript?	02:05
nuba	well as of yet it seems like a firefox extension to me	02:08
nuba	theres a nice video in the ibm website too	02:09
+perlDreamer	I'll have to check that out at home.	02:09
+perlDreamer	No multimedia at $dayJob	02:09
nuba	heh i'll stop now	02:09
nuba	heh btw im by no means whatsoever involved with IBM or the koala initiative etc. etc.	02:10
nuba	:)	02:10
+perlDreamer	Hey, it does sound very cool.	02:10
+perlDreamer	I'd rather write koala than Selenium/Mech code any day.	02:10
+perlDreamer	It's natural language.	02:10
+perlDreamer	That means we could get WebGUI users to record bug statements and then publish them.	02:11
+perlDreamer	No more trying to guess how they did something.	02:11
+perlDreamer	Then those bugs become part of the permanent record for wG.	02:11
nuba	yeah its amazing what you could do with that	02:11
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has quit []		02:28
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@204.17.142.86] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:29
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		03:40
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		04:05
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		04:05
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		05:18
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has quit []		07:38
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:42
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: +Radix_		11:28
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:49
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		13:24
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix_] by ChanServ		13:24
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:11
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@54.sub-75-205-61.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:37
SDuensin	Good morning.	15:39
+Radix_	evenin'	17:12
SDuensin	Hi Radix_	17:12
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		17:50
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		17:50
+perlDreamer	Morning folks	17:50
@preaction	morning	17:51
+perlDreamer	I noted your commt from last night, preaction	17:54
+perlDreamer	You forgot to chastise me :)	17:54
@preaction	meh	17:54
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui		18:00
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		18:13
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		18:35
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		18:35
+crythias	and then I said to her... Necklace? I thought you said Perl Module...	18:36
+perlDreamer	That's how you always get the girls, crythias.	18:37
+crythias	Somehow, "Let me insert my module in your filesystem" just doesn't seem to be an aphrodisiac with most women.	18:37
+perlDreamer	no, filesystems are about storage.	18:38
+perlDreamer	They want to be a module in your kernel, not some peripheral.	18:38
+crythias	"I promise it's taint safe"	18:38
+crythias	well, as long as I can insmod or kldmod	18:39
+perlDreamer	So what's up in the BSD-using WebGUI world?	18:39
nuba	suffering	18:40
nuba	with thread libs and modperl crashing	18:40
nuba	> Fatal error 'Spinlock called when not threaded.' at line 83 in file /usr/src/lib/libpthread/thread/thr_spinlock.c (errno = 2)	18:40
+crythias	well, what with it using ImageMagick.	18:40
nuba	?	18:41
+crythias	grr	18:41
+perlDreamer	It's only 3 weeks 'til the 7.4 WebGUI and 0.8 WRE release.	18:41
+crythias	oh?	18:41
+perlDreamer	Then it will start using GraphicsMagick instead	18:41
+perlDreamer	Yes	18:41
+crythias	I spose I should update my faq	18:41
nuba	no shit!	18:44
nuba	its gone!!! :o	18:44
+perlDreamer	Serious, nuba.	18:44
+perlDreamer	Huh?	18:44
+perlDreamer	What do you mean?	18:44
nuba	its been three days since this was kicking my ass	18:44
+perlDreamer	mod_perl stuff on BSD?	18:44
nuba	oh damn	18:44
nuba	not really, its still here	18:44
nuba	ugh	18:44
nuba	yes, mod_perl, threads, freebsd...	18:45
nuba	now its not producing that Spinlock error anymore	18:46
nuba	its only silently segfaulting	18:46
nuba	aint it lovely?	18:46
+perlDreamer	Is switching to a different BSD or Linux an option?	18:46
nuba	this is with the 7.2 wre, btw	18:46
nuba	is gonna be, if it continues like this	18:46
nuba	wre on linux has always been smooth for me	18:47
+perlDreamer	I haven't used the WRE yet. I've always used Fedora's packages.	18:48
nuba	with freebsd the install is all about "ok, lets find out about what went wrong this time" moments	18:48
nuba	at least for me	18:48
nuba	ok, this is looking good	18:51
nuba	now for the record, if anyone else gets stuck on this	18:51
* perlDreamer suggests a wiki page		18:51
+perlDreamer	instead of an IRC log	18:51
nuba	hmm can be	18:52
+perlDreamer	It _is_more work, but you'll reach a whole lot more people that way.	18:52
nuba	true	18:53
+perlDreamer	Make you a deal. If you'll share the fix, I can make the wiki page.	18:53
nuba	im already at the wiki, thx anyway :)	18:55
nuba	where would freebsd-specific notes go there ? a new wiki page, or as a section into the http://www.webgui.org/community-wiki/wre-building one?	18:56
+perlDreamer	I would make a new page. WRE-Building-on-BSD	18:57
nuba	k	18:57
nuba	these I have here are just are just scattered notes, no text structure or much coment, is that fine ?	18:58
nuba	i figure its a good seed	18:58
+perlDreamer	Sure.	18:58
nuba	if someone wants to build upon it later	18:58
+perlDreamer	The new version may make the info unnecessary, but it will help people today, and who don't want to upgrade yet.	18:59
+perlDreamer	preaction: ping	19:03
@preaction	ACK!	19:03
+perlDreamer	Can you please move this http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/webguiuser-has-no-way-to-get-a-user-when-you-only-know-their-username	19:03
+perlDreamer	to the RFE section?	19:03
@preaction	k	19:04
+perlDreamer	thanks	19:05
@preaction	i imagine assigning it a difficulty of 1 would be prudent, since the patch seems stable	19:06
+perlDreamer	indeed.	19:07
+perlDreamer	In fact, maybe someone with SVN access will add it himself. Perhaps even write test code for it.	19:07
+perlDreamer	But it has to be an RFE for that ;)	19:07
nuba	no words for how im happy after getting modperl to act straight on freebsd :)	19:07
nuba	they joy of bugfixing :)	19:08
+perlDreamer	Should I be worried that it took 3 days for an email to the WebGUI dev list to come through?	19:08
nuba	or rather, circunventing	19:08
@preaction	i just nudged spectre, i think there's still a problem with the cron code	19:20
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-1.adsl.indra.com] has quit []		19:21
nuba	im so lucky	19:25
nuba	getting an error with spectre now	19:25
nuba	root@aviva# date	19:25
nuba	Fri Jul 6 08:19:25 UTC 2007	19:25
nuba	root@aviva# perl spectre.pl --run	19:25
nuba	Cannot determine local time zone	19:25
nuba	should I fill a bug ?	19:25
+perlDreamer	That may not be a WebGUI bug, but a DateTime bug.	19:25
ckotil	we're encountering a bug with date time, not webgui related tho	19:26
+perlDreamer	do share :)	19:26
nuba	it triggers here	19:26
nuba	211: POE::Kernel->run();	19:26
nuba	leaves the spectre.pl code here	19:27
nuba	main::(./spectre.pl:107): Spectre::Admin->new($config, $debug);	19:27
ckotil	im not sure of the specifics.	19:27
nuba	im trying with the machine's date not set to UTC	19:27
nuba	ok, doing this..	19:31
nuba	root@aviva# cp /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/Sao_Paulo /etc/localtime	19:31
nuba	root@aviva# perl ./spectre.pl --run	19:31
nuba	it works fine	19:31
nuba	is that a bug?	19:32
+perlDreamer	Only for the operating system.	19:32
nuba	i see	19:33
nuba	i know this may look dumb, but how do i add a new topic to the wiki ?	19:52
nuba	i tried addind a link to the toc and work from there, but it didnt worked	19:52
+perlDreamer	It's not dumb. It's obfuscated.	19:52
+perlDreamer	Search for a page	19:52
+perlDreamer	The search results page will give you a link to add a new page.	19:52
nuba	ok. thx	19:52
+perlDreamer	preaction: is that RFE considered "approved"?	20:02
@preaction	i don't know, while i would approve it, i don't know what TMRFE will say to it	20:02
+perlDreamer	well, I have it all prepped, including testing code.	20:02
+perlDreamer	I'll wait till he weighs in	20:02
+perlDreamer	Anyone know cap10morgan's real name?	20:07
nuba	added http://www.webgui.org/community-wiki/wre-building-on-freebsd-5.3 to the wiki	20:09
+perlDreamer	Thanks, nuba!	20:17
+perlDreamer	ckotil: you may want to read that article, since he also had lftp building problems.	20:18
nuba	bbiaw	20:24
+perlDreamer	lunch, then Transformers. cya later	21:53
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		21:53
ckotil	ah, thanks.	23:37
ckotil	transformers rockd!	23:38
nuba	it transformed me	23:41
nuba	in a dissatisfied moviegoer	23:41
nuba	:/	23:41
nuba	i think it didnt live up to my expectations as one who watched transformer toons as a kid	23:42
nuba	dunno	23:43
nuba	i felt like the trailers i've seen were better than the movie (!)	23:44
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@54.sub-75-205-61.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:48
--- Day changed Sat Jul 07 2007
ckotil	heh	00:26
ckotil	heading home.	00:26
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:38
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		03:37
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		06:59
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has left #webgui []		19:09
--- Day changed Sun Jul 08 2007
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		02:53
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		06:11
@preaction	Radix_: you around? have you heard anything good or bad about the Nokia N75 phone?	08:34
+Radix_	Hiya	08:40
+Radix_	I really don't know much about nokia smartphone's myself. I went windows mobile years ago and haven't looked back :) I like reading ebooks too much.	08:41
@preaction	sup	08:41
@preaction	yeah, it'd be nice to get a WM5 phone, but i also have to think about what plainblack will buy me	08:42
+Radix_	Ahh.. salary sacrificing for it or something like that?	08:42
@preaction	no, i got a raise for taking on the responsibility of being on-call	08:43
@preaction	so they'll pay for a phone/plan	08:43
@preaction	within reason	08:43
+Radix_	heh.. k	08:43
@preaction	they won't pay for an iphone, but a $50 i'm sure i can convince vrby	08:43
@preaction	i got the financing for my house, so i'll be broke for a few months because of the down payment	08:43
@preaction	unfortunately, when i can't even make calls because the damn antenna is gone on my motorola 8200	08:44
+Radix_	doh	08:44
@preaction	plus, it'd be very very nice to find a phone with bluetooth DUN	08:44
+Radix_	sony ericson make some nice phones, but they're not really smartphones	08:44
@preaction	nokia N75 has it, but i've been reading these reviews saying that the battery life is rather low (it says 4 hours of talk, 8 days of standby, but these reviewers say less)	08:44
@preaction	doesn't have to be very smart	08:45
@preaction	i need: mp3, bluetooth DUN, link with any OS	08:45
@preaction	and apparently branded phones are crap, but that's about all you can get in the US	08:46
+Radix_	my gf has the sony ericson k800i and is pretty happy with it	08:46
@preaction	http://www.myrateplan.com/iphone_compare/ <- i've been looking at this thing	08:46
@preaction	the ericson W810i is on there, and that seems nice	08:47
@preaction	except for the no high-speed data (EDGE / HDsomething)	08:47
+Radix_	hers has a 3.2mp camera which takes some pretty good shots	08:47
@preaction	jesus	08:47
@preaction	it's a camera that happens to be a phone	08:49
+Radix_	it's actually a pretty decent phone too	08:50
@preaction	yeah, it does look nice, would work for just about all i need, now to find a carrier	08:50
+Radix_	We don't really have anything faster than edge here tho, so don't know about hsdpa	08:50
@preaction	sometimes i swear the america gets shafted because of our system of "phone goes with network plan"	08:56
@preaction	http://www.gsmarena.com/nokia_n95-1716.php <- holy crap me wanty!	08:57
@preaction	which is, of course, $700 for the phone	08:58
+Radix_	They have a phone/plan combo here too.. which is how most people buy stuff.. but you can buy a phone outright as well - it just costs a bit more	09:09
+Radix_	especially for the higher end phones, as the lower ones get subsidized a lot	09:09
@preaction	i'm tempted to wait until open moko is released on a phone	09:21
@preaction	a free OS for mobile phones would be awesome	09:21
+Radix_	heh	09:21
@preaction	it's like we're at the cusp of a mobile computing revolution, and it'd be stupid to try to find a decent one until the dust settles	09:25
@preaction	on one end, you have the iphone, on another end, the neo1973, and you've got every other company pushing to get towards the iphone	09:26
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		15:57
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui		19:49
-!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ		19:49
--- Day changed Mon Jul 09 2007
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		00:02
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		00:02
+perlDreamer	Does anyone know why WebGUI::Storage::Image doesn't recoginize tiff's or bmp's as image files?	00:02
+MrHairgrease	no	00:04
+MrHairgrease	ther just not is some array in trhat file	00:04
+MrHairgrease	but why they aren't i do not know	00:04
+perlDreamer	Dude, this cannot be. I thought you knew everything?!	00:07
+MrHairgrease	i do	00:07
+MrHairgrease	but tomorrow i'll be off to France	00:07
+MrHairgrease	so i'm on vacation	00:07
+MrHairgrease	ask me again in three weeks =)	00:07
+perlDreamer	You have a good vacation, Martin. You've earned it.	00:07
+perlDreamer	Drink some great wine and eat some stinky cheese.	00:08
+MrHairgrease	i hate cheese	00:09
+MrHairgrease	but i'll compensate with some extra wine	00:09
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		00:29
-!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui []		00:52
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		00:57
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		00:57
@rizen	nuba, r u here?	00:59
-!- rizen_ [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		01:28
-!- rizen_ [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		01:33
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		01:35
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		01:36
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		01:36
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		01:41
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		02:58
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		02:58
+Radix-wrk	http://video.on.nytimes.com/?fr_story=f390265dcbb9e1f1da97a69637e921d39b6c99aa - iPhone: the Musical	03:32
@rizen	that's hillarious	03:47
+Radix-wrk	:)	03:56
+Radix-wrk	He seems to do a good assessment of the pro's and con's too :)	03:57
+Radix-wrk	you got one yet JT?	03:57
@rizen	well at least of the perceived pros and cons	03:57
@rizen	yup	03:57
@rizen	got it on iphone friday	03:57
+Radix-wrk	heh	03:57
+Radix-wrk	Got root access yet?	03:57
@rizen	no, don't care to	03:58
@rizen	not at least until people learn how to install applications on it	03:58
+Radix-wrk	not even curious? :)	03:58
@rizen	last week i was on site at a convention that one of our clients was running, and i took the iphone	03:58
@rizen	but i left my laptop in the room	03:58
@rizen	while on the convention floor i used the iphone to look up informaiton on the web, check the status of some web sites, keep in touch with my staff and convention folks through email and phone	03:59
@rizen	i took notes of software issues, kept all my appointments with the calendar	03:59
@rizen	woke myself up each morning with the built in alarm clock	03:59
+Radix-wrk	cool	03:59
@rizen	and took pictures of the convention attendees	04:00
@rizen	i can honestly say, that the iphone was AWESOME for this	04:00
+Radix-wrk	Do you guys have data charges in the US for web browsing/email/etc?	04:00
@rizen	not a single problem	04:00
@rizen	it's built in to the cell phone	04:00
@rizen	unlimited data transfer	04:00
@rizen	built into the plan i mean	04:00
+Radix-wrk	What kind of plan is that?	04:01
+Radix-wrk	cost?	04:01
@rizen	my wife and i both have iphones, and we get 400 SMS messages, 1400 anytime minutes, free in-network calling, unlimited nights and weekends, and unlimited data transfer for $130 (total for the 2 phones)	04:02
@rizen	$130/month	04:02
+Radix-wrk	Hmm.. expensive plan	04:03
@rizen	expensive compared to a regular cell phone plan	04:03
@rizen	but cheap compared to most PDA / Smartphone plans	04:04
@rizen	at least in the US	04:04
@rizen	don't know about abroad	04:04
@rizen	most smartphone plans don't have unlimited data	04:04
@rizen	and most only come with 100 sms messages	04:05
@rizen	for that price	04:05
+Radix-wrk	Ahh k.. that sounds more like it is here then	04:05
@rizen	i went to a wedding this weekend where half of the people there were from oz	04:13
@rizen	the groom is a friend of mine from sydney	04:13
@rizen	but people came in from all over	04:14
+Radix-wrk	We get around :)	04:15
+Radix-wrk	Besides.. it's cold and wet here.. so of course we'd want to go north :)	04:15
+Radix-wrk	http://www.gearlive.com/news/article/q307-how-to-use-irc-on-the-iphone/	04:31
@rizen	requires your local pc to be on and in range	04:33
+Radix-wrk	true	04:34
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		05:05
-!- rizen_ [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		05:40
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		05:40
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		06:11
-!- sstanvir [n=Tanvir@s208148.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #webgui		07:55
sstanvir	hello!	07:56
rizen_	howdy	07:56
sstanvir	how r u doing?	07:56
rizen_	terrible, and you?	07:57
sstanvir	haha..	07:57
sstanvir	i dont know how I am now ...;)	07:57
sstanvir	i am having serious problem with webGUI cache	07:57
sstanvir	r u in the mood of discussion ?	07:58
rizen_	i'll see what i can do	07:58
sstanvir	great	07:58
rizen_	be warned that i don't really do support on this channel...but we'll see	07:58
sstanvir	thats enough.. thnx	07:59
sstanvir	the problem is..	07:59
sstanvir	our customer is always complaining that +	07:59
sstanvir	he is always gets old content (from our server that uses webGUI)	07:59
sstanvir	we setup the "prevent proxy-caching"	07:59
sstanvir	+	08:00
sstanvir	but now its like.. +	08:00
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: ckotil, nuba		08:00
sstanvir	when we refresh a page.. it still shows the old content+	08:00
sstanvir	it only shows the new content when we close the browser +	08:00
sstanvir	and reopen it	08:00
sstanvir	(browser = IE)	08:00
sstanvir	what should I do now?	08:01
rizen_	what version do you use?	08:02
-!- Netsplit over, joins: nuba, ckotil		08:03
sstanvir	7.0.6	08:03
rizen_	that's the problem	08:05
sstanvir	?	08:05
rizen_	7.3.18 and above has all cache problems fixed	08:05
rizen_	there's no easy way to backport them to 7.0	08:06
sstanvir	hmm	08:07
sstanvir	I am afraid. management can't afford to setup new version of webGUI at the moment	08:07
sstanvir	it's a always up server ..	08:07
sstanvir	isn't there any patch or something like that?	08:08
rizen_	i just said no	08:08
rizen_	and you don't need to set up a new server	08:08
rizen_	you just need to upgrade	08:08
sstanvir	hmm	08:08
sstanvir	problem is original sources have been changed to meet requirements..	08:09
rizen_	well if you want to try and patch it yourself you can	08:10
rizen_	the changes were made in lib/WebGUI.pm	08:11
rizen_	and lib/WebGUI/Session/Http.pm	08:11
rizen_	i think that's it	08:11
sstanvir	ah.. cool	08:11
+Radix-wrk	rizen: is wg 7.4 going to have those changes to allow users to change their passwords easier? (without involving entering in profile fields like 7.3 does?)	08:11
rizen_	if you search through https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/WebGUI	08:11
rizen_	you might be able to find the specific patches made	08:11
rizen_	yes	08:11
+Radix-wrk	cool.. just checking :)	08:12
+Radix-wrk	We're still using 7.08 because of that ourselves	08:12
sstanvir	ok rizen, I will pass on the info to my team lead..	08:13
sstanvir	lets see if it works patching lib/WebGUI.pm and lib/WebGUI/Session/Http.pm	08:14
sstanvir	thank u very much	08:14
rizen_	why would you change the core of WebGUI/	08:15
rizen_	?	08:15
sstanvir	well.. i dont know much.. but	08:16
sstanvir	like instead of webGUI authentication method.. some other modules have been made	08:16
sstanvir	i guess not much change..	08:16
sstanvir	but drop by drop it made huge changes	08:16
rizen_	yeah, and it sounds like you used plugin points	08:17
rizen_	and if that's true	08:17
rizen_	then there's no problem	08:17
sstanvir	i guess so	08:17
+Radix-wrk	any authentication modules the rest of us could benefit from? :)	08:18
sstanvir	:)	08:22
sstanvir	actually its nothing special ..	08:23
sstanvir	just changed too add some function for user validation or password recovery methods..	08:24
+Radix-wrk	http://www.hanselman.com/blog/BeyondElvisEinsteinAndMortNewProgrammingStereotypesForWeb20.aspx	08:59
+Radix-wrk	hehe.. I'm right at the end in that - the "Not-The-Sysadmin" guy :)	09:02
+Radix-wrk	On a related note: http://www.theonion.com/content/node/33210	09:13
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		09:52
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		09:52
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		09:52
-!- Radix-work [n=Jesse@formsys.com] has joined #webgui		09:55
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		09:56
-!- Radix-work [n=Jesse@formsys.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		09:56
-!- Radix-work [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		09:56
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: rizen_		10:06
-!- greghacke [n=greghack@208.65.132.187] has joined #webgui		10:23
-!- greghacke [n=greghack@208.65.132.187] has quit [Client Quit]		10:24
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:32
-!- Radix-work [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:08
-!- sstanvir [n=Tanvir@s208148.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has left #webgui []		13:40
-!- Radix__ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		13:51
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: perlbot		13:51
-!- Netsplit over, joins: perlbot		13:52
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		13:53
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:03
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@135.sub-75-206-71.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:48
SDuensin	Good morning!	15:49
ckotil	good morning	15:53
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		16:32
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		16:32
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		16:58
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		16:58
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12"]		18:10
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		19:08
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		19:08
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		19:21
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		19:35
Khaytsus	preaction: Remember my "asses have disapeared" issue from a week ago? It's mysteriously fixed.	20:26
Khaytsus	One clue I've gotten is someone said "I went to your page, went to register, filled it out, got the email, and when I clicked the link to verify, the page was blank"	20:26
Khaytsus	And that was ~7 days ago	20:26
Khaytsus	So my guess is some process involved in that did some maintenance or something..... I've disabled anonymous registration for now.	20:27
@rizen	nuba, are you around?	20:27
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		21:38
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		21:38
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		22:11
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		22:12
nuba	rizen: around?	22:17
@rizen	yeah, on phone...be with you in a min	22:18
nuba	ok, bbiab, relocating..	22:18
@rizen	i'm back when you are	22:20
nuba	hey	22:20
nuba	im @ university atm, will be back at home later today	22:20
nuba	whats up?	22:20
@rizen	was wondering what the status of the maps asset was....do you think you'll be finished by the feature freeze date (July 2)	22:21
@rizen	July 20	22:21
nuba	i hope so	22:21
nuba	whats the real deadline, for me to submit this to you ?	22:22
nuba	i understand you want to launch 7.4 onjuly 20, isn't it so ?	22:22
@rizen	yes...july 20	22:23
@rizen	that's the real deadline	22:23
nuba	getting this to you on july 20's noon time would be ok ?	22:24
@rizen	yup	22:25
nuba	awesome. will keep it in mind, of course the sooner the better :)	22:26
nuba	i've got a couple of gmaps ebooks to boost me up to speed	22:27
nuba	so im confident i'll make it in time for the deadline	22:28
@rizen	sweet	22:28
@rizen	i really want to use it on webgui.org	22:28
@rizen	so webgui users can stick a pin in it for wherever they are and we'll know how far reaching the community is	22:28
nuba	that'd be rad!	22:29
@rizen	it would also be neat to see if there are other users local to yourself	22:29
@rizen	so in my case, how many webgui users in wisconsin	22:29
@rizen	or in your case, brazil	22:29
@preaction	rizen: the new 7.4 password recovery, should it be possible to turn it off? or should it always be "email" unless it is "profile field"?	22:29
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		22:29
@rizen	it should be "off", "email", or "profile based"	22:30
@rizen	that way we can also add others later if we want	22:30
@rizen	and some sites don't want you to get back in if you lost your account	22:30
@preaction	because either this patch wasn't finished or whoever wrote it was being durned lazy...	22:30
@rizen	that sux	22:30
@preaction	eh, to be expected	22:30
@rizen	the good news is that whomever wrote it doesn't work here anymore, and therefore we don't have to put up with crap from them	22:31
nuba	huh	22:33
@rizen	nothing for you to worry about nuba	22:35
@rizen	just an RFE for 7.4 that one of our former employees only half wrote, but that said was done	22:35
@preaction	yeah, this is what'll take my day today...	22:37
@preaction	if i'd like the WebGUI::Operation::Settings->www_editSettings to be able to display an error message, knowing that the settings that comprise the form can come from anywhere, would i have to use a session scratch variable (like WebGUI::Asset->www_edit currently does)?	22:41
@preaction	nevermind, i think i have a good idea	22:42
nuba	bbiaw	22:50
-!- jamestolley [n=jamestol@static-72-67-255-194.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		23:34
-!- mode/#webgui [+o jamestolley] by ChanServ		23:34
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@135.sub-75-206-71.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:48
Khaytsus	preaction: You notice I mentioend my assetts problem went away earlier? :)	23:48
@preaction	yup	23:49
Khaytsus	Go figure	23:49
Khaytsus	DAMN work cache.. Just gave me a scare, I thought it was broke again	23:50
@jamestolley	anyone have an idea how I might change the background color on locked assets?	23:59
@preaction	in the asset manager i hope?	23:59
--- Day changed Tue Jul 10 2007
@jamestolley	I don't think so... I think it's to show up on each page, if the thing is locked... it looked hairy to me..	00:00
@preaction	it might mean when admin mode is on, notice the grey bar above each asset on the page? that's encased in a div. you should be able to edit the template to change the background color of that div	00:04
@preaction	it doesn't sound like a good idea to me, but whatevz	00:04
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has left #webgui []		00:36
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		00:47
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		00:47
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:36
@jamestolley	... is this your understanding as well ? That these are the places, and nowhere in the code, where these background-colors need to be edited (to be dynamiuc, of course)	01:42
@jamestolley	oops!	01:42
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		01:43
+perlDreamer	rizen: If WebGUI wins the community choice award, are you coming out to Portland to accept it?	01:43
nuba	sourceforge's community awards are great to raise awareness about a given software	01:45
nuba	im crossing my fingers for webgui	01:45
+perlDreamer	I'll wear my supply of WebGUI T-shirts to the conference.	01:46
nuba	i can see a ultramegaboost in the community size if that happens	01:46
nuba	cause that means appearing in all sorts of medias	01:48
* perlDreamer hopes for more testing whackos		01:48
nuba	in all sorts of places	01:48
+perlDreamer	we need to bootstrap the automated browser testing of WebGUI	01:48
nuba	perlDreamer: was it you who i've talked with about koala ?	01:49
+perlDreamer	Yes.	01:49
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: @Haarg, perlbot, ckotil, jarcher, +perlDreamer, nuba, Radix__, Khaytsus, SDuensin, pjesi, (+4 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them)		01:53
-!- Netsplit over, joins: @jamestolley, jarcher, SDuensin, +perlDreamer, @preaction, Radix__, ckotil, nuba, besonen_mobile, pjesi (+2 more)		01:54
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: Khaytsus, @preaction, @jamestolley		01:55
nuba	in a broader sense, generally speaking, programs which have a GUI could have as well means to report their GUI's features and resources so that they could be programmed. a specific instance of this would be the browser reporting all "hotspots" of a html document being rendered, be it html, embedded plugins, etc.	01:55
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		01:56
-!- perlbot [n=perlbot@lv.pm.org] has joined #webgui		01:56
-!- ServerMode/#webgui [+o rizen] by irc.freenode.net		01:56
+perlDreamer	kind of makes you wonder if that's already been done, automatic GUI testing, rather than the subset of automated browser testing.	01:56
-!- Netsplit over, joins: @preaction, Khaytsus		01:56
nuba	if you think about koala, its just at the browser level, just at the html	01:56
nuba	i wonder when we would see something of which koala would be a specialization	01:57
+perlDreamer	It's more than HTML, because it's automating clicks and other operations, isn't it?	01:57
nuba	yes	01:59
nuba	but i bet it wont support clicking on a embedded flash in a page	01:59
nuba	or java applets	02:00
nuba	etc.	02:00
nuba	i used to do lots of automation with this tool long ago http://www.networkautomation.com/automate/interface.htm	02:00
nuba	but that was more like the usual recorded macros thing	02:00
@rizen	stupid irc client	02:09
Radix__	perlDreamer: koala could work on IE as well if it worked well with IETab	02:17
+perlDreamer	What's IETab? Does it read and interpret FireFox extensions?	02:23
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:28
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		03:16
-!- rizen_ [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		03:22
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		03:22
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		03:31
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		03:31
-!- rizen_ [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		03:31
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:14
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		04:20
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		04:20
+Radix-wrk	preaction: http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/09/openmoko-neo-1973-and-advanced-dev-kit-finally-for-sale/	05:06
@preaction	damnit damnit damnit	05:07
@preaction	you'll never guess what i just bought...	05:07
+Radix-wrk	heh	05:08
+Radix-wrk	What?	05:08
+Radix-wrk	the openmoko website is dead anyway.. you'd never get an order in :)	05:08
@preaction	samsung upstage	05:08
@preaction	i've got a thirty-day grace period	05:09
@preaction	but it's the only phone i've found that supports bluetooth DUN, and is a half-way decent mp3 player	05:09
* Radix-wrk googles.		05:09
+Radix-wrk	looks chunky	05:09
@preaction	how so? this thing is tiny	05:10
+Radix-wrk	3.5mm jack - that's good	05:10
@preaction	3.5cm by 9cm by .6cm about	05:10
+Radix-wrk	Oh.. sorry.. with the battery wallet	05:10
