--- Log opened Fri May 01 00:00:46 2009
00:04 -!- WebGUI is now known as SynQ
00:15 < CIA-38> WebGUI: perlmonkey2 * r10600 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 4 dirs): Survey sections now have logical section type, which is never shown to the user, only used for silently checking gotos.
00:15 < CIA-38> WebGUI: colin * r10601 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Sku/Product.pm: Backport removal of dead code in the Product Sku.
00:15 < CIA-38> WebGUI: graham * r10602 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.7.4-7.7.5.pl: fix compile warnings
00:15 < CIA-38> WebGUI: graham * r10603 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Wobject/Thingy.t: fix thingy test for field type being provided provided
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00:20 <@Haarg> bad monkey
00:35 < perlmonkey21> what's up?
00:36 <@Haarg> broke a test.  i have a fix already.
00:36 < perlmonkey21> but I ran all the survey tests?
00:37 <@Haarg> https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/revision/?rev=10605
00:37 <@Haarg> not sure why they passed for you
00:40 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10604 /translations/German/German/Asset_StockData.pm: Update from translation server
00:40 < CIA-38> WebGUI: graham * r10605 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Wobject/Survey/SurveyJSON.t: fix survey test
00:40 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10606 /translations/German/German/Asset_Thingy.pm: Update from translation server
00:40 <@preaction> woot go German!
00:41 < perlmonkey21> well crap it fails now.  Must have missed that in the scroll.
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01:01 <+perlDreamer> perlmonkey21, how do you run tests?
01:02 < perlmonkey21> perlDreamer: I go to the correct direction the type "perl file.t"
01:02 < perlmonkey21> directory
01:02 <+perlDreamer> right at the bottom, it should tell you how many tests failed
01:02 <+perlDreamer> that way you don't have to scroll
01:02 <@Haarg> if you use prove it will be color coded
01:03 <@Haarg> prove alone will only report if it passed/failed, prove -v will show all the output but color coded
01:04 <+perlDreamer> Germans at 78.8%
01:04 <+perlDreamer> but the Dutch is clean down to 94.6
01:05 < perlmonkey21> hmm, I like prove
01:05 < perlmonkey21> heh, nice prove -r *.t
01:06 <@Haarg> prove -r t
01:20 <@preaction> if you get cpan App::Prove, you'll get the latest prove which has the color coding
01:21 <@preaction> the one that comes with the WRE and perl 5.8 doesn't have as many fun features
01:21 <+perlDreamer> Using Crud's built in methods (getAll*), there doesn't appear to be a way to compare columns against one another using the constraints
01:21 <+perlDreamer> am I missing something?
01:22 <@preaction> try "col1 = col2" => [] maybe?
01:22 <+perlDreamer> sneaky.  very sneaky
01:29 <+perlDreamer> preaction, Haarg, what do y'all think of this: http://jquelin.blogspot.com/2009/04/on-coders-and-translators.html
01:30 <@preaction> i think it's a great idea, especially the crowd-sourcing aspect
01:31 <@preaction> our i18n app is a good demonstration of that, and perhaps the code for our translationserver could be used by these guys to collect i18n strings
01:32 <+perlDreamer> I'll drop him a note
01:32 <+perlDreamer> At the very least, we could get a French translation
01:35 <+perlDreamer> apeiron is on the ironman elightened perl blog aggregator
01:48 <@Haarg> rather annoying when test modules have bugs in them
01:50 <+perlDreamer> which one is that?
01:50 <@Haarg> trying to add tests to wgdev and Test::Warn can't test warnings like warn "message\n" because the \n prevents the filename/line number from being added
01:50 <+perlDreamer> that's not Test::Warn's fault
01:50 <+perlDreamer> that's perl's fault
01:51 <@Haarg> how so?
01:51 <@Haarg> that's expected behavior of perl
01:51 <@Haarg> Test::Warn assumes the filename/line number will always be there
01:52 <+perlDreamer> oh, now I see
01:53 <@Haarg> i guess i can adjust my code to all be print {STDERR} instead
01:55 <+perlDreamer> what about just not appending \n to the end of your warnings?
01:55 <@Haarg> kind of ugly
01:55 <@Haarg> and what module and line it came from isn't relevant when it is a user error
01:56 <+perlDreamer> except most of your users are all developers who are on the command line
01:57 <@Haarg> that doesn't make the information any more relevant
02:00 <@Haarg> i guess i can use warning_like instead of warning_is
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02:29 <+perlDreamer> let's try this out
02:29 <+perlDreamer> patspam patspam patspam
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02:40 <+perlDreamer> mmmm, shiny new wgdev
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02:44 <@Haarg> i still have to do a lot of work on the intro command.  it's pretty much empty, and isn't referenced anywhere like it needs to be.
02:46 < CIA-38> WebGUI: graham * r10607 /WebGUI/docs/create.sql: preparing for 7.7.5 release
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02:48 <+patspam> praction: ping
02:49 <+perlDreamer> preaction: ping, too
02:49 <+perlDreamer> rerouting for patspam@webgui
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03:06 < CIA-38> WebGUI: colin * r10608 /WebGUI/t/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Test clean-up for users and groups in Shop/Vendor and all Macro tests.
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03:10 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, since User, Group and Storage all have delete methods, would it make sense to just have objectsToDelete?
03:11 <+perlDreamer> hm, maybe not
03:11 <+perlDreamer> because in storagesToDelete, I set it up to accept objects or GUIDs
03:11 <+perlDreamer> oh well
03:11 <@Haarg> yeah
03:11 <@Haarg> aside from guids, it could work to just have a single method that detected the object type if needed
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03:20 <+perlDreamer> maybe we could have objectsToDelete, which takes objects
03:20 <+perlDreamer> and guidsToDelete, which takes guids and object types as an array ref
03:20 <@preaction> HA! I just figured out why I hate the admin accordian! In order to move between panes, you need to move your mouse the entire height of the page!
03:20 <+perlDreamer> that's a bummer, all right
03:21 <@preaction> but is it better than a fly-out menu?
03:21 <+perlDreamer> well, what if there were buttons on the top, and workspace down below in a fixed pattern?
03:21 <+perlDreamer> same idea, different spatial setup
03:22 <@preaction> and the active pane is highlighted somehow
03:22 <+perlDreamer> sure, indented, colored, blinking
03:23 <@preaction> reserve a max of 1/3 for the pane titles, and 2/3 for the pane content (i'm envisioning a world with more panes, like the quicklinks that dhelsten wants)
03:23 <+perlDreamer> guidsToDelete would get processed first, and just push more objects onto objects to delete
03:24 <+perlDreamer> preaction, how about instead of fixed buttons, a dropdown?
03:24 <+perlDreamer> that leaves the most screen real estate in the pane content
03:24 <@preaction> ahhhhh, very nice
03:24 <@preaction> and easy to do with YUI Menu
03:24 <+perlDreamer> what will the chief say?
03:24 <@preaction> i don't know
03:25 <@preaction> i'm thinking i build it and submit for approval
03:25 <+perlDreamer> well, if he doesn't like it, blame me since I can't be fired
03:25 <+perlDreamer> if he does like it, take all the credit for it
03:27 <+patspam> preaction: is CSS/JavaScript::Packer better than JavaScript/CSS::Minifier[::XS]?
03:27 <@preaction> patspam: HTML::Packer does JS and CSS automatically if the JS::Packer and CSS::Packer are installed
03:27 <@preaction> that's why i picked it
03:28 <+patspam> ah ok
03:28 <+perlDreamer> what about speed?
03:28 <@preaction> wasn't a factor in my decision. the ::Minifier and ::Packer were the only ones I found acceptable
03:28 <@preaction> also ::Packer supports de-minifying (for CSS at least)
03:29 <@preaction> and JS looks like, but not HTML
03:31 <@preaction> i want to add buttons to Template and Snippet to run their content through a tidy program someday
03:31 <@preaction> i should add the RFEs for that
03:32 <@preaction> when pb.com comes back from the 7.7.5 upgrade
03:32 <@Haarg> database has been restoring for 30 minutes :/
03:33 <@preaction> it died that bad?
03:33 <@Haarg> upgrade crashed
03:33 <+perlDreamer> too many assetIds
03:33 <@Haarg> actually something with rssfromparent
03:34 <+perlDreamer> eek
03:34 <+perlDreamer> wait a sec
03:34 <+perlDreamer> that should have been dead a long time ago
03:34 <@Haarg> yes
03:35 < perlmonkey21> wow, please tell me you can turn off html compression.
03:36 <+perlDreamer> in SVN, nothing except the 7.7.2 upgrade script references that
03:36 <@Haarg> it's due to some assets that still exist in the database
03:37 <@preaction> perlmonkey21: you can, on a per-template basis. i'm thinking of making the Debug Mode automatically turn off all compression
03:37 <@Haarg> oh fun
03:37 <@Haarg> the database is too large to restore or something
03:37 <+perlDreamer> that's bad
03:37 <+perlDreamer> how do you recover from that?
03:38 <@Haarg> not sure yet
03:38 <@preaction> Haarg: did you shut down everything except mysql on the box/
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03:43  * patspam goes to a meeting
03:46 < perlmonkey21> This is the most incredible thing.  Only my old survey templates will load.  wgd reverting has brought up old templates.  When I edit them, the new ones are there.  But when I actually run the stupid thing, the old templates show up.
03:47 <@preaction> caching?
03:48 < perlmonkey21> no, this started after I did svn revert
03:48 < perlmonkey21> then wgd revert
03:48 <@preaction> browser cache?
03:48 < perlmonkey21> been working for days with the new templates.
03:48 <@preaction> weirdness
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03:52 <@tavisto> preaction, we upgrading pb/wg sites right now?
03:53 <@Haarg> yeah
03:53 <@Haarg> a bit more painful that usual
03:53 < perlmonkey21> patspam: I think there is something darker going on here.  Look at the section edit template at the 4th from last line.  That textarea should have a name "text" and id "texteditortarget", but when you go to edit a survey it will have an id of "sectiontext".  Why would we both be seeing old templates?
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03:59 <@tavisto> ah okay, just wondering since both are unresponsive
03:59 <@tavisto> *tavis pulls out his rifle and decides if he should aim at haarg or preaction*
03:59 <@tavisto> hmmmm
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04:09 < perlmonkey21> anyone with latest want to create a survey, try to edit it, see what the id is on the textarea in the form that shows up?  
04:09 <@preaction> one sec
04:09 < perlmonkey21> thanks
04:12 <@preaction> okay, which "Edit" button do you mean? the asset edit?
04:13 < perlmonkey21> no
04:13 < perlmonkey21> the edit the survey link
04:13 <@preaction> the id="sectionText"?
04:13 < perlmonkey21> hah
04:14 <@preaction> is that good?
04:14 <+Radix-wrk> http://images.huffingtonpost.com/gen/77627/original.jpg
04:14 < perlmonkey21> if you look at the template you will see that is texteditortarget or some such
04:14 < perlmonkey21> something has gone *wrong*
04:14 < perlmonkey21> the template is Section Edit
04:14 < perlmonkey21> 4th from last line
04:14 < perlmonkey21> Default Section Edit
04:15 < perlmonkey21> Radix-wrk: that is hilarious
04:16 < perlmonkey21> preaction: how could the latest template not be showing up?
04:17 <@tavisto> with the new widgets in wG, is it possible for people to use applications from a wG site externally on another website?
04:18 <@preaction> tavisto: they can fill out the form, but the form submits to the wG site
04:18 <@tavisto> (just a regular html website/intranet)
04:18 <@tavisto> is it only for dataforms then?
04:18 <@preaction> no, it's for any asset
04:18 <@preaction> you can see one page of it, but any links or forms will bring the user back to the wG site
04:19 <@tavisto> here is the question I was asked.... if I am understanding this correctly, the answer would be yes. (at least to some degree_
04:19 <@tavisto> I have a question about WebGUI integration with a current HTML/CSS/ColdFusion built intranet. We are currently looking for a project and file management package that will work flawlessly with our current intranet. In regards to WebGui, does this package require one to remove all HTML built pages or can WebGui work side by side with them? We have spent a lot of time building and designing our new intranet and completely replaci
04:19 <+perlDreamer> it can work side by side with them, using passThruUrls and HttpProxy
04:20 <@preaction> webgui can work side-by-side, and yes even INSIDE of an existing site
04:20 <@preaction> and webgui can be a wrapper around an existing site
04:20 <@tavisto> my response is that they can install the WRE on the same or separate server and then it would be possible for people to widgetize assets or externally link to the pages, or even do an iframe to the content
04:20 <@preaction> really any way they want to do it they can get it done
04:21 <@tavisto> alright coolio, thanks. It's for accuquote.com so that would be neat to reel them in
04:22 <@preaction> perlmonkey21: i deleted the revision that the id="surveyText" was in, and it STILL shows up
04:22 < perlmonkey21> I've wgd'd reverted it, and there is no revision except the good one.
04:23 <@preaction> tavisto: yeah that'd be great! upsell the training!
04:23 <@preaction> SEND ME, WEBGUI EVANGELIST, AROUND THE WORLD!
04:23 <@tavisto> well we may need to start with a developer call with them.. 
04:23 <@tavisto> a free pre-sales one.. because I don't know what they want really
04:24 < perlmonkey21> preaction: I mean where is it getting the text?  There is only a single assetId for that template, and only a single entry in Templates with that assetId.  How is it magically getting something else.
04:24 <@tavisto> they need to specify what the crap they want to do.. and then you or rizen can give thumbs up down blah blah
04:24 <@preaction> i'd offer myself to you, but you have to go through the proper channels
04:24 <@preaction> MY LIFE FOR YOU tavisto
04:24 <@preaction> perlmonkey21: there has to be a simple explanation for this
04:25 <@tavisto> yeah it's no problemo. I usually have Rizen in on those calls anyway. If he can't make it then you're next in line
04:25 < perlmonkey21> magic
04:25 <@preaction> there is no magic, just technology we don't understand
04:25 < perlmonkey21> an evil dark magic.  the kind that originates in Texas.
04:25 <@tavisto> and I shall call him...... Mini-Riz
04:26 < perlmonkey21> preaction: if there is only a single template in the db with that assetId, where would it be getting this old template from?
04:26 <@preaction> perhaps the ID is being set by some other method?
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04:28 < perlmonkey21> naw, not unless someone has sabotaged the code.
04:28 < perlmonkey21> it doesn't change its templates
04:28 < perlmonkey21> and the default template in code matches the one in the databse.
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04:30 < perlmonkey21> I mean there are only 3 templates in the database with the correct namespace.  1 is the correct, and the 2 others would at least get that element correct.
04:30 <@Haarg> it would be nice if they stopped making the sourceforge website worse all the time
04:31 < perlmonkey21> github will make it obsolete
04:31 <@preaction> select assetId from template where template LIKE "%sectionText%"
04:31 <@preaction> Empty set (0.02 sec)
04:31 <@preaction> wtf is this noise?
04:31 < perlmonkey21> Texas
04:31 <@preaction> the template DOES NOT EXIST
04:32 <@preaction> i even did "ack sectionText lib www" and nothing comes up
04:32 <@preaction> my browser cache has been cleaned, and is disabled 
04:32 <@preaction> i've cleared the webgui cache
04:32 <@tavisto> preaction, I'm not sure about the training in DC... I just heard back from the contact and they're trying to install wG on solaris
04:32 < perlmonkey21> Not even Darth Vader could pull this off.  Something fowl is afoot.  I blame Donald Duck!
04:33 < perlmonkey21> preaction: yes, I did all that.  I've rm'd the cache in both locations from the CLI, just to make sure.
04:33 <@preaction> tavisto: so that's what all the stuff on the forums is. shouldn't be a problem really
04:33 <@tavisto> they are interested in a support contract but it looks like we aren't really keen on doing that
04:34 <@tavisto> not sure, I'm entirely too busy to check the forums lately. However, they are really interested in using WebGUI.. it's just tough since they want to use that. 
04:34 <@tavisto> And they're doing a source install
04:34 < perlmonkey21> preaction: what is exceptionally crazy, is this is happening to everyone.  Not limited to a single instance.
04:34 <@preaction> tavisto: that also shouldn't be a real problem, provided they know what they're doing. someone on-site for a day or three of training could tell them what they're doing ;)
04:35 <@tavisto> that's the problem
04:35 <@tavisto> I don't think the install is going at all.
04:35 < perlmonkey21> crap, i guess I should start putting in traces in the calls for the template
04:35 <@tavisto> and when I asked them if they're willing to switch to another platform.. the answer was.... uh.... don't think so
04:35 < perlmonkey21> frak me
04:36 <@tavisto> however, the good news is that they are approved to use WebGUI. Sounds like that's quite a bit of work to get to that point
04:36  * perlDreamer calls the oklahoma chapter of the Frak Perlmonkey Brotherhood
04:36 <@tavisto> my contact had a friend in the NSA who was like... "webgui... oh yeah we use it and love it"
04:36 <@tavisto> so it helps to have those friends in high level secret security organizations
04:36 <@preaction> afaik there isn't any real problems with Apache 2 and mod_perl2 on a modern solaris
04:37 <@tavisto> rizen said that previously we only had 1 client who used solaris... then they switched b/c they couldn't keep mysql stable
04:37 <@preaction> ah, so mysql is the problem
04:38 <@tavisto> yep
04:38 <@tavisto> and since this is going to be a high profile govie site.. we can't really risk it
04:38 <@tavisto> and I can't exactly sell someone a best-effort support contract   :)
04:39 <+perlDreamer> what arcane perl incantation is supposed to remove a session object from the database
04:39 <@preaction> yeah, there are a lot of fun notes about Solaris and MySQL
04:39 <@preaction> perlDreamer: $session->delete maybe?
04:40 <@tavisto> i was surprised that there wasn't any solaris install instructions on the wiki.. 
04:40 <+perlDreamer> nope
04:40 <+perlDreamer> tavisto, Sun is being bought for a reason
04:40 <+Radix-wrk> should be easy since they're all owned by sun, but never that easy really is it
04:40 <+perlDreamer> and it's not solaris
04:40 <@preaction> yeah, even making solaris open-source is not saving it
04:41 <+Radix-wrk> I have a friend who works for sun on mysql - if you tell me what the problem is specifically I can ask him about it at least and see what he knows.
04:41 <+perlDreamer> hm it says that var->end is supposed to do it
04:41 <@preaction> yeah, that's what the Delete Expired Sessions does
04:42 < perlmonkey21> is the htmlpacker cacheing thsi stuff on disk?
04:42 <@Haarg> the asset with sectionText in it is 1oBRscNIcFOI-pETrCOspA
04:42 <@preaction> perlmonkey21: template and templatePacked in the database
04:42 <@preaction> hell
04:42 <@preaction> there it is
04:42 <@preaction> but why
04:43 <@preaction> is there some limitation of the "filter" property in the definition?
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04:44 <@Haarg> i think html::packer is going to have to go
04:44 <@Haarg> there are too many possible problems with it that aren't obvious
04:45 <@preaction> i've got it: when update() gets called, the filter gets called, but then the templatePacked gets updated
04:45 < CIA-38> WebGUI: graham * r10609 /releases/WebGUI_7.7.5-beta: Release 7.7.5-beta
04:45 <+perlDreamer> needs tests
04:45  * perlDreamer is starting to sound like a broken record
04:45 <+perlDreamer> I don't even listen to myself anymore!
04:46 <@preaction> i was thinking how to test it without using it
04:46 <@Haarg> i don't think there's a reasonable way it can ever be enabled for templates
04:46 <@preaction> why? they work. the only problem is that the templatePacked is getting overwritten with bad data right now
04:46 <+perlDreamer> you know, just something simple like s/^\s+//; would be good
04:46 <@Haarg> http://www.plainblack.com/pr <- or that templates are not html
04:47 <@preaction> so set that template to not use the packed version
04:47 < perlmonkey21> I have no idea what's going on.
04:47 <@Haarg> after you see the problem
04:47 <@preaction> we can update the upgrade to not set the usePacked flag
04:47 <@Haarg> and happen to know that it is due to packing
04:48 <@preaction> so packing will still happen, but it would have to be explicitly enabled to avoid problems like that
04:48 <@Haarg> maybe
04:48 <@preaction> you can fix pb.com by doing "UPDATE template SET usePacked=0" and "delete from cache"
04:48 <@Haarg> still seems too problematic to me
04:48 <@preaction> with setting usePacked=0, nothing has changed at all
04:48 < perlmonkey21> Haarg: I just looked at that template and there is no sectionText in it.
04:49 <@preaction> perlmonkey21: look at templatePacked, that's where it is
04:49 < perlmonkey21> ah crap
04:49 <@preaction> i'm working on a fix and a test
04:49 < perlmonkey21> that's what you guys were talking about
04:49 < perlmonkey21> okay...whew.
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04:49 < perlmonkey21> groovy
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04:50 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, I'm guessing you're up to your eyebrows in bugs.  The SQL queries for bugs and RFEs on the participate page are borked.
04:50 <@Haarg> hmm
04:50 <@Haarg> those were definitely working at some point
04:50 <+perlDreamer> sure, just earlier today
04:52 <@Haarg> working now?
04:53 <@preaction> yes
04:53 <+perlDreamer> no
04:54 <+perlDreamer> look at the top 2 RFEs
04:54 <+perlDreamer> they haven't been touched in months or longer
04:54 <+perlDreamer> yet they show up above things that were submitted today
04:54 <+perlDreamer> similar with bugs
04:54 <+perlDreamer> similarly with bugs
04:56 <+perlDreamer> oh, this is totally evil!
04:57 <+perlDreamer> I guess I'm going to make sessionToDelete next
04:57 <@Haarg> i think version tag would be good
04:57 <@Haarg> since it would take care of cleaning up assets as well
04:58 <+perlDreamer> if you make an object that takes a session variable, and delete that session variable, and then try to delete the object, it revivifies the session object!
04:59 <@Haarg> i think i ran into that before
04:59 <+perlDreamer> if this is true, then I think we have a problem
05:00 <+perlDreamer> because session->var is not the last thing destroyed
05:00 <+perlDreamer> in session->close
05:01 <@Haarg> it depends on the object
05:01 <@Haarg> it's only going to cause a problem if they try to do work when destroyed/deleted/etc
05:01 <@Haarg> errorhandler doesn't do anything on destroy
05:03 <+perlDreamer> yeah, I think I'm just worrying too much about the circular nature of the references
05:03 <+perlDreamer> well, time to build sessionsToDelete
05:07 <@Haarg> need a break.  been dealing with this upgrade for at least 6 hours today.
05:09 <+perlDreamer> take 50, you've earned it
05:22 < CIA-38> WebGUI: colin * r10610 /WebGUI/t/ (5 files in 3 dirs): 
05:22 < CIA-38> WebGUI: Add method to clean up test sessions. This has to be done
05:22 < CIA-38> WebGUI: after ALL other types of objects have been cleaned up.
05:22 < CIA-38> WebGUI: More test clean-up for users, groups and sessions.
05:38 < CIA-38> WebGUI: colin * r10611 /WebGUI/t/ (6 files in 5 dirs): 
05:38 < CIA-38> WebGUI: Test cleanups.
05:38 < CIA-38> WebGUI: Fix a leaking group in Asset/Post/permission.t. Threads do not clean
05:38 < CIA-38> WebGUI: up their groups when they are purged.
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06:05 <@preaction> is there a standard way to prevent a property from being updated through update()?
06:11 < CIA-38> WebGUI: colin * r10612 /WebGUI/t/Asset/ (6 files in 4 dirs): Another batch of clean-ups for users and groups.
06:11 <@preaction> nm, it has to be during addRevision
06:25 <+perlDreamer> it's hopeless
06:26 <@preaction> hmm?
06:26 <+perlDreamer> trying to get shipping API documentation
06:26 <@preaction> bastards
06:28 <+perlDreamer> preaction, thank you for being so conscientious in cleaning up things made in your test.
06:29 <@preaction> you mean fixing how i broke all of webgui?
06:31 <+perlDreamer> no
06:31 <+perlDreamer> I've been looking at some of your gallery tests, and mech tests
06:32 <+perlDreamer> and you do a good job of cleaning up users, groups, assets and version tags
06:32 <@preaction> ahh, yeah
06:32 <+perlDreamer> no, what happened today was almost worthy of a Kuskie-level mess
06:32 <+perlDreamer> close, but not quite
06:32 <+perlDreamer> you didn't destroy any websites and no one cursed at you
06:34 <@preaction> yeah, i've borked webgui worse than this
06:34 <@preaction> this was easy to fix even
06:34 <@preaction> the upgrade problems weren't the fault of this
06:36 <+perlDreamer> 37 files later...
06:36 <+perlDreamer> the User and Group clean-ups are done
06:37 <+perlDreamer> now, to go back and look for Storage
06:40 <+perlDreamer> maybe another night, between struggling with the government, kids, cats and just regular work, I'm beat
06:40 < CIA-38> WebGUI: colin * r10613 /WebGUI/t/ (7 files in 6 dirs): Last batch of User and Group cleanups.
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07:05 < CIA-38> WebGUI: doug * r10614 /WebGUI/docs/ (3 files in 2 dirs): reverted usePacked. you can re-enable it carefully.
07:05 < CIA-38> WebGUI: doug * r10615 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI.pm: Beginning 7.7.6 dev
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08:22 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10616 /translations/German/German/ (5 files): Update from translation server
08:22 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10617 /translations/German/German/Asset.pm: Update from translation server
08:22 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10618 /translations/German/German/Asset_Event.pm: Update from translation server
08:45 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10619 /translations/German/German/ (PayDriver_Cash.pm Shop.pm): Update from translation server
08:45 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10620 /translations/German/German/ (WebGUI.pm PayDriver.pm): Update from translation server
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09:09 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10621 /translations/German/German/ (2 files): Update from translation server
09:09 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10622 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
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09:35 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10623 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
10:01 < CIA-38> WebGUI: translation * r10624 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
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11:49 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10625 /translations/German/German/ (6 files): Update from translation server
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12:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10626 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
12:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10627 /translations/German/German/PassiveAnalytics.pm: Update from translation server
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13:01 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10628 /translations/German/German/Asset_DataTable.pm: Update from translation server
13:01 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10629 /translations/German/notes.txt: Update from translation server
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13:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10630 /translations/French/ (9 files in 2 dirs): Update from translation server
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14:09 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10631 /translations/French/French/ (Account_Profile.pm Account_Shop.pm Account_Friends.pm): Update from translation server
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14:40 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10632 /translations/Russian/ (31 files in 2 dirs): Update from translation server
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15:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10633 /translations/French/French/ (Account_Contributions.pm Account_Friends.pm): Update from translation server
15:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10634 /translations/French/French/Workflow_Activity_PurgeOldInboxMessages.pm: Update from translation server
15:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10635 /translations/French/French/Workflow_Activity_RemoveOldCarts.pm: Update from translation server
15:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10636 /translations/French/French/Workflow_Activity_NotifyAboutThing.pm: Update from translation server
15:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10637 /translations/French/French/Workflow_Activity_NotifyAboutLowStock.pm: Update from translation server
15:18 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10638 /translations/French/French/Workflow_Activity_ExpirePurchasedThingyRecords.pm: Update from translation server
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16:14 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10639 /translations/French/French/Workflow_Activity_ExpireIncompleteSurveyResponses.pm: Update from translation server
16:14 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10640 /translations/French/French/Asset_Article.pm: Update from translation server
16:14 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10641 /translations/French/French/Account_User.pm: Update from translation server
16:14 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10642 /translations/French/French/Account_Contributions.pm: Update from translation server
16:14 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10643 /translations/French/French/Form_Captcha.pm: Update from translation server
16:14 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10644 /translations/French/French/ (Tax.pm Auth.pm): Update from translation server
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17:47 <+perlDreamer> hey, BartJol!
17:47 <+BartJol> jo
17:48 <+BartJol> this time I really am here
17:48 <+BartJol> ho's life?
17:48 <+perlDreamer> Life is okay
17:48 <+perlDreamer> been sick the last week
17:48 <+BartJol> not good
17:48 <+BartJol> but better now?
17:48 <+perlDreamer> No, but it is over
17:49 <+perlDreamer> How about you?
17:49 <+BartJol> good
17:49 <+perlDreamer> Putting big holes into the new house?
17:49 <+BartJol> well, my house is going ok
17:49 <+BartJol> yeah
17:49 <+BartJol> seen the pictures?
17:49 <+BartJol> I put some on my site wednesday
17:49 <+perlDreamer> no, I'll go look
17:49 <+BartJol> maybe I should internationalise my site
17:50 <+BartJol> it a big mess right now
17:50 <+BartJol> but I like the missing walls
17:50 <+BartJol> it looks a lot more roomy now
17:51 <+perlDreamer> what's this one: http://www.bartjol.nl/uploads/58/18/581890edd90e252bcd2b487db7d00f73/DSC00491.JPG
17:52 <+perlDreamer> is that the main electrical panel?
17:52 <+BartJol> my old electricity meter
17:52 <+BartJol> yeah
17:52 <+BartJol> but that one is mostly gone now
17:55 <+perlDreamer> it is good to have friends to help
17:55 <+BartJol> I know
17:57 <+BartJol> well, and I helped a lot of people in the past, which helps me now, good brings good
17:58 <+BartJol> there is even a guy that wants to come from Romania especially to help me move
17:58 <+perlDreamer> that's awesome!
17:58 <+BartJol> but his movement was a really tough one
17:59 <+perlDreamer> danger, danger.  chicks with splitting mauls!
17:59 <+BartJol> we have a group of friends that get insulted when you don't let them help[ moving
18:00 <+BartJol> yeah, that's the girlfriend of my roommate
18:02 <+BartJol> they were so kind to move 2 walls into a more dispersed pile of rubble, enlarging the enthropy in my house
18:12 <+perlDreamer> well, even though you've moved your hacking into another realm, it's good to see that you're keeping up
18:13 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10645 /translations/German/German/ (4 files): Update from translation server
18:25 <+BartJol> :)
18:25 <+BartJol> going to coomk
18:25 <+BartJol> cook
18:27 <+perlDreamer> went to eat breakfast
18:40 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, svn del https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/branch/WebGUI_Story look right to you?
18:45 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10646 /translations/German/German/ (Shop.pm Asset_Template.pm): Update from translation server
18:45 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10647 /translations/German/German/Asset_Product.pm: Update from translation server
18:45 <+perlDreamer> BartJol, somebody is doing a huge amount of work translating German
18:46 <+perlDreamer> they are nearing 79%
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18:50 <+BartJol> perlDreamer: 79? oops
18:50 <+BartJol> getting skakky
18:50 <+BartJol> slakky
18:50 <+perlDreamer> no, the Germans are doing great
18:50 <+perlDreamer> Dutch is only down to about 92.4% or so
18:50 <+BartJol> I know
18:51 <+perlDreamer> but you have a house to work on, so keep your priorities straight
18:51 <+BartJol> but I am getting too far behinf
18:51 <+BartJol> I will
18:52 <+perlDreamer> maybe we should make your student perlmonkey2 do some Dutch translating while you're on brake
18:52 <+BartJol> stable is up to 98.1
18:53 <+perlDreamer> stable is fine, it's just beta
18:53 <+perlmonkey2> nee
18:53 <+perlmonkey2> nee ik zal niet
18:53 <+BartJol> yeah and rory and Bob from alpha mega will help
18:54 <+BartJol> wat zal je niet perlmonkey2?
18:54 <+perlmonkey2> Heeft uw hond zoals de banjo?
18:54 <+BartJol> I got that message a lot in the survey...
18:54 <+perlmonkey2> vertalen
18:54 <+perlmonkey2> hahaha
18:55 <+BartJol> but a nice outsourcing to the Netherlands will be nice, won't it?
18:55 <+perlmonkey2> In het jaar 2020, disco zal de wereld regeren.
18:56 <+perlmonkey2> but of course
18:56 <+perlmonkey2> If I spoke Dutch.
18:56 <+BartJol> well, a laptop with connection and bablefish will get you somewhere
18:56 <+BartJol> probably the hospital
18:57 <+perlmonkey2> yeah, with people wondering why the hover help is asking them if their dogs likes the banjo :P
18:57 <+BartJol> like was translated in the wrong manner btw
18:57 <+BartJol> more in "it's like that"
18:58 <+BartJol> instead of "I like perlmonkey2 for his deep voice"
18:58 <+perlmonkey2> Ah, I see the difference.
18:59 <+perlmonkey2> That's what all the tall vikings say, though.
18:59 <+BartJol> now it's "has your dog in a manner of a banjo"
18:59 <+perlDreamer> only when he's properly tuned
19:01 <+BartJol> how do protect yourself from vikings perlmonkey2?
19:01 <+perlmonkey2> I sing softly to them.
19:01 <+perlDreamer> in his deep voice
19:01 <+perlmonkey2> I find Britney Spears' songs work well.
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19:02 <+BartJol> :)
19:02 <+BartJol> hee, it's metroman
19:03 <+BartJol> food's in the oven, so a have half an hour to bug him!
19:03 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, it looks like previousVersion.sql hasn't been updated, and it may have uncovered a bug in the upgrade process
19:04 <+perlDreamer> I'm only getting config changes for the first upgrade script
19:04 <+perlDreamer> nm
19:04 <+perlDreamer> it's because I'm an idiot, and put my wgd switches in the wrong order
19:05 <+BartJol> no, you're not an idiot
19:05 <+perlDreamer> I'm not?
19:05 <+BartJol> provided you are still not using emacs
19:05 <+perlDreamer> bite your tongue!
19:05 <+perlDreamer> better yet, have perlmonkey2's dog bite your tongue
19:05 <+BartJol> I'll wash it with green soap
19:06 <+BartJol> yugh!
19:06 <+perlDreamer> that depends
19:06 <+perlmonkey2> My dog is 18 years old and his teeth are mostly gone.  
19:06 <+perlDreamer> is the soap normally green?
19:06 <+BartJol> doctors forbid me to come to close to banjo-playing dogs
19:06 <+BartJol> well, normally is subjective
19:07 <+BartJol> but for soap it is
19:07 <+perlDreamer> one time I found some brown/tan soap
19:07 <+perlDreamer> after we washed it, it was white again
19:07 <+BartJol> mmm
19:07 <+BartJol> maybe you should wash more often
19:08  * perlDreamer washes twice a day
19:08 <+perlDreamer> once in the morning, and once after a workout
19:08 < ryuu_ro> BartJol: was this a call for some translating help?
19:08 <+perlDreamer> because Mrs. perlDreamer will not allow me into the living room after a workout without a shower
19:08 <+BartJol> sure, if you want it to be
19:09 <+BartJol> ryuu_ro: you do have a hangover I hope
19:09 < ryuu_ro> why?
19:09 <+BartJol> oh and my car is fixed
19:09 <+BartJol> eeh, because it was queensday yesterday
19:09 < ryuu_ro> yeah, but I didn't go to disco herman
19:09 <+BartJol> or did you strike because of the accident
19:10 <+BartJol> me neither
19:10 < ryuu_ro> so I feel perfectly fine
19:10 < ryuu_ro> :)
19:10 < ryuu_ro> no, i was working today. Only not at the office
19:10 <+BartJol> really starnge that my car doens't make any squeeky noices anymore
19:10 <+BartJol> when I shift gear
19:10 < ryuu_ro> did you own a black suzuki swift? ;)
19:11 <+BartJol> no a white opel astra, you know that!
19:11 <+BartJol> always thought that swift drivers were suspicious
19:11 < ryuu_ro> true that, but I thought that you were behind the attack of yesterday
19:11 <+BartJol> why?
19:11 < ryuu_ro> it sounded like your kind of thing :)
19:12 <+BartJol> I like the royal family, it gives you an excuse to get toatlly wasted once a year
19:12 < ryuu_ro> but then i was still thinking it was a drinking and driving accident 
19:12 <+BartJol> me thinks tavisto is scared of me
19:13 < ryuu_ro> why, he has unbelievable super powers
19:13 < ryuu_ro> according to your comic
19:13 <+BartJol> well, but making people look like brad pitt doesn't scare me
19:13 <+BartJol> I saw him do it once
19:14 < ryuu_ro> but what if he want's to make you look like Brad Pitt
19:14 < ryuu_ro> that kinda scares me
19:14 <+BartJol> I'd rather look like Johnny Depp
19:15 <+perlDreamer> I thought you were Johnny Depp?
19:15 <+BartJol> no, I only share his brithday
19:15 <@preaction> Johnny Depp is like 5'6". you don't want to be that short
19:15 <+BartJol> well, I won't hit my head as often
19:15 < ryuu_ro> in pirates or in sweeney todd btw?
19:15 <@preaction> Compared to you, im as tall as Johnny Depp is compared to me
19:16 <@preaction> no, in real life he's 5'6", that's why he only works with short female actresses
19:16 <+BartJol> his birthday isn't movie depending
19:17 <@preaction> i live in oshkosh, where they shot some scenes for Public Enemies. they had a call for extras, but i'm too tall
19:17 < ryuu_ro> no but then I know if you want to be a half dead drunk pirate or a singing and murdering hairdresser
19:17 <+perlDreamer> he's not half dead, he's "mostly dead"
19:17 <+BartJol> apart from the singing, I like the hardresser better
19:18 < ryuu_ro> true :)
19:19 <+BartJol> I am not a public enemy, I didn't try to kill the royal family. I did see Public Enemy one time though
19:20 <+perlDreamer> close enough
19:20 <+BartJol> prolly I will be too tall too then
19:23 <+BartJol> criminals are trying to put BA's mom out of her apartment, wonder how it will finish
19:23 <+perlDreamer> who is "BA"?
19:23 <+BartJol> mr T
19:23 <+BartJol> in the A-team
19:24  * perlDreamer guesses that BA will pity them
19:25 <+BartJol> he will, but my food is ready
19:25 <+BartJol> so till later
19:25 -!- BartJol is now known as BartJoliseatingd
19:46 <+perlmonkey2> catching up on that scroll was painful.
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20:00  * perlDreamer thinks it's cool that Queen Beatrix rides a bicycle.  Sounds very down to earth.
20:01 <+BartJol> well, she doesn't do that always
20:01 <+BartJol> but she's cool
20:03 <+perlDreamer> Do they have any idea why that guy tried to run into her bus?
20:04 <+BartJol> it seems he held a grudge against the royal family
20:05 <+BartJol> but getting more info will be hard, since he died
20:05 <+perlDreamer> yeah, crashing your car into a bus can make that happen
20:05 <+BartJol> it wasn't a bus
20:05 <+BartJol> it was a pillar
20:06 <+BartJol> not less deadly
20:06 <+perlDreamer> pillars are worse
20:07 < dhelsten> you're sure he didn't have a grudge against pillars?  
