| --- Log opened Sun Apr 01 00:00:24 2007 |
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| @vayde | cap10morgan, how irritating is that leading space problem in DateTime? | 01:54 |
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| cap10morgan | vayde: heh, pretty annoying | 01:54 |
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| cap10morgan | oh, that's probably already reported as a bug, isn't it? | 01:54 |
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| cap10morgan | it just occurred to me that i didn't even check... :/ | 01:54 |
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| @vayde | The reason I ask, is that's the proper behavior of the perl DateTime module | 01:54 |
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| cap10morgan | vayde: oh... | 01:55 |
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| cap10morgan | suck | 01:55 |
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| @vayde | Yeah, you have been burining up the bug reports | 01:55 |
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| cap10morgan | haha, it's true | 01:55 |
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| @vayde | I can figure a way to work around it, but i'm wondering if that's put in there for a reason. | 01:55 |
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| @vayde | I don't know what that reason might be though. | 01:55 |
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| cap10morgan | vayde: yeah, seems pretty weird | 01:55 |
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| cap10morgan | the month %M one doesn't do that | 01:56 |
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| @vayde | that's cos there's a workaround in the wG version. | 01:56 |
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| @vayde | now that you point that out, that tells me what to do. thanks | 01:57 |
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| @vayde | I just didn't want to change it before giving someone a chance to point out why the leading space was necessary in some obscure way. | 01:57 |
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| @vayde | Fixed your '+' in emails too btw | 02:00 |
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| cap10morgan | yeah, i saw that thanks | 02:11 |
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| cap10morgan | thanks for fixing this one too :) | 02:11 |
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| cap10morgan | if you told a workflow to run in the scheduler (i.e. the manual "Run" link), and it just didn't do anything (nothing in the log, not even at info level), what would be the first things to check? | 02:12 |
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| --- Day changed Mon Apr 02 2007 |
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| +perlDreamer | vayde! You're up late tonight | 07:42 |
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| @vayde | Late? Oh I don't know | 07:43 |
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| @vayde | Mostly been hangin out hopin you'd show up | 07:44 |
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| +perlDreamer | I was in Seattle over the weekend | 07:44 |
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| +perlDreamer | any luck with your www_view stuff? | 07:45 |
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| @vayde | I haven't really messed with it this weekend. I was hunting other bugs | 07:45 |
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| +perlDreamer | I buttoned up the isSingleton one just now. | 07:46 |
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| +perlDreamer | isSingleton wasn't checked in www_editSaveWorkflow | 07:46 |
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| +perlDreamer | :( | 07:46 |
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| @vayde | It really only showed up in a test wobject I was playing with, so I chalked it up to my mistake. However I get the same puzzler with debugs put into Asset.pm | 07:46 |
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| @vayde | damn. I was gonna start the day tomorrow with a simple one. | 07:46 |
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| +perlDreamer | ah, sorry about that. But I know why you're having www_view problems. | 07:47 |
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| +perlDreamer | Wobjects inherit from Wobject.pm | 07:47 |
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| @vayde | Please enlighten me | 07:47 |
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| +perlDreamer | Wobject.pm's www_view does not call SUPER | 07:47 |
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| @vayde | I must have mistyped | 07:48 |
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| +perlDreamer | you put stuff into Wobject.pm's www_view and it doesn't get called? | 07:48 |
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| @vayde | that works allright | 07:48 |
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| @vayde | putting stuff into Asset.pm 's www_view method doesn't work | 07:49 |
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| @vayde | putting them in both yields Wobject.pm 's message only. | 07:49 |
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| @vayde | hence it looked like somehow the base class was overriding the derived class | 07:49 |
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| +perlDreamer | it is | 07:49 |
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| +perlDreamer | Wobject.pm has a www_view | 07:49 |
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| +perlDreamer | it doesn't call SUPER | 07:50 |
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| +perlDreamer | so it's overridden, not extended | 07:50 |
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| @vayde | Oh duh! Wobject inherits from Asset, not the other way around | 07:50 |
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| @vayde | I was thinking Article, and putting my statements into Asset | 07:51 |
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| @vayde | Well, I knew there was a problem, and it turns out that problem is me! | 07:51 |
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| +perlDreamer | I don't suppose preaction said anything about MrHairGrease's proposed Post.pm fix? | 07:52 |
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| @preaction | perlDreamer: didn't work. | 07:52 |
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| +perlDreamer | bummer | 07:52 |
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| +perlDreamer | I've been drooling over this | 07:54 |
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| +perlDreamer | http://sourceforge.net/projects/smolder | 07:54 |
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| +perlDreamer | Back in December I did some P6 test hacking. | 08:00 |
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| +perlDreamer | They use something that looks like Smolder (may actually be) | 08:00 |
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| +perlDreamer | It was awesome | 08:00 |
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| @vayde | Hmm. No, it's not just me. Putting the following into Article.pm yields nothing: $self->session->errorHandler->warn('foo'); print STDERR "foo \n"; | 08:01 |
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| @vayde | neither on the page or in the logs. It's like the method isn't being called. | 08:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | restarted Apache after changing it? | 08:03 |
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| @vayde | yeah, couple of times | 08:03 |
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| @vayde | and dumped the caceh | 08:03 |
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| @vayde | cache | 08:03 |
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| @vayde | Been wracking my brain trying to find out how that would even be possible, and if it is, how we're doing it. Seems to be an interesting trick. | 08:05 |
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| @vayde | even this doesn't work: die "ARRRGH! \n"; | 08:06 |
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| +perlDreamer | I'm getting the same thing | 08:09 |
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| +perlDreamer | Wobject's www_view is being called | 08:09 |
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| @vayde | Oh good, then it's not just me. | 08:09 |
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| @vayde | rizen said something about it being a wG thing, but didn't have time to explain. I may not have communicated what was going on precisely though | 08:10 |
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| +perlDreamer | hang on, I have an idea | 08:10 |
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| +perlDreamer | The article you're looking at, is it inside a Layout? | 08:11 |
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| @vayde | Page layout? Yes. | 08:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | that is why | 08:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | I think | 08:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | Layout calls the child Asset's prepareView directly | 08:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | so it never invokes www_view | 08:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | The Wobject call is from the Layout, not from the article | 08:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | if you view the Article URL directly, you should see it pop-up | 08:12 |
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| @vayde | Since Layout basically means a page, isn't everything technically in a Layout? | 08:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | no | 08:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | Assets, in wG 6.3, were originally concieved to be "pageless". | 08:13 |
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| +perlDreamer | you wouldn't need a container Asset to have a single Article. | 08:13 |
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| +perlDreamer | But most entry level wG users couldn't get the idea into their heards, so the Layout is used everywhere | 08:13 |
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| @vayde | Aha! Light dawns on shady brook! | 08:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | but if you go directly to any Asset's URL, it will use whatever page style it is configured to have and render you "a page". | 08:14 |
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| @vayde | If I call it directly it dies screaming. That's gratifying | 08:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | It's one of the hiccups people have with the CS | 08:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | some want it to remain "embedded" in the current page, rather than pushing down into the core CS asset itself | 08:15 |
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| +perlDreamer | this also means that cache specific behavior for the Article is not propagated up to the page through www_view. | 08:16 |
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| +perlDreamer | that's worth bringing up to JT, since viewing an Article on a page will increase the load on the server | 08:17 |
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| @vayde | I'll mention it to him | 08:18 |
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| +perlDreamer | tomorrow, if you like, I can show you the test scripts | 08:19 |
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| +perlDreamer | I've been told that my tests are a little confusing | 08:19 |
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| @vayde | I'll take any help you have time/interest in offering | 08:19 |
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| @vayde | especially when it prevents me from bugging JT or preaction. I sense they cringe when I log on | 08:20 |
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| +Radix-wrk | "But most entry level wG users couldn't get the idea into their heards, so the Layout is used everywhere" - not just entry level wG users - I'm still this way and don't think that will ever change to be honest. | 08:21 |
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| +perlDreamer | I must be making large (and false) assumptions. | 08:22 |
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| +perlDreamer | my apologies | 08:22 |
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| +Radix-wrk | none taken ;) | 08:22 |
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| @vayde | I didn't really think of 'Layout' and 'Page Layout' as the same thing. I just figured the page layout thing was a fancy interface to the page's properties. | 08:22 |
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| +perlDreamer | it is | 08:23 |
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| +perlDreamer | Layout is just a container. | 08:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | Like a Folder | 08:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | The Wiki is also pretty much a container. | 08:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | and the CS | 08:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | and the Calendar | 08:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | they don't really do much beyond aggregate data from their children | 08:24 |
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| @vayde | I see that now. Thanks. | 08:24 |
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| @vayde | Well, that's it for me. 'night all | 08:48 |
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| nuba | so, while using WWW::Mechanize to mass migrate some content to Articles w/ file attachements i had to manually add the file input to the form before posting it, as it is currently added by javascript. should I file that as a bug ? | 11:51 |
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| SDuensin | Good morning. | 15:49 |
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| pjesi | hi SDuensin | 15:50 |
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| SDuensin | Hey pjesi | 15:51 |
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| preaction_ | can someone here try to access http://commctrl.com and get a default webgui install page? | 18:46 |
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| @preaction | just trying to check that my router is working right | 18:46 |
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| ckotil | its just loading and loading.... | 18:47 |
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| ckotil | timed out | 18:47 |
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| @preaction | that's not as good | 18:48 |
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| @preaction | that sounds like what manuel does, since it's trying to run Perl CGI on a 90mhz machine. | 18:48 |
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| @preaction | when the router should be pointing to wyoh... | 18:48 |
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| ckotil | heh | 18:49 |
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| pjesi | I get a page | 18:49 |
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| @preaction | pjesi: a page with green on the top? | 18:49 |
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| pjesi | sorry I dont | 18:50 |
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| * pjesi looked at the wrong tab | 18:50 |
| @preaction | rofl... my DNS provider reset my settings? | 18:52 |
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| ckotil | I just experienced some wierd shit, was editing an asset, but never got attached to a version tag. | 18:52 |
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| @preaction | what kind of asset? | 18:53 |
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| ckotil | folder asset | 18:53 |
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| @preaction | that is weird | 18:54 |
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| ckotil | tell me about it. quite scary too | 18:56 |
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| ckotil | the manager caught the problem. | 18:56 |
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| ckotil | i have yet to expirience it | 18:56 |
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| ckotil | im hoping its related to me clearing the file cache via a scheduled task | 18:57 |
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| perlmonkey2 | preaction: run your own DNS cacheing service and no more problems with DNS providers :) | 19:01 |
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| @preaction | i lied, nothing in the DNS changed | 19:01 |
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| @preaction | the router restarted itself | 19:01 |
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| @preaction | everything Should work | 19:01 |
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| @preaction | it works internally, with my /etc/hosts files updated accordingly | 19:01 |
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| ckotil | damn, WebGUI dir is at half a gig now | 19:12 |
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| SDuensin | That's all? You're not trying! | 19:13 |
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| ckotil | good to hear | 19:14 |
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| ckotil | pastebin paste | 19:14 |
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| ckotil | perlbot paste | 19:15 |
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| perlbot | Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl or http://erxz.com/pb and #perl will be able to view it. | 19:15 |
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| ckotil | http://sial.org/pbot/23946 | 19:15 |
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| SDuensin | I've got one of about 5 sites half built and I'm at 1.5. Moving it to my host is going to take forever. :-) | 19:15 |
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| ckotil | weatherdata is really screwing me | 19:15 |
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| pjesi | topic is old :) | 19:17 |
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| @preaction | ckotil: you're going to have to comment out the sub that adds that column so that your upgrade can run successfully, after you restore from backup | 19:18 |
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| @preaction | one of these days someone should remind me to ask TMRFE for a week or two to build a better upgrade system | 19:19 |
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| ckotil | ok. so i need to restore my back up first? | 19:19 |
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| ckotil | then run upgrade.pl with the commented out sub? | 19:19 |
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| @preaction | yes, that upgrade (.10-.11) didn't get to finish because it died in the middle | 19:20 |
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| ckotil | ok, ya i see an open version tag | 19:20 |
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| @preaction | but the upgrade.pl script kept on going, which i would consider a bug but JT would call an RFE | 19:20 |
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| ckotil | heh | 19:21 |
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| ckotil | so this sub updateTemplates{} | 19:21 |
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| @preaction | no | 19:21 |
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| @preaction | there's a section after WebGUI::Session->open that is a list of subroutine calls | 19:21 |
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| @preaction | nevermind, there's only that one thing in that upgrade anyway | 19:22 |
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| ckotil | in updrade_7.3.10-7.3.11.pl? | 19:22 |
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| @preaction | yeah, after my $session = start(); | 19:22 |
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| @preaction | it's fixWeather or something | 19:22 |
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| ckotil | got it. | 19:23 |
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| ckotil | can i just rerun the upgrade script or must i bring up my backup? | 19:23 |
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| @preaction | how long has it been since the backup? | 19:23 |
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| ckotil | just did it a minute ago | 19:23 |
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| ckotil | jsut before the upgrade | 19:24 |
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| @preaction | it would probably be best to bring up the backup | 19:24 |
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| ckotil | k | 19:24 |
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| @preaction | somehow your site got the additional weather column without running the upgrade | 19:24 |
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| ckotil | i was told to add it while trying to fix bug | 19:24 |
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| ckotil | :/ | 19:24 |
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| @preaction | that'd be why | 19:25 |
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| @preaction | it's best to bring up the backup in case something in the 7.3.11 upgrade relies on something in the upgrade that failed | 19:25 |
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| ckotil | k | 19:25 |
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| @preaction | in this case, it probably did not happen, but better safe than sorry and other trite expressions | 19:25 |
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| ckotil | always | 19:26 |
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| ckotil | upgrade complete | 19:32 |
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| ckotil | thx | 19:32 |
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| ckotil | mmm paginated commite version goodness | 19:45 |
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| ckotil | commited | 19:45 |
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| SDuensin | Hey rizen | 19:54 |
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| @rizen | howdy | 19:54 |
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| -!- wgGuest98 is now known as snapcount | 21:07 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v snapcount] by ChanServ | 21:07 |
| +snapcount | anybody home? | 21:07 |
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| +perlDreamer | hola | 21:08 |
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| pjesi | hæ | 21:08 |
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| +perlDreamer | how you doing, man? | 21:08 |
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| +snapcount | life is rough... I have to wait for at least 2 hours before WoW downloads | 21:09 |
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| +snapcount | =) | 21:09 |
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| +perlDreamer | I've been feeding your crickets | 21:09 |
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| +snapcount | heh | 21:09 |
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| +snapcount | I should enter the style wcc | 21:10 |
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| +snapcount | that would be funny | 21:10 |
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| +snapcount | Steve would get nausea | 21:10 |
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| +snapcount | lime green with orange | 21:10 |
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| +snapcount | lots of <blink> tags | 21:10 |
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| +snapcount | show off my design prowess | 21:10 |
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| +perlDreamer | blink is so 90's | 21:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | we need to update it for y2k | 21:11 |
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| +snapcount | I can bring it back | 21:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | we'll call it the "bling" tag | 21:11 |
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| +snapcount | there ya go | 21:11 |
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| +snapcount | I haven't had a chance to check out the acme entries... | 21:13 |
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| +snapcount | any good ones? | 21:13 |
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| * SDuensin thinks so. :-) | 21:13 |
| +snapcount | what did you submit? | 21:13 |
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| SDuensin | The HGR Macro. | 21:13 |
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| +snapcount | what does it do? | 21:14 |
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| SDuensin | Lets you use Apple II high resolution images as assets. :-D | 21:14 |
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| +snapcount | is there a reason that you couldn't do that without the macro? | 21:15 |
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| +snapcount | I don't really know what an Apple II high res image is or what's unique about it | 21:15 |
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| SDuensin | It reads them right off Apple II ProDOS formatted disk images and displays them as PNGs. | 21:15 |
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| pjesi | haha | 21:15 |
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| -!- cga [n=cga@213-140-6-101.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit ["90% of the problems that people have with GNU/Linux are to impute to Windows."] | 21:15 |
| SDuensin | Apple II images are 240x192 six color images saved as an 8k raw memory dump of the video page of an Apple II. | 21:16 |
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| SDuensin | They're encoded really funky like. Woz managed to get six displayable colors (there are actually 8, but two are white and two are black) out of a 1 bit memory map. | 21:16 |
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| +snapcount | well that definitely sounds like an acme contrib =) | 21:17 |
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| +snapcount | nicely done | 21:17 |
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| SDuensin | :-) | 21:17 |
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| SDuensin | I figured that was weird enough. | 21:17 |
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| +snapcount | I'm fresh out of Apple II's though | 21:17 |
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| +snapcount | so I guess I can't try it out | 21:17 |
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| SDuensin | I put a sample image in the archive. | 21:18 |
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| +snapcount | so the image can be stored on other OS's and still requires the macro? | 21:18 |
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| +snapcount | what does it do... translate to a web friendly binary format? | 21:18 |
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| SDuensin | Makes it a PNG | 21:19 |
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| +snapcount | ok the light bulb is starting to come on | 21:19 |
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| +snapcount | sounds pretty cool | 21:19 |
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| SDuensin | You can have multiple 8k pictures stored in a 140k ProDOS disk image. | 21:20 |
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| pjesi | SDuensin: how long time did it take you? | 21:20 |
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| SDuensin | Few days. WebGUI API was the hardest part. :-) | 21:20 |
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| +snapcount | I want to write a code breaking wobject | 21:20 |
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| +snapcount | for substitution ciphers | 21:21 |
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| +snapcount | not brute force though, that's gay | 21:21 |
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| +snapcount | I was going to have it use a frequency method | 21:21 |
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| SDuensin | Do a one-time pad. Each run needs a new PM module. | 21:21 |
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| +snapcount | based on the language the message is in | 21:21 |
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| cap10morgan | so, we have around 55 domains in our webgui 7 installation | 21:22 |
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| cap10morgan | but spectre seems to be getting further and further behind | 21:22 |
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| +snapcount | The thing that interested me was the algorithim for breaking the cipher so I was going to write it all from scratch | 21:22 |
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| +snapcount | I just like to use WebGUI because of the API | 21:22 |
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| +snapcount | granted it's probably more familiar to me =) | 21:22 |
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| cap10morgan | the server has plenty more horsepower to throw at it, but how do i tell spectre to use it? | 21:23 |
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| cap10morgan | i've tried increasing the number of maxWorkers to 25 | 21:23 |
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| cap10morgan | what else should i do? | 21:23 |
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| +snapcount | what is spectre getting hung up on? | 21:23 |
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| cap10morgan | the workflow queue just keeps getting longer and longer | 21:24 |
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| cap10morgan | it's processing through it all | 21:24 |
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| cap10morgan | but it just keeps growing | 21:24 |
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| +snapcount | latest version? | 21:24 |
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| cap10morgan | yeah | 21:24 |
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| cap10morgan | 7.3.13 in WRE 0.7.2 | 21:24 |
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| cap10morgan | on RHEL 4 | 21:24 |
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| +snapcount | there is probably a workflow that is hanging up | 21:24 |
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| +snapcount | spectre doesn't ignore those anymore | 21:24 |
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| cap10morgan | i'm watching spectre run, there doesn't seem to be | 21:24 |
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| +snapcount | it pushes them to the bottom of the que | 21:24 |
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| +snapcount | so if you have a list that is growing... that would be my first guess | 21:25 |