@preaction	yeah, that's a little bigger	05:11
+Radix-wrk	Okay.. so it's two sided with a button switching between them?	05:11
@preaction	yup	05:11
@preaction	only slightly annoying	05:11
+Radix-wrk	candy bar design.. hmm.. looks nice enough	05:12
+Radix-wrk	Dunno about samsung tho	05:13
+Radix-wrk	How easy is it to connect to your pc and get files on/off it?	05:13
@preaction	it's decently easy, the samsung drivers appear to support everything standard windows	05:14
@preaction	haven't tried OSX yet	05:14
+Radix-wrk	cool	05:14
@preaction	plus they have a not-quite-intuitive music syncing program (not as good as itunes by a long chalk)	05:14
+Radix-wrk	Never used a samsung phone myself.. but I know my mum's LG syncing software is diabolical	05:14
+Radix-wrk	every company does it differently :)	05:15
@preaction	yeah, it'd be best if they all just decided to support the One Standard (the USB file sync and/or bluetooth file sync)	05:15
+Radix-wrk	All should have mini usb connectors imho :)	05:16
@preaction	haven't figured out if it supports bluetooth A2DP yet, there's another phone at spring that does, but it's as big as my old phone (a fracking brick)	05:16
nuba	why isn't webgui listed here: http://freenode.net/primary_groups.shtml ?	05:18
+Radix-wrk	yeah, a2dp is nice, though I ended up not using my stereo bluetooth headset as much as I'd thought I would so sold it to a friend	05:18
nuba	err, #webgui	05:18
nuba	rizen: ?	05:18
@rizen	yes nuba	05:19
nuba	why isn't webgui listed here: http://freenode.net/primary_groups.shtml ?	05:19
@preaction	i want a2dp so i can get a bluetooth enabled head unit for my car, then my awesome will be complete	05:19
nuba	im just curious, not whining..	05:19
@rizen	that's preactions job	05:20
@rizen	he's in charge of irc	05:20
nuba	it seems they can be contacted at web@freenode.net for comments on that page	05:21
@preaction	i'd have to have vrby or you do all the paperwork, they want a contact address / phone number before they'll give out stuff like that if i remember correctly	05:22
nuba	i'd comment that "webgui is missing" :)	05:22
@preaction	they're verified by phone it seems, if i were to fill out a group contact form	05:23
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		06:20
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		06:48
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		09:08
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		09:08
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		09:08
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:08
nuba	here's the reply from web@freenode.net re: link to webgui missing on freenode's website: http://sial.org/pbot/26170	10:24
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:27
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@173.sub-75-206-196.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		16:02
SDuensin	Good morning!	16:06
@rizen	Nooooooooooooooo!	17:01
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		17:14
perlmonkey2	rizen: I've got bad news and worse news. The bad news if I haven't started. The worse news is my project milestone has been pushed back to the middle of next week. So I won't start having, what normal people call, downtime until the middle of next week where I can start on the new survey system. Yes, I am a luser.	17:15
@rizen	that's horrible and terrible news	17:16
perlmonkey2	7.4 is released on the 20th, right?	17:21
@rizen	yes	17:47
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12"]		18:15
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		18:29
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		18:39
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		18:56
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		19:15
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has joined #webgui		19:41
perlmonkey2	Does WebGUI have any way of accepting/managing payments?	20:57
@preaction	the Commerce module, currently "beta"	20:59
@preaction	you can build plugins for payment gateways, currently comes with an Itransact gateway	20:59
@preaction	and i believe there's a community-contributed Paypal one, but don't quote me on that	21:00
@preaction	however, from what i hear Commerce is being completely re-written for 8.0, and done right	21:00
perlmonkey2	8.0? When is 8.0 coming out?	21:03
@preaction	probably quite a while from now	21:08
@preaction	we've gone from 7.1 to 7.4 in the last 10 months of my tenure here, so i'd assume late next year at the very earliest, but that's just idle speculation	21:09
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		21:20
Khaytsus	Goes fairly fast.. I missed about 12 updates in 3 months it seemeed when I last updated.	21:26
Khaytsus	Ad I think I am behind again :)	21:29
Khaytsus	Yep, one release.. But no biggie, I'll wait. It upgradesnicely anyway.	21:39
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		22:01
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		23:29
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		23:29
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@173.sub-75-206-196.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:58
--- Day changed Wed Jul 11 2007
perlmonkey2	I don't want this to sound like a criticism, because it is an honest question, but why does WebGUI need to be installed in the root directory (I've installed it elsewhere, but I had to change hard coded paths in code).	01:34
+perlDreamer	it's just the convention	01:35
@preaction	it's easier to manage. it'd be possible to make the directory configurable, but nobody's done it yet (and i don't know if JT would authorize it)	01:35
perlmonkey2	Good, I like it. I'm documenting my app for delievery, and I'm looking for reasons as to why I force them into installing it in the root directory.	01:36
perlmonkey2	And since I'm already being a nusance, can someone point me at the svn URL? I need to grab the latest.	01:37
+perlDreamer	latest, like 7.4 or latest version of 7.3?	01:38
+perlDreamer	I'm pretty sure it's on the wiki	01:38
perlmonkey2	Okay, I'll check there, thanks.	01:38
+perlDreamer	that has the SVN URL, which is HEAD, which is 7.4	01:39
+perlDreamer	a copy of 7.3 would be found in https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/branch/WebGUI_7.3	01:40
perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: Cool thanks. But if I'm going to try to write something for 7.4 release, shouldn't I be using the 7.4 code base?	01:41
+perlDreamer	yes, but it isn't stable	01:41
+perlDreamer	use at your own risk	01:41
perlmonkey2	perlDreamer: Unless someone is working on a new survey system that happens to use my test namespace, I should be fine :)	01:43
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:45
+perlDreamer	http://www.webgui.org/community-wiki/webgui-releases-and-svn-revision-numbers	01:47
+perlDreamer	Anyone know why the table feature is disabled in the Wiki?	01:48
@preaction	probably because it's just using the Post Rich Editor, which has tables disabled	01:50
@preaction	you could configure it differently, of course	01:51
+perlDreamer	or you could flip into HTML mode and enter it directly, too ;)	01:51
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:12
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has quit []		02:54
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:45
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:45
@preaction	should admins be automatically in the Visitors group?	03:46
+Radix-wrk	aren't admins by definition in every group	03:50
@preaction	yes, but visitors group is only visitors, no?	03:54
@preaction	i mean, in the code, there doesn't seem to be an automatic admins <-> visitors relationship	03:54
+Radix-wrk	Hmm.. visitors may be the exception really.. and kinda makes sense	03:56
+Radix-wrk	there's probably a fair bit of "if not visitor" code around	03:57
@preaction	exactly	03:59
@preaction	but if not visitor = registered user	03:59
@preaction	that's probably better to do	03:59
@preaction	unf, better	04:02
@preaction	fixed that bug	04:02
-!- crythia1 [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:41
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythia1] by ChanServ		04:41
+crythia1	heya	04:41
+Radix-wrk	howdy stranger	04:42
+crythia1	images as assets/attachments?	04:42
+Radix-wrk	yes?	04:43
+crythia1	has a concensus been made?	04:43
+Radix-wrk	I must have missed the discussion - not sure what you're talking about :)	04:44
+crythia1	dev	04:44
+crythia1	dev list thing	04:44
+Radix-wrk	Ahh.. I see the thread	04:46
+Radix-wrk	I'm with the asset crowd	04:46
@preaction	crythia1: the discussion is the dev list, this is more quick one-on-one. for long-term project goals and stuff that needs all the community involved, that's the dev list	04:46
@preaction	reply so JT knows what the community wants	04:46
+Radix-wrk	I still want images inserted into through the html editor to link to the asset, not the image too.	04:47
+Radix-wrk	Was just thinking of adding that as an RFE again	04:47
@preaction	i'm more towards storing JSON objects in the database with more information about attachments	04:47
+crythia1	well, yeah i just wanted to know if anything was hashed out here	04:47
+crythia1	why can't things be hybrids?	04:49
+crythia1	hee	04:49
-!- diakopter [n=diakopte@pdpc/supporter/active/diakopter] has joined #webgui		04:50
+crythia1	they're attached but they can be referenced either as an attachment or asset, depending what you want to do with them.	04:50
+crythia1	meh	04:54
+crythia1	ttfn	04:54
-!- crythia1 [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has left #webgui []		04:54
* Radix-wrk adds a new RFE and waits for JT to say he hates it.		05:22
* diakopter says JT hates it, for him.		05:31
diakopter	(j/k; I haven't even looked at the rfe)	05:31
perlmonkey2	Is there a standard object for use to communicate with Ajaxified pages?	05:37
@preaction	nope, unless you want httpproxy	05:40
perlmonkey2	Or would you just use the standard www_ calls and have the ajax handle the results?	05:40
perlmonkey2	Which probably means a framework of objects on the ajax side shoudl be developed with YUI.	05:41
@preaction	that's what i do, usually i call them www_ajax*	05:41
perlmonkey2	preaction: cool.	05:41
@preaction	and that's underway too, in www/extras/yui-webgui	05:41
perlmonkey2	you guys think of everything :)	05:41
@preaction	not everything, but a lot	05:42
Khaytsus	I should try the project management and wiki.. I haven't yet	06:12
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has left #webgui []		06:15
* Radix-wrk just uploaded a Lightbox2 webgui package to webgui.org for anyone interested.		06:20
Khaytsus	What would that be?	06:24
Khaytsus	Project Management is a little klunky, but usable mostly	06:26
@preaction	yeah, that one needs to be redone	06:26
+Radix-wrk	http://www.webgui.org/user_contributions/user_contributions/packages/lightbox2-template-package	06:27
+Radix-wrk	Just added a link to my test page showing examples of it's use	06:27
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		06:28
Khaytsus	That's pretty cool	06:29
Khaytsus	I have been meaning to put a limited photo album in mine, but have yet to do it	06:29
+Radix-wrk	yeah, that's what I thought, so I got it to work in webgui :)	06:30
Khaytsus	heh	06:30
Khaytsus	So you're a webgui consultant? Interesting.	06:30
+Radix-wrk	yeah, just starting it up as a business really.	06:31
+Radix-wrk	just a sideline afterhours really	06:31
Khaytsus	ah, gotcha.. WebGUI is a good platform. I use about 2% of it I think ;-)	06:32
Khaytsus	Man I know I'm a complete tard, but I'm not even sure how to start a WIki page.. Guess I'll try editing the content with some standard wiki stuff and see what happens..	06:33
+Radix-wrk	you have to search for something before it'll let you add new	06:37
Khaytsus	oh, doh.. That's a shortcut to it in TWiki, didn't think about that.	06:38
Khaytsus	I always make a WikiWord so it's not orphaned	06:38
Khaytsus	That's a little unclear...	06:38
+Radix-wrk	I happen to agree :)	06:39
Khaytsus	And the WikiWord links are... odd	06:42
Khaytsus	ThisWord, the link is Word	06:42
Khaytsus	I'll have to try that template tommorrow, neat stuff	06:47
Khaytsus	Hey, that was easy ;-)	06:56
Khaytsus	I need to resize the images, ahem :)	06:56
Khaytsus	Be nice if I could figure out how to display all the images directly, rather than in an album below the main page.	07:00
Khaytsus	I must be missing something :)	07:01
+Radix-wrk	Hmm.. not sure how you'd do that, but it might be possible	07:07
+Radix-wrk	the images are attached to a thread - and essentially you're viewing a thread when you click on an album	07:07
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		07:21
@preaction	would it be prudent for a feature to make links? i mean everything else can be handled by the HTML editor, but perhaps let [[WikiWord]] be a wiki link?	07:27
@preaction	that would probably make things a lot better for the wiki	07:27
@preaction	that and adding Category pages	07:27
@preaction	or Tag pages	07:27
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		08:00
@rizen	tags are in	08:14
@rizen	added it to 7.4	08:14
@rizen	as far as making links, i'd prefer that stuff only gets automagically linked or hand linked. i don't like wikis that link to pages that don't exist	08:15
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Connection timed out]		08:17
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:11
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Connection timed out]		10:38
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:51
Khaytsus	I personally prefer to make preferences to WikiWords that I plan on defining, then defining them. Yes, I doo hate when those WikiWords don't get defined, but at least the template is there.	13:39
Khaytsus	That's always how I create pages in TWiki myself; fill in content and WikiWords as I go along, then go in and fill in each of the WikiWords content.	13:40
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:09
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@102.sub-75-207-150.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:40
SDuensin	Greetings!	15:44
-!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		15:48
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		16:50
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		17:03
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		17:03
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has joined #webgui		17:12
jdan	Hi everybody. I'm new to WebGUI 7, but very familiar with WebGUI 5. I am looking form document which describe how to testing new Perl modules. The problem is that I have to restart Apache every time I change source. Could someone point me any solution how to set my environment?	17:22
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@102.sub-75-207-150.myvzw.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		17:37
Radix__	jdan: is this what you're looking for? http://www.webgui.org/community-wiki/configure-the-wre-for-developers	17:46
Radix__	http://www.webgui.org/webgui/dev/discuss/stop--start/6 - this topic has more info as well on how to configure Apache2::Reload	17:48
jdan	Radix__: Almost. I don't use WRE. So I am trying configure my Apache2 to work with Apache2::Reload. Unfortunately I don't know how to set WebGUI path to @INC in config	17:49
Radix__	Check out that second topic then	17:50
Radix__	IMHO if you're not using the WRE then you're shooting yourself in the foot from the get-go ;)	17:50
Radix__	Good luck! :)	17:51
* Radix__ wanders off to bed.		17:51
jdan	ok, I will install WRE on my Debian.	17:52
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@71.sub-75-206-78.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		17:56
jdan	Radix__: I found solution. I added "PerlSwitches -Ipath-to-webgui_lib" and Apache2 reload modules if it is changed	18:05
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has quit ["Leaving"]		18:21
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		19:01
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix_] by ChanServ		19:01
-!- Radix__ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		19:02
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: Khaytsus		19:26
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has joined #webgui		19:26
-!- Netsplit over, joins: Khaytsus		19:28
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@71.sub-75-206-78.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		19:31
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@168.sub-75-207-41.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		19:39
-!- besonen_mobile_ [n=besonen_@71-220-233-253.eugn.qwest.net] has joined #webgui		20:40
-!- Radix__ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		20:41
-!- besonen_mobile [n=besonen_@71-220-233-253.eugn.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		20:41
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		20:41
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		21:03
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		21:03
+perlDreamer	I need a cross platform check on a test that's failing.	21:17
+perlDreamer	Does anyone have 5 minutes to run a test for me on their system?	21:17
@rizen	i have osx ppc, will that work?	21:21
+perlDreamer	sure.	21:21
@rizen	and i only have 7.4 set up right now...can i use that?	21:21
+perlDreamer	Yes.	21:21
@rizen	ok then	21:21
@rizen	what do you need?	21:21
+perlDreamer	export WEBGUI_CONFIG=/data/WebGUI/etc/rizens.conf	21:22
@rizen	done	21:22
+perlDreamer	cd /data/WebGUI/t	21:22
+perlDreamer	perl Macro/FetchMimeType.t	21:22
@rizen	should i update to latest?	21:22
@rizen	i'm probably a few hours behind	21:22
+perlDreamer	It won't matter	21:22
@rizen	k	21:22
+perlDreamer	Does the test pass?	21:23
@rizen	running	21:23
@rizen	no	21:23
@rizen	1..7	21:23
@rizen	ok 1 - use WebGUI::Macro::FetchMimeType;	21:23
@rizen	ok 2 - gif	21:23
@rizen	ok 3 - jpeg	21:23
@rizen	not ok 4 - plain text	21:23
@rizen	# Failed test 'plain text'	21:23
@rizen	# in Macro/FetchMimeType.t at line 73.	21:23
@rizen	# got: 'application/octet-stream'	21:23
@rizen	# expected: 'text/plain'	21:23
@rizen	ok 5 - octet-stream for unknown type	21:23
@rizen	ok 6 - Null path returns application/octet-stream	21:23
@rizen	ok 7 - Undef path returns undef	21:23
@rizen	# Looks like you failed 1 test of 7.	21:23
+perlDreamer	weird	21:23
+perlDreamer	It looks like javascript files are handled differently than they have been in the past.	21:24
+perlDreamer	I'll update the test.	21:24
+perlDreamer	The test suite caught two fatal bugs today, so now I'm doing other triage.	21:25
@rizen	cool	21:26
+perlDreamer	13788 tests run, all clean	21:42
+perlDreamer	I'll run the CODE_COP tests later, too	21:42
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		21:43
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		23:24
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@168.sub-75-207-41.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:55
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		23:56
--- Day changed Thu Jul 12 2007
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has joined #webgui		01:10
Khaytsus	Hmmmm, how does one convert an article into a thread? I was thinking I saw a way to do that once. I have a handful of articles that I now want to put into a collaboration system (Topics template0	01:40
Khaytsus	Copy and paste I suppose... I tried just moving them into the Collaboration System under Manage, but that didn't do much :)	01:40
@rizen	copy and paste the content	01:40
Khaytsus	k, I figured that was gonna be the asnwer.	01:40
@rizen	if it were more than a handful, it may be useful to write a program to do it	01:41
@rizen	but in this case..not really	01:41
Khaytsus	Nah, not too many	01:41
Khaytsus	Just figured I might be missing something	01:42
Khaytsus	Thanks :)	01:42
-!- Radix__ is now known as Radix_		02:11
-!- Radix_ changed the topic of #webgui to: [ WebGUI 7.3.20 \| WRE 0.7.2 ] - Come To The WUC http://www.plainblack.com/wuc		02:11
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix_] by ChanServ		02:11
+Radix_	preaction: what's with the multiple personalities? :) ie. DBell and preaction on the forums	02:21
@preaction	apparently "alias" isn't good enough for some parts of WebGUI	02:23
@preaction	i imagine i'll go into the db and change my username someday	02:23
+Radix_	heh	02:23
+Radix_	Alias works - but each thread post must embed the name used or something	02:25
+Radix_	http://www.webgui.org/install/upgrade_help/installing-webgui-7_3_19-problem/5#idALwBgIblIekyP2AiAldqOA	02:25
+Radix_	your first reply is listed as DBell, then the second is preaction	02:25
+Radix_	same userid each time tho	02:25
@preaction	yeah, between there i changed my alias	02:25
@preaction	(the original alias defaults to username)	02:26
+Radix_	do you know if a 7.3.21 is planned at all?	02:30
@preaction	i think it is, i think there'll be one more stable release before 7.4	02:32
+Radix_	if you get a chance, could you roll this one line change into it? - http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/left-admin-bar-overlap-problem	02:32
@preaction	but 7.4 was pushed back, so there might be another	02:32
+Radix_	it was posted a while back, but I don't think anyone noticed	02:33
@preaction	it was just a damned specificity problem?	02:33
+Radix_	just z-index wasn't set for the right object	02:33
+Radix_	or rather was set in wrong css tag	02:33
@preaction	.slidePanel and #slidePanel refer to the same thing (in theory), but classes are "less specific" than IDs, which assigns them less weight to the cascade, so z-index: 100; becomes more important	02:34
@preaction	i'll put this on my to-do list	02:34
+Radix_	no, .slidepanel is included only if class="slidepanel", #slidepanel is only included if id="slidepanel"	02:35
+Radix_	cheers anyway	02:36
* Radix_ heads off to work.		02:38
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		03:07
@rizen	radix, yes there will be a 7.3.21 release	03:08
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		03:11
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has quit []		03:14
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:53
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:53
perlmonkey2	rizen: (Concerning the survey) Since a lot of survey's are eventually exported either into number crunchers like SPSS, or to reporting applications, could we add a way to assign user defined variable names to each question, and then an export option which would transpose the results with the columns labeled with the user defined variable names?	03:56
@rizen	can you do it in such a way that doesn't make the export system difficult to use?	03:57
+Radix-wrk	Why not just use webgui to display the results?	03:57
@rizen	cuz a lot of people just want to export to a spreadsheet or something	03:57
perlmonkey2	rizen: definetly, I'd make the user defined variable names optional and just another column in the question table, not used until the user exports as TAB TRANSPOSED or something.	03:58
@rizen	i'm all for making the system better	03:59
@rizen	so sure	03:59
perlmonkey2	groovy	03:59
perlmonkey2	by-the-by, the new (I guess it is new) youtube vid is pretty slick. Nice graphics and voice over.	04:00
@rizen	it's actually been on our site for 6 months	04:02
@rizen	but the reorg of our site brought it front and center	04:02
@rizen	thanks	04:02
perlmonkey2	I usually look at your site from work where I'm running 64 bit fedora ie no Flash.	04:02
+Radix-wrk	imho it's not wow enough - it's just a powerpoint slide with a voiceover	04:03
perlmonkey2	For a FOSS project it's pretty frik'n major.	04:03
+Radix-wrk	that said, it's better than one I could make :)	04:03
@rizen	we're talking about a business productivity tool here...how wow can you get?	04:04
@rizen	it's not like we're doing 3d animation, or cutting off people's heads	04:04
@rizen	=)	04:05
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		04:41
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		04:41
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		04:42
perlmonkey2	Okay, I'm an idiot, and not afraid to admit it. On my fresh install of F7, I'm trying to creating a WebGUI instance from the svn latest. But I'm missing jpg's and the admin bar won't appear. I'm positive this has to do with permissions, but I've given apache the golden key to everything.	04:44
perlmonkey2	Is someone working on the workflow?	05:06
perlmonkey2	"Root cause: Unknown column 'mode' in 'where clause'"	05:06
@rizen	yes i made some changes to workflow	05:08
@rizen	you need to run the upgrade	05:08
perlmonkey2	running the upgrade didn't work. "NO UPGRADES NECESSARY". Is there a way to force it?	05:16
@rizen	what version is your database?	05:17
perlmonkey2	crap	05:17
@rizen	this is just a dev instance right?	05:17
perlmonkey2	no, the database should be the latest.	05:17
perlmonkey2	correct	05:17
@rizen	ok then do this	05:17
perlmonkey2	I recreated the database after svn update	05:17
@rizen	mysql -e "drop database dbname; create database dbname"	05:18
@rizen	mysql dbname < /data/WebGUI/docs/previousVersion.sql	05:18
@rizen	cd /data/WebGUI/sbin	05:18
@rizen	perl upgrade.pl	05:18
perlmonkey2	ic....cool, thanks.	05:18
@rizen	if you do that, then you'll be all good	05:18
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: +Radix_		05:18
@rizen	i usually create a script to do that among other things	05:19
@rizen	cuz i screw up my database a lot while developing	05:19
@rizen	you may want to consider making one too	05:19
perlmonkey2	Good idea, I'll do that.	05:19
@rizen	if you want, i can give you my script	05:20
-!- Netsplit over, joins: Radix_		05:20
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix_] by ChanServ		05:20
perlmonkey2	That would be even better.	05:21
@rizen	http://rafb.net/p/tL6yRZ40.html	05:25
perlmonkey2	Thanks	05:26
@rizen	np	05:26
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		05:59
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		06:07
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		06:18
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		06:18
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has left #webgui []		06:23
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		06:56
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		07:57
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		09:36
-!- Leon [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has joined #webgui		10:01
Leon	any one here ?	10:01
+Radix-wrk	Yup	10:03
Leon	is this a help channel or what ? hehe	10:03
+Radix-wrk	To a certain extent.. if we can help anyway :)	10:03
Leon	hehe...	10:03
Leon	listen then.. maybe you can	10:03
Leon	i installed webgui 7.3.19 yest..	10:03
Leon	but having a problem with images, and can't get the idea of what the problem can be as i tried all permisions..	10:04
Leon	www.ecwdp.com	10:04
+Radix-wrk	Checked your webgui logs?	10:04
Leon	can it be a problem with spectre ?	10:05
+Radix-wrk	perlbot paste	10:05
perlbot	Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl or http://erxz.com/pb and #perl will be able to view it.	10:05
+Radix-wrk	paste a copy of your webgui.log in using one of those sites and let me know the url you get.	10:06
+Radix-wrk	I reckon your permissions are setup wrong though at a guess	10:06
+Radix-wrk	you have to ensure that the entire uploads folder is chown to nobody:nobody	10:07
Leon	http://sial.org/pbot/26233	10:07
Leon	yep nobody.nobody	10:07
+Radix-wrk	and what is apache set to run under?	10:08
+Radix-wrk	most distro's use nobody, but perhaps it's using something different?	10:08
+Radix-wrk	www or something maybe	10:08
Leon	i setted up apache to run as nobody.nobody	10:08
Leon	# User/Group: The name (or #number) of the user/group to run httpd as.	10:09
Leon	# It is usually good practice to create a dedicated user and group for	10:09
Leon	# running httpd, as with most system services.	10:09
Leon	#	10:09
Leon	User nobody	10:09
Leon	Group nobody	10:09
Leon	</IfModule>	10:09
Leon	i have 2 apaches running on the same machine..	10:10
+Radix-wrk	and what are the permissions on that file/dir?	10:10
Leon	apache1 and apache2	10:10
+Radix-wrk	on the /home/WebGUI/www/ one	10:10
Leon	tried with 600, 666, 755, 775	10:10
+Radix-wrk	Hmm.. wierd	10:10
Leon	yeah i can't get the idea of what the problem is :/	10:11
Leon	can it be a problem with spectre ?	10:11
+Radix-wrk	no, doesn't look like it's getting that far	10:11
+Radix-wrk	WebGUI is trying to simply store the files on the disk, and it's failing to create the directories at all	10:11
+Radix-wrk	what distro are you using?	10:12
Leon	red hat enterprise 4	10:12
+Radix-wrk	and where did you get the apache from? yum or the cd itself?	10:12
Leon	and apache 2.2.4	10:12
Leon	from apache's website	10:13
+Radix-wrk	Oh.. so you compiled it yourself?	10:13
Leon	yep	10:13
+Radix-wrk	Hmm..	10:13
+Radix-wrk	Are you sure it's using the apache.conf that you think it is?	10:13
Leon	the httpd.conf you mean ?	10:14
+Radix-wrk	yeah	10:14
Leon	yeah apache1 and apache2 are running on different ip's	10:14
+Radix-wrk	using two separate copies of apache?	10:14
Leon	yes	10:15
Leon	cpanel only works with apache1 atm	10:15
+Radix-wrk	could the webgui apache be using the httpd.conf from the other apache setup?	10:15
Leon	no i don't think so..	10:16
Leon	because there isn't the setup of mod_perl on the apache1	10:17
Leon	and i have another server with same setup... i have webgui 5.2.12 on it	10:17
Leon	it works fine	10:17
+Radix-wrk	Hmm...	10:18
+Radix-wrk	When you dumped the module config before from your httpd.conf - you said "<Leon> </IfModule>" at the end	10:18
+Radix-wrk	what module was that?	10:19
Leon	aha	10:19
Leon	<IfModule !mpm_netware_module>	10:19
+Radix-wrk	err..	10:20
Leon	apache kemm with it..	10:20
+Radix-wrk	user and group shouldn't need to be defined inside a ifmodule tag	10:20
Leon	*came	10:20
Leon	i tried to make them outside the tag	10:21
Leon	but the start	10:21
Leon	*didn't	10:21
* Radix-wrk applies his language parser to the above few lines and tries to make head or tail of its meaning.		10:23
Leon	lol	10:23
Leon	i tried defining the user and group outside the ifmodule tag..	10:24
Leon	but then apache didn't start	10:24
+Radix-wrk	Hmm.. that's odd	10:24
+Radix-wrk	Any particular reason why you didn't just use the wre?	10:24
Leon	hmm no i don't think so..	10:25
Leon	wre if i have perl already installed it will skip it or ?	10:25
+Radix-wrk	the WRE is complete by itself	10:25
Leon	so it won't clash with already installed?	10:26
+Radix-wrk	Good question	10:26
Leon	hehe	10:26
+Radix-wrk	ideally no, though I know the wre mysql will be overridden if you already have one	10:27
+Radix-wrk	it comes with a compiled and optimised apache/modperl/modproxy setup	10:27
+Radix-wrk	and some very nifty scripts for adding sites, etc	10:27
Leon	hmm..	10:27
+Radix-wrk	it's also the recommended way of installing Webgui	10:27
+Radix-wrk	WebGUI relies on a lot of perl scripts, and the ones in cpan aren't always the best ones to use	10:28
Leon	hehe.. i installed the 5.2.12 without wre and thought 7.3.19 would be something simimalr	10:28
Leon	what was that of mysql thing ?	10:28
+Radix-wrk	yeah, the 5.x series was a lot easier to install, webgui has grown heaps since then, but also added a lot more perl modules	10:29
+Radix-wrk	the WRE makes all that so much easier to manage	10:29
Leon	i'll try it off..	10:29
Leon	it won't earase my databases right ?	10:29
+Radix-wrk	yikes, I should hope not :)	10:30
Leon	i hope so..	10:30
Leon	lol	10:30
+Radix-wrk	that said, always make a backup!	10:30
Leon	i'll try it off..	10:31
Leon	thanks for your help :)	10:31
+Radix-wrk	np	10:31
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has joined #webgui		11:04
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:06
Leon	any one can help ?	11:58
-!- Leon [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has quit []		12:18
Khaytsus	I haven't tried the WRE, as I didn't want to dedicate the whole server to webgui. I have other cgi's, php, etc, running on the box. Perhaps there's a way to coexist or have the WRE use the existing httpd.	14:07
Khaytsus	(Just a statement... :)	14:07
Khaytsus	I wonder if 7.x has gotten more difficul to install.. 6.8 wasn't too bad, but it took a heck of a lot of compiling modules (some of which would compile on their own, some I had to compile... which was odd)	14:08
pjesi	Khaytsus: they are coexisting over here	14:59