20:07 <+BartJol> no
20:08 <+BartJol> but it seems he said something about the royal family
20:21  * perlDreamer heads off for gym and lunch, be back much later this afternoon
20:22 <+perlDreamer> for all you European types, happy house hacking!
20:22 <+BartJol> by
20:22 <+BartJol> ee
20:31 <@preaction> perlDreamer: do you have any "How-tos" on tests?
20:35 <+BartJol> he's out
20:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: hao * r10648 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): RFE #9998, mark selected inbox messages as read/unread.
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21:19 <+BartJol> ryuu_ro: beer?
21:19 <@tavisto> nope, he's doing the opposite of beer... Working out at the gym
21:19 < ryuu_ro> unfortanely no, I have to go to my house and put a floor in 
21:20 <+BartJol> ah
21:20 < ryuu_ro> see you later guys!
21:20 <+BartJol> perlDreamer: is working out
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21:43 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10649 /WebGUI/docs/previousVersion.sql: updating previousVersion for 7.7.6 dev
21:43 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10650 /WebGUI/ (67 files in 11 dirs): fixed: #9897. Fixed problem with highlighting in codearea. Updated EditArea to version 0.8.1.1
21:47 < dhelsten> preaction: you there?  I need to upgrade but will need to change my files back.
21:48 <@preaction> dhelsten: do you still have the package i gave you? that should do it iirc
21:48 < dhelsten> you mean remove the package...
21:49 <@preaction> wait, what did i say? was it adding a package or deleting a revision?
21:49 <@preaction> i think you have to delete the revision
21:50 < dhelsten> that is more likely.  As I recall the package didn't work.  I just need to jump back to the revision that had the simple <dragger icon> or whatever it read, right?
21:50 <@preaction> yeah
21:51 < dhelsten> I also made a change in the calendar.pm file.  I assume that will be overwritten with the fixed version so I don't need to do anything, right?
21:57 <@preaction> dhelsten: yes
22:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10651 /WebGUI/www/extras/editarea/ (21 files in 3 dirs): really fixed brainfuck problem
22:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10652 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (67 files in 11 dirs): merged 10650
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22:23 <@tavisto> wow let's keep it PG Preaction!!
22:32 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10653 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/www/extras/editarea/ (21 files in 3 dirs): merged 10651
22:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10654 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: updated changelog
22:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: perlmonkey2 * r10655 /WebGUI/www/extras/wobject/Survey/editsurvey/object.js: YUI editor in the edit panel for the Survey editor now drags with the panel and hides with the panel.
22:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: perlmonkey2 * r10656 /WebGUI/www/extras/wobject/Survey/editsurvey/object.js: Removed superfluous function wrappers on the yui event subscriptions.
22:39 <@tavisto> is it just me or are pb/wg just absolutely crawling right now... argh
22:40 <@tavisto> it's probably just my crappy ISP.. but I feel like I'm stuck in mud
22:41 <@preaction> tavisto: just you. works fine for me
22:41 <@tavisto> alright great. Thanks Verizon
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23:35 < dhelsten> I'm not familiar with IRC can someone tell me what the @ and + in front of the handles means?   Also how does one indicate their status as away, etc?  
23:37 <@preaction> dhelsten: @ = +o = channel operator. + = +v = voiced (can talk when channel is moderated, special users)
23:37 <@preaction> you can indicate away using /away, but normally you just don't have to
23:39 < dhelsten> Thanks
23:40 < dhelsten> I an upcoming events area for my home page using a shortcut to a calendar and overriding with the List View.  At the time I thought that did it because all my events were in the future.  Now I realize that this displays all events, even those in the past.  Any ideas of how I can show only future events?
23:41 <@preaction> a SQLReport?
23:42 <@preaction> ooh, you could use a Template Toolkit template to only show an event if it's in the future
23:42 <@preaction> that might be better
23:43 < dhelsten> I'm not familiar with Template Toolkit
23:44 <@preaction> there will be a presentation at the WUC
23:44 <@preaction> but HTML::Template::Expr might be able to handle it too
23:46 < dhelsten> Is TT going to be replacing HTML::Template?
23:47 < dhelsten> Or will WG just support both
23:47 <@preaction> i believe we're moving to TT entirely, but TT supports the HTML::Template dialect
23:48 <+perlmonkey2> TT is an incredible improvement.
23:48 <@preaction> yes
23:48 <@preaction> ten million percent improvement
23:49 < dhelsten> And in TT I could create a statement in my calendar loop such as "if event date > today then ..."
23:49 < dhelsten> ?
23:49 <@preaction> yep
23:50 < dhelsten> That will be great for non coders like myself who must rely only on the available variables.
23:52 <@preaction> yeah, steve swanson (head of our design dept.) is really excited about it
23:53 < dhelsten> How difficult would it be to implement a TT template for the calendar list view?  Are there any examples out there I can look at?  When will it be included in the core(or how do I enable it)?
23:54 <@preaction> i think there's a wiki article about it
23:55 <@preaction> dhelsten: http://www.webgui.org/community-wiki/how-to-enable-other-template-engines
23:55 < dhelsten> thanks.  looking at it now
23:57 < dhelsten> what is the name of the TT CPAN Bundle?   The article doesn't say
23:57 <@preaction> dhelsten: it's just called "Template"
23:57 <@preaction> http://template-toolkit.org/ <- here's the main TT2 site
23:57 < dhelsten> Thanks.
23:58 <@preaction> you'll have to look at the Plugins for Date functions
23:59 < dhelsten> I assume I need to install the module bundles as well, yes?
23:59 <@preaction> the date plugin should be part of the normal TT distribution, but maybe
--- Day changed Sat May 02 2009
00:00 < dhelsten> Thanks.  I'm got to get on a conf call but will play around with this later...
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00:27 <+perlDreamer> preaction, how does TT support H::T dialect?
00:27 <+perlDreamer> also, for testing resources...
00:27 <+perlDreamer> The Developers Guid
00:27 <+perlDreamer> e
00:27 <+perlDreamer> my testing presentation
00:27 <+perlDreamer> some wiki pages
00:28 <+perlDreamer> also, see my blog for recent developments in testing convenience methods
00:29 <@preaction> perlDreamer: i don't know, i'm just repeating what i were told
00:30 <+perlDreamer> I did some looking on that recently, and it's not exactly true
00:30 <+perlDreamer> that TT plugin just calls H::T, then passes the content on to the template
00:35 -!- WebGUI is now known as SynQ
00:38 <+perlDreamer> preaction: what kind of testing questions do you have?
00:40 <@preaction> none, i wanted steveo_aa to get some information on how to write tests
00:40 <@preaction> i'll be writing some tests for the collab system, because i need to fix part of it
00:41 <+perlDreamer> Do you guys have the PDF for my testing presentation, because it has lots of links to Perl testing in general
00:42 <@preaction> i think we do. otherwise it not up on webgui.tv yet?
00:42 <+perlDreamer> yes
00:42 <+perlDreamer> well, I figure y'all have access to those videos whether it's on wgtv or not
00:43 <@preaction> er, what year was it?
00:43 <@preaction> 08 right?
00:43 <+perlDreamer> 07 or 06
00:44 <@preaction> 06 here it is
00:44 <+perlDreamer> 05 was Help, 06 was testing, 07 was community, 08 was game show and community redo
00:44 <+perlDreamer> 09 is Story Manager, and Clinic
00:45 <@preaction> heh, i don't get to do a presentation this year, so i'll be there to heckle everybody!
00:46 <+perlDreamer> what?
00:46 <@preaction> but i especially want to see the Story Manager, i've got a few clients who might be very interested in that
00:46 <+perlDreamer> want one of mine?
00:46 <@preaction> oh no, i've got other SOOPER SEKRIT projects I get to work on that I'll hopefully have done for the WUC
00:47  * perlDreamer needs a USB keyboard and mouse
00:47 <+perlDreamer> The desk is too high
00:47 <+perlDreamer> (for a laptop)
00:47 <@preaction> go wireless!
00:47 <+perlDreamer> we do have one of those...
00:47 <@preaction> it's a business expense!
00:48 <+perlDreamer> that just makes it less expensive, not free
00:50 <+perlDreamer> preaction, does the editarea commit also fix the long standing bugs with display and resizing, by chance?
00:50 <@preaction> resizing doesn't have a bug taht i know of, it's just counter-intuitive
00:50 <@preaction> but display, no it doesn't
00:50 <@preaction> it fixes the blue-bar problem though
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01:46  * perlDreamer goes running
01:47 <+perlDreamer> I know, that's two bouts of exercising today, but I didn't go on Tuesday so this makes up for it.
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02:29 <@preaction> i'll do zero bouts of exercising today to make up for it
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02:45 < CIA-23> WebGUI: paul * r10657 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 6 dirs): template attachments (scripts and stylesheets)
02:53 <@preaction> does anyone want to help me with a new feature? you'll have to svn up and wgd reset
02:53 <@preaction> templates now allow attachments, and i want your opinion
03:17 < CIA-23> WebGUI: paul * r10658 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: added a changelog note about template attachments
03:23 <+perlDreamer> what kind of attachments?
03:23  * perlDreamer is very curiuos
03:23 <@preaction> CSS and JS
03:24 <@preaction> to fix the "double include" problem and also to allow deferred loading of some JS (to improve render times)
03:24 <@preaction> mostly i want an opinion on the UI, i like it, and i want to make sure other people like it too
03:24  * perlDreamer will look
03:25 <+perlDreamer> so how does an attachment fix the double include problem?
03:25 <@preaction> there was no attempt at parsing or whatever, so we're going to have to eventually go in manually and change the Extra HEAD tags into Attachments (if possible)
03:25 <+perlDreamer> does it get registered?
03:25 <@preaction> because it uses $style->setScript, which doesn't allow duplicate scripts
03:25 <+perlDreamer> ah...
03:25 <@preaction> and Style->setLink, which also doesn't allow dups
03:26 <@preaction> in a related note, setScript can now add scripts to the body instead of the head, so there's that
03:26 <+perlDreamer> if I ask you if it has tests, will you shoot me?
03:26 <@preaction> no, because i didn't write it ;) so i don't know
03:26 <@preaction> also, it does
03:27 <@preaction> so three cheers for frodwith there
03:27 <+perlDreamer> frodwith++
03:34 <+perlDreamer> sub prepare could do with some review
03:35 <+perlDreamer> and WGBP is to do @{ }, not @$
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03:37 <@preaction> prepare? how so? looks okay to me, except that $self->getAttachments is called 3 times (3 DB queries, when we're getting ALL attachments anyway)
03:41 <@preaction> why does it take us 20 lines to determine how to sort the Threads in a collab system? my god...
03:51 <+perlDreamer> inside prepare, there's no need to build a variable every time through the loop
03:51 <+perlDreamer> and I don't think a closure needs to be built, when a loop would do
03:51 <@preaction> oh, that, i see
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03:53 < Zylopfa> Hello Webguis
03:55 <+perlDreamer> nice POD work in Session/Style
03:56 <+perlDreamer> session/style.t tests need to be updated for all the new code
03:57 < Zylopfa> Sweet my bazaar thing is still on most downloaded
03:57 < Zylopfa> makes me wanna make more stuff
03:59 <+perlDreamer> which bazaar thing is that, Zylopfa?
04:00 < Zylopfa> Workflow Activity to Create Personal User Areas, When user is created. "
04:00 < Zylopfa> I am realy busy atm making a story site i have into webgui
04:01 < Zylopfa> btw. it was a hilarious php aprils fools, just read it now as i browsed the black blog
04:04 <+perlDreamer> preaction, index is always 0 when I add thing to the list of attachments
04:04 <@preaction> not sure if that is expected behavior or not
04:04 <+perlDreamer> and because the way webgui works, I'd call them something else, like links or something, because attachments usually means files
04:04 <@preaction> good idea
04:06 <+perlDreamer> I see
04:06 <+perlDreamer> in the attachments section, if you change the index it allows you to move them around relative to one another
04:06 <+perlDreamer> but when you're adding them, any newly added thing gets appended to the end, regardless of the index, and it's given an index of 0
04:08 <+perlDreamer> I like how you can easily edit the entries after adding them
04:08 <+perlDreamer> change names and types
04:10 <+perlDreamer> uh oh
04:10 <+perlDreamer> something really bad happened to the edit screen
04:10 <@preaction> that's not good
04:10 <+perlDreamer> no, wait, that's the template source
04:12  * perlDreamer needs to go, it's dinner time
04:12 <+perlDreamer> later, all
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04:13 < Zylopfa> Have a good dinner
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06:11 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10659 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/ (2 files in 2 dirs): added minimal skeletons without all the unnecessary example code
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00:03 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10660 /translations/German/German/ (Account_Shop.pm Shop.pm): Update from translation server
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02:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10661 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
02:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10662 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
02:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10663 /translations/German/German/Asset_Subscription.pm: Update from translation server
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06:23 < elnino> HI!
06:24 < elnino> I need to provide redirects for old URLs that are from a mambo install: /images/stories//uis%20-%20home%20inspection%20price%20schedule.pdf to a webgui url
06:24 < elnino> but webgui seems to want to correct the double slash and %20's. is there a way to make webgui not do that?
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08:45 < elnino> hello?
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--- Day changed Mon May 04 2009
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02:19 < wgGuest43> Hi folks
02:20 < wgGuest43> anyone game to take a couple quick questions?
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02:27 < wgGuest43> anyone around?
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02:35 <+patspam> the EditArea syntax highlighter supports branfuck? that's awesome
02:51 <@Haarg> kind of odd.  i'm not sure how much syntax highlighting is going to help you when there are only 8 operations.
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04:15 < wgGuest43> anyone tried out the underground template?
04:17 <@preaction> wgGuest43: i made it, what do you need?
04:20 < wgGuest43> ohh
04:20 < wgGuest43> cool
04:20 < wgGuest43> should search be working properly?
04:20 < wgGuest43> for some reason it seems like the theme isn't propagating to a few pages correctly... specifically the 'search' page and the 'view my account' pages
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04:21 <@preaction>  the "view my account" page is controlled by the "User Function Style" in the settings
04:21 <@preaction> it's considered rude to private message without asking
04:22 <@preaction> but the "Search" page, that'd be a bug
04:22 < wgGuest43> dude, I have been on irc since 1993
04:23 <@preaction> yes, and since then the social contract has probably changed quite a bit. we get sounds when people private message now, like an IM, so it's more urgent (especially when you're using IRC for business and such)
04:23 < wgGuest43> I suppose it depends on your client
04:23 <@preaction> but to fix the Search page, Turn Admin On and go to the Search page, edit the Search asset and you'll see Display tab, under the "Style Template" field, choose "Underground [style]"
04:24 <@preaction> i'll add it to the next revision
04:24 < wgGuest43> Its a really sexy theme, I like it
04:24 <@preaction> thank the guy at styleshout.com, i just put it into webgui
04:25 < wgGuest43> this is my first go around with webgui, I def. prefer your theme to the default..
04:25 < wgGuest43> your/his
04:25 <@preaction> yeah, Tavis has wanted a way to pull default themes from the bazaar during the site starter wizard, which i think would be great
04:27 < wgGuest43> That seems to work, but for some reason the menu bar at the top is garbled with a bunch of links that shouldn't be there..
04:28 <@preaction> that depends on where the search asset is located i suspect
04:29 <@preaction> if you Cut the search asset and then Paste it on a Search page under your Home page, that should fix it
04:29 <@preaction> i'll also find a way to fix that for this release
04:31 <@preaction> now i remember. i wanted to make the Navigation asset have a special "home page" start point to fix this
04:50 < wgGuest43> thanks preaction, the cut/paste fix worked
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05:51 < dhelsten> I know that CS assets can automatically expire.  Is there anyway to get an article to do this?
06:00 < wgGuest43> preaction: I made a little fix to enable search from the top navigation search window after the cut/paste thing, I'll probably make a few more changes... you have this thing in svn somewhere?  I could share these with you...
06:01 <@preaction> dhelsten: not currently, no
06:02 <@preaction> wgGuest43: not really, wgpkg doesn't lend itself well to diff/patch. you could just e-mail it to me doug@plainblack.com
06:02 < wgGuest43> cool
06:08 < dhelsten> preaction: ok, thanks.
06:26 <+patspam> perlmonkey2: ...
06:27 <+patspam> perlmonkey2: I have a Survey scoring idea
06:32 < wgGuest43> preaction: do you have a fix for enabling the underground theme for the "View My Account" pagee?
06:44 < wgGuest43> nevermind =)
06:50 <+perlmonkey2> patspam: what's the idea?
06:50 <+patspam> heya
06:50 <+patspam> well..
06:53 < dhelsten> how do I get avatars to show in templates.  Using <tmpl_var user_profile_avatar_value> just returns the Asset ID.  I assume I need to put this in a macro to get it show up as an image...
06:53 <+patspam> in the general case I think you can treat scoring as an arbitrary number of rules that get evaluated
06:53 <+perlmonkey2> patspam: that makes sense.
06:54 <+patspam> each rule evaluates to something, often just a true/false flag, but also possibly a numeric score
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06:54 <+perlDreamer> whoa
06:54 <+perlDreamer> a wgGuest
06:54  * perlDreamer hopes you guys have helped them out
06:54 <+perlmonkey2> my original idea was to leave that up to the report generators.....but jumping logic seems to require some rules to be solidified I guess.
06:54 <+patspam> what I'm thinking is..
06:55 <+patspam> we can easily add a section to the UI for the survey builder to add in an arbitrary number of scoring expressions
06:55 <+patspam> that (at this stage) just get run at survey completion time
06:55 <+patspam> adding an extra 'score' data object to the response hash
06:56 <+patspam> each score expression can be of the form: score({ <expression>} TAG_NAME)
06:56 <+patspam> and then you can expose all those TAG_NAMEs as template variables on a results page
06:56 <+perlmonkey2> hmm
06:57 <+patspam> for instance, say you're recreating one of those cheesy magazine-type surveys that tell you what category you fall into
06:59 <+patspam> for each category, you add a score expression: score { value(var1) > 10} CATEGORY1; score { value(var20) == 3} CATEGORY2, etc..
06:59 <+perlmonkey2> Oh, I get you, and I think it is a really clever idea.
06:59 <+perlmonkey2> I'm just thinking that when this is implemented, it might be a good idea to refactor the section, question, answer paradigm into something more generalized that allows for other, more speialized objects to be added.
06:59 <+perlmonkey2> specialized.
07:00 <+patspam> for example?
07:01 <+perlmonkey2> right now a lot of very similiar code is reimplemented for all three objects.  Maybe refactor that into roles, so adding a new "scoring" object won't require making 15,000 code changes.
07:01 <+patspam> ah, I don't think we need to add a new object to achieve this
07:01 <+perlmonkey2> instead of having jumping sections, we have a jump object that can be placed anywhere.
07:02 <+perlmonkey2> I mean "logical" sections.  We have a logical object.
07:02 <+perlmonkey2> can be an answer, question, or section.
07:02 <+perlmonkey2> or placed after any of those.
07:02 <+patspam> yeah that'd be cool. And at the same time I'd love to be able to nest sections
07:03 <+perlmonkey2> wait....hah
07:03 <+perlmonkey2> you said add a section, and I thought you meant add functionality to the section objets.
07:03 <+perlmonkey2> hah.
07:03 <+perlmonkey2> nevermind.
07:03 <+perlDreamer> preaction: that guy from France added 2% to the WebGUI translation for us
07:03 <+perlmonkey2> okay, yes.  maybe a tab button that pops up a scoring panel where those rules are entered.
07:04 <+patspam> heh yeah, for the scoring expression thing the only thing we add (right at the end) is a new key in the response hash
07:04 <+patspam> but in general we could do lots more refactoring
07:04 <+perlmonkey2> or a special scoring screen where multiple scoring lists can be created for multiple templates.
07:05 <+perlmonkey2> anyways, I dig the idea.  Sounds like a really powerful feature for users.  Way easier than sqlreports or figuring out how to use the temptable on their own.
07:05 <+patspam> yeah, agreed
07:06 <+patspam> although nothing to stop people from pulling the responseJSON out of the db and doing whatever they like with it too
07:06 <+patspam> I'll implement the simplest approach with scoring expressions first, and later we can add more awesome
07:07 <+perlmonkey2> absolutely.....this takes away nothing from power users, but allows a pidgin language to quickly put together a complex list of params for a template.
07:08 <+perlmonkey2> man, that is just a cool idea.  Seems like this could be applied to quite a few wobjects in wG.
07:10 <+patspam> I'd love to do a comprehensive feature comparison of Survey with the best available web-based products out there (commercial or otherwise)
07:10 <@preaction> what if SQLReport could deserialize JSON?
07:11 <@preaction> hmm... but how would it know?
07:12 <+perlDreamer> it would be easier in TT
07:12 <+perlDreamer> since you can call subroutines and methods in it
07:13 <@preaction> ha! right!
07:13 <+perlDreamer> you can do that in H::T, too
07:13 <+perlDreamer> they just have to be setup ahead of time
07:14 <@preaction> yeah, yeah, i get it
07:14 <@preaction> that would work
07:16  * perlmonkey2 sets up to go to bed.  
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07:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10664 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 2 dirs): 
07:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Survey Branch Expressions can now test whether a question
07:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: has been reached/answered, rather than just testing for the value
07:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: of a response
08:03 <+perlDreamer> in svn, on the commandline, does anyone know how to get a listing of which files were included in a particular revision?
08:06 <+perlDreamer> svn log -vr
08:06 <@preaction> ooh nice
08:07 <@preaction> perlDreamer: quick question about an RFE
08:08 <@preaction> http://www.webgui.org/rfe/request-for-enhancement/hyperlinks-on-the-fly
08:08 <@preaction> should i just allow a "None" entry under a template for this, or should I specifically add an option to "Enable viewing"
08:08 <+perlDreamer> ...reading
08:09 <@preaction> basically she wants to allow Redirect asset to appear in Layout as a link
08:09 <@preaction> and I think that might be a good idea, especially if Layouts get used more
08:09 <@preaction> i don't use layouts as much as i probably should, but they're powerful tools
08:10 <+perlDreamer> this almost doesn't sound like a template to me
08:10 <+perlDreamer> more like a mode toggle
08:10 <+perlDreamer> Display redirect?
08:10 <+perlDreamer> or Force Redirect?
08:10 <@preaction> i want a template so that more can be done, like one of those buttons on the webgui.org page Learn, Participate, Support, or whatever
08:12 <+perlDreamer> If you allow a null template, you may have to subclass prepareView, view and www_view, since they assume (falsely) that the template is always accessible.
08:14 <@preaction> okay, so then the "Show in Layout" toggle would work better
08:14 <@preaction> it would explicitly say "This will only appear in page layouts"
08:14 <@preaction> and then clicking "yes" can enable the user to select a template
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08:34 <+perlDreamer> okay, it's a little more work than I thought going back through 19 revisions of template changes
08:35 <+perlDreamer> but Rogier has a list of all templates that changed in each revision, along with the commit comment
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09:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10665 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed)
09:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Survey Branch Expressions now allow you to "tag" data along the way and store
09:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: it in the response data structure along with the actual user input. Tag data
09:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: can be used in subsequent expressions, in [[tag]] templated text replacement,
09:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: and to classify responses in an arbitrary way.
09:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Refactored Survey expression utility subs that lookup values/scores/tags in
09:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: external assets.
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16:52 <@plainhao> was template_attachments added recently?
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17:05 <+bartjol> plainhao: where is that added?
17:07 <@plainhao> yeah, it's in wg svn HEAD, WebGUI::Asset::Template
17:10 <+bartjol> ah
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17:14 <+bartjol> plainhao: a paul added template attachements last friday, as far as I can see
17:15 <@plainhao> thanks, bartjol, i just saw that :)
17:16 <+bartjol> not sure who paul is, but bug him about it :)
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17:48 <+bartjol> perlDreamer!
17:48 <+perlDreamer> hey, bartjol!
17:48  * perlDreamer needs to take kids to school in a few minutes, but I'll be right back
17:48 <+bartjol> ok
17:48 <@tavisto> Hello Big Dutch Girlyman!
17:50 <+bartjol> hee tavisto!
17:51 <+bartjol> everything Ok?
17:51 <@tavisto> yep, been very busy and hopefully we'll have some of our newest leads turn into customers
17:52 <+bartjol> cool, was that from those latest ad:tech?
17:52 <@tavisto> yeah quite a few new leads from that
17:52 <@tavisto> and some others that just came in from the web and cmsmatrix
17:52 <+bartjol> nice
17:53 <+bartjol> also rock stars?
17:53 <@tavisto> one definitely has the potential
17:55 <+bartjol> and further, already having kids?
17:57 <+bartjol> I mostly have some muscle ache from sailing and "remodelling my house" with a sledgehammer
17:59 <@tavisto> nice... did you go on a long sailing trip?
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18:01 <+bartjol> no, just one day with 4 short races. but that gives you only less time to rest, so I was pretty tired
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18:01 <+bartjol> in 2 weeks I will be sailing to Englanf
18:01 <+bartjol> England
18:07 <+perlDreamer> wow!
18:08 <+perlDreamer> you have an ocean going sail boat, bartjol?
18:10 <@tavisto> he has a 10ft dingy
18:11 <+bartjol> no a 27 foot pion
18:11 <+bartjol> and it's not mine
18:12 <+bartjol> it's from a father's friend
18:12 <+bartjol> a friend's father
18:14 <+bartjol> and no tavisto, I'm not suicidal
18:14 <@tavisto> hehe I know, I learned to sail in like a 12ft dingy.. and it was on a lake
18:14 <@tavisto> it wouldn't last 5 minutes in the ocean
18:15 <+bartjol> http://www.pionklasse.nl/pionnenboek?wid=122&func=viewSubmission&sid=69
18:15 < carogray> bartjol: -to  where in England are you sailing? I will be in Norfolk in 3 weeks!
18:16 <+bartjol> Wolverstone, between Harwich and Ipswitch
18:17 <+bartjol> http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=woolverstone&sll=37.062500,-95.677068&sspn=54.005807,127.529297&ie=UTF8&cd=1&t=h&z=14&iwloc=A
18:17 <@tavisto> cool
18:18 < carogray> aah too far south for us..
18:19 <+bartjol> alas
18:19 < carogray> my husband will be windsurfing all over the coast when the wind is good - except only near us - in Holt. wouldn't it have been funny if you "ran" into each other:P
18:20 <+perlDreamer> bartjol, just keeping heading east, and you can sail to Madison
18:20 <+bartjol> last time I sailed there I met a friend of mine in the bathroom, he also sailed that race
18:20 <+bartjol> eee, you have a small little island in between: great britain
18:22 <+bartjol> and a few 100's of miles USA perlDreamer
18:23 <+perlDreamer> once you hit North America, just said up around toward Canada, and take a left
18:24 <+perlDreamer> that'll get you to a series of large lakes
18:24 <+perlDreamer> follow them until you get to michigan
18:24 <+perlDreamer> once you're there, we'll take care of the rest
18:25 <+bartjol> rent a car, follow route 90 west, I believe, get off at madison etc
18:31 <+bartjol> perlDreamer: Illinois also ok, at leat I know my way in Chicago
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19:03 -!- WebGUI is now known as SynQ
19:04 <+perlDreamer> what's the good word, SynQ?
20:03 < SynQ> the right word is love
20:03 < SynQ> the good word, depends on the bad and the ugly one
20:34 <@preaction> wow, this year's wuc is going to be awesome
20:35 <@preaction> there are so many presentations i want to see... and of course some HAVE to conflict
20:35 <+perlDreamer> is the schedule finalized?
20:35 <@preaction> it's up on the site, i know that much
20:36 <@preaction> it's mostly the beginner courses i want to see, they're a lot about how to use webgui to accomplish goals
20:36 <@preaction> Lisa's "Social WebGUI" and Chris's WebGUI in Government
20:37 <@preaction> Roy's Enterprise WebGUI
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21:02 <+perlDreamer> BartJol?  You're back
21:02 <+BartJol> I am
21:03 <+BartJol> got problems?
21:03 <+perlDreamer> I do, do you have a little time?
21:04 <+BartJol> sure
21:04 <+perlDreamer> Please read this: http://jquelin.blogspot.com/2009/04/on-coders-and-translators.html?showComment=1241409480000#c892450259529363533
21:04 <+perlDreamer> I found a fellow who would help us with the french translation of WebGUI
21:04 <+BartJol> that's cool
21:05 <+perlDreamer> he has a question about international characters
21:05 <+perlDreamer> whether they should be HTML encoded, or straight characters
21:05  * perlDreamer doesn't know
21:05 <+BartJol> ai
21:05 <@preaction> the HTML encoding should happen by the translation server itself, if it doesn't i would consider that a bug
21:06 <+BartJol> dutch hasn't gor that much strange characters (a lot of strange people we do have though)
21:06 <+perlDreamer> what about unlauts, accents, and so on?
21:06 <+BartJol> mostly german
21:06 <+BartJol> but we have some
21:07 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, you're our resident utf8 guru (due to long suffering experience).  What do you think?
21:07 <+BartJol> in the last editor that wasn't a problem
21:08 <+BartJol> dor me
21:08 <+BartJol> for
21:09 <+BartJol> but I agree with preaction that they should be encoded by the serevr
21:09 <@preaction> if it's even necessary to encode them, that is
21:09 <@preaction> user shouldn't care
21:10  * preaction imagines a world where the translation server outputs multiple types of i18n files
21:10 <+BartJol> how are the i18n messages encoded now?
21:10 <@preaction> i don't know
21:10  * perlDreamer thinks that the i18n server is utf8 safe
21:10 <+perlDreamer> just like WebGUI
21:11 <@preaction> damnit, another project i want to do... make the encoder/decoder in the translation server pluggable
21:11 <+BartJol> it says "use utf8" in the script
21:11 <@preaction> that just means the code might contain utf8 characters in it
21:12 <+perlDreamer> no, it's for utf8 handling
21:12 <@preaction> which would be those i18n modules, since they're perl code
21:12 <+perlDreamer> the filehandles use utf8
21:12 <@preaction> i thought Encode was for utf8 string handling
21:12 <@preaction> and "use utf8" was for utf8 inside code (like the Perl modules we use for i18n)
21:13 <+perlDreamer> you're right.  It's for when i18n modules are required into the code.
21:14 <+BartJol> I do see html encoded stuff in the messages
21:18 <+BartJol> mm, also see messages without code for same characters
21:21 <+perlDreamer> that's a Data::Dumper bug
21:22 <+BartJol> that is on my server. now I'm seaking for the messages in my site
21:23 <+BartJol> both seem to work fine
21:30 <+perlDreamer> cool, I'll let him know that
21:30 <+perlDreamer> thanks, BartJol!
21:31 <+perlDreamer> there's another guy on that site who says he may translate some Esperanto
21:37 <+BartJol> ok, dinner time
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21:43 < knowmad> perlDreamer: i have a blocked send queued email messages workflow; got a minute to help me investigate it?
21:44 <+perlDreamer> knowmad, actually I have to head off for a run
21:44 < knowmad> ok, i'll see what i can learn
21:44 < knowmad> have a good run
21:44  * perlDreamer guesses you will find that the currentActivityId is blank
21:44 < knowmad> in what table?
21:45 <+perlDreamer> WorkflowInstance
21:45 < knowmad> i've got nothing in there
21:45 <+perlDreamer> and the workflow still won't run?
21:45 <+perlDreamer> now I'm curious
21:45 <+perlDreamer> but I still have to head out
21:45 <+perlDreamer> making the running partner mad only means more miles
21:46 < knowmad> :)
21:46 < knowmad> later
21:46 <+perlDreamer> http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/10189 for reference about the empty currentActivityid
21:51 <+perlDreamer> knowmad, the running partner is late, so I have 10 minutes
21:52 <+perlDreamer> any error messages in the webgui.log?
21:54 < knowmad> yes, i'm seeing spectre connection errors
21:54 < knowmad> was just reading over the bug report
21:54 < knowmad> this is happening on a site that has 2 domains operating out of a single database -- like pb and webgui.org
21:55 < knowmad> actually, there are more like 16 domains....
21:55 <+perlDreamer> out of 1 db?
21:55 <+perlDreamer> wow
21:55 < knowmad> yep, they run training courses
21:55 < knowmad> we prob wouldn't do it this way again
21:56 < knowmad> but we do have the webgui/etc/conf files for each of these subdomains which i wonder if we really need
21:56 < knowmad> they are definitely causing spectre errors
21:57 <+perlDreamer> so it's more like the main site has 16 aliases, or 16 branches all running off of 1 "real" WebGUI site?
21:59 < knowmad> yes
22:00 <+perlDreamer> yeah, then AFAIK, you don't need conf files for the subdomains
22:00 <+perlDreamer> spectre will make requests for data for all of them
22:00 <+perlDreamer> which will make duplicates of every cron job
22:00 < knowmad> that might be the issue
22:00 < knowmad> i just restarted spectre and mail is flowing again
22:01 <+perlDreamer> what were the connection errors?
22:01 < knowmad> let me get my log
22:02 < knowmad> 500 Internal Server Error
22:03 <+perlDreamer> are there corresponding apache error log entries?
22:03 < knowmad> checking...
22:06 < knowmad> lots of db connection errors and then -- Label not found for "last WEBGUI_FATAL" at /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Session/ErrorHandler.pm line 235.
22:06 < knowmad> hadn't seen that one before
22:06 <+perlDreamer> sorry, knowmad, this makes twice that I need to run out on you.
22:06 <+perlDreamer> I'd file this as a new bug
22:07 <+perlDreamer> since the WEBGUI_FATAL label _does_ exist over in URL/Content.pm, line 58
22:07 <+perlDreamer> later
22:07 < knowmad> ok
22:10 < knowmad> the problem is that this is showing up in v7.5.40 which is not supported; anyone using that version who has patched this error?
22:44 <@preaction> quick advice needed on refactoring the Collab system: the "sub getThreadsPaginator" is huge, and devotes nearly 20 lines to getting which column to sort by. should that be moved into its own sub?
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22:59 <@Haarg> preaction, that sounds like a good idea
23:00 <@preaction> okay, so i'll try to granulate the collab system
23:00 <@preaction> but i have to write the tests first, then i can granulate, then i can test the newly granulated method
23:00 <@preaction> evil...
23:00 <@Haarg> also, re: pluggable encoder/decoder in the translation server
23:00 <@Haarg> what are you referring to with that?
23:01 <@preaction> we could use the translationserver.cgi to also do GNU gettext or some other program's proprietary database i18n or something
23:01 < slickware> I just got the WUC2009 email  - looks like it's filling up nicely
23:01 <@preaction> make the translation server generally useful, to lead an effort to crowd-source i18n for more programs
23:01 <@Haarg> hmm
23:01 <@preaction> like the blog post perlDreamer linked to suggests
23:02 <@preaction> i dunno if it's possible, or even a good idea, but probably a few projects have i18n like ours (just key => value pairs essentially)
23:03 <@Haarg> i've started work on a new translation server, but it can't do much yet
23:04 <@preaction> ooh nice
23:04 <@Haarg> but it's very specific to our usage - getting it to handle that would be even harder than doing so with the current translation server
23:05 <@preaction> aww
23:05 <@preaction> eh, it's not a priority
23:05 <@preaction> just another wall-banging idea
23:05 <@Haarg> i still have to adjust and finalize the design in a few places though, so i'll keep that in mind
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23:07 <@Haarg> i should try to get it cleaned up enough to where i could put it on github
23:14 <+perlmonkey2> Anyone do anything outside on May 1st?
23:15 <@preaction> nope, was supposed to go for a bike ride but couldn't
23:15 <@preaction> today is beautiful though, so i can make it up
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23:41 <+perlmonkey2> preaction: not funny?
23:42 <@preaction> didn't watch yet
23:44 <@preaction> that's beautiful
23:44 <+perlmonkey2> yeah, totally made my day.
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23:53 <+perlDreamer> wow, so all you Plain Black guys don't have to present this year
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01:07 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, I'm trying to think of a way to automatically test shipping and payment drivers that require development keys
01:07 <+perlDreamer> is it safe to stash them in the config file?
01:08 <@Haarg> so anyone can run the tests?
01:11 <+perlDreamer> well, no
01:12 <+perlDreamer> developer keys are licensed on a 1/person basis
01:12 <+perlDreamer> so I can't hardcode a set inside the tests
01:12 <+perlDreamer> so the config file was the next best option I could think of
01:12 <@Haarg> developer keys are separate from user keys?
01:13 <@Haarg> or whatever the person running the site would need?
01:13 <+perlDreamer> yes.  they go to a non-production server
01:13 <+perlDreamer> at least for this 1 driver setup I've found
01:13 <+perlDreamer> for ITransact, you tell the remote end whether it is a test or not.
01:13 <+perlDreamer> but for others, you get a developer key, or a user key
01:14 <@preaction> i like the ITransact way :p
01:15 <@Haarg> well, the config file seems as good as any place for a developer key.  user keys would need to be in the ui of course.
01:19 <+perlDreamer> yeah
01:19 <+perlDreamer> in all likelihood, only 2-3 people will ever run the tests
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01:43 < zylopfa> Wouldn't it be a good idea to make the "Send Mail To Group" function be templatable?
01:44 < zylopfa> So you can send mail where fields in the userProfileData and user tables can be used in mails?
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01:54 <+perlDreamer> zylopfa, that almost sounds like something you could do with macros
01:54 <+perlDreamer> are they evaluated in that email?
01:54 < zylopfa> Its because i have a group with 400 members i wish to send an email with invitation to testdrive the site
01:55 < zylopfa> and in the mail i need vars such as <ttmpl_var username> <tmpl_var temppassword>
01:55 < zylopfa> Macros arent evaluated in the sendtogroup function
01:55 < zylopfa> I tested it a moment ago
01:56 < zylopfa> Imo it should be templatable cause when you send out to a group chance is you wish to use some fields in userProfileData
01:56 < zylopfa> to make the mails more personal
02:00 < zylopfa> I will make a Mailer.pm wobject i think to facilitate sending mail to groups with templated messages
02:00 < zylopfa> instead of grinding at the core of webgui
02:00 < zylopfa> Its the whole group mailing function that is assuming that each of the group will receive the exact same mail
02:01 <+perlDreamer> it would be a good RFE to add macros to the send group mail
02:01 <+perlDreamer> 1 line of code
02:01 < zylopfa> yeah perlDreamer but that dont change it
02:01 <+perlDreamer> and safe from security, since only admins can use that function
02:01 <+perlDreamer> huh?