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| cap10morgan | ok | 21:25 |
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| * SDuensin is excited - he just ordered a virtual server to put his WebGUI (and other) STUFF ON! WHOOO! | 21:25 |
| +snapcount | basically if the wf has a problem it becomes priority 0 | 21:25 |
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| +snapcount | so spectre runs the other stuff and then trys those again | 21:25 |
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| +snapcount | set your logging to debug and see if you have errors | 21:26 |
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| cap10morgan | ok | 21:26 |
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| +snapcount | btw this is just community advice | 21:27 |
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| +snapcount | I don't work for pb anymore so this isn't official support | 21:27 |
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| +snapcount | just so you know | 21:27 |
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| cap10morgan | ok | 21:27 |
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| SDuensin | That means we don't have to pay you. :-) | 21:27 |
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| cap10morgan | haha | 21:27 |
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| +snapcount | that's one way to look at it =) | 21:27 |
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| +snapcount | SDuensin: where did you get your server? | 21:28 |
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| SDuensin | LiquidWeb. I've been using them for some time. Support is excellent. (I'd have done PlainBlack, but I need root access and can't afford them - yet!) | 21:29 |
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| cap10morgan | one of our domains just added a ton of workflow instances to the queue at priority 20 | 21:29 |
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| +snapcount | I think that higher number == lower priority | 21:30 |
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| SDuensin | snapcount - I just got this: https://www.liquidweb.com/shared/plan4.htm | 21:30 |
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| +snapcount | I never looked at that code after rizen re-wrote it | 21:30 |
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| +snapcount | I need to setup a virtual machine in windows... what do you guys recommend? | 21:31 |
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| +snapcount | VMWare appears to cost $$$ | 21:31 |
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| +perlDreamer | installing linux :) | 21:31 |
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| +snapcount | and I don't like that | 21:31 |
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| cap10morgan | VMWare Server is free | 21:31 |
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| cap10morgan | that's what i use | 21:32 |
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| +snapcount | My bodybugg doesn't work in Linux | 21:32 |
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| +snapcount | so I need windoze | 21:32 |
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| +snapcount | and I have the muscle to run a virtual machine pretty snappy | 21:32 |
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| +perlDreamer | what's a bodybugg? | 21:32 |
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| +snapcount | amazing what 4 sata2 baracuddas in Raid 0 will do for performance | 21:33 |
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| +snapcount | it's a "Make yourself un-fat monitor" | 21:33 |
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| +snapcount | its an armband that measures the amount of calories you're burning | 21:33 |
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| +snapcount | I want to loose 2lbs/week | 21:33 |
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| +snapcount | so I need to burn 1000 calories more than I consume each day | 21:34 |
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| +snapcount | this tells me how many I'm burning and the food log part of the software tells me how much is going in | 21:34 |
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| +snapcount | the software is all web based but uses active x controls so it requires IE | 21:35 |
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| perlmonkey2 | how does it know how many you are burning? | 21:35 |
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| +snapcount | it measures a lot of things like number of steps, heart rate, and the electrical conduction between two points on your skin | 21:36 |
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| +snapcount | some how all of that crap into some formula lets them figure it out | 21:36 |
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| +snapcount | pretty amazing | 21:36 |
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| +snapcount | also your skin temperature I think | 21:36 |
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| perlmonkey2 | that is amazing. | 21:36 |
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| +snapcount | www.bodybugg.com | 21:36 |
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| pjesi | snapcount: that is no excuse | 21:37 |
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| pjesi | http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/page/Main_Page | 21:37 |
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| pjesi | :P | 21:38 |
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| wgGuest49 | what the f | 21:38 |
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| perlmonkey2 | IEs4Linux++ | 21:38 |
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| -!- wgGuest49 is now known as snapcount | 21:39 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v snapcount] by ChanServ | 21:39 |
| +snapcount | apparently this chat java applet doesn't like it when you minimize the window | 21:39 |
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| pjesi | did you see the url? | 21:40 |
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| +snapcount | no | 21:40 |
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| pjesi | [19:37] <pjesi> http://www.tatanka.com.br/ies4linux/page/Main_Page | 21:41 |
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| +snapcount | will active x controls work? | 21:43 |
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| +snapcount | I think that's how it interfaces with the hardware | 21:43 |
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| SDuensin | This is a better URL: http://goodbye-microsoft.com/ | 21:43 |
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| SDuensin | :-) | 21:43 |
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| +snapcount | that's funny | 21:44 |
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| SDuensin | snapcount, just snag VMWare Server. It works great. | 21:44 |
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| SDuensin | Video is slow on the Server edition, but you just minimize it and SSH in anyway. :-) | 21:44 |
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| +snapcount | will that allow you to create the virtual machine? | 21:44 |
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| cap10morgan | snapcount: yes | 21:44 |
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| SDuensin | Or you could be completely psycho and use CoLinux. | 21:44 |
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| SDuensin | Yes. | 21:44 |
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| +snapcount | ok that sounds good... vmware server is the free one right | 21:45 |
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| SDuensin | BillSoft also gives away VirtualPC now, too. I prefer VMWare Server though. | 21:45 |
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| SDuensin | Yep. Free. | 21:45 |
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| +snapcount | cool | 21:45 |
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| +snapcount | It will slow down my WoW download for a bit but I suppose that's acceptable | 21:45 |
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| SDuensin | hehehe | 21:46 |
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| +snapcount | 3.18 GB | 21:46 |
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| SDuensin | You're a digital crack addict. | 21:46 |
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| +snapcount | 20% done woo hoo | 21:46 |
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| +snapcount | digital crack eh? | 21:46 |
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| +snapcount | haven't heard that one yet | 21:46 |
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| SDuensin | That reminds me - I need to install CentOS in a VM. | 21:46 |
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| +snapcount | but it sound appropriate | 21:46 |
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| SDuensin | World of Warcrack? | 21:46 |
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| +snapcount | ahh | 21:46 |
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| +snapcount | I haven't played in quite a while | 21:47 |
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| +snapcount | I'm starting up again | 21:47 |
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| * snapcount has a relapse | 21:47 |
| SDuensin | It's the newer, more addictive, version of EverCrack. | 21:47 |
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| +perlDreamer | Intervention! | 21:47 |
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| * SDuensin just sticks with IRC. It's the same, but with lower system requirements. | 21:47 |
| +snapcount | always wanted to be on TV | 21:47 |
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| +snapcount | I finally have a system that can play games again | 21:47 |
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| +snapcount | so I'm happy | 21:47 |
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| SDuensin | I do, too. Just can't find *time* to play them! | 21:48 |
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| +snapcount | ah yes | 21:50 |
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| +snapcount | time | 21:50 |
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| SDuensin | I bought a GameBoy DS game. Figured I could play it while on the couch or wherever and maybe get to game a bit. My two year old has played it more than I have. (She's watched the intro at least two hundred times.) | 21:51 |
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| +snapcount | my Mom hijacked my DS when I visited her last | 21:53 |
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| +snapcount | now she has her own | 21:53 |
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| +snapcount | thank God | 21:53 |
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| +snapcount | she got hooked on Brain Age | 21:53 |
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| SDuensin | hehe | 21:53 |
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| SDuensin | The game I got was "Hotel Dusk: 215". What I've seen of it is pretty cool. | 21:54 |
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| +snapcount | crap I keep forgetting this is a 64 bit machine | 21:55 |
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| +snapcount | I'm constantly downloading the wrong stuff | 21:55 |
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| SDuensin | ehe | 21:55 |
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| SDuensin | hehe | 21:56 |
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| ckotil | brain age is neat | 23:21 |
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| SDuensin | Wow, ckotil, you got some lag. :-P | 23:26 |
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| ckotil | heh | 23:28 |
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| * ckotil blames the 3 beers at lunch | 23:28 |
| ckotil | it acutually just clicked now in my head what brain age was. | 23:28 |
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| cap10morgan | so, i have a custom workflow that i wrote that runs fine on my development box | 23:28 |
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| * ckotil 's brain age is 200 | 23:28 |
| SDuensin | hehe | 23:29 |
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| cap10morgan | but on my server, it doesn't run | 23:29 |
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| cap10morgan | it doesn't spit out any errors or anything in the log | 23:29 |
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| cap10morgan | even when i run it manually in the scheduler admin console | 23:29 |
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| cap10morgan | any idea what to check? | 23:29 |
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| cap10morgan | i have a once every 5 minute schedule for it to run, but it just doesn't | 23:30 |
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| ckotil | what does it do? | 23:30 |
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| ckotil | what kind of workflow? | 23:30 |
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| cap10morgan | it processes "actions" | 23:30 |
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| cap10morgan | which are basically dataform submissions | 23:31 |
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| cap10morgan | once it's done its work, it marks the datafrom_entry as processed in the db (using a new field) | 23:31 |
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| cap10morgan | but that's not happening | 23:31 |
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| cap10morgan | i see no evidence anywhere that it's even attempting to run... :/ | 23:31 |
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| cap10morgan | hahaha | 23:32 |
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| cap10morgan | it just ran | 23:33 |
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| cap10morgan | finally! | 23:33 |
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| cap10morgan | :) | 23:33 |
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| ckotil | heh | 23:33 |
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| ckotil | so spectre took a while to process it? | 23:33 |
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| cap10morgan | wow, it took it like half an hour to run | 23:33 |
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| cap10morgan | well, it didn't even attempt to run it until just now | 23:33 |
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| ckotil | thats one of my biggest complaints with webgui right now | 23:33 |
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| cap10morgan | and then it completed basically instantly | 23:33 |
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| cap10morgan | how asynchronous spectre is? | 23:34 |
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| ckotil | not sure. | 23:35 |
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| ckotil | seems to be quite a bit tho | 23:35 |
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| ckotil | otherwise why would jobs take so long to process , or even get into the queue? | 23:35 |
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| +perlDreamer | It's very hard to debug spectre problems on dev systems | 23:39 |
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| @rizen | pd, i disagree | 23:41 |
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| @rizen | spectre has all kinds of debug and testing stuff now | 23:41 |
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| +perlDreamer | I should be more clear | 23:41 |
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| +perlDreamer | It's hard to replicate some spectre problems on dev systems | 23:41 |
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| @rizen | and as for synchronicity problems, it's got to be a config error, or you've found a new bug that no one else has reported | 23:41 |
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| +perlDreamer | spectre seems to be very situatinos dependent | 23:41 |
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| @rizen | have you guys done: perl spectre.pl --status | 23:42 |
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| @rizen | It tells you what's in the queue and how long it's been running | 23:42 |
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| @rizen | what the status of each things is as well | 23:42 |
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| SDuensin | Ok, heading home. Later all. | 23:51 |
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| --- Day changed Tue Apr 03 2007 |
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| cap10morgan | spectre.pl --status is pretty interesting | 00:41 |
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| cap10morgan | i have a bunch (over 400) waiting workflows, all at priority 20 or 21 | 00:42 |
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| cap10morgan | the ones at 21 are complete | 00:42 |
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| cap10morgan | the ones at 20 are all "never run" | 00:42 |
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| rizen_ | "complete" means that it successfully ran it's last task | 00:42 |
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| -!- rizen_ is now known as rizen | 00:42 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+o rizen] by ChanServ | 00:42 |
| cap10morgan | does 400 workflows seem normal for ~10 domains? | 00:46 |
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| @rizen | not even close to normal | 00:46 |
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| cap10morgan | kinda what i thought... | 00:46 |
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| cap10morgan | hmm... | 00:46 |
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| @rizen | it does depend on your spectre settings though | 00:46 |
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| @rizen | what does your spectre config look like? | 00:47 |
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| @rizen | the defaults aren't really adequate for a multi-domain server | 00:47 |
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| cap10morgan | ok to paste to channel? | 00:47 |
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| @rizen | perlbot paste? | 00:47 |
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| perlbot | Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl or http://erxz.com/pb and #perl will be able to view it. | 00:47 |
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| cap10morgan | http://sial.org/pbot/23951 | 00:48 |
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| @rizen | wow | 00:49 |
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| cap10morgan | i love ~70 domains by the time this is a production server | 00:49 |
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| @rizen | i wouldn't set max workers higher than 5 | 00:49 |
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| cap10morgan | oh, ok | 00:49 |
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| @rizen | also, time between workflows should probably be 1 second | 00:50 |
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| cap10morgan | ok, changing those | 00:50 |
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| @rizen | generally speaking you want the list of running workflows to be empty | 00:51 |
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| @rizen | aka zero latency | 00:51 |
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| cap10morgan | right | 00:51 |
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| @rizen | for example: http://sial.org/pbot/23952 | 00:53 |
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| @rizen | this particular box has 90 sites running on it | 00:53 |
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| @rizen | the only ones sitting in the queue are ones that are waiting for approval | 00:54 |
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| cap10morgan | is priority 20 the lowest priority? | 00:54 |
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| @rizen | nope | 00:54 |
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| @rizen | well wait | 00:54 |
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| @rizen | by lowest do you mean "least" | 00:54 |
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| @rizen | the priorities are 0, 10, and 20 | 00:54 |
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| @rizen | the starting | 00:54 |
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| @rizen | something with a priority of 0 will be run immedietly | 00:55 |
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| cap10morgan | ok | 00:55 |
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| cap10morgan | gotcha | 00:55 |
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| @rizen | as things are executed, their priority will increase | 00:55 |
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| cap10morgan | alright, my queue is steadily declining now | 00:55 |
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| @rizen | you may see something like 243/20 as a priority | 00:55 |
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| @rizen | meaning that it has executed 223 times | 00:56 |
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| @rizen | and started at 20 | 00:56 |
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| cap10morgan | oh, ok | 00:56 |
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| @rizen | generally, anything running that long is going to be problematic | 00:56 |
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| cap10morgan | right, makes sense | 00:56 |
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| @rizen | everything that comes with webgui will fully complete withing 5-15 executions | 00:56 |
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| cap10morgan | thanks rizen, that's working much more smoothly now | 01:04 |
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| @rizen | glad to hear it | 01:04 |
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| @rizen | incidentally there's a lot of info about spectre included in the upcoming "WebGUI Administrators Guide" book that i'm writing | 01:05 |
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| @rizen | you should check it out | 01:05 |
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| @rizen | it should be out mid may | 01:05 |
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| cap10morgan | oh, cool | 01:05 |
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| -!- Netsplit over, joins: @rizen | 01:07 |
| -!- Netsplit over, joins: cap10morgan, besonen_mobile, ckotil, perlbot, nuba | 01:07 |
| -!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [] | 01:07 |
| -!- Netsplit over, joins: +perlDreamer | 01:07 |
| cap10morgan | well that was fun | 01:09 |
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| +perlDreamer | vayde, you want to talk tests? | 01:09 |
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| +perlDreamer | cap10morgan: indeed. at least it was short | 01:10 |
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| cap10morgan | :) | 01:10 |
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| @vayde | sure, let's talk tests | 01:10 |
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| +perlDreamer | We'll do the email one first, it's the easiest. | 01:10 |
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| +perlDreamer | 1) Grab a copy of my wG testing talk from http://www.sunsetpres.org/web/webgui | 01:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | 2)Skim it (10-15 minutes tops) | 01:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | 3) Holler back | 01:11 |
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| @vayde | will do | 01:11 |
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| @vayde | Woah, pD. I just looked at the clock. I have to teach shortly. I'll read it and check back with you either later tonight if you're around or tomorrow | 01:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | no problem | 01:15 |
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| +perlDreamer | hack on, it whatever medium you need to | 01:15 |
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| -!- estivenrpo [n=estivenr@200.58.205.236] has left #webgui [] | 01:17 |
| -!- estivenrpo [n=estivenr@200.58.205.236] has joined #webgui | 01:17 |
| -!- estivenrpo [n=estivenr@200.58.205.236] has quit [] | 01:21 |
| -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI | 01:59 |
| -!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has quit [] | 02:19 |
| -!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui | 02:20 |
| -!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat064.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"] | 02:51 |
| -!- cap10morgan [n=wmorgan@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)] | 03:25 |
| --- Log closed Tue Apr 03 03:58:51 2007 |
| --- Log opened Tue Apr 03 12:58:56 2007 |
| -!- xdanger [i=xdanger@i.should.be.in.a.mentalhouse.net] has joined #webgui | 12:58 |
| -!- Irssi: #webgui: Total of 12 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 1 voices, 11 normal] | 12:58 |
| -!- Irssi: Join to #webgui was synced in 3 secs | 12:58 |
| -!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has joined #webgui | 13:18 |
| -!- Hinrik_ [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 13:23 |
| -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has quit ["Leaving"] | 14:08 |
| -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@52.sub-75-207-10.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI | 15:57 |
| SDuensin | Blargh. Morning. | 15:57 |
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| AMH_bob | Goodmorning | 15:59 |
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| SDuensin | Hey AMH_bob | 16:04 |
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| * SDuensin is already having a bad day. :-( | 16:04 |
| SDuensin | You'd think a company the size of Apple would be able to pay their bills. | 16:05 |
|---|
| * SDuensin has the worst luck getting paid for his work. <sigh> | 16:06 |
| AMH_bob | They make pretty good stuff, that's all I know! | 16:19 |
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| * SDuensin is on a MacBook Pro right now. :-) | 16:21 |
| AMH_bob | would like to be on a MacBook Pro right now :P | 16:24 |
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| AMH_bob | I'm in The Netherlands, it seems that this channel gets busy when I head off to home ... :( | 16:25 |
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| AMH_bob | its 3:24 pm here | 16:25 |
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| AMH_bob | I'm crash coursing wobjects now... it is starting to make sence | 16:32 |
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| -!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@wlan-145-94-246-128.wlan.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui | 16:32 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ | 16:32 |
| SDuensin | Cool, AMH_bob - I get to learn that yet. | 16:35 |
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| SDuensin | I *almost* had it figured out in the 5.x series. Then I went away for a bit. :-) | 16:35 |
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| SDuensin | Hey MrHairgrease | 16:35 |
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| +MrHairgrease | hi | 16:37 |
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| -!- MrHairgrease is now known as MrAfkGrease | 16:38 |
| -!- MrAfkGrease is now known as MrHairgrease | 16:45 |
| -!- vayde [n=vayde@209.134.142.196] has joined #webgui | 16:55 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+o vayde] by ChanServ | 16:55 |
| -!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has joined #webgui | 17:44 |
| -!- AMH_mari [n=mari@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection] | 18:03 |
| -!- cga [n=cga@213-140-6-101.ip.fastwebnet.it] has joined #webgui | 18:03 |
| cga | ciao a tutti =) | 18:03 |
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| cga | ohps sorry | 18:04 |
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| +MrHairgrease | hi | 18:04 |
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| -!- AMH_bob [n=chatzill@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection] | 18:14 |
| -!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat064.mxim.com] has joined #webgui | 18:33 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ | 18:33 |
| -!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@wlan-145-94-246-128.wlan.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui [] | 18:47 |
| -!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui | 19:16 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ | 19:16 |
| +perlDreamer | MrHairGrease: Do you know if there's a EuroWUC this year? | 19:21 |
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| +MrHairgrease | While I am not certain | 19:22 |
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| +MrHairgrease | I think no | 19:22 |
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| +MrHairgrease | It there is, I would've prolly heard about it | 19:22 |
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| +perlDreamer | okay, thanks | 19:22 |
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| +MrHairgrease | that is, if oit wer to be in NL | 19:23 |
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| +perlDreamer | well, you are well connected in the Euro wG community | 19:23 |
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| +MrHairgrease | only in the dutch incrowd | 19:23 |
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| +MrHairgrease | most of the other euro guys i have never seen | 19:23 |
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| -!- dgm [n=dgm@24-119-133-72.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #webgui | 21:01 |
| dgm | trying to install webgui from source.... and I have to say... the instructions are severly lacking. | 21:02 |
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| perlmonkey2 | How long would it take to port WebGUI to use Moose? I've already tested Moose with Poe with no issues. | 21:02 |
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| perlmonkey2 | Although I don't start the Poe event loop until the Moose post-constructor BUILD call. | 21:03 |
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| SDuensin | Moose? | 21:03 |
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| perlmonkey2 | Moose is Perl6 OO in Perl5 | 21:04 |
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| SDuensin | Ah. | 21:04 |
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| SDuensin | dgm - you mean the WRE? | 21:04 |
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| dgm | no, the source | 21:05 |
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| perlmonkey2 | yes, rewrite all of the source in Moose. | 21:05 |