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@59.sub-75-206-65.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:30
SDuensin	Good morning.	15:36
Khaytsus	pjesi: I'll have to try it, I read it as they wouldn't.	15:53
pjesi	my setup is basically WRE + normal http	16:09
pjesi	I use the mod_proxy in the WRE to serve requests to the regualr http	16:09
pjesi	mod_proxy on 80, mod_perl on 81, and then the distro http with whatever php and stuff on other port	16:10
jdan	Hey, how $self->session->form->process works? I can't found 'process' subroutine. I have to view it to learn how it works.	16:28
jdan	Definitely I don't know how WebGUI::Form inherit process subroutine	16:31
pjesi	SDuensin: you in #eclipse? :P	16:43
SDuensin	Yep. I'm losing a battle with it and seriously need help.	16:45
pjesi	sorry I have not had that usecase for it	16:48
SDuensin	I have, and it's a serious issue. :-(	16:55
pjesi	what are you using eclipse for?	16:59
SDuensin	My ZK Desktop project.	17:00
pjesi	are you using Europa?	17:01
SDuensin	Yea	17:01
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		17:09
jdan	Sorry for my foolish question. I mistaked WebGUI::Form with WebGUI::Session::Form. Ech	17:17
-!- wenzu [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has joined #webgui		18:56
wenzu	anyone here ?	18:56
@preaction	yes'm	18:57
wenzu	what does the commit changes does in webgui ?	18:57
wenzu	i'm used with old webgui and can't figure out how to change style in the new one	18:57
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has quit ["Leaving"]		18:58
@preaction	when you change an asset, you create a new Revision of that asset. that revision is marked as "pending" until it's committed (when it's marked as "approved")	18:58
@preaction	the latest version of an approved asset is the one that appears, unless you have your own pending version (are working under your own version tag)	18:59
wenzu	couse before i created my own style... done it in webgui and everything.. and i was seeing it logged in.. when i logged out everything was gone..	19:00
@preaction	because you did not commit your version tag	19:00
wenzu	so.. i'll create a version tag..	19:01
wenzu	do everything, and then commit ?	19:01
@preaction	they're created automatically	19:01
wenzu	and what things come locked ?	19:02
wenzu	*why	19:02
@preaction	because they're being edited under a different version tag	19:03
wenzu	ah ic	19:03
@preaction	(incidentally, this and more is all explained in the Content Manager's Guide from Plain Black)	19:03
wenzu	so my main problem are the version tags	19:03
wenzu	hehe	19:03
wenzu	ah shi...	19:04
wenzu	i was only looking at webgui.org	19:04
@preaction	i'm an employee at plainblack, gotta push the product (especially when it answers so many questions)	19:06
wenzu	didn't release how much webgui changed from my old 5.1.12	19:07
wenzu	totally different	19:07
@rizen	once you get used to it, i think you'll find that it may be totally different, but it's totally better	19:08
@preaction	yeah, hopefully people start coming out from the 5.x/6.x rock	19:08
wenzu	i'll just press commit my changes and thats all ?	19:13
@preaction	the comment page will pop up and request you insert a comment, but that's optional, and then "save" and then spectre will do the commit, usually in a few seconds	19:14
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		19:15
wenzu	sorry i'm going to annoy you...	19:18
wenzu	i created a folder.. commited changes.. and folder isn't there	19:19
@rizen	is this on a custom server or on demo.webgui.org?	19:20
wenzu	custom	19:20
@rizen	are you sure you have spectre set up correctly?	19:20
@rizen	log in to your server	19:20
@rizen	and type	19:20
@rizen	cd /data/WebGUI/sbin	19:20
wenzu	aha	19:20
@rizen	perl spectre.pl --test	19:20
@rizen	spectre is the workflow governor	19:21
@rizen	you can't commit changes without it	19:21
wenzu	ah shit	19:21
wenzu	ERROR: Spectre cannot communicate with WebGUI. Perhaps you need to adjust the spectreSubnets setting in this config file:	19:21
@rizen	ding - we have a winner	19:22
@rizen	=)	19:22
wenzu	lol	19:22
wenzu	this webgui is making me mad	19:23
@rizen	don't be mad	19:23
@rizen	you have to have some faith...once you get it up and running, you're going to love 7.x	19:23
@rizen	and not know how you ever even survived with 5.x	19:23
wenzu	hehe	19:23
@rizen	i quite literally hear that all the time	19:24
@rizen	people always hate 7 if they've used 5	19:24
@rizen	but then they get used to it	19:24
@rizen	and can't imagine how they ever used 5	19:24
wenzu	5 is nice and easy :P	19:24
@rizen	you say that now	19:24
@rizen	i'll talk to you at the beginning of august	19:25
@rizen	after you've been using 7 for a bit	19:25
wenzu	and easy too install too :P	19:25
@rizen	so is webgui 7	19:25
@rizen	if you do it following the instructions	19:25
@rizen	meaning use the WRE	19:25
wenzu	i did	19:25
wenzu	but now i got this error in spectre	19:25
@rizen	did you answer the question about subnets correctly when you installed the WRE?	19:26
wenzu	i guess yes	19:27
@rizen	edit your webgui config	19:27
wenzu	i can't see the subnet setting in spectre.conf :/	19:27
@rizen	look for spectreSubnets	19:27
@rizen	it's not in there it's in the webgui config	19:27
@rizen	make sure it looks like	19:28
wenzu	ah this is strange... i only have WebGUI.conf.original	19:28
SDuensin	wenzu - I was a huge fan of 5.x and never went to 6. After 7 "clicks" with you, 5 looks downright primitive. It's fantastic.	19:28
SDuensin	(Hi rizen)	19:28
@rizen	"spectreSubnets" : ["127.0.0.1/32", "1.1.1.1/32"],	19:28
@rizen	where 1.1.1.1 is replaced with your server's IP	19:28
@rizen	howdy SD	19:29
wenzu	i only have WebGUI.conf.original	19:29
wenzu	strange eh ?	19:29
@rizen	you should also have	19:29
@rizen	www.yoursite.com.conf	19:29
@rizen	that's your webgui config	19:29
wenzu	a ok	19:29
SDuensin	rizen - Totally off topic, but I shipped a HUGE update to the ZK Desktop. The new super-duper Wonder Grid CRUD tool is in!	19:30
@rizen	ZK Desktop is only for doobie smokers and crank yankers	19:30
@rizen	WebGUI Desktop is where it's at	19:30
@rizen	=)	19:30
@rizen	thanks for the heads up SD, i'll have to get a download	19:31
SDuensin	Yea, and on that front, I did some reading about YUI + EXT today. Wow does that produce some awesome looking UIs.	19:31
@rizen	yeah YUI and Ext are amazing, they just aren't neat autogen frameworks like ZK is	19:32
@rizen	they have the super flexible, powerful, and well documented API's	19:32
@rizen	but it would be nice if they also had some prebuilt power tools like zk	19:33
@rizen	i suppose then	19:33
@rizen	they couldn't be server side neutral though	19:33
@rizen	which is why they don't do it	19:33
SDuensin	Like I said before, my whole reason for ZK was the server-side stuff. It's great not having to deal with the browser.	19:33
SDuensin	Yup.	19:33
wenzu	its ok now..	19:34
wenzu	thanks rizen :)	19:34
wenzu	one other think..	19:34
wenzu	can i edit something so that when i create a new site its config will be with the right subnet ?	19:35
@rizen	yes	19:36
@rizen	it's /data/wre/var/hoster.arg.cache	19:37
@rizen	if you make it look like this then you'll be good:	19:37
@rizen	spectreSubnets:10.0.0.101/32, \	19:37
@rizen	127.0.0.1/32	19:37
wenzu	k fixed :)	19:37
wenzu	ur the king of the swing	19:38
@rizen	use 7 for a month, then i dare you to tell me you still like 5 better than 7	19:38
wenzu	hehe	19:39
@rizen	i say there's a 95% chance you won't be able to do it	19:39
wenzu	i hope so..	19:39
wenzu	and is the adminbar a bit bugged or is mine a bit fu.... ?	19:39
SDuensin	99% :-)	19:39
wenzu	ah i think the "bug" was the spectre lol	19:40
wenzu	ok this is far better now working fine :)	19:41
wenzu	let me take the opportunity and ask another thing that i didn't find on 5..	19:42
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		19:42
wenzu	can i make like a page in the style lets say.. on the right hand side of the website.. and it will be updateable..	19:42
wenzu	bot a template with the numbers like 5 was.. i want it in every page and updateable	19:43
wenzu	*not	19:43
SDuensin	Same thing on each page?	19:43
wenzu	yes	19:43
SDuensin	Shortcuts!	19:43
SDuensin	You can make a shortcut of an asset and paste it elsewhere on the site.	19:44
SDuensin	Or include the asset in the style with a macro.	19:44
wenzu	hmm	19:44
wenzu	i'll try that	19:44
wenzu	cheers :)	19:45
SDuensin	Enjoy!	19:45
wenzu	i'll do	19:46
wenzu	its surely faster eh	19:47
@rizen	Read the wiki about the ^AssetProxy(); macr	19:48
@rizen	macro	19:48
wenzu	thanks again :)	19:48
wenzu	very helpfull guys	19:48
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		19:52
-!- wenzu [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has quit []		19:56
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		19:57
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		19:57
ckotil	anyone hear of cosign integration into webgui?	20:52
ckotil	its another sso solution.	20:52
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		20:54
@rizen	i heard it when you said it on irc last week	21:00
@rizen	=)	21:00
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		21:02
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		21:02
ckotil	yah, i said we were thinking about moving to cosign	21:16
ckotil	we have development cosign servers up and running.	21:17
ckotil	its going to be a breeze to switch everything to cosign, and since it has a kerberos backend. the change will not be very drastic, only a cosmetic change to our users.	21:17
ckotil	but, so far we havent figured out an elegant solution to make a pluggable authentication module for webgui.	21:18
@preaction	what's the backend? are there command-line authorization scripts? are there Perl modules for authentication or perhaps something you can use with Inline::* modules?	22:18
ckotil	its perl.	22:24
ckotil	dunno about using modules with it.	22:24
@preaction	if it's written in Perl it should be trivial to build an auth module against it (or at least not exceedingly difficult)	22:26
@preaction	this looks like C	22:30
ckotil	compiled cgi	22:32
ckotil	hrmm maybe the daemon IS c	22:32
ckotil	3001#12345# type this into your iPhones!	22:32
ckotil	'field info'	22:32
ckotil	aka debug mode	22:32
@preaction	theoretically though wouldn't you use the cosign server to actually do the auth, and only use the WebGUI::Auth::Cosign to get a username from the cosign cookie?	22:33
@preaction	so you only really need to be able to read the cookie and get a webgui userId from it	22:34
ckotil	ah.	22:34
ckotil	yeah that sounds good.	22:34
ckotil	pretty much how CAS sso works.	22:34
@preaction	unfortunately, like most code that i get to read, nobody ever documents or comments, so since i don't really know C, this is a lot of gibberish	22:34
@preaction	but it looks like a cookie named "cosign" is created with two text strings separated by a / (one called "new_cookiebuf" and another called "tv.tv_sec") <- if you find out what those two things are, you can find out who's logged in and what's happening with it	22:36
@preaction	but it also seems that cosign requires SSL	22:37
@preaction	have you ever looked at Yadis / OpenID (or LID)? i know OpenID is written in Perl and would be easy to port to WebGUI	22:39
ckotil	we have not.	22:41
ckotil	so the problem we're going to run into with cosign is that it pretty mcuh requires webgui to be behind mod_cosign.	22:42
ckotil	which will be a problem.	22:42
ckotil	and you cannot remotley check on teh cosigns cookie.	22:42
@preaction	i dunno, it seems that cosign serves central auth. there must be a remote interface for apps to verify auth	22:43
ckotil	they have these things called filters.	22:44
ckotil	which allow for remote checking of the cookies.	22:44
ckotil	but supposedly they are a bi0tch to create.	22:44
ckotil	i have a more pressing issue. i upgraded to red hat 5, and now when i try to execute perl preload.perl it tries to run perl5.5.8 rather than 5.8.8	22:45
ckotil	i ran into this when i first started using webgui, and i forgot how to fix it.	22:46
@preaction	what does ls -l /usr/bin/perl say? you might have to point /usr/bin/perl somewhere else	22:46
ckotil	./usr/bin/perl	22:46
ckotil	and perl -v shows 5.8.8	22:52
ckotil	my only guess is that APR or libapreq are majorly screwed up	22:53
@rizen	FYI: http://www.plainblack.com/news/news/webgui/perl-developer-position#lc7UqGyASnjmvbougzs8YQ	22:55
@rizen	FYI: http://www.plainblack.com/news/news/web-support-and-training-specialist	22:56
ckotil	rizen: scroll up and type that number into your iphone.	22:57
ckotil	via the phone keypad	22:57
@rizen	how do i get back out of that mode?	22:57
ckotil	home button.	22:58
ckotil	back out with the tabs.	22:58
ckotil	you're not stuck there or anything.	22:58
@rizen	cool	22:59
ckotil	ya, some witty developer can use this to triangulate your location	22:59
perlmonkey2	I can answer the Perl dev questions pretty easy, but I'm morally obligated to continue at my current place.	23:17
perlmonkey2	and '\r' are the devil.	23:19
perlmonkey2	But wouldn't it be cool to work, like as a job, for WebGUI?	23:20
perlmonkey2	document.getElementById("x").innerHTML implies x is a <div> right?	23:23
perlmonkey2	My JS is rusty.	23:23
@preaction	i'm bound by desire to keep my body parts to not help you with that one :(	23:23
perlmonkey2	discussing that probably defeats the purpose of it being on the job post, so I"ll go back to shutting up.	23:23
diakopter	perlmonkey: no, that doesn't assume x is a <div>	23:44
diakopter	perlmonkey2 I mean	23:44
@preaction	a note though: innerHTML, while supported by FF and IE (and maybe WebKit), is not W3C canon	23:49
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@59.sub-75-206-65.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:51
@rizen	preaction, shouldn't you be leaving soon?	23:53
@preaction	i've got an hour yet, yes	23:54
@preaction	if the durned bank didn't have a crisis over my ability to pay (and i didn't have to come up with an additional $750) i wouldn't be 5 hours behind today... i'm going to look like someone strung me out for a week...	23:54
perlmonkey2	1. I read up on innerhtml and while I only have exp. using it in the way I spoke, I was wrong. 2. I'm a jackarse for even talking about it, because this is a test for interviewers, and someone reading here could unfairly pass that hurdle.	23:55
ckotil	heh	23:56
--- Day changed Fri Jul 13 2007
nuba	sigh >... US Citizen, and able to pass Federal security clearance.	00:13
nuba	poor us people, non-US people :/	00:14
@rizen	poor plain black for not being able to hire non-us people	00:17
nuba	heh	00:17
nuba	you need a sister company, which then gets contracted by plainblack ;)	00:18
nuba	BlackPlain LCC	00:20
perlmonkey2	BlainPlack	00:20
nuba	PainBlack, "for you painfull coding needs!"	00:21
nuba	-l	00:21
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		00:30
@rizen	i'm afraid we still couldn't hire you	00:30
@rizen	for the same reasons	00:30
@rizen	or at least you couldn't work on government projects	00:30
@rizen	which we have a lot of	00:30
ckotil	heh	00:40
ckotil	anyone know how to remove things from @INC?	00:40
ckotil	ive got soo many paths to old perl versions	00:40
@rizen	shift	00:41
@rizen	pop	00:41
@rizen	poop	00:41
ckotil	but is that permanent?	00:44
ckotil	id rather not have to do it for every perl applicatiotn.	00:44
@rizen	no	00:44
@rizen	no idea where the permanent file is for that	00:44
ckotil	well, preload.perl seems to be the only thing that complains.	00:44
@rizen	try perlmonks	00:44
ckotil	ok ill just shift it out.	00:44
ckotil	thx	00:44
@rizen	i was kidding about shift	00:45
@rizen	i don't know if that will work or not	00:45
ckotil	might.	00:45
@rizen	might	00:45
ckotil	get this. my ihone had the shittiest battery out of all the iphones ive seen. theres 6 of them in my office.	00:45
@rizen	you're just lucky i guess	00:45
ckotil	i haev a loaner from apple while mine is in the shop. its going on 3 days straight with the factory charge.	00:46
@rizen	btw...are you ready to check in those triggers?	00:46
ckotil	i want to keep this phone...	00:46
ckotil	sort of.	00:46
ckotil	half anyway	00:46
ckotil	ill get you them tonight.	00:46
ckotil	sorry for slacking.	00:48
ckotil	heading home now.	00:48
perlmonkey2	ckotil: I think you have to recompile and the consensus on #perl appears to agree.	00:51
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit []		00:52
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		02:34
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		02:36
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		02:37
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		02:40
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has left #WebGUI ["Leaving"]		02:41
-!- Archer [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		02:43
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		02:43
-!- Archer [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		02:45
-!- khenn [n=khenn@204.147.1.130] has joined #WebGUI		03:00
-!- mode/#webgui [+o khenn] by ChanServ		03:00
@khenn	diakopter: send me a PM on IM: FRANKLD75	03:01
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:44
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:44
-!- khenn [n=khenn@204.147.1.130] has left #WebGUI []		04:27
-!- SDuensin_ [n=Scott@149.sub-75-207-163.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		04:39
-!- SDuensin_ [n=Scott@149.sub-75-207-163.myvzw.com] has left #WebGUI ["Leaving"]		04:39
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has left #webgui []		06:07
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		08:13
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		08:13
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has joined #webgui		11:20
-!- wenzu [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has joined #webgui		11:31
wenzu	why is webgui showing wrong time ?	11:31
+Radix-wrk	your user profile has a timezone setting	11:45
+Radix-wrk	if you want to change the default timezone, then change the visitor account's timezone in their profile and all new users will then get that as the default	11:46
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:49
-!- wenzu [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has quit []		12:59
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@113.sub-75-207-49.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		16:13
SDuensin	Greetings.	16:25
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		17:14
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		19:02
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		19:02
+perlDreamer	Is there an SQL query that will tell you the name of the database that you're working on?	19:24
@preaction	that's a good question, might want to pop over to #mysql and see if they know (because i don't)	19:25
+perlDreamer	but preaction, you're my javascript/SQL/webtech goto guy... :)	19:26
@preaction	there are limits to even my knowledge :(	19:26
+perlDreamer	how did your talk go last night?	19:26
@preaction	my greatness lies in knowing those limits	19:26
@preaction	imho, C-	19:26
@preaction	i presented the data, i was woefully under-prepared, i had half the amount of materiel i should have had	19:26
@preaction	i did feel and work with the audience better than i anticipated	19:27
@preaction	and being my first presentation like that in about 3 years has rekindled all that knowledge from before when i could actually go up in front of people and move them	19:28
@preaction	so if i start now, i should have some good presentations for the WUC	19:28
+perlDreamer	that's actually some good motivation for me to get started, too	19:28
@preaction	also, this presentation was a lot of examples / hands-on sort of things (since perl one-liners is so easy to give examples for)	19:29
@preaction	the YUI talk i'm giving i can provide examples, but the splitting webgui sites one would be unlikely (which reminds me that's still theoretical, i haven't proven it works yet), and the upgrading webgui i can't really show examples of (since it might take time i don't have to waste)	19:30
+perlDreamer	Damian Conway has some modules that mockup real time displays of code executing.	19:31
+perlDreamer	That might help	19:31
@preaction	like as it runs the code it prints out the code that's running?	19:32
+perlDreamer	Like, it just spews out whatever you want so that you don't have to worry about delays or mistakes in realtime demos	19:32
@preaction	ah, so basically faking real scripts	19:33
+perlDreamer	yup	19:33
@preaction	what is maintenance mode again? isn't it a special apache instance that runs in place of modperl while modperl is doing the upgrade tasks?	19:36
+perlDreamer	No, it throws up a splash screen and prevents db access.	19:36
+perlDreamer	Check out WebGUI.pm	19:36
+perlDreamer	precation: SELECT DATABASE()	19:41
+perlDreamer	that probably only works in MySQL, though.	19:43
@preaction	there's a lot of stuff webgui does that only works in mysql now	19:47
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		19:48
@rizen	pd: if it's for the core, then it's ok if it only works in mysql	19:55
@rizen	if it's supposed to work with the Database Link, then it has to be generic	19:55
+perlDreamer	It's for a test against the DSN from the webgui config file	19:55
@rizen	for example, if it's for SQL Report	19:55
@rizen	then it has to be generic	19:55
@rizen	that can be mysql specific	19:55
+perlDreamer	The big goal is the fixing of the SQLForm privileges bug	19:57
@preaction	to prevent messing with the WebGUI database? or just to give them a stern warning that they can (and probably will) screw up their system?	19:57
@rizen	SQLForm is mysql only	19:57
-!- rizen is now known as rizenaway		19:58
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		20:34
perlmonkey2	quiet here today.	21:13
SDuensin	Shhh	21:15
@preaction	it's so quiet i can't hear myself think!	21:27
SDuensin	Nice. The installation docs I'm writing have a link to the IMDB entry for "Aliens". How many enterprise software projects can claim that?	21:36
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		21:43
perlmonkey2	SDuensin: I think that needs an explanation (the aliens link).	22:15
SDuensin	The docs say that if you already have some of the tools installed and you just tweak them instead of following my instructions that the best thing to do is "...take off and nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."	22:20
SDuensin	I also have a section on the Care and Feeding of Your New IDE.	22:20
@rizenaway	care and feeding of your SD	22:20
SDuensin	Hey! You're supposed to be away!	22:21
@rizenaway	i'm here for 5 min	22:21
SDuensin	Oh yea. Sure. Just long enough to harass people. :-P	22:21
SDuensin	Hey, my boss in the next office is working with WebGUI. She's loving it. :-D	22:21
@rizenaway	bah...she'd like it better if she had webgui desktop	22:47
SDuensin	Well, she DOES love ZK Desktop. :-P	22:48
perlmonkey2	WebGUI is going to be ported to ZKDesktop?	23:38
SDuensin	I wish.	23:42
SDuensin	rizenaway and I were talking about writing another desktop for it that doesn't rely on Java and Tomcat.	23:43
perlmonkey2	Should wait for Perl 6	23:45
SDuensin	Could be a long wait.	23:45
@preaction	which has turned into vaporware?	23:45
@preaction	will it be released before Duke Nukem Forever?	23:46
SDuensin	hehe	23:46
perlmonkey2	I thought it was on schedule for December.	23:46
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:47
@preaction	you mean "before christmas"?	23:47
@preaction	before christmas seems to be the Perl world's way of saying "you'll get it when you get it"	23:48
SDuensin	He didn't say WHICH December.	23:49
SDuensin	Ut oh. The new server I just ordered is 64 bit Linux. Time to rebuild the WRE. <sigh>	23:51
diakopter	perlmonkey2: you can help with Perl 6, if you want.	23:51
* SDuensin wants Parrot. And things to run on it, of course.		23:51
perlmonkey2	diakopter: First I have a WebGUI project I need to finish.	23:52
perlmonkey2	diakopter: And I still have a 60 hour work week at work until next Wednesday.	23:53
diakopter	perlmonkey2: whee!	23:53
perlmonkey2	diakopter: How do you manage to have time to do FOSS and work a job?	23:59
--- Day changed Sat Jul 14 2007
SDuensin	Gotta get 'em to play together. My job let me release ZK Desktop as FOSS, so I get paid to maintain it.	00:00
@preaction	dedication and lack of a social life, like the rest of us	00:00
diakopter	perlmonkey2: heh :P ... I don't do FOSS, truly. I just help do admin junk. like keep out the spammers from #perl6. or buying domain names. or doing other enabling stuff.	00:01
diakopter	preaction++ # those too.	00:01
perlmonkey2	diakopter: That sounds like something even a monkey could do......a perlmonkey	00:02
diakopter	well sure	00:02
diakopter	there are plenty of tasks like that that still need attention.	00:02
diakopter	admin junk is never ending.	00:02
perlmonkey2	well, I have a 7.27 deadline for the 7.4 release, so I'll talk to you about it after then.	00:03
diakopter	perlmonkey2: get off irc and finish your wG project! :P	00:03
perlmonkey2	diakopter: No, I document until 5, then finish wG.	00:03
diakopter	ahhh	00:03
perlmonkey2	and irc is much more fun then documentation.	00:04
* diakopter is readying a wG(svn-latest) install for a site that literally 25 domain names (will) point to. including perl6.com and perlsix.com, and tons of variants.		00:05
perlmonkey2	operator's manual, installiation manual, trouble shooting guide, QA'ing the code comments. A one man shop means one man gets to do all the crud work too.	00:05
perlmonkey2	25 virtual hosts?	00:05
@preaction	may want to avoid svn-latest, there are lots of untested features there (even though those features are awesomecore)	00:05
diakopter	yes, but all redirecting (or rewriteruleing, haven't decided) to various paths within the main site.	00:07
diakopter	preaction: I can handle it.	00:07
diakopter	if i find a bug, I'll nopaste a patch here.	00:07
@preaction	or buglist (someone may not be here to get your patch)	00:08
SDuensin	Outta here! Headed home. Later!	00:08
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@113.sub-75-207-49.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		00:08
diakopter	now... others may veto the use of wG for these sites... ;) and demand a more CPAN-ish web application platform, but whatever; I'm setting it up anyway for now.	00:12
diakopter	oh, that reminds me, I'll need to make a custom auth method that uses Apache2 htpasswd lists... unless someone has already contributed one.	00:15
diakopter	er, I take that back, the credentials are also in a sqlite3 db	00:16
diakopter	that's easier.	00:16
@preaction	i don't believe i've seen one, but the htpasswd list would be a nice addition (the auth system is kinda ugly atm, i'm trying to fix a bug in it right now)	00:16
diakopter	preaction: which bug	00:17
@preaction	there's a bug where deactiveAccountConfirm returns a WebGUI::User object (instead of the login form)	00:18
@preaction	i would assume if i explicitly return undef; from that sub in WebGUI::Auth, it would work	00:18
@preaction	but i'm trying to make a nice message saying "username has been deactivated."	00:18
@preaction	but it seems that calling $self->displayLogin would require me to know things about the subclasses, which is impossible	00:19
@preaction	example: the WebGUI::Auth::WebGUI->displayLogin has no arguments (while WebGUI::Auth->displayLogin has method, and vars arguments)	00:19
@preaction	i lied, wG::Auth::WebGUI has one argument, the method	00:20
@preaction	no wait, it's the message itself	00:20
@preaction	god... not documented...	00:20
@preaction	the problem being is this the same prototype as Auth::LDAP? or Auth::MyCompany?	00:21
@preaction	worse: if i change it, what API will i break?	00:22
diakopter	preaction: have you yourself seen the error message in question that results from deactivateAccountConfirm returning a WebGUI::User object? or only user-reported?	00:27
@preaction	i've seen it	00:28
@preaction	it shows: WebGUI::User(0xblah)	00:28
diakopter	when you deactivated yourself, or some other user.	00:28
@preaction	yourself	00:28
diakopter	oh... patch forthcoming.	00:28
diakopter	http://rafb.net/p/Dd3h5Q41.html	00:42
@preaction	k, seems simple enough	00:44
diakopter	well, er	00:44
diakopter	forgot about the api difference there	00:44
diakopter	insert 'login', after displayLogin( :D	00:44
@preaction	yeah, i'm thinking it won't work just yet to have that message	00:44
@preaction	because using an explicit "login" doesn't allow for other auth subclasses to specify different login methods, and calling $self->displayLogin goes first to that subclass which (the WebGUI Auth one for example) has a different prototype than the Auth.pm superclass	00:45
@preaction	so it would require fixing the API, which afaik i can't do until the API unfreeze	00:46
diakopter	okay, then this: http://rafb.net/p/ZfYzLE81.html	00:47
@preaction	that plus an explicit return undef in the Auth.pm should do it	00:49
diakopter	shouldn't need to change anything in the Auth.pm:deactivateAccountConfirm()	00:49
diakopter	since none of its callers care what it returns	00:50
diakopter	or, shouldn't at least.	00:50
@preaction	if they don't care, then they won't care that i explicitly return undef instead of returning the webgui user object	00:50
diakopter	true :D	00:50
diakopter	bbl	00:53
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		03:02
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has left #WebGUI ["Leaving"]		03:03
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:00
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		04:01
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		04:02
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		04:43
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		07:36
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		08:21
diakopter	anyone around?	09:25
+Radix_	no	09:25
diakopter	anyone around with svn commit?	09:25
+Radix_	no	09:26
+Radix_	;)	09:26
diakopter	k; I'll post the patch tomorrow.	09:26
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		17:39
perlmonkey2	the hoverHelp property of Wobjects now takes a template id instead of plain text?	18:05
perlmonkey2	Bah, duh, no.	18:07
-!- wgGuest25 [n=wgGuest2@76.28.6.5] has joined #webgui		19:02
-!- wgGuest25 [n=wgGuest2@76.28.6.5] has quit [Client Quit]		19:03
perlmonkey2	So I've never designed webpages in Linux before (I've always had access to Dreamweaver). If you use *nix only, what's your favorite HTML designer tool?	19:04
-!- danny_mk [n=daniel@76.28.6.5] has joined #webgui		19:09
-!- danny_mk [n=daniel@76.28.6.5] has quit [Client Quit]		19:09
+Radix_	vi	19:55
@rizenaway	vim	19:55
-!- rizenaway is now known as rizen		19:55
-!- rizen is now known as rizen-in-out		19:56
perlmonkey2	Can someone point me at an ajaxified wobject?	20:14
@rizen-in-out	none of them use YUI yet, that's why we decided to standardize...cuz they were all using their own stuff....but	20:20
@rizen-in-out	Dashboard	20:20
@rizen-in-out	Project Management	20:20
@rizen-in-out	Time Tracker	20:20
perlmonkey2	rizen-in-out: Looks like your AJAX code is kept in extras. Should I just throw the complete YUI into extras?	20:43
perlmonkey2	oh.	20:43
perlmonkey2	nevermind.	20:43
@rizen-in-out	it is	20:43
perlmonkey2	I see it :)	20:43
perlmonkey2	For the survey, I a survey admin selects that the survey/quiz is a multi-session, I'm going to add a choice of length of time from start and also a hard datestamp, at which point the user will no longer be able to complete the survey/quiz. Sound reasonable?	20:50
perlmonkey2	Put that logic into "response.isComplete"	20:51
perlmonkey2	s/ I / if /	20:53
@rizen-in-out	yup	20:59
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has left #WebGUI ["Leaving"]		21:58
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		22:26
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		22:26
+perlDreamer	Anyone home?	22:47
perlmonkey2	kind of	22:55
+perlDreamer	By chance, do you have any idea what an Oracle DSN for the DBI would look like?	22:55
perlmonkey2	mocking up the pages and JS for the ajax survey before I port them to WebGUI.	22:55
@preaction	iirc oracle can use the ODBC driver, but otherwise i don't think oracle has a working DBD anymore	22:56
perlmonkey2	hmm.....I would have to fire up my XP box which has my backups from an old job where I connected to Oracle. But I think it was very similiar.	22:56
+perlDreamer	okay	22:56
+perlDreamer	I'm moving some of the functionality out of the SQL Form into the DatabaseLink.	22:57