02:01 < zylopfa> if you macro ^User(name);
02:01 <+perlDreamer> yes
02:01 < zylopfa> in the message you send
02:01 < zylopfa> it will only have Admin in it
02:01 < zylopfa> for all the users
02:01 <+perlDreamer> no :)
02:02 < zylopfa> yeah
02:02 < zylopfa> Cause the mail function send 1 mail
02:02 <+perlDreamer> no
02:02 < zylopfa> it dont iterate the messages
02:02 < zylopfa> it only send it with changed email address
02:02 <+perlDreamer> Operation/Group.pm, line 634
02:02 <+perlDreamer> toGroup = $session->form->process('gid')
02:02 <+perlDreamer> that makes it send 1 email to each person in the group
02:02 <+perlDreamer> and they're processed individually
02:02 < zylopfa> yesh but look in the mail sender
02:03 < zylopfa> look in that sub
02:03 < zylopfa> I will make this wob
02:03 < zylopfa> WebGUI::Mail::Send->create
02:03 <+perlDreamer> it pushes 1 email into the queue
02:03 < zylopfa> yes 
02:03 <+perlDreamer> but it sends 1 email to each user in the group
02:03 < zylopfa> and wont iterate it 
02:03 < zylopfa> yeah but it wont change the email body
02:04 <+perlDreamer> that is what would need to change
02:04 < zylopfa> sure you can make it do it
02:04 < zylopfa> but its more than 1 line
02:04 <+perlDreamer> you're right, it is more than 1 line
02:05 < zylopfa> Sir
02:05 < zylopfa> Also you have to change the send thing
02:06 <+perlDreamer> yes, indeed
02:06 < zylopfa> and perhaps the queue function also
02:07 <+perlDreamer> queue would have to be modified to handle sending to a single person
02:07 < zylopfa> yeah
02:07 < zylopfa> For now i will make a wobject with a "Group" field, a HTMLArea field, subject field
02:08 < zylopfa> and when i send with my wobject, it will interpolate all the fields in userProfileData  with <tmpl_var profilefield>
02:09 < zylopfa> I so love the webgui API, its simply genious
02:10 < zylopfa> I am calling my new wobject GroupMailer
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02:24  * patspam is sad there's only 2 days of wuc talks now
02:25  * zylopfa comforts patspam
02:26 <+perlDreamer> patspam, maybe we should hold an extra conference day on Wednesday, anyway
02:26 <+patspam> hackathon?
02:26 <+perlDreamer> sure!
02:27 <+patspam> sweet!
02:27 <+perlDreamer> JT's house has 3 levels
02:27 <+perlDreamer> 1 level for each track
02:27 <+patspam> heheh awesome
02:27 <+perlDreamer> API hacking on the first floor
02:27 <+perlDreamer> UI hacking on the 2nd floor
02:27 <+perlDreamer> and leftover hacking (business, management, strategy) on the 3rd floor
02:27 <+patspam> and lightning talks at lunch :)
02:28 < zylopfa> sounda awesome
02:28 <+perlDreamer> you coming, zylopfa?
02:28 < zylopfa> to bad i am no there :/
02:28 < zylopfa> Its in the US isnt it ?
02:28 <+perlDreamer> maybe you could hitch a ride on BatJol's boat
02:28 < zylopfa> haha nice
02:28 < zylopfa> I definately wanna come some time
02:33 <+perlDreamer> it's like 5 times better than IRC, since you can see people
02:34  * patspam heads out for coffee
02:35 < zylopfa> I have read all about you guys so you are the only ones I "know"
02:35 < zylopfa> would be awesome to meet up at wuc
02:41 < zylopfa> I am going for 1000+ karma this year i only have 542 atm :(
02:42 <+perlDreamer> how do you earn your karma?
02:44 < zylopfa> I have made some of the danish translation (i am the only from Denmark doing it)
02:44 < zylopfa> And i have fixed some small bugs
02:44  * perlDreamer would give you 1000 karma for 50% completion of the Danish translation
02:44 < zylopfa> and i have made a thing in the bazaar that some liked
02:44 < zylopfa> awesome perlDreamer 
02:45 < zylopfa> I have yet to understand why not many from Denmark use webgui
02:45 < zylopfa> Its gold waiting to be picked up imo
02:45 <+perlDreamer> it's just that people don't know about it
02:45 < zylopfa> yeah true
02:46 < zylopfa> but maybe also cause you need to know about linux to get it installed
02:46 <+perlDreamer> yes, installation is still hard
02:47 <+perlDreamer> time for me to make dinner for the kids, be back later
02:47 < zylopfa> I am lucky that i know everything about linux to host webgui, i have my own 1 man company that design, host and make apps for webgui
02:47 < zylopfa> Take care perlDreamer !
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05:11 < zylopfa> If you have a variable $message containing template variable tags
05:12 < zylopfa> how can you prepare it, like you do normal templates?
05:12 < zylopfa> I want to replace all <tmpl_var something> in this variable with the $var fields
05:13 <+patspam> zylopfa: in your wobject code?
05:13 < zylopfa> yes Sir
05:13 <+patspam> do you want to add those vars to an existing template that's being used?
05:13 <+patspam> or template something that currently isn't templated?
05:14 < zylopfa> just a simple text scalar i wish to replace <tmpl_var something> tags with the %var things
05:14 <+patspam> ah ok
05:14 < zylopfa> return $self->processTemplate($var,$my-text);
05:14 < zylopfa> something like this
05:14 <+patspam> you use the same template engine that the rest of webgui uses
05:14 < zylopfa> but not with a template variable
05:15 < zylopfa> I just wish my $text variable containing the text from a htmlarea to be the template
05:15 < zylopfa> can that be done?
05:16 <+patspam> sure!
05:16 <+patspam> if I understand you correctly..
05:17 < zylopfa> I GOT IT NOW :D
05:17 < zylopfa> sub processTemplate {
05:17 < zylopfa>     my $self = shift;
05:17 < zylopfa>     my $var = shift;
05:17 < zylopfa>     my $templateId = shift;
05:17 < zylopfa>     my $template = shift;
05:17 < zylopfa> sorry for spam
05:17 <+patspam> that's ok.. you can use pastebin
05:17 <+patspam> webgui.pastebin.com
05:17 < zylopfa> but i see that it just needs an argument more which can be the template
05:17 < zylopfa> in pure text
05:17 < zylopfa> god i love webgui all is taken care of
05:18 < zylopfa> patspam, I just made a GroupMailer wobject
05:18 < zylopfa> a simple thing that has a Group, Subject and mail message
05:19 <+patspam> congratulations :)
05:19 < zylopfa> and then it sends the mail message to all users in the group, and it also substitute template variables like <tmpl_var username> and
05:19 <+patspam> great to hear that you've caught the webgui bug =D
05:19 < zylopfa> all fields in the userProfileData
05:19 < zylopfa> I made a Wobject for it instead of changing the code
05:19 <+perlDreamer> zylopfa is porting an old website with ~10K users to WebGUI
05:20 < zylopfa> yeah perlDreamer 
05:20 <+patspam> legend!
05:20 < zylopfa> i make this wobject to send out to 400 of the users to test the beta version
05:21 < zylopfa> i neede the mail i send to be like: Dear <tmpl_var username> ... bla bla here is your password <tmpl_var tmppassword>
05:23 <+patspam> zylopfa: doing it as a wobject is totally fine, but next time around you might want to do it as a Content Handler instead.. you still have access to the same awesome webgui API, but instead of having a wobject that conceptually is an asset to be added (possibly in multiple places) as content, you have a single interface that controls your mailouts
05:24 < zylopfa> ahh thanks a lot patspam, it makes more sense as you say to have 1 on the entire site instead of being able to add more of them
05:25 <+perlDreamer> it would be be even better if the Mail/Send API didn't suck and it was easy to evaluate Macros in emails sent from WebGUI
05:25 < zylopfa> yeah true perlDreamer 
05:25 < zylopfa> I didnt wanna mess with it thats why i made the wobject
05:25 < zylopfa> cause its in the design that you have to change some things
05:25 < zylopfa> in the way the mailer was designed from the start
05:26 <+perlDreamer> exactly
05:26 < zylopfa> Its strange though that it assumes you wish to send the totaly same mail to a group of users
05:26 < zylopfa> ok you can send a newsletter out but i like the personalization bit
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05:30 <+perlDreamer> submit an RFE about it, zylopfa
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05:30 < zylopfa> yeah I will do it now
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05:30 <+perlDreamer> we'll figure it out someday
05:30 <+perlDreamer> unless you get to it first :)
05:30 < zylopfa> Also i have a question about User->profileField
05:30 <+perlDreamer> yes?
05:31 < zylopfa> it can return a users profile field using profileField(fieldname)
05:31 < zylopfa> I was wondering why it doesnt have a profileField() way to be called
05:31 < zylopfa> so it return all the profilefields as a hash
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05:34 < elnino> when I do a ps aux, should the number of modproxy = modperls?
05:35 <+perlDreamer> it could zylopfa.  it just doesn't
05:36 < zylopfa> elnino, I think so i have equal numbers on my install
05:36 < elnino> I usually do too, but for somereason I do not a this time. Just  happened to look.
05:49 < elnino> in the wre.conf file, what is the difference between wreMonitor -> modproxyAdministrativelyDown and wreMonitor->items->modproxy ?
05:53 <@preaction> elnino: the wremonitor keeps track if you wanted to restart mysql, (that's administratively down), and it temporarily doesn't check it
05:54 < elnino> preaction, then what does wreMonitor->items->modproxy control?
05:55 <@preaction> whether or not it should monitor modproxy at all
05:55 < elnino> so if I disable wreMonitor->items->modproxy, then I don't need to do wreMonitor->moproxyAdministrativelyDown?
05:55 < elnino> s/need to/need to disable
05:56 < elnino> and if I have wreMonitor->items->modproxy enabled, and modproxyAdministravelyDown disabled, what would wreMonitor do? just tell me? and not try to restart it?
05:56 <@preaction> right
05:57 <@preaction> modproxyAdministrativelyDown is set by wreservice.pl, it's not something you do manually
05:57 < elnino> oh. then why is it in the conf file?? =)
05:57 < elnino> I'll go fix my wiki.  =)
05:57 <@preaction> probably because it was just easier to put it there for JT
05:57 < elnino> lol
05:59 < elnino> it's set by wreservice or wremonitor?
06:01 <@preaction> wreservice.pl
06:01 < elnino> preaction - do YOU konw if when ps aux is performed if the number of modproxy should equal modperls?  I stopped the services on my server, double checked they were gone, and started them, and they still don't equal the same number.
06:02 < elnino> theres less modperls than there are modproxies.
06:02 < elnino> thanks for clarifying myother quesiton. I fixed my wiki
06:03 < elnino> .
06:03 < elnino> zylopfa and I were both under the impression that the number of each should equal.
06:04 <@preaction> modproxy should be more, since it will serve static files as well
06:05 < elnino> oh. ok.  I used to have 10/10 and I now am noticing I have 14/7. Plus I think my modproxy is proxying an apache site (which I suspect would also affect this).  I guess I never saw this before.
06:05 < elnino> I suppose it depends on the time of day.
06:06 < elnino> tomorrow, I'll be upgrading to 7.6 yippee!!
06:07 < elnino> long awaited.  Have a good night all!
06:21 <+patspam> night elnino!
06:21  * patspam heads off for lunch
06:39 < zylopfa> anyone on for a quick question?
06:43 <@preaction> perhaps
06:44 < zylopfa> I am working on making my $text variable be templated
06:44 < zylopfa> and i have found the function
06:44 < zylopfa> my $message= WebGUI::Asset::Template->processRaw($session,$tmpmsg,$var);
06:45 < zylopfa> but it wont do anything :( the <tmpl_var > in the text doesn't get substituted
06:52 < zylopfa> sure i could just do a s/<tmpl_var fieldName>/$var->{'fieldname'}/gi;
06:52 < zylopfa> but that seems lame when there is a template system already in place
06:54 <@preaction> so $tmpmsg contains "<tmpl_var something>" and $var contains { something => "some text" } ?
06:54 < zylopfa> Exactly
06:55 <@preaction> can you pastebin the actual code somewhere? or a minimal test case perhaps?
06:55 < zylopfa> the only thing i get in the $message is the original text with the "<tmpl_var something> in them
06:55 < zylopfa> so the processor return the string i gave it but doesnt seem to substitute anything
07:06 < zylopfa> LOL preaction i found out why!!
07:09 < zylopfa> sometimes i am too stupid for my own good
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09:55 < CIA-23> webgui: Patrick Donelan flux * rf023b7e / lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm : Improved Survey exportStructure - http://bit.ly/EKldZ
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16:19 < zylopfa> Greetings Webguians!
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18:52 <+perlDreamer> bopbop, preaction, Haarg: we need a SPAM post removed from the forum
18:52 <+perlDreamer> http://www.webgui.org/web_design_templates_and_themes/combining-response-driven-with-section-survey/5#id2sbscGbO33OJsV9eR3HM0A
18:57 <@bopbop> gone
18:57 <@bopbop> there were three users who posted a bunch of those last nige
18:57 <@bopbop> night
18:57 <+perlDreamer> grrrr
18:58 <@bopbop> yep
18:58 <+perlDreamer> what they seem to be doing is taking posts, copying the contents, and then inserting spam links into the original post.
18:58 <+perlDreamer> even the username is suspect, yahoohao
18:58 <@bopbop> yeah, not nice
18:58 <@bopbop> there was another called sinalong
18:58 <+perlDreamer> nice
19:01 <+perlDreamer> at first, with that yahoohao username, I thought plainhao was testing a SPAM filter
19:01 <+perlDreamer> then I realized that if he had, he would have deleted it after the test
19:02 <@bopbop> I assumed yahoohao was hao from our staff
19:02 <@bopbop> so I didn't look at that one
19:02 <@bopbop> oh yeah... what you just said
19:02 <@bopbop> :)
19:03  * plainhao was elsewhere doing other naughty things, truly.
19:04 <@plainhao> how's your thumb, bopbop?
19:04 <@bopbop> sore
19:04 <@bopbop> not good
19:04 <@plainhao> how's your kid, failed the test?
19:04 <+perlDreamer> what happened to the thumb?
19:04 <@bopbop> failed the test-yeah!
19:04 <@plainhao> cool
19:05  * plainhao is happy that bopbop's kid failed the official test.
19:05 <@bopbop> I cut off the corner of my thumb yesterday while chopping some vegetables- took off a a good chunk of the fingernail and underlying nail bed and the the side/corner
19:05 <+perlDreamer> ouch!
19:05 <@plainhao> did you go to e.r.?
19:05 <@bopbop> no
19:06 <@bopbop> probably should have
19:06 <+perlDreamer> yes!
19:06 <+perlDreamer> they can reattach if you go quickly
19:06  * plainhao is amazed at cheeseheads.
19:06 <+perlDreamer> that happened to my mom
19:06 <+perlDreamer> she cut off part of her thumb with an axe
19:06 <+perlDreamer> (not while chopping vegetables)
19:06 <@bopbop> it gives me the willies every time I change the bandage - yikes, an ax?
19:06 <@bopbop> chopping off chicken heads instead?
19:06 <+perlDreamer> she was chopping wood
19:07 <@bopbop> ow
19:07 <+perlDreamer> don't ask why her hand was on the wood while chopping
19:07 <@bopbop> hehe
19:07  * plainhao thinks she should've asked someone else to hold the wood.
19:07 <+perlDreamer> I was inside on a break
19:07 <+perlDreamer> otherwise I would have chopped it off for her
19:07 <@bopbop> did she get it reattached
19:08 <@bopbop> or was she tough
19:08 <+perlDreamer> she did
19:08 <@bopbop> like me
19:08 <+perlDreamer> s/tough/other adjective/;
19:08 <+perlDreamer> she even got the feeling back after a couple of years
19:08 <@bopbop> I actually was being kind of a chicken- I was afraid they would cauterize it, which I hear hurts really bad
19:08 <+perlDreamer> in the meantime, she used it to stir hot coffee
19:08 <@bopbop> yeah, my thumb is pretty numb
19:08 <@bopbop> nice
19:08 <+perlDreamer> that's my mom
19:09 <+perlDreamer> you should still have a doctor look at it, bopbop
19:09 <@bopbop> we'll see
19:09 <@bopbop> the bleeding has slowed way down
19:10 <@bopbop> so I think I'm in the clear, but if the pain picks up or things start to turn colors I'll go in
19:10 <@bopbop> there's not really anything they can do at this point
19:11 <+perlDreamer> rum
19:11 <+perlDreamer> good astringent and pain medication
19:11 <@bopbop> yeah
19:11 <@bopbop> It is cinco de mayo- tequila might work too
19:11 <+perlDreamer> there ya go
19:12 <+perlDreamer> so how come all the other PB guys got to wiggle out of their WUC talks but you're still on?
19:12 <@bopbop> cuz I'm cool
19:12 <@bopbop> I don't know actually
19:12 <@bopbop> but I'm fine with it
19:12 <+perlDreamer> there's not even PB&J, so you must be way cool
19:12 <@bopbop> obviously
19:14 <+perlDreamer> yeah.  Just so you know, there are other ways to celebrate Cinco de Mayo instead of making the thumb red, green and white.
19:14 <@bopbop> oh I'm sure
19:15 <@bopbop> but I can wave my thumb in the air like the flag
19:15 <@bopbop> so it's convenient
19:15  * perlDreamer thinks if he teases you much more about it that the thumb may be replaced with another finger.
19:15 <@bopbop> :)
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19:59 < zylopfa> Greetings, all the americanos are up now ;)
20:04 <+perlmonkey2> Vote, worst Perl OO implementation?
20:06 <+perlDreamer> perlmonkey2, we need some more context for that one...
20:07 <+perlDreamer> gotta scoot, gym time
20:07 <+perlmonkey2> perlDreamer: well, was the original OO of just blessed hashes worst?  inside-out?  etc?
20:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10666 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Form/Textarea.pm): Fix wrong attribute for script tag in Dataform.
20:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10667 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Form/Textarea.pm): Backporting script attribute fix for Form/Textarea
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21:26 < topsub> Is there a way to disable emails that a user would get from buying something from webgui?
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22:47 <+perlDreamer> topsub, in 7.7 there will be
22:47 <+perlDreamer> I think
22:47 <+perlDreamer> in 7.7 there will be a way to configure how/if you get inbox notifications
22:48 < topsub> pd, ahh
22:48 < topsub> i think i found the sub that sends out emails that i will override if the client approves the time
22:48 < topsub> we have a custom pay driver that i can move the sub into and almost "null" it out
22:55  * perlDreamer can't remember whether that emails directly, or whether it is an inbox message.
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22:58 <+perlDreamer> it goes through the inbox
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23:03 <+perlDreamer> hey, Haarg!
23:03 <@Haarg> greetings
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23:16 <+perlDreamer> EPO Ironman is up to 100 signups in its first month
23:16 <+perlDreamer> including recent submits from patspam and perlDreamer
--- Day changed Wed May 06 2009
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00:55 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, I think there may be a bug in Crud's serialized data types
00:55 <+perlDreamer> are you close to release?
00:55 <@Haarg> yes
00:55 <@Haarg> what is the bug?
00:56 <+perlDreamer> I have a crud field set to serialize automatically
00:56 <+perlDreamer> when I call update on it, it writes data to the database, then it resets the field to be the dataDefaultValue
00:56 <@Haarg> hrm
00:56 <+perlDreamer> that's what it looks like anyway
00:57 <+perlDreamer> and there's no use of serialize in the core so far
00:57 <+perlDreamer> time to start writing tests with a dummy class :)
00:58 <@Haarg> well, this isn't a priority for the release since crud isn't even used in core in 7.6
00:58 <+perlDreamer> no, I just wanted to know how much time I had
01:00 <+perlDreamer> also, dataDefault for the field needs to be a string to create the database, but it needs to be a data structure when building the object
01:02 <@Haarg> fun
01:02 <@Haarg> assets have the same problems
01:02 <+perlDreamer> really?
01:02 <+perlDreamer> how do the assets handle it?
01:02 <@Haarg> default is used both for form controls and for update
01:02 <+perlDreamer> oy
01:03 <+perlDreamer> so it breaks for the list types, or is there a fix in there?
01:03 <@Haarg> form controls accept whatever they are designed to, sometimes strings, sometimes structs.  update only accepts strings.
01:03 <@Haarg> no fix yet
01:03 <+perlDreamer> any opinions on "the right way" to fix Crud?
01:03 <@Haarg> that was the problem wgd edit Template was running into if you remember
01:03 <+perlDreamer> oh, yes
01:03 <@Haarg> we 'fixed' it by changing the default to a string instead of an array
01:04 <@Haarg> since there was no reason for it to be an array anyway
01:04 <@Haarg> but that didn't help the underlying cause
01:04 <@Haarg> crud should be simpler to fix i would think
01:04 <+perlDreamer> it's all the same codebase, so basically yes
01:04 <@Haarg> hmm
01:04  * perlDreamer is tempted to do the other fix
01:04 <+perlDreamer> and make dataDefault a data structure
01:05 <@Haarg> does it use the forms api as well?
01:05 <+perlDreamer> well, you can hack it to make it do that
01:05 <+perlDreamer> that would mean, strings
01:05 <@Haarg> better for it not to really
01:05 <@Haarg> the correct fix for asset's problem is to have update run every value through the forms api
01:06 <@Haarg> which is kind of a significant change and i don't like the speed implications it will have
01:06 <+perlDreamer> no, that wouldn't be fast
01:06 <@Haarg> crud is more self contained so i would think it could just convert the default as needed
01:06 <+perlDreamer> from string to data?
01:07 <+perlDreamer> or the other way?
01:07  * perlDreamer is leaning toward string, because it's very nice to have HTMLForm->dynamicForm build the forms for your Crud methods
01:07 <+perlDreamer> (which I'd forgotten about earlier)
01:09 <@Haarg> i think allowing structures in the default would be preferable
01:10 <+perlDreamer> why?
01:12 <@Haarg> because the whole point of the Crud, including the serialize flag is that you shouldn't have to think about the underlying storage mechanism
01:12 <@Haarg> form controls generally accept structs for value/default
01:12 <+perlDreamer> this is true
01:13 <+perlDreamer> wg8 can't come soon enough
01:13 <+perlDreamer> we won't have time/resources to fix it all though, will we?
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01:13 <@Haarg> not really
01:14 <+perlDreamer> I don't think data structures will work with serialize
01:14 <@Haarg> why not?
01:14 <+perlDreamer> what kind of Form type is JSON?
01:14 <@Haarg> this is a problem in update?
01:15 <+perlDreamer> we store it as text in the db
01:16 <@Haarg> <perlDreamer> I don't think data structures will work with serialize < you mean when using it with forms or fixing your initial problem?
01:16 <+perlDreamer> I mean at all
01:16 <+perlDreamer> I think they have to be strings
01:16 <@Haarg> why?
01:16 <@Haarg> fixing your initial problem is simple from what i see
01:17 <+perlDreamer> well, because of the answer to the question I posed above, "What kind of Form type is JSON?"
01:17 <+perlDreamer> serialized data is stored as text in the db
01:17 < zylopfa> Hello WebGUIans
01:17 <+perlDreamer> and crud_updateTable uses the form API to set column types
01:20 <+perlDreamer> hm, SelectList works with hashes, but not arrays
01:20 <+perlDreamer> and it's databaseFieldType is LONGTEXT
01:21 <@Haarg> the same problem of how to define column type exists whether you allow structs or not
01:22 < zylopfa> longtext is a big mofo with space
01:24 <@Haarg> you have to handle serialized structs manually anyway with form -> crud storage
01:24 <+perlDreamer> yes
01:24 <@Haarg> so i don't think it makes a difference really
01:25 <+perlDreamer> probably not, aside from handling update, crud_tableUpdate and everything else correctly
01:25 <+perlDreamer> correctly and consistently
01:25 <+perlDreamer> okay, I'll try data structures
01:26 <@Haarg> crud->updateFromFormPost looks broken though
01:26 <@Haarg> or maybe not
01:26 <@Haarg> i guess not
01:26 <+perlDreamer> it works okay, I've used it before, although not with a serialized data structure
01:27 <+perlDreamer> okay, so here's the convention I think I'm going with
01:27 <+perlDreamer> data structures in the crud_defintion
01:27 <+perlDreamer> crud_getProperties returns the definition unaltered
01:27 <+perlDreamer> users of crud_getProperties are expected to serialize when necessary
01:30 <@Haarg> i think this is actually just a typo
01:30 <+perlDreamer> in uFFP?
01:31 <+perlDreamer> maybe we need a JSON dummy form type
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01:31 <+perlDreamer> it is purposefully broken
01:31 <+perlDreamer> never processes form data
01:31 <@Haarg> http://gist.github.com/107254
01:33 <+perlDreamer> yes, that's a typo, but then consider when create calls update with a data structure
01:33 <+perlDreamer> which is where I am now
01:33 <@Haarg> it will be encoded and stored
01:36 <@Haarg> i guess i don't see the problem
01:36 <+perlDreamer> I think the problem is that I'm tired, and not thinking straight
01:37 <@Haarg> i'm going to fix that typo in 7.6
01:38 < zylopfa> Sweet
01:39 <@Haarg> i'll be back in a bit
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02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10668 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/ (23 files in 13 dirs): Change tests to use the automatic backup of Settings in END blocks.
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10669 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: 
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Only clone the data from Setting. This prevents trying to close the
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: session dbh twice and getting odd warning messages.
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10670 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/ (Asset/Post.t Group.t Asset/Asset.t lib/WebGUI/Test.pm): 
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Provide a way for WebGUI::Test to register groups to clean up at
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: the end of a test.
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Convert several tests to use that, including Post.t, which leaked Groups.
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10671 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: Forward port auto storage deletion code for WebGUI::Test.
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10672 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: Handle automatically cleaning up users at the end of a test.
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10673 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/Asset/Post.t: fix Post test cleaning up core groups
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10674 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (lib/WebGUI/Session/Setting.pm t/Session/Setting.t): 
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Have Setting's get work like other gets by returning a hashref when
02:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: no param is requested.
02:03 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10675 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/ (Mail/Send.t smtpd.pl): improve handling of SMTP test server
02:03 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10676 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Crud.pm): fixed: serialized fields in WebGUI::Crud were broken
02:14 < daviddelikat> I just had an upgrade fail http://webgui.pastebin.com/d39c9fd1a looking for HTML/Packer.pm
02:15 < daviddelikat> is that a new package from CPAN that I need to install?
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02:32  * daviddelikat read gotcha.txt
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02:49 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10677 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/docs/create.sql: preparing for 7.6.22 release
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03:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10678 /releases/WebGUI_7.6.22-stable: Release 7.6.22-stable
03:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10679 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (4 files in 4 dirs): preparing for 7.6.23 dev
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04:18 < ckotilHOME> Any one notice something funky about search results around 7.5.40? At 7.5.32 my search results would contain keywords in with the results. At 7.5.40 they only contain metadata. No more keywords.
04:20 < ckotilHOME> change logs are sparse from 7.5.31 - 7.6.0
04:21 < ckotilHOME> i guess ill upgrade from 7.5.32 to 7.5.40 manually untill i find the culprit
04:30 < ckotilHOME> aha! funkiness appears at 7.5.35
04:40 < ckotilHOME> ohh, i have major problems with this release. macro's arent executing. 
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05:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10680 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 4 dirs): 
05:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added Country question type to Survey
05:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Refactored WebGUI::Form::Country so that it can be used to return a list of countries
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07:05 <+perlDreamer> setRow will handle sparse data, won't it?
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09:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10681 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 4 dirs): 
09:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Refactored Survey ExpressionEngine tag() util into tag() setter and tagged() accessor.
09:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Updated i18n to reflect the fact that min/max/step are used for all numeric types, not just slider.
09:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Also updated textCols/Rows i18n.
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15:19 < daviddelikat> is there a perl test function/module that will do a deep comparison of a JSON data set returned from a function?
15:36 <+BartJol> daviddelikat: me thinks perldreamer will know
15:38 < daviddelikat> thanks, that seems likely, he usually drops in around 10:ish I('ll have to aska gain then.
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15:48 <+BartJol> to what do you want to compare it?
15:50 -!- khenn_ [n=khenn@adsl-76-208-68-155.dsl.mdsnwi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #WebGUI
15:54 <+BartJol> mmm, I should code more
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15:57 <+BartJol> happy birthday khenn_!
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15:57 <@khenn> thanks Bart =)
15:57 <+BartJol> how young are you now?
15:58 <@khenn> 34 years young
15:58 <+BartJol> oooh, so you have some more happy years tanking to go!
15:59 <+BartJol> very good
15:59 <@khenn> yep
16:04 < carogray> yoo hoo - how do you "force the calendar to update" to get a big webgui calendar to display feeds from little calendars?
16:05 < carogray> I am going round and round with scheduler and workflows and cannot figure out steps to make the calendar update
16:05 < carogray> I put 4 calendars in yesterday
16:06 < carogray> added ?func=ical to the end of each of the URLs and then put those URLs in the big calendar
16:06 < carogray> big calendar not showing little calendar's stuff
16:18 <+BartJol> carogray: sorry I don't know
16:18 < carogray> k- thanks
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16:20 < daviddelikat> carogray: in your big calendar you need to set the feed interval
16:21 < daviddelikat> it is on the display tab when you edit the asset.
16:21 < carogray> ok will have a look
16:22 < daviddelikat> no sorry, thats not the right bit, give me a minute...
16:26 < carogray> whoops - yeah that didn't seem quite right "period of time displayed in the icalendar feed" doesn't look like what I need
16:26 < daviddelikat> I know I've seen the setting but I cant remember quite where
16:26 < daviddelikat> i'll have it in a minute though
16:27 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10682 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
16:27 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10683 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
16:27 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10684 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
16:27 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10685 /translations/German/German/Shop.pm: Update from translation server
16:39 < daviddelikat> carogray: there is supposed to be an 'update calendar feed' but it seems to have gone AWOL.  I don't know why and unfortunately don't have any more time to investigate...
16:40 < carogray> ok thanks... will keep it on my plate and continue asking passersby. Thanks for investigating and confirming my suspicions.
16:41 < daviddelikat> i found it...
16:41 < daviddelikat> from the adminmenu go to the workflow are
16:41 < daviddelikat> ...area
16:42 < daviddelikat> then add new workflow
16:42 < daviddelikat> it says 'no object' with a save butotn, click save
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16:43 < daviddelikat> the update cal feed is the second on the list at the bottom, select it
16:43 < daviddelikat> then save it
16:44 < daviddelikat> then put a name in for the workflow and save it also
16:45 < daviddelikat> don't forget to mark it as enabled
16:45 < daviddelikat> carogray: are you catching this?
16:46 < carogray> thanks - no I wasn't now I am paying attention!
16:46 < daviddelikat> after you save the last bit then you can go to the schedular and schedule the workflow.
16:47 < daviddelikat> does it make sense?
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16:47  * MrHairgrease congratulates Frank with being older than me
16:48 < carogray> what about Mode? I was just reading about serial, parallel and singleton...I am sure I don't want parallel - running in the background when WebGUI has time, nor singleton - I think I want serial
16:49 < daviddelikat> I think singlton is what you want.
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16:50 < daviddelikat> this is like email, in that you want it to run periodically, but not overlap
16:50 < carogray> ok - 
16:50 < carogray> I will make it singleton
16:50 < carogray> when I went to scheduler, it was already in there
16:52 < daviddelikat> there is another workflow that schedules items that are enabled ...
16:53 < carogray> aah so that workflow adds it to scheduler automatically
16:54 < carogray> ok - well I ran it and of course....large calendar isn't showing small calendar's events :(
16:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10686 /translations/German/German/PayDriver.pm: Update from translation server
16:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10687 /WebGUI/ (7 files in 6 dirs): Pluggable Tax: more POD, more tests, better code and less bugs
16:54 < carogray> cleared server cache and browser cach
16:54 < carogray> e
16:55 < daviddelikat> then check to make sure the URLs are correct.
16:56 < daviddelikat> the easy way to do that is to copy them from the calendar setup and paste them into the address location in your browser
16:56 < daviddelikat> it should try to download the ical data to your desktop
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17:00 < carogray> yup did that already just double checked again
17:00 < carogray> I right click on the edit button for the calendar
17:00 < carogray> then substitute 'edit' with 'ical'
17:00 < carogray> I tried your way 
17:01 < carogray> ical link on calendar, save to desktop but it gives me 
17:01 < carogray> feed.ics
17:01 < carogray> when I open in notepad I seem to get 
17:01 < carogray> X-WEBGUI-URL:caroline_robinson/calendar/caroline
17:02 < carogray> whereas url I thought I ought to be using is: http://www.mlri.org/caroline_robinson/calendar?func=ical
17:02 < daviddelikat> may I click on that link?
17:03 < carogray> I wonder could it be something with permissions? of course, but the calendars are only visible to mlri staff
17:03 < carogray> I can make viewable to all for a sec if you think that might help.
17:03 < daviddelikat> I'd like to see the data
17:03 < carogray> I mean of course, click on thelink
17:06  * daviddelikat needs a faster computer
17:06 < daviddelikat> ive got the file.
17:06 < daviddelikat> there is nothing in it
17:07 < carogray> huh.
17:07 < carogray> I haven't made the calendar viewable to everyone - could that be why?
17:07 < daviddelikat> yes
17:08 < daviddelikat> it could also be why your big calendar is not getting any data
17:08 < daviddelikat> you may need to make the calendar viewable to the user that runs the scheduled jobs
17:08 < daviddelikat> i don't know off hand what id that would be tyhough
17:09 < daviddelikat> does the big calendar show an update date for the feeds?
17:11 < carogray> ugh...
17:11 < carogray> sorry just playing with it a little
17:11 < carogray> just made my calendar viewable to everyone
17:11 < carogray> then I clicked on the link I gave you
17:11 < carogray> in IE
17:12 < carogray> asks me if I want to save or open the ics file
17:12 < carogray> I picked save to desktop...
17:12 < carogray> empty except for BEGIN:VCALENDAR
17:12 < carogray> PRODID:WebGUI 7.6.15-stable
17:12 < carogray> VERSION:2.0
17:12 < carogray> END:VCALENDAR
17:12 < carogray> hah
17:13 < carogray> when I did it before from the calendar itself...I got:
17:13 < carogray> BEGIN:VCALENDAR
17:13 < carogray> PRODID:WebGUI 7.6.15-stable
17:13 < carogray> VERSION:2.0
17:13 < carogray> BEGIN:VEVENT
17:13 < carogray> UID:W03J3qc4aXK6r9XweCfRNA@www.mlri.org
17:13 < carogray> LAST-MODIFIED:20090506T125612Z
17:13 < carogray> CREATED:20090505T200710Z
17:13 < carogray> SEQUENCE:1
17:13 < carogray> DTSTART;VALUE=DATE:20090519
17:13 < carogray> DTEND;VALUE=DATE:20090532
17:13 < carogray> SUMMARY:Caroline on Holiday
17:13 < carogray> DESCRIPTION:
17:13 < carogray> LOCATION:
17:13 < carogray> X-WEBGUI-GROUPIDVIEW:26
17:13 < carogray> X-WEBGUI-GROUPIDEDIT:4
17:13 < carogray> X-WEBGUI-URL:caroline_robinson/calendar/caroline
17:13 < carogray> X-WEBGUI-MENUTITLE:Caroline
17:13 < carogray> END:VEVENT
17:13 < carogray> END:VCALENDAR
17:13 < carogray> oh jeez! sorry about taking up so much space in the chat room - returns I guess
17:14 < daviddelikat> best to uyse pastebin for any thingmore than a couple of lines...
17:15 < carogray> yeah! OOPS. 
17:15 < carogray> so now that I have made my calendar public..
17:15 < carogray> I looked at in IE not logged in and there are no events in the calendar 
17:16 < daviddelikat> perhaps the events themselves are still not public...
17:16 < carogray> do you think that when the calendar was private, the events I added..right
17:16 < carogray> that's what I am thinking...
17:18 < carogray> so I just added another event now that it is public...
17:18 < carogray> doesn't show up 
17:18 < daviddelikat> how does it look when you are logged in?
17:20 < carogray> May 6 - month view, Lunch with May Yoga Advocacy Meeting - each on its own line
17:22 < carogray> I am going to asset manager to check security on individual events
17:22 < daviddelikat> look at the bottom of the event in 'edit event' and see what the setting is for 'group to view this event'
17:23 < carogray> aah
17:24 < carogray> mmm
17:24 < carogray> I edited the branch and made security for calendar and recursively view by everyone..
17:25 < carogray> when Idid what yousuggested 'everyone' was in group
17:25 < carogray> refreshed browser and at least events now show up in MY calendar now that it is public..
17:26 < carogray> however events from my calendar still not showing up in big, MLRI - viewable only to mlri staff - calendar
17:26 < carogray> ran update feeds workflow activity again too
17:27 < daviddelikat> did you re-run the update workflow?
17:27 < carogray> yep
17:28 < daviddelikat> also check the last update date on the feeds in the big calendar
17:28 < daviddelikat> if the job has not finished yet they may still show up
17:29 < carogray> Success! 1 added, 0 updated, 0 parsing errors
17:29 < carogray> 2009-05-06 13:38:45
17:29 < daviddelikat> yippeee!
17:29 < daviddelikat> now to get it to work the way you want it to
17:29 < carogray> that's right- except the events are not showing up in teh calendar
17:29 < carogray> oh
17:30 < daviddelikat> the callendar may be a caching issue
17:30 < carogray> like everything else in WebGUI ;)
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17:30 < daviddelikat> cache makes fast queries but painfull debgging
17:30 < carogray> I cleared the cache iin admin console
17:31 < daviddelikat> fortunately we dont always debug
17:31 < daviddelikat> well you dont
17:31 < daviddelikat> I debug every day
17:32 < carogray> I come across bugs every day - probably usually the same ones and this project was supposed to take my mind off the bug that has been preoccupying me for the last 5 weeks
17:32 < carogray> grumpf
17:32 < daviddelikat> which bug is that?
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17:33 < carogray> it's something David Huggins is working on for me to do with env('httpreferer') and mail data forms
17:33 < carogray> it's not probably technically a 'bug' ...yet
17:34 < daviddelikat> everything is a bug from some point of view
17:35 < carogray> then of course, you don't want to know about the bugs my son is breeding out in the garden until we manage to get a tractor to dig a whole to bury all the carcasses from the farm collected over the winter...blech gag...
17:35 < carogray> dig a hole
17:36 < daviddelikat> swounds like fun
17:36 < carogray> so ... back to calendars, now that the technical end of webgui seems to think our calendars are working how do get people to think the calendars are working
17:36 < carogray> ?
17:36 < carogray> it's a far cry from computers...farming
17:37 < daviddelikat> so did the stuff show up aftrer clearing the cache?
17:37 < carogray> nope
17:40 < xdanger> could someone verify my bug finding? is there any devs around?