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| SDuensin | Source of WebGUI? Or compile the WRE from source? | 21:06 |
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| +perlDreamer | installing wG from source couldn't take more than 15-30 minutes, with most of that being downloading and installing perl modules from CPAN | 21:06 |
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| dgm | webgui source | 21:06 |
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| dgm | on ubunto 6.06 | 21:06 |
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| dgm | cpan modules wouldn't all install | 21:06 |
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| +perlDreamer | which ones? | 21:06 |
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| SDuensin | Why not use the WRE for Ubuntu? | 21:07 |
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| dgm | I already have other apahce websites.... doesn't the WRE supply another apache? | 21:08 |
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| SDuensin | Two more, in fact. :-) | 21:08 |
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| perlmonkey2 | dgm, I originally thought the documentation was lacking, because I didn't have a lot of modules installed. The real problem was the documentation was too thorough and I had skimmed a lot of it, missing crucial steps. Everything I had to do to get WebGui source running on brand new Fedora boxes was in the documentation. | 21:08 |
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| dgm | the cpan stuff should be earlier | 21:09 |
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| dgm | the instructions show the apache config before showing the cpan stuff, but some perl stuff needs to be installed before the web server is restarted | 21:10 |
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| dgm | gah. I have to give up for today... 3 hours is too much | 21:11 |
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| -!- dgm [n=dgm@24-119-133-72.cpe.cableone.net] has left #webgui [] | 21:12 |
| SDuensin | He was fun. | 21:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | yes, but too bad he wouldn't give more details | 21:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | dgm is a PHP/perl/rails dev | 21:12 |
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| SDuensin | Ah | 21:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | perlmonkey2: it would be a big task to rewrite everything in Moose. | 21:13 |
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| * SDuensin is a whatever-the-source-is-in dev. | 21:13 |
| perlmonkey2 | perlDreamer: probably makes more sense to wait until Perl6 is production worthy? | 21:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | rizen would like to move to p6 when that happens | 21:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | It would be nice (very nice) to have the power of p6 today, but don't you think it would be much slower than regular old p5? | 21:15 |
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| perlmonkey2 | I've signed up to the pugs project, but haven't had time to contibute :( | 21:15 |
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| +perlDreamer | WebGUI can always use more perl hackers | 21:15 |
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| perlmonkey2 | Slower? Definetely. Noticeably? Probably not. | 21:15 |
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| +perlDreamer | are there any Moose benchmarks out there for comparison? | 21:16 |
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| * perlmonkey2 would love to be a full time Perl project hacker. | 21:16 |
| +perlDreamer | I found a little info in Moose::Cookbook::FAQ | 21:18 |
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| +perlDreamer | the big risk in such a big rewrite is that there's no wG-wide test suite to back you up. | 21:19 |
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| perlmonkey2 | yes, it wasn't a very well thought out idea. But irc is perfect for those :P | 21:20 |
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| perlmonkey2 | Plus, since p6 is ontrack for xmas2007, the rewrite would just be wrapped up when p6 design work would need to be started. | 21:20 |
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| +perlDreamer | maybe we should flesh out wG's test suite to make such ideas easier to implement? | 21:21 |
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| perlmonkey2 | And the p6 rewrite will be magnitudes more fun. | 21:21 |
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| perlmonkey2 | With threading functional and working, I wonder if POE will be necessary anymore? | 21:22 |
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| +perlDreamer | p6 has been on track for xmas 2\d\d\d for a long time | 21:22 |
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| perlmonkey2 | #perl6 is very assuring on this issue. | 21:23 |
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| * perlmonkey2 gets a little sick to his stomach thinking about a redesign of WebGui that would not entail using POE. | 21:26 |
| * perlDreamer heads off to lunch. bbl | 21:27 |
| SDuensin | WTF is POE anyway? All I know is that I updated it. :-) | 21:31 |
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| ckotil | http://poe.perl.org/?POE_Components_List | 21:32 |
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| perlmonkey2 | POE is a psuedo operating system/event handler. | 21:34 |
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| SDuensin | ah | 21:35 |
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| SDuensin | Man, there's POE crap for everything. :-) | 21:37 |
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| -!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui | 21:39 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+o preaction] by ChanServ | 21:39 |
| perlmonkey2 | yes, POE is like butta | 21:43 |
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| -!- rbroen [n=chatzill@cp47104-a.roemd1.lb.home.nl] has joined #webgui | 22:08 |
| -!- rbroen is now known as AHM_Bob | 22:08 |
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| -!- AHM_Bob is now known as AMH_bob | 22:15 |
| +perlDreamer | vayde, want to talk tests? | 22:58 |
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| @vayde | I'd love to, but I have to squash something for JT first | 22:59 |
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| SDuensin | He's scared of spiders, eh? | 22:59 |
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| @vayde | gimme a few to puzzle over it, maybe you can explain it to me | 22:59 |
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| @vayde | call me the Orkin man... Nik Bash Bugs! | 23:00 |
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| +perlDreamer | are we going to release tomorrow? | 23:01 |
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| @vayde | I don't know. I'm pretty low on the totem pole | 23:04 |
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| -!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has quit [Remote closed the connection] | 23:18 |
| -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@52.sub-75-207-10.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"] | 23:43 |
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| -!- cga [n=cga@213-140-6-101.ip.fastwebnet.it] has quit ["90% of the problems that people have with GNU/Linux are to impute to Windows."] | 23:55 |
| --- Day changed Wed Apr 04 2007 |
| @preaction | god i remember saying that same thing a few months ago | 00:28 |
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| @vayde | ahh, the good old days eh? | 00:36 |
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| @vayde | now you're the 'elder brother' as we would say in kung fu | 00:37 |
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| -!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui [] | 01:12 |
| @preaction | of course, kohai | 01:18 |
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| @vayde | wrong country round eye. To me you're 'sihing'. | 01:20 |
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| @preaction | that's racist, dog | 01:20 |
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| @preaction | they're not round, they're more droopy | 01:20 |
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| @vayde | Hey, as a Japanese/Swedish/Scot I reserve the right to use 'round eye' any time I want. Don't make me serve you raw lutefisk while wearing a kilt! | 01:23 |
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| @preaction | Japanese/Swedish/Scot who teaches Chinese martial art? | 01:24 |
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| * preaction braces for "wrong country, <insert racist term>" | 01:24 |
| @vayde | Yup. My great-great-great grandfather was samurai, and I only do chinese martial arts. My family is very disappointed | 01:24 |
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| @preaction | i'd break out the "slope", but i'm white, so therefore I cannot play with racism. | 01:25 |
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| @preaction | yeah, i'd say so. how long did Japan have to defend itself against Chinese/Mandarin tyrants? | 01:26 |
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| @vayde | At least twice, but other than the Mongols, I don't really remember. | 01:27 |
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| @vayde | I'm more familiar with the times it wen't the other way | 01:27 |
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| @preaction | the evil japanese imperialists? I remember one, and vaguely remember that another one might've been a factor in a mongol occupation before the mongols established a dynasty. but i'm probably just admitting my own ignorance | 01:30 |
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| @vayde | I have a weapon style/form that was specifically tailored to fight the japanese katana. | 01:31 |
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| @vayde | I'm not much of an historian, really. I just hit stuff. | 01:32 |
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| @vayde | Is there a support/hosting price list somewhere? | 02:09 |
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| +perlDreamer | https://www.plainblack.com/store/services | 02:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | perlbot: PBstore is https://www.plainblack.com/store/services | 02:18 |
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| perlbot | added PBstore to the database | 02:18 |
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| @vayde | duh. found it | 02:18 |
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| +Radix_ | mornin' | 02:24 |
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| +Radix_ | I'm winning on the ACME contest so far.. of course noone else has voted and I voted for myself, but hey.. | 02:25 |
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| +Radix_ | ;) | 02:25 |
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| -!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat064.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"] | 02:35 |
| -!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui [] | 02:53 |
| -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@177.sub-75-206-140.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI | 02:55 |
| -!- Hinrik_ [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has joined #webgui | 03:06 |
| -!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 03:19 |
| -!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui | 04:00 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ | 04:00 |
| -!- Radix-work [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui | 05:12 |
| -!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] | 05:12 |
| -!- Radix-work [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] | 05:21 |
| -!- PedersenMJ [n=Pedersen@mail.icelus.biz] has joined #webgui | 05:58 |
| * PedersenMJ wavers. | 05:59 |
| -!- vayde [n=vayde@209.134.142.196] has quit ["Ex-Chat"] | 06:05 |
| pjesi | \o | 06:17 |
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| pjesi | PedersenMJ: how many styles do you plan to submit to the contest? :-) | 06:18 |
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| PedersenMJ | I still thought it had to be all original? And, though I can convert without problem, making a new one? I suck. | 06:18 |
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| pjesi | it has been changed? | 06:23 |
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| pjesi | I think | 06:23 |
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| pjesi | you can convert open source templates | 06:23 |
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| PedersenMJ | Ah, cool. In that case, I might have time to convert a good three or four of them :) | 06:25 |
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| pjesi | nice! | 06:25 |
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| pjesi | I was hoping I can find the time for one! | 06:25 |
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| PedersenMJ | Hey, they're pretty easy. Just go down the tutorial I wrote, working on any given theme. Shouldn't take but 3 to 4 hours, depending on complexity. | 06:26 |
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| PedersenMJ | Some could take longer, sure, but they're pretty easy overall. | 06:26 |
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| pjesi | PedersenMJ: yeah I know how to make them, but just really busy | 06:26 |
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| pjesi | for instance I am pulling an "allnighter" as we speak | 06:27 |
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| PedersenMJ | Ah, ditto. Still, it's a chance for another $250, so I can make some time. | 06:27 |
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| pjesi | :) | 06:27 |
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| PedersenMJ | Just got home from work half an hour ago myself (it's now 11:30pm). | 06:27 |
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| pjesi | Im doing final assignments for a msc course | 06:27 |
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| pjesi | I have written more code in the last three week then the entire year 2006 | 06:28 |
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| pjesi | weeks* | 06:28 |
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| PedersenMJ | Well, if it was for you, rather than for a course, I'd say congrats on these 3 weeks. | 06:28 |
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| pjesi | it is 4:28 over here | 06:28 |
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| pjesi | :) | 06:28 |
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| pjesi | Im just really tired, have to submit at noon | 06:29 |
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| PedersenMJ | That's never any fun. | 06:29 |
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| pjesi | but I learned a lot on these three weeks, so I dont regret it | 06:30 |
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| pjesi | but it would be nice to do some fun work that does not require much "brains" like converting a style :) | 06:34 |
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| PedersenMJ | Heh. I'm working on finishing a python app of mine before I allow myself some of the fun stuff. | 06:34 |
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| PedersenMJ | Wonder if it could be done for perl, actually? It's a three piece tool for python scripts. | 06:36 |
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| PedersenMJ | 1) Run a compile process over all files. | 06:36 |
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| PedersenMJ | 2) Run a documentation checker, making sure that all docs are written, properly tagged, etc | 06:37 |
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| PedersenMJ | 3) Run a unit test coverage checker, which makes sure that every method has a unit test, and that the test actually calls the method | 06:37 |
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| PedersenMJ | (woops, 4 parts) 4) Run the unit tests | 06:37 |
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| PedersenMJ | I don't doubt it could be done in/for perl, but I have no idea how I'd go about it. | 06:39 |
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| pjesi | python is cool | 06:43 |
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| pjesi | the web frameworks look really promising | 06:44 |
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| PedersenMJ | Can be, sure. I dunno. I'm using it because it's the best tool for the job I've got in mind, but I can't honestly say I really like it. Sorry, but the mandatory whitespace thing really bugs me. | 06:44 |
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| PedersenMJ | Okay, this one made me LOL: http://www.bash.org/?258104 | 06:46 |
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| pjesi | I dont mind it | 06:46 |
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| pjesi | hehe | 06:47 |
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| PedersenMJ | Yeowch. Here's one I'd not soon try on *any* machine I cared about (unless it was Windows... wait, I did say cared abotu, which eliminates Windows anyway): http://www.bash.org/?96164 | 07:02 |
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| @preaction | roflrofl | 07:02 |
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| -!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has joined #webgui | 07:04 |
| PedersenMJ | Shh! he's back! | 07:05 |
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| @preaction | don't say that, now he knows! | 07:05 |
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| PedersenMJ | Damn! Hinrik, please log out, log back in again, and pretend you haven't seen anything, okay? | 07:06 |
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| -!- Hinrik_ [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 07:18 |
| PedersenMJ | Video that you need to see: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFpp1zRrDfg | 07:18 |
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| PedersenMJ | Well, will enjoy seeing, if you like flight. | 07:18 |
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| pjesi | what did I miss? :s | 07:30 |
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| pjesi | Hinrik: you better upload pictures of the kitten real soon, I want to see the soldier | 07:30 |
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| -!- PedersenMJ [n=Pedersen@mail.icelus.biz] has quit [] | 07:32 |
| -!- Radix-wrk [n=Jesse@203.161.68.67] has joined #webgui | 08:30 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v Radix-wrk] by ChanServ | 08:30 |
| -!- AMH_bob [n=chatzill@cp47104-a.roemd1.lb.home.nl] has quit [Remote closed the connection] | 08:31 |
| Hinrik | talking about me eh... | 08:37 |
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| Hinrik | pjesi: here you go | 08:43 |
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| Hinrik | http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/2674/kitty1fu1.jpg | 08:43 |
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| Hinrik | http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/8739/kitty2tf5.jpg | 08:43 |
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| Hinrik | http://img482.imageshack.us/img482/1848/kitty3hl1.jpg | 08:43 |
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| Hinrik | http://img479.imageshack.us/img479/7666/kitty4ra3.jpg | 08:43 |
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| Hinrik | http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/8611/kitty5fq2.jpg | 08:43 |
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| Hinrik | http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/1086/kitty6xm7.jpg | 08:43 |
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| Hinrik | excuse the toes | 08:44 |
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| @preaction | KITTIES | 08:48 |
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| @preaction | ooh, he's a teenager and he's all gangly and CUUUUUTE | 08:48 |
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| @preaction | oh.. it was just that one pichar he looked gangly | 08:48 |
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| pjesi | pie | 08:57 |
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| Hinrik | she | 08:59 |
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| @preaction | i hate learning that my assumptions were wrong and having to undo 4 hours of work at 2:00 in the morning... | 10:19 |
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| * preaction goes to bed instead | 10:19 |
| +Radix-wrk | heh | 10:25 |
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| @preaction | and my gf wonders why i'm gaining weight... no time to do anything but sit here with a computer on my lap... | 10:26 |
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| * preaction stops whining | 10:26 |
| +Radix-wrk | I had a similar ordeal today | 10:26 |
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| @preaction | eventually, i mean | 10:26 |
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| @preaction | yum | 10:26 |
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| +Radix-wrk | assumptions are killers | 10:26 |
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| @preaction | one of those "I want to build an EMP so that every computer will die and we'll have to use tech manuals to build our technology back up to current level over a slow period of a few decades"? | 10:27 |
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| +Radix-wrk | heh | 10:28 |
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| +Radix-wrk | http://www.dslreports.com/forum/remark,18099897 | 10:28 |
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| +Radix-wrk | did I post that one in here? | 10:29 |
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| @preaction | not that i know of | 10:30 |
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| @preaction | 3 minutes into it and ... wow... | 10:32 |
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| +Radix-wrk | yeah | 10:33 |
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| @preaction | of course, all he had to do was say "hold the power button for 6 seconds" | 10:34 |
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| +Radix-wrk | personally I think both are idiots.. the dell tech was obviously following protocol by asking for his basic questions.. knowing that if he didn't get them up front the guy would hang up | 10:34 |
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| @preaction | i hate level 1 techs | 10:34 |
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| +Radix-wrk | that said, he could have told the guy this up front so the guy didn't go on and on | 10:35 |
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| +Radix-wrk | but obviously the second guy is an idiot also who just likes the sound of his own voice and likes to yell and abuse. | 10:35 |
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| @preaction | i dunno man, after an hour screwing around with those automated systems, i want to kill people too | 10:36 |
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| @preaction | that added to the "it's so simple I'm stupid for not figuring it out" embarassment of how to turn the thing Off | 10:37 |
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| @preaction | after the first bit of yelling, i'd deviate from script and say "hold the power button down for a few seconds" | 10:37 |
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| @preaction | and now i'm reading this thread and i'm wondering why more people do NOT yell at the tech support people... | 10:40 |
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| @preaction | their bosses seem to think that support is just a waste of money. a "120 second handle time", what if it's actually a real PROBLEM? | 10:40 |
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| +Radix-wrk | yup, which is why i said both are idiots | 10:44 |
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| @preaction | http://customerssuck.com <- some hilarity here | 10:53 |
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| @preaction | has anyone seen ubuntu's launchpad recently? https://launchpad.net | 11:55 |
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| @preaction | wonder if the new webgui.org site could do things as straightforward as this | 11:55 |
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| +Radix-wrk | it's very nice | 12:02 |
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| @preaction | screw that, it's amazing | 12:02 |
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| @preaction | RFE for built-in bug tracking to the project manager perhaps? | 12:03 |
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| @preaction | plainblack is just using a CS right now | 12:03 |
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| @preaction | built-in release tracking too maybe? mark bugs for certain releases and then the release can have a percentage done | 12:04 |
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| @preaction | mark RFEs as well, put them in the same system (being able to choose between "RFE", "Minor", "Major", "Critical" or "Fatal") | 12:08 |
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| +Radix-wrk | hehe.. I want to download it and install it on a server here to manage our own projects.. wish we could! | 12:21 |
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| +Radix-wrk | anyways.. hometime now.. adios | 12:21 |
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| @preaction | cya | 12:21 |
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| +Radix_ | I should prolly write this up in the wiki sometime I guess - http://www.plainblack.com/web_design_templates_and_themes/newbie-how-to-set-navigation-for-different-areas-of-the-site | 13:28 |
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| @preaction | snippets are cached, so the slowdown with assetproxy calls is minimal compared to the time it saves you. processor time is less expensive than programmer time (which i try to convince my bosses of every time they tell me to optimize before implementation) | 13:30 |
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| * preaction remembers that the channel is listening and there are logs... | 13:31 |
| @preaction | but yes, that would make a bully wiki article | 13:31 |
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| +Radix_ | "The awesome power of snippets and assetproxy - or how to make your site more dynamic than ever" | 13:33 |
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| +Radix_ | http://www.biggercheese.com/comics/0332.png | 13:49 |
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| @preaction | they h4x0r3d t3h g1b50n! | 13:50 |
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| ckotil | If you have a workflow w/ object type WebGUI::VersionTag , can you create a scheduled event to execute a workflow w/ object type WebGUI::User without getting errors? | 15:53 |
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| SDuensin | Good morning. | 15:58 |
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| @preaction | ckotil: iirc versiontag and user workflows don't work under the scheduler (since they require objects) | 15:58 |
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| ckotil | I see | 15:58 |
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| ckotil | that makes sense | 15:58 |
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| ckotil | Can I safely delete the workflow from the WorkflowInstance table? | 15:59 |
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| @preaction | maybe, maybe not | 16:01 |
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| @preaction | i personally haven't had any major problems removing things from the WorkflowInstance table, and you might want to go remove things from WorkflowInstanceScratch too, but ymmv | 16:02 |
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| ckotil | the bulk of the workflow ran fine, its just this last activity in the workflow that is getting hung up bc its a create scheduled event w/ WebGUI::User | 16:02 |
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| ckotil | yah. ive done it in the past, and nothing got screwed up | 16:03 |
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| ckotil | I had this workflow creating a scheduled event to send an email notifying users that there is a pending version tag needing to be approved | 16:05 |
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| ckotil | it just occured to me i can pull this off with this activity i have that lets me send an personilzed email message to any email address | 16:05 |
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| ckotil | i think i found a bad bug | 17:28 |
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| ckotil | w/ editing file assets. | 17:28 |
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| ckotil | when you click save, the file gets downlaoded and an warning is thrown | 17:29 |
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| ckotil | WARN - globalnoc.webgui.conf - main::[[undef]] - Couldn't call method editSave on asset for url: | 17:29 |
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| ckotil | Root cause: Can't call method "setPrivileges" on an undefined value at /gnoc/globalnoc/htdocs/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/File.pm line 251. | 17:29 |
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| @vayde | ugh | 17:29 |
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| ckotil | im about to revert to a backup | 17:30 |
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| ckotil | bc i have to be able to have users edit file assets | 17:30 |
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| @vayde | when did that start? | 17:30 |
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| ckotil | today | 17:30 |
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| @vayde | which version? | 17:30 |
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| ckotil | i upgraded yesterday | 17:30 |
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| ckotil | 7.3.13 | 17:31 |
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| @vayde | write it up so we have a record of it in the system, and I'll jump on it right away | 17:32 |
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| ckotil | submitting a post to the PB Support forum | 17:32 |
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| ckotil | http://www.plainblack.com/plain_black_support/wierd-behavior-when-editing-file-asset | 17:35 |
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| @rizen | why are you giving me that url? | 17:35 |
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| ckotil | habbit | 17:39 |
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| ckotil | sorry | 17:39 |
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| ckotil | thanks jt | 19:03 |