+perlDreamer	Things like finding the database name from the DSN and determining privileges.	22:57
@preaction	www.orafaq.com/faqperl.htm	22:57
+perlDreamer	That way they can be tested and kept track of.	22:57
+perlDreamer	preaction: thanks	22:57
perlmonkey2	oracle uses a normal dsn with "Oracle" as the driver name. so 'dbi:Oracle:database=db;host=localhost;port=666',uid,pwd	23:00
+perlDreamer	perlmonkey2: many thanks	23:00
perlmonkey2	Which requires DBD::Oracle, which preaction says is flaky?	23:02
@preaction	i don't know	23:02
+perlDreamer	I think he said unmaintained.	23:02
@preaction	i don't know why Frank needed to use Java instead of Perl for this migration we had to do before	23:02
@preaction	perhaps it's just non-free	23:03
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		23:10
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		23:15
perlmonkey2	Someone how my www.host.com.conf has been converted into a JSON format. Anyway to revert it?	23:17
SDuensin	No idea dude. :-(	23:18
SDuensin	Got my own issues here.	23:18
* SDuensin is trying to build the WRE on RHEL x64.		23:18
@preaction	perlmonkey2: it's supposed to be JSON	23:20
@preaction	starting, i want to say, with 6.99	23:21
perlmonkey2	preaction: So after initial configuration, it is converted to JSON. Cool.	23:23
perlmonkey2	SDuensin: Wow. That doesn't sound like fun at all. apreqlib?	23:23
SDuensin	I have no idea. Fails building perl. I think my libs are in the wrong place. Complains about all the math functions.	23:24
@preaction	perlmonkey2: no, new installs of 6.99-7.x should come with JSON config files. or are we not talking about the WebGUI config file?	23:24
perlmonkey2	I think you misspelled "building perl" which should better be spelled "Fails because for some crazy reason I'm doing a full rebuild of Perl when RHEL comes with 5.8.8".	23:24
@preaction	perlmonkey2: the WRE comes with its own Perl, its own everything	23:25
SDuensin	perlmonkey2 - Trying to build the WRE.	23:25
perlmonkey2	preaction: We are. and I'm just retarded. The comments in the webgui.conf.example through me off. I'm just not used to seeing JSON outside of javascript.	23:25
perlmonkey2	SDuensin: you have my most sincere sympathies.	23:26
@preaction	the idea being you can just install the bare minimum system, download the WRE, get GNU make and GCC and you can compile a working WebGUI system	23:26
perlmonkey2	s/through/threw/	23:26
SDuensin	preaction - That's a great theory. :-P	23:26
@preaction	it's probably complaining about the math libs because they're all 64bit, you may have to point Perl to the correct place for your 32-bit compatibility libs	23:27
SDuensin	Greek, dude. This is the first 64 bit box I've worked with.	23:29
@preaction	64bit boxes have the 32bit libraries installed along with a translation layer for the kernel, somewhere on your system are those libraries	23:30
@preaction	either that or you have to find a 64bit perl	23:30
@preaction	it's greek to me too, i don't know thing one about compiling programs and finding dependancies	23:30
SDuensin	How does the WRE know which one it's building?	23:30
@preaction	there are flags to GCC in the build.sh script	23:30
SDuensin	Yea. I was poking around in there.	23:31
* perlmonkey2 stabs spectre in the neck. Why won't you stop dieing and write to webgui.log		23:37
--- Day changed Sun Jul 15 2007
-!- vayde [n=vayde@mobile-166-217-144-021.mycingular.net] has joined #webgui		01:13
-!- vayde [n=vayde@mobile-166-217-144-021.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		01:52
diakopter	testEnvironment.pl is missing HTML::TagCloud	03:23
diakopter	er, no it's not	03:24
* perlmonkey2 ponders what in WebGUI could use HTML::TagCloud.		03:37
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:16
+Radix_	the wiki?	04:24
perlmonkey2	Keyword.pm is the only package that uses HTML::TagCloud it appears.	04:25
perlmonkey2	Ah, create and modify keywords used by the asset system.	04:27
@preaction	new feature that currently is used by the wiki, but may be adapted to other assets (like CS posts)	04:30
perlmonkey2	rizen-in-out: I have a q about the survey. I'm going with the flowchart option, but have started poking about the line drawing for connecting nodes. Putting in some logic to make the lines curve around other questions/answers would be a bit tricky. So for now, I'll have the lines draw straight over anything in the way and let the user drag things around to keep the flowchart clean.	04:31
perlmonkey2	Also, for now, it might appear a bit chunky. Each q will be a draggable div, but contain a table with the q on top, and answers stacked in rows below. The user will be able to select an answer and drag it to another question, which will cause a line to be drawn between that answer and question (the answer div will snap back to the original question).	04:33
perlmonkey2	The flowchart will grow to the right, with forks going vertical (down), although the user will be able to drag them wherever they want. Answers will default a connection to the next question id, or none at all.	04:35
perlmonkey2	Since the flowcharts will quickly cause the screen to scroll, adding q&a's will be done with right click context menus. Deleting nodes will be done with double click, and will orphan children.	04:36
perlmonkey2	right click context menus will bring up a dialog with all the options.	04:37
perlmonkey2	At least that's how I'm going to prototype the system unless you say otherwise ;)	04:38
perlmonkey2	I'm just trying to cram in all the functionality for 7.4 and make it pretty, smooth and sexy for 7.4.1	04:42
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		05:12
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]		05:12
-!- preaction_ is now known as preaction		05:12
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		05:12
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		06:42
-!- vayde [n=vayde@mobile-166-217-155-226.mycingular.net] has joined #webgui		06:44
@rizen-in-out	i trust you to do the right thing	06:51
@rizen-in-out	everything sounds fine to me so far	06:51
SDuensin	Hey rizen-in-out	07:00
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit []		07:08
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		07:10
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		07:10
perlmonkey2	cool. I'm outy for the night.	07:13
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has left #webgui []		07:14
-!- vayde_ [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		07:14
-!- vayde [n=vayde@mobile-166-217-155-226.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		07:16
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has left #WebGUI ["Leaving"]		07:21
-!- vayde_ [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		07:25
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		07:26
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		07:59
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		18:59
@rizen-in-out	diakopter r u here?	19:45
perlmonkey2	Whatever happened to snapcount?	20:29
@rizen-in-out	he's still around from time to time	20:31
--- Day changed Mon Jul 16 2007
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		01:47
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		01:48
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		03:07
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		04:00
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		04:00
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:17
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		04:37
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		06:41
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		06:50
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		08:40
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:29
-!- ckotil [n=newtrino@snare.grnoc.iu.edu] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		10:07
-!- ckotil [n=newtrino@snare.grnoc.iu.edu] has joined #webgui		10:07
-!- perlbot [n=perlbot@lv.pm.org] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		10:38
-!- perlbot [n=perlbot@lv.pm.org] has joined #webgui		10:38
-!- perlbot [n=perlbot@lv.pm.org] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		10:42
-!- perlbot [n=perlbot@lv.pm.org] has joined #webgui		10:42
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:26
-!- l-e-o-n [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has joined #webgui		11:51
l-e-o-n	anyone here ?	11:51
l-e-o-n	where does webgui creates the "virtualhosts" for apache ?	11:57
-!- l-e-o-n [n=leon@as10p145.access.maltanet.net] has quit []		12:22
AMH_bob	l-e-o-n shows little patience	13:08
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["Leaving."]		13:08
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		13:19
+Radix_	aye, that he does.	13:26
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:06
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@64.sub-75-204-153.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:44
SDuensin	Greetings.	15:45
AMH_bob	Good morning! (You beat me to it)	15:45
SDuensin	hehe	15:45
-!- ckotil [n=newtrino@snare.grnoc.iu.edu] has quit ["Lost terminal"]		15:48
-!- vayde [n=vayde@mobile-166-217-142-224.mycingular.net] has joined #webgui		16:05
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		16:18
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		16:20
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		16:20
-!- vayde [n=vayde@mobile-166-217-142-224.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		16:29
@rizen-in-out	AMH_bob's speech pattern this morning reads deceptively similar to that of optimus prime	16:44
AMH_bob	:P	17:00
AMH_bob	just a co-inkydinky, I haven't seen it yet :D	17:01
@rizen-in-out	you should...very cool	17:05
pjesi	I have to write some CRUD pages for an external db, should I start with some of the SQL assets or perhaps just do it in perl as a new asset?	17:10
@rizen-in-out	depends on what you need	17:12
@rizen-in-out	SQLForm is pretty good for most CRUD duty	17:12
@rizen-in-out	but it's not highly templatable	17:12
pjesi	ok so if layout is not a big concern then SQLForm is the way to go, if I need pretty pages then a custom asset?	17:13
@rizen-in-out	yup	17:13
pjesi	ok thanks for the advice	17:13
@rizen-in-out	also if you need something complex that the SQL Form doesn't handle	17:13
-!- rizen-in-out is now known as rizen		17:13
pjesi	I doubt that is going to be the case here :)	17:14
@rizen	anybody around that wants to help with a bit of javascript debugging?	17:44
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		18:02
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		18:02
AMH_bob	for which part do you need help....	18:02
AMH_bob	(AMH_henry wanted to know more... we're tempted to help)	18:03
AMH_bob	@rizen: ?	18:03
-!- AMH_henry [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		18:05
diakopter	rizen: yay; javascript debuggin	18:08
@rizen	sorry was on the phone	18:10
@rizen	ok if you check out the latest from svn head	18:11
@rizen	there is a folder called www/extras/styleDesigner/	18:11
@rizen	then point your browser to the example.html page in that folder	18:12
@rizen	the problem is that IE doesn't appear to like the color picker	18:12
@rizen	it's not popping it up	18:12
@rizen	and it's not throwing an error	18:12
AMH_bob	Sorry, we don't support IE	18:12
@rizen	i wish i didn't have to either	18:12
@rizen	but this is going in the core	18:12
AMH_henry	I'll take a look at it when i get home (in about ten minutes ;)	18:13
AMH_bob	ok, than I'm off too, bye!	18:13
@rizen	thanks guys	18:14
-!- AMH_henry [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]"]		18:14
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		18:14
diakopter	rizen: IE6 throws an error for me...	18:28
@rizen	really, can you put it in a pastepin?	18:29
@rizen	pastebin and link it?	18:29
diakopter	sure	18:29
diakopter	but I'd rather fix it real quick first and nopaste a patch ;)	18:29
@rizen	ok?	18:30
@rizen	or	18:30
@rizen	just check in your patch	18:30
diakopter	the only helpful info it says is: WebguiColorPicker is undefined	18:30
@rizen	why don't i get that damn error?	18:30
@rizen	i'm using IE6 as well	18:30
diakopter	the yellow exclamation point in the bottom left of the status bar?	18:32
@rizen	no, nothing	18:32
diakopter	hrm; shrugs	18:32
@rizen	the other thing that's boggling me is that firefox and safari work just fine	18:33
@rizen	so this has to be an IE only problem	18:33
diakopter	oh, I see the problem	18:34
diakopter	hang on	18:34
diakopter	fancy JS here... ;)	18:35
diakopter	currying and so forth	18:35
@rizen	currying?	18:37
@rizen	i'm trying to follow Yahoo!'s design guidelines for javascript by doing encapsulated objects and whatnot	18:37
@rizen	i figure they know 10,000 times what i do about javascript so i should follow them	18:38
@rizen	ok so the problem appears to be with the color picker code rather than the style designer	18:40
@rizen	cuz the color picker doesn't pop anywhere in webgui when using IE	18:40
diakopter	right	18:41
@rizen	sorry, i didn't check that before cuz i thought i tested it in IE when I put the new color picker into the system	18:42
@rizen	i guess i didn't test IE though since it's obviously not working	18:42
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		18:47
diakopter	well no, the reason it's not working there is you didn't change webguiColorPicker to WebguiColorPicker everywhere	18:47
@rizen	then how come it works in firefox and safari?	18:47
@rizen	are they case insensitive?	18:48
diakopter	well, a reason.	18:48
@rizen	in addition	18:48
@rizen	if i grep for the lower case version	18:48
@rizen	it doesn't exist	18:48
@rizen	so where didn't i change it?	18:48
diakopter	rizen: https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/checkout/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Form/Color.pm	18:50
@rizen	that's actually changed too	18:50
@rizen	just not checked in yet	18:50
diakopter	oh; heh :)	18:50
@rizen	but you don't need to test there	18:50
@rizen	just use example.html	18:50
@rizen	in the colorpicker folder	18:50
@rizen	it doesn't work in IE	18:50
@rizen	and throws no errors	18:50
@rizen	i should have mentioned i've only checked in what i needed to to show you this problem	18:52
@rizen	methinks that IE isn't even parsing colorpicker.js	18:55
@rizen	if you just put a window.alert() at the top of the file it doesn't even pop up	18:55
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has joined #webgui		18:58
@rizen	found one problem	18:59
@rizen	checked in	19:00
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has quit [Client Quit]		19:00
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has joined #webgui		19:01
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Connection timed out]		19:07
@rizen	ok, now that the comma that was causing it not to load the js file is gone	19:09
@rizen	i'm able to execute the init() method	19:09
@rizen	but the display method doesn't do anything	19:09
@rizen	never even gets called	19:09
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		19:27
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		19:32
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		19:32
@rizen	ok, i've narrowed it down a bit further and have discovered that IE dies in the display method at ddPicker = Dom.get("ddPicker");	19:32
+crythias	you can pick your nose...	19:33
-!- henryykt [n=yktang@erica.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		19:34
-!- henryykt is now known as henryykt_aka_AMH		19:39
@rizen	well that's ****ed up	19:39
@rizen	if i change the variable so it doesn't have the same name as the div id, then the picker shows up	19:39
diakopter	ahhhhhh; silly IE and its aliasing global JS variables to each DOM node id.	19:57
diakopter	good find...	19:57
@rizen	are you kidding me?	19:58
@rizen	that's a "feature"	19:58
@rizen	i still have one problem left though	19:58
@rizen	in IE, the color shader doesn't work on the picker	19:59
@rizen	it's just always grey, which is the background image	19:59
@rizen	actually i think i know what that is too	20:01
@rizen	yup..fixed	20:02
diakopter	dunno how you did it, but I did if (YAHOO.util.Event.isIE) {	20:08
@rizen	i did if (navigator.appName == 'Microsoft Internet Explorer') {	20:09
@rizen	but I'll change it to that	20:09
diakopter	oo oo	20:17
diakopter	(found it.. committing)	20:17
diakopter	aw drat, you beat me to it, yet agin. still you should wrap the correctPNG() call in that isIE conditional.	20:19
@rizen	why?	20:20
@rizen	i put the wrapper in the correctPNG call instead	20:21
@rizen	that way it's only done if it's IE no matter where you call correctPNG from	20:21
@rizen	thinking of future scenarios	20:21
diakopter	oh; i missed that diff	20:21
-!- henryykt_aka_AMH [n=yktang@erica.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		20:30
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		21:11
@rizen	in CSS i can do .navigation A { color: orange; }	22:09
@rizen	how do i accomplish the same thing using javascript	22:10
preaction_	getElementsByTagName("a")	22:11
preaction_	assuming you know where .navigation is	22:11
preaction_	i believe Yui has a getElementsByClassName you can use	22:12
@rizen	so lets say it was #navigation instead	22:12
@rizen	Dom.get("navigation").getElementsByTagName("a")	22:12
SDuensin	Hey gang. Dang, what a morning.	22:12
@rizen	then loop over the list	22:12
preaction_	so that'd be a loop over document.getElementById("navigation").getElementsByTagName("a")	22:12
@rizen	and apply the style?	22:12
preaction_	should work	22:12
@rizen	ok	22:13
@rizen	i'll give that a try	22:13
@rizen	i was hoping there would be a nice shortcut	22:13
@rizen	but i guess this isn't too bad	22:13
@rizen	ok one more	22:16
@rizen	what about	22:16
@rizen	#navigation A:visited	22:16
@rizen	would that just be:	22:17
@rizen	tags[i].vlinkColor	22:17
@rizen	crap...your loop idea doesn't work	22:20
@rizen	http://rafb.net/p/9gF9Us56.html	22:20
@rizen	that's what i have	22:20
@rizen	any other ideas?	22:20
@rizen	also "this.value" comes from a case statement that this thing is inside of	22:20
@rizen	and when i say it doesn't work i mean that the color doesn't get set, and no error is thrown	22:21
preaction_	tags[i].style.color	22:32
@rizen	damn i'm an idiot	22:35
@rizen	also..damn javascript sux	22:35
@rizen	it should have thrown an error	22:35
preaction_	i love that FF allows trailing commas but IE barfs on them, usually with no error	22:37
@rizen	had that problem this morning	22:37
@rizen	firefox, safari, and opera all did the right thing	22:37
@rizen	ie of course didn't	22:37
preaction_	there is an MS script debugger for JS, but it's rather... difficult	22:38
preaction_	works in IE7 that i know, i think it works in IE6 as well	22:38
@rizen	yeah and you need to know MS Office to get it	22:41
@rizen	s/know/own/	22:41
preaction_	really? i've got it and use it, even considering how much it sucks	22:42
@rizen	it's supposedly on the MS Office CD	22:42
@rizen	i couldn't find a download for it anywhere	22:42
preaction_	http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2004/10/26/247912.aspx	22:42
diakopter	or for those who don't want to validate their Windows license: http://download.microsoft.com/download/winscript56/Install/1.0a/NT45XP/EN-US/scd10en.exe	22:44
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		23:32
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		23:32
+perlDreamer	On the Contrib's page, the PBWG icon still points to Radix_, but the Ad Space pulls up Yung.	23:33
@rizen	that image wasn't even supposed to be there anymore	23:35
@rizen	removed	23:35
+perlDreamer	rizen: have you decided if you're coming out to OSCON to pick up your sourceforge award or not?	23:37
@rizen	we haven't won it yet	23:38
+perlDreamer	eh, it's just a matter of time	23:39
@rizen	regardless though, i can't actually come out...i have a client upgrade to do that weekend	23:39
* diakopter is attending Oscon		23:39
@rizen	methinks that 2006 WebGUI Contributor of the Year should accept the award on our behalf	23:39
+perlDreamer	Martin is coming to OSCON?	23:40
@rizen	hehe...no silly	23:40
+perlDreamer	If he's not going to be there, I guess I could do it.	23:41
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@64.sub-75-204-153.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:48
--- Day changed Tue Jul 17 2007
* perlDreamer makes a note not to wear t-shirt and gym shorts on Tuesday		00:10
+perlDreamer	bug--	00:13
@rizen	bug++	00:13
@rizen	have to introduce them as fast as you fix them so we're not out of balance	00:13
@rizen	=)	00:13
+perlDreamer	I'm hoping that there's a limiting factor to my theory.	00:14
+perlDreamer	Fixing them slowly may allow the balance point to be reset.	00:14
@rizen	from now on also tell me how hard the bug was for you to fix, so i can introduce one that's equally hard	00:14
+perlDreamer	Just stuff in anything JS related. That will be hard enough.	00:15
@rizen	i've been fixing JS bugs in my new code all day so that you wouldn't have to fix them	00:15
@rizen	i guess i should have left them in	00:15
+perlDreamer	When do the plainblack.com bugs get fixed? ;)	00:16
@rizen	as someone gets to them	00:18
@rizen	generally as they come in i assign them either to myself or someone else	00:18
@rizen	sometimes they'll fall through the cracks as we work on other projects	00:19
@rizen	regardless though, graham is supposed to be fixing bugs every day	00:19
@rizen	Haarg....are you here?	00:19
@rizen	if not, why not?	00:19
+perlDreamer	There are at least two easy bugs to close on the boards	00:20
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/link-and-javascript-headers-output-in-wrong-place#neN0aD9fHhDQZoqUBG8_-A	00:20
+perlDreamer	which is content chunking, not a bug	00:20
@Haarg	yeah, i'm here	00:20
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/polls-not-working-on-os-x-intel#XL71AxwxkpvKi5to2Iu7kA	00:20
+perlDreamer	which is "tough stuff it doesn't work"	00:20
+perlDreamer	portability	00:20
@rizen	please note what colin is saying and make them a priority to close out some bugs	00:20
@rizen	pd, until you mentioned it today, i didn't think anybody was even reading the black blog	00:25
+perlDreamer	Have do the logs say?	00:30
+perlDreamer	s/Have/What/	00:30
diakopter	I've read every entry...	00:30
diakopter	but that's why I spoke up just now. getLineage isn't working worth beans on this wG (svn trunk) installation.	00:31
diakopter	that's not why, I mean. <sigh>	00:31
+perlDreamer	Does the test pass?	00:32
+perlDreamer	t/Asset/AssetLineage	00:32
diakopter	good q	00:32
+perlDreamer	actually, just do a prove -r Asset	00:32
+perlDreamer	run them all!	00:32
+perlDreamer	I think Lineage has been static for a while	00:32
diakopter	hmm; gotta come up with a non-destructive WEBGUI_CONFIG	00:33
preaction_	i changed some of it in 7.3.0, but other than that i think lineage hasn't changed much	00:33
diakopter	or are the tests non destructive?	00:33
+perlDreamer	The tests are not non-destructive.	00:33
preaction_	the tests are supposed to be non-destructive	00:33
+perlDreamer	So you have two options	00:33
+perlDreamer	1) Dump, test, restore	00:33
diakopter	dump it is	00:33
+perlDreamer	2) Create a disposable database	00:33
+perlDreamer	and site uploads area	00:33
diakopter	ick ick ick ;)	00:34
+perlDreamer	We could make that a goal for OSCON	00:34
+perlDreamer	Completely non-destructive tests	00:34
+perlDreamer	It shouldn't be that hard to achieve	00:34
diakopter	although I suppose option 2 is rather more one-time than the other.	00:34
+perlDreamer	It's what I do, along with the old "resetdev" script	00:35
diakopter	I wish Test.pm would just prompt for mysql root password, and create its own temp dirs and temp db, importing create.sql etc.	00:35
preaction_	http://webgui.org/user_contributions/user_contributions/miscellaneous/switch_webgui_pl----switch-between-webgui-source-directories <- this is what i do. let me upload my latest fixes to it	00:36
+perlDreamer	diakopter, that's a great idea, but it would prompt on EVERY test. Need to use Test::Class or something similar.	00:37
+perlDreamer	Maybe a create test sandbox script?	00:37
diakopter	preaction_: thanks	00:37
+crythias	or maybe just read the configs from mytest.inc.php	00:38
+crythias	oh. um. oops	00:38
diakopter	crythias: boo-yuh	00:39
+perlDreamer	afk for 15	00:39
+crythias	I meant. mysql-test.conf	00:39
+crythias	boo-yah	00:39
preaction_	done, now it enables/disables both the modperl and modproxy entries of the WRE. it's configurable enough to allow for almost any Apache+WebGUI combination	00:41
preaction_	it's kinda ugly code, i know. I should be using File::Spec	00:41
preaction_	but all you do is switch to the WebGUI you want to use, and use the WRE's addsite script to add a site to that webgui. then whenever you switch, the script will enable/disable the sites that are configured with that version of the webgui source	00:43
diakopter	Enviroment variable WEBGUI_CONFIG must be set.	00:43
diakopter	Enviro ment	00:43
+crythias	kewl. does that come in sugar free?	00:46
+crythias	double your pleasure... double your fun.. with rizen's... enviroment gum.	00:47
diakopter	perlDreamer: nope, AssetLineage DIED. FAILED tests 3, 37, 39, 44, 46, 48, 50, 55-56, 58, 68-72	00:48
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has left #webgui []		00:49
diakopter	the rest of Asset* tests seem okay, except AssetPackage failed tests 3-7.	00:50
+perlDreamer	let me do an update	00:51
diakopter	note that this is stock create.sql, upgraded from 7.3.20svn to 7.4svn	00:52
+perlDreamer	My test run is clean	00:53
* diakopter tries prove verbose		00:53
+perlDreamer	what does testEnvironment.pl --simpleReport say?	00:53
diakopter	all OKs	00:54
+perlDreamer	my setup is the same as yours	00:54
diakopter	why would any of that be messed up? The site generally works. But no children are ever shown on Layouts, and manageAssets' crumbtrail and child listing are always blank.	00:55
+perlDreamer	WRE?	00:55
diakopter	no	00:55
diakopter	MySQL 5.0.41a-1 (debian)	00:56
+perlDreamer	oh	00:56
+perlDreamer	that may be the problem right there	00:56
+perlDreamer	I've seen bugs posted about using mysql's biggen than 5.0.32	00:56
diakopter	lovely...	00:56
+perlDreamer	maybe it was on the boards...	00:57
@Haarg	http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/mysql-5.0.41	00:57
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/bugs/tracker/mysql-5/re-mysql-5.0.41#IjsCDJd-hkr3jgCvhwDjLA	00:57
@Haarg	it's a mysql bug	00:58
diakopter	Haarg: thanks.	00:58
+perlDreamer	Is it easy for you to downgrade, diakopter?	00:58
+perlDreamer	Haarg, does that mean that 5.0.42 and above will be okay?	00:59
diakopter	eh, maybe. the whole machine is Debian Sid. Lemme see what's in the package pipeline...	00:59
diakopter	5.0.44	00:59
diakopter	well, there's 5.1.19beta-1 in debian/experimental, released Jun 11	01:01
+perlDreamer	We have an easy way to validate it now, via the test suite.	01:02
diakopter	and 5.1.19 upstream does include that patch.... supposedly...	01:03
+perlDreamer	Install it then run prove across the whole test suite. Make sure that CODE_COP=0 and it should take about 15 minutes to check everything.	01:04
diakopter	sir yes sir	01:09
diakopter	I wonder if the 60 other users/admins of this machine will mind...	01:09
+perlDreamer	this is on feather?	01:09
diakopter	sshhh	01:10
diakopter	well now that's weird.	01:10
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		01:11
+perlDreamer	Anyone happen to know the URl for the ImageMagick API docs?	01:13
@rizen	http://www.imagemagick.org/script/perl-magick.php	01:22
+perlDreamer	thanks!	01:23
@rizen	pd, how are you coming with removing the aux help files in 7.4	01:23
@rizen	two weeks left until release	01:23
+perlDreamer	Do you know when the files were last updated in the wiki, approximately?	01:24
+perlDreamer	That way I can track down any changes that need to be moved before they're lost.	01:24
+perlDreamer	btw. YUI does not play well with SeaMonkey	01:25
+perlDreamer	SeaMonkey 1.0.3 on RHEL 4 64-bit	01:26
@rizen	may	01:29
@rizen	what is seamonkey?	01:29
+perlDreamer	Mozilla	01:29
+perlDreamer	Mozilla "abandoned" mozilla, so someone picked it up and started calling it seamonkey	01:29
+perlDreamer	It's the old integrated suite, instead of being busted up like Firefox, thunderbird, sunbird, etc.	01:30
+perlDreamer	And we're pulling everything but hoverHelp, template variables and...	01:31
@rizen	hoverhelp and template variables stay	01:32
@rizen	all other pages go	01:32
@rizen	if seamonkey is based on firefox then it should work fine...regardless webgui only supports what yahoo calls A class browsers	01:33
+perlDreamer	ok	01:33
+perlDreamer	So the add/edit article page goes, but the hoverHelp behind it stays?	01:34
@rizen	http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/articles/gbs/	01:34
+perlDreamer	and the Macro pages should be stripped down to template variables ony	01:34
@rizen	right	01:34
@rizen	on both counts	01:34
+perlDreamer	The autogenerated lists of assets, macros, workflow activities, template parsers also go	01:36
@rizen	yup	01:36
* perlDreamer whips out his vorpal vim editor		01:37
@rizen	i guess you could leave the page that shows what macros are enabled or whatever	01:37
@rizen	but the actual description pages should no longer be there	01:37
+perlDreamer	Okay, so no linking inside of there.	01:37
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:41
+perlDreamer	rizen: I'm going to change the name on all the Macro pages that remain to Macro Template Variables, just to be clear	01:48
+perlDreamer	sound okay?	01:48
+perlDreamer	If all Help content is either HoverHelp or template variables, we don't need the body tag anymore.	01:51
+perlDreamer	But existing docs for custom software may use it, so probably better to leave it in	01:59
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		02:22
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		02:22
* diakopter still downloads mysql5.1.19beta		02:39
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		02:42
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		02:44
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		02:45
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has left #webgui []		02:47
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		03:53
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		04:12
@preaction	i have a healthy respect for whomever wrote the Navigation asset... I've just basically re-implemented the same tree-building algorithm in my client project...	04:13
@preaction	the varying ways to represent these things... JS and HTML both require a completely different set of instructions on how to re-create the tree from a flat array...	04:13
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		05:17
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		05:17
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		06:05
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		06:21
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		06:36
diakopter	yes, upgrading to mysql-server-5.1.19beta-1 fixed http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/mysql-5.0.41	06:47
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		07:10
--- Log closed Tue Jul 17 09:55:58 2007
--- Log opened Tue Jul 17 09:56:02 2007
-!- xdanger_ [i=xdanger@i.should.be.in.a.mentalhouse.net] has joined #webgui		09:56
-!- Irssi: #webgui: Total of 15 nicks [3 ops, 0 halfops, 2 voices, 10 normal]		09:56
-!- xdanger [i=xdanger@i.should.be.in.a.mentalhouse.net] has quit [Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)]		09:56
-!- Irssi: Join to #webgui was synced in 7 secs		09:56
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		12:15
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		12:26
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:04
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@5.sub-75-204-184.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		16:06
SDuensin	Greetings.	16:08
AMH_bob	Good morning!	16:09
SDuensin	Hey AMH_bob	16:10
AMH_bob	Hi Scott!	16:11
@rizen	howdy peeps	16:16
SDuensin	Hey rizen	16:18
SDuensin	rizen, you know of anyone using the WRE on RHEL4 x64?	16:20
@rizen	no	16:21
SDuensin	Nuts.	16:22
diakopter	rizen: I don't see a reference to mod_header(s?) in svn's /wrebuild - was it removed from the mod_proxy.conf at some point?	16:25
@rizen	no	16:25
diakopter	hum; I'll keep looking	16:25
-!- l-e-o-n [n=leon@as2p9.access.maltanet.net] has joined #webgui		17:12
l-e-o-n	anyone here ?	17:12