17:41 < daviddelikat> theres folksa round, i can peek if its quick
17:41 < xdanger> there is a error in the upgrade script of 7.6.0 -> 7.6.1
17:42 < xdanger> the column postReceivedTemplateId is updated incorrectly
17:42 < xdanger> in upgrade_7.5.24-7.6.0.pl:    $session->db->write("ALTER TABLE Collaboration ADD COLUMN postReceivedTemplateId VARCHAR(22) DEFAULT 'default-post-received';");
17:42 < daviddelikat> sorry, thats going to be beyond me
17:43 < xdanger> but in 7.6.0-7.6.1 there is a fixShort assetId that fixes it:         'default_post_received'     => 'default_post_received1',
17:43 < daviddelikat> more fols pop up arount 10 though
17:43 < daviddelikat> s/fols/folks/ !fools
17:43 < daviddelikat> :)
17:45 < daviddelikat> carogray: can you see the events from big cal if you are logged in?
17:46 < carogray> nope
17:46 < daviddelikat> I hope you don't mind but I am trying to pull them into a calendar on my test environment
17:47 < daviddelikat> I wipe the DB about once a week
17:47 < daviddelikat> so it wont be here long
17:47 < carogray> of course not...
17:47 < carogray> when I am on holiday, the fact that I have lunch with a vietnamese translator and yoga and advocacy meeting all scheduled at once are hardly private info
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17:48 < carogray> just not particularly professional to be advertising to the rest of the world
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17:49 <+perlDreamer> Mech422, Story Manager was released with WebGUI 7.7.5, if you'd like to play with it.
17:50 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, I got all the bugs worked out of serialized Crud data last night
17:50 <+perlDreamer> I'll side port the patch and create some more test to validate it further.
17:50 <@Haarg> cool
17:51 <@Haarg> what else needed to be fixed?
17:52 <+perlDreamer> update
17:53 <+perlDreamer> update created 1 hash which was used to update the object cache, and to write to the db
17:53 <+perlDreamer> unfortunately, they need different kinds of data
17:53 <+perlDreamer> JSON => db
17:53 <+perlDreamer> data => object
17:55 <@Haarg> ah
17:55 < daviddelikat> carogray: the only event that transfered was the vacation item
17:55 < daviddelikat> it does not chow up in calendar view foer some reason
17:56 < daviddelikat> just found it by searching
17:56 < carogray> oh no..
17:56 < daviddelikat> i think you are going to have to seek a higher level techie to solve this issue
17:56 < carogray> so much for productive diversions
17:57 < carogray> well thanks so much for trying so diligently...and for so long. I do appreciate it.
17:57 < daviddelikat> well there should be more people coming on board soon
17:57 < daviddelikat> the workflow is running -- thats productive...
17:58 < carogray> yeah...I guess so. thing is I don't want to distract WebGUI support from the big problem I mentioned earlier... will just have to put this on the back burner again for a while..
17:59 < carogray> again thanks for trying...we did make a little progress.
18:07 <+perlDreamer> xdanger: thanks for the bug fix!
18:08 < xdanger> no problem
18:09 < xdanger> to bad that I didn't notice it before 7.6.22 was released =)
18:09 <+perlDreamer> it's all right, we'll get it fixed in .23
18:10 <+perlDreamer> it's an easy fix
18:10 < xdanger> yeah, fixeded it on my sites already
18:17 < daviddelikat> perlDreamer: is there a perl test function to do deep comparison on JSON data returned by a perl function?
18:18 <+perlDreamer> JSON data is text, so you can use like($jsonData, qr/gnarly regexp/, 'JSON check');
18:18 <+MrHairgrease> daviddelikat: cmp_deeply( from_json, ...)
18:18 <+perlDreamer> exactly
18:18 <+perlDreamer> cmp_deeply is provided from Test::Deep
18:19 <+perlDreamer> and you can find examples of it being used that way in the Shop/Tax tests
18:19 <+MrHairgrease> cmp_deeply( from_json( $JSONString), ...) that is
18:19 < daviddelikat> thanks that is what I was hoping you were saying
18:21 <+perlDreamer> there's also Test::JSON, but we haven't used it yet
18:22 <+MrHairgrease> Test::JSON seems a bit sucky
18:23 <+MrHairgrease> I think it's better to use Test::Deep
18:23 <+MrHairgrease> b/c it has muchg more powerful comparison functionality
18:25 <+perlDreamer> I agree.  The only advantage I see in Test::JSON is that it displays the differences in the JSON, vs the data structure
18:25 <+perlDreamer> but that's pretty minimal
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> yeah but oinly 1 level deep
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> anyway
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> gotta go
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> later
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18:43 <+perlDreamer> bopbop: are you still seeing this bug happen http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/9029
18:47 < daviddelikat> what is the easiest way to manage revisions on an asset?
18:48 < daviddelikat> im selecting some items with SQL and I want to make sure that I have the latest row
18:48 < daviddelikat> can I exclude rows with s simple clause?
18:48 < daviddelikat> or do I have to go through the data with perl?
18:50 <+perlDreamer> you do a subselect on the revisionDate
18:50 <+perlDreamer> there are examples of it in Asset/Template.pm
18:52 < daviddelikat> do you know how much that slows down the query?
18:53 < daviddelikat> I'm getting EMSTicket rows and I'm told there may be thousands
18:53 <+perlDreamer> very well could be
18:53 <+perlDreamer> but you have to do that to find the latest version
18:53 <+perlDreamer> at one point, rizen did some profiling of the cost of the subselect, and it was small
18:53 <+perlDreamer> I think
18:53 < daviddelikat> or I could chug through it in perl and delete the old rows.
18:54 <+perlDreamer> that might be slower still
18:54 <+perlDreamer> because you'd returning huge amounts of data
18:54 <+perlDreamer> versus a more complex query
18:54 < daviddelikat> yeah
18:55 < daviddelikat> 'course the other bit is that i really only want data for select locations
18:55 < daviddelikat> and location does not seem to have an index
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19:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10688 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/docs/ (4 files in 2 dirs): 
19:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fix a bug with the CS default post received template id. db defaults pointed
19:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: to a template that does not exist.
19:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10689 /WebGUI/docs/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Forward porting CS default post received templateId fix for the db.
19:05 < daviddelikat> perlDreamer: do I need to include the bit about the version tag?
19:06 <+perlDreamer> what's the goal of what you're trying to do?
19:06 < daviddelikat> im selecting rows to put in a table 
19:06 < daviddelikat> putting up the schedule for the event
19:07 <+perlDreamer> yes, you do
19:07 < daviddelikat> im asking mostly because i dont really understand how the whole rev control thing works in wg
19:07 <+perlDreamer> because it would let  people working under version tags see what their proposed (uncommitted) tickets will do to the schedule
19:07 < daviddelikat> is the version tag always going to be in the scratch?
19:09 <+perlDreamer> yes
19:09 < daviddelikat> k thanks
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20:15 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, sounds like I'm still screwed.
20:15 <+perlDreamer> mysql won't let a default be set on text column types
20:16 <+perlDreamer> "Root cause: BLOB/TEXT column 'jsonField' can't have a default value"
20:17 < daviddelikat> have you considered usinga  trigger?
20:17 < daviddelikat> or is that bad karma?
20:18 <+perlDreamer> yes, but killing Mysql is not the answer
20:19 <+perlDreamer> sorry, bad pun there. trigger/gun vs db/trigger
20:19 < daviddelikat> oh  i see
20:19 < daviddelikat> i had not made that jump...
20:20 <+perlDreamer> it was probably better not to ;)
20:20 < daviddelikat> my first thought was a horse
20:20 < daviddelikat> i forget whos horse it was
20:26 < daviddelikat> i gottta go to my other job
20:26 < daviddelikat> back in a few hours...
20:30 <+perlDreamer> somebody spammed the wiki for ads for armed security guards
20:35 <+perlDreamer> of course, the Crud thing is not strictly due to serializing
20:41 <+perlmonkey2> perlDreamer: you have any idea how Crypt::Admin is supposed to be tied into the admin panel?
20:41 <+perlDreamer> none
20:41 <+perlDreamer> probably needs a content handler for the interface, which means it goes into the config file in the admin console section
20:42 <+perlmonkey2> perlDreamer: I don't see anything else in the admin panel that works like that though.
20:43 <+perlDreamer> Asset Manager
20:43 <+perlDreamer> Asset History
20:43 <+perlmonkey2> ah
20:43 <+perlDreamer> Shop
20:43 <+perlmonkey2> oh
20:43 <+perlmonkey2> ic
20:43 <+perlmonkey2> thanks ;)
20:44 <+perlDreamer> np
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20:58 <+perlDreamer> okay, time for an early run
20:58 <+perlDreamer> later, y'all
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22:29 <+perlmonkey2> perlDreamer: you have any idea what's going on with the crypt branch?  master has a crypt content manager but not crypt.
22:29 <+perlmonkey2> has crypt dev moved to the master branch?
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23:03 <+perlDreamer> no idea, perlmonkey2
23:24 < SynQ> ohm
23:24  * SynQ is a xen buddist
23:24 <+perlDreamer> SynQ is an electrician
23:25 < SynQ> perlDreamer: congrats with your webgui-worldwide entry :)
23:25 <+perlDreamer> webgui worldwide?
23:25  * SynQ notices everything
23:26 < SynQ> http://www.webgui.org/w3/webgui-worldwide/perldreamer-consulting
23:26 <+perlDreamer> wow!
23:26 <+perlDreamer> that's awesome
23:27 <+perlDreamer> thank you SynQ
23:27 <+perlDreamer> I thought you were talking about my post to the partner's list about the hackathon
23:28 < preaction> when did w3 come back?
23:28 < SynQ> w3 never went away
23:28 < preaction> new design then?
23:28 < SynQ> not really
23:28 < SynQ> it's been so for a while now
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23:50 <+perlDreamer> I really want to build some caching into Crud
23:50 <+perlDreamer> at least things like getTableName, getTableKey, etc.
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00:03 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10690 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Fix multiple Crud issues with serialization and text/blob field handling
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01:13 <+perlDreamer> I think the end of the world is near
01:13 <+perlDreamer> First, we have this swine flu stuff
01:13 <+perlDreamer> now I hear the several trees in a local park are going to have to be cut down
01:13 <+perlDreamer> because they have schwieneiggi butt rot
01:14 <+perlDreamer> for those of you who don't speak German, that's piggy butt rot
01:14 <+perlDreamer> if that crosses over like the swine flu did, we're screwed
01:19 <@tavisto> I think JT already has butt rot
01:20 <+perlDreamer> you only say that because he's not in channel, and doesn't read the IRC logs
01:20 <@tavisto> nah I say that because I share quite a few hotel rooms with him while I'm on the tradeshow schedule
01:20 <+perlDreamer> oh, well then
01:20 <@tavisto> I don't read the IRC logs either.. Who on earth has time to do that
01:20 <+perlDreamer> :)
01:21 <+perlDreamer> Are you going to give WWN an exclusive interview recap of AdTech?
01:21 < Chizad> don't read 'em, just run 'em through grep so you can see if anyone said anything about you while you weren't around. :)
01:22 <@tavisto> actually I thought JT was going to blog about this.. That's true we haven't posted anything about ad:tech yet.
01:24 < preaction> tavisto: Re: the "too hard to find source install" thing
01:24 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10691 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Fix an i18n typo in the survey exitURL hover help.
01:24 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10692 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Backporting Survey i18n fix.
01:24 <@tavisto> yeah pre
01:25 <@tavisto> I honestly thought we did fine by hiding it a bit.. JT wanted to as well
01:25 < preaction> if they're asking for it, does it mean they're using it? and if they're using it, no matter how difficult it may be to install, should we not make it at least easy to find?
01:25 <@tavisto> We also need a new box for the Local Debian & Ubuntu installs
01:25 < preaction> i know we had this dicussion last month
01:26 <@tavisto> well, I'm okay with adding it as the 3rd box. It previously was the 2nd box
01:26 <@tavisto> Susan Baur and Knowmad both reported it
01:26 <@tavisto> which kinda scares me in a way.... that they want the source install
01:26 <@tavisto> but hey if they want it then I don't see any harm in putting it as the last option
01:27 < preaction> perhaps there's something wrong with the WRE they haven't mentioned
01:27 <@tavisto> good question.
01:27 < preaction> or perhaps they just want to work with their native package systems, and the WRE requires some workarounds for that (though we could fix that too)
01:28 <+perlDreamer> just make it the last box and say something like, "I wouldn't let my dog do a source install, but if you really want it..."
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02:17 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10693 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Sku.pm: Prevent a possible logic problem in the Sku with shipsSeparately and isShippingRequired.
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03:24  * perlDreamer heads off to coffee
03:24 <+perlDreamer> might be back on later tonight
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03:39 <+perlmonkey2> Source isntalls wouldn't be an issue if Apache::Request wasn't such a pain.
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04:36 <+patspam> perlbot: say something funny
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04:44 <+patspam> perlbot: webgui
04:44 < perlbot> WebGUI - an open source content management system written in Perl - http://webgui.org | Also see #webgui on irc.freenode.net
04:45 <+patspam> perlbot: perlmonkey2
04:45 < perlbot> don't feed teh monkey!
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05:13 <+perlmonkey2> perlbot: patspam
05:14 <+patspam> I am invisible
05:16 <+perlDreamer> perlmonkey2, where are you manners
05:16 <+perlDreamer> you always make introductions both ways...
05:17 <+perlDreamer> now perlbot's feelings are going to be hurt
05:17 <+perlmonkey2> perlbot: perlDreamer
05:17 < perlbot> Colin Kuskie, Contributor of the Year, and jack of all trades
05:18 <+perlDreamer> perlbot: patspam is Patrick Donelan from SDH, and a major WebGUI Developer and community member
05:18 < perlbot> added patspam to the database
05:18 < daviddelikat> aren't there supposed to be fireworks?
05:18 < daviddelikat> or at least a bottle of champagne
05:18 <+perlDreamer> only when we release a new version of WebGUI
06:04 <+perlmonkey2> perlbot: webgui
06:04 < perlbot> WebGUI - an open source content management system written in Perl - http://webgui.org | Also see #webgui on irc.freenode.net
06:04 <+perlmonkey2> perlbot: perl
06:04 < perlbot> It's Perl (for the language) or perl (for the interpreter) but NEVER 'PERL'!
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06:40 <+perlDreamer> I'm making a new Shipping Driver for the US Postal Service
06:40 <+perlDreamer> because they are very strict in XML processing, I can't use XML::Simple
06:40 <+perlDreamer> which means another core module for writing XML
06:40 <+perlDreamer> I'm heavily leaning toward XML::Writer
06:41 <+perlDreamer> does anyone have any experience that might sway that?
07:12 <+patspam> presumably XML::Tiny isn't strict enough either?
07:12 <+patspam> perlbot: xml
07:12 < perlbot> Don't parse xml with regular expressions! Use a real parser.  If your response begins "that's overkill.  i only want to..." you are wrong.  http://perl-xml.sf.net/faq/ and http://www.xml.com/pub/a/2000/04/05/feature/ (XML parser comparisons)
07:13 <+patspam> perlbot: thanks!
07:13 <+perlDreamer> I don't think it's an emitter, only a parser
07:13 < perlbot> If you want to thank us, help out the perl community by sending some money (even if just a couple of dollars) to The Perl Foundation. http://donate.perlfoundation.org/
07:13 <+patspam> ah sorry, just realised you want to write xml, not parse it
07:14 <+perlDreamer> what I really wish is that XML::Simple would not change the order of hashes that are passed to it
07:15 <+patspam> even when you IxHash tie them?
07:15 <+perlDreamer> yeah
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07:15 <+perlDreamer> I went and looked inside the module after I started using Tie::IxHash
07:16 <+perlDreamer> it sorts them on purpose
07:16 <+patspam> dang, you'd think they'd make that an optional thing
07:16 <+patspam> i guess it sorts them to make it more deterministic
07:16 <+patspam> since hashes are not supposed to have any sort of natural order
07:17 <+perlDreamer> I think it has something to do with attribute parsing.
07:17 <+patspam> Newer versions of XML::Simple sort elements and attributes alphabetically (*), by default. Enable this option to suppress the sorting - possibly for backwards compatibility.
07:17 <+patspam> * Actually, sorting is alphabetical but 'key' attribute or element names (as in 'KeyAttr') sort first. Also, when a hash of hashes is 'unfolded', the elements are sorted alphabetically by the value of the key field.
07:18 <+patspam> that's the "NoSort" option.. tried that?
07:18 <+perlDreamer> not yet
07:18 <+perlDreamer> you rock!
07:18 <+patspam> ooh, and in Hook Methods you can supply your own sorted_keys(name, hashref) function
07:18 <+patspam> --> Called when XMLout() is translating a hashref to XML. This routine returns a list of hash keys in the order that the corresponding attributes/elements should appear in the output.
07:19 <+perlDreamer> maybe I just need to take a bit and read that XML::Simple from top to bottom
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07:32 <+patspam> lol, just fixed my sister's macbook which she'd been told by a repair shop was dead and "not worth sending back to apple"
07:32 <+perlDreamer> what was the problem?  bad battery?
07:32 <+patspam> solution: take out battery, hold down power button for 10 seconds, put battery back in & connect to power
07:32 <+patspam> ..and turn on
07:33 <+patspam> (problem was: couldn'
07:33 <+patspam> t turn on)
07:33 <+patspam> I should have added a voodoo chant in the middle for dramatic effect
07:33 <+perlDreamer> eh, you'd have to charge extra for the chant
07:36 <+perlDreamer> xkcd is too funny
07:40 <+patspam> heh, too many firefly references today, I'm missing all the jokes
07:53  * perlDreamer is going to call it a night
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10:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10694 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): 
10:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fixed Survey jump target and jump expression precedence order across
10:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Answer, Question and Section (and improved documentation in API)
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15:49 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10695 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Internationalised the javascript part of the vendor payouts manager.
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16:17 < ckotil> I had a wiked RFE last night before i fell asleep. now i cant remember it
16:17 < ckotil> i knew i should have written it down
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18:31 <@preaction> Haarg: can you let me know when you're going to do the release? i've got a couple bugfixes for the features we added last friday
18:31 <@Haarg> sure
18:32 <@Haarg> i'm starting running the tests right now, but i can wait on the release
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18:35 <@preaction> ok, there's two main things i need to do quick then the rest of it can wait
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18:36 <@preaction> template attachments need to work with packages, and the help for the new style template vars needs to be added/updated
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18:45 <@Haarg> perlDreamer, t/Crud/serialize.t is failing, i think you may have missed adding a file
18:45 <+perlDreamer> you're right!
18:45 <+perlDreamer> it's the pseudo module
18:45 <+perlDreamer> I'll fix it now
18:46 <+perlDreamer> I have so many little scripts laying around that svn st is nigh on useless
18:46 <+perlDreamer> it's committed
18:46 <+perlDreamer> sorry about that, Haarg
18:46 <@Haarg> not a problem
18:46 <+perlDreamer> normally I write tests to make our lives easier :)
18:48 <@tavisto> perlDreamer, you are fired
18:48 <+perlDreamer> there's too much of that going around, tavisto
18:48 <@tavisto> making mistakes? how dare you.
18:48 <+perlDreamer> a friend of mine lost his job yesterday
18:48 <+perlDreamer> they did it over the phone
18:49 <@tavisto> did he work for that same company you did
18:49 <+perlDreamer> no, for all the negative things I could say about $oldDayJob, they were very polite and respectful when it came to layoffs
18:50 <+perlDreamer> even so, I hope the CEO forgives me for that case of boils that I prayed for.
18:50 <@tavisto> I thought your $oldDayJob told you to move your desk far back in your cubicle while they stole your stapler
18:52 <+perlDreamer> that was after I cut down the cubicle wall to get a nice window view
18:53 <@tavisto> *tavisto wonders if perlDreamer was Milton in Officespace*  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvGwr5wj8A8
18:56 <+perlDreamer> tavisto, you haven't signed up for the hackathon yet
18:56  * perlDreamer wants you to bring your mad design skills for some templating work
18:57 <@tavisto> since when does hackathon require design skills
18:57 <+perlDreamer> and someone has to keep an eye on preaction
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19:00 <@tavisto> all I know is that preaction promised me a pony in the next wG release...
19:01 <@preaction> yeah, well Avery Brooks promised me a flying car by the year 2000
19:01 <@preaction> i want my flying car
19:02 <+perlDreamer> I don't think ponies can be licensed under the GPL
19:02 <@preaction> what about Acme::POE::Knee?
19:02 <+MrHairgrease> crap
19:02 <+MrHairgrease> beat me to it
19:02 <+perlDreamer> and I don't think we'll get flying cars before the end of the world
19:02 <@Haarg> perlDreamer, you're getting a bit too aggressive with the cleanup code i think
19:02 <+perlDreamer> what did I break?
19:03 <@Haarg> cleaning up default groups
19:03 <@Haarg> in t/Asset/Post.t
19:03 <@tavisto> oh dude... preaction punked me..... POE::Knee?! You gotta me kidding me
19:03 <@Haarg> simple to fix though
19:04 <+perlDreamer> we should probably fix it twice, once in t/Asset/Post.t, and again in WebGUI::Test so that it doesn't clean up default groups (like the default users code)
19:04 <+perlDreamer> want me to do that?
19:04 <@preaction> tavisto: http://search.cpan.org/~kane/Acme-POE-Knee-1.10/lib/Acme/POE/Knee.pm
19:04 <@Haarg> i'll do the first part
19:04 <+perlDreamer> maybe I was just trying to reduce the size of the create.sql file...
19:04 <@Haarg> heh
19:05 <+perlDreamer> oh, and I found a bug
19:05 <+perlDreamer> deleting a user does not clean up his address book(s)
19:05 <@Haarg> oh?
19:06 <+perlDreamer> I should post that so I don't forget it
19:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10696 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/Serialize.pm: Adding in pseudo-module for Crud serialization testing.
19:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10697 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Workflow/Activity/ExpirePurchasedThingyRecords.pm: fix Thingy Record expiry workflow activity
19:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10698 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey/ResponseJSON.pm: fix pod typo
19:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10699 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Post.t: don't clean up default groups
19:10 <+perlDreamer> Haarg: does this list look right for default groups 1 2 3 4 6 7 8 11 12 13 14 pbgroup000000000000015 pbgroup000000000000016 pbgroup000000000000017
19:11 <@Haarg> yes
19:12 <+perlDreamer> checked, and committed
19:12 <+perlDreamer> has anyone benchmarked WebGUI::Utility::isIn vs List::Utils::any?
19:13 <+perlDreamer> with any being written in C, you think it would be very fast
19:14 <+MrHairgrease> I like any better just because it's in List Utils
19:14 <+MrHairgrease> and isIn is home brew
19:14 <+MrHairgrease> but for much WG stuf I use isIn
19:15 <+MrHairgrease> because it's more or less the defacto stanadard in wg code
19:15 <@Haarg> any is in List::MoreUtils
19:15 <+MrHairgrease> that's what i meant
19:15 <+perlDreamer> what I was thinking is, if any is much faster than isIn, that we replace the guts of isIn with any
19:15 <@Haarg> List::Util has first
19:15 <@Haarg> which would work just as well
19:17 <+perlDreamer> well, yes and no
19:17 <+perlDreamer> any returns a boolean
19:17 <+perlDreamer> first returns the first value that matches the criterion
19:18 <+perlDreamer> so if you were searching for 0, you have to be careful
19:18 <@Haarg> defined check will take care of that though
19:29 <@Haarg> http://gist.github.com/108194
19:33 <+perlDreamer> I'm not sure how to read that
19:33 <+perlDreamer> based on rate, it looks like isIn is really fast
19:39 <@Haarg> depending on how many elements you are searching and how fast it can short circuit, isIn is sometimes faster or slower than grep, but always faster than first and any
19:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10700 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: Prevent default groups from being deleted.
19:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10701 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm): fixed: URLs that shouldn't happen (#10353)
19:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10702 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm): URLs that shouldn't happen (#10353)
19:39 <@preaction> i thought isIn was implemented by grep
19:39 <@Haarg> no
19:40 <@Haarg> $_ eq $key and return 1 for @_;
19:40 <@preaction> ah
19:42 <@Haarg> grep using an expression instead of a block is slightly faster than that comparison shows, but only by a little
19:43 <+perlDreamer> recent Asset.pm breaks Asset.t
19:45 <+MrHairgrease> naming question
19:46 <+perlDreamer> Peter and Tim for boys, Emma for girls
19:46 <+MrHairgrease> I have a method in the TaxDrivers that should return information that should be stored along with transactoion items
19:46 <+MrHairgrease> right now I've called it getConfigurationForTransactionLog
19:46 <+MrHairgrease> but that sound kinda sucky
19:46 <+MrHairgrease> any better ideas
19:46 <+MrHairgrease> ?
19:47 <+perlDreamer> getTransactionData
19:47 <+perlDreamer> getTaxTransactionData
19:47 <+MrHairgrease> get TranasctionTaxData
19:47 <+MrHairgrease> that's better i guess
19:47 <+perlDreamer> there you go!
19:47 <+MrHairgrease> w/o the spelling errors
19:47 <+MrHairgrease> mucho gracias!
19:47 <@preaction> it should be verbNounAdjectiveAdjectiveAdjective
19:48 <+MrHairgrease> I know
19:48 <+MrHairgrease> but I had something like getTransactionData at first
19:48 <+MrHairgrease> which is too confusing
19:48 <+MrHairgrease> does it fetch soime transaction data
19:49 <+MrHairgrease> or does it provide the data to store with the transaction
19:49 <@preaction> it fetches the Tax data for the transaction
19:50 <+perlDreamer> what is a parfait?
19:50 <+MrHairgrease> it's a desert
19:50 < dreamersgirl> dessert?
19:50 < dreamersgirl> :)
19:51 <+MrHairgrease> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parfait_(food)
19:51 <@preaction> it has layers, like an Ogre
19:51 <+MrHairgrease> the french version is quite good
19:51 <@preaction> plus everybody likes parfaits
19:51 <+MrHairgrease> oh wait
19:52 < dreamersgirl> mmmm....we were checking out these here:
19:52 <+MrHairgrease> I'm mixing things up
19:52 < dreamersgirl> http://www.oregonmomsemptynest.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=section&layout=blog&id=1&Itemid=57
19:52 < dreamersgirl> they're a ways down the page
19:52 <+MrHairgrease> profiterole is good
19:52 < dreamersgirl> they look really tasty, though
19:52 <+MrHairgrease> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Profiterole
19:53 < ckotil> should testCodebase.pl complete with PASS?
19:53 < dreamersgirl> I like those, too
19:54 <+perlDreamer> ckotil, if it doesn't something is wrong
19:54 < ckotil> sweet.
19:54 <+perlDreamer> although historically there have been cases where the tests were out of date
19:54 < ckotil> i have a lot of .t files failing 
19:54 <+perlmonkey2> sweet "git config --global alias.co checkout #"
19:54 <+perlmonkey2> didn't know abotu alias
19:55 <+perlDreamer> ckotil, what does testEnvironment.pl say?
19:55 <+perlDreamer> and what version are we talking about here?
19:55 < ckotil> testEnvironment finishes fine.
19:55 < ckotil> i dont have all of the optional modules tho
19:56 < ckotil> 7.6.22
19:56 <+perlDreamer> Haarg just released that on Tuesday, which means it should run clean.
19:57 <+perlDreamer> which files are failing?  Can you give us a paste?
19:57 < ckotil> sure
19:57 <@Haarg> which optional modules do you now have?
19:57 <@Haarg> *not
19:57 < ckotil> http://webgui.pastebin.com/m67afc5d0
19:57 < ckotil> text::aspell is one
19:58  * Haarg murders UNIVERSAL::can
19:58 < ckotil> dateTime might have a problem too
19:58 < ckotil> maybe whats causing the UNIVERSAL errors?
19:58 < ckotil> Checking for module DateTime:                     Called UNIVERSAL::can() as a function, not a method at /usr/lib/perl5/site_perl/5.8.8/DateTime/Locale.pm line 298
19:58 < ckotil> OK
19:58 <@Haarg> they aren't really errors
19:59 <+perlDreamer> ckotil, did you run that on a production database?
19:59 < ckotil> no way.
19:59 <+perlDreamer> good
19:59 < ckotil> this is my dev host.
19:59 < ckotil> damn, so i did a cpan install on DateTime to update it, thinking it might clear up that UNIVERSAL::can error. it did not
19:59 <@preaction> Haarg: running tests before my commit, then i'm done
19:59 < ckotil> s/error/warning
19:59 <@Haarg> the universal warnings are a bug in UNIVERSAL::can as far as i'm aware
20:00 <+perlDreamer> ckotil: what does this say (please paste):  WEBGUI_CONFIG=/data/WebGUI/sbin/../etc/globalnoc.webgui.conf CODE_COP=1 prove  -v ../t/Asset/Asset.t
20:00 <+perlDreamer> run that from the sbin directory
20:00 < ckotil> k
20:00 <+perlDreamer> or adjust the path accordingly
20:01 < ckotil> do i prepend testCodebase.pl to that?
20:02 <+perlDreamer> no
20:02 < ckotil> ah ok, i see
20:02 <+perlDreamer> testCodebase.pl is just a somewhat handy wrapper around prove
20:02 <+MrHairgrease> ok, time to go home
20:02 < ckotil> its quite lengthy
20:02  * MrHairgrease is starving
20:02 <+MrHairgrease> later!
20:02 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10703 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Asset.t: Update test to work with new fixUrl code.
20:02 <+perlDreamer> redirect the output into a file and paste it, please
20:03 < ckotil> k
20:03 <+perlDreamer> it will tell us exactly which tests are failing on your dev system
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20:04 < ckotil> http://webgui.pastebin.com/m1a68fa84
20:04 <+perlDreamer> man, to test this new shipping driver I can't use Shawshank collateral, since the post office is actually going to validate the address data
20:05 <+perlDreamer> ckotil, tell me about your initial database setup
20:05 <+perlDreamer> and what's your gateway setting?
20:06 < ckotil> gateway is /
20:06 < ckotil> database is running locally on port 3306
20:06 <+perlDreamer> brb
20:08 <+perlDreamer> the failing tests are using fixUrl
20:08 <+perlDreamer> and it's kind of troublesome that one that checks for /root is failing
20:09 <+perlDreamer> since WebGUI will break without the root node
20:10 <+perlDreamer> ckotil, does your dev site have a full, standard WebGUI database?
20:10 < ckotil> yes
20:11 < ckotil> i used create.sql way back when
20:11 < ckotil> and its a direct copy of the production site
20:11 < ckotil> s/copy/dump
20:15 < ckotil> at line 50, it says got root. then why at 51 would it  expect 'root2'?
20:15 < ckotil> got root? now that's a nerdy shirt
20:19 <+perlDreamer> that's the test output
20:19 <+perlDreamer> what it got as test data was 'root'
20:19 <+perlDreamer> but it was told that the correct answer is 'root2'
20:19 <+perlDreamer> so that test failed
20:19 <+perlDreamer> and it printed those diagnostics
20:19 < ckotil> any idea where this root2 would be defined?/
20:19 <+perlDreamer> oh no, it's the opposite of that
20:19 < ckotil> ./WebGUI/t/Asset/Asset.t:is($importNode->fixUrl('/root'), 'root2', 'If a node exists, appends a "2" to it');
20:20 <+perlDreamer> right
20:20 <+perlDreamer> since it didn't append a "2" to it, the /root URL does not exist
20:20 <+perlDreamer> and that's bad
20:20 < ckotil> ohh
20:20 < ckotil> so get this. http://webdoc-dev.grnoc.iu.edu/root/
20:20 < ckotil> page doesnt exist. that explains it
20:20 <+perlDreamer> how can the page not exist?
20:20 <+perlDreamer> that's the root node
20:20 < ckotil> let me check out my asset structure ;)
20:20 <+perlDreamer> gotcha :)
20:21 < ckotil> ah... heh... the .html extension!
20:21 < ckotil> http://webdoc-dev.grnoc.iu.edu/root.html
20:21 <+perlDreamer> so by default, .html is added to all URLs on your site?
20:21 < ckotil> yes.
20:21 < ckotil> as defined in the admin console > settings
20:22 < ckotil> its been hit or miss tho.
20:22 <+perlDreamer> well then, that's a test bug that has to be fixed
20:22 < ckotil> sometimes it works, sometimes no
20:22 <+perlDreamer> and your default URL, is it index.html instead of /home?
20:22 < ckotil> hrm, where would that be defined?
20:23 < ckotil> index.html takes me to the start page for my site. /home takes me nowhere
20:24 <+perlDreamer> also in the settings
20:25 < ckotil> ok. it looks like it's called default ome page
20:25 <+perlDreamer> right, that's it
20:26 < ckotil> yeah, it goes to index.html
20:26 <+perlDreamer> this test mistakenly assumes that the default home page is /home
20:26 <+perlDreamer> so the test should either change those settings to run the test, or take them into account
20:27 < ckotil> can't it just pulldown the values from the db?
20:27 <+perlDreamer> oh, it could.  It just doesn't
20:27 <+perlDreamer> are those the only two tests that are failing?
20:27 < ckotil> are the tests desinged to be independent of the db?
20:28 <+perlDreamer> somewhat independent
20:28 < ckotil> nah, there are more that fail.
20:28 <+perlDreamer> but as you can see, there's at least two places where it makes bad assumptions
20:28 < ckotil> right.
20:29 < ckotil> ill capture the out put and past.
20:29 < ckotil> e
20:32 < ckotil> how's this for an RFE? The ability to move assets between version tags.
20:33 <@preaction> it's already possible
20:33 <+perlDreamer> I think that's already possible
20:33 < ckotil> ah, nice.
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20:43 <@preaction> Haarg: done. sorry it took so long (tests were failing). could you re-run your tests? some unrelated tests were failing and i can't figure out why
20:44 <@Haarg> which ones?
20:48 <@preaction> let me pastebin. it's a whole bunch
20:49 <@preaction> http://webgui.pastebin.com/m1edf5b08
20:49 <@preaction> assetExportHtml.t has always failed on my system
20:49 <@preaction> Asset_diagnose.t was a problem with a custom asset i have in my SVN repo
20:50 <@preaction> and there are two new tests I'm building, but the rest are unknown status
20:51 <@Haarg> i don't get those failures here on a clean database
20:51 <@Haarg> at least, not most of them
20:52 <@preaction> i'll reset once more and try again
20:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10704 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/AssetVersioning.pm: fix bug with packed extra head tags
20:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10705 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Snippet.pm: fix regeneration of packed snippet
20:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10706 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset.pm: fix default value for packed head tags. too dangerous to make default to on right now
20:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10707 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 4 dirs): template attachments now work with packages. head_attachments and body_attachments are now documented
21:10 <@preaction> Haarg, perlDreamer are there any of these failing tests you haven't fixed yet? 
21:13 <@preaction> all the macro tests are failing because the packing isn't happening anymore :p
21:15 < ckotil> the full test. http://webgui.pastebin.com/m51541a09
21:16 <@Haarg> aside from macro tests, the only failure i see is t/Asset/Sku.t
21:16 <@preaction> which is a problem with the test, it needs to set isShippingRequired as weill as shipsSeperately
21:16 <@preaction> i'm fixing the macro tests right now
21:26 <@preaction> Haarg: tests should be fixed now
21:26 <@Haarg> cool, thanks
21:47 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10708 /WebGUI/t/ (9 files in 2 dirs): fixed tests
22:33 <@Haarg> seems the code editor is even more broken in firefox 3.5
22:39 < ckotil> I couldnt resize the window :/
22:39 < ckotil> but i really like how it highlights stuff
22:46 <+perlDreamer> I think it's time to get rid of the code editor
22:46 <+perlDreamer> it's fragile
22:46 <+perlDreamer> I love what it _could_ do, but what it actually does is heartbreaking
22:46 <@preaction> i'm willing to agree, until i can fork it and make it actually work
22:49 <+perlDreamer> no need to fork it, just send the guy a patch
22:49 <+perlDreamer> on whatever browsers he has, it probably works fine
22:49 <+perlDreamer> but how can 1 guy cover everything out there, on every platform?
23:00 <+perlDreamer> I'm on the soapbox again, aren't I?  Sorry about that
23:06 <@preaction> no, but then we should keep it and report bugs against it, optionally providing patches
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23:34 <+perlDreamer> yay, I can make requests to the USPS!
23:34 <+perlDreamer> Unfortunately, the USPS hates my request :(
23:35 <@preaction> how dare they?
23:37 <+perlDreamer> well, when the URL looks like: http://production.shippingapis.com/ShippingAPI.dll
23:37 <+perlDreamer> it just doesn't bode well
23:39 < ckotil> there are some odd url extensions out there
23:43 <+perlDreamer> ah, it's probably a problem on my end
23:44 <+perlDreamer> I just got off the phone with them, and they're cool with high volume automated tests
23:44 <+perlDreamer> so I'll figure out what's up
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23:49 <+perlDreamer> yeah, my bad.  GET vs POST request
23:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: hao * r10709 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: Oops, forgot to rfe #9998 in changelog.
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00:18 <+perlDreamer> bopbop's back!
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00:27 <@preaction> you scared her away!
00:27 <@preaction> question: if the collab's default sort order is desc, when I as a user click on a column header, would i expect that column to sort descending or ascending?
00:27 <@preaction> so if "unsorted" it's doing a descending sort, when i sorted it, would i expect ascending?
00:28 <@preaction> say i click on "title" column, the first time, unless it's already sorted by "title", i would want it sorted ascending, right?
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00:46 <+perlDreamer> from a (top) to z (bottom)
00:46 <+perlDreamer> that's what I would expect
00:46 <@preaction> that's not what is happening
00:46 <@preaction> on another note: i'm writing tests for the Collab system so I can refactor it!
00:46 <@preaction> yay!
00:47 <+perlDreamer> call a medic
00:48 <+perlDreamer> I think I'm having a heart attack
00:48 <+perlDreamer> Martha, I'm comin' to see ya, baby!
00:48 <@preaction> i've already found about 20 lines of useless code
00:50 <@preaction> uh.. how do i sort by rating? is it karmaRank? wtf?
00:50 <@preaction> rating is not one of the allowed configurable sortBy options, BUT you can sort by it using the form for some reason...
00:53 <+perlDreamer> danger, preaction.  Working in the CS is known to induce fits of rage and frothing at the mouth.
00:54 <@preaction> yeah, imma gather up a list of all the crap so i can discuss it with people to make sure we're Doing The Right Thing
00:54 <+perlDreamer> is start from scratch on the list?
00:55 <@preaction> i think the CS is salvagable
00:55 <@preaction> which is why i'm building tests and refactoring
00:56 <@preaction> well, the real reason is I need to refactor to fix a problem with a subclass, but still
01:07 <+perlDreamer> we'll all benefit from the refactor, and the tests.
01:07 <+perlDreamer> one thing about the sorting, I think that's actually a RFE'ed feature.