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| @rizen | np | 19:04 |
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| +perlDreamer | bunches and bunches of PB people today | 20:27 |
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| +perlDreamer | hello PB people! | 20:27 |
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| @preaction | hello perlDearest | 20:28 |
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| @rizen | preaction......your wording scares me sometimes | 20:55 |
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| @preaction | "wording"? | 20:55 |
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| @rizen | perlDearest | 20:55 |
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| @rizen | and i remember one time you saying something like "yes JT sweetums" or something like that to me | 20:56 |
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| @preaction | it's a good gauge of my mood: the more eloquent the speech, the more embarassed or ashamed or... oh, you're talking about THAT | 20:56 |
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| @preaction | that's just good ol fashioned fun! | 20:56 |
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| +MrHairgrease | what's wrong with that sweetums? | 20:56 |
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| @preaction | yeah, pookie-pie? | 20:56 |
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| * preaction might have just gone too far | 20:57 |
| +MrHairgrease | nah | 20:57 |
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| +MrHairgrease | you have to call jt my little p[onie for that | 20:57 |
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| +MrHairgrease | or | 20:57 |
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| @preaction | is that a reference to Plone? one of the Axis of Evil? | 20:57 |
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| +MrHairgrease | maybe carebear\ | 20:57 |
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| @rizen | i hate you guys | 20:58 |
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| +MrHairgrease | fyr! | 20:58 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i can't belive that you liked the bofh macro better than the l33tout | 20:58 |
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| @preaction | MrHairgrease: i wasn't able to get the l33tout to work :'( | 20:58 |
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| +MrHairgrease | what? | 20:59 |
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| +MrHairgrease | what went wrong | 20:59 |
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| @rizen | and l33tout is a remake, where bofh is brand new | 20:59 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i didn't say so in the rules | 20:59 |
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| +MrHairgrease | but then again | 20:59 |
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| @preaction | couldn't call method "get" on an undefined value at line something, i can dig it up hang on | 20:59 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i do not care that much | 20:59 |
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| +MrHairgrease | oh | 20:59 |
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| +MrHairgrease | weird | 20:59 |
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| @rizen | there's nothing saying you can't do a remake...just that i prefer new stuff to a remake | 21:00 |
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| +MrHairgrease | file a bug report =) | 21:00 |
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| +MrHairgrease | ok | 21:00 |
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| +MrHairgrease | fair enough | 21:00 |
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| @rizen | also...bofh gives you something new an hillarious everytime | 21:00 |
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| +MrHairgrease | try explain that to marijn | 21:00 |
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| +perlDreamer | so who is marijn? | 21:01 |
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| +perlDreamer | you were going to tell us about her last week but were suffering | 21:01 |
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| +perlDreamer | from EBC | 21:01 |
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| +MrHairgrease | a girl who like ultrahip eurothrash with sex appeal | 21:01 |
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| +perlDreamer | can she hack? | 21:01 |
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| +MrHairgrease | no | 21:01 |
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| +MrHairgrease | but she can drink | 21:01 |
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| +MrHairgrease | which is a virtue in itself | 21:01 |
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| +perlDreamer | 1/2 isn't bad! | 21:01 |
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| +MrHairgrease | right? | 21:01 |
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| @rizen | i'm not certain why she likes ultruhip eurotrash though | 21:02 |
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| @preaction | can she outdrink a german? | 21:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | it's the sex appeal | 21:02 |
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| @preaction | no, can she outdrink an Irishman? | 21:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | well, bring her to Wisconsin in October | 21:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | we'll teach her perl | 21:02 |
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| @preaction | we can test the german one then | 21:02 |
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| +MrHairgrease | ok pd | 21:03 |
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| +MrHairgrease | you get joeri to ay expenses for marijn | 21:03 |
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| +MrHairgrease | and i might bvring her | 21:03 |
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| +MrHairgrease | actually | 21:03 |
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| +perlDreamer | she's part of your staff | 21:03 |
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| +perlDreamer | required for travel | 21:03 |
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| +perlDreamer | it's not an option | 21:03 |
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| +MrHairgrease | there's a picture of her in the spot gooey section | 21:03 |
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| +MrHairgrease | no staff! | 21:03 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i don't have any staff | 21:04 |
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| +MrHairgrease | being a minion muself | 21:04 |
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| +perlDreamer | who is going to check your flights, handle appointments, speaking engagements and the autograph event? | 21:04 |
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| +MrHairgrease | joeri is | 21:04 |
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| +MrHairgrease | but he also pays my bills | 21:04 |
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| +MrHairgrease | oh | 21:04 |
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| +MrHairgrease | diners ready | 21:04 |
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| +perlDreamer | w00t! release. | 21:40 |
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| ckotil | hrm, i cant seem to recall wehre the code is that will prevent me from uploading an htm file. automatically turns it into a txt | 21:40 |
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| -!- rizen changed the topic of #webgui to: [ WebGUI 7.3.14 | WRE 0.7.2 ][ New Contest Open -- Acme Code Contribution -- Win $$$ and Karma (www.plainblack.com/wcc) ] | 21:40 |
| +perlDreamer | Storage.pm | 21:42 |
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| ckotil | thx p | 21:42 |
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| ckotil | d | 21:42 |
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| +perlDreamer | ckotil: btw, I haven't had a chance to look at your workflow bug. It may be a while, so if you'd like someone else to look at it it's fine by me. | 21:43 |
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| ckotil | no problem. | 21:44 |
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| ckotil | none of the bugs seem to be urgently requiring attention | 21:44 |
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| * SDuensin has been busy as crap today. | 22:28 |
| * pjesi has not slept for 37 hours | 22:31 |
| SDuensin | I slept, but I don't know if it did any good. | 22:35 |
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| * ckotil bites | 22:35 |
| ckotil | why? | 22:35 |
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| pjesi | three deadlines at noon | 22:44 |
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| ckotil | thats hardcore | 22:44 |
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| pjesi | yeah I should know | 22:45 |
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| SDuensin | Been there, done that. You can keep it. | 22:48 |
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| pjesi | I dont want to be rude and sit on it alone | 22:49 |
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| @vayde | Hey pD! Im in the club! I just broke a couple pb servers! | 22:57 |
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| * SDuensin cheers! | 22:57 |
| @vayde | well, I didn't totally break them, it was just a flesh wound... | 22:58 |
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| pjesi | Hinrik once did rm -r mysql in wre on a site launch day, that was a good day | 23:00 |
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| pjesi | :) | 23:00 |
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| Hinrik | yes | 23:00 |
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| @vayde | I'm still in the bush leagues I guess. I think I already fixed what I did. Hafta try harder next time I guess | 23:01 |
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| ckotil | heh | 23:04 |
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| +perlDreamer | how did you do it, vayde? | 23:38 |
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| +perlDreamer | share your pain.... | 23:38 |
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| @vayde | Oh, no biggie, really, I just screwed up how the CS mail handler works. | 23:38 |
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| @vayde | It should be fixed now, but of course, now that I'm waiting for the email to circulate, they are g o i n g v e r y s l o w l y | 23:39 |
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| +perlDreamer | that's a pretty good one. Broke all notifications and subscriptions for forums. | 23:39 |
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| +perlDreamer | that's at least a 7 | 23:39 |
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| @vayde | wow, and it only took 3 or 4 lines | 23:40 |
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| @vayde | gifted I guess | 23:40 |
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| @vayde | actually, come to think of it, I've been claiming my real talent to be in the field of destruction for years now | 23:41 |
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| +perlDreamer | analyze your enemies weaknesses and use them to defeat him? Or is that the wrong philosophy? | 23:42 |
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| @vayde | close. | 23:43 |
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| @vayde | Actually the art of war says that being invulnerable lies with you, but being vulnerable lies with the enemy | 23:43 |
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| @vayde | therefore great warriors made themselves invulnerable, and then awaited the moment when the enemy could be defeated | 23:43 |
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| @vayde | all I can really do is make myself invulnerable. | 23:43 |
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| @vayde | you are responsible for leaving an opening. all I do is use it when you present it | 23:44 |
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| --- Day changed Thu Apr 05 2007 |
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| +Radix_ | I love deadlines | 02:33 |
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| +Radix_ | I especially like the wooshing sound they make when they go past. | 02:33 |
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| nuba | Radix_: thats a classic line :) | 03:33 |
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| +crythias | hrm | 03:50 |
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| +crythias | ch-ch-ch-changes | 03:50 |
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| +crythias | Jesse! | 03:53 |
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| +crythias | Hiya, Radix-wek | 03:54 |
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| +crythias | erm. Radix-wrk | 03:54 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Hiya | 03:54 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Just got into the office :) | 03:54 |
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| +crythias | Ah. :) | 03:55 |
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| +Radix-wrk | last day of work before a nice long easter weekend :) | 03:55 |
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| +crythias | likewise | 03:55 |
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| +crythias | actually, I'll be taking off Thursday :) | 03:55 |
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| +crythias | So, Roy's gone, hmm? | 03:56 |
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| +Radix-wrk | gone? | 03:56 |
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| +crythias | Apparently, no longer staff @plainblack... | 03:57 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Ahh.. i see | 03:57 |
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| +crythias | CTS.. speaking of /topic... | 03:58 |
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| +crythias | http://crythias.blogspot.com/2007/04/from-picture-choose-color-scheme.html | 03:59 |
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| +Radix-wrk | cool idea | 04:00 |
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| -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-162-173.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI | 04:13 |
| -!- PedersenMJ [n=Pedersen@mail.icelus.biz] has joined #webgui | 04:23 |
| PedersenMJ | good evening | 04:24 |
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| SDuensin | Hey PedersenMJ | 04:25 |
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| PedersenMJ | How's it going? | 04:25 |
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| SDuensin | Other than I'm sick as a dog, not bad. :-) | 04:26 |
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| @preaction | that's not good | 04:26 |
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| @preaction | in fact, i would go so far as to call that abd | 04:27 |
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| PedersenMJ | Meh, I dunno. I've known some sick dogs, and more often than not, it just turns out they need some simple meds, and they're fine. | 04:28 |
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| PedersenMJ | Of course, the whole neutering thing sucks. | 04:28 |
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| @preaction | whoa, this conversation took a very bad turn | 04:28 |
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| SDuensin | hehehe | 04:29 |
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| PedersenMJ | Well, whatever you do, don't get sick as a dog. Lest somebody decide you should be neutered. | 04:30 |
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| +crythias | ugh | 04:30 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Umm.. yeah | 04:32 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Hi Ped | 04:32 |
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| -!- vayde [n=vayde@64-131-48-253.usfamily.net] has joined #webgui | 04:33 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+o vayde] by ChanServ | 04:33 |
| PedersenMJ | Hey, Radix. You're not that sick, are you? | 04:33 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I'm pretty sick.. but physically I'm just fine. | 04:33 |
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| @preaction | take them both out back and shoot them? | 04:33 |
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| PedersenMJ | Nah, that's for horses. | 04:34 |
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| @preaction | *sniff* they were the best devs a guy could want | 04:34 |
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| * SDuensin is, that's true. | 04:34 |
| SDuensin | :-P | 04:34 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I think you're all pretty sick. | 04:35 |
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| @vayde | wouldn't be here if we weren't | 04:36 |
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| PedersenMJ | Uh-uh. Definitely not sick. Not with chats of neutering and shooting going on. | 04:36 |
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| @vayde | or maybe, we wouldn't feel comfortable here if we weren't sick | 04:36 |
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| @vayde | Jeez, you guys have all the interesting chats after I log off | 04:36 |
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| +Radix-wrk | PedersenMJ, you're the only one obsessed with neutering I think ;) | 04:37 |
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| PedersenMJ | Hey, it was SDuension who said he was sick as a dog. | 04:37 |
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| @preaction | a simple figure of speech turns into a bloodbath of neutering and euthenasia | 04:38 |
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| +Radix-wrk | hence why I think you're all pretty sick.. in the head. ;) | 04:39 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Have you guys ever heard the term "fully sik"? | 04:39 |
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| @preaction | i've not not heard of it! | 04:40 |
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| @preaction | no wait. just regular not | 04:40 |
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| +Radix-wrk | It's an aussie slang used by greeks and lebanese over here to say something is pretty cool | 04:41 |
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| +Radix-wrk | ie. "That car is fully sick Habib!" | 04:41 |
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| +Radix-wrk | sick/sic/sik are used interchangeably in those sentences | 04:41 |
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| @preaction | it's west-coast slang in america, not very midwest yet | 04:42 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Became a big thing after the aussie show and movie "Fat Pizza" | 04:42 |
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| @preaction | nik's west-coast i think. come to think of it i don't know where nik lives | 04:42 |
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| @preaction | ... and fixing one bug reveals another... | 04:43 |
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| +Radix-wrk | So to be called "sick" has other connotations over here.. it can also mean very cool | 04:43 |
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| @vayde | Im midwest. Minneapolis. Sick here is just, sick. | 04:44 |
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| @preaction | vayde: wait, don't we have a staff get-together this weekend sometime? | 04:45 |
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| @vayde | week from friday | 04:45 |
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| @preaction | good. i thought i forgot. way too much stuff piling up | 04:46 |
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| @vayde | Friday the 13th actually. | 04:46 |
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| @vayde | fitting I thought | 04:46 |
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| @preaction | dear jeebus | 04:47 |
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| @preaction | i'll need to bring my garlic | 04:47 |
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| @preaction | does garlic work on you people? | 04:47 |
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| @vayde | nope, not crucifixes either. We're different sorts of terrible evil | 04:49 |
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| @vayde | you could try beer, or women. I confess to having a weakness for either. | 04:49 |
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| @vayde | they don't really ward off the evil, just keep it distracted for a while | 04:50 |
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| @preaction | how can i ward off evil with evil? more beer? | 04:55 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Just bring buffy along | 05:00 |
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| @preaction | but buffy is part of the "evil-that-is-greater-than-nik" | 05:01 |
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| @vayde | everything's better with more beer | 05:01 |
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| @vayde | and yes, please bring buffy | 05:01 |
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| @vayde | I like her kind of evil... | 05:02 |
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| @preaction | the pretty one or sarah michelle gellar? | 05:02 |
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| @vayde | the original please | 05:02 |
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| @vayde | speaking of that kind of evil, you guys are lucky, I have managed to persuade the GF that the 'staff get together' is just for staff | 05:04 |
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| @vayde | If you think meeting me is a shock, wait till you meet her. | 05:04 |
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| +Radix-wrk | You mean this buffy? - http://next-episode.net/babe-of-the-day/babe/470.html | 05:05 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Personally, I prefer the series | 05:05 |
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| @vayde | yeah, that's the one. | 05:06 |
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| @preaction | my gf's 5 foot nothing and about 120 lbs. i'm six-three, 190. our maturity levels are so different she could be my daughter if i weren't always pawing her. i doubt you can shock me :p | 05:06 |
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| @preaction | kristy swanson! that's her name | 05:06 |
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| +Radix-wrk | favourite episode was Hush - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hush_(Buffy_episode) | 05:06 |
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| @vayde | Ok, you thought that the Japanese-Swedish-Scot chinese martial artist who has delusions of being a developer was bad? | 05:06 |
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| @vayde | my gf's a costume designer for renaissance festivals, not to mention a slinky, redheaded, tatooed, ex dominatrix and stripper | 05:07 |
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| @preaction | i'm shocked | 05:07 |
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| @preaction | SHOCK AND AWE | 05:08 |
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| @vayde | I win | 05:08 |
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| +Radix-wrk | awesome | 05:08 |
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| @vayde | just another lure for the next WUC. I don't think you want to put it on the ads though | 05:08 |
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| +Radix-wrk | My gf sells drugs for a living - and makes a nice bit of money out of it. | 05:08 |
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| * SDuensin takes more of an interested in what vayde has to say | 05:09 |
| @vayde | heh, I don't know if I can top myself. | 05:10 |
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| SDuensin | Well, if your girl is the dominatrix, that makes you a bottom. :-P | 05:11 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I went out with a Madam once | 05:11 |
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| PedersenMJ | Hmm, lessee: Buy drugs from Radix's gf, or ogle vayde's gf. One legal, one not. One liable to get me punched by three people (vayde, vayde's gf, and my wife), one liable to get me thrown to the ground by large men in blue uniforms who will place me in a large building to stay with large men named Bubba. Tough choice. | 05:11 |
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| @vayde | lol | 05:11 |
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| @preaction | PedersenMJ: you'd survive the blue men. i'm not sure you'd survive vayde | 05:12 |
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| @vayde | naw, she stopped the dominatrix gig a while ago | 05:12 |
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| PedersenMJ | Survive the blue men? Sure. Dunno that I'd survive the Bubba's, though. | 05:12 |
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| @vayde | I pop the cores of heavy bags with punches. | 05:12 |
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| @preaction | webgui question: should different revisions to the same assetId under the same version tag create new revisions? or should an asset only get one revision per version tag? | 05:12 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Hmm.. interesting one | 05:13 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Currently it does new revisions | 05:13 |
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| @preaction | right, but i don't know why | 05:13 |
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| @preaction | i mean, when debugging javascript, i've got like 60 revisions of this template | 05:13 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Well if something is being edited multiple times before it's committed then you don't necessarily want to lose those changes | 05:14 |
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| @preaction | true | 05:14 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I think it should really combine all of the revisions done under a revision tag when it's actually committed tho | 05:14 |
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| @preaction | what if after its committed some higher power decides they want B (which was deleted when committed)? | 05:15 |
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| @preaction | seems to me the issue is all-or-nothing, and there's a better argument for all | 05:15 |
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| +Radix-wrk | they'd roll back to the revision prior to the latest commit | 05:15 |
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| @preaction | but the changes that made B are lost, A being the original, C being the new | 05:16 |
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| @preaction | if B and C were created under the same version tag | 05:16 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Oh I see what you mean | 05:16 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Yeah.. better argument for all then for those cases | 05:16 |
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| PedersenMJ | Too bad there's no good ui to allow the user to choose whether or not to collapse the changes. | 05:17 |
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| @preaction | you can delete revisions. perhaps a revision manager much like the asset manager? with a checkbox list so you can select multiple revisions to delete? | 05:19 |
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| -!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-209-62.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui | 05:48 |
| -!- mode/#webgui [+v perlDreamer] by ChanServ | 05:48 |
| +perlDreamer | crythias: How you doing, man? | 05:48 |
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| +perlDreamer | vayde: I got you test email. I forwarded it back to you with all headers for inspection. | 05:51 |
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| @vayde | cool. It turned out there WAS a server issue | 05:51 |
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| @vayde | I finally got all the test emails I sent out this afternoon. Boy my 'delete' key got tired | 05:52 |
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| +perlDreamer | especially after handling a room of "monsters" | 05:52 |
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| @vayde | Yeah, years ago we called them the 'baby class', but word got out, and they were offended. | 05:53 |
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| @vayde | then we started calling them the monsters, and word got out. they're proud of it | 05:53 |
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| +perlDreamer | it's amazing how labeling works | 05:55 |
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| @vayde | It's a fun class. 4~6 yr olds. Not the most technical class around mind you, but entertaining. | 05:56 |
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| @preaction | that's cute | 06:01 |
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| @preaction | almost as cute as kittens. | 06:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | preaction: maybe you'd like to go class and tell them that? | 06:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | I can see it now | 06:02 |
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| @preaction | and have them beat the crap out of me? my gf's 6-year old brother already does that, and he isn't being training in martial art | 06:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | vayde can fix that... | 06:03 |
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| @preaction | true, though i'm not sure what martial art vayde teaches | 06:03 |
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| +perlDreamer | W.A. | 06:03 |
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| @preaction | that means nothing to me :( | 06:03 |
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| +perlDreamer | it's a redneck term. Whoop Ass | 06:04 |
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| @vayde | Hsing-I, Bagua, Taiji, Northern Shaolin Longfist, and Southern Hung Gar | 06:04 |
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| @preaction | ah | 06:04 |
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| @preaction | and now i know as much as i did before ;) | 06:04 |
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| +perlDreamer | usually stored in cans, hence the phrase, "Open up a can of Whoop Ass on you" | 06:04 |