SDuensin	Nope. Nobody at all.	17:17
l-e-o-n	ah ok then... lol	17:17
l-e-o-n	u can help me ?	17:17
SDuensin	Probably not, but I'll try!	17:18
l-e-o-n	i've installed webgui 7.3.20 wre.. and i had another apache instance running.. but the apache of webgui is on top of it and can't start my other apache	17:19
diakopter	l-e-o-n: then what's your question	17:20
l-e-o-n	how can i bind webgui apache to run on an ip	17:20
l-e-o-n	so i'll bind the other apache on another ip	17:20
l-e-o-n	cause it's ignoring anything from its httpd.conf	17:21
SDuensin	It uses modproxy.conf and modperl.conf.	17:21
SDuensin	(Or something close to that.)	17:21
* diakopter continues to fight with mysql 5.1.19 on debian sid and DBD::mysql		17:23
diakopter	cpan	17:23
diakopter	ugh	17:23
* SDuensin is fighting with WRE on RHEL x64.		17:23
l-e-o-n	can't find any ip's binded on modproxy and modperl	17:23
* SDuensin is losing badly.		17:23
l-e-o-n	i'm fighting with wre on rhel too but to bind it to an ip grr	17:24
l-e-o-n	lol	17:24
diakopter	fun! Couldn't call method deleteList on asset for url: home Root cause: Transactions not supported by database at /usr/lib/perl5/DBI.pm line 1665.	17:24
SDuensin	l-e-o-n, look in /data/wre/prereqs/apache/conf	17:24
SDuensin	It has http.modproxy.conf and http.modperl.conf in it.	17:25
SDuensin	Find the "Listen" line in those files.	17:25
-!- chatito28 [n=david@130.156.38.11] has joined #webgui		17:25
chatito28	good morning i am new using webgui and i am trying to get a calendar working can anybody help?	17:26
diakopter	whee; that fixed it. (apt-get install libmysqlclient15off=5.1.19beta-1 and then cpan force install DBD::mysql)	17:27
SDuensin	chatito28 - I've not used that asset, sorry.	17:27
SDuensin	diakopter - Congrats!	17:27
SDuensin	diakopter - Now fix mine. :-)	17:27
@Haarg	what kind of trouble are you having chatito28?	17:28
diakopter	rizen: I think the mod_headers stuff got dropped from the port80 apache at some point	17:28
chatito28	i am trying to add a a event calendar	17:29
diakopter	not that it matters too much to me; I'm not using the wre.	17:29
chatito28	and i don't know how to	17:29
diakopter	chatito28: what version of WebGUI do you have	17:29
* SDuensin longs for the WRE.		17:29
l-e-o-n	i bindend webgui to run on ip 209.62.91.100..	17:29
l-e-o-n	http://209.62.91.98/	17:29
l-e-o-n	ah shit	17:30
l-e-o-n	it seem to work now	17:30
chatito28	7.3.18	17:30
l-e-o-n	lol	17:30
chatito28	i was looking for a how to or a manual.. but i can't find anything	17:30
diakopter	da manual is fo sale	17:33
SDuensin	https://www.plainblack.com/store/services/books2/webgui-content-managers-guide	17:33
* diakopter loves save-and-commit		17:40
chatito28	my company bough support for webgui , can i see guides with this?	17:43
diakopter	interesting; I changed this WebGUI site config file, and did not restart mod_perl, but the site immediately reflected the change.	17:47
diakopter	that's a new one	17:47
* diakopter could've sworn the config file was cached permanently by preload.perl		17:48
diakopter	(the modproxy mod_header line really improves admin-mode responsiveness and server load)	17:51
-!- chatito28 [n=david@130.156.38.11] has quit []		17:52
-!- l-e-o-n [n=leon@as2p9.access.maltanet.net] has quit []		17:58
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["Leaving."]		18:07
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		19:15
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		19:15
+perlDreamer	Morning folks	19:16
@rizen	morning?	19:17
@rizen	it's like afternoon or something	19:17
+perlDreamer	Not in Wisonsin	19:17
+perlDreamer	You can't fool me, I studied Giograffy	19:17
diakopter	morning	19:17
+perlDreamer	But spelling was never my strong poynt	19:18
* diakopter giraffes about		19:18
+perlDreamer	diakopter, do you want to wiki your mod_header hack?	19:21
diakopter	well I realized (yet again) that I'm an idiot	19:21
+perlDreamer	Paraphrasing "The American President", "My idiocy is complex and lies on many levels".	19:22
diakopter	and that it is still there .. wre/var/setupfiles/modproxy.conf: Header set Cache-Control "max-age=36000"	19:22
+perlDreamer	Great misfortune and woe.	19:25
+perlDreamer	The SourceForge community awards are Thursday night.	19:25
diakopter	so they are	19:32
diakopter	have the winners been announced? or not till Thursday night?	19:38
+perlDreamer	Not 'til Thursday night.	19:38
+perlDreamer	When I'm at rehearsal.	19:38
diakopter	how could SF rent out the whole Jupiter hotel and invite all of OSCON and offer free drinks? do the site ads pay that well??!?	19:39
+perlDreamer	SF also owns Slashdot, ThinkGeek, Linux.com and so on	19:40
diakopter	oh, I see, all under VA Linux, a publicly traded large company. gotcha. plenty of revenue.	19:41
+perlDreamer	Oodles	19:46
+perlDreamer	Plus commercial SourceForge, plus support.	19:46
pjesi	diakopter: was your hacked related to IE6 caching everything internally forever?	19:47
diakopter	pjesi: no...	19:48
pjesi	darn..	19:48
diakopter	unless by everything you mean /extras/*	19:48
pjesi	nope	19:48
diakopter	pjesi: is that still a problem?	19:54
pjesi	indeed it is	19:57
diakopter	pjesi: is there a bug entry for it?	19:58
pjesi	I think my co-worker did, I dont have any windows machines here so I can't reproduce the error	19:59
diakopter	oh	20:00
* pjesi is a university student in a foreign country with very small laptop		20:01
diakopter	a country foreign to you? or a country foreign to me?	20:02
pjesi	to me	20:03
pjesi	I am not in the same country as the company	20:03
pjesi	well, gotta go bowling!	20:06
+perlDreamer	If you request the deletion of a file in svn, but don't actually commit, is there a way to cancel the request?	20:21
diakopter	svn revert theFilename?	20:24
+perlDreamer	Hey! Thanks, man.	20:25
+perlDreamer	That worked.	20:25
diakopter	then make sure svn status doesn't show it D	20:25
+perlDreamer	You'd think that would be in the SVN book, or in Google, but it isn't.	20:25
+perlDreamer	Maybe it's so obvious it doesn't need to be... :(	20:25
diakopter	I bet it's in Google accessible by some keyword	20:25
diakopter	:-P	20:25
+perlDreamer	it's not in svn undelete or svn cancel delete	20:26
diakopter	http://www.tigris.org/nonav/scdocs/ddUsingSVN_command-line.html is a lot shorter than svnbook.	20:28
-!- wgGuest01 [n=wgGuest0@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has joined #webgui		20:58
+perlDreamer	Welcome, wgGuest01	20:59
-!- wgGuest01 is now known as Dc5e		20:59
Dc5e	Hey, is anyone here familiar with the commerce in WebGUI?	21:00
+perlDreamer	somewhat, what are you trying to do with it?	21:00
Dc5e	well	21:00
Dc5e	i want to be able to sell some products with it	21:00
Dc5e	i've set up the products and product macros	21:01
Dc5e	and when i put in an order using the cash method, the order goes through	21:01
Dc5e	but on the administrative side, how do i view the order?	21:01
Dc5e	well, to be more precise, I can view the order in the 'List Transactions' page	21:02
Dc5e	but is there any way i can edit it? such as change it's status from 'pending' to 'complete' and view where to ship an item?	21:02
+perlDreamer	good question	21:04
+perlDreamer	I don't know the answer to it. I'd recommend posting it on the discussion boards.	21:05
@preaction	example.com?op=listTransactions (it's under the Commerce tab in the admin console. on the right side menu you'll see List Transactions and List Pending Transactions)	21:05
Dc5e	yeah, when I get to that page though, it only allows me to delete transactions	21:05
Dc5e	and 'List Pending Transactions' doesn't work	21:05
Dc5e	it just brings me to the homepage	21:05
@preaction	that's a bug: the bug is "listPendingTransactions" is not a valid operation, even though it's referred to	21:06
@preaction	http://webgui.org/bugs	21:07
@preaction	(it's not there yet that i know of, if you want to post it)	21:07
@preaction	most likely all someone has to do is add it to the list in WebGUI::Operation.pm	21:07
Dc5e	oh ok	21:07
Dc5e	yeah, because I was wondering about that too, I searched all over the site and saw no mention of it being a bug	21:07
+perlDreamer	That's a good indication that you're the first :)	21:08
@preaction	but good idea coming here for us to verify, if you give the buglist all the information i've said someone should be able to fix it in 5-10 minutes (if i'm right about it, at least)	21:08
+perlDreamer	preaction, you're right, and I've got a fix ready to check in	21:09
Dc5e	okay	21:09
@preaction	could you make a patch and attach it to that thread for Dc5e to apply to his WebGUI (so he can get going)?	21:10
+perlDreamer	Sure. Dc5e, are you cool with patching your code? Do you have a hosted server, or run your own?	21:10
Dc5e	well, right now i'm running on my own	21:10
Dc5e	but i'm planning to buy the hosting service soon	21:10
@preaction	it's as simple as: cd /data/WebGUI; patch -p0 < patchfile	21:11
@preaction	provided perlDreamer makes the patch out of the same directory (/data/WebGUI)	21:11
+perlDreamer	I'll provide patch instructions	21:11
+perlDreamer	rizen: are we scheduled to release .21 tomorrow?	21:12
* preaction goes back into the Collaboration System code, if I'm not back in 2 hours, don't send rescue, just give me a beautiful funeral		21:12
+perlDreamer	check in Auth i18n first, please?	21:13
@preaction	that should be done	21:13
+perlDreamer	Dc5e, give us a holler when you submit that bug.	21:13
Dc5e	okay	21:13
@preaction	uhm	21:13
+perlDreamer	preaction: got it.	21:13
@preaction	has anyone tried the 7.4 collab system?	21:13
@preaction	oh, it's been refactored	21:14
+perlDreamer	Yes	21:14
+perlDreamer	Inheritable, subclassable now	21:14
+perlDreamer	To help with the newsletter Asset	21:14
@preaction	it scared me seeing a 12-line subroutine that i knew should be almost 50	21:14
@preaction	which sucks because i did that before but apparently forgot to move the changes from a client site into the webgui core. luckily this change and my change can be used together	21:15
+perlDreamer	Okay, I'm out for lunch for a while.	21:16
+perlDreamer	Dc5e, I have your bugfix ready to commit. All we need is your bug report to finish the documentation.	21:16
Dc5e	okay	21:18
Dc5e	i just posted the bug	21:18
+perlDreamer	Fixed, and patch posted	21:26
+perlDreamer	Now I'm really going to lunch.	21:26
* SDuensin sighs		21:31
SDuensin	MySQL hates me today.	21:33
@rizen	yes sir pd, .21 tomorrow	22:26
@rizen	it may go out slow though cuz i'm teaching graham how to do releases tomorrow	22:26
SDuensin	Hey, here's a new one...	22:28
SDuensin	Aspell.so: wrong ELF class	22:28
SDuensin	Happened during cpan running from testEnvironment.pl.	22:29
@rizen	if you can figure out how many grasshoppers with wooden legs it would take to kick all of the seeds out of a dill pickle, then i'll tell you how to fix it	22:30
SDuensin	42	22:30
@rizen	nope	22:30
SDuensin	It is. You're mistaken.	22:30
@rizen	hmm..then i guess i'd be mistaken about the other thing too	22:30
SDuensin	:-P	22:30
SDuensin	Do I really need Text::Aspell: ?	22:36
@rizen	you don't need text aspell unless you want to enable webgui spell checking	22:36
SDuensin	Aww, that'd be nice. Guess I can worry about it later.	22:37
SDuensin	Uh, this is bad, isn't it?	22:40
SDuensin	[root@u15262483 sbin]# . ./setenvironment	22:40
SDuensin	[root@u15262483 sbin]# whereis perl	22:40
SDuensin	perl: /usr/bin/perl /usr/share/man/man1/perl.1.gz	22:40
SDuensin	Or not. "which perl" gives the right answer.	22:42
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@5.sub-75-204-184.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:42
@rizen	c of k in the usa	23:53
+perlDreamer	yo	23:53
@rizen	hehe...that's soo cool	23:53
@rizen	oscon, you're going for the whole week?	23:53
+perlDreamer	Yup.	23:53
@rizen	man i wish i could go to that	23:53
+perlDreamer	It's going to be fun.	23:54
+perlDreamer	I have a lot of hacking to do that week :)	23:54
@rizen	there's a little something going on at pb that i can't yet talk about that prevents me from going, so i'm going to have to live vicariously through you	23:54
+perlDreamer	I'll be on IRC and IM as long as batteries allow.	23:54
+perlDreamer	If you like, put in some requests for sessions to attend and I'll see if I can get to them.	23:55
diakopter	perlDreamer: we should take turns live blogging...	23:55
+perlDreamer	Yeah!	23:55
+perlDreamer	Inbetween hacking the Help...	23:56
+perlDreamer	rizen: pb changes announced at WUC or sooner?	23:57
@preaction	are there any enhancements for the packaging system planned? like the ability to ignore revision dates and just take the imported package's version? or a workflow activity to sync packages between sites?	23:59
@preaction	duh.. search the RFEs	23:59
--- Day changed Wed Jul 18 2007
@rizen	pd and dk that would be great	00:00
@rizen	the private things that are going on now should become public in august with any luck	00:00
@rizen	preaction yes no yes	00:00
@rizen	preaction, i'll skype you	00:01
+perlDreamer	better skype than scalp...	00:02
+perlDreamer	stupid, accursed, non-intuitive, overly restrictive, broken, non-Vim based, emacs wanna be RTE!	00:12
@rizen	who wants to do a super simple RFE for me?	00:17
@rizen	don't everybody jump at once	00:18
@rizen	diakopter?	00:18
diakopter	whoosawhat	00:20
diakopter	sure, why not	00:20
@rizen	http://www.plainblack.com/user_contributions/user_contributions/miscellaneous/form-codearea-replacement	00:20
@rizen	add that to the core	00:20
@rizen	actually	00:21
@rizen	make sure that the code is an open source license first	00:21
@rizen	but if it is	00:21
@rizen	then do it	00:21
diakopter	WoW	00:21
@rizen	WoW?	00:22
diakopter	spiffy	00:22
@rizen	it is cool	00:22
diakopter	oh, not World of Warcraft	00:22
diakopter	it's LGPL	00:22
@rizen	ok then...add it to the core and test it	00:22
diakopter	www/extras/codepress like he has it there?	00:24
diakopter	or somewhere deeper?	00:24
@preaction	that would probably be best	00:34
@preaction	(the www/extras/codepress)	00:34
diakopter	k	00:34
@preaction	did that say anything about search/replace inside the codearea?	00:35
@preaction	hmm... that would be nice, but doesn't look like it in the description	00:36
diakopter	no, doesn't seem to have that feature.	00:38
diakopter	now if only if could do what subthaedit does... ;)	00:38
@rizen	that's fine by me	00:43
+perlDreamer	rizen, do you have 10 minutes to edit my recently submitted Dev Guide to Testing?	00:53
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/community-wiki/developers-guide-to-testing-in-webgui	00:55
+perlDreamer	oh, and I did a double submit by accident, so could some nice WebGUI.org admin please delete this one	00:55
+perlDreamer	http://www.plainblack.com/community-wiki/developers-guide-to-testing-in-webgui2	00:55
@rizen	i'll delete and look	00:56
+perlDreamer	Thanks	00:57
+perlDreamer	If I've overstepped any lines, please hack the page, then me.	00:57
@rizen	oh i'll hack you even if you haven't	00:58
@rizen	hehe	00:58
@rizen	there i made some minor edits	01:03
@rizen	in general it looks great	01:03
@rizen	and you don't have to ask for my approvla	01:03
@rizen	approval	01:03
@rizen	that's the whole idea of a wiki...so everyone can create collaborative knowledge	01:03
+perlDreamer	Well, I didn't want to set standards for core code without your buyin	01:03
@rizen	the standards are already set in wgbp	01:04
@rizen	=)	01:04
@rizen	you're just telling people how to make sense of it	01:04
-!- rizen is now known as rizenisout		01:05
-!- Dc5e [n=wgGuest0@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		01:11
diakopter	rizen; preaction: the integration of this editor is kind of crappy	01:20
@preaction	is it fixable? i think i'll defer to JT on this	01:20
* preaction runs		01:20
diakopter	well it's extremely fragile in IE	01:20
diakopter	barely usable, really.	01:21
diakopter	I should say, not even usable.	01:22
@preaction	which IE? 6 or 7?	01:22
diakopter	6	01:22
@preaction	curses...	01:22
diakopter	but the stupid thing is	01:24
diakopter	the only feature it adds to the codearea is line numbers.	01:24
diakopter	and in fact it removes the resizable aspect.	01:24
@preaction	what about the highlighting?	01:26
@preaction	or do you have to actually specify the highlighting to use? (wouldn't be hard to add that)	01:26
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:37
+perlDreamer	I'm questioning the statistics a little, but so far I've hacked out ~2 Mb of i18n and Help out of the core.	01:40
+perlDreamer	And that's just with the docs for the Macros	01:54
@preaction	nice	02:05
@preaction	7.4 will be leaner then? 7.3.x was creeping up towards 20meg	02:05
+perlDreamer	have you ever run du -s on lib/WebGUI?	02:06
+perlDreamer	There are several megs of help/i18n	02:06
+perlDreamer	Althought the biggest area by far is the YUI/icon stuff	02:06
+perlDreamer	This should trim several Mb off of the running size as well, since Help and i18n are implemented as code.	02:06
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:35
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #webgui		02:35
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		02:50
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		02:51
diakopter	preaction: no, it seems you have to specify the highlighting grammar. But of course, that can be a runtime dropdown; surely it doesn't need to persist across saves. On the other, hand, if HTML::Template templates could have their own highlighting grammar, that'd be pretty sweet.	02:59
+crythias	highlighting grammar. Like... if I fed my mother's mother Uranium?	03:08
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:45
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:45
diakopter	LOL	04:19
+Radix-wrk	Hmm.. coghead.com are doing some interesting stuff atm	04:22
+Radix-wrk	ajax application/database design and they've just added coglets - customisable widgets you can put on your website to access the application/database you set up.	04:37
+Radix-wrk	http://www.coghead.com/coglets	04:38
+Radix-wrk	rizenisout: that webgui package you sent on May 4th just arrived :) Surface mail sure takes a while! - 2 months, 14 days	05:17
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has left #webgui []		05:57
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		06:08
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@ip70-189-104-178.ok.ok.cox.net] has left #webgui []		06:33
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:36
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		12:10
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		12:18
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]		12:25
-!- preaction_ is now known as preaction		12:25
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		12:26
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		14:58
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		15:04
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		15:04
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Client Quit]		15:05
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		15:09
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		15:09
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		15:27
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@91.sub-75-207-163.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:41
SDuensin	Greetings	15:42
AMH_bob	Welcome	15:53
SDuensin	Hey AMH_bob	15:54
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		16:13
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		16:16
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		16:17
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		16:17
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		16:30
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		16:31
@rizenisout	radix_: holy crap balls	16:43
@rizenisout	that is a long time	16:43
-!- rizenisout is now known as rizen		16:43
@rizen	diakopter: if it's fragile, do not introduce it into the core	16:43
@rizen	the last thing i want is more bugs to fix	16:43
diakopter	that's what I figured	16:43
diakopter	it's a POS actually	16:43
@rizen	crap	16:43
@rizen	it looked cool	16:43
diakopter	sure, the latest version	16:43
diakopter	properly configured/integrated	16:43
* SDuensin missed something		16:44
diakopter	but as the forum attests, the latest version has devastating bugs.	16:44
@rizen	not worth it then...i guess we'll have to let it stabilize	16:44
diakopter	yeah :(	16:44
diakopter	sorry :(	16:44
SDuensin	What are we talking about?	16:45
diakopter	el CodeArea.pm	16:45
diakopter	and some JS editor mod	16:45
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		16:45
-!- Haarg [n=gknop@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:15
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:15
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		17:25
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["Leaving."]		18:05
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		18:17
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		19:48
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		19:48
@rizen	perlDreamer: you are checking your help changes into 7.4 and not 7.3 right?	20:42
+perlDreamer	oh no!	20:42
+perlDreamer	yes, I'm doing 7.4 ;)	20:43
+perlDreamer	There are some help topics for screens that don't have hoverhelp, like user settings.	20:43
+perlDreamer	Do you want to keep that help, purge it, or what?	20:43
-!- wgGuest70 [n=wgGuest7@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has joined #webgui		20:43
@rizen	user settings?	20:44
+perlDreamer	user profile settings	20:44
@rizen	goes in the wiki	20:44
@rizen	i want nothing remaining except regular i18n labels, hover help, and template variables	20:45
+perlDreamer	got it	20:45
+perlDreamer	later today, or perhaps tomorrow I'll need to ask you what to do with the Help icon and operations.	20:46
@rizen	i'm happy to report that the test suite discovered 4 errors this morning before the release	20:55
@rizen	which we're correcting	20:55
@rizen	kudos test suite	20:55
+perlDreamer	w00t!	20:55
+perlDreamer	What did I break?	20:55
@rizen	two problems were, i believe frank	20:56
@rizen	patching a bug in 7.4 but not backporting the fix to 7.3	20:56
@rizen	and the last two were...i don't know who	20:56
@rizen	but both have to do with help	20:56
@rizen	one i18n file had a syntax error	20:56
@rizen	and now there's a related problem that we're trying to track down	20:57
@rizen	but having trouble with	20:57
+perlDreamer	Need help?	20:57
@rizen	the output from the related test is not easy to follow	20:57
+perlDreamer	If you paste it, I can tell you what it means	20:57
+perlDreamer	ok 680 - Help entry: Asset -> asset template from Asset_Layout -> layout template	20:58
+perlDreamer	for example	20:58
@Haarg	not ok 164 - Help entry: Workflow_Activity_NotifyAdminsWithOpenVersionTags -> 'notify admins with open version tags' from Workflow_Activity -> list of installed activities	20:59
+perlDreamer	Ah.	20:59
+perlDreamer	That means that there is no help for NotifyAdminsWithOpenVersionTags	20:59
+perlDreamer	Since it's going away for 7.4, might not be a big deal	20:59
+perlDreamer	It was fixed in 7.4, before I chopped it out	21:00
@rizen	actually that workflow activity is not supposed to even be there	21:01
+perlDreamer	Even easier	21:02
@rizen	colin	21:25
@rizen	we have a big problem	21:25
@rizen	with the related help test	21:25
@rizen	it's somehow pulling stuff in from 7.4 even though those files aren't in our tree	21:25
@rizen	on my machine it's complaining about Asset_Newsletter	21:25
@rizen	but that doesn't exist until 7.4	21:25
+perlDreamer	what's your WEBGUI_CONFIG env var set to?	21:26
@rizen	does it cache anywhere?	21:27
@rizen	related.t?	21:27
+perlDreamer	no	21:27
@rizen	the config var is set to the right place on both graham and my machines	21:27
@rizen	we're both getting different sets of errors	21:27
@rizen	even though at /data/WebGUI	21:27
@rizen	is our 7.3 branch	21:27
@rizen	on both machines	21:27
@rizen	i get: Failed test 'Help entry: Asset_Newsletter -> 'newsletter add/edit' from Asset -> asset list'	21:27
@rizen	and Failed test 'Help entry: Macro_Basic -> 'basic' from Macros -> macros list'	21:28
@rizen	he gets that other one he told you about	21:28
+perlDreamer	I'll see if I can duplicate it.	21:28
@rizen	i'm boggled	21:29
+perlDreamer	I don't get any errors. that's after updating	21:29
diakopter	rizen: maybe a 7.4 checkout is in PERL5LIB :/ try starting another shell?	21:30
@rizen	ok i'll try that	21:30
+perlDreamer	gtg, be back after lunch	21:30
@rizen	same errors in a new shell	21:31
@rizen	oh well, i think we're going to just release with this	21:31
@rizen	cuz it doesn't seem to be a real problem	21:31
@rizen	only a problem in the test suite on our boxes	21:31
diakopter	is svn status empty?	21:31
@rizen	yup	21:31
diakopter	hum	21:31
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has joined #webgui		21:32
@rizen	Khaytsus, how do you like PostNuke?	21:35
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has quit []		21:58
pjesi	can someone point me to the 7.4 feature list?	22:08
@rizen	https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/view/WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt	22:10
pjesi	wow these nominees on SF, I have not heard about 90%	22:11
pjesi	thanks	22:11
pjesi	I only voted for Spring and WebGUI	22:13
pjesi	the rest either used PHP or is for Windows	22:13
Khaytsus	rizen: I don't.. heh..	22:14
Khaytsus	rizen: It's a pain in the ass to keep up to date	22:14
@rizen	as a user of PostNuke is there anything it has over WebGUI?	22:15
@rizen	other than that it's easier to install	22:15
+perlDreamer	rizen: You can use PostNuke on a shared hoster?	23:17
@rizen	yup	23:18
@rizen	that's what i'm talking about with install stuff though	23:18
@rizen	php vs mod_perl	23:18
@rizen	not something i can do anything about	23:18
perlmonkey2	php performance vs mod_perl	23:30
@rizen	pd you rule	23:30
@rizen	webgui is going to scream without all that help in memory	23:30
@rizen	now if we could just eliminate all labels from templates and use the i18n macro, we'd be sitting pretty	23:33
Khaytsus	rizen: Not really, only thing I can think of PostNuke might have is more themes readily availably.	23:39
Khaytsus	But that might be that I just haven't looked around as much ywet for WebGui themes.	23:39
Khaytsus	Sorry, working here, peep in every so often :)	23:39
* Khaytsus runs home		23:39
+perlDreamer	rizen, I'm guessing we can drop another 2-3 Mb with the Asset docs and other stuff, but it's getting real lean.	23:41
@rizen	that's awesome	23:41
@rizen	it will drop our per process size by around 5mb	23:41
@rizen	that's a huge overall drop	23:41
+perlDreamer	It will be easier to maintain, too. Since it's smaller.	23:43
* SDuensin cheers for RAM savings!		23:43
SDuensin	WebGUI's RAM use has been kicking my ass lately. That's fantastic news.	23:44
+perlDreamer	When I'm done with pruning, I'll run perltidy --WGBP on the Help and i18n files, too	23:46
SDuensin	Well, time to go home and work on my new WebGUI server! Later all!	23:48
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@91.sub-75-207-163.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:48
pjesi	"I can see that it is a step up for people whi have used various java based frameworks til now. But when you already have CGI::Builder, Catalyst, Maypole, or even webgui if you want to get really filthy ... why change?"	23:49
pjesi	from http://discuss.joelonsoftware.com/default.asp?joel.3.309321.4	23:49
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has left #webgui ["Leaving"]		23:55
--- Day changed Thu Jul 19 2007
-!- wgGuest70 [n=wgGuest7@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has quit []		00:07
-!- wgGuest70 [n=wgGuest7@pool-71-174-108-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		00:29
-!- wgGuest70 [n=wgGuest7@pool-71-174-108-13.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit]		00:30
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		00:35
+perlDreamer	Haarg, preaction, rizen: would someone please give spectre a kick on pb.com.	00:52
+perlDreamer	It's stuck again.	00:52
@preaction	sure	00:52
@preaction	wait, isn't that part of the fix in today's release?	00:52
@preaction	are they still releasing?	00:52
+perlDreamer	You'd sure think so :)	00:52
+perlDreamer	I don't know	00:52
@Haarg	the release is out	00:53
+perlDreamer	A bug was just submitted about plainblack emails not going out.	00:53
@preaction	Haarg, rizen, do you guys want to debug what's happening right now or can i just restart it?	00:54
@Haarg	let me take a look quick	00:54
@preaction	--status shows nothing, --test shows everything's fine	00:55
@Haarg	yeah, i'm not seeing anything in particular	00:57
+perlDreamer	for example, JT responded to Yung's post about file attachments	00:58
+perlDreamer	I never got any emails.	00:59
+perlDreamer	And that's from the dev list.	00:59
@preaction	Haarg, the only thing i can think of is that the scheduled tasks stop getting run after X days (but only on pb.com? we haven't had anyone else see this error that I know of). perhaps the libs that Spectre::Cron rely on have been updated recently?	01:01
@preaction	nevermind, looks like Spectre::Cron is its own scheduler system entirely	01:01
@Haarg	it might be good to add something about cron jobs to --status	01:05
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		01:07
-!- Haarg [n=gknop@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		01:08
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		01:09
+perlDreamer	oh look, a raft of PB emails!	01:10
+perlDreamer	thanks, guys	01:11
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		01:28
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		01:29
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		01:30
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		01:30
+perlDreamer	You know, as much as I tout the test suite, y'all need to remind me that it's nowhere near totally comprehensive.	02:00
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		02:10
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]		02:17
-!- preaction_ is now known as preaction		02:17
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		02:18
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		02:18
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		02:18
+crythias	... and then I said, "Compiler? But I hardly even know her!"	02:18
@preaction	uwah ha ha ha ha!!11	02:19
+crythias	"Clergyperson: Then by the power vested in me by insert local credentializing agency here, I now pronounce you wooter and WiFi. You may now surf the Internet, download MP3s, make Internet phone calls, share files, play network games, and stream high-definition videos simultaneously, and without wires, as long as you both shall function."	02:20
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		02:29
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:38
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		03:54
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:03
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		04:18
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		04:18
-!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has joined #webgui		04:44
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		04:46
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		05:19
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		06:23
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		06:24
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		06:25
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		07:52
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:46
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:14
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has joined #webgui		10:22
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		12:03
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@106.sub-75-206-142.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		16:24
@rizen	crythias makes funny jokes	16:25
SDuensin	Greetings.	16:27
AMH_bob	Good morning!	16:32
@rizen	AMH_bob is a liar. it's not morning where he is	16:33
AMH_bob	Nope, but it's morning somewhere! (I love that country song: It's five O'Clock somewhere)	16:34
@rizen	hehe	16:34
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		16:53
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:20
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:20
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui		17:22
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		18:03