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01:16 <+perlDreamer> crud, scared her away, too
01:16 <+perlDreamer> what's wrong with us, preaction?
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01:54 <+perlDreamer> I will never, ever start a project without branching for version control again
01:54 <+perlDreamer> I will never, ever, start a project without branching for version control again
01:55 <+perlDreamer> I will never, ever, start a project without branching for version control again.
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02:07 <+perlDreamer> bopbop, something to file away for writing about Account modules
02:07 <+perlDreamer> the Contributions page only shows unarchived contributions
02:08 <+perlDreamer> I did a search for a user by username, which gave me a whole list of assets
02:08 <+perlDreamer> then I clicked on his name to view his profile and contributions, and it was empty
02:25 <@preaction> git can work with svn repos, right?
02:25 <@preaction> so i can create a git repo of my svn repo and clone that and then commit only what i need?
02:26 <@preaction> perlDreamer: re: the attachment order in collab systems: Doesn't the Story Manager allow you to order attachments?
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02:35 < perlDreamer1> yup, git can work on SVN repos
02:43 < perlDreamer1> Haarg and patspam both know how to connect the two.
02:44 <+patspam> git-svn is your friend
02:46  * perlDreamer1 does not like the 50 character limit on git commit messages
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02:48  * perlDreamer doesn't either
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03:29 <+perlDreamer> dinner time, hope to be back later
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11:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10710 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 4 dirs): (log message trimmed)
11:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fixed Survey's handling of multi-answer questions (e.g. maxAnswers != 1)
11:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Now stores all supplied answers to multi-answer question as arrayref
11:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Variable [[var]] text replacement converts to comma-separated list
11:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Expression Engine's value() returns appropriate value depending on context
11:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Expression Engine's score() does sum of multi-answers, as you would expect
11:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Updated related i18n & hover-help, and tests
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11:34 <@Haarg> patspam, if there's any api enhancements i could make to wgdev to help with your padre plugin let me know.
11:34 <@Haarg> i can't get padre itself to install at this point
11:37 <+patspam> thanks Haarg!
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13:26 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10711 /WebGUI/ (7 files in 6 dirs): Tax details are now stored with the transaction items they belong to.
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16:50 < finiteset> is webgui better than Joomla ? what are WebGUI's advantages?
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17:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10712 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 4 dirs): Added the methods for the pluggable tax system that add templ vars to the cart and cart items.
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17:32 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10713 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Added more information output to EMS record importer.
17:32 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10714 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Search.pm): Fixed a search results display error with synopsis.
17:32 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10715 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Search.pm): Fixed a search results display error with synopsis.
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17:52 <+perlDreamer> morning, folks
17:53 <+MrHairgrease> hey pd!
17:57 < SDuensin> Hey gang.  Figured I'd poke in and prove I'm still alive.
18:02 <+MrHairgrease> SDuensin: I don't buy it
18:02 < SDuensin> :-P
18:02 <+MrHairgrease> everybody knows you cannot trust prove delivered over the internet
18:03 < SDuensin> I even have a new WebGUI site explaining my disappearance!  http://www.getrosie.com
18:06 <+perlDreamer> SDuensin, unless it runs WebGUI, it's not that interesting :P
18:08 <+perlDreamer> wait a sec, the _site_ runs WebGUI.
18:08 <+perlDreamer> but I've seen this someplace else
18:09 < SDuensin> That's a standard development kit.  I'm working on making our hardware better.  Our software is already better than PogoPlug.  :-D
18:16 <+perlDreamer> wait a sec, you're doing the hardware, too?
18:16 <+perlDreamer> SDuensin, you're a hardware hacker!
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18:18 < SDuensin> perlDreamer - Uh, kinda.  More like I know people who are.  :-)
18:18 < SDuensin> (But I have built an array of odd accessories for PCs over the years.)
18:19 <+MrHairgrease> why do you caal the thing rosie?
18:19 < SDuensin> Why not?  :-)
18:20 < SDuensin> Actually, we asked around quite a bit and most people liked it.  Go figure.
18:20 <+MrHairgrease> If it'scool you should prolly call it Martin
18:20 <+MrHairgrease> just my 2 ct
18:21 < SDuensin> :-)
18:21 < SDuensin> I lobbied for "Bob" just to be silly.
18:21 <+perlDreamer> How about Murray?
18:21 <+perlDreamer> He's a curmudgeonly old man with awesome hair styling, but he's very technically savvy
18:22 <+MrHairgrease> that would be good too
18:22 < SDuensin> Part of the requirement was that whatever the name ended up being, it can't scare your parents.  :-)
18:22 <+MrHairgrease> hehe
18:22 <+MrHairgrease> that's one cool word perldreamer
18:22 <+MrHairgrease> i had to look it up
18:23 < SDuensin> hehe
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18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10716 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Form/Codearea.pm): 
18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI: - Fixed a load problem with Code Editor by making user toggle it on. This is
18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI:  better than normal anyway since many users appear not to want to use the
18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI:  editor in most cases.
18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10717 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (lib/WebGUI/Form/Codearea.pm docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt): 
18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI: - Fixed a load problem with Code Editor by making user toggle it on. This is
18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI:  better than normal anyway since many users appear not to want to use the
18:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI:  editor in most cases.
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19:36 <+perlDreamer> Chuck Norris saves a bakers: http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0%2C23739%2C25441767-5013016%2C00.html
19:36 <+perlDreamer> bakery
19:45 <+perlDreamer> hey, all.  Which year was the first WUC?
19:45 <+perlDreamer> was it 2004, or 2005?
19:49 <@bopbop> Yeah SwiftySite!!
19:49 <+perlDreamer> isn't that awesome?!!
19:49 <@bopbop> very cool
19:50 <+perlDreamer> bummer that LTR_bob isn't still in channel for some well earned kudos
19:50 <@bopbop> no kidding
19:50 <@bopbop> we'll kudo him later
20:11 <@preaction> this swiftysite designer thing is amazing
20:11 <@preaction> i mean, i don't understand dutch, but it works great
20:11 <@preaction> http://www.alphamegahosting.com/swiftysitedesigner/swiftysitedesigner.html
20:15 < ckotil> wow! this is awsome
20:18 <@bopbop> they're presenting on swiftysite at the wuc too, aren't they?
20:18 <@bopbop> you should go, preaction- see how it's done
20:18 <@preaction> i was there last year when they demoed the first rev, but this version is leaps and bounds
20:18 <@preaction> and i'll be there i suspect, i get to just hang around and be mostly useless
20:19 <@preaction> schmoozing and boozing
20:19 <@bopbop> it has its advantages
20:19 <@preaction> yeah, i get to see presentations instead of worrying about my own ;)
20:20 <@bopbop> much more fun
20:20 <@bopbop> you have to hang out in my session, in case someone shows up
20:20 <@bopbop> and has template questions
20:21 <+perlDreamer> if he's not there, I will be
20:21 <@bopbop> cool
20:21 <@bopbop> and thx
20:21 <@bopbop> :)
20:21 <@preaction> oh, the clinic, yeah that's one of the main reasons i'll be there
20:22 <@preaction> which means i'll miss the presentation on "The Swiftysite Technique" :'(
20:22 <+perlDreamer> who is this guy talking about testing?
20:22 <@preaction> Pluton is a dutch company
20:22 <@preaction> i think it's one of Synq's
20:23 < ckotil> i wonder if google translate would work on swifty design
20:23 <+perlDreamer> I'd like to attend, but I'm talking about the Story Manager at the same time
20:23 <@bopbop> I'm excited to see the story manager
20:23 <@bopbop> which means I'll be on hand to grill you w/ questions
20:24 <+perlDreamer> you don't have to wait until the WUC to do that
20:24 <@bopbop> true
20:24 <@bopbop> actually, you'll likely hear from me before then since I'll be trying to wrap up some more books by wuc time
20:27 <+perlDreamer> not a problem
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20:43 <@preaction> i dunno about google translate, but i might have to talk to their group about the i18n.js we have
20:44 < ckotil> worth a shot
20:44 < ckotil> then comes the swifty design asset
20:52 <+perlDreamer> preaction, have you blogged about that yet?
20:52 <+perlDreamer> I don't think anyone except a handful of people know about it yet.
20:53 <+perlDreamer> actually, maybe I should WNN it
20:53 <@preaction> no i haven't, it's on the docket as my next one
20:53 <@preaction> so sometime in the next week or two
20:53 <@preaction> then when i finally get the Map out i can blog about how the google maps API sucks
20:53 <+perlDreamer> I'll tease it, then
20:54 <+perlDreamer> unless you rather I not mention it all until after your post?
20:55 <@preaction> go ahead, it's in there
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21:48 <+perlDreamer> anyone going to see Star Trek today?
21:49 <@preaction> mememememememe
21:53 <+perlDreamer> From all the non-spoiler reviews, it's going to be good
21:53  * perlDreamer heads off for a short lunch
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22:46 <@preaction> perlDreamer: can i ask you a quick question about Devel::Cover? what does the A, B, C and "dec" mean in the HTML output?
22:47 <@preaction> i want to get 100% coverage on the collab tests before i try to refactor, in case i screw something up
22:50 <+perlDreamer> A, B, C and dec?
22:50 <+perlDreamer> it's a logic table
22:50 <+perlDreamer> A, B, and C are the various options
22:50 <+perlDreamer> but it will also list what they are
22:50 <+perlDreamer> does that help, preaction?
22:51 <@preaction> $self->session->form->process('sortBy') and $self->session->form->process('func') ne 'editSave' <- so in this, A is the first part, B is the second
22:51 <+perlDreamer> right
22:51 <+perlDreamer> not sure about dec
22:51 <@preaction> and the logic table says that i need 3 paths through it, when both are false, when A is false and B is true, and when A is true
22:52 <@preaction> since when A is true, it doesn't matter what the other ones are
22:52 <+perlDreamer> not quite
22:52 <+perlDreamer> B doesn't matter if A if false
22:52 <+perlDreamer> since and shortcircuits
22:53 <@preaction> okay, now i see
22:53 <+perlDreamer> so for a simple 2 condition AND, you have to check !A AND !B, !A AND B, A AND !B, and A AND B
22:53 <@preaction> the X under B means "not checked because A is already false"
22:53 <+perlDreamer> right
22:53 <@preaction> "dec" seems to be the total value of the expression
22:54 <+perlDreamer> maybe it's short for "decision"?
22:54 <@preaction> that's what i'm thinking
22:54 <+perlDreamer> it will take a very long time to cover all the CS at 100%
22:54 <@preaction> don't want all of it, just this sub
22:54 <+perlDreamer> cool
22:55  * perlDreamer is going to hit the showers, then head to the movie
22:55 <+perlDreamer> I'll check back if you have more questions
22:55 <@preaction> the problem is i think i need to refactor the sub in order to get some unreachable decisions
22:55 <@preaction> or rather, decisions that no longer apply, but may still break things if removed :p
22:55 <+perlDreamer> then you have to test in a larger context
22:55 <+perlDreamer> more than just the sub
22:56 <@preaction> i think removing these lines will only break people who were migrating from 6.x or earlier
22:56 <@preaction> since it used to be properties could be undefined, and there was no default value
22:56 <@preaction> anyway, have fun at the movie
22:56 <+perlDreamer> so this would allow them to pass additional values for sorting in the URL as a query param?
22:57 <+perlDreamer> things that aren't specified in the asset property?
22:57 <@preaction> i'm talking before CS was an asset, back when it was USS
22:57 <+perlDreamer> right
22:58 <@preaction> so there may be assets out there that do not have values for certain properties, whereas today no property goes unfilled (thanks to defaultValue and new behavior of update())
22:58 <@preaction> that's easily remedied with an upgrade script, of course
22:59 <+perlDreamer> but if you change that behavior, it needs to go through the RFE loop?
22:59 <+perlDreamer> which lines are you talking about?
23:00 <+perlDreamer> near the 980's?
23:00 <@preaction> 997 and 998
23:00 <@preaction> $sortBy ||= 'assetData.revisionDate'
23:00 <@preaction> when that's the defaultValue up in the definition
23:00 <@preaction> there should be no reason it reaches that point without a value
23:01 <+perlDreamer> I see, unless the asset doesn't have that property set
23:01 <@preaction> right
23:02 <@preaction> which was possible before, but no longer
23:02 <+perlDreamer> in that case, I'd do what you were talking about earlier
23:02 <+perlDreamer> and put something into the upgrade script, and kill those lines
23:02 <@preaction> upgrade? or test for it?
23:02 <@preaction> i think i should test for it for now
23:03 <@preaction> change as little as possible
23:03 <@preaction> (i know, i just changed my mind)
23:03 <+perlDreamer> it doesn't hurt to have it there.  In fact, you could merge it into the statement above
23:03 <@preaction> but my mind is little ;)
23:03 <@preaction> that too
23:03 <+perlDreamer> it's easier to get 100% coverage on OR, since a true value cascades
23:03  * perlDreamer is outta here
23:25  * perlDreamer is back for a bit
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23:43 <@preaction> working with Devel::Cover makes testing so much more fun and easy
23:44 <@preaction> no guessing "am i testing this thoroughly?"
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20:16 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10718 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/EventManagementSystem.pm: fixed pagination counting error and some ticket import problems
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05:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10719 /WebGUI/t/Group.t: Add a test to check for the override of expire time in addUsers.
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06:15 <+patspam> Haarg: ping
06:15 <@Haarg> ?
06:15 <+patspam> heya!
06:15 <+patspam> the main thing at the moment with wgd padre plugin..
06:16 <+patspam> is that i am running padre under one perl (my system perl, which is threaded), and wgd under wre perl
06:16 <+patspam> meaning that i can only access wgd as if it were a binary (/data/wre/prereqs/bin/perl /data/wre/prereqs/bin/wgd <cmd> <options>)
06:17 <@Haarg> hmm
06:17 <+patspam> which is obviously a lot less powerful than if i could access wgd as a perl module
06:18 <@Haarg> locally, i have wgd and anything else command line using a perl i compiled myself
06:18 <@Haarg> but apache still runs using the wre
06:19 <+patspam> so you're adding /data/WebGUI/lib to your custom perl lib includes?
06:19 <@Haarg> yeah, it's in PERL5LIB
06:20 <+patspam> from memory you would have also had to do something when installing DBI::mysql to let it know about wre's mysql? or not?
06:21 <+patspam> can't remember why i think that, but a bell in my head was ringing..
06:21 <@Haarg> well, the only real problem mysql is that if the hostname is localhost it tries to connect with the socket file
06:21 <@Haarg> i just have it configured as 127.0.0.1 so it avoids that magic and uses tcp like you would expect
06:21 <+patspam> ah beautiful
06:22 <@Haarg> alternatively, you may be able to compile DBI::mysql against the wre's mysql libraries
06:22 <@Haarg> but i haven't done that
06:22 <@Haarg> i haven't worked extensively on some of the commands, import/export would likely work better that edit if you continue using it as a binary though
06:23 <@Haarg> the main problem i would see with a binary, especially if you get into something like an asset tree browser, would be speed
06:23 <@Haarg> loading all those libraries takes a long time if you have to do it multiple times
06:24 <+patspam> yeah good point
06:24 <@Haarg> it's unfortunate that we can't build threading into the wre, but unless we had a separate developer build i don't think that would be reasonable
06:25 <+patspam> that's ok, it sounds like the separate perl approach will work well
06:26 <+patspam> i was wondering though, xs modules are supposed to be binary incompatible between threaded/non-threaded perl
06:26 <+patspam> ah that's ok through, because all the xs modules are in the wre, not in /data/WebGUI/lib
06:26 <@Haarg> yeah
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06:34 <+patspam> heh damn, too exciting, i want to run off and play with it but have to prioritise $work :(
06:36 <@Haarg> heh
06:36 <@Haarg> i finally got wxWidgets to install properly so i do have padre working now
06:37 <@Haarg> i'll be happy to test out stuff
06:41 <+patspam> awesome!
06:41 <+patspam> i just switched over from Eclipse + EPIC to Padre as my IDE
06:42 <+patspam> it still has plenty of rough edges but enough cool stuff to be worthwhile
06:42 <+patspam> and it's improving at a ridiculous rate
06:42 <+patspam> when i get a chance i'll set up a git repo for the plugin so that you can play with it
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09:05 < CIA-23> webgui: Patrick Donelan flux * re46e2c3 / lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm : Improved survey www_exportStructure - http://bit.ly/1aqe59
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09:15 < CIA-23> webgui: Patrick Donelan flux * rf279bcd / lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm : Correction to previous commit - http://bit.ly/Yq3jz
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11:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10720 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 4 dirs): 
11:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Survey Expression Engine validation++
11:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Survey Expression Engine now detects invalid variable names passed to value(), score(), etc..
11:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Also now detects situations where you have jump targets/expressions defined at multiple levels - thus causing precedence rules to kick in (normally this indicates a mistake)
11:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fixed Survey edit page bug where TextEditor would not move after gotoExpression textarea resize caused items to move
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03:27 < daviddelikat> any body else notice strange behaviour of the rich text editor in newer versions of WG?
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03:45 < elnino> does the 7.5 shop book apply to the 7.6 shop? or is the 7.6 entirely different?
03:46 < elnino> oh nevermind, it says 7.5 and higher, so then the question is, is 7.7 going to change the shop drasticlly?
03:46 < daviddelikat> hi elnino
03:46 < elnino> howdy!
03:46 < daviddelikat> sorry i can't help with your question
03:47 < elnino> that's ok. it's a sunday, I don't expect much activity on weekends.
03:47 <@preaction> elnino: no. shop is API frozen now
03:47 < daviddelikat> itys usually very quiet here on weekends
03:47 < elnino> ok. thanks for the quick response preaction.
03:48 < elnino> Now I wish I could ask if there is a discount if I buy two books.
03:48 < elnino> I dont' think anyone here would know. there isn't anything on the website.
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03:49 < elnino> hi dionak! haven't seen you for a while.
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08:36 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10721 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Fixed Survey "copy" button on Edit Survey page
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09:52 < SynQ> heu joeri
10:07 < dapperedodo> goodmorning
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10:20 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10722 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Survey Expressions can now access verbatim values
10:31 <+patspam> preaction: you awake?
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11:50 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10723 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey/ExpressionEngine.pm: Fixed Survey expression validation handling of verbatim values
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12:10 < ryuu_ro> hi all, is there any chance that one of you guys has a compiled WRE for CentOs 64bit?
12:10 < ryuu_ro> and are willing to share that with me :)
12:45 <+bartjol> willing? no ;)
12:45 <+bartjol> have not either
12:53 <+bartjol> sorry
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12:55 < ryuu_ro> bartjol: thanks for nothing then ;)
12:55 <+bartjol> I'm always the guy to get useless answers from :)
12:56 < ryuu_ro> it's almost lunchtime 
14:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10724 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): 
14:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added Survey Visualization
14:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Does nothing if GraphViz module not installed (the default until wre 0.9.3)
14:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Shows sections and questions as nodes, answers as edges.
14:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Branch targets also show up as edges
14:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Branch expression edges are currently disabled
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14:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10725 /WebGUI/ (t/Asset/Wobject/Survey.t lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm): Added some tests for Survey visualization
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19:18 <+perlDreamer> plainhao, there's a typo in my user/address book bug.  It should say 7.6 and 7.7
19:19 <@plainhao> ok, thanks
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19:27 < dionak> hey, elnino!
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20:35 < pvanthony> where can wre ver 0.9.2 be downloaded?
20:40 <+perlDreamer> pvanthony, howdy.  It seems to have been built, but not released yet.
20:40 <+perlDreamer> I would make a follow-up post to this forum thread: http://www.plainblack.com/webgui/dev/discuss/wre-0.9.2-
20:40 < pvanthony> Hello perlDreamer
20:41 < pvanthony> yes I did notice that 0.9.2 is with the VM version
20:41 <+perlDreamer> I'm guessing that it got lost in a wave of business and maybe a conference trip.
20:44 < pvanthony> ok.
20:44 < pvanthony> in the forum post, it states ver 0.9.3
20:44 < pvanthony> maybe they would release that version.
20:45 <+perlDreamer> right.  At the date that post was made, if anything was committed after that date (April 10, 2009), it would come out on 0.9.3
20:45 <+perlDreamer> but 0.9.2 is supposed to be the current one
20:46 < pvanthony> ok.
20:46 < pvanthony> in the latest stable release, it states that it fixed email sending
20:47 < pvanthony> is this the issue I was having?
20:47 <+perlDreamer> is that the WebGUI 7.6 release?
20:47 <+perlDreamer> or the WRE?
20:47 < pvanthony> in 7.6.22
20:47 < pvanthony> WebGUI
20:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10726 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Wobject/Collaboration/getThreads.t: added tests for getThreadsPaginator in Collaboration to allow future refactoring
20:48 <+perlDreamer> if that's bug 10210, then probably not
20:48 <+perlDreamer> that was a bad message-Id generation
20:48 <+perlDreamer> not workflow related at all, unfortunately
20:49 <@preaction> CIA-23: thanks, i know i'm awesome ;)
20:49 < pvanthony> noted.
20:49 <+perlDreamer> preaction++
20:49 <+perlDreamer> writing tests.  I always know you had it in you
20:49 <@preaction> there are two other "getThreads" methods that need testing yet, then we'll be good
20:49 <@preaction> i write tests when i'm given enough time! blame the managers (of which i am one)
20:50 <+perlDreamer> I know, just busting your chops
20:50 <@preaction> consider them busted ;_;
20:51 <+perlDreamer> In that base, it's time to start jumping through hoops for the USPS
20:52 <+perlDreamer> s/base/case
20:52  * preaction breaks out his whip and fire-ring
20:52 <+perlDreamer> they require you to run several XML queries through their testing server
20:52 <+perlDreamer> even if the testing server doesn't support the service that you want to use
20:53 <@preaction> some days i wonder if webgui just gets lucky when it comes to not doing stupid things
20:54 <+perlDreamer> you mean it's not due to our awesome coding prowess?
20:56 <@preaction> we are awesome yes, but in any development ecosystem, there has to be some weaker "prey" animals
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20:56 < metanil> any ideas? --> Couldn't execute operation : WebGUI::Operation::Spectre::www_spectreStatus. Root cause: Undefined subroutine &WebGUI::Operation::Spectre::from_json
20:57 <@preaction> metanil: what version you running, because that's a bug
20:57 <@preaction> or what version of JSON you have?
20:57 <@preaction> we shouldn't be using from_json anymore
20:57 < metanil> preaction: i guess pretty old.
20:57 <@preaction> there's a problem running old webgui with new JSON.pm
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20:58 < metanil> preaction: WebGUI 7.4.17-stable
20:58 <@preaction> and that would be one of the versions affected
20:58 <@preaction> anything pre 7.5 stable would be effected
20:58 <@preaction> er... s/\be/a/
20:59 < metanil> preaction: I just recently noticed this problem
20:59 < metanil> because my spectre is not working properly.
21:00 <@preaction> did you upgrade your WRE or your perl modules?
21:00 < metanil> preaction: i can't remember.. but i think i did.. 
21:01 <@preaction> and as i said, new JSON.pm broke API with old versions
21:01 <@preaction> so you either need to update webgui or downgrade JSON.pm
21:01 < metanil> its WRE 0.8.1
21:02 < metanil> preaction: is that the reason that my queued mail is not getting send?
21:02 <@preaction> yes
21:02 < metanil> preaction: but the commit is also done by Spectre, but i guess its working fine. 
21:03 <@preaction> because commit is not a scheduled task. scheduled tasks are sent to spectre using a JSON object
21:03 < metanil> what about this one--> WebGUI::Workflow::Activity::CommitVersionTag?
21:04 <@preaction> that's the activity that commits a version tag
21:05 <+perlDreamer> it's run in realtime when you do a commit
21:05 <+perlDreamer> if it can't complete in 55 seconds, then it dispatches it to Spectre
21:05 <@preaction> not in 7.4. it's sent directly to spectre
21:06 < metanil> perlDreamer: gotcha!
21:06 <+perlDreamer> oh, that's right.
21:06 < metanil> preaction: really?
21:07 <@preaction> spectre gets the scheduled tasks via JSON. then it creates instances when it needs to, which get run. the problem is that spectre is not creating instances of scheduled tasks because it can't parse the JSON
21:07 <@preaction> so now we're back to my original comment: Upgrade WebGUI or downgrade JSON.pm
21:07 < metanil> i'll try to downgrade the WRE for not and see what happens.
21:07 < metanil> err.. s/not/now/
21:10 < metanil> preaction: is it just possible to downgrade JSON thing
21:11 <@preaction> as i've been saying, yes
21:11 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10727 /translations/Arabic/ (188 files in 2 dirs): Update from translation server
21:11 <@preaction> huh, arabic translation is getting an update
21:12 <@preaction> it's now beating Spanish for 3rd place
21:14 <+perlDreamer> it's been ahead of Spanish always
21:14 <+perlDreamer> by like 0.2%
21:16 <+perlDreamer> if you look at that commit, it just reformats the perl and adds the use utf8 line to each file.
21:19 <@preaction> aww
21:22 <+perlDreamer> according to the WNN i18n analyzer, Arabic has been at 60% since May 3rd
21:23 <+perlDreamer> and, quoting the recently released 3rd issue of WNN, the only language that isn't losing ground is German.
21:23 <+perlDreamer> oh, and French
21:24 <+perlDreamer> their work has just been enough to get them some gain to offset all the new i18n going into the system
21:24 <+perlDreamer> awesome t-shirt: http://www.topatoco.com/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=TO&Product_Code=QW-CHEATSHEET&Category_Code=QW
21:30 <@preaction> yeah, this is like the "everyone should know this if the world dies" t-shirt
21:31 <+perlDreamer> ooh, do you have a URL for that?
21:32 <@preaction> you're looking at it
21:33 <+perlDreamer> I see.  I thought you meant that it reminded you of another t-shirt _like_ that one
21:33 <@preaction> oh, no
21:33 <@preaction> though there's little chemistry info, and chemistry would probably be the second most-important knowledge after health
21:38 < pvanthony> was trying out the beta.webgui and notice a new item in shop catogory
21:38 < pvanthony> thing-record
21:39 < pvanthony> is this fully working?
21:39 < pvanthony> tried to use it but could not really get it to work
21:40 < pvanthony> or is this still in development
21:40 <+perlDreamer> it should be fully working
21:40 <@preaction> it should work fine
21:40 < pvanthony> ok then I did not do it right.
21:41 < pvanthony> any documentation around.
21:41 < pvanthony> in the wiki?
21:41 <@preaction> not really. do you have a Thingy with a Thing or two?
21:41 < pvanthony> Created a thingy. Simple one flat.
21:41 <@preaction> but it has a Thing in it?
21:42 < pvanthony> then proceeded to create thing-record
21:42 < pvanthony> to link to the thingy
21:43 < pvanthony> the idea was to create only one field to be linked to the shop
21:44 < pvanthony> so if the customer fills that feild then and only then they will be charged.
21:45 < pvanthony> I was thinking to create the thingy frist then create the thingy-record to make one of the fields in the thingy payable.
21:47 <@preaction> create the Thingy. create the Thing inside of it that the user should be adding records to. Then create the ThingyRecord sku to allow users to add records to that Thing
21:52  * perlDreamer goes running
21:53 < pvanthony> lets say I create a thingy called Talents
21:53 < pvanthony> with feilds, name and telephone
21:53 < pvanthony> I want to charge $10 for the telehpone feild
21:54 < pvanthony> so I create a thingy-record linked to talent thingy at the telephone feild.
21:55 <@preaction> right
21:55 < pvanthony> so when the customer fills in the data in the thingy form with telephone number, the cart has 10 dollars added.
21:55 <@preaction> no, not right. what you're doing is linking the ThingyRecord to the Thingy, and allowing them to only fill out the Telephone field at a cost
21:55 <@preaction> the ThingyRecord only adds records to Thingy
21:56 <@preaction> it doesn't modify existing ones. you can still use Thingy as-is
21:58 < pvanthony> what if we allow customers to fill their names for free but what to charge if they add the telephone number?
21:58 <@preaction> the ThingyRecord allows users who are normally unprivileged for that Thing to add records
21:58 <@preaction> then make a new Thing and have it link to the first Thing with names
21:58 <@preaction> then the user selects their name and adds a phone number
21:59 <@preaction> so two things, one for names, one for phone numbers.
21:59 < pvanthony> ok now I get it
22:00 < pvanthony> thingy-record can only to charges for one thingy not one feild of a thingy
22:01 < pvanthony> that is, do charges for one thingy not one feild of a thingy
22:02 < pvanthony> so if there is a form with 5 feilds that need to be charged, 5 more thingy have to be created and linked to thingy-record.
22:03 <@preaction> no
22:03 <@preaction> thingy record charges for one record in one thingy, but it tracks its records seperately
22:03 < pvanthony> sorry I do not get it then
22:03 <@preaction> it cannot charge for a record that was not created using ThingyRecord
22:04 <@preaction> imagine it more like a Classified Ad system
22:05 <@preaction> if you want to charge seperately for each field, then yes you would need to have seperate things
22:05 < pvanthony> ok
22:06 < pvanthony> plus we have to create one more thingy to link all the feilds into one form. Correct?
22:08 <@preaction> you could do that, or you could make an SQLReport that would combine all the fields
22:09 <@preaction> alternatively, you could enhance / subclass the ThingyRecord to do what you want
22:10 < pvanthony> what I was hoping for is to do something like this, http://www.lsvasiadirectory.com/home/normal
22:10 < pvanthony> if the customer fills in the part B, then he will be charged.
22:11 < pvanthony> each feild has a different price
22:11 <@preaction> you would be far better served by making this a custom Sku, using the ThingyRecord as a base
22:13 < pvanthony> oh no. I am not a programmer.
22:13 <@preaction> or, as i mentioned, making it so each field that a user is allowed to enter has a price (so that the ThingyRecord could be used)
22:13 <@preaction> plain black (and others) does programming
22:13 < pvanthony> ok noted.
22:13 <@preaction> we could develop the feature and put it into webgui (at a cost, of course)
22:14 <@preaction> otherwise, if you want it free, you can submit an RFE to webgui.org/rfe and wait (whereas paying money will get you the feature right now)
22:14 < pvanthony> understand
22:15 < pvanthony> thanks for explaining how to use the thingy-record
22:15 <@preaction> np
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22:43 < metanil> preaction: any ways to find the current version of JSON on the wre?
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22:48 <@Haarg> /data/wre/prereqs/bin/perl -mJSON -le'print JSON->VERSION'
22:54 < metanil> Haarg: thanks
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23:00 < metanil> still no luck .WebGUI 7.4.17-stable WRE 0.8.1 JSON 1.1  --->  Couldn't execute operation : WebGUI::Operation::Spectre::www_spectreStatus. Root cause: Undefined subroutine &WebGUI::Operation::Spectre::from_json
23:03 <@Haarg> are you certain all of your files are from 7.4.17?
23:04 <@Haarg> from_json is from JSON 2.0, which we switched to in 7.4.22
23:05 < metanil> so you mean the Operation::Spectre.pm should not be using from_json()?
23:05 <@Haarg> not in 7.4.17
23:06 < metanil> file /data/WebGUI/docs/changelog is 7.4.17
23:07 < metanil> file /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI.pm is also 7.4.17
23:11 <@Haarg> what are you doing to see those errors?
23:11 < metanil> i went to admin console->settings->Spectre
23:12 < metanil> (moreover, my queued mail is also not being send)
23:12 <@Haarg> and that showed up in the error log?
23:12 <@Haarg> can you pastebin /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Operation/Spectre.pm ?
23:13 < metanil> yes and that error showed up in webgui log
23:15 < metanil> Haarg: http://webgui.pastebin.com/d12eea067
23:16 <@Haarg> that file is not from 7.4.17
23:17 <@Haarg> have you made any code modifications?
23:17 < metanil> oops!! .. (how can it be)
23:17 < metanil> yes i did lots of code modificatioh
23:17 <@Haarg> hmm
23:18 <@Haarg> you might want to do a diff with stock 7.4.17
23:18 < metanil> its not like i haven't played with newer version.. but this one suppose to be 7.4.17
23:21 <@Haarg> if you can do a full diff with a stock copy of 7.4.17 that would help fixing this issue
23:21 < metanil> Haarg: yes i just did whole project directory comparison with the stock one, they're different
23:21 < metanil> :(
23:21 <@Haarg> pastebin?
23:21 < metanil> stock use jsonToObj .. my version use from_json
23:22 < metanil> the first file i saw is Admin.pm
23:22 < metanil> and same goes with Operation/Spectre.pm
23:23 < metanil> Haarg: http://webgui.pastebin.com/d724e4068
23:23 <@Haarg> i mean, can you pastebin a full diff of the dirs?
23:23 < metanil> everything is same. except from_json and to_json
23:24 < metanil> i used meld to compare them
23:27 <@Haarg> it might be possible to upgrade to json 2.0, but we were resolving bugs with that upgrade for a while afterward, so unless you want to upgrade to the latest 7.4, it might be easier to change them back to be compatible with json 1.x
23:30 < metanil> Haarg: sorry my bad.. now i remember.. last time (may be 7-8 month ago), i tried to use latest version of WRE for old WebGUI and the first place it didn't work is due to JSON call. Then i replace all with the newer call. But somehow again, it didn't work, so i reverted back to old wre. however, i pressume to revert the webgui.. :( (damn me!)
23:30 < metanil> err... however, i pressume i forgot to revert the webgui
23:31 < metanil> the current version is still 7.4.17 except the call to json is replace by the newer call. 
23:32 < metanil> i guess should be ok, if replace the newer call with the older one (like jsonToObj)
23:32 <@Haarg> yeah, that should be ok
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--- Day changed Tue May 12 2009
00:07 <+perlDreamer> preaction: test #8 is failing on the getThreads test
00:07 <+perlDreamer> got: undef, expected; 'desc'
00:08 <@preaction> okay, that's trying to get the scratch value, which should be filled in by getThreadsPaginator
00:08 <@preaction> ("should" being a word to describe current behavior, i hope to excise that stupidity)
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00:08 <+perlDreamer> gotcha
00:09 <+perlDreamer> you know, if you fix enough things in the CS maybe the rumors of its demise will go away...
00:11 <@preaction> that's what i'm hoping. it is a good platform for building apps when you subclass it
00:11 <@preaction> but i still want the specific assets to be built, the Blog asset, the Story Manager, the Gallery, etc...
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00:13 <+perlDreamer> Yes!
00:13  * perlDreamer wants to use the Blog asset
00:13 <@preaction> why can't the Story Manager be used for Blogging? is it too big?
00:13 <+perlDreamer> No comments
00:13 <+perlDreamer> No trackbacks
00:13 <+perlDreamer> No remote authentication
00:14 <@preaction> oh, API stuff
00:14 <+perlDreamer> yes
00:14 <+perlDreamer> It's just as bad as using the CS for blogging, probably worse
00:14 <@preaction> remote auth is a WebGUI tool, will be added in 8 (well, Auth will be rewritten with OpenID in mind)
00:15 <+perlDreamer> although the Story Manager is pretty light weight, all three assets only take 1772 lines, including POD, whitespace and comments
00:15 <@preaction> yeah that's like 1/3 of the CS
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00:15 <@preaction> but then, the CS should get reduced once i clean out some bitrot and some more aspects are made
00:16 <@preaction> if you can, perlDreamer, go over that getThreads.t test and see what behavior doesn't make sense to you. my plan is to test the CS as-is and let others make judgements over how stupid it's being
00:17 <+perlDreamer> I'll try to have a look later today.
00:17 <@preaction> no rush, there are plenty of tests left to write
00:18 <+perlDreamer> I guess I'm still not sure why that one test is failing.  Is it failing on your dev setup as well?
00:19 <@preaction> no, they all passed when i committed. let me check though
00:20 <+perlDreamer> maybe it's some uncommitted CS code
00:22 <@preaction> yeah, all tests pass for me
00:22 <@preaction> it's also a pretty dangerous operation, checking the scratch like that. i only tested it because it's what the CS does, and i want to refactor that part out of getThreadsPaginator into a getSortBy
00:24 <+perlDreamer> from what I see, it's either going to set the sortBy, or the sortDir, never both
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00:27 <+perlDreamer> and there's a copy/paste error in the test comment for the failing test.  I just committed a fix for that
00:28 <+perlDreamer> hm, since it's scratch, it can accumulate across calls in a valid set of requests
00:29 <+perlDreamer> but the scratch is cleared out just before the sortBy from form tests
00:29 <@preaction> yeah, that's why i try to delete it afterward when i am not testing if it should stay
00:29 <@preaction> oh wait, maybe i updated the CS to update both scratch no matter what
00:29 <+perlDreamer> :)
00:29 <+perlDreamer> svn diff tells all
00:29 <@preaction> that would be what i did
00:30 <@preaction> i'll commit that
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00:30 <+perlDreamer> Haarg has been back porting all new tests to help with 7.6 debug.  We should let him know not to do that unless he modifies the test first.
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00:31 <@preaction> the problem i have is that getThreadsPaginator is what handles the flipping of sorting. if you use getThreadsPaginator twice in one request that contains a sortBy= form param, you get two different answers
00:32 <+perlDreamer> in other words, it would be nice to have getThreadyPaginator just get the paginator, and let some other method do all the form handling and mode flipping?
00:32 <@preaction> right, preferably view() would do that
00:32 <@preaction> web-facing methods should handle web data and web input
00:33 <+perlDreamer> sure
00:33 <+perlDreamer> www_view, even better
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00:34 <+perlDreamer> having done the hoop jumping manuever, our hero now calls the post office in an attempt to get his account upgraded
00:35 <+perlDreamer> bbiaw
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00:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10728 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Wobject/Collaboration/getThreads.t: Fix a test comment.
00:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10729 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Collaboration.pm: collab now always sets sortOrder scratch, for better testing
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01:14 <+perlDreamer> yay!
01:14 <+perlDreamer> production access to the server
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03:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: ernesto * r10730 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/www/extras/editarea/edit_area/ (images/Thumbs.db plugins/test/images/Thumbs.db): Remove stray Windows' Thumbs.db files.
03:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: ernesto * r10731 /WebGUI/www/extras/editarea/edit_area/ (images/Thumbs.db plugins/test/images/Thumbs.db): Remove stray Windows' Thumbs.db files.
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03:44 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10732 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Made Survey date picker more i18n-generic until we support proper i18n
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16:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10733 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 4 dirs): 
16:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Refactored Survey for more happy endings
16:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Refactored www_submitQuestions to use utility submitQuestions sub (for ease of testing)
16:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Replaced numeric flags, completedCode etc..
16:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added restart() and exitUrl() to the Expression Engine
16:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added more Survey instance tests
16:57 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10734 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (16 files): Update from translation server
16:57 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10735 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (PayDriver_ITransact.pm Asset.pm WebGUI.pm): Update from translation server
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17:39 < SquOnk> Greetings everyone
17:40 < dionak> hi
17:41 < SquOnk> FYI, I've already packaged 7.6.22 for Debian _Sid_ and it's working fine
17:41 < SquOnk> I expect an sponsored upload to Debian next week
17:42 < SquOnk> The package can be made to work in Debian Lenny with little effort.
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17:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10736 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (5 files): Update from translation server
18:03 <+perlmonkey2> hmm, no perldreamer today
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18:20 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10737 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Compare form on Matrix default view screen is now generated from markup
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19:16 <+perlDreamer> cool!  Somebody is translating Dutch again!
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19:21 <@tavisto> great news
19:21 <@tavisto> and it's not bart jol, the big dutch girly man?
19:22  * perlDreamer doesn't know
19:22 <+perlDreamer> but he's not in IRC, so I'm guessing that he's breaking down walls or something
21:22 <@Haarg> bleh.  i can't wait until we switch to template toolkit.
21:22 <@Haarg> every time i use html::template i hate it more
21:22 <@preaction> amen brother
21:38  * SquOnk wishes for a switch to DBIx::Class instead
21:38 < SquOnk> That would make so many things easier...
21:39 <@preaction> SquOnk: there's a DBIx::Class::WebGUI you can use if you want
21:39 <@preaction> or there's also WebGUI::Crud
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21:44 <+perlDreamer> what's so cool about DBIx::Class?
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22:49 <+perlmonkey2> ORM?
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23:11 <+perlDreamer> mmmmm, mango/vanilla protein shake
23:11 <+perlDreamer> it's not as good as pizza
23:11 <+perlDreamer> but don't tell my trainer that I said that
23:16 <@preaction> that actually sounds pretty good
23:16 <@preaction> but why not just increase protein in diet?
23:16 <@preaction> seafood++
23:16 <@preaction> you're in Oregon! you get cheap seafood. unlike Wisconsin :p
23:18 <+perlDreamer> want me to bring you some at the WUC?
23:18 <+perlDreamer> rizen and I see eye to eye on seafood
23:19 <+perlDreamer> which means, when you order surf and turf, you pass the surf over to the wife
23:22 <@preaction> shrimp is like candy of the ocean!
23:22 <+perlDreamer> shrimp is good
23:22 <@preaction> or sushi!
23:23  * perlDreamer always gets confused.  sushi==raw fish, or vegetables?
23:23 <@preaction> sushi is the rice
23:23 <+perlDreamer> one is sushi, the other is sashimi
23:23 <@preaction> sashimi is raw fish over sushi rice
23:23 <+perlDreamer> in that case, I'm digging the sushi, but leave the fish bait off of it
23:23 <@preaction> maki is the "sushi" you know, with the fish and the veggies rolled up in sushi rice
23:25 < Chizad> Man, this sushi talk is making me hungry, and I just ate about an hour ago.
23:26 < Chizad> also, IIRC nigiri is the raw fish over sushi rice, and sashimi is just thin slices of raw fish.
23:27 <@preaction> yeah, that sounds right
23:29 < Chizad> Either way, they're both very tasty. :)
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23:42 < dionak> you guys are making me hungry
23:43 <@preaction> then i won't go into the details on how i made home-made tortellini last night
23:44 <@preaction> mmmmmmm
23:44 <@tavisto> preaction, you got Olive Garden to go. I saw you there
23:44 <@preaction> don't tell THEM that
23:44 <@tavisto> er...
23:44 <@preaction> besides, they don't make pasta from scratch either
23:44 <@preaction> they have MACHINES
23:45 <+perlDreamer> no one makes pasta without a machine
23:45 < dionak> oh, i thought they ordered it frozen (olive garden)
23:45 <+perlDreamer> we have this little hand crank one
23:46 <@tavisto> perlDreamer has fisher price play-doh machine
23:46 <@preaction> yeah, i want me one of thems hand-crank ones
23:47 <+perlDreamer> tavisto is jealous, cuz he got a Easy Bake oven instead
23:47 <@tavisto> why would I be jealous of you when I have an easy bake oven? are you insane!
23:48 <+perlDreamer> because I'll be cranking out the pasta long after you run out of chococake mix and pink frosting
23:48 <@tavisto> have fun poisoning your brain with blue play doh spaghetti... I'm making & eating chocolate cake and brownies!
23:48 <@tavisto> I think you'll be dead after 1 plate of play doh sketti
23:48 <+perlDreamer> blue is fine, it's the yellow you have to watch out for
23:49 <@tavisto> we'll bring some to WUC and you'll have to prove it to me
23:51 <+perlDreamer> I'll bring the marinara
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02:12 < ekennedy_> I've got an RFE (#10253) that I've received permission to commit.  I'm good with submitting the code changes via SVN, however, the change also adds a column to the DataForm table.  Am I to add the code within an upgrade script to handle that or do I communicate it to someone else who does if for me?
02:13 <@preaction> ekennedy_: add the column within the appropriate upgrade script
02:14 < ekennedy_> thanks.
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02:31 <+perlDreamer> we should have told him about RFE day tomorrow.
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03:06 <+perlDreamer> just committed the USPS shipping driver, and I'd love any feedback y'all have about it
03:06 <+perlDreamer> bbiaw
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03:15 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10738 /WebGUI/ (10 files in 8 dirs): 
03:15 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Add USPS Shipping Driver with tests, and i18n.
03:15 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Change the Ship, Cart to do exception handling when calling a shipping driver,
03:15 < CIA-23> WebGUI: as that's the message passing interface between the modules.
03:15 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Add a noFormProcess field property that is recognized by processPropertiesFromFormPost.
03:35 <@preaction> perlDreamer: code looks solid to me. why all the private methods instead of public methods? is there a special reason?
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04:04 <+perlDreamer> preaction, they aren't meant to be called by anyone but me
04:04 <+perlDreamer> so that's why I marked them private
04:05 <+perlDreamer> and thank you very much for the review
04:06 <@preaction> doesn't mean they couldn't be useful to someone else, in a macro perhaps?
04:06 <@preaction> the calculate one especially
04:06 <@preaction> i dunno how shipdrivers work, maybe i'm off-base
04:07 <+perlDreamer> (I think) everything a caller would need is ->calculate, rather than building the XML, submitting the request, and then reconciling XML data with the shippable units
04:08 <+perlDreamer> although, if getShippableUnits is as useful as I think it is, it will be promoted to ShipDriver
04:08 <+perlDreamer> since the UPS code will use it, too
04:23 <@preaction> good to know when trying to debug that the production server has code with bugfixes that SVN doesn't have...
04:24 <+perlDreamer> that's bad
04:25 <@preaction> yeah, little bit
04:35 <+perlmonkey2> woohoo, my G1 comes in tomorrow.  I bet android market wouldn't reject a Gallery app because the default template looks like a Polaroid.  
04:42 <@preaction> i was under impression that android didn't have a central app server, or at least it's controlled by people who believe in a free market
04:55 <+Radix-wrk> Ahh.. you're getting a G1 eh.. not going to wait for the nicer sapphire/magic handset? :)
04:56 <+Radix-wrk> saw a video of samsung's new android handset in action yesterday - looks nice.. tho still lots of stuff to fix in their software it looks like
04:58 <+Radix-wrk> preaction: android has an app server.. and it's controlled, but not as much as the apple app market is from what I've heard - that may change of course
05:06 <@preaction> but i can install whatever i want on my android phone, w/o using their app server, right?
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05:11 <+perlDreamer> at what point does one throw caution aside and decide to publish the details of bad technical support?
05:14 <+perlmonkey2> Radix-wrk: nicer?  I didn't think the magic was going to be nicer
05:14 <+perlmonkey2> lcd keyboard....fail
05:15 <+perlmonkey2> and other than the lack of keyboard, giving it a slighter smaller lighter frame, and a marginally upgraded battery, it is the same machine.
05:15 <@preaction> perlDreamer: after one is finally satisfied
05:15 <+perlmonkey2> preaction: yes, you can install whatever you want from your machine.  
05:18 <+perlDreamer> I was having problems with the API docs.  I told them that.  I sent them the XML I was sending, and the response from their server.
05:18 <+perlDreamer> I called out the pages in the spec
05:18 <+perlDreamer> His response was " I have verified your account is active and everything on our side is up and running correctly. I would suggest contacting your 3rd party shopping cart for assistance."
05:18 <+perlDreamer> I AM the 3rd party shopping cart
05:21 <+perlDreamer> I don't know whether to email him back and try to explain
05:21 <+perlDreamer> or to publish this on my blog
05:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10739 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/AssetVersioning.pm): Improved performance for large numbers of asset instantiations
05:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10740 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/AssetVersioning.pm: merged 10739
05:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10741 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Improved handling of Survey restart
05:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10742 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 5 dirs): 
05:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: More Survey refactoring
05:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: refactored out repetitive checking of takenCount
05:22 < CIA-23> WebGUI: added i18n template variables to Survey template so that user is told what happened for timeouts etc..
05:23 <+perlDreamer> patspam++ for remembering the Help
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05:29 < ekennedy> Question:  Is there a way to install an different version of Webgui in an existing wre installation? This is for test purposes so I'm not worried about hammering the exisitng databases.
05:30 <+perlDreamer> ekennedy, there's a couple of ways to do tht
05:30 <+perlDreamer> the most common way is to symlink directories to /data/WebGUI
05:31 <+perlDreamer> which would let you change between many versions
05:31 <+perlDreamer> another way is via git, which makes switching between branches quite painless
05:31 <+perlDreamer> I'd recommend the first, unless you're quite proficient with git
05:31 <+perlDreamer> which /me is not
05:32 < ekennedy> Its been a few years since I've done a source install of WebGUI but I assume that is what I will want to do to create the desired environment.
05:34  * patspam sneaks off for lunch
05:46 <+Radix-wrk> perlmonkey2, personally not a fan of physical keyboards on phones - a good onscreen keyboard works better imho and they just add bulk to the phone.  The HTC Magic looks very slim in comparison so less weight in the pocket.
05:52 <+perlmonkey2> I wonder how Google is making money with Android?  I read so far only 3% of handheld web traffic is via Android.  Are they hoping it will eventually drive enough search traffic?
05:53 <@preaction> deals with vendors to provide support perhaps?
05:54 <+perlmonkey2> makes sense
06:00 <+Radix-wrk> android has barely gotten off the ground tho
06:01 <+Radix-wrk> it's only available in one phone atm
06:01 <+Radix-wrk> and google win by just making google maps/search/etc all ubiquitous on your phone
06:02 <+Radix-wrk> the more phones that come out powered by android, the more google wins marketshare of the handset market
06:04 <@preaction> yes, but what does marketshare mean to google when android is F/OSS
06:05 <+perlDreamer> then doesn't it become F/OSS vs proprietary?
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06:06 <@preaction> the HTC Magic looks pretty nice
06:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10743 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey/SurveyJSON.pm: Fix a POD whitespace problem in SurveyJSON.
06:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10744 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm: Fix POD syntax errors in Survey.pm
06:07 <@preaction> and now, again, i want to wait to buy a new phone because i want to see if the openness of android leads to better software than the idiots at apple
06:08 <+Radix-wrk> f/oss just means it's possible for other vendors to add support for their stuff - but doesn't mean they will
06:09 <+Radix-wrk> MS is still pushing their Windows mobile stuff.. apple still pushing iPhone.
06:09 <+Radix-wrk> Interestingly enough, Symbian OS is open source now too
06:10 <@preaction> yeah, but symbian has always sucked
06:10 <+Radix-wrk> yup
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06:12 <+Radix-wrk> So I think MS will still control the corporate market for the time being.. apple will have the artsy geeks, and android will be aimed at the hacker/geek market who want more flexibility/customisation
06:13 <+Radix-wrk> and of course there's a few others.. blackberries OS, Palm's WebOS
06:14 <@preaction> i heard BB was going to android
06:14 <+Radix-wrk> it's an interesting market atm.. lots of interesting developments and changes
06:14 <+Radix-wrk> I think android has the potential to be great.. it all depends on the next few handsets
06:15 <@preaction> yes, but if you want something that works well now, go with iphone
06:15 <+perlmonkey2> Radix-wrk: what's wrong with the G1?
06:15 <@preaction> in 3 years i suspect android will be top dog
06:17 <+perlDreamer> you think it will appeal to the mass market?
06:19 <+perlmonkey2> perlDreamer: there is only a single phone out and it accounts for 3% of online mobile traffic.  That seems pretty huge to me.
06:20 <@preaction> i think the openness will appeal to users and vendors alike
06:20 <@preaction> it's basically a free OS for them to use
06:20 <@preaction> (provided their hardware is supported, hence building new phones to take advantage of it)
06:20 <+Radix-wrk> perlmonkey2, my only problem with the G1 was the keyboard.. I find those keyboards too dicky.. tiny little buttons on em
06:21 <@preaction> it's the ubuntu of phones, only more awesome because of the difference in the platform
06:21 <@preaction> android could be a huge win for f/oss
06:21 <+perlmonkey2> android 1.5 has some opengl support.  How long before 3D games :P
06:21 <+Radix-wrk> onscreen keyboards have the disadvantage in that they take up screen realestate.. but they are much better at touch typing on
06:22 <+Radix-wrk> windows mobile and iphone os both have opengl support also
06:22 <+Radix-wrk> biggest problem with the games on them has been how to interact.. touch screen or keyboard.. especially with every device being different (some having d-pad, some not)
06:22 <+perlmonkey2> a visor mount and a bluetooth keyboard and it could be a workable terminal :P
06:24 <+Radix-wrk> I have a htc touch diamond phone atm.. will stick with this until android stabilises and more phones come out I think
06:24 <+Radix-wrk> love the size of this phone tho.. it's tiny
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06:25 <+perlmonkey2> the only thing that would draw me to the iphone is the kindle app.
06:25 <+Radix-wrk> Ahh.. you read ebooks on your phone?
06:25 <+perlmonkey2> I've never had a phone that could do it.
06:25 <+Radix-wrk> that's the #1 application for me on my existing phone - ebook reader
06:25 <+perlmonkey2> But my bro-in-law showed me his iphone with the kindle app, and the text was very readable.
06:26 <+perlmonkey2> I probably wouldn't kill for it, but I might consider harsh words :P
06:26 <+Radix-wrk> I've been reading ebooks on my phone for about 5 years now
06:26 <+perlmonkey2> nice
06:26 <+Radix-wrk> microsoft reader and tiny ebook reader are both great
06:28 <+Radix-wrk> iphone has text/pdf/html ebook readers already tho
06:28 <+Radix-wrk> tho a dedicated reader app is a bit better than your typical app for viewing text files (remembers where you are, allows bookmarks, etc)
06:30 <+Radix-wrk> it's great to carry a few hundred books around me all the time tho - read on the train on the way to work.. continue reading over lunch.. read while waiting in a queue.. read while on the treadmill at the gym.. etc
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06:32 <+perlmonkey2> hmm, how would you read on the treadmill?  Going to drip sweat on your $400 handheld?
06:32 <+perlDreamer> you park it on the console
06:33 <+Radix-wrk> I put it on the treadmill itself on the rail in front of the display - and have a sweat towel for dealing with drips ;)
06:34 <+perlmonkey2> heh, makes sense.
06:34 <+Radix-wrk> just gotta keep pressing the next page key regularly that's all
06:34 <+Radix-wrk> I don't usually run on the treadmill tho.. just a fast paced walk on an incline.. running would be too hard
06:40 <+perlmonkey2> Radix-wrk: heh, I hear that brother.  Once I realized how hard it was on an incline, I decided to never run again, barring velociraptors or going to see the visiting Swedish bikini team.
06:41  * perlmonkey2 turns in for the night.
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06:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10745 /WebGUI/t/Shop/Ship.t: Update this test to work with the new USPS driver.
06:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10746 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Sku.t: 
06:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fix the logic in t/Asset/Sku.t. Add tests to make sure that the
06:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: shipsSeparately method is tested.
06:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10747 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Wobject/Matrix.t: 
06:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Update test to make getListings work. It used the defaultSort value, which was
06:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: set to an invalid column.
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06:45 <+perlDreamer> elnino!
06:45 < elnino> hi. you saw me quick!
06:46 < elnino> perlDreamer,   before I go promising people stuff.. the SMS.. is that in webgui yet? I think we talked about this a while ago.
06:46 <+perlDreamer> should be in there by end of tomorrow
06:46 <+perlDreamer> so, in 7.7.7
06:46 < elnino> ah beta
06:46 < elnino> ok.
06:46 <+perlDreamer> well, an enterprising programmer should be able to backport it if necessary
06:46 < elnino> and 7.7 is released when? this summer?
06:47 < elnino> =)
06:47  * perlDreamer is not sure when it goes stable
06:47 <@tavisto> perldreamer, which should we apply for... integrator or provider?
06:47 <+perlDreamer> provider
06:49 <+perlDreamer> elnino, we should check the roadmap to see if it's on there
06:50 < elnino> not mentioned on http://www.webgui.org/webgui/roadmap
06:50 <+perlDreamer> nope
06:50 <+perlDreamer> maybe preaction will say something about it...
06:51 <@preaction> about what?
06:51 <+perlDreamer> when does 7.7 go stable?
06:51 < elnino> sms
06:51 < elnino> and that
06:51 < elnino> =)
06:51 <@preaction> right before the WUC
06:51 < elnino> ok.
06:51 < elnino> thanks.
06:51 < elnino> and ... sms doesn't cost US (the sender) anything right? she wants a work flow that sends text messages on a particular frequency
06:52 <+perlDreamer> I think it depends on the provider
06:52 < elnino> ...so I just write a workflow for a subscription. right
06:52 < elnino> oh.
06:52 <+perlDreamer> most providers get you coming and going
06:52 <@preaction> why aren't we just using an SMS-email gateway?
06:52 < elnino> thats what I thought (email gateway)
06:53 < elnino> cell to cell costs money. but email to cell?
06:53 <+perlDreamer> that would only cost the receiver?
06:53 <@preaction> right
06:53 < elnino> cool. thanks for confirming.
06:53 <@preaction> i'm not confirming anything, i didn't write it
06:54 < elnino> confirming the email gateway thing/and only costing the receiver.
06:54 < elnino> whether webgui works is another store. =)
06:54 < elnino> s/store/story
06:54 <@preaction> there are SMS-email gateways and they only cost the reciever, dunno if we'll use them
06:54 < elnino> so Ihave to sign up for an sms email gateway. 
06:54 < elnino> I vaguely remember this converstaion.
06:55 < elnino> sorry if it's repeat.
06:55 <@preaction> no, providers each have their own sms-email gateway
06:55 <@preaction> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS_gateways#Carrier-Provided_E-Mail_or_Web_to_SMS_Gateways
06:56 < elnino> ok. backup. my customer wants people to sign up for a subscription of some sort, that will periodically send them (the customer) a text message. (think weather report for your area) 
06:56 < elnino> I imagine that the customer wil provide their own email gateway to their cell phone
06:57 < elnino> and I just write a workflow to send the text message to the customer's cell.
06:57 <@preaction> they could, sure
06:57 <@preaction> you'd be sending an e-mail though
06:57 <@preaction> the gateway would make it into an SMS message and send it to the user
06:57 < elnino> right. like #####@tmobile.com - which the customer will have in their profile somewhere I imagine.
06:58 <@preaction> alternatively, you can have them type in their mobile phone number, and give their carrier, and you can try to figure out what their SMS gateway e-mail address is
06:58 <@preaction> having them provide the e-mail address is safer though
06:58 <@tavisto> yeah those are usually in a standardized format
06:59 <+perlDreamer> so there's no general gateway, that would map any cell phone number to the provider?
06:59 < elnino> correct
07:00 < elnino> one for tmoble, one for verizon, http://www.mutube.com/projects/open-email-to-sms/gateway-list/
07:02 <+perlDreamer> hm
07:02 < elnino> should webgui be listed on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS_gateways#Carrier-Provided_E-Mail_or_Web_to_SMS_Gateways under "SMS Gateway Software"?
07:02 < elnino> whatcha thinkin?
07:03 <@preaction> no, it's not itself an SMS gateway
07:03  * perlDreamer is thinking that the SMS system that I am thinking of is more along the lines of these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS_gateway#API_based_3rd_Party_Bulk_SMS_Gateways
07:04 <@preaction> a gateway implies that it transforms a submitted message into an SMS message and sends it out over the phone network
07:06 <@preaction> so, like, using a modem
07:09 < elnino> I guess, using that definition, the modem is the actuall cell phone. no?
07:10 < elnino> or the cell phone provider themselves.
07:17 <@preaction> the modem is the phone, the gateway takes a request and transfers it to the phone
07:18 < elnino> k.
07:20  * elnino goes to bed to think more.
07:25 < ekennedy> Is there anyone on-line that can help with an SVN password reset?
07:26 <+perlDreamer> ekennedy: that would be Haarg, preaction or rizen
07:27  * perlDreamer would recommend coming back tomorrow morning at 9:00pm CDT for RFE day.
07:27 <+perlDreamer> there will be a whole lot of hacking going on
07:28 < ekennedy> The day job will be in the way.  I've got an RFE to commit and wanted to try to get it before a bunch of other changes are submitted assuming that the RFE day is productive.
07:29 <+perlDreamer> ekennedy, can you send me a SVN diff?  I'll commit it for you.
07:29 <+perlDreamer> but we should get your SVN password cleared up anyway
07:31 < ekennedy> perlDreamer - I'll see if I can't find a newer password somewhere on my system and if I don't I send a note to JT to get a new one.  If he sees it in the morning maybe I can get it in before taking off.  Thanks for your help!
07:31 <+perlDreamer> you bet, ekennedy
07:35 <@preaction> i'd help, but i'm afraid i don't know who you are
07:38 <+perlDreamer> preaction, I'll vouch for ekennedy
07:39 <+perlDreamer> same IRC nick as username on the site, see the RFE about reply filter
07:40 <+perlDreamer> time for this old man to go to bed.
07:40 <+perlDreamer> happy hacking, all
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07:49 < ekennedy> preaction: I was just drafting a message to JT.  Can I e-mail you the original message I had from JT giving me svn access as some kind of proof?  Or would you rather than I just send a note to JT?  I get it if that is your preference.  Thanks.
07:54 <@preaction> ekennedy: perlDreamer vouches for you. what you want your new password to be?
07:54 <@preaction> ekennedy: email it to doug@plainblack.com, that way i have an audit trail to CMA
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11:03 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10748 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): adding listings caching to Matrix
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12:16 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10749 /WebGUI/ (7 files in 6 dirs): 
12:16 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added Survey feedback template
12:16 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added survey feedback template and method for returning the templated feedback for a given response
12:16 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Used this to clean up the default survey template, and updated the i18n and help
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12:42 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10750 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey.pm: Added www_showFeedback to Survey so that you can dial up response feedback on demand
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16:17 < carogray> can anyone answer questions about website statistics - awstats in particular and being hosted on Plain Black servers?
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17:09 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10751 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Refactored genereation of tranasaction related tmpl_vars into WG::Shop::Transaction->getTransactionVars.
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17:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10752 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.6.22-7.6.23.pl t/Asset/Asset.t): test and upgrade cleanups
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17:52 <+perlDreamer> great change, MrHairgrease!
17:53 <+MrHairgrease> huh
17:53 <+MrHairgrease> what change
17:53 <+MrHairgrease> did I change?
17:53 <+perlDreamer> refactoring out those template variables
17:53 <+MrHairgrease> oh yeah
17:53 <+perlDreamer> so they aren't copy/pasted
17:53 <+MrHairgrease> they were _almost_ copy/pasted =)
17:54 <+MrHairgrease> they differed both one line or so
17:54 <+MrHairgrease> but both could use each others missing line
17:54 <+MrHairgrease> =)
17:55 <+MrHairgrease> I was about to add a tmpl_var to the skus called pricePlusTax
17:55 <+MrHairgrease> which would contain the getPrice plus the dafult tax that is applied to it
17:56 <+MrHairgrease> default tax being the tax that would be applied when no shipping address is given
17:56 <+MrHairgrease> I though it would be easy, but there's no centralized tmpl_var generation thingy in all skus
17:56 <+perlDreamer> no, there's not :(
17:56 <+MrHairgrease> so I prolly have to add it everywhere
17:56 <+MrHairgrease> which sucks
17:57 <+MrHairgrease> I did add a getPriceWithTax sub to WG::A::Sku in my working tree already
17:57 <+MrHairgrease> but I'm wondering if there would be a better way
17:58 <+MrHairgrease> any ideas?
18:01 <+perlDreamer> MrHairgrease, this is what I'd do.
18:01 <+perlDreamer> I'd start making such a subroutine
18:01 <+perlDreamer> and make sure that all the child classes call it
18:01 <+perlDreamer> that way it only has to be done once
18:02 <+perlDreamer> and we can begin moving common stuff back up into Sku->getTemplateVariables as needed/when time permits
18:02  * perlDreamer has to run to a meeting
18:02 <+MrHairgrease> yeah, that was what I was planning on
18:02 <+MrHairgrease> ok 
18:02 <+MrHairgrease> thanks
18:02 <+perlDreamer> trying to get some school loans for Kathy
18:02 <+MrHairgrease> suck em dry pd
18:02 <+perlDreamer> the EU way of higher education is much less expensive, but I hear they tax y'all to death
18:02 <+perlDreamer> l8r
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18:23 <@tavisto> perldreamer
18:23 <@tavisto> I got back the USPS provider account info
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19:50 <+perlmonkey2> accounts
19:53 <+perlDreamer> tavisto, how does it sound?
19:55 <+perlDreamer> onerous?
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20:06 <@tavisto> well doesn't mean much to me but I passed it on to Graham and JT so that they can play with it
20:18 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, I need to commit a template that is going to end up in a weird place because of the import/parent problem.
20:18 <+perlDreamer> would it be safer to export the whole subfolder?
20:19 <@Haarg> hrm
20:19 <@Haarg> we should probably just fix the root problem
20:19 <@Haarg> for now just do the single template
20:20 <+perlDreamer> Okay.  If i can come back around and look at the import/parent issue, I'll let you know.
20:20 <+perlDreamer> as long as I get it fixed by 7.7.7 release time, it won't matter
20:20 <+perlDreamer> er, 7.7.6 rather
20:27 < zmk> is there an intended way to make the default view of a gallery the thumbnail view? Can't figure out how to do it except by manually linking to ?func=thumbnails ..
20:28 <@preaction> zmk: not presently, no. but there's an RFE out there for it I believe
20:29 <+perlDreamer> RFE++
20:29 <+perlDreamer> (meaning I just committed one)
20:29 <+perlDreamer> anybody seen RFESlasherMcGurk today?
20:31 <@Haarg> yes, over there ->
20:31 < zmk> preaction: thanks!
20:31 <@Haarg> bunch of crap came up today though
20:31 <+perlDreamer> I'll be committing 4 RFEs today
20:31 <+perlDreamer> if all goes well ;)
20:32 <@preaction> bunch of crap my ass, this week has been a hellstorm
20:32 <+perlDreamer> it's been pretty constant the last month
20:33 <@preaction> nah, yesterday JT's world exploded, of course he was off-world at the time (as usual for these things to happen), so there were some fun things
20:33 <@preaction> one day the world will fear him enough to not explode when he stops looking, but until that day...
20:34 <+perlDreamer> hopefully he was heading to a small blue/green world where the rays of the sun will evoke his latent alien powers
20:34 <@preaction> well, that's what Graham and I are for :p
20:34 <+perlDreamer> indeed
20:34 <+perlDreamer> have you pointed out to him that bad things happen when he goes away?
20:34 <+perlDreamer> hoster fires
20:34 <+perlDreamer> exploding planets
20:35 <+perlDreamer> might be better just to stay at home
20:35 <+perlDreamer> that happens to my boss
20:35 <+perlDreamer> when he goes to Florida there's some major terrorist issue that comes up and disrupts airline travel
20:37 <+perlDreamer> ex-boss, I should say
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: sno * r10753 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Workflow/Activity/CleanLoginHistory.pm: 
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Add retain last login yesNo option. If configured to retain, workflow will determine if
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: the last login would be removed from the login history and will skip deleting that entry.
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10754 /WebGUI/ (8 files in 8 dirs): 
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: RFE for making an user's inbox filterable by the person who sent it.
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Includes template changes, i18n, help and tests.
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10755 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/Session/Setting.pm t/Session/Setting.t): 
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Add a has method to Session/Setting, so that it's easy to check if a setting
20:41 <@preaction> oh lord. i'm checking out the svn repo with git-svn. and it's at r50. of 10754...
20:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: already exists. Very handy for upgrade scripts.
20:46 <@preaction> r500 of 10756... this might take a while...
20:50 <+perlDreamer> hm 10:52 - 10:47/(500-50) ~ 5 minutes for 450 commits
20:51 <+perlDreamer> roughly 25X more commits to go
20:51 <+perlDreamer> so 135 minutes
20:57 <+perlDreamer> that's enough time to meet a friend for 5 mile run, drive back home, shower and eat lunch
20:59 <+perlDreamer> RFE ++
21:00 <+perlmonkey2> preaction: you are a brave soul.
21:01 <@preaction> i need it. i can't handle keeping all these changes in one SVN repo in limbo like i do
21:02 <@preaction> i end up committing half of them erroneously, or having to make absolutely sure, or not being able to work on two features in one file...
21:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: sno * r10756 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/Workflow_Activity_CleanLoginHistory.pm: Option messages for Admin panel.
21:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10757 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Add an Inbox setting to send the user a copy of messages that they send.
21:09 <@preaction> and if people keep adding revisions, my git-svn clone will NEVER FINISH
21:09 <+perlDreamer> sorry :/
21:09 <+perlDreamer> the good news is that they're small, and it's pulling revs faster than we can make them
21:09 <+perlDreamer> until RFESlasherMcGurk shows up
21:11 <@preaction> er... well after 2200 it decided to do some compressing thing. 
21:17 <+perlDreamer> going faster?
21:19 <@preaction> 2800 now, i suspect it' will be usable by tonight
21:22 <+perlDreamer> it'll be faster once we're all in git
21:24 <+perlDreamer> RFE ++
21:27 -!- dapperedodo [n=dappered@ip4da72a6b.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #webgui
21:27 <@Haarg> preaction, i could give you my repo
21:29 <@Haarg> when i built it, i downloaded a copy of the full repo off the server to make it go at a reasonable speed
21:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10758 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ProfileCategory.pm: Remove some whitespace.
21:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10759 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Account.pm: Document the store method in POD for Account.
21:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10760 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Inbox/Message.pm: Only use 1 i18n object.
21:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10761 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Add templated inbox notifications.
21:47 -!- perlDreamer1 [n=colink@pool-71-117-209-184.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #webgui
21:47 < perlDreamer1> am I back?
21:47 < perlDreamer1> phew
21:48  * perlDreamer1 goes running
21:48 < perlDreamer1> be back before preaction's git-svn download finishes
21:48 -!- perlDreamer [n=colink@pool-71-117-209-184.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
22:00 <@Haarg> also, it will take much longer than you think to build a webgui git repo if you include the branches.
22:00 <@Haarg> there is one branch that was made by mistake that is a copy of svn root
22:01 <@Haarg> so it rebuilds the whole history again
22:06 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10762 /WebGUI/docs/ (2 files in 2 dirs): - Fixed a search tickets problem in the EMS badge builder template.
22:12 <@Haarg> preaction, i'm uploading my git repo to dusk.  eta 87 minutes.  goes back to webgui 0.9.
22:14 <@preaction> i just checked out https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/WebGUI, so it should be just waht i need
22:14 <@preaction> i'm already up to 6300
22:14 <@Haarg> ah
22:14 <@Haarg> yeah, that goes a lot faster
22:15 <@preaction> and your git repo in dusk won't commit back to svn will it? or could you add an auto-hook that would git-svn dcommit
22:15 <@preaction> i'm pulling a master and i'll make local branches for all my changes, then push back to master and then dcommit
22:15 <@Haarg> what i'm uploading is just a tarball of what i'm using basically
22:15 <@Haarg> so yes it will commit back to svn
22:17 <@preaction> ohh, i get it
22:19 <@Haarg> it's basically just a git svn checkout that's been massaged a bit to have more data and so i can rebuild it faster
22:22 <@tavisto> preaction, I need your l33t gallery sk1llz
22:22 <@tavisto> er kn0wl3dge
22:22 <@preaction> tavisto: wat j00 n33d
22:22 <@tavisto> hehe
22:22 <@tavisto> I have been tasked with grouping the webgui sightings into categories that match our solutions section
22:23 <@tavisto> therefore, business, gov, non-prof, education
22:23 <@preaction> individual galleries?
22:23 <@tavisto> yessir, so I'm curious if I can just go in and manage the current monster gallery for sightings and cut/paste the albums 
22:23 <@tavisto> I don't think this is a problem but I wasn't sure since I've never done anything like this before
22:33 <@preaction> yes, cut/paste should work fine
22:33 <@tavisto> that is great news
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22:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10763 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Sku/EMSTicket.pm): 
22:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: - Fixed a problem in the EMS calculating prices on tickets with a badge that
22:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI:  has an existing ribbon.
23:06 <@preaction> IT'S DONE! YAY!
23:06 <@preaction> only 2 hours, not bad
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23:20 < CIA-23> WebGUI: joeri * r10764 /WebGUI/ (11 files in 10 dirs): add PayPal paydriver
23:21 < carogray> webstatistics question
23:21 < carogray> ?
23:22 < carogray> hosted on plainblack when we look at webstatistics for hosts - we are assuming that the hosts are the the hosts of our visitors? or the ip addresses of people looking at our website
23:22 < carogray> Plain Black is "looking" at our pages more than anyone else - way more than anyone else?
23:23 < carogray> doesn't this then skew all of the results of our statistics like how many pages are looked at?
23:23 < dapperedodo> I think that will be spectre who is looking
23:23 < carogray> ok - but it isn't people who are using our information right?
23:24 < dapperedodo> Well, you never know that for sure if you put things on the internet
23:26 <@preaction> carogray: that's probably spectre, yes. what IP address specifically?
23:26 <@preaction> or what hostname?
23:26 <@preaction> we can make it so those don't show up anymore, if you post to the support board and ask
23:27 < carogray> ugh! have to go! 15 minutes ago! will you guys still be aorund  in a couple of hours or tomorrow?
23:29 -!- carogray [n=Caroline@host2.209.113.248.conversent.net] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)]
23:34 <@preaction> i really need to stop giving PB help here...
23:40 <@Haarg> preaction, if you want a more complete git repo, it's on dusk in my home dir
23:41 <@preaction> okay, thanks. i might replace my SVN.master with it
23:45 < ckotil> so i just lost some perl modules which broke webgui after a restart of httpd. i rerean testEnvironment, and it downloaded what i had lost. so its working again
23:45 < ckotil> so far i cant figure out why/how i lost the perl modules.
23:45 <@preaction> wrong environment?
23:45 <@preaction> new WRE?
23:46 < ckotil> wrong env maybe. but i called the apache restart script via sudo like i always do
23:46 < ckotil> its a source install
23:48 <@preaction> perhaps someone else did it and didn't know they were doing wrong? perhaps the version numbers we needed got bumped up?
23:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: sno * r10765 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (Content/AssetManager.pm Search.pm): 
23:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Admin Panel asset search extension: allow searching by assetId with the inclusion of a helper keyword:
23:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: assetid: <an_asset_id>
23:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: assetId search is performed using a logical OR so multiple helper:key pairs can be applied
23:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: and normal keywords can also be used in the same query
23:48 < ckotil> impossible to say. i just hope i stumble accross something that explains what just happened.
23:49 < ckotil> my heart always drops when i see service unavailable.
23:49 < ckotil> saw this in apache logs.   Can't locate object method "open" via package "WebGUI::Session" at /gnoc/globalnoc/htdocs/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/URL/Content.pm line 54.\n
23:49 < ckotil> saw nothing in webgui log.
23:49 <@preaction> missing modules will do that
23:50 < ckotil> ya
23:50 < ckotil> so that tipped me off to rerun the testEnv script
23:50 < ckotil> MIME::Tools was one missing package, and i forget the others.
23:51 <@Haarg> i think i'm going to add and use Scope::Guard as a way to deal with session's tendancy to leak
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23:52 < ckotil> modules installed via testEnv dont update the history file for cpan
23:52 < ckotil> or maybe im lookin int he wrong place
23:52 <@preaction> ckotil: that's weird. it uses CPAN.pm to do it
23:55 < ckotil> ah, at least i can see the build files in .cpan/build. File::Temp, MIME::Tools, File::Path were reinstalled
23:56 <@preaction> File::Path is a standard module, same as File::Temp
23:56 <@preaction> so whatever happened, it's pretty weird
23:57 <@preaction> wooo! go joeri! paypal driver!
23:57 < dapperedodo> no that would be woo go Paul Wrightson, he created it
23:58 <@preaction> oh, then WOOOOO!
23:58 <@preaction> yay for new committers!
--- Day changed Thu May 14 2009
00:00 <@preaction> so how could i justify this patch i made to allow Redirect to show up in Page Layout with a template?
00:01 <@preaction> elnino asked for the feature, didn't make an RFE, but i did it anyway because i was bored one night
00:01 <@Haarg> preaction, if you do use my git repo, you'll note it maps svn users to real names.  if new names show up you'll have to add them to the authors file it uses.  alternatively, you could just remove that from the config file.
00:01 <@preaction> and now i get this strange sense of deja vu like she asked for this before and was rejected... like i've argued for it before...
00:02 <@preaction> Haarg: it doesn't happen automatically?
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00:02 <@Haarg> it will refuse to continue updating until you add an entry to the authors file
00:02 <@preaction> ah, nice
00:04 < perlDreamer1> Haarg, you think Session is leaking?
00:04 <@Haarg> not currently
00:04 <@Haarg> but it's easy to write code that does leak it
00:04 <@Haarg> and depending on the design of the code, fixing the leaks can be painful
00:05 <@Haarg> export code specifically
00:05 < perlDreamer1> too true :/
00:05 <@Haarg> would be much friendlier to be able to just throw an error or return
00:05 <@Haarg> instead of having to close the session before doing that
00:06 -!- c_thomas [n=tomb@207-119-125-236.stat.centurytel.net] has joined #webgui
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00:27 < perlDreamer1> ugh
00:27 < perlDreamer1> merging code from old versions of wG into HEAD is hard!
00:30 <@preaction> yes, yessir it is
00:30 <@preaction> easier to merge back to older versions imho
00:30 -!- s4eek [n=charles@andc-fw1.exploreos.com] has joined #webgui
00:30 <@preaction> so i made a Form::SelectAsset control, but i don't know if it works :(
00:31 < perlDreamer1> you _do_ know what I'm going to say to that, right?