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| @vayde | I'll show you guys a bit of it when we're in person | 06:04 |
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| @preaction | i imagine there are better disciplines for different types of people? | 06:05 |
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| @vayde | It all comes down to physics and physiology. The difference between styles is largely a matter of approach and taste | 06:05 |
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| +perlDreamer | okay, needing a clue here. Why would one use $asset->getValue('assetProperty') instead of $asset->get('assetProperty')? | 06:05 |
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| @preaction | pd: i believe getValue has the added benefit of looking at the form first. at least, from the docs i read on it? | 06:07 |
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| @preaction | it sounded to me like you could use $asset->getValue() as the value of a form element in an asset edit form and it would automatically survive preview / edit errors | 06:07 |
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| +crythias | sorry for delay... perlDreamer. I'm fine. | 06:07 |
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| @preaction | of course, i've never used it as such | 06:07 |
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| +perlDreamer | preaction: I think the docs lie | 06:08 |
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| @preaction | i do too, because i didn't see anything referring to session->form | 06:08 |
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| +perlDreamer | pinging rizen. | 06:08 |
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| +perlDreamer | rizen, please report to IRC to beat your clueless volunteer dev | 06:08 |
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| -!- crythias is now known as cluelessnewb | 06:10 |
| +cluelessnewb | what's a webgui? izzat like a browser? | 06:10 |
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| +perlDreamer | naw | 06:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | preaction: getValue just looks like it dupes some of the code in new, for providing defaults from the definition sub. | 06:12 |
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| @preaction | perlbot be cluelessnewb | 06:13 |
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| perlbot | <cluelessnewb> How I can make teh web wit pearl?!?! | 06:13 |
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| +cluelessnewb | how do I get webgui off of me? | 06:13 |
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| +perlDreamer | cluelessnewb: lava soap and a camel hair brush | 06:13 |
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| +perlDreamer | either that, or wd40 | 06:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | it fixes everything | 06:14 |
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| +cluelessnewb | webgui sounds like something a spider shoots out of its butt. | 06:14 |
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| +cluelessnewb | can you imagine Spderman being more anatomically correct? | 06:15 |
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| @vayde | my gf thought the mascot should be cthlulu | 06:15 |
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| @preaction | omg gooey totally reminds me of a baby cthlulu | 06:15 |
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| @vayde | that's what she said too | 06:15 |
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| @vayde | that's alright though, remember, 'evil' spelled backwards is 'live' | 06:16 |
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| +cluelessnewb | and Maisey backwards is es I am | 06:17 |
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| +cluelessnewb | Yes I am | 06:17 |
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| @preaction | Naomi I moan | 06:17 |
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| @preaction | A toyota's a toyota | 06:17 |
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| @preaction | A dog! A panic in a pagoda! | 06:17 |
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| +cluelessnewb | A man a plan a canal. Panama. | 06:18 |
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| @vayde | If I could reach you, I would hurt you | 06:18 |
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| -!- cluelessnewb is now known as crythias | 06:18 |
| @preaction | i palindome i! | 06:19 |
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| @preaction | someday mother will die and i'll get the money | 06:19 |
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| +crythias | I can't believe it's not butter. | 06:20 |
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| @rizen | let the beating commence | 06:22 |
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| * PedersenMJ breaks out the popcorn. | 06:22 |
| +perlDreamer | greetings, sensei. Why does one use getValue vs get? | 06:22 |
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| @vayde | hajime! | 06:22 |
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| +Radix-wrk | !Ah Satan - Natasha! | 06:22 |
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| +crythias | Speaking of Cthulhu ... http://www.electric-escape.net/node/1425 | 06:22 |
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| @vayde | I got a button for christmas that said: "Jesus saves, Moses invests, Cthulu forcloses!" | 06:24 |
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| @rizen | get is the value stored in the db | 06:24 |
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| @rizen | getValue is a helper | 06:24 |
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| @rizen | it checks the value from form() first | 06:24 |
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| @rizen | $session->form->param() | 06:24 |
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| @rizen | then gets the value from the db | 06:24 |
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| @rizen | then gets the default | 06:24 |
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| @rizen | so basically, if the form value exists, it uses that | 06:25 |
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| +perlDreamer | the form->param part is missing from getValue | 06:25 |
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| @rizen | it is? | 06:25 |
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| +perlDreamer | yup | 06:25 |
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| @rizen | i wonder when it was removed | 06:25 |
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| +perlDreamer | before rev 1152 | 06:27 |
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| +Radix-wrk | http://www.sinfest.net/archive_page.php?comicID=2401 | 06:27 |
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| +perlDreamer | before rev 24 | 06:27 |
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| +perlDreamer | a very long time ago | 06:28 |
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| +perlDreamer | are the CVS archives still online? | 06:28 |
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| @rizen | hmmm...perhaps i removed it on purpose | 06:29 |
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| @rizen | if it's been gone that long | 06:29 |
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| @rizen | then it probably shouldn't be there | 06:29 |
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| @rizen | and i just don't remember it | 06:29 |
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| +perlDreamer | so the real difference is that get gives you values from the db, and getValue will give you values from the db OR defaults from the definition sub. | 06:30 |
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| @rizen | yup | 06:31 |
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| @rizen | we probably don't need getValue() anymore | 06:32 |
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| @rizen | we can probably change get() to do that | 06:32 |
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| @rizen | and then write getValue() out of existence in the 8.x series | 06:32 |
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| @rizen | but that's so far off, who cares | 06:32 |
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| +perlDreamer | or new could pull defaults out of the def sub | 06:32 |
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| +perlDreamer | then we could drop getValue and leave get as is | 06:33 |
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| @rizen | either or...but for now it stays as is | 06:33 |
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| @rizen | as i said, who cares | 06:33 |
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| @rizen | it's too far off to start thinking about 8.x now | 06:33 |
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| +perlDreamer | got it, chief | 06:33 |
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| +perlDreamer | I'll update the POD | 06:34 |
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| +perlDreamer | I'll send you a Beating IOU, for another time | 06:36 |
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| @rizen | bah...no need | 06:37 |
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| @rizen | i'll just take it out on sarah | 06:37 |
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| @rizen | =) | 06:37 |
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| +perlDreamer | oh dear | 06:37 |
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| +perlDreamer | oh, while you're here, care to confirm or deny the rumor of WebGUI-Microsoft connection? | 06:38 |
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| +Radix-wrk | heh | 06:39 |
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| @rizen | what have you heard | 06:39 |
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| @rizen | i will admit there have been talks | 06:39 |
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| +perlDreamer | well, it seems strange that several PB people would choose to move to the only city whose airport letters are MSN | 06:40 |
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| +perlDreamer | from there it was easy to connect the dots | 06:40 |
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| +perlDreamer | increased workload | 06:40 |
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| +perlDreamer | decreased productivity | 06:40 |
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| +perlDreamer | (everyone moved to using Microsoft desktops) | 06:40 |
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| @vayde | maybe you should hand over that IOU after all... | 06:41 |
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| @rizen | pd: you know why i hired vayde, right? | 06:41 |
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| @rizen | it's to conduct beatings on my behalf | 06:42 |
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| @rizen | all i can do is brute force the beatings | 06:42 |
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| +perlDreamer | He's a db expert | 06:42 |
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| +perlDreamer | (Designated Beater) | 06:42 |
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| @rizen | but he knows how to kill you in 6 different styles | 06:42 |
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| @vayde | I'm the complaint department | 06:42 |
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| +Radix-wrk | heh | 06:42 |
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| +Radix-wrk | heh.. PB Support board just hit 100000 views | 06:45 |
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| +Radix-wrk | http://www.plainblack.com/discuss | 06:46 |
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| @rizen | that seems very low | 06:46 |
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| +Radix-wrk | rizen: could you do me a favour and rate my rfe when you have a minute? | 06:47 |
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| +Radix-wrk | http://www.plainblack.com/rfe/request-for-enhancement/additional-post-template-variables-for-cs | 06:47 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Compared to the other forums it seems low, but obviously only support users can see the forum, so it's pretty impressive if you look at it that way | 06:49 |
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| @rizen | true | 06:50 |
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| @rizen | i don't like your RFE's radix | 06:50 |
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| +Radix-wrk | why? | 06:50 |
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| @rizen | mostly because they are written by you | 06:52 |
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| +Radix-wrk | :P | 06:52 |
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| @rizen | what if i told you that you can already do this | 06:53 |
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| +Radix-wrk | how? I'd love to know | 06:53 |
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| @rizen | and even moreso than that, it has far more power than what you're asking for | 06:53 |
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| +perlDreamer | "dumber than a box of rocks" rjacobsen is too funny | 06:54 |
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| @rizen | what is this information worth to you? | 06:54 |
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| @rizen | perhaps you will punch perlDreamer in the arm? | 06:54 |
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| +Radix-wrk | sure | 06:55 |
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| @rizen | hehe | 06:55 |
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| +perlDreamer | left arm please, I have to perform this weekend | 06:55 |
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| @vayde | ooh! ooh! pick me! | 06:55 |
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| @rizen | the answer you are looking for is ^-; | 06:55 |
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| @rizen | let's say you write an article^-; that looks like this | 06:56 |
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| @rizen | your synopsis will now be "let's say you write an article" | 06:56 |
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| @rizen | the ^-; special character tells webgui where you want to grab the synopsis from | 06:57 |
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| @rizen | so rather than taking after the first carriage return | 06:57 |
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| @rizen | it will stop at ^-; | 06:57 |
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| @rizen | wherever that is in the text | 06:57 |
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| @rizen | in addition to that | 06:57 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Ahh.. well there's a macro I never knew existed. You're right, that works a treat. | 06:57 |
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| @rizen | it's not a macro | 06:57 |
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| @rizen | it's just s special sequence of characters | 06:58 |
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| @rizen | anyway...in addition to that, you can actually go one step further | 06:58 |
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| @rizen | you can expose the synopsis field directly | 06:58 |
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| @rizen | then you can type something wholly new into the synopsis if you like | 06:58 |
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| @rizen | anyway...i'm going to go ahead and delete your RFE | 06:59 |
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| +Radix-wrk | k | 06:59 |
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| @rizen | because i would have rejected it anyway | 06:59 |
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| @rizen | adding variables like those to the collaboration system would have slowed it down tremendouslyy | 07:00 |
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| @rizen | go forth and share this knowledge | 07:01 |
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| @rizen | in the form of a wiki article | 07:01 |
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| +Radix-wrk | fair enough - preaction did mention that too - but he didn't tell me about ^-; | 07:01 |
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| @rizen | he probably didn't know about it | 07:01 |
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| +perlDreamer | It also works in the Article | 07:01 |
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| @rizen | true | 07:02 |
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| @rizen | most people don't even know that the article asset supports pagination | 07:02 |
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| +perlDreamer | most people don't read the docs, that's why | 07:03 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Happy to write a wiki article for it - though I don't follow the step further you described or how I would do any of that | 07:03 |
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| @rizen | it's actually already done for you | 07:03 |
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| @rizen | take a look at the "submission form" template vs the "post form" template | 07:03 |
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| @rizen | submission form sets up the synopsis as a separate field | 07:04 |
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| +perlDreamer | that's another good thing to mention. The marker only works if there is no explicit synopsis. | 07:06 |
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| +Radix-wrk | So is this documented anywhere currently? | 07:08 |
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| +perlDreamer | no | 07:08 |
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| +perlDreamer | it is now, but only in the template variables. | 07:11 |
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| +perlDreamer | We can't document it via hover help since there's no hover help for the Post Edit form. | 07:12 |
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| +perlDreamer | that's why a wiki article would be great | 07:12 |
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| +Radix-wrk | any ideas what the wiki article name should be called? | 07:13 |
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| +perlDreamer | rizen's righteous post content synopsis marker | 07:13 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I'll write one up now, and at least to describe how to use it in collaboration system posts | 07:13 |
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| PedersenMJ | post title: How To Add A Synopsis To Your Collaboration System Posts | 07:16 |
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| @rizen | hey pedersenmj | 07:16 |
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| @rizen | i've been meaning to talk to you | 07:16 |
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| PedersenMJ | Uh-oh... | 07:17 |
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| @rizen | one of our hosting customers just launched a new site | 07:17 |
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| @rizen | that i think you'll want to check out | 07:17 |
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| PedersenMJ | Done esta? | 07:17 |
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| @rizen | http://www.playstationnationpodcast.com/ | 07:17 |
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| PedersenMJ | Donde esta, even? | 07:17 |
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| +Radix-wrk | hehe.. cool | 07:17 |
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| +Radix-wrk | burned theme | 07:17 |
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| PedersenMJ | Too cool! | 07:17 |
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| PedersenMJ | That totally took me by surprise. Thank you :) | 07:18 |
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| @rizen | so see | 07:18 |
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| @rizen | your work paid off already | 07:18 |
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| @rizen | you should do more of those for the contest we have going on right now | 07:18 |
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| +Radix-wrk | needs to be original work tho | 07:18 |
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| PedersenMJ | I'm going to. Calypso is going to go up this week. I think MultiFlex next week. | 07:18 |
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| @rizen | nope | 07:18 |
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| @rizen | i had kristi change the rules | 07:19 |
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| PedersenMJ | Dunno which one for the week after, though. | 07:19 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Oh? | 07:19 |
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| @rizen | you can use open source designs | 07:19 |
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| @rizen | provided you provide a link back to the original | 07:19 |
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| @rizen | so we know you didn't rip it off | 07:19 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Oh cool.. means I could look at entering too then | 07:19 |
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| @rizen | sweet | 07:19 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I could never do my own.. but I can rip off someone elses witht he best of them ;) | 07:19 |
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| +perlDreamer | andreas01 | 07:20 |
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| PedersenMJ | Ditto here. I suck at original, but rip a theme? That's easy. | 07:20 |
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| @rizen | oh btw guys, i'll be sending out your schwag and whatnot next week for the wiki contest | 07:20 |
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| @rizen | i'm a little behind | 07:20 |
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| @rizen | sorry about that | 07:20 |
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| +Radix-wrk | np :) | 07:21 |
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| PedersenMJ | That's cool. | 07:21 |
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| @rizen | we're short two people, and i have another on vacation | 07:21 |
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| @rizen | so i'm working 4 jobs right now | 07:21 |
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| @rizen | =) | 07:21 |
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| PedersenMJ | If I'm really lucky, I can get a bit more outta the theme contest ;) | 07:21 |
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| @rizen | true | 07:21 |
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| @rizen | anyway...gotta get some sleep | 07:21 |
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| @rizen | later | 07:21 |
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| PedersenMJ | l8r | 07:22 |
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| +perlDreamer | he works too hard | 07:22 |
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| +perlDreamer | Bill should give him a raise | 07:22 |
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| @vayde | Bill? | 07:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | Gates | 07:24 |
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| @vayde | lol | 07:24 |
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| +Radix-wrk | http://www.plainblack.com/community-wiki/how-to-add-a-synopsis-to-your-collaboration-system-templates | 07:37 |
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| +perlDreamer | Radix-*, you rock | 07:39 |
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| +Radix-wrk | hopefully I've explained it well enough for ppl to understand | 07:39 |
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| PedersenMJ | Radix: What are post templates? | 07:44 |
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| PedersenMJ | http://www.bash.org/?21784 | 07:47 |
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| +Radix-wrk | http://www.plainblack.com/?op=viewHelp;hid=collaboration%20post%20list%20template%20variables;namespace=Asset_Collaboration | 07:50 |
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| +perlDreamer | having re-re-vanquished the monster, our hero exists stage left | 07:50 |
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| PedersenMJ | Damn, I didn't expect you to reply to that with anything other than a growl. | 07:51 |
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| @vayde | ugh, need sleep. Later gents | 07:52 |
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| @preaction | you people and your "sleep" | 07:53 |
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| @preaction | it's so cute | 07:53 |
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| +Radix-wrk | cya vayde | 07:53 |
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| PedersenMJ | I'm heading for sleep too. | 07:53 |
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| +Radix-wrk | wuss | 07:53 |
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| @preaction | is it bad that i do not remember the last time i slept? | 07:53 |
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| PedersenMJ | Yeah, I am. I start to pass out at 1am in a non-recoverable fashion. | 07:53 |
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| PedersenMJ | l8r all | 07:54 |
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| +Radix-wrk | sleep probs preaction? | 07:56 |
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| @preaction | so much to do, caffiene to do it, caffiene causes inability to sleep, then eventually it becomes "if i sleep now, i won't get up in time for *" | 07:56 |
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| @preaction | like now: in order to make the meeting tomorrow at 8a, i need to drop my car off at the shop tonight, walk home. meaning another hour of wake-time | 07:57 |
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| @preaction | meaning 6.5 hours of sleep | 07:57 |
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| +Radix-wrk | better than nothing | 07:57 |
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| @preaction | as JT said, we're working more than one person's job :p | 07:57 |
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| +Radix-wrk | He mentioned that you guys are down two people - roy is one obviously.. who was the other? | 07:58 |
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| @preaction | Drake | 08:00 |
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| @preaction | left before the new year | 08:00 |
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| +Radix-wrk | He was barely a blip on the radar really | 08:00 |
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| @preaction | durno, he was hired before i was. i think instead of me actually | 08:01 |
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| +Radix-wrk | he was hired around the same time the WUC was on.. I spoke to him briefly then and he was only just starting | 08:01 |
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| +Radix-wrk | So September to December - maybe two/three months.. | 08:02 |
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| @preaction | yeah, if it weren't for him, you'd've been meeting me ;) | 08:02 |
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| @preaction | 18 years old, i still can't believe it | 08:02 |
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| +Radix-wrk | eeks.. scary | 08:02 |
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| @preaction | i would've been meek kitten though, instead, when you meet me, i get to be power-webgui-god | 08:03 |
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| @preaction | i'll need a suit | 08:03 |
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| +Radix-wrk | heh | 08:03 |
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| @preaction | a white suit | 08:03 |
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| @preaction | white top hat and cane | 08:03 |
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| @preaction | unf | 08:03 |
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| +Radix-wrk | sounds like a photo op - with your gf dressed up next to ya ;) | 08:04 |
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| @preaction | pfft, i'll get my hos on my wings, boi | 08:05 |
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| @preaction | anyway, gone drop car off / sleep. cya | 08:13 |
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| wgGuest84 | hello | 11:20 |
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| wgGuest84 | i need some help on troubleshooting webgui 7.3.13 installation | 11:20 |
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| wgGuest84 | can I get help from somebody ? | 11:22 |
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| +Radix-wrk | wassup | 11:23 |
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| +Radix-wrk | can't guarantee i can help, but I can listen! :) | 11:23 |
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| wgGuest84 | thnx | 11:24 |
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| wgGuest84 | i installed webgui 7.3.13 | 11:24 |
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| wgGuest84 | and did all the setup | 11:24 |
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| wgGuest84 | when I try to run the apache + | 11:24 |
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| wgGuest84 | Starting WebGUI 7.3.13 | 11:25 |
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| wgGuest84 | Loading www.domain.com.conf | 11:25 |
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| wgGuest84 | WebGUI Started! | 11:25 |
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| wgGuest84 | usr/local/apache2/bin/apachectl: line 78: 5622 7d424e863057307e3057305f $HTTPD -k $ARGV | 11:25 |
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| wgGuest84 | and the server stops responding for a while | 11:25 |
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| wgGuest84 | i checked with # /data/WebGUI/sbin/perl preload.perl | 11:25 |
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| wgGuest84 | it shows: + | 11:25 |
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| wgGuest84 | Can't locate object method "server" via package "Apache2::ServerUtil" at preload.perl line 57.. | 11:26 |
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| wgGuest84 | i posted this trouble in forum (last message in http://www.plainblack.com/etcetera/cant-locate-object-method-server/3) | 11:26 |
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| wgGuest84 | can you please give me any idea ? | 11:27 |