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		18:04
-!- mindspin [n=mindspin@unaffiliated/mindspin] has joined #webgui		18:07
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		18:07
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["Leaving."]		18:09
mindspin	hi, I got a weird problem with webgui 5.8.8, when i type the url of the website, some virtual hosts work properly, some others work only when I type url/index.pl and some otehrs refuse to work, firefox is only asking wether it should download index.pl	18:11
perlmonkey2	mindspin: Sounds like your webgui.conf for apache isn't set up right. You need to tell apache how to handle scripts in your /data dir.	18:27
mindspin	it came out of a sudden	18:28
mindspin	could it be that I editet with utf8, instead of iso blah charset?	18:28
mindspin	because the error log shows cryptic signs	18:29
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has joined #webgui		18:29
mindspin	like this: Undefined subroutine &Apache::Registry::handl	18:29
mindspin	it worked properly for three years, real weird thing	18:30
mindspin	perlmonkey2: I tried to add scriptURL=/ in webgui.conf but with no effect	18:31
perlmonkey2	If it used to work and just now stopped, I'd roll back whatever changes you just made and also make sure there aren't encoding issues.	18:31
mindspin	I'll bet its encoding issues	18:32
mindspin	because only the suites where I uncommented Perl::Registry refuse to work	18:32
mindspin	I hate it	18:33
diakopter	mindspin: what editor were you using	18:43
mindspin	midnight commander	18:43
mindspin	actually I have a look at httpd.conf with vi	18:45
diakopter	ahhh.... good old mc. ick... I've had encoding problems with that built-in editor before.	18:47
mindspin	but vi shows no crypting chars	18:48
mindspin	now all pages work with URL/index.pl	18:48
mindspin	but not with just the url	18:48
mindspin	all sites i did not touch yesterday work fine...	18:50
diakopter	mindspin: are you restarting apache/mod_perl after these changes?	18:50
mindspin	yupp	18:50
diakopter	why did you uncomment Perl::Registry in those sites?	18:51
diakopter	(yesterday)	18:51
mindspin	it gave me internal server errors which needed rfreshing of the site...	18:51
mindspin	after uncommenting the errors did not appear anymore	18:52
mindspin	but wether uncommented or not, it has no effects, the site shows up only when I add /index.pl	18:55
mindspin	now I try some magic, I just change a working config of a garbage site and change the values to the paths of the site i need, I#ll bet its a coding issue	19:00
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has joined #webgui		19:06
mindspin	nope, magic doesnt do the trick	19:08
mindspin	hehe its not a webgui issue, its just firefox..... the sites work with konqueror, and IE, weird weird thing	19:25
diakopter	rizen: just got this in a spam: http://www.scriptlogic.com/landing/server%2Drockstar/	19:33
@rizen	there are no original ideas left in the world	19:35
diakopter	nor memes! :)	19:36
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has quit ["Leaving."]		19:57
-!- mindspin [n=mindspin@unaffiliated/mindspin] has left #webgui ["Konversation terminated!"]		20:14
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		20:38
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		20:38
-!- wgGuest23 [n=wgGuest2@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has joined #webgui		20:41
-!- wgGuest23 is now known as Dc5e		20:45
Dc5e	Has anyone tested the List Pending Transactions since 7.3.21? Supposedly it was fixed but it still does not seem to be working.	20:49
+perlDreamer	uh oh	20:50
+perlDreamer	What shows up in your webgui.log file?	20:50
Dc5e	uh hold on	20:50
Dc5e	main::[[undef]] - Couldn't execute operation : WebGUI::Operation::Commerce::www_listPendingTransactions. Root cause: Can't locat	20:52
Dc5e	er hold on	20:53
Dc5e	main::[[undef]] - Couldn't execute operation : WebGUI::Operation::Commerce::www_listPendingTransactions. Root cause: Can't locate object method "db" via package "WebGUI::Commerce::Transaction" at /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Commerce/Transaction.pm line 478.	20:53
Dc5e	there we go	20:53
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		20:54
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		20:54
+perlDreamer	Dc5e, are you comfortable with a text editor?	20:55
-!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui []		20:57
+perlDreamer	rizen: how many more 7.3's are there going to be?	20:57
@preaction	i would hope we keep releasing bugfixes to 7.3 until 7.4 goes stable	21:00
* perlDreamer imagines rizen talking on the phone, looking longingly at his IRC client		21:00
@preaction	he's trying to hire me some durned help around here	21:01
+perlDreamer	bah	21:01
+perlDreamer	When the Commerce gets rewritten in 7.(>4), I'm going to have a royal tizzy fit if we don't build a basic test suite to go with it.	21:03
+perlDreamer	Dc5e: Here's the scoop. I don't have a way to sandbox the Commerce system during the day. So when I fixed the operation, it just allowed the next bug to be uncovered.	21:05
+perlDreamer	I've found this bug, and have a prototype fix for it, but we're again in jeopardy of not having the final solution.	21:05
+perlDreamer	If you're willing, we can do this together.	21:05
Dc5e	sorry, i was busy doing something, i'm back now.	21:05
+perlDreamer	You willing to try a fix for me?	21:06
Dc5e	well, I'm kind of busy right now...	21:07
+perlDreamer	Would a time later today be better?	21:08
Dc5e	possibly	21:08
+perlDreamer	Alternately, I can give you the fix and let you try it (and downstream stuff) at your leisure	21:09
+perlDreamer	How does that sound	21:09
Dc5e	sure	21:09
+perlDreamer	perlbot pastebin	21:10
perlbot	(see paste)	21:10
+perlDreamer	perlbot: paste	21:10
perlbot	Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl or http://erxz.com/pb and #perl will be able to view it.	21:10
+perlDreamer	Dc5e: here's your patch http://sial.org/pbot/26409	21:12
+perlDreamer	I'll be afk for a while	21:13
Dc5e	okay, thanks	21:13
+perlDreamer	Please post back here if you have more problems, or better yet, file a bug	21:13
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		21:33
Dc5e	perlDreamer, the patch worked. Thanks alot.	21:44
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		21:50
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		21:50
@rizen	pd, there will be exactly 1 more 7.3 release	21:51
@rizen	next wednesday	21:51
-!- professorfrink_ [n=dstephan@h-74-0-5-198.phlapafg.covad.net] has joined #webgui		23:03
professorfrink_	i'm running 7.3.19 and i'm having trouble with subscriptions to collaboration system -	23:05
professorfrink_	in v6, when someone subscribed to a collab system, they got an email any time something was posted or changed	23:05
professorfrink_	and this worked when we were running an earlier version of 7.3, but then it just stopped working	23:06
professorfrink_	any thoughts?	23:06
@preaction	is spectre running? are there queued messages in the "mailQueue" table?	23:06
professorfrink_	spectre is running, and we're not having any trouble with any other workflows	23:08
professorfrink_	i'll check the mailqueue	23:08
professorfrink_	it looks like the notification message is in the mailqueue tab	23:17
+perlDreamer	Dc5e: So is _everything_ working now, or do you just get the screen now?	23:19
@preaction	professorfrink_, what version are you running? it might be a good idea to kick spectre (rc.webgui restartspectre)	23:19
professorfrink_	we're running 7.3.19	23:19
professorfrink_	i'll give it a shot	23:21
@preaction	looks like the fix for that isn't until 7.4	23:22
professorfrink_	hm	23:31
professorfrink_	yea, restarting spectre didn't seem to help	23:31
professorfrink_	so it seems like other people are having this problem, not just us?	23:32
@rizen	curl http://www.yoursite.com:81/?op=spectreGetSiteData	23:39
@rizen	run that from the command line	23:39
@rizen	and make sure it returns good data and no errors	23:39
professorfrink_	looks good to me - returned a bunch of processes and workflows, but no errors	23:44
@rizen	excellent then that's not the problem	23:45
professorfrink_	whoa - everything just came through	23:48
professorfrink_	from the past 3 weeks when it wasn't working	23:48
professorfrink_	looks like spectre just needed a kick in the pants	23:50
professorfrink_	thanks for all the help!	23:50
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has quit ["Leaving."]		23:51
+perlDreamer	just be sure to use that trick only on spectre	23:51
professorfrink_	for sure	23:51
+perlDreamer	using it on other things, (cars, dogs, etc.) is not guaranteed to work	23:51
professorfrink_	haha	23:51
professorfrink_	webgui IRC - not just webgui help, but life advice as well	23:52
+perlDreamer	We try to be a full service community	23:52
+perlDreamer	Why, just last week rizen told me why the meringue weeps in my Lemon Meringue pie.	23:52
professorfrink_	and i appreciate that	23:52
professorfrink_	oooo	23:52
professorfrink_	delightful	23:52
professorfrink_	that was so nice of him	23:54
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@106.sub-75-206-142.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:54
professorfrink_	i need to hang out more often....	23:54
+perlDreamer	Yeah, I never would have thought of Cream of Tartar as a binding agent.	23:55
--- Day changed Fri Jul 20 2007
+perlDreamer	Go Haarg!	00:04
+perlDreamer	Dude, you seem to be blessed.	00:04
+perlDreamer	Whenever I fix bugs, people keep reporting more	00:04
@Haarg	heh	00:04
-!- professorfrink_ [n=dstephan@h-74-0-5-198.phlapafg.covad.net] has left #webgui ["Ex-Chat"]		00:06
-!- Dc5e [n=wgGuest2@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		00:23
+perlDreamer	++bug	01:13
+perlDreamer	karma bug	01:13
+perlDreamer	perlbot: karma bug	01:13
perlbot	Karma for bug: 1	01:13
+perlDreamer	perlbot: karma bugs	01:13
perlbot	Karma for bugs: -2	01:13
+perlDreamer	--but	01:13
+perlDreamer	--bug	01:13
+perlDreamer	++bugs	01:13
@rizen	are you drunk?	01:13
+perlDreamer	no, just misspelling	01:13
* diakopter is crunk		01:13
+perlDreamer	I closed a WebGUI.org bug because it appeared to go away	01:14
+perlDreamer	Well, now it's back.	01:14
@Haarg	maybe i screwed it up when i fixed the other issue with those lists	01:17
+perlDreamer	It isn't a recent reoccurance, it's been a while.	01:20
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		01:31
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		02:00
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:47
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@tintangel.cdl.edu] has quit []		02:56
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:48
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:48
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		03:51
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		03:52
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		03:52
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		04:09
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		06:04
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		07:28
-!- diakopter [n=diakopte@pdpc/supporter/active/diakopter] has quit ["Changing server"]		09:02
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has quit ["Leaving"]		09:39
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		10:03
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:08
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		10:11
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Client Quit]		10:13
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		13:23
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:10
-!- l-e-o-n [n=leon@as2p9.access.maltanet.net] has joined #webgui		15:37
l-e-o-n	where can i find the virtual hosts for the awstats and how can i disable the demo in wre 0.7.2	15:37
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@176.sub-75-207-27.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:57
SDuensin	Greetings.	16:00
l-e-o-n	hey SDuensin	16:02
-!- diakopter [n=diakopte@pdpc/supporter/active/diakopter] has joined #webgui		16:27
@rizen	l-e-o-n, both are in /data/wre/etc	16:28
SDuensin	Hey rizen	16:35
@rizen	how goes it SD?	16:36
SDuensin	Pretty well. Got both my servers on the same release of WG last night and transferred all the web data over. Took forever. :-)	16:37
SDuensin	But now I'm ready to install everything and then resync the databases. Hopefully that'll fix my never ending RAM issues.	16:38
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		17:28
-!- l-e-o-n [n=leon@as2p9.access.maltanet.net] has quit []		17:28
AMH_bob	Good afternoon (Better late than never!)	17:33
SDuensin	Hey AMH_bob	17:36
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has joined #webgui		17:43
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		17:43
+crythias	... and then the ghost said, "Give me a beer... and a mop!"	17:44
AMH_bob	Hi Scott, I'm on duty this weekend - I'm going to try keeping the serverparc up using a nokia 770 instead of my laptop	17:44
+crythias	nokia 770 rocks	17:44
+crythias	thanks woot!	17:44
SDuensin	:-)	17:44
AMH_bob	uh-uh	17:44
AMH_bob	It's like... so cool dude	17:45
+crythias	I can't believe what convenience it is.	17:45
+crythias	except that rdesktop needs bt kbd	17:45
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:45
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:45
AMH_bob	yeah, a mini bluetooth keyboard would be welcome (if real server problems arise)	17:46
+crythias	I wish I got this one http://www.proporta.com/F02/PPF02P05.php?t_id=1461&t_mode=des	17:47
+crythias	This would be nice, too. http://freedominput.com/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=30	17:52
diakopter	wooton	17:53
AMH_bob	Yep, that freedom thing is going onto my wishlist.	18:03
AMH_bob	To everybody: have a nice weekend!	18:03
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		18:06
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		18:13
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has joined #webgui		19:02
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		19:02
+perlDreamer	Is rizen going to be around today?	19:19
@preaction	perlDreamer, no, he's out today	19:22
+perlDreamer	I'm probably going to be able to finish up the Help hacking today	19:23
+perlDreamer	Step 2 is what to do with all the Help icons.	19:23
+perlDreamer	Where do they link to?	19:23
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		21:28
-!- besonen_mobile_ [n=besonen_@71-220-233-253.eugn.qwest.net] has quit ["Leaving"]		22:24
-!- besonen_mobile [n=besonen_@71-220-233-253.eugn.qwest.net] has joined #webgui		22:27
+perlDreamer	boy, we have a lot of Assets	22:34
+perlDreamer	SDuensin: for 64-bit WRE, I think ckotil has done a lot of work on that.	22:35
SDuensin	Be nice to have one.	22:36
SDuensin	For now, I've made the 32 bit RHEL one run.	22:37
SDuensin	In fact, I just moved all my sites. :-)	22:37
+perlDreamer	were you having problems with the ftp client?	22:37
+perlDreamer	compiling it?	22:37
SDuensin	I don't remember. I had a ton of things that wouldn't build.	22:37
+perlDreamer	I know you're already all set up, but if you get interested, I think the answers are in the IRC logs and the discussion boards.	22:38
SDuensin	Logs maybe. I didn't see anything in the forums. Well, nothing newer than WRE 6.	22:39
+perlDreamer	might have been on the paid support forums, but I don't remember.	22:39
+perlDreamer	ckotil: ping. Yo! You around?	22:40
+perlDreamer	nope, not today.	22:40
SDuensin	hehe	22:40
SDuensin	I had some kind of paid support. No idea what it was - doesn't seem to be an option anymore.	22:40
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		22:53
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		23:28
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		23:29
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		23:29
-!- crythias [n=gyoung@64.200.2.35] has quit ["Leaving."]		23:36
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@176.sub-75-207-27.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:56
--- Day changed Sat Jul 21 2007
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		00:14
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		00:27
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		00:28
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		00:46
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:21
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has left #WebGUI ["Leaving"]		01:22
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		01:46
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		01:56
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined #webgui		01:57
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		01:57
+perlDreamer	preaction, got a sec?	01:58
@preaction	pourquoi?	01:58
+perlDreamer	Do mulitple versions of the same asset have different assetIds?	01:59
@preaction	no	01:59
+perlDreamer	I didn't think so.	01:59
+perlDreamer	Same asset can have different URLs, though	02:00
+perlDreamer	I'm trying to understand the logic behind Asset->urlExists	02:01
-!- jarcher [n=jarcher@64-142-95-110.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit []		02:09
-!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat086.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]		02:21
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Connection timed out]		05:16
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		06:24
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		06:24
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Connection timed out]		06:47
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		08:03
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		08:03
-!- Radix__ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		09:05
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		09:10
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		09:11
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix_] by ChanServ		09:11
-!- Radix__ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		09:11
-!- Radix__ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		09:16
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		09:16
--- Day changed Sun Jul 22 2007
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		02:11
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		02:11
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		02:12
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		02:13
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		02:13
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		02:48
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		03:11
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		03:11
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		03:26
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		07:15
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		08:06
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		21:41
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		21:41
+crythias	so, I've been thinking about Schriedinger's cat	21:42
+crythias	s/chri/chro	21:42
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		23:21
--- Day changed Mon Jul 23 2007
diakopter	crythias: is it for sale or something?	00:01
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		00:02
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		00:57
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:31
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:31
-!- knowmad [n=william@adsl-074-170-007-083.sip.clt.bellsouth.net] has joined #webgui		03:53
-!- knowmad [n=william@adsl-074-170-007-083.sip.clt.bellsouth.net] has left #webgui []		03:53
-!- knowmad [n=william@adsl-074-170-007-083.sip.clt.bellsouth.net] has joined #webgui		03:54
-!- knowmad [n=william@adsl-074-170-007-083.sip.clt.bellsouth.net] has left #webgui []		03:58
-!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has quit ["kbye"]		06:03
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui		07:52
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		07:52
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-216-252.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["Leaving."]		08:09
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:33
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:41
-!- wgGuest51 [n=wgGuest5@adsl-9-68-70.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #webgui		09:56
wgGuest51	Question : Is it possible to setup WebGUI on a shared hosting site?	09:59
-!- wgGuest51 [n=wgGuest5@adsl-9-68-70.mia.bellsouth.net] has quit [Client Quit]		10:00
-!- wgGuest04 [n=wgGuest0@adsl-9-68-70.mia.bellsouth.net] has joined #webgui		10:05
wgGuest04	Does anyone know where a requirements list might be for installing WebGUI?	10:06
wgGuest04	Nevermind, found it. There really should be a page instead of only in the wiki though. o.o	10:08
-!- wgGuest04 [n=wgGuest0@adsl-9-68-70.mia.bellsouth.net] has quit [Client Quit]		10:08
-!- Radix-wrk changed the topic of #webgui to: [ WebGUI 7.3.20 \| WRE 0.7.2 ] .:. Come To The WUC http://www.plainblack.com/wuc .:. Feel free to ask questions on here - but make sure you stick around long enough for us to answer! :)		10:31
@preaction	tomorrow starts the amateur air show in the country, 5 miles away from where i'm sitting, trying to sleep. the tourists have already arrived to wreak havoc on this small city of 60,000 people.	10:46
@preaction	i feel sorry for our service industry...	10:46
+Radix-wrk	good luck! :)	11:43
+Radix-wrk	I	11:43
+Radix-wrk	I'd be worrying about my house being crashed into by one of the amateur pilots myself! :)	11:44
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:44
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		15:33
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		15:33
+crythias	hrm	15:33
+crythias	HI, et al.	15:33
+crythias	I was thinking about the AssetProxy being added to the rich editor.	15:35
+crythias	Radix__ you there?	15:36
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		15:50
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		16:06
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@188.sub-75-204-53.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		16:12
Radix__	yeah	16:21
+crythias	just was	16:25
+crythias	sorry	16:25
+crythias	was thinking about the process to put an asset in rich editor	16:26
Radix__	Rizen doesn't seem to think it's possible, and closed my request	16:27
Radix__	not without simply embedding assetproxy calls and then not displaying the image at all	16:27
+crythias	It seems to me that if the edit screen is more like a ... what is that thing...	16:27
+crythias	I want to say "desktop" but I mean something else.	16:28
Radix__	viewer?	16:28
+crythias	but what if the edit screen was more like a page layout admin mode rather than the way it is, now.	16:28
+crythias	there's this asset that allows you to move chunks of content around.	16:29
+crythias	kinda like a mini portal	16:29
Radix__	I think it's more the way the rich text editor interacts with webgui	16:29
Radix__	and how the data is passed around that is the problem	16:29
Radix__	webgui kinda dumps the html out and sends it to the rich text editor, then gets it back at the end	16:30
Radix__	with images there is some kind of interaction with webgui going on, but the rte still needs valid html to work with	16:31
Radix__	what you want is some kind of special object reference that gets interpreted the right way to the rte and to webgui when it gets the data back at the end	16:32
+crythias	dashboard	16:32
SDuensin	Morning!	16:32
+crythias	morning	16:32
Radix__	evenin ;)	16:32
AMH_bob	Afternoon!	16:32
SDuensin	Hehehe	16:32
+crythias	we need a java WYSIWYG that handles the requests better. or perhaps a AJAX-like request/retrieval	16:33
Radix__	Hey bob - how's the weather in nl atm? :)	16:33
AMH_bob	it has rained and its a 17C/63F out there...	16:35
* Radix__ will make sure he brings his raincoat when he goes there next weekend.		16:35
AMH_bob	but I only get to go outside 40 feet to the car and 20 feet from the car to the house..... so it's not that big a deal to me :P	16:36
Radix__	heh	16:36
Radix__	it's flooding down here at the moment	16:36
AMH_bob	Radix, are you comming over? Gonna be in the neighbourhood of Eindhoven?	16:37
Radix__	but then it's winter for us, so we expect it :)	16:37
Radix__	AMH_bob: Yup, as of Sunday I leave wet and rainy australia and head north to europe for a couple of months. Spending two weeks with Oqapi in Delft, then head off on holidays to see the rest of europe :)	16:38
AMH_bob	Cool, I'll send you my home and office details, jist in case you have time to kill or if you need help with anything.	16:42
Radix__	cool	16:44
SDuensin	Anyone ever have the WRE go nuts and eat all the CPU time?	16:44
-!- wgGuest98 [n=wgGuest9@76.28.6.5] has joined #webgui		16:46
-!- wgGuest98 is now known as danny_mk		16:47
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		16:51
pjesi	SDuensin: yes please	16:59
SDuensin	Please? You want it to go nuts?	17:01
pjesi	hehe no, but I have to restart WRE frequently because of this	17:17
SDuensin	That's not good. I need to fix it.	17:18
pjesi	I know	17:19
pjesi	actually it is the admins job	17:20
pjesi	and he insisted on this	17:20
SDuensin	Well, for me, the sad thing is - I'M the admin!	17:20
pjesi	:)	17:21
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:21
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		17:21
SDuensin	Trouble has arrived!	17:21
pjesi	make sure to highlight me if you find something interesting	17:21
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:25
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:25
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@ip2.fa1-0-2.occ.iinet.com] has joined #webgui		18:17
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		18:17
diakopter	welcome, perlDreamer. WebGUI is web done right.	18:18
+perlDreamer	Good morning, all.	18:18
+perlDreamer	We're reporting live from OSCON.	18:18
diakopter	OSCON 2007, that is.	18:18
+perlDreamer	Please forward all questions to the moderator, and we'll answer them on a one by one basis.	18:18
diakopter	not any past or future ones.	18:18
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		18:21
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction_] by ChanServ		18:21
-!- Radix__ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		18:27
-!- Radix_ [n=Radix@203.161.71.161.static.amnet.net.au] has joined #webgui		18:30
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix_] by ChanServ		18:30
@rizen	what sessions are you guys in right now?	18:31
+perlDreamer	Advanced VIM Scripting	18:31
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Connection timed out]		18:31
@rizen	ask if there is a way to start vim in edit mode	18:31
@rizen	for example, when vim is set as your subversion editor	18:32
+perlDreamer	There's gotta be a way to do that, because that's how diakopter's vim starts	18:32
+perlDreamer	he asked me if there was a way to turn it off :)	18:33
-!- preaction__ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		18:41
-!- preaction_ [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.]		18:43
-!- preaction__ is now known as preaction		18:43
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		18:43
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		18:44
-!- danny_mk [n=wgGuest9@76.28.6.5] has quit []		18:54
-!- wgGuest17 [n=wgGuest1@76.28.6.5] has joined #webgui		18:55
-!- wgGuest17 [n=wgGuest1@76.28.6.5] has quit [Client Quit]		18:57
+Radix_	rizen: vim -y	19:05
+Radix_	it puts vi in a wierd mode tho.. you need to use ctrl-l to get it into command mode	19:09
+Radix_	also called evim	19:09
+Radix_	http://vimdoc.sourceforge.net/htmldoc/starting.html#evim-keys	19:09
@rizen	what i'm looking for is just to execute i as soon as vim opens	19:18
@rizen	i don't want to be in a special mode	19:18
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has joined #webgui		19:20
diakopter	rizen: http://www.vim.org/tips/tip.php?tip_id=297	19:21
diakopter	or, alias vim=vim -c 'startinsert'	19:23
diakopter	I mean, alias vim="vim -c 'startinsert'"	19:24
+perlDreamer	rizen: just committed a fix to the bug we discussed earlier.	19:28
+perlDreamer	I'll work on the backport next	19:28
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has joined #webgui		19:30
+perlDreamer	backport done	19:35
+perlDreamer	in vim, you can use :match to debug regular expressions	19:49
+perlDreamer	It will show you what part of the text matches your regex	19:49
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has left #webgui []		20:04
-!- perlDreamer [n=colink@ip2.fa1-0-2.occ.iinet.com] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]		20:14
-!- wgGuest24 [n=wgGuest2@83.228.8.109] has joined #webgui		21:07
wgGuest24	nick todor_k	21:08
-!- wgGuest24 [n=wgGuest2@83.228.8.109] has quit [Client Quit]		21:08
-!- wgGuest98 [n=wgGuest9@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has joined #webgui		21:15
-!- wgGuest98 is now known as Dc5e		21:17
-!- Dc5e [n=wgGuest9@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		22:54
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-c2a75b88737d6a31] has joined #webgui		23:33
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		23:33
+perlDreamer	full house today	23:33
+perlDreamer	So now I'm in Advanced Techniques for Parsing	23:33
diakopter	full here as well. "A Taste of Haskell"	23:33
+perlDreamer	I saw your room. There are more people in the channel ;)	23:34
diakopter	barely any seats open here now	23:34
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@188.sub-75-204-53.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:42
+crythias	Error Message: Your Password Must Be at Least 18770 Characters and Cannot Repeat Any of Your Previous 30689 Passwords	23:54
+crythias	http://support.microsoft.com/kb/q276304/	23:55
+crythias	and because of this, we learn of the msgina .dll	23:55
+crythias	gtg	23:55
--- Day changed Tue Jul 24 2007
diakopter	ohhhh; pronounced Ms. Jyna. I get it now.	00:03
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		00:19
-!- wgGuest95 [n=wgGuest9@76.28.6.5] has joined #webgui		00:25
-!- wgGuest95 is now known as danny_mk		00:25
danny_mk	Interesting behavior!	00:26
danny_mk	try this: http://www.yournewwebguiinstallation.com/faq	00:26
-!- danny_mk [n=wgGuest9@76.28.6.5] has quit []		00:32
-!- xootom [n=tom@82-38-197-188.cable.ubr04.shef.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #webgui		00:42
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:15
+perlDreamer	I was going to ask last week, is anyone else going to OSCON?	01:16
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		01:35
@preaction	when i'm managing revisions in a tag that has a workflow instance, will i be allowed to approve/deny tags that have already been approved/denied by some other user?	01:53
-!- xootom [n=tom@82-38-197-188.cable.ubr04.shef.blueyonder.co.uk] has left #webgui []		02:26
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-c2a75b88737d6a31] has quit ["Leaving."]		02:51
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		03:44
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		03:44
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		04:01
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		04:01
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has left #webgui []		08:14
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		08:40
-!- jdan [n=jdan@xdsl-461.lubin.dialog.net.pl] has quit ["Leaving"]		09:07
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:33
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:34
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		10:37
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:37
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:43
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has joined #webgui		11:44
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		11:52
AMH_bob	Goodmorning, your ealy!	12:27
xootom	morning amh_bob! which country are you in?	12:41
AMH_bob	The Netherlands	12:49
AMH_bob	Nice and rainy over here...	12:49
xootom	ahh over in the uk here, yes it's been very wet	12:59
pjesi	it is sunny here in the uk	13:03
xootom	yeah it's nice today, where abouts are you pjesi	13:10
pjesi	oxford	13:13
pjesi	I walked down to Thames last night, man it was a lot of water!	13:13
xootom	i was going to say, wasn't that one of the flooded areas?	13:13