00:31 <@preaction> OMG NO, WUT
00:31 < perlDreamer1> How about writing a test? :)
00:31 <@preaction> OMGYES
00:31 < perlDreamer1> tests are easy, friendly, and have two major benefits
00:32 < perlDreamer1> 1) they make sure that the codes works today and will work tomorrow
00:32 <@preaction> but tomorrow or something. i've got real work to do and i'm sitting here cleaning out my SVN repo of all the bits of code i've written and told nobody about
00:32 < perlDreamer1> 2) They get annoying, insistent, berating code maintainers off yer back
00:33 < perlDreamer1> Of course, if Haarg weren't so nice all the time, I wouldn't have to be annoying, insistent, berating, impatient and voluble all the time, either.
00:34 <@preaction> sweet. now i have git clones for each of my in-progress features (only 4, not counting the other full SVN clones and my Doug's Experimental branch)
00:34 <@preaction> oh, wait, 5
00:34 <@Haarg> what do you mean by git clones?
00:35 <@preaction> git clone WebGUI_SVN.master <some name>
00:35 <@Haarg> ah
00:35 <@preaction> then i can git push WebGUI_SVN.master, and then git-svn dcommit in my .master
00:35 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dwrandall * r10766 /WebGUI/ (8 files in 6 dirs): Content Delivery Network (CDN) - optional, for either uploads only or both uploads & extras (rfe 9134)
00:36 <@preaction> wait, who?
00:36 <@Haarg> not sure how you installed git, but the source archive includes a script in contribs that will create symlinked working directories
00:36 <@Haarg> then you could dcommit from any of the directories
00:37 < perlDreamer1> yeah, who?
00:38 <@preaction> Haarg: yeah, but there was a huge disclaimer about "HYRE BE DRAGYNS" that i didn't want to deal with
00:38 <@Haarg> ah
00:38 <@Haarg> it's worked mostly fine for me
00:38 <@preaction> i didn't understand, something about deleting branches and corrupting the clone repo
00:38 <@Haarg> are you sure you mean the same thing?
00:38 <@preaction> most likely it's someone being too thorough on the manpage, but a two-step commit is fine for me
00:39 <@Haarg> there are some options you can give to the clone command to do some odd things
00:39 <@preaction> man git-clone, the --shared option
00:39 <@Haarg> the script i'm using is different
00:39 <@Haarg> it just symlinks all the relevant files/dirs
00:40 < perlDreamer1> it's not bad code
00:40 < perlDreamer1> there's tests
00:40 < perlDreamer1> POD
00:40 <@preaction> but wouldn't symlinks cause me to edit both the clone and the source repo?
00:40 < perlDreamer1> code formatting is strange.  Random indents and cuddled elses
00:40 <@Haarg> depends on what you mean
00:41 <@Haarg> as long as they are working on different branches, it doesn't matter
00:41 <@Haarg> the repo as a whole would be shared, but the data is all still kept separate
00:41 <@preaction> oh, ohhhh, OHHHHH. i didn't have to do this, i could have just done "git branch"
00:41 <@Haarg> for most things, yeah
00:42 <@preaction> i'm still thinking like SVN, where branching is a stupid and dangerous thing
00:42 <@Haarg> although sometimes it's nice to have separate working directories for things
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00:43 < perlDreamer1> only thing that's bad is that he didn't put a notice in the changelog
00:43 < perlDreamer1> but he wrote 38 tests to validate his new CDN storage code
00:43 < perlDreamer1> which is cool!
00:44 <@preaction> indeed
00:44 < perlDreamer1> each new method added to Session/Url and Session/Id got a test
00:45 <@preaction> it'd be nice to see some examples of how to use it with S3 or whatever other CDN are out there
00:46 <@preaction> otherwise i like it, it adds some wonderful features in a nice way into a very old part of WebGUI
00:46 < perlDreamer1> someone needs to let him know about the changelog and general coding standards
00:47 <@preaction> i can ask who dunnit so we can mention it
00:47 < perlDreamer1> u da man, dawg
00:48 <@Haarg> perlDreamer1, are there any particular rough spots you noticed when working on exporting in story manager?
00:48 < perlDreamer1> nope
00:48 < perlDreamer1> worked fine
00:48 <@Haarg> looks like i'm going to end up refactoring some parts of the export code
00:49 < perlDreamer1> AssetExport code, or Story* export code?
00:49 <@Haarg> AssetExport
00:49 < perlDreamer1> that would be very good
00:49 <@Haarg> it won't be all that different, but at least cleaned up in some ways
00:50 < perlDreamer1> is t/Mail/Send.t working for you, Haarg?
00:50 <@Haarg> 7.6 or 7.7?
00:51 < perlDreamer1> 7.7
00:51 < perlDreamer1> I'm neck deep in merging RFE code
00:51 < perlDreamer1> that test was acting funny last night
00:51 <@Haarg> works for me
00:51 <@Haarg> although i have seen it act odd from time to time
00:51 < perlDreamer1> random pairs of tests would fail
00:59 <@preaction> the only suitable course is for me to commit ritual seppuku to absolve myself of the sin of t/Mail/Send.t
01:00 <@Haarg> heh
01:00 < perlDreamer1> preaction, it's a great test
01:00 < perlDreamer1> there are things that we couldn't test without it
01:00 <@preaction> TELL ME LIES TELL ME SWEET LITTLE LIES
01:00 < perlDreamer1> instead of sepuku, you must find a way to refactor it to make it more testable
01:00 <@preaction> anyway, real work now!
01:00 < perlDreamer1> I have read the PayPal code
01:01 < perlDreamer1> and it's not going to pass the POD tests
01:01 < perlDreamer1> Haarg, I'm going to start running regressions now
01:01 < perlDreamer1> maybe we'll get done by Friday
01:01 <@Haarg> heh
01:01 <@Haarg> thanks
01:01 <@Haarg> i still have a number of things to commit
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10767 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: Add missing changelog entry for rfe #9134
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10768 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/sharefolder.gif: Addes sharefolder.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10769 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/story.gif: added story.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10770 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/storyarchive.gif: added storyarchive.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10771 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/storytopic.gif: added storytopic.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10772 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/small/storytopic.gif: added small storytopic.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10773 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/small/storyarchive.gif: added small storyarchive.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10774 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/small/story.gif: added small story.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dagitz * r10775 /WebGUI/www/extras/assets/small/sharefolder.gif: added small sharefolder.gif
01:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10776 /WebGUI/ (8 files in 8 dirs): Enable WebGUI sites to send SMS messages as inbox notifications.
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01:12 <@tavisto> I WEAR MY SUNGLASSES AT NIGHT
01:12 <@tavisto> *Tavisto snaps out of 80's karaoke night* ... preaction, did you solve the case?
01:13 <@Haarg> perlDreamer1, preaction, http://gist.github.com/111343 if you care to look
01:13 <@Haarg> still incomplete
01:13 <@preaction> The Case of the Missing Millionaire? well, i recovered 500,000, and i'll return the 300,000 to the authorities
01:14 <@tavisto> um no.. Nancy Drew... I'm talking about your staff email
01:15 <@preaction> no
01:15 <@tavisto> what is the "new hotness" feature you're talking about
01:15 < perlDreamer1> Haarg, doesn't it still need to output messages back to the user, in addition to the throw?
01:15 <@preaction> i had heard it was someone from Donorware
01:15 <@Haarg> that's handled by the method that calls it
01:15 < perlDreamer1> cool
01:15 <@tavisto> Colin that's very cool about the SMS messages
01:16 <@preaction> tavisto: the Content Delivery Network thing? allows you to use Amazon S3 or some other CDN to speed up requests
01:16 <@preaction> i forget what that other big CDN is
01:16 <@preaction> inktomi?
01:16 <@preaction> alexa?
01:16 <@tavisto> yeah must be... I had not heard of this...
01:16 < perlDreamer1> tavisto: cool features today: CDN handling for wG, SMS messaging, PayPal driver
01:16 < perlDreamer1> akamai is a CDN?
01:16 <@tavisto> oooh paypal!
01:16 <@preaction> akamai, that's the one
01:17 < perlDreamer1> isn't all core code supposed to have the copyright sent back to PB?
01:17 <@tavisto> someone must have big plans if they're going to use amazon s3 or akamai servers for their content
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01:18 <@preaction> it's Donorware, they're big, and they have plans, so they're big plans ;)
01:18 <@tavisto> that's awesome... I can only hope that some of their wG clients want to move to that
01:19 <@preaction> indeed. especially for world-wide sites it will improve response times (since CDNs usually do geocaching)
01:21 <@tavisto> so perldreamer1, I take it we could add a new option to allow password recovery to be an sms message
01:21 <@tavisto> I know my bank (Chase) seems to favor that option
01:21  * perlDreamer1 would have to think about that.  Right now only inbox notifications are setup with that route
01:21 < perlDreamer1> it could be done
01:23 <@preaction> that would be nice actually. requires they have the phone instead of an e-mail account one can login to wherever
01:23 <@tavisto> yep I'm sure it could be now that you've got some of it in place
01:23 <@tavisto> it's a nice option to have.. assuming they already have their phone # in their profile. Otherwise it's a miserable failure
01:24 <@preaction> well, we'd only send the pw to sms if they can, otherwise we'd go back to e-mail :p
01:24 <@tavisto> I would like a snail mail option too please. ;)
01:25 <@preaction> hmm... that might be an idea. an email to snail-mail gateway, like paycheques
01:25 <@preaction> they just get printed and sent, almost no user interaction (afaik)
01:25 <@tavisto> nooo.. 
01:26 <@preaction> they're special paper and printers, it's like an envelope with carbon-paper inside
01:26 <@preaction> use the special printer to print one side, then laser the address on the other
01:27  * preaction gets head out of the clouds
01:27 <@preaction> we could add an e-mail to fax gateway though
01:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10777 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/ (Wobject/StoryTopic.pm Wobject/StoryArchive.pm Story.pm): Make the Story Manager assets use the new icons.
01:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10778 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Shop/PayDriver/PayPal/PayPalStd.pm: Fix POD whitespace problem in the new PayPal driver.
01:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10779 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.7.5-7.7.6.pl: Fix syntax errors in the upgrade script.
01:33 <@Haarg> perlDreamer1, what would you think of changing tests to use Scope::Guard instead of an END block
01:34 <@Haarg> it would take a while to change all the tests, but the main advantage would be allowing the tests to run through something like Test::Aggregate
01:35 <@Haarg> which would speed up running all the tests substantially
01:36 < perlDreamer1> Haarg, I'm not familiar with Scope::Guard, how does it make removing the END block work?
01:36 <@preaction> it runs some code when the scope ends
01:36 <@Haarg> well, it basically just returns an object with a destroy method
01:36 <@preaction> i think, that's what i read
01:37 <@Haarg> and the destroy method calls an arbitrary sub
01:38 <@Haarg> so instead of having an end block, you would have at the top of the test 'my $guard = Scope::Guard->new(sub { cleanup; });'
01:39 <@Haarg> Test::Aggregate is kind of hackish, but it runs all the tests in the same perl interpreter
01:39 <@Haarg> so you don't have to re-load modules
01:39 <@Haarg> that wouldn't work at all with all the cleanup code in the end blocks though, since many of the tests rely on having a clean db
01:41 < perlDreamer1> I stuck it in an END block because for many errors, the tests clean themselves up anyway
01:41 < perlDreamer1> but it doesn't always work
01:43 <@preaction> does Scope::Guard / DESTROY get called in case of a die?
01:43 <@Haarg> well, i think using something like Scope::Guard you get similar guarantees that the code will be run compared to and END
01:43 <@Haarg> yes
01:44 < perlDreamer1> then we only have the problems of updating every single test, seeing how well they work run in aggregate, and all the script support to make it work.
01:45 <@Haarg> yeah
01:45 <@Haarg> not a small amount of work certainly
01:45 < perlDreamer1> updating the tests is not that much work, I've already been doing that for the object clean-up
01:45 <@Haarg> i'd say we should use Test::Class instead, but it's hard to know when that will be working again
01:46 < perlDreamer1> yeah
01:46 <@Haarg> have to go, be back in a little
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01:46 <@preaction> good lord what happened to donorware?
01:46 < perlDreamer1> huh?
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01:46 <@preaction> donor.com is their new site, and it's... incredible
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01:47 <@preaction> and it's a WebGUI site
01:47 <@tavisto> oooh ooh ooooh!
01:47 <@tavisto> oh yeah that's not new
01:47 <@tavisto> good site though
01:48 <@preaction> okay, i remember their olllld old site
01:48 <@preaction> back when i was upgrading them to 6.8
01:48 <@tavisto> yeah it was ugh
01:48 <@preaction> it was functional, but not so much the pretty
01:48 <@preaction> well. it wasn't so much the functional either...
01:48 <@preaction> they had three sites they merged into one
01:48 <@tavisto> i like the iDasco app they have hehe
01:48  * preaction wrote the "Splitting and Merging WebGUI Sites" presentation from that experience
01:49 <@tavisto> sounds like a blast
01:50 <@preaction> the experience was nice. the presentation sucked
01:51 <@tavisto> anyone have an idea about this?
01:51 <@tavisto> I was able to widgetize a webgui calendar by starting the new demo you gave me and using the macro but when I copied the code over to my site it displayed the entire webgui page housing the calendar within the set dimensions rather than just the calendar. Ideas?
01:52 <@preaction> style template maybe? or wrong URL?
01:52 <@tavisto> isnt the widget function only supposed to bring over the asset?
01:52 <@tavisto> hmm... think it could be the page url instead of the actual calendar? :)
01:53 < perlDreamer1> widget is broken, it's a known bug
01:53 < perlDreamer1> however, try the beta server instead to see if it works differently
01:54 <@tavisto> I just looked and it's the correct url
01:54 <@tavisto> oh crap
01:54 <@tavisto> you just peed on my cheerios perlDreamer
01:54 < perlDreamer1> do try the beta server, tavisto
01:54 <@tavisto> yep will do.. the widget isn't enabled on the regular demo.plainblack server though
01:55 < perlDreamer1> well, let me be blunt
01:55 < perlDreamer1> I had a prototype fix for the Widget
01:55 < perlDreamer1> it seemed to work for me
01:55 < perlDreamer1> but it got accidently committed before I was fully convinced that it worked the way the widget was supposed to
01:56 < perlDreamer1> when I left it last, it showed just the content, not a whole page
01:56 < perlDreamer1> it would be in 7.7.5 or .6
01:56 < perlDreamer1> maybe another dev could look at it in HEAD and let me know how close I got?
01:58 <@tavisto> just like on the other demo server, widgets are not enabled
01:58 <@tavisto> er the macro is not
01:59 < perlDreamer1> preaction: can you take a peek at it?
02:02 <@preaction> i can't right now, but perhaps in the future
02:03 <@tavisto> perlDreamer1, I don't see a bug report on this. I see one about the templating being broken
02:03 < perlDreamer1> it's the same one
02:03 < perlDreamer1> same thing
02:03 < perlDreamer1> without a template, it's broken
02:03 < perlDreamer1> with a template, it's kind of broken
02:03 <@tavisto> oh okay.. 
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02:06 <@preaction> hm.. wonder if/when donorware will upgrade to the new Shop. they've got some old Commerce plugins that would need updating
02:09 < perlDreamer1> there was a guy in the forum asking if there were plans to reintroduce the multiple variant category into the Shop.
02:09 <@preaction> i don't see why really, since it's just another level of complexity that's not really necessary
02:09 < perlDreamer1> oh, ask SDuensin
02:10 <@preaction> though perhaps an easy UI to add/edit variants that does levels like that
02:10 < perlDreamer1> if you have a high number of variants, it helps a lot
02:10 < perlDreamer1> he was making one for a jewelry shop, where you can order rings by one of like 30 sizes, in several metals and with different stone options
02:10 < perlDreamer1> 30*X*Y is a big number to add
02:10 <@preaction> ah, true
02:11 <@preaction> perhaps easier would be to add a Size to the Ring product when the ring is purchased
02:11 <@preaction> okay, maybe not easier
02:14 < perlDreamer1> worth thinking about, though
02:19 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10780 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/Asset_Survey.pm: Fix a missing help title for the Survey.
02:19 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10781 /WebGUI/etc/WebGUI.conf.original: Fix bad JSON in the new CDN section
02:26 <@tavisto> perlDreamer, I added extra description and a screenshot to that bug report. In case other people (like me) are out there and aren't understanding the bug
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03:06 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10782 /WebGUI/t/Shop/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Add a basic test for the PayPalStd driver.
03:06 < CIA-23> WebGUI: ekennedy * r10783 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Implemented RFE 10253 - Select DataForm HTMLArea Rich Text Editor - Provides ability to specify the Rich Editor to be used for htmlArea fields on a given DataForm Wobject
03:06 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10784 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/packages-7.7.6/root_import_survey_default-feedback.wgpkg: Fixed bad i18n call in Survey feedback template
03:07 <@preaction> wow, today was huge RFE day
03:08 < perlDreamer1> 6-7 big RFEs
03:09 <@preaction> i still haven't gotten my RFE in yet
03:10 < perlDreamer1> I'll quit bothering you
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03:13 < perlDreamer1> hm, the new DataForm code needs i18n
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03:16 <@preaction> okay, the Visual mode in vim just became my new best friend
03:16 < perlDreamer1> :)
03:16 <@preaction> do capital-V, select some lines, then :s/Something/SomeOtherThing/g<Enter> <- MAGIC
03:16 < perlDreamer1> yup
03:16 <@preaction> no more guessing line numbers and putting in stupid :.,.+20s/.../.../g
03:16 < perlDreamer1> v is even better
03:17 <@preaction> i like line-wise, i work line-wise more
03:17 < perlDreamer1> for s///, I do too
03:17 < perlDreamer1> but v is great for inserting the same thing in the same place
03:17 < perlDreamer1> or for changing variable names when they are all lined up
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03:18 <@preaction> i like . as well, especially with "c"hange
03:18 <@preaction> i just forget to use change a lot
03:22  * perlDreamer1 is going to take break before getting back to RFE merging central
03:23 <@preaction> humph. now i want a unified web services API for WebGUI
03:23 <@preaction> for consistency and code re-use's sake
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03:31 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10785 /WebGUI/t/Inbox.t: Clean up users in the new Inbox tests.
03:31 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10786 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (i18n/English/Asset_DataForm.pm Asset/Wobject/DataForm.pm): i18n the choices for the new DataForm Rich Editor selector.
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03:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dwrandall * r10787 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 5 dirs): CDN: perltidy on new/changed code
03:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: dwrandall * r10788 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: Attributions for rfe #9134
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04:56 <+patspam> hmm, crud seems to be creating all entries with sequenceNumber=1, and then promote/demote doesn't work
04:56 <@preaction> that's not good
04:56 <+patspam> using a sequenceKey (assetId)
04:59 <+perlDreamer> almost have all tests cleaned up
05:00 <+perlDreamer> with so many commits today, it's hard to tell what I've broken, vs other code.
05:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10789 /WebGUI/t/Shop/TaxDriver/EU.t: 
05:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Cleanup the sku created for testing.
05:04 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Use the new WebGUI::Test->usersToDelete for user cleanup.
05:07 <+perlDreamer> sounds like Crud needs more tests
05:10 <+patspam> mea culpa
05:11 <+patspam> i wasn't passing in the sequenceKey when the empty crud item was created for the "Add" action
05:12 <+perlDreamer> you have to do that?
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05:20 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10790 /WebGUI/t/Shop/TaxDriver/EU.t: Better cart cleanup, so it also removes the CartItems.
05:20 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10791 /WebGUI/t/ (Inbox Inbox/Message.t): Add a test for Inbox/Message, for status codes.
05:21 <+perlDreamer> getting closer to clean
05:27 <@preaction> wtf is WebGUI::Session::Env->clientIsSpider?
05:27 <+perlDreamer> daviddelikat cooked that up
05:28 <+perlDreamer> it's a way of preventing bots
05:28 <+perlDreamer> that disobey robots.txt
05:28 <+perlDreamer> _I think_
05:28 <@preaction> but it works based on useragent, and is thus completely innacurate
05:29 <@preaction> what if i have a plugin in firefox called "webcrawler toolbar"?
05:29 <@preaction> i'm a spider?
05:29 <+perlDreamer> actually, there's a $username eq 'preaction' for that.
05:29 <@preaction> omg where?
05:29 <+perlDreamer> ack preaction /data/WebGUI/lib
05:30 <@preaction> nothing
05:30 <@preaction> you lied
05:30 <+perlDreamer> who? /me?
05:31 < daviddelikat> I got a list of user agent strings that represented the 'known' agents out ther and indicated if it was a browser or spider/crawler
05:31 < daviddelikat> and using that I developed the tests used
05:32 < daviddelikat> the code is actually about 80% acurate.
05:32 < daviddelikat> the only thing you lose if you match the spider code is the ads...
05:33 <@preaction> uhm... so 20% of my visitors will not see advertisements? i'm not sure i like that
05:33 < daviddelikat> not really a valid assumption
05:34 < daviddelikat> the strings used are for ALL known agents, that does not represent the nnumber of user who actually use them
05:34 <+perlDreamer> daviddelikat, does 80% accurate mean that it makes false negatives, or false positives?
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05:34 < daviddelikat> both neg and pos.
05:34 <+perlDreamer> are you more likely to miss a spider, or hit a user?
05:34 <@preaction> i can use a firefox extention to change my UA string to whatever i want
05:35 < daviddelikat> but it does not take into account the fact that 99% of all users are on one of the main 3 or 4 browsers
05:35 < daviddelikat> and as such will get the normal rendering
05:35 < daviddelikat> how many users are going to chenge their UA?
05:36 < daviddelikat> and so they don't see the ads
05:36 < daviddelikat> is that such a big deal?
05:36 < daviddelikat> .5% of users?
05:36 < daviddelikat> anyway JT OK'd the design
05:36 < daviddelikat> it reduces the number of ghost hits to a reasonable amount
05:37 < daviddelikat> i think that ghost views of an ad are more of a problem than users who dont see them at all.
05:38 < daviddelikat> if your advertisers pay for someone to view an ad they really want a person to see it
05:38 <+perlDreamer> rather than a bot
05:39 <+perlDreamer> is it enabled by default, or does it have to be turned on?
05:39 < daviddelikat> it is on by default
05:40 < daviddelikat> the only way to turn it off is to edit the code...
05:41 <@preaction> eh, i don't like it, but not my opin that matters
05:42 < daviddelikat> if you have a better idea im sure it would be worth trying
05:42 < daviddelikat> but before typical sites were getting hundreds of ghost hits to ads and advertisers  were paying for it...
05:44 < daviddelikat> even on my test site i got several hits a sec just from specter scanning the from spectre scanning the front page of the site.
05:44 <+perlDreamer> somebody mentioned that today
05:45 <+perlDreamer> that spectre was the highest visitor to their site in awstats
05:46 < daviddelikat> its probably not as niticable to ads where there is more than one ad in the group
05:46 < daviddelikat> but if you only have one ad it really adds up fast.
05:46 <+perlDreamer> 8 RFEs went in today
05:47 < daviddelikat> say who around here know lots about YUI datatables and paginator etc?
05:47 <+perlDreamer> how much is lots?
05:47 <@preaction> that'd be me probably
05:48 < daviddelikat> could you take a look at this:   http://delikat.homeip.net:8080/
05:48 < daviddelikat> click on the schedule link
05:48 < daviddelikat> right next to 'view tickets'
05:49 <@preaction> ooh, nice
05:49 <@preaction> looks broken
05:49 < daviddelikat> yup.
05:50 < daviddelikat> its kind messy 
05:50 < daviddelikat> because the table actuall goes left to right rather than top to bottom
05:50 < daviddelikat> notice how the regular column headers are blank?
05:50 <@preaction> yes
05:51 < daviddelikat> i finally got paginator to recognize that i have more than one page
05:51 < daviddelikat> but now it wont actually ask for the second page
05:51 < daviddelikat> just says data error
05:51 < daviddelikat> the root problem is that the length of the table varies from page to page
05:52 < daviddelikat> so i tell the paginator how many rows there are in the current page and how many total rows based on the number in the current page.
05:52 < daviddelikat> is this making sense?
05:52 <@preaction> yes
05:53 <@preaction> are you trying to fix the EMS thing there?
05:53 < daviddelikat> the schedule table is new code
05:53 < daviddelikat> fix what EMS thing?
05:54 <@preaction> ok, nm
05:54 <@preaction> looks like an EMS
05:54 < daviddelikat> its part of the EMS
05:54 <@preaction> okay. the second page gives me a data error. do you have Firebug?
05:54 < daviddelikat> yes but i don't get anything from it
05:55 <@preaction> func=getScheduleDataJSONsort=colDate&dir=asc&startIndex=6&results=6 <- this is the URL you're trying to get
05:55 <@preaction> func=getScheduleDataJSONsort <- looks not right
05:55 < daviddelikat> yup
05:55 < daviddelikat> needs a '?' after JSON
05:55 < daviddelikat> how did you get thet?
05:55 <@preaction> no, needs a ;
05:55 <@preaction> or a & whatever
05:56 <@preaction> on the Console tab, click the GET http://...
05:56 <@preaction> then click the Response tab
05:56 <@preaction> you can see exactly what the AJAX request got
05:56 < daviddelikat> ahah!  i see, thanks
05:57 <@preaction> as for the rowsPerPage thing, the EMS has problems with that right now
05:57 < daviddelikat> whats the problem?
05:57 <@preaction> considering in order to get what Events you're allowed to see, you have to instantiate the event. with 4000+ events, it will take down the server
05:58 <@preaction> the privileges are complicated, and expensive to check
05:58 < daviddelikat> no more data error
05:58 < daviddelikat> no I just have to get the correct data
05:59 < daviddelikat> or maybe this is OK...
05:59 < daviddelikat> rizen: you around?
06:01 <@preaction> oh. is it part of the spec to do that left-right pagination thing?
06:01 <@preaction> that's kinda weird to me
06:01 < daviddelikat> yes, it is supposed to display a set of locations and the events scheduled for them
06:01 < daviddelikat> it is not supposed to overlap like that
06:02 < daviddelikat> the second page should have only one location
06:03 <@preaction> ah, in DT, removing/adding columns has to be done expliictly
06:03 < daviddelikat> ideally for an event with only 6 locations the customer would make 6 columns
06:03 <@preaction> number of columns is configurable?
06:04 < daviddelikat> yes when you create the EMS
06:04 < daviddelikat> perhaps the next REV will do something fancier...
06:05 <@preaction> eh, basic is better, let the users tell us what they want
06:05 < daviddelikat> too true
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06:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10792 /WebGUI/t/Inbox.t: What knothead commented out the cleanup code?
06:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10793 /WebGUI/ (7 files in 6 dirs): 
06:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Add managed Friends network, allowing a designated group to add and remove
06:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: friends from each other groups.
06:07 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10794 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Operation/Group.pm): Do not automatically have Everyone group highlighted in Manage Groups in Group.
06:09 < daviddelikat> this gets messier everytime i turn around
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06:15 <@preaction> how many http status codes do you know without looking at a reference?
06:16 < daviddelikat> 200, 400, 404, 500
06:16 < daviddelikat> why?
06:16 <@preaction> 100, 200, 300, 400, 401, 402, 403, 404, 500,
06:16 <@plainhao> 301 302?
06:16 <@preaction> i dunno, seems like a good metric for complete nerdiness ;)
06:16 < daviddelikat> we could inplement a server on IRC
06:17 <@preaction> ha! no, new metric, how many IRC numeric codes do you know? ;)
06:17 < daviddelikat> none
06:17  * preaction can't remember a single one
06:17 < daviddelikat> there are codes?
06:17 <@preaction> (and why do i find this so hilarious)
06:17 < daviddelikat> when was the last time you wrote an irc client?
06:17 <@preaction> a long long time ago
06:18 < daviddelikat> never done it
06:18 <@preaction> but there are numeric messages for most automatic responses from the server (not from other users)
06:18 <+perlDreamer> nice commit ekennedy_
06:18 < daviddelikat> i;ve done FTP and thhp tho
06:18 <@preaction> so "Start of MOTD" is one. "MOTD line" is two. "End of MOTD" is three, etc...
06:19 <@preaction> thhp?
06:19 <@preaction> like ackthhp?
06:19 < daviddelikat> its a new protocol i just invented
06:19 <+perlDreamer> Totally hacked hyper protocol?
06:19 <@preaction> textual happy-hiccup protocol
06:19 < daviddelikat> hiccup is more the like
06:19 < ekennedy_> perlDreamer: Thanks. I hope someone else finds it useful too.
06:20 <@preaction> ten happy hippy potsmokers!
06:20 <+perlDreamer> I made one small tweak to it, i18n'ed the Default Rich editor label in the select form
06:23 < daviddelikat> i need to give my head a rest
06:23 < daviddelikat> i'll try to knock this wall down tomorrow.
06:27 < ekennedy_> perlDreamer: Thanks.  That does make it clearer.  Question: Is the entry that you added for "'Use Default Rich Editor" actually accessed?
06:29 <+perlDreamer> it's just the label, ekennedy_.  The value of the select editor entry.  the key, which is the internal value, is the same as before.
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06:32 < ekennedy_> perlDreamer:  Got it.  I hadn't looked at DataForm.pm.  Thanks for your updates.  
06:34 < ekennedy_> In implementing RFE 9204 I seemed to have an issue with isReply in Collaboration.pm.  isReply was 1 when first creating a new Tread.  It seemed that after it was saved it had a value of 0.  Would a valid way to check in isReply be $self->isa("WebGUI::Asset::Post::Thread")?  That was what I used instead of isReply.
06:35 < ekennedy_> Makes me wonder if isReply is correct for all uses.
06:35 <@preaction> isreply should only be true when it's a Post, not a Thread
06:36 <@preaction> but let me guess, that's something that isn't tested?
06:36 <@preaction> hell... i bit off way too much with promising to fix the CS...
06:38 <+perlDreamer> yup
06:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: ekennedy * r10795 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Implemented RFE 9204 - Add Reply Filter Code and Reply Rich Editor Option to Collaboration System - Provides ability to specify different Rich Editors and FilterCodes for posts (start of thread) and replies
06:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: ekennedy * r10796 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: Updated Changelog entry for version 10795 - Implementation of RFE 9204
06:41 <@preaction> quick question about WebGUI::Exception:
06:42 <@preaction> if i'm making a web service, would it be a good idea to use a WebGUI::Error::* as my "errorType"
06:42 <@preaction> that way the service method could just throw, get caught by the service dispatcher, and the error given to the user 
06:43 <@preaction> i'm not trying to over-engineer this, really honest
06:43 <+perlDreamer> no, that's a great idea
06:43 <+perlDreamer> there's more and more of that happening
06:43 <+perlDreamer> Haarg just did that for the AssetExport
06:44 <@preaction> so the service responds with XML: <response><error>WebGUI::Error::InvalidParam</error><param>username</param><message>i18n message</message></response>
06:44 <+perlDreamer> now you went overboard
06:44 <@preaction> <param> is defined by WebGUI::Error::InvalidParam
06:44 <+perlDreamer> oh, okay
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06:44 <@preaction> so if it were WebGUI::Error::InvalidFile, it would include "brokenFile" and "brokenLine" items
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06:45 <@preaction> i have a feeling i'm gonna get dropkicked for this one
06:45 <+perlDreamer> I don't think so.
06:45 <+perlDreamer> What you're doing is inline with all of our new development
06:45 <+perlDreamer> Shop is built with exceptions
06:45 <@preaction> yes, but they're never ever EVER sent outside of WebGUI
06:46 <@preaction> this is new, and i think it's awesome
06:46 <+perlDreamer> but at that point it's only an error message.
06:46 <@preaction> eventually the service just has to "throw". for now, i'm building these responses by hand.
06:46 <+perlDreamer> If the message passing scheme is via Exception up to the interface layer
06:46 <@preaction> but i'm building an API, and i want forwards-compat
06:47 <@preaction> <error> is required so that the service consumer knows exactly what kind of error occurred. <message> is for the user who triggered the consumer
06:47 <@preaction> so <error> is machine parseable, <message> is i18n
06:47 <@preaction> this all seems like the only way to do it (or rather, the most correct way)
06:48 <@preaction> eh, enough dawdling.
06:48 <+perlDreamer> dapperedodo, any luck with the PayPal driver?
06:49 < dapperedodo> Yes, I am just awake
06:49 < dapperedodo> I missed  a file
06:49 <+perlDreamer> phew
06:49 < dapperedodo> That is checked in now
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06:49 <+perlDreamer> I'll update and see if that helps the test
06:49 < dapperedodo> so you see: tests are gooed
06:50 <+perlDreamer> it is nice that the tests are good, but it's awesome that the PayPal driver is working
06:50 <+perlDreamer> A lot of people saw that commit and are very excited about it
06:51 <@preaction> indeed. i've been picking up bricks all night
06:52  * perlDreamer has told you to watch your fiber intake, preaction
06:54 < dapperedodo> I will be running now, i'll be back in an hour if there is anything on the paypal
06:54 <+perlDreamer> thanks, dapperedodo :)
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06:58 <@preaction> okay, so the Visitor user is not used for the "default new user's profile" anymore?
06:59 <+perlDreamer> no
06:59 <@preaction> no meaning "correct" or no meaning "incorrect"?
06:59 <+perlDreamer> it uses ProfileField->defaultValue
06:59 <@preaction> okay
06:59 <+perlDreamer> see User.pm, sub new
06:59 <@preaction> that's line 933-937 in WebGUI::User, right?
07:00 <+perlDreamer> yes
07:00 <+perlDreamer> select dataDefault from...
07:00 <@preaction> part of my mandate for this RFE is realigning the user API to be in-tune with how we doing things elsewhere
07:00 <@preaction> which means "get()", "set()" and "getId()"
07:01 <+perlDreamer> that is a great idea
07:01 <@preaction> since you're not allowed to have a userProfile field the same as a user property, it's also easy
07:01 <@preaction> though i'm going to test user.pm coverage before i start modifying/deprecating the existing methods
07:03 <+perlDreamer> the coverage is quite high for User.pm
07:03 <+perlDreamer> the profile form processing routines are not covered at all
07:04 <@preaction> dunno if i'll have to touch them, mainly profileField() and the `users` fields
07:05 <+perlDreamer> so profileField gets subsumed by ->get?
07:05 <@preaction> and ->set
07:05 <@preaction> yes
07:05 <@preaction> no more one-at-a-time crap
07:05 <@preaction> (which i just realized is how we've been doing it forever)
07:06 <@preaction> so the old methods will call the new methods and the old methods will be deprecated and removed in 8
07:08 <+perlDreamer> there have been problems with those form field methods and the order in which they set their values
07:09 <@preaction> which ones? in WebGUI::User?
07:09 <+perlDreamer> yes
07:09 < CIA-23> WebGUI: joeri * r10797 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Shop/PayDriver/PayPal.pm: PayPal driver missed its base class
07:09 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10798 /WebGUI/t/Shop/Pay.t: Update this test for adding a new PayDriver.
07:10 <+perlDreamer> validateProfileDataFromForm
07:10 <+perlDreamer> and whatever calls it
07:11 <@preaction> looks like that just validates data, doesn't actually change anything
07:30 <+patspam> oooh, extjs 3.0 rc1 is out
07:30 <+patspam> ..and it's under an MIT license now
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07:32 <+patspam> or maybe only the "core" is
07:32 <+patspam> either way i have widget envy
07:33  * perlDreamer passes patspam a drool towel
07:35 <@preaction> oh, patspam, was there something you needed to ask me the other day?
07:35 <+patspam> ummm yeah i think there was something...
07:36 <+patspam> but forgot now :)
07:36 <@preaction> about Filepump maybe?
07:36 <@preaction> eh, if you think of it, you can feel free to e-mail me: doug@plainblack.com
07:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10799 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/Account_Inbox.pm: Add broken i18n for Account/Inbox
07:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10800 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Add files missed during the initial checkin of managed friends network.
07:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10801 /WebGUI/www/extras/yui-webgui/build/ (friendManager/friendManager.js friendManager): Add JS missed in the initial checkin of the friend manager.
07:41 <+perlDreamer> patspam, re FilePump, DonorWare added a CDN handler to the Storage.pm today.
07:41 <+patspam> yeah i saw, freakin cool
07:41 <+patspam> definite filepump integration possibilities there
07:42 <+patspam> koen has also been eyeing off ways to use filepump to distribute files over a cluster
07:42 <@preaction> won't the CDN thing overlap the yahooapis.com thing?
07:42 <+patspam> yep, but the cdn thing has pushing capabilities too
07:43 <@preaction> wonder if Frank got that finished
07:43 <+patspam> filepump could have a feature to push bundles out to your cdn post-build
07:44 <@preaction> it just worries me when three different features overlap with little discussion between the three implementors
07:45 <@preaction> well, four really, with template_attachments
07:46 <+patspam> yeah agreed, i regret that
07:46 <@preaction> well not your fault. the CDN thing was developed in a vacuum for all i know
07:46 <@preaction> template_attachments came before i knew filepump existed
07:47 <@preaction> and yahooapis.com thing started before any of this too
07:47 <@preaction> it's almost like we need a place to discuss these things without promising that we'll put them in
07:47 <@preaction> (which is probably the main reason i don't talk about things like this on the dev list, my "AssetReport" has been in development for 2 years now...)
07:48 <+patspam> the rfe approval process should be a key spot for that
07:48 <@preaction> there is that, yes. perhaps we need to put more technical implementation details on there as they become available?
07:48 <@preaction> a development log of that feature?
07:49 <+patspam> almost everything i design gets submitted first as an rfe, although filepump was an exception to that
07:50 <@preaction> i've been using the RFE boards more, and e-mailing JT directly less. as steveo_aa told me, it helps the whole transparency and peer-review process
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07:50 <+patspam> yeah, and increases the chances for people working on similar things to find each other
07:51 <+patspam> I could be wrong, because i don't monitor the RFE board too much, but i get the feeling that a lot of PB-designed stuff in the past hasn't gone through the publicly-visible RFE process
07:51 <@preaction> it hasn't, no
07:52 <@preaction> but a lot of stuff is client-sponsored, which has only to go through JT
07:52 <@preaction> the new social networking stuff, for example
07:52 <@preaction> the Gallery
07:53 <+patspam> yup, obviously the buck stops with jt for approval. but it would be useful for those of us outside PB to know what's being developed
07:54 <@preaction> perhaps bring that up on the dev list? i'm willing to back you on it, just for us (PB) to file the RFE when we verify everything is going to go in, and then close it when we're done developing it
07:54 <+patspam> ok, I'll do it now
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10:36 < SynQ1> cought up by reality
10:36 < SynQ1> that is what you call it
10:36 -!- SynQ1 is now known as SynQ
10:43 < SynQ> how can someone keep up with the joneses these days
10:44  * SynQ dives into FUSE and GFS before someone else does :P
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11:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10802 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Added crud for Survey test suites
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12:33 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10803 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Account/Shop.pm: Adding missing tmpl_vars.