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| wgGuest84 | r u listening Radix-wrk ? | 11:41 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Sorry.. was busy for a bit then.. lemme catch up. | 11:43 |
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| +Radix-wrk | How are you installing webgui? are you using the WRE? | 11:43 |
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| wgGuest84 | no | 11:44 |
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| wgGuest84 | from source | 11:44 |
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| wgGuest84 | in a centOS | 11:44 |
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| +Radix-wrk | okay.. have you checked your perl setup using /data/WebGUI/sbin/testEnvironment.pl | 11:44 |
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| wgGuest84 | yes.. | 11:44 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Sounds like a perl module is missing from the error message, but not sure what it would be I'm afraid. | 11:46 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Any particular reason you're not using the WRE? | 11:46 |
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| wgGuest84 | i checked.. Apache2::ServerUtil is there | 11:46 |
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| wgGuest84 | actually I am preparing a development server.. where there will be a lots of changes in source | 11:47 |
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| +Radix-wrk | WebGUI has a lot of perl dependencies, and the WRE is the recommended installation method for this very reason | 11:47 |
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| +Radix-wrk | there is a WRE installation for centos though, and it makes life soooo much easier | 11:48 |
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| +Radix-wrk | that's what we're using | 11:48 |
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| wgGuest84 | actually I used another previous version before | 11:48 |
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| wgGuest84 | 7.3... | 11:48 |
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| wgGuest84 | i installed from source that time.. | 11:49 |
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| wgGuest84 | but didnt face such problem | 11:49 |
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| wgGuest84 | it's a requirement anyway to install from the source | 11:49 |
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| wgGuest84 | i am stucked with this error from yesterday :( | 11:49 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I don't know I'm afraid.. it sounds like there's a missing perl module that isn't tested in testEnvironment, but not sure how to fix it offhand. | 11:50 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Most of the developers are asleep at the moment, preaction and rizen might be able to tell you what it is when they wake up. | 11:50 |
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| wgGuest84 | could u have a look in the details of my problem that i posted in the forum? | 11:51 |
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| +Radix-wrk | but that probably won't be for several hours - it's the middle of the night for them atm | 11:51 |
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| wgGuest84 | i c | 11:51 |
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| +Radix-wrk | yeah, I've had a look - I'm not that familiar with the source install and perl modules needed these days tho | 11:51 |
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| wgGuest84 | i c | 11:51 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I use Centos myself, but I installed the WRE for it | 11:51 |
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| +Radix-wrk | it is THE best way to install webgui - without a doubt | 11:51 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I can do a base install of webgui on centos within minutes | 11:52 |
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| +Radix-wrk | using the wre for rhel4 | 11:52 |
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| wgGuest84 | but since there is a source release.. that is of some use surely like we are using..:) | 11:52 |
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| wgGuest84 | in fact webGUI did great on our last project.. | 11:53 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Yeah, I haven't used a source install since version 6.8 tho | 11:53 |
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| wgGuest84 | so, what do u suggest as of now ? | 11:53 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I was having odd issues with perl modules on my previous setup and when i switched to the WRE they all went away - I've been with the WRE ever since | 11:53 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I'd highly recommend taking a look at the WRE if you can | 11:54 |
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| +Radix-wrk | if you must stick with a source install, I'd come back in say 5-6 hours and try and catch preaction or rizen | 11:54 |
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| wgGuest84 | is it like.. installing from WRE then I can use the source installation ? | 11:54 |
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| +Radix-wrk | the WRE gives you all of the perl source if that's what you mean | 11:55 |
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| +Radix-wrk | the WRE is a tar.gz file that contains everything you need to run WebGUI - all the perl modules, mysql, apache, etc all in one big file | 11:55 |
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| +Radix-wrk | well.. kinda.. it downloads the latest webgui source and installs that really | 11:56 |
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| +Radix-wrk | the WRE is everything you need to RUN webgui | 11:56 |
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| wgGuest84 | o..the team leader just solved the problem | 11:56 |
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| wgGuest84 | webGUI is now running fine | 11:56 |
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| +Radix-wrk | excellent | 11:56 |
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| +Radix-wrk | what was it then? | 11:56 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I'd still recommend the WRE. Using the wre simplifies upgrades and comes with fully preconfigured apache optimised for webgui. It also has some nice scripts to quickly add new webgui websites with ease | 11:58 |
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| +Radix-wrk | it also makes backing up and cloning a webgui setup so much easier - just copy one directory onto a blank system. | 11:59 |
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| wgGuest84 | sorry.. was talking to him | 11:59 |
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| +Radix-wrk | No probs | 11:59 |
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| wgGuest84 | actually he changed some settings in apache-> httpd.conf | 11:59 |
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| wgGuest84 | he added user "daemon" and Group "daemon" | 11:59 |
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| wgGuest84 | probably its the spectre who needs those | 12:00 |
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| +Radix-wrk | wierd.. didn't sound like that was where the problem was to me.. but if it fixed it who am I to argue! :) | 12:00 |
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| wgGuest84 | :) | 12:00 |
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| wgGuest84 | yeah.. the error message was misleading | 12:01 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I'm afraid I'm gonna head off.. 5pm here (and 6pm for you I suspect) - have a good easter! :) | 12:01 |
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| wgGuest84 | o..thanks | 12:01 |
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| wgGuest84 | it ws nice talking to u | 12:01 |
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| +Radix-wrk | Do itashimashite! | 12:01 |
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| wgGuest84 | wow !! | 12:01 |
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| wgGuest84 | u know japanese | 12:01 |
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| wgGuest84 | btw... where r u ? | 12:01 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I know a little | 12:02 |
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| +Radix-wrk | from Perth, Western Australia | 12:02 |
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| wgGuest84 | i c | 12:02 |
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| wgGuest84 | one question if u dont mind | 12:02 |
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| +Radix-wrk | I've been to tokyo though and know a lot of japanese :) | 12:02 |
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| wgGuest84 | how can i join this irc channel from visual iRC | 12:02 |
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| wgGuest84 | ( that's cool :) ) | 12:02 |
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| +Radix-wrk | jump on the server irc.freenode.net I think and the channel is #webgui | 12:02 |
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| wgGuest84 | i couldnt find irc.freenode.net.. actually I am not much used to use IRC | 12:03 |
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| +Radix-wrk | try using something like /server irc.freenode.net and it should get you here | 12:03 |
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| +Radix-wrk | then /join #webgui | 12:03 |
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| wgGuest84 | o...i will try.. | 12:03 |
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| wgGuest84 | thanks a lot for ur help | 12:04 |
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| +Radix-wrk | no probs.. hope to see you here more often in future! | 12:04 |
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| wgGuest84 | i hope too :) | 12:04 |
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| +Radix-wrk | lots of useful and interesting stuff gets discussed here, so worthwhile dropping in and idling like I do :) | 12:04 |
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| wgGuest84 | that's good.. i would like to do that.. | 12:04 |
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| +Radix-wrk | ja ne! | 12:04 |
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| wgGuest84 | arigatou-gozaimasu | 12:05 |
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| syedm | nick sstanvir | 13:08 |
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| -!- syedm is now known as sstanvir | 13:09 |
| +Radix_ | Home! :) | 13:09 |
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| sstanvir | good :) | 13:10 |
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| sstanvir | so.. that ws ur work nick Radix_wrk ? | 13:10 |
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| +Radix_ | yup | 13:10 |
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| sstanvir | i ws also thinking so | 13:10 |
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| sstanvir | mystery is my problem came back again :( | 13:11 |
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| +Radix_ | what do the apache logs say? | 13:12 |
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| +Radix_ | and what is in webgui.log | 13:12 |
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| +Radix_ | perlbot paste | 13:12 |
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| perlbot | Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl or http://erxz.com/pb and #perl will be able to view it. | 13:12 |
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| sstanvir | in the apache log nothing | 13:12 |
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| +Radix_ | You can paste the info using one of those instead of spamming it to the channel | 13:12 |
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| sstanvir | i c, ok | 13:13 |
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| sstanvir | thnx for the info | 13:13 |
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| +Radix_ | np | 13:13 |
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| sstanvir | but I dont want to disturb u with the issues | 13:13 |
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| sstanvir | otsukare-sama-desu :) | 13:13 |
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| +Radix_ | With your dev box.. do you have anything else on it? | 13:14 |
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| +Radix_ | or is it set up just for webgui? | 13:14 |
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| sstanvir | its newly setup | 13:15 |
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| +Radix_ | If it's just for webgui, then there's absolutely no reason not to use the WRE | 13:15 |
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| +Radix_ | you can install the wre and webgui within minutes on a blank centos box | 13:15 |
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| sstanvir | actuallly what is the difference between the WRE and the source release ? | 13:15 |
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| +Radix_ | the WRE is everything you need to run WebGUI - so it's a special distribution of apache/mysql/perl and all the perl modules webgui depends on. It also includes scripts to help you get started quickly with Webgui. | 13:16 |
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| +Radix_ | It doesn't actually include webgui itself - it downloads that as part of the setup | 13:17 |
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| sstanvir | i c | 13:17 |
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| sstanvir | brb | 13:18 |
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| +Radix_ | with centos I generally do a basic install, no mysql, apache, perl, etc at all installed | 13:20 |
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| +Radix_ | then you install the wre and run the setup | 13:20 |
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| sstanvir | understood | 13:20 |
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| sstanvir | actually it depends on the team leader.. I will try to convince him | 13:21 |
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| +Radix_ | the only gotcha I've found is you need to make sure you delete any /etc/my.cnf files that might be there | 13:21 |
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| +Radix_ | I might point out that the WRE is the recommended method for using webgui according to plainblack - and the best way to get support also | 13:22 |
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| +Radix_ | there's info in the wiki on doing an install too | 13:22 |
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| sstanvir | yes.. i checked the web | 13:23 |
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| sstanvir | it looks simple to install from the wre.. | 13:24 |
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| +Radix_ | it is.. it's great :) | 13:25 |
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| sstanvir | you already convinced me | 13:25 |
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| +Radix_ | good.. my job is done here then ;) | 13:25 |
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| sstanvir | haha | 13:25 |
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| sstanvir | but now is the toughest part to convince the Tl | 13:26 |
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| sstanvir | anyway... | 13:26 |
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| sstanvir | thanks a lot for ur time | 13:26 |
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| +Radix_ | Good luck! :) | 13:26 |
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| +Radix_ | time for me to get supplies for the easter long weekend here :) | 13:26 |
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| +Radix_ | four days holiday have just started for me :) | 13:26 |
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| sstanvir | wow! | 13:26 |
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| sstanvir | i am sure u have lots of plans | 13:27 |
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| +Radix_ | got a friend's wedding to attend, and looks like we might be doing some archery and some karaoke this weekend too.. should be fun! :) | 13:27 |
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| sstanvir | great | 13:27 |
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| sstanvir | Have a nice holidays !! | 13:27 |
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| sstanvir | Catch you again! | 13:28 |
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| sstanvir | bye | 13:29 |
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| nuba | nice holidays folks! | 15:04 |
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| SDuensin | Good morningish. | 18:20 |
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| perlmonkey2 | quiet today | 20:51 |
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| +perlDreamer | muy | 20:51 |
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| perlmonkey2 | webgui religious holiday? | 20:51 |
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| +perlDreamer | how goes the Moose rewrite? | 20:51 |
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| perlmonkey2 | heh | 20:51 |
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| perlmonkey2 | I think I'll focus my extra time on p6. | 20:51 |
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| +perlDreamer | I did some p6 test suite hacking for a few weeks | 20:52 |
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| +perlDreamer | then the spec changed from under me | 20:52 |
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| +perlDreamer | so I worked around it | 20:52 |
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| +perlDreamer | then it changed again, and I gave up | 20:52 |
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| perlmonkey2 | a very fluid dev env. | 20:52 |
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| +perlDreamer | it is | 20:53 |
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| +perlDreamer | which allows for very powerful dynamics | 20:53 |
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| +perlDreamer | but also exposes you to lots of criticism from outside observers | 20:53 |
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| perlmonkey2 | I only take criticism from Perl::Critic. | 20:54 |
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| perlmonkey2 | or anyone else who bothers to tell me my work is crap ;) | 20:54 |
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| @vayde | We need a wG forum/nick translation hash. | 21:10 |
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| +perlDreamer | can gooeybot help us? | 21:13 |
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| +perlDreamer | or perlbot? | 21:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | perlbot: rizen? | 21:14 |
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| +perlDreamer | perlbot: perlDreamer? | 21:16 |
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| -!- MrHairgreas1 [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui | 21:22 |
| @vayde | :q | 21:24 |
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| @vayde | oops, wrong window ;P | 21:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | Never quit, never surrender | 21:25 |
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| @vayde | that file couldn't handle any more attention from me | 21:25 |
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| @vayde | the wimp | 21:25 |
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| ckotil | perlbot channel log | 22:12 |
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| @rizen | perlbot: perlbot? | 22:14 |
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| perlbot | Perl OO tricks and examples - http://perldoc.perl.org/perlbot.html | 22:14 |
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| ckotil | perlbot: log | 22:15 |
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| ckotil | perlbot: log? | 22:15 |
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| ckotil | bah, perlbot isnt playing nice | 22:16 |
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| @rizen | perlbot, rizen is JT, the creator of WebGUI, aka TMRFE | 22:16 |
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| perlbot | added rizen to the database | 22:16 |
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| @rizen | perlbot: rizen? | 22:16 |
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| perlbot | JT, the creator of WebGUI, aka TMRFE | 22:16 |
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| @rizen | perlbot, perlDreamer is Colin Kuskie, Contributor of the Year, and jack of all trades | 22:16 |
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| perlbot | added perlDreamer to the database | 22:16 |
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| @rizen | how's that for your pd? | 22:17 |
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| @rizen | perlbot, vayde Nik Ogura, aka bengchoi, aka Nik, is a WebGUI padawan learner | 22:18 |
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| perlbot | added vayde Nik Ogura, aka bengchoi, aka Nik, to the database | 22:18 |
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| @rizen | perlbot vayde? | 22:19 |
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| @rizen | perlbot forget vayde Nik Ogura, aka bengchoi, aka Nik, | 22:19 |
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| perlbot | removed vayde Nik Ogura, aka bengchoi, aka Nik, from the database | 22:19 |
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| @rizen | perlbot, vayde is Nik Ogura, aka bengchoi, aka Nik, is a WebGUI padawan learner | 22:19 |
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| perlbot | added vayde to the database | 22:19 |
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| MrHairgreas1 | perlbot TMRFE? | 22:21 |
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| perlbot | The Man Responsible For Everything -- Sometimes you DO have someone to blame. | 22:21 |
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| MrHairgreas1 | perlbot pomade? | 22:22 |
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| MrHairgreas1 | perlbot MrHairgrease | 22:22 |
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| MrHairgreas1 | perlbot MrHairgrease? | 22:22 |
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| @vayde | Jeez, I pop off for a bite, and everyone's talking about me behind my back | 22:25 |
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| @rizen | perlbot, MrHairGrease is Martin Kamerbeek, aka MrCookingGrease, aka Eurotrash with sex appeal, and is a Contributor of the Year | 22:33 |
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| perlbot | added MrHairGrease to the database | 22:33 |
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| -!- MrHairgreas1 is now known as MrHairgrease | 22:34 |
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| +MrHairgrease | perlbot maxscience? | 22:35 |
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| +MrHairgrease | perlbot iPhoneGuy? | 22:35 |
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| -!- Hinrik [n=hinrik@dsl-228-236.hive.is] has joined #webgui | 22:35 |
| +MrHairgrease | ha well, ignorance is bliss i think | 22:35 |
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| @rizen | perlbot, maxscience is iPhoneGuy, some ridiculous bastard from Italy that bitches as loud as he can scream, but is unwilling to lift a finger to help out | 22:37 |
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| perlbot | added maxscience to the database | 22:37 |
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| @vayde | sounds like there's quite a story there | 22:38 |
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| @preaction | what's the WebGUI::Commerce::Item->handler sub for? is it executed after the item is purchased? | 22:38 |
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| @preaction | after checkout, say? | 22:38 |
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| @rizen | dont' know...i'd have to track it down in the code | 22:39 |
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| @rizen | perhaps MrHairGrease knows | 22:39 |
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| @preaction | the docs for the sub say "this executes the handler". no real description of its actual purpose | 22:39 |
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| +MrHairgrease | the handler is executed on payment | 22:45 |
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| +MrHairgrease | it handles the group timeout extension for subscriptions for instance | 22:46 |
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| @preaction | when the transaction is completed, i see now | 22:47 |
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| +MrHairgrease | yeah | 22:47 |
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| +MrHairgrease | and also on complete recurring payments | 22:47 |
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| @preaction | which means technically there's no cart at that moment, correct? | 22:47 |
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| +MrHairgrease | yes | 22:48 |
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| +MrHairgrease | well | 22:48 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i would think so | 22:48 |
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| +MrHairgrease | it has been some time since i last looked at it | 22:48 |
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| @preaction | the idea is this: i need the ID of the cart that the item belonged to | 22:49 |
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| +MrHairgrease | carts don't don't have an id | 22:49 |
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| +MrHairgrease | a cart i tied to a session | 22:49 |
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| +MrHairgrease | maybe you mean the transaction id? | 22:49 |
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| @preaction | then how do carts survive across sessions? | 22:49 |
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| +MrHairgrease | they don't | 22:50 |
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| @preaction | how can i logout and log back in and still have items in my cart? | 22:50 |
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| +MrHairgrease | oh | 22:50 |
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| +MrHairgrease | let me see | 22:50 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i know | 22:51 |
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| +MrHairgrease | if you log out | 22:51 |
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| +MrHairgrease | your session id stays the same | 22:51 |
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| +MrHairgrease | but visiutor is tied to it | 22:51 |
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| +MrHairgrease | yeah | 22:52 |
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| +MrHairgrease | that must be it | 22:52 |
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| +MrHairgrease | WG::C::ShoppingCart->new doesn't have any userId awareness | 22:53 |
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| +MrHairgrease | only sessionId | 22:53 |
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| @vayde | Is there an easy way to tell when a modification was placed into the core? Right now I'm doing it the hard way, but downloading the old version, untarring it and looking at the file. We're all way to lazy to put up with that b.s. for long | 22:57 |
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| @preaction | svn blame | 22:58 |
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| @preaction | gives you the revision number of lines of the code iirc | 22:58 |
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| @vayde | thanks | 22:59 |
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| @vayde | Ok, now having found the right svn version, how do I relate that to an actual release? (I'm very new to svn) | 23:02 |
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| @preaction | http://svn.webgui.org <- look up the messages around the revision, the first one that says "X.X.X released" is the version it was in | 23:11 |
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| @vayde | ahh. little things that make all the difference. thanks | 23:11 |
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| @vayde | Wow, JT asked me about the picture of me on my studio website, so I sent him an older one, his reaction was so violent that it crashed both my IRC client, and Gaim. | 23:32 |
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| @vayde | Now that's some bad-assed kung fu! | 23:32 |
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| +MrHairgrease | show it! show it! | 23:33 |
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| @vayde | um, how do I do that here? It's not online | 23:33 |
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| +MrHairgrease | oh | 23:34 |
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| +perlDreamer | post it on PB.com in the contribs area? | 23:34 |
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| @preaction | >_> <_> <_< | 23:34 |
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| +perlDreamer | email it out? | 23:34 |
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| @preaction | ^(--@^@--)> | 23:34 |
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| @preaction | youtube! | 23:34 |
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| @preaction | show us the monsters! | 23:34 |
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| +MrHairgrease | http://www.themonsters.ch | 23:34 |
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| +MrHairgrease | tomorrow I'm gonna see them play in utrecht | 23:35 |
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| @preaction | nice | 23:36 |
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| +perlDreamer | they suck. Their website uses frames. | 23:37 |
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| +MrHairgrease | who cares | 23:38 |
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| +MrHairgrease | I'm not going all the way to utrecht just to watch their stupid website =) | 23:38 |
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| @vayde | http://www.uma-mn.com/Pics/Rennaissance.JPG | 23:38 |
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| @vayde | that's about 12 - 15 yrs old | 23:39 |
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| @vayde | 12-15 years ago anyway | 23:39 |
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| @vayde | http://www.uma-mn.com/Pics/img_2672.jpg | 23:39 |
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| @vayde | that's last year | 23:39 |
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| * MrHairgrease 's gaim is about to implode | 23:39 |