pjesi	Some of the roads near Thames were closed yesterday, I don't know how bad it was	13:14
+Radix_	it's been raining cats and dogs here too!	13:57
+Radix_	We had a section of our office flooded overnight	13:57
+Radix_	No serious damage tho.. just wet carpets - had huge industrial dryers drying out the carpet all day	13:58
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		13:59
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has left #webgui []		15:10
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@124.sub-75-204-202.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:35
SDuensin	Greetings.	15:36
@rizen	salutations	16:24
-!- wgGuest79 [n=wgGuest7@76.28.6.5] has joined #webgui		16:26
SDuensin	Hey rizen	16:26
@rizen	straw SD	16:27
-!- wgGuest79 [n=wgGuest7@76.28.6.5] has quit [Client Quit]		16:29
AMH_bob	Hi Guys	16:58
-!- chatito28 [n=david@130.156.38.11] has joined #Webgui		17:01
chatito28	Good morning .. i have a question. I setup up webgui 7.3.21 from scratch and i am able to get my page through port 81 but not port 80	17:02
chatito28	what do i need to do	17:02
chatito28	i get a mssg configure awstats.newweb.conf	17:02
chatito28	anybody can help me	17:08
@rizen	mv awstats.newweb.conf awstats.newweb.conf.off	17:09
@rizen	restart web	17:09
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		17:10
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:10
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:10
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Client Quit]		17:10
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:12
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:12
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		17:14
chatito28	sorry but now i get the stats when i type http://newweb	17:21
@rizen	oops, told you to rename the wrong file	17:22
@rizen	meant stats.modproxy	17:22
chatito28	so it should be stats.modproxy.off	17:23
@rizen	y	17:24
@rizen	anybody know if there are stylesheet properties i could use to lock a div to the lower right corner of a window regardless of whether the window scrolls or not?	17:25
chatito28	now i get a bad gateway error	17:26
SDuensin	I think there are. Don't ask me what they might be though.	17:26
chatito28	502 Bad Gateway	17:26
@rizen	chatito28, that's all i can tell you. for more contact plainblack support	17:26
chatito28	thanks for the help	17:35
chatito28	i have karmas .. how do i contact support	17:35
@rizen	do you have a support contract?	17:39
@rizen	if not, go to plainblack.com > store > support	17:39
chatito28	thanks	17:42
-!- chatito28 [n=david@130.156.38.11] has quit []		17:42
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		17:44
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		17:57
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		17:57
@preaction	anyone in here ever notice a problem with empty version tags from users (who should have their stuff auto-committed)?	18:00
@rizen	i have seen that on occasion, but have not been able to determine what causes it	18:01
@rizen	i've only ever seen it on one site though, so i thought it might be site related	18:02
@preaction	which site? the alumni site? they seem to have it happen rather often	18:02
@rizen	cmsmatrix.org	18:02
@preaction	interesting	18:02
@rizen	it never seems to happen on plainblack.com even though we have a lot of people posting there all the time	18:03
@preaction	perhaps all the people posting there are speaking UTF-8?	18:07
@preaction	or, the postings aren't subject to approval	18:07
@preaction	whereas the ones on the alumni site and the cmsmatrix are	18:07
@rizen	on plainblack.com only the news page is subject to approval	18:11
@rizen	on cmsmatrix.org only the news page is subject to approval	18:11
@preaction	doesn't cmsmatrix.org allow anyone to post news though? whereas plainblack only allows us?	18:13
@rizen	nope, anyone can post news on plainblack.com	18:14
@rizen	just mostly people don't	18:15
@preaction	side-note: is anyone allowed to post news to webgui.org?	18:15
@rizen	it's the same site	18:16
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		18:21
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit ["Leaving."]		18:35
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		19:19
-!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui		19:20
-!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ		19:20
@rizen	nuba, how's the google maps thing?	19:48
-!- cryolai [n=alai@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has joined #webgui		20:32
cryolai	anybody have any idea when the commerce module will be updated with a new version?	20:33
@rizen	7.5 or beyond	20:34
@rizen	meaning, not in the next few months	20:34
@rizen	bug--	20:40
@preaction	woot	20:40
-!- wgGuest74 [n=wgGuest7@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has joined #webgui		20:46
SDuensin	When do we get to start seeing the slimmer, nicer to my RAM, WebGUI? :-)	20:47
@rizen	7.4	20:47
@rizen	when it is released	20:47
@rizen	and i've already stated the release date on the dev mailing list	20:47
SDuensin	Well, get typin'! I need it! :-)	20:47
@preaction	hold yer horses	20:48
SDuensin	My horses are swappin' like mad! :-P	20:49
@preaction	there are so many new features in 7.4, we have to ensure they all get in	20:49
cryolai	are there any order details that can be seen other than the item bought in the commerce section?	20:53
cryolai	such as CC #'s, buyers, etc	20:53
@preaction	cryolai, which version? i believe there was a bug fixed in commerce for this wednesday's release that fixed the View Pending transactions	20:54
cryolai	the latest version...	20:54
@rizen	cryolai: you can never view cc numbers, that would be a big security problem	20:55
cryolai	the view pending doesn't really show any pertinent details	20:55
@rizen	but you can see what items were purchased, and the total purchase amount, and what user made the purchase	20:55
@rizen	and when you log in to the itransact account you can see other things like whether it was purchased with a visa/mastercard, etc	20:56
@rizen	but in general, the commerce system is bare bones right now. it's fine for small stores, but it needs a major upgrade to do fancy stuff	20:56
@rizen	and that's all coming in later 7.x releases	20:56
cryolai	where does it show which user made the purchase?	21:01
cryolai	pending transactions shows transactionID, date, gatewayID...	21:02
@rizen	my mistake, it is supposed to show that in the list transactions screen	21:03
@rizen	that's a bug	21:03
cryolai	oh alright	21:04
-!- wgGuest74 is now known as Dc5e		21:06
cryolai	so, does that mean that iTransact will have all the CC information?	21:16
cryolai	or no	21:16
@rizen	it has their credit card info, but you are not allowed to see it	21:16
@rizen	again, that would be a security flaw	21:16
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@fl-71-3-58-222.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #webgui		21:32
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		21:32
cryolai	so..how do you access the contact information that they provided in the form (such as an address for shipping)	21:39
cryolai	or that is a security issue as well	21:39
@rizen	i just told you, that's a bug	21:39
@rizen	it's being worked on as we speak	21:40
cryolai	oh, okay, sorry	21:40
@rizen	you should see the user that made the purchase in the transaction list	21:40
@rizen	and then you can view their address info	21:40
@rizen	although, you can probably also see that in your iTransact account if you want	21:40
@Haarg	i have that fixed now. it will show the user in the transaction lists.	22:19
@rizen	note, that fix will be in 7.3.22	22:20
cryolai	when is that coming out?	22:32
cryolai	tmorrow? :)	22:33
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@fl-71-3-58-222.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		22:39
@rizen	sometime on wednesday	22:40
@rizen	it may be wednesday night, so its probably safer to tell you thursday	22:40
cryolai	awesome	22:47
cryolai	Thanks for your help	23:38
-!- cryolai [n=alai@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has quit []		23:38
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@124.sub-75-204-202.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:49
--- Day changed Wed Jul 25 2007
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-425ab0743cf58a64] has joined #webgui		00:11
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		00:12
+perlDreamer	Haarg: no need to forward port the Asset Template help to 7.4. It was deleted.	00:12
@Haarg	hmm	00:12
@Haarg	i did that by accident	00:12
+perlDreamer	Deleted as part of the Great Help purge of 2007	00:12
@Haarg	didn't think i committed it	00:12
+perlDreamer	You didn't, I was just being proactive.	00:12
@Haarg	ok :)	00:13
@preaction	Help purge? this is a witch hunt! cossacks!	00:13
@preaction	help help its being repressed!	00:13
+perlDreamer	svn del Help/Asset_preaction.pm	00:13
+perlDreamer	svn commit -m 'For the greater good'	00:14
@preaction	is there any way to prevent some text from being wiki-linked?	00:14
@preaction	i think not yet, right?	00:14
+perlDreamer	Not unless you misspell it.	00:14
@Haarg	put it in an anchor would work	00:14
+perlDreamer	In Kwiki-ese, you mean something like !ThisIsNotAWikiLink	00:15
@preaction	a named anchor? that's evil	00:15
@preaction	basically, yeah	00:15
@Haarg	yeah, that's only appropriate in certain places	00:15
@preaction	i'm almost thinking we'll need to move towards adding wiki-markup for the linking feature :(	00:15
@preaction	[[wikilink]] [[!don't wiki link this you git]]	00:16
* rizen mumbles something about how he hates wiki markup		00:18
+perlDreamer	Maybe a noLInker plugin to the RTE?	00:18
+perlDreamer	inbetween the words may do it, since its regexp based.	00:19
@rizen	why would you not want to link it if the title exists?	00:19
@rizen	give me a reason	00:19
@preaction	it's linking the France part of Francesca because there's a "France" article	00:20
@rizen	bs...then create a Francesca article	00:20
@preaction	but they don't want Francesca to be an article	00:21
@rizen	or link to an external page that is related to francesca	00:21
@preaction	it's just the name of a person, can't link to her profile because (probably) it's private	00:21
@preaction	(if she even has a profile)	00:21
@rizen	sorry, i just don't see it as being a problem	00:22
@rizen	why don't you submit and RFE and see if people agree with you	00:36
@rizen	if it gets moved up toward the top of the list i'll be forced to change my mind	00:36
-!- Dc5e [n=wgGuest7@h-64-105-49-14.cmbrmaor.covad.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		00:37
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-425ab0743cf58a64] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		00:37
@preaction	just the problem or my proposed solution? i could try to take some time to understand the TinyMCE enough to integrate some sort of WYSIWYG way to manipulate wiki linking (as well as handy show-auto-linking-as-you-type)	00:38
@preaction	probably a better solution, if possible, but far more difficult	00:39
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-5629ad9f84659fb8] has joined #webgui		01:14
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		01:14
+perlDreamer	preaction: how about anchoring the regexp's with \b to enforce whole word matching?	01:15
@preaction	change all the spaces in the title we're trying to match against to \b\s+\b ?	01:16
+perlDreamer	no, see line 100 in Asset/Wobject/WikiMaster.pm	01:17
+perlDreamer	it builds that gnarly regexp then joins them with \|'s	01:17
@Haarg	the problem with that is linking plurals and such	01:18
+perlDreamer	you'd lose linking to plurals	01:18
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		01:35
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:42
+perlDreamer	There's a wiki whose markup is POD...	01:42
@preaction	yeah, not so much	01:44
@preaction	we don't need to replace anything that HTML can already do	01:45
SDuensin	ReHi	01:50
+perlDreamer	howdy	01:51
SDuensin	Poo. I was hoping someone was industrious and added a memory reduction page to the wiki. :-)	02:02
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-5629ad9f84659fb8] has quit ["Leaving."]		02:19
-!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has joined #webgui		03:05
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		04:19
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		04:19
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		06:48
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit ["Exit- stage left"]		08:11
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:44
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:27
@preaction	what's the Graphics admin panel used for?	10:34
@preaction	there's an entire admin panel that i've never used and is completely undocumented	10:34
-!- diakopter [n=diakopte@pdpc/supporter/active/diakopter] has left #webgui []		10:47
+Radix-wrk	preaction: it's used for graphs in polls	10:49
@preaction	that would explain it	10:49
@preaction	okay, ethical question: should I confront a committer about their blatant disregard for the WebGUI Best Practices?	11:07
+Radix-wrk	lol	11:13
+Radix-wrk	Sure, but be nice and helpful too, whoever it is is still contributing!	11:13
@preaction	second question: what if it's JT?	11:14
+Radix-wrk	haha... then drop the nice and helpful bit - just tell him ;)	11:15
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		11:59
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		13:34
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has joined #webgui		13:55
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:18
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		15:23
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Client Quit]		15:24
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		15:25
-!- AMH_Mari_ [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		15:25
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		15:39
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@165.sub-75-204-21.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		16:01
SDuensin	Kinda good morning.	17:02
@rizen	would be better if preaction wasn't always dissing me	17:05
SDuensin	You probably deserve it for something. :-)	17:06
SDuensin	We still love ya though.	17:06
SDuensin	I'd love you a lot more if my server quit running it's load up to 35+ when WebGUI is running. :-(	17:07
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:09
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:09
@rizen	is it my fault that you've set up webgui on a woefully underpowered box?	17:12
SDuensin	Thing is, it's not. I have a dual core AMD 64 bit thing with a gig of RAM.	17:23
SDuensin	I have a sinking feeling it's the "64 bit" part. Since it's hosted, I don't have a choice of OSs.	17:24
@rizen	holy balls man. then ram is not your problem, unless the site is just being flooded with thousands and thousands of requests	17:24
xootom	i was really worried about running webgui on my server, but it performs really well, only 1gb and that's shared with 3 other apaches running metadot, php4 and php5	17:24
SDuensin	Nope. It's sitting bored. Maybe four people on it.	17:24
@rizen	it's either the 64-bit part, or it's not configured very well	17:24
@rizen	what does your /data/wre/prereqs/apache/conf/startup.pl look like?	17:25
SDuensin	What's to configure? It's the WRE. I even went in and trimmed down the RAM settings like I did on my old server.	17:25
xootom	mine was originally 64 bit but i abandoned and reimaged with 32 bit, 64 bit had far too many issues with things not compiling or not available	17:25
@rizen	even with the WRE there is some tuning that can be done to suit the given environment	17:25
@rizen	the WRE is configured as well as it can be without knowing the environment	17:26
SDuensin	I changed startup.pl to this:	17:26
SDuensin	$Apache2::SizeLimit::MAX_PROCESS_SIZE = 50000;	17:26
SDuensin	$Apache2::SizeLimit::MAX_UNSHARED_SIZE = 25000;	17:26
SDuensin	$Apache2::SizeLimit::CHECK_EVERY_N_REQUESTS = 5;	17:26
@rizen	those are way too low	17:26
@rizen	i bet if you look at your modperl error log	17:26
@rizen	you'll see that the processes are being killed after serving just one or two requests	17:27
SDuensin	I can put them back where they were. Doesn't seem to matter.	17:27
@rizen	look at your modperl error log	17:27
SDuensin	Yea. It's mad. Oddly, it also has errors that fork() doesn't have enough memory.	17:29
SDuensin	I'll put 'em back to 100000 and 75000.	17:29
@rizen	yeah, and then see what the log says	17:30
SDuensin	So when does the "Moron's Guide to WebGUI Administration" get released? :-)	17:30
@rizen	when i'm done writing it	17:30
SDuensin	OK, now to sit and watch "top" for awhile. :-D	17:33
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has left #webgui []		17:41
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:42
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:42
-!- wgGuest88 [n=wgGuest8@72.85.248.223] has joined #webgui		18:11
SDuensin	What should the perms under /data/domains look like?	18:16
@rizen	the uploads folder for each site should be owned recursively by nobody	18:17
@rizen	other than that it doesn't matter much as long as the web server can get to the uploads folder	18:17
@rizen	and write logs in the logs folder	18:18
SDuensin	Thanks	18:19
-!- wgGuest62 [n=wgGuest6@72.85.248.223] has joined #webgui		18:44
-!- wgGuest62 [n=wgGuest6@72.85.248.223] has quit []		18:51
@rizen	nuba, how is the google maps thing coming?	19:04
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has left #webgui []		19:32
-!- wgGuest88 [n=wgGuest8@72.85.248.223] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		20:53
-!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		23:00
SDuensin	IT'S DOING IT! httpd is freaking out again. Load is 17. WTF?!	23:01
@rizen	look in modperl error log?	23:02
SDuensin	I have one httpd process from the WRE that has 87.5% of my RAM.	23:02
@rizen	do you have wre monitor configured?	23:02
SDuensin	Pretty sure I do.	23:03
SDuensin	Wide character in print at /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Session/Output.pm line 96.	23:03
SDuensin	Out of memory!	23:03
SDuensin	[Mon Jul 23 20:41:11 2007] [notice] child pid 10138 exit signal Segmentation fault (11)	23:03
SDuensin	Out of memory!	23:03
SDuensin	I also get these in the modproxy log:	23:04
SDuensin	[Mon Jul 23 21:00:51 2007] [error] [client 66.249.65.11] proxy: error reading status line from remote server www.kevinmhuntfoundation.org	23:04
SDuensin	[Mon Jul 23 21:00:52 2007] [error] [client 66.249.65.11] proxy: Error reading from remote server returned by /guestbook/memoriallog	23:04
@rizen	that's definitely not good, but i don't know what could be causing it	23:05
@rizen	could be the 64-bit stuff like you said	23:05
@rizen	we don't have any 64bit boxes to play with it on	23:05
SDuensin	Apparently someone tried to upload using the filepile. But just a single image.	23:05
@rizen	you could use a script like this set up to run once a minute in your crontab to kill the runaways	23:06
@rizen	http://pastebin.com/m69085e6a	23:06
@rizen	that's really only a short term bandaid	23:06
SDuensin	mem > 5 is 5% ?	23:06
@rizen	but it's something	23:07
@rizen	yeah	23:07
SDuensin	I know. Something is much appreciated.	23:07
@rizen	we use a script like that on servers with custom code in case the custom code causes any memory problems	23:07
SDuensin	SONOFA(%#*#(!@	23:07
SDuensin	So what if wremonitor isn't running? Grrr.	23:08
@rizen	wremonitor just checks stuff to make sure it's alive once in a while, and restarts it if it isn't	23:08
@rizen	it's a good thing to run, but you don't have to	23:08
SDuensin	k	23:08
SDuensin	Well, all my crontab stuff for WebGUI was commented out. :-(	23:08
@rizen	likewise, even if it is running, but wremonitor can't connect it will restart the service	23:09
SDuensin	Still gonna toss in the script you gave me.	23:09
@rizen	yeah...we run them both on the servers where we're worried about runaways	23:10
@rizen	you might need to tweak that script i gave you though	23:10
@rizen	cuz it uses top	23:10
@rizen	and top's output is a little different on different platforms	23:10
SDuensin	k	23:10
SDuensin	Wow. Nice regex.	23:14
@rizen	sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do	23:14
SDuensin	We need to get you a 64 bit box for the next WRE.	23:16
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-3bf75cf68947411d] has joined #webgui		23:29
-!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ		23:29
+perlDreamer	hey, all!	23:29
SDuensin	Hey	23:31
+perlDreamer	What's happening in the WebGUI world?	23:32
SDuensin	It's running wild! It's consuming everything in sight! Save the children!	23:34
+perlDreamer	heh	23:38
SDuensin	Something in the WRE is mad about running on x64. Dunno WTF is going on.	23:39
+perlDreamer	we need someone to volunteer an x64 box for WRE testing.	23:41
+perlDreamer	build/compile/etc.	23:41
SDuensin	If I can find one, it's all yours. I'm just a bit low on extra hardware at the moment.	23:43
+perlDreamer	They're not cheap, that's for sure.	23:43
SDuensin	They're not exactly expensive either.	23:44
+perlDreamer	Do you mean a dedicated box, or shared, or VPS'ed?	23:45
SDuensin	I mean just to buy one and set it up under a desk somewhere.	23:46
SDuensin	About $300 on NewEgg to build a cheap one.	23:52
SDuensin	I'll poke around. Maybe I can dig one up.	23:52
SDuensin	However, for now, I'm going home. Later all!	23:52
SDuensin	Thanks again, rizen - you rock!	23:52
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@165.sub-75-204-21.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:54
--- Day changed Thu Jul 26 2007
+perlDreamer	preaction, Haarg: I'm building a new form for additional databaseLink parameters. I was planning on using a 1 per line syntax. Do you know if I have to handle Windows newlines as well as Unix newlines, or am I safe using Unix newlines?	00:12
@preaction	i'd probably go so far as to use JSON inside, or Storable qw(nfreeze), or something less plain-text	00:13
@preaction	but why aren't we normalizing it?	00:13
+perlDreamer	Normalizing it?	00:13
+perlDreamer	Teach me, Obi-wan	00:14
@preaction	one column for each value	00:15
@preaction	instead of storing data structures in the database that need to be translated somehow	00:15
@preaction	i mean, sure, we can perform regex matches to attempt to parse the datastructures using SQL queries, but that's just crazy	00:16
+perlDreamer	Then you'd have to add them dynamically as the user adds more parameters.	00:16
@preaction	what are these parameters being used for?	00:17
@preaction	and the new userProfileData table does exactly that	00:17
+perlDreamer	DatabaseLink, additional db parameters	00:17
+perlDreamer	If it was generalized, I'd be happy to plug it into a new table	00:17
@preaction	parameters like what? more options to DBI->connect perhaps?	00:18
+perlDreamer	LongReadLen, LongTruncOK	00:18
+perlDreamer	See SQL.pm, sub connect for examples.	00:18
@preaction	somethink like that might be best served using JSON (then you can just jsonToObj, add the other params, and send it right to SQL->connect	00:20
+perlDreamer	So the user will enter JSON into a text box for additional parameters?	00:21
@preaction	no, how the user does it is up to you	00:23
+perlDreamer	Well, that's what I started out asking. About line endings.	00:23
@preaction	i'd imagine that a little javascript app would be best, with a list of param names and have them enter the value	00:24
@preaction	but i think apache translates line endings for you	00:24
* preaction gotta go look at house		00:24
+perlDreamer	Good luck. and thanks for your help	00:25
-!- perlDreamer [i=colink@conference/oscon/x-3bf75cf68947411d] has quit ["Leaving."]		00:56
@rizen	wahooo!!! wikis have attachmetns	01:30
-!- Netsplit orwell.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: @Haarg, perlbot, nuba, pjesi, @rizen, +Radix_, besonen_mobile		01:33
-!- Netsplit over, joins: @Haarg, +Radix_, @rizen, besonen_mobile, perlbot, nuba, pjesi		01:33
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		01:36
@preaction	rizen, is it alright to re-write your code for workflow/form helpers that requires turning off strictures with code that uses UNIVERSAL->can to get a reference to the subroutine? (we'll be able to detect if the sub exists before we try to call it)	03:33
@preaction	also, is the www_spectreStatus in WebGUI::Operation::Spectre supposed to only allow people in the spectre subnets to see spectre's status via the admin console?	03:34
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		03:43
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		03:43
-!- wgGuest07 [n=wgGuest0@user-38q49cv.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #webgui		03:54
wgGuest07	hello?	03:54
@preaction	hello	03:54
@Haarg	hello	03:54
wgGuest07	oh hi. I think I've talked with preaction before...	03:55
wgGuest07	I'm really stuck on something. I thought it was the lack of sleep, but I've duplicated it several times and I think Ifoudn a bug with 7.2.1	03:55
wgGuest07	Oh and Hi Haarg!	03:55
@preaction	that's to be expected, there's been at least a hundred bugs fixed since 7.2.1 was released	03:56
wgGuest07	So. I've created a folder and then file piled images up. Like 50-80 of them	03:56
wgGuest07	I then reference their url in an http proxied page	03:56
wgGuest07	I think I have 7.2.1, but I'd have to vpn to find out...	03:56
wgGuest07	and the image won't show up in the http proxy page. UNLESS I go to the image, edit it and save it without making changes	03:57
@preaction	7.3.22 was released today, so you'd have to reproduce there before we could do anything. http://demo.webgui.org <- if you can reproduce on a demo site, we can help you more	03:57
wgGuest07	it's weird. but I've done it several times.	03:57
wgGuest07	so my question is. I can deal with the bug fine, but I really don't want to modify all these images	03:57
wgGuest07	is there an fla being set when I "save" the image that I can set via SQL?	03:58
@Haarg	is this a problem with thumbnails?	03:59
wgGuest07	nope. I'm referencing the imges them selves.	03:59
wgGuest07	I've even looked to see if they were in the uplaod directory and they are.	03:59
@preaction	their webgui URL or their url in the /uploads/XX/XX/XXXXXXXXX...	03:59
wgGuest07	I reference the webgui URL in the http proxied page.	03:59
wgGuest07	but eiher url (webgui or the uploads) will produce a 404 error unless I resave the image (without changing anything)	04:00
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		04:01
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui		04:01
-!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ		04:01
wgGuest07	I should be a little more specific. I've I put the webgui or upload url in the address box in my broswer (forget the proxy page) I get a 404.	04:02
wgGuest07	geez I type to fast. hopefully people understood me.	04:03
@preaction	is that after you commit the changes? there seems to be an unspecific "Storage bug" fixed in 7.3.11	04:03
@preaction	if you can reproduce this behavior on a demo site, then i'd suggest posting a bug report on the bug list	04:04
wgGuest07	yep. the first time this happened was last night. I committed my changes. I've cleared my cached (rm -f method) and waited a day. Then I reproduced it several times today.	04:04
@preaction	but can you reproduce on the latest webgui? http://demo.webgui.org <- make a demo, set up the situation, and see if it happens. is there someplace i can see this happening?	04:05
@rizen	preaction: yes you can rewrite stuff to use UNIVERSAL->can	04:06
@preaction	i mean, we're talking 7.2.1 here, and admittedly though it's a roundabout bug, there've been at least a hundred bugs fixed since then, one of them might've been this one	04:06
wgGuest07	unfortunately it's behind our firewall right now. I'm doing the demo now. I hope I don't have to upload 80 photos to repro this.	04:06
@rizen	preaction: no spectre status is supposed to work for admins	04:06
@preaction	rizen, okay, will fix	04:07
wgGuest07	I guess I was just hoping to have a sql update statement I can use or select query to see what maybe changing when I "save" an image.	04:07
@preaction	wgGuest07, since i'm not sure what's causing it, i don't know what you or i could do to fix it	04:08
wgGuest07	what table is the data stored in for images?	04:09
wgGuest07	I uploaded one photo on webgui demo and it seemed to work I haven't tried 80 photos yet.	04:09
@preaction	wgGuest07, asset, assetData, File, and Image	04:09
@rizen	FileAsset and ImageAsset actually	04:09
@rizen	crap fuck crap fuck	04:10
@preaction	that... doesnt'... sound... good...	04:10
@rizen	all the changes i made to the upgrade script were lost when Haarg renamed it	04:10
@rizen	which he was suppsoed to do	04:10
@rizen	not his fault	04:10
@rizen	svn's fault	04:10
wgGuest07	80 photos is a pain. I'll look at those tables to see if anything changes when I "resave" an image. Thanks!	04:11
@rizen	i'm 99.99999% sure that bug is fixed in a later version wgGuest07	04:11
@preaction	wgGuest07, i believe away back when there was a bug that caused a new storage location to be created every time you saved a file/image asset	04:11
@rizen	check the change log if you like, but i'm sure i remember someone fixed that	04:11
wgGuest07	what table is the storage location kept? because if I go directly to the directory it says the image is in, its there. even though I get a 404. I copied pasted so I shouldn't have had typo errors going on.	04:12
wgGuest07	so maybe the storage location wasn't "saved" when I filepiled.	04:13
@preaction	wgGuest07, it's in the FileAsset table	04:13
wgGuest07	ok. I'll watch that specific field. I can't do anythign now, because I'm not vpned in. Thanks! I might be back later.	04:14
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		04:14
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		04:15
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		04:15
wgGuest07	how do you log out of this? I'm using plainblacks provided software...	04:16
@preaction	just close it	04:16
wgGuest07	k bye	04:16
-!- wgGuest07 [n=wgGuest0@user-38q49cv.cable.mindspring.com] has quit []		04:16
@rizen	it's amazing how many people use that web thing	04:16
@rizen	it's a pile compared to a real irc client	04:16
@preaction	it is	04:16
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		04:40
nuba	rizen: im working on the asset now, and keeping the deadline in mind	04:43
nuba	rizen: just replied to your email	04:43
@rizen	shall i assume that you just started on the asset today?	04:44
@rizen	based upon what you've said, that's what it sounds like	04:44
nuba	yes, i was working with googlemaps but outside webgui until today	04:46
nuba	i was planning to do that sooner but some local issues kept me busy these last days	04:47
nuba	but I usually perform better under tight deadlines and high pressure, so I hope it will turn out a good asset :)	04:48
nuba	thats seriously	04:48
@rizen	i'm concerned that we're only 2 days away and you're just starting. my concern is for the stability of the code	04:49
nuba	i see. well I hope the code will pass your scrutinity	04:50
nuba	i can say i follow some best practices while designing or coding something	04:51
nuba	s/scrutinity/scrutiny/	04:51
+Radix-wrk	heh.. you got WebGUI running on your iphone yet rizen? I hear someone has apache, python and various other apps running on it now :)	05:22
@rizen	of course i do	05:22
@rizen	actually runs pretty well	05:22
+Radix-wrk	no, I mean compiled and running as a webserver ;)	05:22
@rizen	can't get image magick to work	05:22
@rizen	thats what i'm saying	05:22
+Radix-wrk	Oh.. cool!	05:22
@rizen	i have the WRE mostly working on it	05:22
+Radix-wrk	awesome	05:23
@rizen	i'm actually just screwing with you. i've been so busy with 7.4 stuff that i haven't really had time to play with any iphone hacking	05:23
+Radix-wrk	Aww..	05:24
+Radix-wrk	http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/07/25/1225242&from=rss	05:24
@rizen	i've seen the article	05:24
+Radix-wrk	iphone doom is jsut around the corner :)	05:24
@rizen	just haven't done anything with the info	05:24
@rizen	when i have the time the first thing i'm going to do is replace the SMS sound	05:24
@rizen	it's so quiet i can't even hear it	05:24
+Radix-wrk	heh.. I use the old ICQ sound for my SMS's - Uhoh!	05:25
SDuensin	Oh no. If they make Doom run on it, then I have to buy one.	05:29
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		05:37