| +MrHairgrease | what is it? | 23:40 |
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| +MrHairgrease | some kind of medieval reenaction? | 23:40 |
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| @vayde | the thing next to the girl is me | 23:40 |
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| +MrHairgrease | didn't know you ware red dresses | 23:41 |
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| @vayde | heh | 23:41 |
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| +MrHairgrease | there's that eurotrash humor for you =) | 23:41 |
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| +MrHairgrease | don't even try to laugh | 23:41 |
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| @vayde | I sincerely you don't have girls over there with as much facial hair as I have. | 23:43 |
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| +MrHairgrease | who can what's what with all these costumes | 23:44 |
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| +MrHairgrease | can tell* | 23:44 |
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| @vayde | what can I say, that's how the gf makes a living, working up those court gowns | 23:44 |
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| +MrHairgrease | ok | 23:46 |
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| +MrHairgrease | but i can imagine jt's reaction | 23:47 |
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| @vayde | he brought it up | 23:48 |
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| SDuensin | Dang vayde - looked at your pics. Now I want to go to Pennsic again. | 23:50 |
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| @vayde | Pennsic? | 23:50 |
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| * SDuensin smacks his head | 23:51 |
| SDuensin | Only the largest SCA event ever. | 23:51 |
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| @vayde | Ahh. | 23:51 |
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| SDuensin | http://www.pennsic.net/ | 23:51 |
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| @vayde | I had bad experiences with the SVA crowd. I hope they're better these days | 23:51 |
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| SDuensin | Probably depends on the group. I've never had problems myself. Now some other groups, that's a different story. | 23:52 |
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| @vayde | One incident when I was berated for my heraldic design from a guy who was wearing a metal watch, photogrey glasses, and had his armor held together with duct tape | 23:52 |
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| SDuensin | hehehehe | 23:52 |
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| SDuensin | You'd have been proud of me. Some chick with frickin' skull and crossbones tights and elf ears wandered into our camp. I chased her off with Yard Guard. | 23:58 |
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| @vayde | LOL | 23:59 |
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| SDuensin | "We're gypsies!" No, you're morons. | 23:59 |
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| --- Day changed Fri Apr 06 2007 |
| SDuensin | I'm no authenticity police, but man, come on - at least try. Elf ears?! | 00:00 |
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| * SDuensin doesn't mind the Coke can at feast. | 00:00 |
| @vayde | I have fun. The gf's daughter is 16, and very popular with the lads. I get to growl and stomp. "Hi there you must be the new vict- er boyfriend" | 00:01 |
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| SDuensin | ehhehe | 00:01 |
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| +perlDreamer | maybe they'd like to come to the 5-year old class to help out? | 00:26 |
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| +perlDreamer | They're only five years old, after all... | 00:27 |
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| @rizen | i need some opinions | 00:32 |
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| @rizen | who's got em to spare? | 00:32 |
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| +MrHairgrease | sure | 00:32 |
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| +perlDreamer | yo | 00:32 |
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| @rizen | http://jt.plainblack.com/uploads/DZ/Hu/DZHuIEGTBk7z_HU-JOW-iw/Webgui-site-rev4.jpg | 00:32 |
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| +MrHairgrease | positive or negative? | 00:32 |
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| @rizen | honest | 00:32 |
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| +MrHairgrease | you suck =) | 00:33 |
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| @rizen | this is the potential design for the new webgui.org | 00:33 |
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| @rizen | split off from plainblack.com | 00:33 |
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| @rizen | i'm pretty happy with it | 00:33 |
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| @rizen | but before we proceed, i'd like a few gut reactions | 00:33 |
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| +perlDreamer | not bad for a front page | 00:33 |
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| +MrHairgrease | the design is good | 00:34 |
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| +MrHairgrease | but i don't like the yellow | 00:34 |
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| +perlDreamer | what does real front page look like (the one that analogs pb.com/support)? | 00:34 |
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| @rizen | pd, this isn't about content | 00:34 |
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| @rizen | this is about style | 00:34 |
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| +MrHairgrease | what is good | 00:34 |
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| +MrHairgrease | at least i guess | 00:34 |
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| +MrHairgrease | is that is does not have the generic-clean-look that mambo and joomla etc have | 00:35 |
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| +MrHairgrease | it kinda makes it stand out | 00:35 |
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| +MrHairgrease | otoh those 'clean' layouts have a more professional touch | 00:35 |
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| +MrHairgrease | sober like the tax department | 00:36 |
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| +MrHairgrease | also | 00:37 |
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| @rizen | i think it looks clean, it's just not sparse like those | 00:37 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i don't like the blue webgui logo | 00:37 |
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| @rizen | the logo is orange like always | 00:37 |
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| +MrHairgrease | left of that | 00:37 |
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| @rizen | or do you mean the font that says "webgui" | 00:37 |
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| +MrHairgrease | yeah | 00:37 |
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| +MrHairgrease | the font is just not my thing | 00:37 |
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| @rizen | ok, it's one thing to say that you don't like the colors (yellow background, blue font), but i need to know why | 00:38 |
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| +MrHairgrease | it has this 90's a have website appeal | 00:38 |
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| @rizen | without the why, i can't change it to something good | 00:38 |
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| +MrHairgrease | ok | 00:38 |
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| +MrHairgrease | let me think on how to word that | 00:38 |
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| @rizen | so you also don't like the modern font? | 00:38 |
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| @rizen | in addition to the color? | 00:38 |
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| +MrHairgrease | yes | 00:40 |
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| +MrHairgrease | and it's background | 00:40 |
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| +MrHairgrease | it just doesn't fit in with the rest | 00:40 |
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| @vayde | I think the yellow draws the attention away from the content. It should frame it, point it up, not overwhelm it | 00:40 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i guess why i don't like the color is | 00:40 |
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| +MrHairgrease | b/c their 'weak' | 00:41 |
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| +perlDreamer | it needs more content area | 00:41 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i know the dutch word | 00:41 |
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| +MrHairgrease | but i dunno the translation | 00:41 |
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| @vayde | more content area, yeah. content seems buried | 00:41 |
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| +MrHairgrease | no | 00:41 |
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| +MrHairgrease | little content on the frontpage is good | 00:41 |
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| +MrHairgrease | people will only read two lines or so | 00:41 |
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| +perlDreamer | but rizen said this is "the style" | 00:41 |
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| +perlDreamer | are sub-page style different rizen? | 00:42 |
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| @vayde | right, but that's what we're talking about | 00:42 |
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| +MrHairgrease | the download button is good | 00:42 |
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| +MrHairgrease | very visible | 00:42 |
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| @vayde | not necessarily what the content is, but the balance between the content area and the stuff on the left seems visually off. | 00:42 |
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| +perlDreamer | the links to the forums and wiki needs to be as visible | 00:43 |
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| @rizen | the design you're looking at is the front page design, but all the other pages will be a variation on a theme | 00:44 |
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| @rizen | for example | 00:44 |
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| +MrHairgrease | yeah, but that's those three buttons below the content right? | 00:44 |
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| +perlDreamer | if so, then I'm happy | 00:44 |
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| @rizen | the banner for the webgui conference is will not be on every page, that's only to show off an example crown | 00:44 |
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| @rizen | on most content pages, the content section will be pushed up | 00:45 |
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| +MrHairgrease | what i mean by colors and visibility is eg. the firebug page | 00:45 |
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| +MrHairgrease | http://www.getfirebug.com/ | 00:45 |
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| +MrHairgrease | strong colors | 00:45 |
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| @rizen | also the page will be stretchy, it won't be limited to the width you're seeing it at now | 00:45 |
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| +MrHairgrease | big content that says what the stuff does | 00:45 |
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| @rizen | so there will be plenty of room for content | 00:45 |
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| +MrHairgrease | and a big install me button | 00:45 |
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| +perlDreamer | Let me roll up my opinion. I like it. It's bright and different without looking bad. Links to wiki and forum need to be prominent and content areas should be maximized . | 00:45 |
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| @rizen | on the pages that need it the yellow strip on the right side will be stretched out, and the "recent discussion" macro will go in there | 00:46 |
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| @rizen | MrHairGrease, I could also argue that the colors of the firebug site are weak | 00:47 |
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| @rizen | mustard yellow is not a weak color | 00:47 |
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| @rizen | it's not like canary yellow | 00:47 |
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| +MrHairgrease | you asked my my opinion | 00:47 |
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| +perlDreamer | how does Gooey look on there? does he clash? | 00:47 |
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| +MrHairgrease | that's one of the few things that is not negotiable with me =) | 00:47 |
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| @rizen | i know...and i'm not trying to say that your opinion is wrong, just that i don't agree that the colors are weak | 00:48 |
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| +MrHairgrease | what i mean with weak is their too pastel for my tastes | 00:48 |
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| @rizen | gooey looks great | 00:48 |
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| @rizen | gooey is pastel you moron | 00:48 |
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| @rizen | =) | 00:48 |
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| +MrHairgrease | never said i liked gooey too =) | 00:48 |
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| +perlDreamer | watch out, them's fighting words! | 00:49 |
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| +perlDreamer | insulting a project's mascot is like making a website in baby-puke yellow | 00:49 |
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| +MrHairgrease | never had any children | 00:49 |
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| @rizen | purple and yellow are great colors together...that's part of the reason we chose yellow as the background color here | 00:49 |
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| +MrHairgrease | wouldn't know what that looks like | 00:49 |
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| @rizen | purple and yellow are the colors of royalty | 00:49 |
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| +MrHairgrease | ha | 00:50 |
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| +perlDreamer | trust me on this one, MHG. Given the bilious nature of stomach acid, it's baby-puke yellow. | 00:50 |
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| +MrHairgrease | the only royalty i care for is royaly sized drinks | 00:50 |
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| @vayde | not to mention the colors of the MN Vikings | 00:50 |
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| +MrHairgrease | pd: thanks for the tip | 00:50 |
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| +perlDreamer | But this is Wisconsin.....? | 00:50 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i'll put children on hold for even longer =) | 00:50 |
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| * SDuensin still doesn't like the yellow. | 00:51 |
| @rizen | webgui is bigger than wisconsin | 00:51 |
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| +perlDreamer | MrHairGrease, if you weaken and need a refresher, we can take care of you. | 00:51 |
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| +MrHairgrease | pd thanks | 00:51 |
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| @rizen | SDuensin...is it because you don't like yellow as a color, or the particular yellows that we've chosen? | 00:51 |
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| +MrHairgrease | nice to be able to count on people | 00:51 |
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| +MrHairgrease | rizen, with weak is meant pale | 00:52 |
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| +MrHairgrease | that's the word i was looking for | 00:52 |
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| SDuensin | I just don't care for it as the base color on a web site. | 00:52 |
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| @rizen | so your bias is against yellow in general then | 00:53 |
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| @rizen | not specifically the colors we've chosen | 00:53 |
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| SDuensin | Yea | 00:53 |
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| @rizen | ok...quick poll...who here won't like this design no matter what variety of yellow we put on it? | 00:55 |
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| +MrHairgrease | it's not really my taste | 00:56 |
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| SDuensin | Design is fine with me. The font on the lozenges is a bit hard to read. | 00:56 |
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| @vayde | the lozenge font is hard to read | 00:57 |
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| @rizen | we'll be using a different font on the lozenge when we go out, cuz i can't read it either | 00:57 |
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| @vayde | the Z's could be taken for an attempt at a lower case L | 00:57 |
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| +MrHairgrease | it's the same font as the webgui image | 00:58 |
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| +MrHairgrease | next to the logo | 00:58 |
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| @rizen | yeah, but big you can read it. small you can't | 00:58 |
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| @rizen | some fonts are just like that | 00:58 |
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| @vayde | It's cool, it just takes a couple more seconds to decipher | 00:58 |
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| +MrHairgrease | vayde don't you worry about that photo you sent jt | 01:23 |
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| +MrHairgrease | check this out: | 01:23 |
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| +MrHairgrease | http://jt.plainblack.com/uploads/ph/Wv/phWv1xzJkxfxxHor9fVVew/jt_face.jpg | 01:23 |
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| @rizen | that's a beautiful face | 01:24 |
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| +perlDreamer | it's the face of death! | 01:25 |
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| +perlDreamer | or at least badly hungover | 01:25 |
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| @rizen | this is an even better close-up, you can really see the detail in the eyes | 01:25 |
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| @rizen | http://www.bownds.net/uploads/xW/WS/xWWS5RE23tXxpVwiFQbtkg/jteyes-small.jpg | 01:25 |
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| @preaction | remind me to never do anything to annoy JT again | 01:26 |
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| +perlDreamer | don't call him sweetie, preaction | 01:26 |
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| @preaction | checkaroonie | 01:26 |
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| +perlDreamer | it makes his eyeballs spin in the other direction | 01:26 |
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| @rizen | oooh...and the hand tatoo http://www.bownds.net/uploads/xW/WS/xWWS5RE23tXxpVwiFQbtkg/jt_side.jpg | 01:26 |
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| +MrHairgrease | perlbot carebare is the ever cuddly rizen | 01:26 |
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| perlbot | added carebare to the database | 01:26 |
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| @preaction | rizen: LARP? | 01:26 |
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| @rizen | nope...halloween 2002 | 01:27 |
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| @preaction | ah | 01:27 |
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| +perlDreamer | perlbot: LARP? | 01:27 |
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| +MrHairgrease | ha | 01:27 |
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| +perlDreamer | Los Angeles Riot Police? | 01:27 |
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| @rizen | a little less scary in 2004: http://www.bownds.net/uploads/nW/GU/nWGUUFrr4y5NA-9ko6xt4w/jt_and_sarah_as_fred_and_wilma.jpg | 01:27 |
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| @preaction | perlbot LARP is Live-Action Role Playing -- One of the last vestiges of the uber-geek. | 01:27 |
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| perlbot | added LARP to the database | 01:27 |
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| +MrHairgrease | the 2nd image does remind me of something | 01:27 |
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| @rizen | what jt would look like if he were dutch: http://www.bownds.net/uploads/K-/K4/K-K4NLygFyXYXeTJNUru3Q/PICT1224.JPG | 01:29 |
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| @preaction | rizen: so I have this fix for the EMS / gama problem. What should I do with existing shopping carts / sessions that will create problems (since they don't have matching entries in the new table)? should i just delete them? expire the session perhaps? or just leave a note in the gotchas? | 01:29 |
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| +MrHairgrease | oh man | 01:30 |
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| +MrHairgrease | i really need wooden shoes now | 01:30 |
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| @vayde | dear sweet god! | 01:30 |
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| @rizen | leave a note in the gotchas | 01:30 |
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| @preaction | k | 01:30 |
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| @rizen | and write some sort of an sql report that we can give to gama | 01:30 |
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| @rizen | so they can sort out the mess | 01:30 |
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| +MrHairgrease | ewww | 01:32 |
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| +MrHairgrease | never new ryan could be so gross | 01:32 |
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| +MrHairgrease | http://jt.plainblack.com/uploads/R3/yz/R3yzI23c8d_3a9gGj9Msmg/ryan_kristi.jpg | 01:32 |
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| +MrHairgrease | anyway | 01:37 |
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| +MrHairgrease | time for those sweet dreams | 01:37 |
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| -!- MrHairgrease [n=martin@x032124.its-s.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui [] | 01:44 |
| -!- perlmonkey2 [n=perlmonk@casr-dev.fwsm2ppuser.ou.edu] has left #webgui [] | 01:50 |
| @preaction | rizen: should i go ahead and install the fix for gama? or will they have to wait for 7.3.15? there's an upgrade script, so i'd think wait, but the upgrade script will still work if it just happens to be run multiple times (create table if not exists) | 02:22 |
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| -!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat054.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"] | 02:23 |
| @rizen | if it will still work | 02:25 |
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| @rizen | then install it now | 02:25 |
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| @preaction | k | 02:25 |
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| @rizen | be sure to backup their database before installing | 02:25 |
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| @preaction | will do | 02:25 |
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| SDuensin | Muhahahaha - got WebGUI 7.3.14 running on my host. So easy! | 03:49 |
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| SDuensin | Used the RHLE4 WRE. My host is running CentOS4. Works like a champ. | 03:54 |
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| @preaction | woohoo! | 04:04 |
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| @preaction | i'm starting to understand the Event Management System. and i feel dirty | 04:06 |
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| SDuensin | hehehe | 04:07 |
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| * SDuensin feels guilty for not hosting with PB. | 04:07 |
| @preaction | why? it's good to get more spread for webgui | 04:08 |
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| @preaction | of course, why CentOS? why not ubuntu or debian? | 04:08 |
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| SDuensin | That's what my host uses. I have a "virtual private server". Full root access to do whatever I want. $60 a month. Not bad at all. | 04:09 |
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| @preaction | not bad indeed | 04:09 |
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| SDuensin | Think it's safe to move a MySQL database by copying the files instead of doing a dump/reload? | 04:11 |
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| @preaction | no | 04:11 |
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| SDuensin | :-) | 04:12 |
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| @preaction | unless the server is shut down | 04:12 |
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| @preaction | then ... good luck | 04:12 |
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| SDuensin | That was my gut feeling. | 04:12 |
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| * SDuensin has to move a mess of WebGUI sites to the new host. | 04:12 |
| @preaction | make a remote login to one of the mysql servers, then it's as simple as: | 04:12 |
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| @preaction | mysqldump -hhost1 <db1> | mysql -hhost2 <db2> | 04:13 |
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| SDuensin | Yea. I used to do that to back up databases on a point of sale system I wrote. | 04:13 |
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| @preaction | and then: scp -r host1:/data/domains host2:/data | 04:13 |
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| @preaction | shell programming is fun | 04:14 |
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| SDuensin | :-) | 04:14 |
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| @rizen | you should feel dirty for touching the ems, but not for understanding it | 04:14 |
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| @vayde | So, no problems with wG on a virtual private server? | 04:31 |
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| -!- PedersenMJ [n=Pedersen@mail.icelus.biz] has joined #webgui | 04:33 |
| PedersenMJ | hey all | 04:33 |
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| @vayde | rizen, does a 'virtual private server' entail any special conditions for wG? | 04:35 |
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| SDuensin | Nope, vayde. I simply turned off the existing Apache and loaded the WRE. | 04:35 |
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| -!- sstanvir [n=Tanvir@s208148.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #webgui | 04:35 |
| @vayde | cool. I had my old ISP asking for details about it. | 04:35 |
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| @rizen | nope. no special conditions | 04:36 |
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| @rizen | but you'll need a hell of a lot of ram in the physical server | 04:36 |
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| @rizen | because each VPS will need at least 512 to make webgui run | 04:36 |
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| @rizen | and it better be a multiprocessor box as well | 04:36 |
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| SDuensin | It is. :-) | 04:37 |
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| SDuensin | Could have more RAM, but I can get more later: http://www.liquidweb.com/shared/plan4.htm | 04:37 |
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| sstanvir | hello | 04:39 |
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| sstanvir | I need some help | 04:39 |
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| @rizen | very cool sd | 04:39 |
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| @rizen | we'd like to offer vps, but it's just not worth it financially to us. you have to sell a lot of them to make it worth while | 04:40 |
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| @rizen | plus we can't offer it cheap enough | 04:40 |
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| @rizen | what sort of help sstanvir? | 04:40 |
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| SDuensin | Yea. Like I said, I feel bad for not using PB, but I can't beat that price. (And I can't afford PB.) | 04:40 |
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| sstanvir | thnx for reply | 04:40 |
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| @vayde | I know a guy locally that will do it for $25/month. Not sure what the hardware or details are though | 04:41 |
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| sstanvir | i posted the details here+ | 04:41 |
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| sstanvir | http://www.plainblack.com/install/upgrade_help/fresh-installation-of-webgui-7.3.13?layout=nested#idlOK_myX1AqKV_SeSmHWhZw | 04:41 |
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| sstanvir | and here + | 04:41 |
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| sstanvir | http://www.plainblack.com/etcetera/cant-locate-object-method-server/2/re-cant-locate-object-method-server | 04:41 |
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| sstanvir | (the last message) | 04:41 |
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| sstanvir | i guess both relates to same problem.. may be due to perl installation ... | 04:42 |
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| PedersenMJ | sstanvir: Hang on, I run Debian unstable/testing at home, and have it working. That's a missing package. Lemme get the list. | 04:43 |
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| PedersenMJ | gooeybot pastebin | 04:44 |
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| sstanvir | ok | 04:44 |
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| PedersenMJ | Dang, need a pastebin site, and can never remember where they are. | 04:44 |
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| PedersenMJ | perlbot tell me about pastebin | 04:44 |
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| sstanvir | (FYI: i am installing in a CentOS) | 04:44 |
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| @rizen | perlbot paste? | 04:45 |
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| perlbot | Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl or http://erxz.com/pb and #perl will be able to view it. | 04:45 |
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| SDuensin | I just installed WebGUI on CentOS 4 using the RHLE4 WRE. Worked like a champ. | 04:45 |
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| sstanvir | but I am installing from the source.. and I have to install from the source | 04:45 |
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| PedersenMJ | http://sial.org/pbot/24040 | 04:45 |
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| @rizen | what are the results of the following commands: | 04:46 |
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| @rizen | which perl | 04:46 |
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| @rizen | perl -v | 04:46 |
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| SDuensin | You have to? Why? | 04:46 |
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| sstanvir | which perl -? /usr/local/bin/perl | 04:46 |
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| sstanvir | perl -v - > This is perl, v5.8.8 built for i686-linux .... | 04:47 |
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| sstanvir | SDuensin is asking the reason for installing from source? well.. actually I am preparing a development server for a project | 04:48 |
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| sstanvir | and most vital reason is..it's the order from the management to install from the source :( | 04:48 |
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| SDuensin | Oh yea. Very familiar with that reason. | 04:49 |
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| PedersenMJ | Hmmm... Couldn't you do that by downloading the WRE source file, and compile that? | 04:49 |
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| sstanvir | actually I can't argue with that.. there are lots of policies.. or reasons | 04:50 |
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| sstanvir | and obviously there is some reason to release webgui source.. right ? | 04:50 |
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| PedersenMJ | Wait, I didn't read *your* part of the post, sstanvir: Your problem is more basic than that. Unless you *are* running www.domain.com | 04:50 |
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| PedersenMJ | spectre.conf - POE::Kernel::_dispatch_event[1012] - ADMIN: Couldn't connect to WebGUI site www.domain.com.conf | 04:51 |
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| sstanvir | ok..please read the post. if u have some time | 04:51 |
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| PedersenMJ | I did. I think. | 04:51 |
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| sstanvir | ok | 04:51 |
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| sstanvir | as per my knowledge I installed all the modules | 04:52 |
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| sstanvir | but perl preloade.perl says.. can't find Apache2::ServerUtil-> server | 04:52 |
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| PedersenMJ | Where did you install WebGUI to? /data/WebGUI ? | 04:52 |
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| sstanvir | right | 04:52 |
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| PedersenMJ | ls /data/WebGUI/etc/*.conf | 04:53 |
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| sstanvir | well: + | 04:53 |
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| sstanvir | log.conf spectre.conf www.domain.com.conf | 04:54 |
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| PedersenMJ | Okay: Are you the webhost for domain.com ? | 04:54 |
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| sstanvir | you mean DNS ? | 04:55 |
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| PedersenMJ | No, I mean: Are you running the computer that will serve the pages if I point my browser to http://www.domain.com/ | 04:55 |
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| sstanvir | we are just using a name for development.. moreover it's machine that doesn't even have a real IP | 04:56 |
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| PedersenMJ | That's fine. But, unless I'm mistaken (and about to get a smackdown for it) spectre (a very critical piece of webgui) must be able to connect to what it *thinks* is a real domain. | 04:57 |
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| @preaction | you can use /etc/hosts to point spectre in the right direction | 04:57 |
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| @preaction | but don't use "domain.com", use "example.com", which is actually set aside by the ICANN for use in things like this | 04:57 |
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| @preaction | or just use "localhost" | 04:57 |
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| PedersenMJ | Yes, perfect suggestion. I was thinking I was going to need to find a good dns tutorial :) | 04:57 |
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| sstanvir | actually instead of domain we used some name [domain].com | 04:58 |
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| @preaction | mais oui | 04:59 |
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| sstanvir | i also did the installation of webgui before with webgui7... some version.. | 04:59 |
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| sstanvir | that time there was no such problem | 04:59 |
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| sstanvir | so.. what r u suggesting.. | 04:59 |
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| sstanvir | i have to have the same name in /etc/host as the www.domain.com.conf _ | 05:00 |
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| sstanvir | ? | 05:00 |
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| PedersenMJ | Spectre is relatively new. I don't know which version started requiring it, but it was in the 7.x series. I think it was 7.2. | 05:00 |
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| @preaction | your server has to know what it is, right? | 05:00 |
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| @preaction | 6.99 started spectre | 05:00 |
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| @preaction | which was the beta for 7.0 | 05:00 |
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| sstanvir | (i installed 7.3.5 or 7.3.6 i guess before) | 05:01 |
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| PedersenMJ | 7.3.5 is a version that I *know* required spectre in order to operate properly. | 05:01 |
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| sstanvir | i know.. because I read about spectre and prepared some documents for office internal use on the configuration issues | 05:02 |
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| sstanvir | i found there are two different directory structure for perl in the server: | 05:04 |
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| sstanvir | one is in /usr/local/lib/perl5 | 05:04 |
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| @rizen | yeah, if you're using perl out of /usr/local | 05:04 |
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| PedersenMJ | BTW, sstanvir: I just ran "perl preload.perl" from the command line, and got the same issue (unable to locate method server), even though WebGUI runs fine. | 05:04 |
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| @rizen | then you also have one in /usr/bin | 05:04 |
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| sstanvir | other is /usr/lib/perl5 | 05:05 |
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| @rizen | are you using the apache that came with centos? | 05:05 |
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| sstanvir | i installed separately ..2.0.59 | 05:05 |
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| @rizen | and you told that new apache specifically where your new perl is? | 05:05 |
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| sstanvir | yes..u mean in httpd.conf? | 05:05 |
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| @rizen | no..i mean at compile time | 05:05 |
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| @rizen | when you compiled modperl | 05:06 |
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| @rizen | you had to tell it which perl to use | 05:06 |
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| @rizen | if you didn't do that, then it's probably using the /usr/bin version | 05:06 |
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| @rizen | rather than /usr/local | 05:06 |
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| sstanvir | i did one thing.. i linked the /usr/bin/perl to /usr/local/bin/perl | 05:06 |
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| @rizen | in addition, since you compiled your own apache, you have to download and install libapreq2 from the apache site | 05:06 |
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| @rizen | and compile that manually | 05:06 |
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| sstanvir | yes.. i did that too | 05:06 |
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| @rizen | don't know what to tell you then. sounds like you did everything right | 05:07 |
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| PedersenMJ | sst: What do you you linked /usr/bin/perl to /usr/local/bin/perl? | 05:07 |
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| sstanvir | sorry PedersenMJ...can u pls repeat the que | 05:08 |
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| @rizen | does "management" ever acutally log in to the server? if not, just use the WRE. wre-0.7.2-rhel4 was compiled on CentOS 4 | 05:08 |
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| @rizen | you'll save yourself piles and piles of headache | 05:08 |
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| PedersenMJ | sst: What do you mean when you say you "linked the /usr/bin/perl to /usr/local/bin/perl" ? | 05:09 |
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| sstanvir | thnx rizen.. but my team leader is strict to install from the source | 05:09 |
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| sstanvir | i mean.. there was one /usr/bin/perl.. i guess from some previous installation | 05:09 |
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| sstanvir | after I install perl-5.8.8 , i found /usr/local/bin/perl | 05:09 |
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| @rizen | and going back to the reason that we release as source...it's not so "management" can say install from source. it's so people that don't use the OS's we compile for can build for their own distro | 05:09 |
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| sstanvir | understood rizen | 05:10 |
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| PedersenMJ | So, sst: What did you do to make this link happen? | 05:10 |
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| sstanvir | and pedersen.. to make sure that when i execute perl | 05:10 |
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| sstanvir | it invokes the latest installation.. i linked the old binary to the new one | 05:10 |
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| @rizen | here's an idea if you're absolutely unwilling/unable to use the WRE...what you could do is download the WRE source tarball, and look at build.sh that comes with it | 05:10 |
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| @rizen | that will give you step by step instructions on the commands you need to use to compile successfully | 05:11 |
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| PedersenMJ | What command(s) did you use to link the old binary to the new one? | 05:11 |
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| sstanvir | ln -s | 05:11 |
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| sstanvir | now /usr/bin/ shows : perl -> /usr/local/bin/perl | 05:12 |
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| @rizen | hey peeps...the first new book is out | 05:12 |
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| @rizen | http://www.lulu.com/content/779723 | 05:12 |
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| SDuensin | Books!? | 05:12 |
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| @rizen | and the b/w edition http://www.lulu.com/content/780007 | 05:12 |
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| SDuensin | BOOKS! | 05:12 |
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| SDuensin | WHOO! | 05:12 |
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| PedersenMJ | Ah, so instead of running "ln -s" you ran "ln -s /usr/local/bin/perl /usr/bin/perl". That's what I was trying to ascertain. | 05:12 |
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| sstanvir | yeah | 05:13 |
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| sstanvir | comeon.. i am not much of an expert.. but i am not that stupid ;) | 05:13 |
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| PedersenMJ | Ooof. $100 is a tough price for me to pay right now. But I would love to get it. | 05:14 |
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| PedersenMJ | sst: You could have done a number of different things when you say that you linked the two. I wanted to know which of the items on the list you had done, so I could provide ideas on where to look next to resolve any problems. | 05:18 |
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| PedersenMJ | Even saying you had done "ln -s" *still* left open quite a few possibilities, ranging from the simple ln command above, to a backwards version of it, to having written a script that would loop over everything under /usr/local, looking for perl files, and symlinking them back into the main /usr/lib/perl area to make sure you didn't accidentally use the one from /usr/local. | 05:19 |
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| sstanvir | hmm | 05:21 |
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| sstanvir | what if i just remove the /usr/bin/perl | 05:21 |
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| @preaction | sstanvir: probably a Very Bad Idea (tm) | 05:22 |
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| PedersenMJ | A very real possibility for your issues right now is that your compilation of mod_perl for Apache picked up the include files under /usr/include, instead of the ones from /usr/local (assuming that they are there). Now, you run perl from /usr/local, and things look good there, but Apache (and mod_perl) don't see the same version you do, because they're not running the same code. | 05:22 |
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| sstanvir | i c | 05:23 |
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| sstanvir | yeah.. that could happen | 05:23 |
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| -!- vayde [n=vayde@209.134.142.196] has quit [Remote closed the connection] | 05:24 |
| PedersenMJ | So, go with what rizen suggested: Download the WRE, follow the steps in build.sh. After that, make sure that your machine sees the hostname you expect Spectre to see, and thinks that that hostname points to itself (for instance, have "127.0.0.1 www.domain.com" in /etc/hosts | 05:25 |
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| sstanvir | considering the possibility that u mentioned about apache and mod_perl | 05:26 |
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| sstanvir | what if I compile those again ? | 05:27 |
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| PedersenMJ | Well, wre contains Apache, mod_perl, and everything else. If you follow the full set of steps in build.sh, you'll be rebuilding them anyway. | 05:27 |
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| sstanvir | understood | 05:28 |
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| sstanvir | but I thought as of now ..just to try compiling apache.. mod_perl .. | 05:28 |
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| PedersenMJ | Go for it. Worst thing that could happen is that you accidentally do rm -rf / and have to rebuild the server :) | 05:30 |
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| sstanvir | :) | 05:30 |
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| sstanvir | btw.. when I installed apache2, | 05:31 |
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| sstanvir | i did this: ./configure --with-z=/usr/local/lib | 05:31 |
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| PedersenMJ | Since I don't know apache2 compile time options off the top of my head, I'll have to go with "Cool. Glad for you. Hope it helped." | 05:33 |
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| sstanvir | :) | 05:33 |
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| sstanvir | oh man... | 05:33 |
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| sstanvir | rizen told me one thing.. when to install mod_perl , during compile time i have to specify which perl to use | 05:33 |
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| sstanvir | how to do that? | 05:34 |
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| PedersenMJ | Probably has to do with some of those apache2 compile time options that I've not memorized, but which would be listed/used in build.sh to ensure that the correct perl is used for the WRE. | 05:34 |
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| sstanvir | okey :( | 05:35 |
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| sstanvir | the world is leading me to WRE.. but the team leader is against the world | 05:35 |
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| SDuensin | I know the feeling, sstanvir. | 05:36 |
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| * SDuensin quit the job he had that was like that. | 05:36 |
| PedersenMJ | No, the world is leading you to the absolute ultimate answer for your questions: How to build from source. Since WRE does it, and does it automatically, there's code that automates the process. And that means you can read the code and duplicate the results. | 05:37 |
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| @preaction | specifically: wre/sbin/build.sh | 05:37 |
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| @preaction | sstanvir: if you insist on installing mod_perl from cpan, make sure you use the right Perl instance | 05:38 |
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| sstanvir | i downloaded the mod_perl-2.0.3 | 05:38 |
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| @preaction | why not just use cpan? | 05:39 |
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| sstanvir | well.. that can work as well | 05:39 |
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| sstanvir | but how to make sure to use the right perl instance | 05:40 |
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| @preaction | it will install it into the Perl that you're using cpan with | 05:40 |
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| sstanvir | i have /usr/bin/cpan and /usr/local/bin/cpan | 05:41 |
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| sstanvir | if i invoke perl -MCPAN -e shell | 05:42 |
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| sstanvir | it should use the right one? | 05:42 |
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| @preaction | depends on the answer to `which perl` | 05:43 |
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| @preaction | which one is the Right one? | 05:43 |
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| sstanvir | which perl is /usr/local/bin/perl | 05:43 |
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| sstanvir | this is the right one | 05:43 |
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| @preaction | so "perl" will run "/usr/local/bin/perl", and "cpan" will probably run /usr/local/bin/cpan (you can verify with 'which cpan') | 05:44 |
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| @preaction | cpan for that perl will install modules for that perl | 05:44 |
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| sstanvir | yes | 05:45 |
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| sstanvir | mod_perl is in Bundle::Apache2 right? do u know the specific name of the module | 05:46 |
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| @preaction | do a search for Bundle::Apache2 | 05:50 |
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| @preaction | or just Apache2 | 05:50 |
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| sstanvir | ok | 05:52 |
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| sstanvir | anyway.. thanks a lot for your help and time preaction, PedersenMJ, rizen, SDuensin.... | 05:53 |
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| sstanvir | you guys are really nice.. | 05:53 |
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| sstanvir | so.. I will continue the battle.. and get back to u later with results.. | 05:54 |
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| sstanvir | wish me luck | 05:54 |
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| sstanvir | bfn | 05:54 |
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| @rizen | good luck | 05:54 |
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| PedersenMJ | lots of luck to you. | 05:55 |
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| @rizen | is there anything better than warm bread right out of the oven | 05:57 |
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| @rizen | drizzled with a little melty butter | 05:57 |
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| @rizen | methinks not | 05:57 |
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| @rizen | just made a loaf of bread | 05:57 |
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| @rizen | so good | 05:58 |
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| SDuensin | Aaahhaahhhhh....fresh bread! | 05:58 |
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| PedersenMJ | Ah, maybe add some small amounts of honey to the butter. Not necessary, but can make a nice touch. | 05:58 |
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| PedersenMJ | Fresh bread is the best, though, butter or no :) | 05:59 |
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| @rizen | pedersenmj...the b/w version is only $75 | 05:59 |
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| @rizen | and the book is almost 400 pages | 05:59 |
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| @rizen | lots of stuff in there | 05:59 |
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| @rizen | hmmm...will have to try the honey | 05:59 |
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| @rizen | haven't tried that one | 05:59 |
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| SDuensin | I'll need to make a bit more hosting money and then pick that book up. | 05:59 |
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| @rizen | not that i'm asking you to buy the book | 05:59 |
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| PedersenMJ | I know. $75 comes into range for me. And *believe* me, I don't doubt the value. Just more than I can do at this point. Although... I've got some cash coming my way soon ... ;) | 06:00 |
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| @rizen | indeed | 06:00 |
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| @rizen | if you prefer i can take it out of the money i'm sending you | 06:00 |
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| @rizen | and send you the book | 06:00 |
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| * SDuensin wants to support PB and wG. | 06:00 |
| PedersenMJ | What the hell. Yeah, I like that idea. | 06:01 |
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| @rizen | ok, which version would you like? | 06:01 |
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| PedersenMJ | Judgment call: Does the color add value to the contents? Or is the book totally fine without it? | 06:02 |
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| PedersenMJ | And: Does it affect how much plainblack gets? | 06:03 |
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| PedersenMJ | Better answer: Screw it, go for the color. Might as well, eh? | 06:03 |
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| @rizen | plain black makes far more on the b/w version | 06:03 |
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| @rizen | but the color one is cooler | 06:03 |
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| @rizen | cuz the screenshots are more legible in color | 06:04 |
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| PedersenMJ | Damn, now I'm torn between the two. Legibility matters, but so does supporting pb. | 06:05 |
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| PedersenMJ | I might be showing this to other people. Color will make them happier with the product. Color it should be. | 06:06 |
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| @rizen | don't worry about supporting us | 06:07 |
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| @rizen | go with the one you want | 06:07 |
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| @rizen | color it is | 06:07 |
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| PedersenMJ | Cool. Those two books should be a *very* lovely jump off point for me. I've got just enough knowledge to go in and muck about, and maybe get what I want. Having more information is always a good thing. | 06:09 |
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| @rizen | two books? | 06:10 |
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| PedersenMJ | WebGUI Primer as well. | 06:11 |
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| @rizen | oh right | 06:11 |
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| @rizen | from the contest | 06:11 |
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| @rizen | you'll probably just end up giving the primer away | 06:12 |
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| PedersenMJ | Exactly. Enough reading material to keep me occupied for a while. | 06:12 |
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| PedersenMJ | Eventually, yeah. But I do intend to at least leaf through it first. And see afterwards who it should go to. | 06:12 |
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| @rizen | everything covered in the primer is also covered in the cm guide...just in a hell of a lot more detail | 06:12 |
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| @rizen | look at it this way | 06:12 |
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| @rizen | the books that we are building now (starting with the CM guide) | 06:12 |
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| @rizen | are for the webgui professionals, like yourself | 06:13 |
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| @rizen | and the primers are the cheap books that can be handed out to the staff as a reference guide | 06:13 |
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| @rizen | the primer is a good book | 06:13 |
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| @rizen | but if you have the cm guide..you don't need the primer | 06:13 |
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| @rizen | i'll send it to you anyway | 06:13 |
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| PedersenMJ | Ah, okay. primer is way to hook somebody, basically. | 06:14 |
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| PedersenMJ | I think I know some people to slip that too, then, to get them started :) | 06:14 |
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| @rizen | cool | 06:14 |
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| @rizen | even though we just are now releasing the CM guide, we're already planning the second edition of it | 06:15 |
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| @rizen | it won't be out for 6 months to a year | 06:15 |
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| SDuensin | BOOKS! We like books. | 06:15 |
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| @rizen | but it's going to be another 100 page or so of content | 06:15 |
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| @rizen | so much in fact, that we're going to have to increase the format to a new bigger sized book | 06:16 |
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| PedersenMJ | Sweet :) | 06:16 |
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| PedersenMJ | I'm definitely going to be getting the other guides, too. | 06:16 |
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| @rizen | i had hoped the other two we're working on would be out this month | 06:17 |
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| @rizen | but we've been so busy with everything, and so short staffed, that they aren't done yet | 06:17 |
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| @rizen | but when all 3 are finished it will be between 1000 and 1200 pages of documentation | 06:18 |
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| SDuensin | Each a hundred bucks? | 06:18 |
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| @rizen | i don't think people will complain that we don't have enough documentation anymore | 06:18 |
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| @rizen | =) | 06:18 |
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| @rizen | 100 for color | 06:18 |
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| @rizen | and 75 for b/w | 06:18 |
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| SDuensin | Box set discount? :-) | 06:18 |
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| PedersenMJ | Is there where I'm supposed to express outrage that you haven't finished these books on my personal timetable? Or should I just nicely say that I'm looking forward to seeing the rest of them as soon as they come out? :) | 06:19 |
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| @rizen | probably | 06:19 |
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| @rizen | just the cost of printing the color ones is 65 per book | 06:19 |
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| SDuensin | Ouch. | 06:19 |
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| @rizen | and that doesn't count for all the time we put in to writing them | 06:19 |
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| @rizen | that's why we're charging so much | 06:19 |
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| @rizen | if we could offer them for 50 a piece we would | 06:19 |
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| SDuensin | Believe me, WebGUI is worth the cash. I just can't swing it yet. When I can, I'll be buying everything you guys offer. :-) | 06:20 |
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| PedersenMJ | I'm not the only one who feels that way. It's a *sweet* system, it really is. | 06:20 |
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