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		05:37
-!- wgGuest53 [n=wgGuest5@user-38q49cv.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #webgui		05:45
wgGuest53	hi.	05:45
wgGuest53	am going to attempt an upgrade, but I think I may have modified some of the templates that webgui comes with. Are those going to be slammed over?	05:46
@rizen	you created copies or modified the defaults?	05:46
wgGuest53	unfortunately, modified a couple of the defaults. like assets and little things splattered around the system.	05:47
@rizen	whether or not they get overwritten in that case depends upon whether there were any modifications by the developers to those templates....the core templates only get updated if a new feature was added or they needed to be modified to fix a bug	05:48
@rizen	either way though, your old templates will still be in the system, due to the version control system	05:49
wgGuest53	oh. as a prior version to the upgrade?	05:49
@rizen	you'll just have to go rescue them if they get written over	05:49
wgGuest53	is there a way I can query the database to see which ones I changed?	05:49
@rizen	yeah...anything new that happens will be in a new version tag specific to the upgrade	05:49
@rizen	yup	05:49
@rizen	just go look for the version tag for the upgrades	05:50
wgGuest53	to see the ones I changed?	05:50
@rizen	oh...no not easily	05:50
wgGuest53	dang.	05:50
wgGuest53	I have no idea which ones I've changed. Maybe there is a modify date somewhere?	05:51
@rizen	it's possible, but requires quite a bit of database querying...more than i have time to help you with	05:51
@rizen	absolutely there is on every single one	05:51
@rizen	but you need something to compare it to	05:51
wgGuest53	well, the date ofthe last version? no? I'm running 7.2.1 yeah, it's me again. =	05:52
@rizen	this query will get you started, but from there you'll need to figure it out:	05:52
wgGuest53	=)	05:52
wgGuest53	any help would be great!	05:52
@rizen	select assetData.title, assetData.url, assetData.assetId, template.namespace from assetData left join template on assetData.assetId=template.assetId and assetData.revisionDate=template.revisionDate where template.revisionDate > unix_timestamp('2007-03-01') order by template.revisionDate desc	05:54
@rizen	i think that will work	05:54
@rizen	but if it doesn't you're on your own troubleshooting	05:54
wgGuest53	That's fine. Thanks!	05:55
wgGuest53	hopefully an easier question. The reason why I never upgraded was because they Totally redid the calendar thing in 7.3.0 which scares me. What am I to expect?	05:55
@rizen	the new calendar is absolutely amazing compared to the old calendar	05:56
wgGuest53	the gotchas says custom templates will be deleted. then in 7.38 they are purged, so how am I to get them back if I need it?	05:56
wgGuest53	hope it's amazing. Does it have an Rss feed? I hope so.	05:57
@rizen	not an RSS feed, it has an ical feed, which is the standard internet feed type for calendars	05:57
@rizen	it's what outlook and google and apple mail all use	05:58
wgGuest53	or is it so amazing that I won't need my templates? does it replace my templates with it's own? or will I have a template-less calendar.	05:58
wgGuest53	I guess I haven't done this before. =(	05:58
@rizen	it replaces your templates with it's own	05:58
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		05:58
wgGuest53	I've seen the ical. Do you recommend a site to read up on it?	05:58
@rizen	just search google for ical	06:00
wgGuest53	hmm. here's a thought. I'm the one with a bunch of 404 errors on my filepiled images. Is an upgrade going to fix the data? or do I still need to resave each one manually? (I haven't dug into the db yet)	06:01
wgGuest53	oh. I wasn't talking with rizen about that.. I was talking with preaction. I suppose you have no idea what I'm talking about =)	06:02
@rizen	i saw your discussion, and i honestly don't know if you have to manually resave each one or not	06:03
@rizen	i believe that perlDreamer was the one that fixed that problem, so check back tomorrow or later tonight and see if he's on	06:04
@rizen	he can tell you	06:04
@rizen	or just upgrade...you'll know soon enough	06:04
@rizen	if you have to manually do it, you're in no worse shape than you're in right now	06:04
wgGuest53	I'm thinking this is a "tomorrow night" project. it's already late. probably a good idea to get some good sleep before this. I'm a bit nervous....	06:05
@rizen	probably a good idea	06:08
@rizen	and make sure you have a good clean backup	06:08
@rizen	BEFORE you start the upgrade	06:08
wgGuest53	I'm pretty sure it dumps every night. I've never done a recovery though. Hopefuly I don't need to.	06:10
+Radix-wrk	is this the image/thumbnails bug?	06:10
wgGuest53	mmm. image storage bug	06:10
+Radix-wrk	the one where if you edit the picture it replaces it with the thumbnail instead?	06:10
wgGuest53	no, I filepiled a bunch of images, and they are all 404's until I "resave" them.	06:11
+Radix-wrk	Oh.. ok.. haven't encountered that one.	06:11
wgGuest53	yeah, it's nasty when you file piled a boat load. =)	06:12
+Radix-wrk	I bet!	06:12
wgGuest53	re upgrading: If I have uncommitted changes. what happens to them if i upgrade without committng first?	06:12
wgGuest53	where are my manners? Hi Radix-wrk. =)	06:13
@rizen	nothing	06:13
@preaction	wgGuest53, if you have uncommitted changes before you upgrade you'll have those same things after you upgrade.	06:13
+Radix-wrk	Hiya :)	06:13
wgGuest53	oh good. Thanks everyone!! Have a good night. I'm sure I'll be back tomorrow night=)	06:15
+Radix-wrk	wgGuest53: can I suggest you get a regular irc client (xchat, mirc, etc) and join the channel that way, it's much nicer than the java based one	06:16
+Radix-wrk	and in our favour, you'll be more likely to stick around - always good to see new faces on here :)	06:16
wgGuest53	yes. you may suggest. =)	06:16
+Radix-wrk	heh k :)	06:16
wgGuest53	I'm on windows now. do you have recommendations? I dont' "chat" at all. other than with you guys.	06:17
+Radix-wrk	there's lots of free windows clients. I use xchat personally - www.silverex.org - but any of the others will work as well	06:18
wgGuest53	ok. I'll give those a try. Thanks again!	06:19
+Radix-wrk	good luck with your upgrade :)	06:19
wgGuest53	thanks! bye.	06:20
-!- wgGuest53 [n=wgGuest5@user-38q49cv.cable.mindspring.com] has quit []		06:20
@rizen	whaooo!! with that checkin i'm officially done with my must-have todo list for 7.4	06:27
@rizen	now i can look into a few "what ifs"	06:28
vayde	hey rizen, I'll be in Madison on the 12th. Got time for a brew?	06:29
@rizen	let me check the calendar	06:31
@rizen	i'll be here, but we'll have to play it by ear. doing a mail server upgrade that weekend	06:31
@rizen	give me a call when you have some free time	06:32
vayde	Ok. I'll be done with the troops about 16:00 or 16:30	06:32
vayde	Technically I'll be in Waunakee, but close enough.	06:32
@rizen	yeah...that's only a few miles from here	06:33
@rizen	actually, there's a great little pub between here and there	06:33
@rizen	http://aleasylum.com/cms/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1	06:34
vayde	got it. I'll call you when I'm done with the class and see if you have time.	06:34
@rizen	vrby will be in town too cuz he's working on the mail server upgrade with me	06:34
vayde	excellent. be good to tip a few back with you two.	06:34
-!- vayde [n=vayde@c-75-72-85-140.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]		07:06
@preaction	jeebus, what haven't we added in 7.4?	07:13
@rizen	are you referring to all the tickets i'm closing?	07:13
@preaction	yeah	07:13
@rizen	hehe	07:14
@rizen	we added quite a bit	07:14
@preaction	i mean, i knew a few of the big ones, but apparently there's been a lot of little things as well	07:14
@rizen	and i'm only doing a quick once over	07:14
@Haarg	apparently my rewritten macro parser is anywhere from 10% to 1000% faster	07:21
+Radix-wrk	woot.. that sounds good :)	07:25
@rizen	10 to 1000?	07:25
@rizen	why such a big difference?	07:25
@rizen	when i hear things that vary that much it makes me suspicious	07:26
@Haarg	depends on the complexity of the macros	07:26
@Haarg	it's pretty consitant for each macro text i give it	07:26
@rizen	like number and nesting?	07:26
@Haarg	yeah	07:26
@Haarg	i'm going to add some more tests though	07:26
@rizen	take the output of the front page of your webgui install	07:26
@rizen	comment out macro processing so they are left in the HTML	07:27
@rizen	then run your parser versus the original	07:27
@rizen	that's an "average" webgui page	07:27
@Haarg	yeah	07:27
@rizen	run it 10 times for each parser and average them	07:27
@rizen	then you'll know	07:27
+Radix-wrk	are there any perl profilers?	07:29
@Haarg	i'm using Benchmark	07:29
@preaction	Devel::DProf	07:29
@preaction	works under mod_perl with the right settings	07:30
@preaction	http://www.perl.com/lpt/a/974	07:30
+Radix-wrk	so that'd be the way youd want to benchmark that kind of stuff and measure performance then	07:30
@rizen	if you want a lot of detail that's the way you do it	07:32
@rizen	but for quick benchmarking Time::HiRes is just as good	07:32
@rizen	i think i've officially closed as many tickets as i can	07:33
@rizen	that's got to be close to 50 rfe's closed for this release	07:33
@rizen	people should be happy	07:33
@rizen	what am i saying. no one is ever happy.	07:34
@preaction	i'm happy?	07:34
+Radix-wrk	Who are these 'people' you speak of? Do I know any of them?	07:34
+Radix-wrk	If there is going to be any more 7.3.x releases - Could someone please apply my fix for the admin bar zindex bug - it's a one line change.	07:36
@preaction	i think Haarg tried to do it and replied that it didn't quite work?	07:37
+Radix-wrk	it definitely does	07:37
@preaction	i durno, the thread should have his reply	07:37
+Radix-wrk	just add z-index: 100; to slidepanel.css in the first css block	07:38
+Radix-wrk	(to .slidePanel)	07:38
+Radix-wrk	Hmm..	07:39
+Radix-wrk	Ahh.. it's actually a different bug - just sounded the same. My bad.	07:41
+Radix-wrk	the z-index fix I made definitely fixes the zenlike theme problem	07:41
@rizen	radix, no more 7.3 releases	07:41
+Radix-wrk	and 7.4 won't use the same adminbar, right?	07:42
@rizen	as of right now it still is	07:42
@rizen	i'm going to work on that tomorrow	07:42
+Radix-wrk	k, cool - not worth worrying over then	07:42
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@24-177-123-127.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		08:08
@rizen	well, i'm outty. ttyl	08:15
@preaction	beautiful. only 1 hour of bugfixing / testing for 10 hours of coding. that's better than the usual projected 25%	09:21
@preaction	admin console now can give permissions on a per-panel basis	09:21
@preaction	i believe this was one of your RFE's, jesse	09:27
+Radix-wrk	Awesome	09:31
@preaction	it's not very granular, but all the existing groups are represented, and every panel has at least one group. it's also written in such a way to make future, more granular permissions easy to implement	09:33
@preaction	hopefully	09:33
@preaction	oh sunnuva bitch i just did what JT did earlier...	09:33
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		09:50
+Radix-wrk	preaction: you could probably close my other rfe related to that item btw - http://www.plainblack.com/rfe/request-for-enhancement/finer-control-of-admin-privileges	10:06
@preaction	depends, do you want to modify that RFE to include the granularity?	10:07
@preaction	i mean, imho the current granularity is just about right. but i can close this one and then later someone can open a new one with more specific needs	10:08
+Radix-wrk	I don't know how your stuff works - but I'd say close it and if I need more granularity then I'll open a new one	10:08
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui		10:09
+Radix-wrk	All I want is to be able to give user admin to some users - ie. list/add/delete/reset passwords/etc, but not for them to have complete site admin privs	10:09
@preaction	a 25 difficulty? wtf was he thinking? and he gave the other one a 3 difficulty. it actually took me 12 hours :p	10:09
+Radix-wrk	yeah, jt doesn't like my rfe's :)	10:10
@preaction	that'll be possible, easily	10:10
@preaction	well, we've also had two clients ask for that same feature	10:10
+Radix-wrk	bonus :)	10:10
@preaction	we actually implemented it once with uiLevels, and the result is less than awesome	10:11
@preaction	my new code only shows the user those admin tabs that they can actually use ;)	10:11
@preaction	well, except for the weird admin functions, like the asset manager, trash, and other stuff that's done as part of WebGUI::Asset (and not as a WebGUI::Operation)	10:13
+Radix-wrk	that's what you want.. if they can't see it, they can't f**k it up ;)	10:13
@preaction	well, they could be able to see it, but not be able to actually use it (get a "Permission denied" error when clicking on it)	10:13
@preaction	but that's just sloppy craftsmanship	10:13
* Radix-wrk dumps a few thousand karma on http://www.plainblack.com/rfe/request-for-enhancement/attache-deletes-to-version-tags		10:16
+Radix-wrk	JT should've made that easier tho, surely it isn't a difficulty 15 to do that	10:16
@preaction	the problem is it's a sweeping change	10:16
@preaction	when you're part of that version tag it must appear as if that asset is deleted	10:17
@preaction	it's not the work that's hard, it'll be the tracking down all the caveats	10:17
@preaction	i mean, there are still places that do not use AssetLineage to get assets (AL being able to do what this requires)	10:17
+Radix-wrk	The way we have to do it now is mark an item as content managers only - and tag it for deletion - then once that version tag has been implemented we delete it.	10:18
@preaction	i do like the idea though	10:18
@preaction	perlbot math 9000 / 15	10:18
perlbot	600	10:18
@preaction	i could bump it up a bit	10:18
@preaction	wait, does that delete the asset when the tag is deleted? or when the tag is committed?	10:19
+Radix-wrk	when the tag is committed	10:19
@preaction	but then we lose the biggest thing about versioning: the ability to rollback	10:20
+Radix-wrk	deletes aren't subject to that anyway	10:20
@preaction	currently, no, but it'd be nice	10:20
+Radix-wrk	sure	10:20
+Radix-wrk	but it's a step in the right direction :)	10:20
@preaction	if you create what amounts to be an empty asset (basically as barren as possible) and if its status is "approved" and deleteTag is defined, the asset is now deleted	10:21
@preaction	then you could rollback that revision and it'd be undeleted	10:21
+Radix-wrk	yes	10:22
+Radix-wrk	Oh..	10:22
@preaction	currently, all fields in the asset tables need to be able to be undefined anyway, so it'd be possible to do without horrific problems	10:22
+Radix-wrk	if you created it in that version tag, and deleted it in that version tag - then it wouldn't exist at all	10:22
@preaction	that'd be a special case, you wouldn't set deleteTag, you'd just remove it	10:23
+Radix-wrk	yeah	10:23
@preaction	basically only if the asset is already "approved" would a new revision be added	10:23
+Radix-wrk	sounds good.. ship it! :)	10:24
@preaction	there are precedents, only CS with one "approved" version are allowed to have children, for example	10:24
@preaction	caveat: urls wouldn't be released	10:27
@preaction	and we already have the trash, do we really need this?	10:28
@preaction	good idea, but unnecessary and too difficult to need	10:29
@preaction	just being able to see what will happen before you move an asset to the trash is probably good enough	10:29
+Radix-wrk	deletes are one of the major things that doesnt' fit into version tags at the moment tho	10:29
@preaction	right, but i assume that the "delete" is actually "move to trash"	10:29
@preaction	so it'd be possible to recover from the trash if necessary	10:30
+Radix-wrk	the big advantage with version tags is that you can work on the site and then deploy the changes in one hit	10:30
+Radix-wrk	We use it for every major software release, we make changes to a number of pages, restructure things, etc and get everything ready for the day we actually ship it and want to make it available.	10:31
@preaction	right, that's handled under the current RFE	10:31
+Radix-wrk	JT's RFE yes	10:32
@preaction	yeah	10:32
@preaction	what i was thinking of would basically replace the Trash	10:32
+Radix-wrk	isn't that what we were talking about?	10:33
@preaction	i think i actually proposed this earlier	10:33
@preaction	i was saying being able to rollback a delete AFTER it's committed	10:33
@preaction	but i forgot about the trash	10:33
+Radix-wrk	Ahh.. yes, trash would cover that case.	10:33
+Radix-wrk	though surely a version tag rollback would do the same thing	10:34
@preaction	no, once the tag is committed, the commit process would see "hmm... we have a deleteTag, okay, time to move this asset to the trash" and everyting would go on as normal	10:34
@preaction	wait, isn't that what the trash-limbo state is for?	10:35
@preaction	meh, durno, way too late for me to be doing heavy thinking	10:36
* Radix-wrk looks at the 10 day weather forecast for Amsterdam and sees a lot of rainy days ahead.		10:36
+Radix-wrk	3 days before I leave on my webgui sabbatical - and only one working day to go after today.	10:38
* Radix-wrk is pretty excited :)		10:39
@preaction	sabbatical?	10:40
+Radix-wrk	I'm spending two weeks with Oqapi in delft, netherlands and immersing myself in webgui, perl and sql and learning everything I can off martin and the other oqapi guys.	10:42
@preaction	nice	10:42
+Radix-wrk	then my gf joins me and we set off around europe together for 6 weeks.	10:42
+Radix-wrk	with a brief stop in vienna for the YAPC::Europe perl conference	10:43
@preaction	wow	10:43
+Radix-wrk	judging from the talks at the conference, 90% or so of it is going to go woosh above my head as my knowledge of perl is still very basic, but by the end of it I hope I'll have absorbed something :)	10:44
@preaction	that's what i've been doing with languages, just listening until i start getting Something ;)	10:44
@preaction	hell, that's why you're here, no?	10:44
+Radix-wrk	heh.. you can follow our blog if you like - http://jesseandyumi.blogspot.com/	10:44
+Radix-wrk	yep - a lot of it goes over my head here, but every now and then I can help out too	10:44
+Radix-wrk	and yeah, learn by absorption	10:45
+Radix-wrk	;)	10:45
@preaction	okay, i guess i'm ignorant american here, but don't you need to know some other languages to go to these places?	10:45
+Radix-wrk	I'm a C++ programmer, so familiar with programming, just unfamiliar with perl - and very unfamiliar with perl libraries and development	10:45
+Radix-wrk	preaction: heh.. I hope not - I only know english myself - but I'll have a phrasebook with me ;)	10:46
@preaction	i mean, i want to tool around europe for a while someday as well, so i'm trying to learn French (took some in school so doing that one first) and Spanish. then later in life I want to visit India and/or Japan	10:46
@preaction	jeebus. you're going to do all of this in just 8 weeks?	10:47
+Radix-wrk	India they speak english pretty well these days ;)	10:47
+Radix-wrk	LOL - yeah, scary isn't it :)	10:47
+Radix-wrk	the amsterdam - paris bit is all part of a packaged tour	10:48
+Radix-wrk	we'll be doing all of that in just 12 days.. so it's a lightning tour with only rome, switzerland and paris being stopped at for more than one day I think	10:48
+Radix-wrk	then we're off to vienna for the conference (she's going to be exploring vienna while I attend it for three days)	10:49
+Radix-wrk	We're going to be sick of planes, trains and buses by the end of it I'm sure :)	10:50
@preaction	oh i imagine	10:50
@preaction	but, oh, the places you'll go	10:50
+Radix-wrk	yeah :)	10:50
+Radix-wrk	looking forward to that side of things :)	10:50
+Radix-wrk	I just hope the weather improves a bit! :)	10:51
@preaction	it's europe, isn't it getting up on the rainy season?	10:51
+Radix-wrk	well, it's their summer - but yeah, they've been getting a lot of rain lately	10:51
+Radix-wrk	http://www.weather.com/outlook/travel/businesstraveler/tenday/NLXX0002?from=36hr_outlet_business	10:52
@preaction	wait, a phrasebook? you've got like 5-6 languages here	10:52
+Radix-wrk	got a generic european one with all the basic phrases in it actually :)	10:52
@preaction	ahh	10:52
@preaction	bonne chance mon ami	10:52
+Radix-wrk	about 6-7 languages	10:52
@preaction	je parles francais en peu, mais je parles anglais tres bien	10:53
+Radix-wrk	and if they can't speak english.. there's always hand signals :)	10:53
@preaction	true that	10:53
+Radix-wrk	Just hope I don't hit on the wrong combination and offend someone ;)	10:53
@preaction	MY MOTHER WAS A SAINT!	10:54
@preaction	je voudrais une royale avec fromage!	10:54
+Radix-wrk	hehe ;)	10:54
@preaction	anyway, i think bedtime. 3:00am isn't bad these days	10:55
+Radix-wrk	the blog I created a couple of days ago and it's pretty cool.. I can email my photos to a special flickr account and it puts them all in my flickr account and also creates a blog post for me with the text and links the photos on it.	10:55
@preaction	ttyl, if i don't get a chance have fun on your trip	10:55
+Radix-wrk	Will do :)	10:55
+Radix-wrk	nite doug :)	10:55
-!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit ["Leaving"]		12:00
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		14:05
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@248.sub-75-204-110.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI		15:45
SDuensin	Greetings.	15:49
@rizen	some people stay up way too late talking	15:52
SDuensin	hehe	15:56
SDuensin	I think I found a fix for my WRE problem...	15:56
SDuensin	I erased the server. :-)	15:56
SDuensin	I found out that I can get a 32 bit OS on it.	15:56
@rizen	seems drastic, but if it works, who cares	15:59
SDuensin	Well, 64 bit was going nowhere. Not only did I have the issues with the WRE running wild, but you couldn't upload anything.	16:01
@rizen	not to mention that you weren't likely going to get any help fixing it since we don't have a way to test on 64 bit yet	16:02
SDuensin	Yup. :-)	16:02
SDuensin	I'm still asking around to get you root space on a 64 bit box somewhere.	16:02
@rizen	sweet	16:14
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		17:12
-!- mode/#webgui [+o Haarg] by ChanServ		17:12
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has joined #webgui		17:19
-!- AMH_Mari [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has left #webgui []		18:19
-!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]		18:34
-!- xootom [n=tom@195.224.29.66] has left #webgui []		19:55
-!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@206-124-31-140.denver.dsl.forethought.net] has joined #webgui		20:22
cap10morgan	Is it possible to set some properties of an asset as required? So when someone deploys a new one or edits an existing one, they have to set this property or it won't save.	20:23
@rizen	nope	20:23
@rizen	what's the problem you're trying to solve?	20:24
cap10morgan	i have a custom asset that we deploy quite a bit (glorified dataform, basically), but my content folks often forget to set one of the properties in it and it makes it just not work	20:24
cap10morgan	so i was hoping i could spit an error at them when they try to do that	20:24
@rizen	so this is an asset you wrote?	20:25
cap10morgan	yeah	20:25
@rizen	there is an error handler mechanism you could employ to force it if you like	20:25
@rizen	i thought you were talking about core assets	20:25
cap10morgan	ah, sorry, nope	20:26
cap10morgan	ok, i'll look into that	20:26
@rizen	here's how it works	20:27
@rizen	in processPropertiesFromFormPost	20:27
@rizen	all you have to do is return an error message	20:27
@rizen	then the new object will be purged	20:27
@rizen	and you'll be returned to the edit screen	20:27
@rizen	along with the error message	20:27
cap10morgan	ok, cool	20:27
@rizen	you can see an example of this in SQL Form	20:28
* SDuensin is 32 bit again! Whooo!		20:31
-!- wgGuest59 [n=wgGuest5@72.85.248.223] has joined #webgui		20:51
-!- the_rev [n=the_rev@167.165.7.204] has joined #webgui		21:45
-!- the_rev [n=the_rev@167.165.7.204] has left #webgui []		21:45
SDuensin	In modperl.error.log, is this bad?	21:55
SDuensin	[Thu Jul 26 06:50:23 2007] [warn] Init: Session Cache is not configured [hint: SSLSessionCache]	21:55
@rizen	no	21:59
SDuensin	k	22:04
SDuensin	thanks	22:04
cap10morgan	rizen: at the last WUC you or someone else was saying that you guys were working on a WebGUI third-party developers directory kinda thing. has any progress been made on that?	22:34
@rizen	i did?	22:35
cap10morgan	may not have been you :)	22:35
@rizen	it must have been someone else	22:35
cap10morgan	some PB staff person though	22:35
@rizen	maybe it was frank	22:35
cap10morgan	they said PB had too much going on, so they wanted to get a network of certified third-party providers together to send folks to	22:35
@rizen	he was thinking about implementing some sort of a bounty network	22:35
@rizen	we certainly do have a lot going on. are you interested in doing some contract work?	22:36
-!- wgGuest59 is now known as Dc5e		22:36
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		22:36
cap10morgan	possibly, but i'm mainly interested in who all i should be submitting requests for quotes and proposals to for webgui work	22:37
-!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui		22:37
-!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ		22:37
cap10morgan	we also have a lot more going on than we can handle internally :)	22:37
@rizen	well we have a network of developers that we use, so you can submit it to us, and if we can't handle it we'll either manage it and bring in contract developers, or hand it off directly	22:38
@rizen	most of our developers though don't like doing the project management part of it	22:38
@rizen	so we usually do that, and then they do the work	22:38
@rizen	we always have more than we can handle, but we always seem to get stuff done on time too. that's the beauty of a contractor pool i guess	22:40
cap10morgan	gotcha	22:40
@preaction	couldn't we set up a forum on the webgui.org site for webgui job postings?	22:41
@rizen	we could but then they aren't qualified	22:41
@rizen	that's the problem with hiring someone out of the netherworld	22:42
@preaction	i'm saying for other people to use, plainblack can do what plainblack does, cap10morgan wanted a way to get in touch with contractors (i think)	22:42
cap10morgan	preaction: yep	22:43
@rizen	and he can just post out there for that sort of thing	22:43
@rizen	what i'm saying though is that he's not going to know who he's getting hiring from the netherworld	22:43
@preaction	with an auction asset in "bid down" mode, you could submit a job with a proposed completion time and/or cost and have the contractors bid on it ;)	22:43
@preaction	true enough	22:44
cap10morgan	i realize it's sort of not in your best interest to help potential clients find other providers of the services you guys sell, but since frank mentioned something about it at the wuc, i thought i'd ask :)	22:44
@preaction	but same is true for any job-posting site really, you'd need to interview and conduct your own screening process	22:44
@rizen	in the end people mostly come back to us anyway even if they end up going somewhere else first	22:44
@rizen	so it's not as big of a burden as one might think	22:45
@preaction	well, we are the best	22:45
* preaction pats himself on the back		22:45
@rizen	either the person they hired to build it did a bad job or isn't getting it done on time	22:45
@rizen	or that person did the initial work, but now doesn't want to do the maintenance work or the add-ons	22:45
@rizen	either way most people end up coming back to us	22:45
SDuensin	It's cause we love you, rizen.	22:46
@rizen	i think it's just the difference between hiring a freelancer and a company	22:46
@rizen	the company is always there, the freelancer can do the gig and leave	22:46
@preaction	which means it's almost like a lead-in to an account with plainblack ;)	22:46
@rizen	anybody have IE7 to test with?	23:15
@rizen	and can check out from subversion?	23:15
@rizen	i need to make sure the new admin bar will work with 7	23:15
@rizen	or for that matter i can send you a zip file to test with	23:17
@rizen	email	23:17
@preaction	i can do that	23:17
@preaction	i can't checkout, my test env is not visible to my IE currently	23:17
@preaction	but i can look at the zip file	23:17
@rizen	it's just html	23:17
@rizen	no perl	23:17
@rizen	ok zip file is on it's way	23:19
@preaction	kk	23:19
@rizen	oh crap	23:19
@rizen	i just realized that it's looking for yui and everything too	23:19
@rizen	you won't be able to test it that way	23:19
@rizen	i'll have to find another way	23:20
@preaction	you can use the URLs from yahooapis.com if you want	23:20
@preaction	http://yui.yahooapis.com/2.2.2/build/yahoo/yahoo-min.js <- like that	23:21
@rizen	graham is brilliant	23:22
@rizen	multipleies	23:22
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@248.sub-75-204-110.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]		23:31
@preaction	rizen, works beautifully in IE7	23:32
@rizen	sweet, thanks	23:38
@rizen	just tested in ie7 myself seems to work there too	23:39
@rizen	sorry, i mean ie6	23:39
@rizen	interestingly enough it doesn't work in ie3	23:39
@rizen	but it does downgrade	23:39
@preaction	you mean ie3 actually renders the thing?	23:40
@rizen	it renders it as a definition list	23:40
@rizen	so yes	23:40
@rizen	it renders it	23:40
@preaction	not bad	23:40
@rizen	now i just have to integrate it in with the current monster so that people don't have to update their templates	23:41
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has joined #webgui		23:46
-!- mode/#webgui [+v crythias] by ChanServ		23:46
+crythias	hee	23:46
+crythias	so then I wooted the other day to get those usb sd cards...	23:47
+crythias	'cause I wanted to have some portable bootable DamnSmall Linux. because I could.	23:47
+crythias	yeah. a bootable Os to fit in your wallet.	23:48
+crythias	and then someone suggested to me that I might try to put WebGUI on one. 'cept it might be hard to compress down to 512MB. Maybe.	23:48
+crythias	but then, what to call it?	23:49
+crythias	A-ha! PenGUI	23:49
+crythias	and then I thought... how cool is that? It's like penguin without the N.	23:49
+crythias	ah. fun times, fun times.	23:49
-!- Dc5e [n=wgGuest5@72.85.248.223] has quit []		23:50
* crythias paypals y'all a quarter so ya ken pay attention.		23:50
@rizen	crythias...i'm taking your advice	23:54
+crythias	oh?	23:54
@rizen	the new adminbar is going to use position:fixed instead of sliding	23:54
@rizen	and i found a trick to make that work in ie6	23:54
+crythias	what the heck made those word come from your fingertips?	23:54
@rizen	it's just a better way to go	23:55
@rizen	the thing that changed my mind was that i found a way to work around the problem in ie6	23:55
+crythias	um. but you're still going to shift content on the page, though, right?	23:55
@rizen	yes	23:56
@rizen	that is until i get the new admin console up and running	23:56
@rizen	then all the content will be in an iframe, so i won't need to shift it over	23:56
+crythias	mmhm. that makes sense to me.	23:56
@rizen	this is a stop gap, cuz it's going to take a really long time to do what i want to do with the admin console	23:57
@rizen	mainly cuz i'm slow at javascripting	23:57
@preaction	why would apache be consistently stopping sending a page when it reaches 1.32M	23:57
+crythias	well, cool.	23:57
@rizen	preaction: no idea	23:58
+crythias	and I'm trying to figure out something about the difference between desktop publishing, asset positioning and tinymce javascript.	23:58
+crythias	but you solved the issue before I thought too hard about it.	23:59
--- Day changed Fri Jul 27 2007
+crythias	the long and short was trying to figure out if there was a way to combine tinymce and asset positioning in a text area. I can't explain it much more than a microcosm of the admin mode in a text area.	00:00
+crythias	admin mode/page layout	00:00
-!- crythias [n=Gerald@c-68-51-234-189.hsd1.fl.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]		01:11
-!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI		01:29
-!- Haarg [n=haarg@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit []		01:49
-!- dannymk [n=daniel@68.15.55.161] has joined #webgui		02:10
dannymk	Hi everyone	02:11
@rizen	howdy	02:11
dannymk	does anyone know what is the current version of yui for the latest version of WebGUI?	02:12