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16:30 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10804 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Adding copy-from-profile buttons to the edit Address screen.
16:30 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10805 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/packages-7.7.6/shopping-cart-collateral-items_address-default.wgpkg: Forgot to add new address template.
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17:10 < carogray> anyone in from yesterday evening - to ask about awstatistics set up?
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17:20 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10806 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): adding a 'delete item' button on Carousel edit screen
17:20 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10807 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (Account/Shop.pm Shop/Vendor.pm): Fixed bug where unsuccessful transations were included in the payout totals and My Sales summary.
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18:37 <+perlDreamer> morning, folks
18:38 <+MrHairgrease> hey PD!
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18:41 <+perlDreamer> seems like we did 9-10 RFEs yesterday
18:41 <+MrHairgrease> nice
18:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI: arjan * r10808 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Added internationalisations in Gallery.pm "Return to Album" and "Add Photo"
18:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI: arjan * r10809 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 2 dirs): 
18:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI: - New features in the UKplayer slidehow: you can hide the textblock, volume
18:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI:  slider and mute button, resize the textblock and thumbnails. A new demo
18:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI:  config is added. See: /extras/ukplayer/slideshow.html
19:06 <@plainhao> yikes, windows 7 is killing my macbook pro
19:06  * perlDreamer struggles  mightily against some anti-microsoft comment
19:06 <+MrHairgrease> why? you should be happy
19:06 <+MrHairgrease> http://blog.doloreslabs.com/2009/05/the-programming-language-with-the-happiest-users/
19:06 <+MrHairgrease> so why even think about anti ms comments?
19:09 <@plainhao> :apologizes for the unintentional double insult :)
19:11 <+perlDreamer> good point, MrHairgrease
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19:34 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10810 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): 
19:34 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Refactor the gallery album i18n so translators don't have to translate URLs
19:34 < CIA-23> WebGUI: when not needed.
--- Log closed Thu May 14 19:46:59 2009
--- Log opened Thu May 14 21:45:03 2009
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21:45 -!- irc.freenode.net changed the topic of #webgui to:  [ 7.6.19-stable | 7.7.4-beta | WRE 0.9.1 ] Before you ask, check the wiki: http://wiki.webgui.org | Pastebin: http://webgui.pastebin.com/
21:48 <+perlmonkey2> what's new today?
21:50 <@preaction> i'm fixing WebGUI::User API to be easier to use
21:51 <@preaction> and it's time-consuming, considering the amount of testing and Devel::Cover and other APIs I'm coming across that are at best incomplete, at worst wrong
21:52 <@preaction> it's a dirty job, but somebody's gotta do it
21:53 < dapperedodo> But the job is appreciated!
--- Log closed Thu May 14 22:00:27 2009
--- Log opened Fri May 15 10:08:31 2009
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12:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10824 /WebGUI/ (20 files in 12 dirs): export cleanups and mobile style
12:59 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10825 /WebGUI/docs/create.sql: preparing for 7.7.6 release
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13:56 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10826 /WebGUI/ (9 files in 7 dirs): 
13:56 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Survey test suite now functional.
13:56 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Tests are defined via a JSON-encoded spec, through Web Crud interface
13:56 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Test results are TAP encoded, and TAP parsed and prettified into HTML
13:56 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added i18n, help and tests
13:56 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10827 /releases/WebGUI_7.7.6-beta: Release 7.7.6-beta
13:56 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10828 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Layout.pm: fix dumbness
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14:34 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10829 /releases/WebGUI_7.7.6-beta/WebGUI: Release 7.7.6-beta
14:34 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10830 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): preparing for 7.7.7 dev
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16:42 < ckotil> FYI: Red Hat Satellite Network package updates are killing webgui
16:43 < ckotil> i havent been able to identify a specific package. 
16:43 < ckotil> there were about 100 updates i applied to two boxes, and after doing so. webgui went tits up
16:49 <@rizen> yikes
16:50 <@rizen> I have a couple suggestions for you to check
16:50 < ckotil> im running RHEL5
16:50 <@rizen> 1) make sure it didn't create a /etc/my.cnf file
16:50 <@rizen> 2) make sure it didn't enable SELinux
16:50 < ckotil> it has to do with missing perl modules.
16:50 <@rizen> oh, you're not running the WRE?
16:50 < ckotil> File::Path File::Temp and MIME::Tools
16:51 < ckotil> source.
16:51 < ckotil> so i ran testEnvironment.pl and the script grabbed those and fixed the problem
16:51 <@rizen> ok, well in that case your best bet is to reinstall all the perl modules again
16:51 <@rizen> ok
16:51 < ckotil> at least it went smoothly on my production box.
16:51 < ckotil> on the hot backup, not so smooth. 
16:51 < ckotil> it appears MIME::Tools was installed into a wierd perl lib directory.
16:51 <@rizen> RHEL is trying to tell you to use the WRE
16:51 <@rizen> =)
16:52 < ckotil> ya rly.
16:52 < ckotil> ive looked into on a few occasions.
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16:53 < ckotil> every time i get it built, i start to setup my sites, and i'm overwhelmed
16:53 < ckotil> i like my source install setup
16:53 < ckotil> ive got over 20 sites now
16:53 <@rizen> get it built? you're hand compiling the WRE?
16:54 < ckotil> no, i use the rhel5 rpm
16:54 <@rizen> ok, you just mean converting your config files over to the wre then
16:54 <@rizen> that's overwelming
16:54 < ckotil> yes.
16:54 <@rizen> is what you're saying
16:54 <@rizen> k
16:54 <@rizen> i suppose it certainly could be
16:55 <@rizen> there's certainly nothing wrong with doing a source install if you have the gumption for it...most people don't have that kind of patience
16:55 <@rizen> or skill
16:56 < ckotil> i should just bite the bullet and set up the wre on a dev host. get all my sites on it, then move it to the production box. 
16:56 < ckotil> last time i tried, i got frustrated when adding additional sites
16:57 < ckotil> and quit. heh too many knobs to set
16:58 <@rizen> really?
16:58 <@rizen> it should be easy
16:58 <@rizen> just
16:58 <@rizen> addsite.pl --sitename=www.example.com --adminPass=mysqldbpass
16:58 <@rizen> and if it's an existing site, then you just copy your files into place after you've run that command
16:59 < ckotil> hrm, that does sound easy. i was in the gui 
16:59 <@rizen> oh
16:59 <@rizen> yeah, that's for people that don't know any better
16:59 <@rizen> =)
16:59 < ckotil> so copy the files into place from the www dir?
17:00 < ckotil> or do i have to export packages into the new site
17:00 <@rizen> yeah, copy your uploads folder into /data/domains/www.example.com/public/uploads
17:00 <@rizen> and import your database into the newly created www_example_com
17:00 <@rizen> and if you have any custom config stuff for webgui, you'll need to copy those directives into your new /data/WebGUI/etc/www.example.com.conf file
17:01 <@rizen> then do:
17:01 <@rizen> wreservice.pl --restart modperl
17:01 <@rizen> and you're back online
17:01 < ckotil> what are the steps to import the database?
17:01 <@rizen> importing the database is 2 steps
17:02 <@rizen> mysql -uroot -pPASS -e "drop database www_example_com;create database www_example_com"
17:02 <@rizen> that one cleans out the fresh db that was created by addsite.pl
17:02 <@rizen> then the second step is
17:02 <@rizen> mysql -uroot -pPASS www_example_com < www.example.com.sql
17:03 <@rizen> that imports your database dump into the database
17:03 <@rizen> i guess i shouldn't assume you have a database dump
17:03 < ckotil> but where does www.exmaple.com.sql come from? currently all my sites are in a single webgui db
17:03 < ckotil> in the wre it sounds like evrey site has their own db
17:03 <@rizen> mysqldump -uroot -pPASS www_example_com > www.example.com.sql
17:04 <@rizen> how is it possible that all your sites use the same webgui db?
17:04 <@rizen> i mean
17:04 <@rizen> you can do that if you want
17:04 <@rizen> you can run lots of sites off of one db
17:04 <@rizen> but don't you run into problems?
17:04 <@rizen> like with the user function style
17:04 <@rizen> ?
17:04 < ckotil> all my sites are beneath globalnoc.iu.edu/ then i do mod_rewrite to allow for unique sitenames
17:05 <@rizen> ok then in your case, replace www_example_com with globalnoc_iu_edu
17:05 < ckotil> ok, if its just an easy dump and import. i can do that
17:05 <@rizen> and then either modify /data/wre/etc/globalnoc.iu.edu.modproxy to add your rewrite rules
17:05 < ckotil> but let's say i want to separate out the single db into many db's
17:06 <@rizen> or create a bunch of additional .modproxy files...one for each virtual host you want to set p
17:06 < ckotil> would exporting my assets as a webgui package, be the best approach?
17:10 < ckotil> as far as user function style goes, i just use the globalnoc template
17:10 < ckotil> since it encompasses all of the sites anyway
17:10 <@rizen> don't use a package
17:10 <@rizen> just do what i said above
17:10 <@rizen> copy your uploads folder in place
17:10 <@rizen> and then import a database dump
17:11 < ckotil> sounds like a lot of crud will come with that import
17:11 <@rizen> i'm not sure how webgui would even handle a package that contains an entire site
17:11 < ckotil> hehe
17:11 <@rizen> it's not designed for that big of an import
17:11 < ckotil> yah, and ive got many many files i nsome of the sites
17:11 < ckotil> roughly 10000 file assets in one.
17:11 <@rizen> i think the biggest thing i ever moved with a package was a forum that had 5,000 posts in it
17:11 <@rizen> wow
17:12 <@rizen> yeah, definitely don't use a package then
17:12 < ckotil> yeah, webgui is our document repository
17:12 < ckotil> it works well
17:12 <@rizen> one of these days i hope to make it so you can mount webgui as a network drive
17:12 <@rizen> i have a prototype working
17:12 < ckotil> my manager would love that
17:12 < ckotil> i setup a webdav thing, that you can do that with
17:12 <@rizen> but the contractor i hired to make it stable for webgui 7.7 flaked out
17:13 < ckotil> aww.
17:13 < ckotil> the problem w/ my webdav implementation was triggering the workflow to perform the import
17:13 < ckotil> not webgui workflow. i was using a fileimport script
17:13 <@rizen> ah
17:14 <@rizen> ours is also webdav, but it's neatly integrated into webgui directly
17:14 < ckotil> separating out my sites would be nice, bc then i could provide more portal functionality, by having the proper user style function for each site.
17:14 <@rizen> so you can browse your asset tree
17:14 < ckotil> sweet.
17:14 <@rizen> use your webgui user/pass
17:14 <@rizen> all privileges are maintained
17:14 <@rizen> and you can even edit non file type assets like templates
17:14 < ckotil> I can't wait for that.
17:15 <@rizen> i'm sorry to say that you have to wait
17:15 <@rizen> i really wanted it in 7.7
17:15 <@rizen> hopefully we can get it released this fall sometime 
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17:21 <+bartjol> hee tavisto!
17:24 <@tavisto> bartjol, how are you my brotha
17:24 <+bartjol> weelly good
17:24 <+bartjol> my house is emptied from trash
17:26  * rizen mumbles "bartjol has stolen my woman"
17:28 <+bartjol> no, I'm just lending her for a day
17:28 <+bartjol> borrowing is maybe better
17:28 <@rizen> hah! so you admit you have stolen her from me!
17:29 <+bartjol> nope
17:29 <+bartjol> just borrowing without telling or asking
17:30 <+bartjol> which might rise feeling of being robbed
17:30 <+bartjol> but it is not factually right
17:31 <@tavisto> hmm.. I think Rizen would be mad except now he can finally buy his new persian bride online
17:31 <@rizen> you know it
17:31 <@rizen> what i'm mad about is that bartjol is only stealing her for a day
17:32 <+bartjol> you don't wanna have her back?
17:33 <@tavisto> hehe
17:33 <@rizen> i can't very well have a persian bride if i already have an american bride
17:33 <@rizen> well i could, but that just gets difficult to manage
17:34 <+bartjol> well, keeping her here still demands a divorce or Sarah missing/dead
17:34 <@tavisto> there's an app for that
17:34 <@tavisto> Wife Manager... only on the iPhone 3G
17:34 <+bartjol> cool
17:35 <@rizen> she doesn't actually have to be dead
17:35 <+bartjol> there are countries where you can set a time limit for your marriage
17:35 <@rizen> i just have to declare her dead
17:35 <+bartjol> (mostly used for going to the hookers)
17:35 <@rizen> and if she's living in europe
17:35 <@rizen> with you
17:35 <@tavisto> rizen and juliet
17:35 <@rizen> then that would be easy
17:35 <+bartjol> ah
17:36 <@tavisto> BarJol, what are you going to do with your chunk of the 1.45 Billion that Intel is going to pay the EU?
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17:36 <+bartjol> "being in europe" eq "near dead state"
17:36 <+bartjol> ?
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17:36 <@rizen> as far as most people in the US are concerned, yess
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17:37 <@rizen> i happen to love europe, so much so that i'm going back again this summer
17:37 <@rizen> but i don't need to convince me
17:37 <@rizen> just the state
17:37 <+bartjol> 1.45 billion/731 million= 2 euro, well I'll get a beer
17:38 <+bartjol> well, but you are one of the cooler US-people
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17:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10831 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 5 dirs): rfe #10061: Use email as username at registration
17:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10832 /WebGUI/ (7 files in 7 dirs): Adding Ogone payment plugin
17:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10833 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Shop/PayDriver/Ogone.pm: Clean out comments.
17:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10834 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Shop/PayDriver/Ogone.pm: Fixed setup instructions.
17:41 <@rizen> here's how stupid the US is
17:41 <@rizen> Congress/Obama are proposing a small tax on soda and other sugary drinks to help pay for the medical costs of the obesity epidemic
17:42 <@rizen> the tax is so small that if you bought 2 liters of soda for $3.50 cents, your total bill would be $3.55 cents
17:42 <+bartjol> it should be a huge tax?
17:42 <@rizen> And people all over the country are outraged by this tax.
17:43 <+perlmonkey2> sin taxes tend to piss people off.
17:43 <+bartjol> well there's a 6% tax on that here
17:43 <+bartjol> but we are known for being outraged all the time
17:44 <+bartjol> that's why we can drink so much beer, to help us calm down
17:44 <@rizen> fat people like me, and there are a lot of people way fatter than me, ad about 1.7 trillion to the medical expenses in the US. and this tax would recoup only 200 million annually. so i think it's not enough
17:45 <+perlmonkey2> sin taxes are just The Man telling us how to live our lives.
17:45 <+bartjol> which has 18% VAT which keeps us outraged and we contyinue to drink
17:45 <@rizen> if you say so perlmonkey2. i think they help pay for the problems they cause.
17:45 <+bartjol> it's a circle
17:46 <@rizen> it's not really a sin tax..it's a tax to show the real cost of a harmful product.
17:46 <+bartjol> well, the idea might sound reasonable, but there enough people drinking soda's who don't get fat
17:46 <@rizen> that's why gasoline costs so much in the EU. and it should be taxed like that here too methinks.
17:47 <@tavisto> yeah I dont want to start taxing everything either. I'm with you perlmonkey2. Pretty soon using this tax model, we will die from 1000 small cuts
17:47 <+perlmonkey2> rizen: yeah, except I've seen so many contradictory numbers on the additional cost to the health care system from fatties, how could they possibly know how to properly price the tax?  They can't, so they will just keep jacking up the tax until people have no choice but to quit the behavior.
17:47 <+bartjol> mmm, maybe there should be a dumb people tax
17:47 <+bartjol> unfortunately that would include me :)
17:48 <@tavisto> If this universal health care works so well.. why do we flipping have tons of people in Michigan hospitals from Canada....
17:48 <@tavisto> bunch of crap
17:48 <+bartjol> are hospitals more expensive in Canada?
17:48 <@rizen> i can see this discussion is going to devolve into something ludicrous, so i'm going to stop now
17:48 <+bartjol> strange
17:49 <+bartjol> sorry rizen, I tend to have that effect
17:49 <+bartjol> it's my karma
17:49 <@rizen> not you bartjol 
17:50 <+perlmonkey2> That is what makes politics so wonderful.  Take a group of people who generally get along, agree on most outlooks in life, and have the same interests, then throw in politics and they'll be knifing each other in seconds :P
17:51 <+bartjol> mmm, but rizen, if you want me to keep Sarah here, I want a signed document, you will not kill me or otherwise get me harmed
17:52 <@rizen> i don't really want you to keep her there. i'll miss her.
17:52 <@rizen> but don't tell her that
17:52 <@rizen> she'll get a big ego
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17:52 <+bartjol> ok
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17:53  * bartjol thinks bopbop was gone to tell Sarah
17:57 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10835 /WebGUI/docs/gotcha.txt: * You must upgrade to WebGUI 7.7.5 before going to this version.
17:57 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10836 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (i18n/English/Shop.pm Shop/TaxDriver/EU.pm): Tax group manager improvements
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18:01 <@bopbop> well, you just better watch your back Bartjol... nothing is secret
18:01 <@bopbop> actually, she's probably packing her bags already
18:01 <@bopbop> sorry rizen
18:02 <+bartjol> eeh? Yeah I will be carefullw with Sarah
18:02 <+bartjol> me thinks someone will not be careful with me otherwise
18:03 <@bopbop> :)
18:03 <+bartjol> don't mention the eggs!
18:04 <@bopbop> whose eggs? Sarah's eggs?
18:04 <+bartjol> mmm, lightning, thunder, rain... foul weather here
18:04 <+bartjol> just don't mention them
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18:38 <+perlDreamer> dionak, do you know if topsub is going to be around in IRC today?
18:38 < dionak> no, i don't. he's flying solo these days.
18:39 <+perlDreamer> solo like not part of Knowmad anymore?
18:39 < dionak> yes. I think he's looking for contract work.
18:39 <+perlDreamer> I see
18:40 < dionak> In case you see an opportunity for him. 
18:40 <+perlDreamer> I'll keep my eyes open
18:40 < dionak> Would you like for me to ping him? Or can I answer a question for you?
18:40 <+perlDreamer> there have been changes to the way the Shipping plugins calculate, and it will affect the 1-page checkout work that he did
18:40 < dionak> ah
18:40 < dionak> ok
18:40 <+perlDreamer> $shipper->calculate may now throw an exception
18:41 <+perlDreamer> so that plugins can pass messages back to their caller
18:41 < dionak> ok, that's very helpful. we'll need to review and possibly refactor then
18:41 < dionak> thanks for letting me know
18:41 <+perlDreamer> you bet.  Finding those things out after the fact can be frustrating
18:42 <+perlDreamer> I should probably drop a note about that in WebGUI Network News
18:42 < dionak> yes, they really can. We're about to upgrade the client that's using it too. 
18:42 < dionak> yes, that would be very helpful. Please do
18:42 <+perlDreamer> that change is in 7.7.6 and above
18:42 < dionak> ok, so we won't see it for a while but it's great to know it's there. I'm sure you just saved us quite a bit of time
18:42 < dionak> and headache
18:43 <+perlDreamer> hope so, since I put it in there in the first place :)
18:44 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, that funny thing with the bugs and RFEs on the participate page happened again
18:44 <+perlDreamer> I think it's due to the packedHeadTags changed the lastUpdated field
18:45 <@Haarg> hmm
18:45 <+perlDreamer> because the last time it happened was 7.7.5, when that field was _added_ to all assets
18:46 <@Haarg> yeah, most likely
18:47 <@Haarg> t/Mail/Send.t is still failing, but i think it's a leaky test
18:47 <@Haarg> not certain where though
18:47 <+perlDreamer> when it fails here, I get undef instead of data
18:47 <+perlDreamer> it's like the thing is too slow or something
18:47 <@Haarg> hmm
18:47 <+perlDreamer> not returning data quickly enough
18:48 <+perlDreamer> are you seeing different behavior?
18:48 <+perlDreamer> if so, then we have a real potential mess with that test
18:48 <@Haarg> it was giving me a different number of items in the mailQueue table than it expected
18:48 <@Haarg> but only after doing a reset then running all the tests
18:48 <+perlDreamer> are all the workflow activity tests passing?
18:48 <@Haarg> if i run it standalone right after a reset it passes iirc
18:49 <@Haarg> should be
18:49 <+perlDreamer> they also do checks for that, but it could depend on testing order
18:49 <@Haarg> i also broke a large part of t/Asset/AssetExportHtml.t and haven't fixed it yet
18:50 <@Haarg> i need to add more tests to it as well
18:51 <+perlDreamer> that's a huge test file
18:51 <+perlDreamer> it's not easy to work with
18:51 <@Haarg> yeah
18:51 <@Haarg> most of the changes will be pretty simple
18:52 <@Haarg> it's due to the method throwing errors instead of returning the code+message
18:53 <@Haarg> i also need to take another look at the rss aspect and story manager export code
18:53 <@Haarg> they both may be able to be simplified some with the changes i made to the rest of the export code
18:54 <+perlDreamer> that would be nice
18:54 <+perlDreamer> I hate to see comments like "had to copy and paste code from assetExportHtml because the code couldn't be reused without tons of refactoring"
18:54 <@Haarg> yeah
18:55 <+perlDreamer> and duplicating getUrl because you can't pass in a URL to use instead of $self->get('url')
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19:16  * perlDreamer is getting really tired of calling class methods on WebGUI::Test
19:16 <+perlDreamer> it might be time to extend Test::Builder
19:16 <+perlDreamer> so I can get a WebGUI::Test object
19:16 <+perlDreamer> and call $test->
19:16 <@Haarg> that might be good
19:17 <@Haarg> it might be good to separate out some things into separate classes/objects
19:19 <+perlDreamer> a collateral class
19:21 <+perlDreamer> that might also help with BEGIN issues.
19:21 <+perlDreamer> we'll just inline the code, or add it to new, or something
19:22 <+perlDreamer> which then just leaves other hiccup, which is the FindBin requirement
19:24 <+perlDreamer> I have an idea for fixing that, but I don't like it very much
19:24 <@Haarg> for 8 i have a few ideas how i'd like to change how the different directories are found
19:24 <+perlDreamer> blib was designed to handle this problem, but only for code that gets installed into the perl install area
19:24 <+perlDreamer> so I thought we'd make a lazylib pragma
19:25 <+perlDreamer> which does the same thing, but only for "lib" instead of "blib"
19:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: jt * r10837 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): - Added WebGUI community statistics question to the site setup wizard.
19:25 <+perlDreamer> add it as a development requirement
19:25 <+perlDreamer> the bummer is that lazylib _has_ to be installed with perl so it can always be found
19:26 <+perlDreamer> what are you thinking of, Haarg?
19:26 <@Haarg> my thought was more along the lines of requiring webgui's lib path be added to PERL5LIB
19:28 <+perlDreamer> via the environment?
19:28 <@Haarg> yeah
19:28 <+perlDreamer> you know, in the WRE you could probably hardcode that pretty simply
19:28 <@Haarg> yeah
19:28 <@preaction> http://search.cpan.org/dist/Test-Apache2/ <- check this out!
19:29 <@preaction> this looks like something we should contribute to
19:29 <+perlDreamer> Yeah!  Didn't you go to his WUC talk?
19:29 <+perlDreamer> wait a sec, I think that was 1 year before  you came
19:29 <@preaction> was gonna say, i don't remember him
19:30 <@Haarg> and then have a module WebGUI::Paths or something that would just have some constants in it with the paths to the other webgui directories - etc, docs, www
19:30 <+perlDreamer> that sounds really good, Haarg
19:30 <@Haarg> the default webgui install those would be calculated when the module was loaded relative to the file itself
19:31 <@Haarg> alternatively, you could hard code them to be wherever you wanted, and install the WebGUI libs in with the rest of your perl libs
19:31 <@Haarg> or wherever else you wanted
19:31 <@Haarg> seems like it would work better for packagers
19:32 <+perlDreamer> oh, I see preaction.  I'm getting confused with Apache::Test, and Test::Apache2
19:32 <+perlDreamer> sorry, man
19:35 <+perlDreamer> Test::Apache2 could use some more POD, that's for sure
19:37 <@preaction> well its first release was 4 days ago
19:38 <+perlDreamer> if we folded in WebGUI::PseudoRequest, it would double the size of his code.
19:38 <+perlDreamer> it would need tests, though...
19:39 <+perlDreamer> but think of the functionality that it would add, though
19:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10838 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Added VAT number manager for shop admins.
19:55 <+perlDreamer> in Crud, how do you tell it that a field must be unique in the db?
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20:29 <@preaction> perlDreamer: is the originalConfig in WebGUI::Test working? it doesn't look like it gets called
20:29  * perlDreamer will check
20:30 <+perlDreamer> config is restored in the END block
20:30 <@preaction> or am i supposed to mark what config values i'm about to change by doing WebGUI::Test::originalConfig( "serviceSubnets" );
20:30 <+perlDreamer> right :)
20:30 <@preaction> ok
20:30 <+perlDreamer> there isn't an automatic, file-wide config restorer, yet
20:30 <+perlDreamer> feel free to implement it, if you wish
20:31 <+perlDreamer> Haarg was going to tweak JSON::Config to support that
20:31 <+perlDreamer> but I'm sure there are some hacking ways to do it
20:31 <+perlDreamer> like cloning the initial config
20:31 <+perlDreamer> and then, in the END block, setting some value back to itself, causing the config file to be rewritten
20:32 <@Haarg> yeah, i need to take care of that
20:32 <+perlDreamer> we _all_ have long TODO lists
20:32 <@preaction> heh, yeah...
20:33 <@Haarg> should just be a matter of bumping the Config::JSON prereq version and adding some simple stuff to WebGUI::Test to prevent all writes
20:33 <+perlDreamer> that would only work in a limited set of cases, though
20:34 <+perlDreamer> what happens if you have to open a session with a duplicate config file?
20:34 <+perlDreamer> that'll cause a new read from filesystem
20:34 <@Haarg> they all run though WebGUI::Config
20:34 <@Haarg> which caches the objects
20:36 <+perlDreamer> that's right.  I'd forgotten about the cache.
20:37 <+perlDreamer> I pulled that at one point, for a while, until you found a workaround for the config file rewrite fork bug
20:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10839 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Improved and templated VAT Number management.
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21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10840 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/PseudoRequest.pm: fixed PseudoRequest to do param list correctly
21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10841 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/User.pm t/User.t): added new API methods to User for easier use
21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10842 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (Operation/User.pm Operation.pm): added services to create, update, and delete users
21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10843 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 4 dirs): user-services
21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10844 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/PseudoRequest.pm: fixed PseudoRequest to do param list correctly
21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10845 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/User.pm t/User.t): added new API methods to User for easier use
21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10846 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (Operation/User.pm Operation.pm): added services to create, update, and delete users
21:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10847 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Operation/User.pm: fixed problem with git svn dcommit...
21:26 <@preaction> wow... my git setup is completely frickin broken...
21:26 <+perlDreamer> patspam and Haarg are git power users
21:26  * perlDreamer is power breaker
21:26 <+perlDreamer> was trying to be a power broken, but completely missed :/
21:27 <@preaction> well, i treated it like SVN: different working copies for each "branch", but git does branching more smarter than that
21:27 <@preaction> and the merging of the different working copies i haven't quite got down yet
21:27 <@preaction> so now i rebuild my git repo to do it correct ways
21:28 <+perlDreamer> maybe I should start learning git-svn
21:28 <@preaction> i lurn bettar by breaking things ;)
21:28 <+perlDreamer> it would be a good bridge for full gitness in wg8
21:28 <@preaction> so yeah, wg tests are borked right now. working on it
21:30 <+perlDreamer> I _wasn't_ going to say anything
21:31 <@preaction> at least i'm CHECKING them. and ADDING them.
21:31 <@preaction> you have to give me that!
21:33 <@preaction> looks like it was just a problem with my pseudorequest fix, bust still more tests running
21:33 <@preaction> we has lots of tests :p
21:40 <+perlDreamer> ~10K across 250 files or so
21:41 <+perlmonkey2> sanity check here.  But I have subclasses with different members a single admin page needs to fill out.  What's the best way to get a list of the required members?  Have each subclass return the member names it needs?
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21:44 <+perlDreamer> perlmonkey2, you could use the Account method, where each plugin returns a subform along with form processing capabilities.
21:45 <+perlmonkey2> perlDreamer: hmm, I like that, but it might make too much duped code.
21:45 <@preaction> so have the superclass have that duplicated code
21:46 <+perlmonkey2> it won't be duplicated in the superclass, a single method and code can handle everything.  The only differences are the list of params.
21:46 <+perlmonkey2> I'll just have the subclasses return their unique members.
21:46 <+perlmonkey2> lame
21:47 <@preaction> yeah, you could do a definition() thing like Crud
21:47 <+perlmonkey2> hmm
21:47 <+perlmonkey2> diggity
21:47 <@preaction> (which i'm surprised that Account did not do)
21:48 <+perlmonkey2> hmmm, but now I need to instantiate a class to get its required members, and then it will just be destroyed.
21:49 <+perlmonkey2> I'll leave it a class function.
21:49 <@preaction> yeah, it's a class method everywhere else too
21:49 <@preaction> might need to pass a $session if you need to, but that's about it
21:50 <+perlmonkey2> I think the method will just be return [{groovy,1,sweet,1,nonsweet,0}];
21:50 <+perlmonkey2> or soemthign
21:50 <@preaction> what about fieldType? you should try to make it as consistent as possible
21:51 < daviddelikat> so if I create an class that extends a YUI class should I put it in the yui-webgui directory?
21:51 <@preaction> daviddelikat: yes, or if it interfaces with a YUI class
21:51 <+perlDreamer> I think so
21:51 < daviddelikat> thanks
21:52 < daviddelikat> any recomended examples of YUI subclasses?
21:52 <@preaction> most of the code in yui-webgui just uses the yui classes
21:53 < daviddelikat> ok I'll have to do some research then
21:53 < daviddelikat> thanks
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22:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10848 /WebGUI/ (5 files in 5 dirs): rfe #9981: RedirectAfterLogin Setting
22:11 <@preaction> so i don't know if i mangled a commit or what, but the full test suite for my new feature is just gone
22:11 <@preaction> 50 tests gone
22:11 <@preaction> just gone. nowhere.
22:12 <@preaction> you might say i'm a bit pissed off right now
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22:34 <+perlDreamer> crap
22:34 <+perlDreamer> backups?
22:34 <+perlDreamer> wait, aren't they in the repo?
22:34 <+perlDreamer> the SVN repo?
22:34 <@preaction> nope. it's just gone
22:34 <@preaction> not sure what i did, but it won't take me too long to redo. the part that took the longest was bugfixing and developing the feature
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22:37  * perlDreamer takes a lunch break
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22:40 <@preaction> wooo iphone plugin!
22:40 <@tavisto> wg?
22:41 <@rizen> yup
22:41 <@tavisto> so it wasn't the gallery template preventing us from getting approved then
22:41 <@tavisto> just someone being a db.
22:41 <@rizen> it was actually the icon we submitted they had a problem with
22:41 <@rizen> of course, they never mentioned that
22:42 <@rizen> we just had to keep guessing
22:42 <@tavisto> of course... why provide feedback on a failed attempt
22:42 <@tavisto> very cool though
23:01 <@steveo_aa> Is something up with plainblack.com?
23:01 <@steveo_aa> Or is it just my connection?
23:03 <@steveo_aa> Seems back to normal.
23:08 <@preaction> upgrade maybe
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23:42 <+perlDreamer> if we use Test::Plan, we might be able to get rid of all that initial SKIP unless use_ok stuff
23:42 <+perlDreamer> there's so much work to do!
23:42 <+perlDreamer> AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHhh
23:56 <+perlDreamer> preaction, I'd like to start a testing todo page on the wiki, where we dump some of these ideas.  What do you think?
23:57 <@preaction> perhaps use the RFE list to track them?
23:59 <+perlDreamer> hm
--- Day changed Sat May 16 2009
00:00 <+perlDreamer> in the past we've usually considered test stuff to be bugs
00:00 <+perlDreamer> but there's no harm in using the RFE list, either
00:01 <@preaction> right, but they're not missing tests, they're just ways to improve the tests
00:02 <@preaction> missing test == bug. easier to write tests in future == feature
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00:07 <+perlDreamer> good point.
00:08 <+perlDreamer> do we wait for rizen to approve them before doing them, though?
00:08 <@rizen> rizen hates you all
00:08 <+perlDreamer> well, fine then!
00:08 <+perlDreamer> I'm going running
00:08 <@preaction> you can't run from rizen
00:09 <+perlDreamer> can I run around him?
00:09 <@preaction> not more than once
00:10 <@rizen> perlDreamer
00:10 <+perlDreamer> yessir?
00:10 <@rizen> as far as i'm concerned you can pretty much do as you see fit with the testing system
00:10 <@rizen> you know a lot more about it than me
00:10 <@rizen> if you want my input, ask for it
00:10 <@preaction> we just want a way to keep track of what we want to do in the future
00:10 <@rizen> but other than that, you have free reign
00:11 <+perlDreamer> you bet.  And if you think we're going off the deep end, then holler.
00:11 <@preaction> like Test::Class, or Test::Plan
00:11 <@preaction> or adding coverage to wgdev
00:11 <@preaction> or fixing the test box to use wgdev instead of the hacked-up thing i got that doesn't work
00:11 <@rizen> one question is, does it make sense to redo all the tests we already have at this point
00:11 <@rizen> or just do that for new tests going forward
00:12 <+perlDreamer> I think there are cases where that is justified
00:12 <@rizen> i don't think we should be updating our existing tests unless we are having a particular problem with them
00:12 <+perlDreamer> like, making the tests run under Test::Aggregate, which will really speed them up
00:13 <+perlDreamer> but for the most part, you're right.  then it's just maintenance vs improvements
00:15 <@rizen> well the other thing we have to factor in is webgui 9
00:15  * perlDreamer heads off to run.  I'll backlog when I get back.
00:15 <@rizen> which is the perl 6 version of webgui
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00:42 <@preaction> http://uizard.jemr.net/uizard.php?action=newProject <- this is officially the coolest thing I have EVER SEEN
00:43 <@tavisto> *tavisto waits for the rickroll to load*
00:44 <@preaction> ... this is how our template wizard should work
00:45 <@tavisto> omg... you are right.. this is sweet and I can't even use any of this... but it looks like any dev would be kid in a candy store
00:48 < daviddelikat> amazing
00:48 < daviddelikat> all that JS should soak up my whole system RAM in les sthatn 10 minutes
00:49 < daviddelikat> less than ...
00:57 -!- perlmonkey21 [n=perlmonk@adsl-70-137-11-15.dsl.okcyok.swbell.net] has joined #webgui
00:57 < perlmonkey21> ssh frpom phone to finch ftw!
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01:09 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10849 /translations/French/ (9 files in 2 dirs): Update from translation server
01:26 <@preaction> we don't ship releases with docs/previousVersion.sql anymore?
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01:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10850 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): added robustness to user services. added tests
01:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10851 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: updated changelog
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02:01  * perlDreamer is back
02:03 <+perlDreamer> interview with the ulzard creator: http://rss.slashdot.org/~r/Slashdot/slashdot/~3/rhN2hgLC5MA/article.pl
02:03 <+perlDreamer> they've been slashdotted :)
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02:19 <+patspam> Haarg: I managed to commit something between you "preparing for 7.7.6 release" and "preparing for 7.7.7 dev"
02:19 <+patspam> i'm guessing i should move my upgrade code from 7.7.5-7.7.6.pl to the new one?
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02:20 <+patspam> because my changes don't appear in the new beta create.sql
02:21 <@preaction> probably
02:24 <+perlDreamer> also in the changelog, so that everything jives
02:33 <@preaction> Haarg: how would i go about sending wgdev changes to you? i've added support for "--cover" to wgdev Test command
02:41  * perlDreamer does a git diff > patch and email it to him
02:41 <+perlDreamer> I can send you his email address if you need it
02:41 <@preaction> nah, i have it
02:42 <@preaction> do you know how to build a self-contained wgd?
02:43 <+perlDreamer> no, but I'd check Build.PL for suggestions
02:44 <@preaction> i'm gonna get that damned test box working again, WITH COVERAGE
02:44 <+perlDreamer> you know, daily coverage isn't really necessary, but daily checks are really important
02:44 <+perlDreamer> weekly coverage is good
02:49 <+perlDreamer> honestly, I'd rather have a good smolder server set up so that we can aggregate test results from several smokers before having regular coverage
02:49 <+perlDreamer> it's only been by luck that we found that Test::Class wasn't working everywhere
02:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10852 /WebGUI/ (8 files in 7 dirs): Moved Survey test upgrade to 7.7.6-7.7.7 upgrade script
03:08 <@preaction> but with regular coverage, JT will write more tests (he said so)
03:09 <+perlDreamer> hm
03:09 <+perlDreamer> well, in that case
03:09 <+perlDreamer> :)
03:09 <@preaction> something along the lines of "If i had feedback on how useful the tests are, or where the tests need to be written most, i would write more tests"
03:09 <@tavisto> perlDreamer, you need to write more tests
03:09 <+perlDreamer> heck, if he needs to know that, I could tell him
03:09 <+perlDreamer> #1 priority, Session
03:09 <+perlDreamer> if Session does not have 100% coverage, we're vulnerable
03:19 <@preaction> It's more dangerous that I realize
03:19 <@preaction> THE COVERAGE YOU SPEAK OF WILL SOON BE IN OUR HANDS
03:19 <@preaction> Any attack we make against the Session would be a useless gesture, no matter what coverage we have!
03:19 <@tavisto> *tavisto is confused and scared*
03:27  * perlDreamer too
03:27 <+perlDreamer> After Session, I'd have to say the Asset base class
03:28 <+perlDreamer> then User and Group
03:28 <+perlDreamer> VersionTag
03:28 <+perlDreamer> and then it would probably be a matter of opinion for the rest
03:28 <+perlDreamer> Crud is important
03:29 <+perlDreamer> you can't download a CentOS DVD?
03:29 <+perlDreamer> what's with that?
03:29 <+perlDreamer> perlmonkey2, what's a good fedora bittorrent client?
03:30 <@preaction> perlDreamer: transmission
03:31 <+perlDreamer> wow
03:31 <+perlDreamer> 1 hour, 40 minutes?
03:32 <+perlDreamer> that's blazingly fast!
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03:33  * perlDreamer should have used torrents a long time ago
03:41 <+perlDreamer> really, for coverage, there is basic coverage for a lot of code, just because it's used by other code that is being tested.
03:41 <+perlDreamer> it's the direct, merciless and thorough testing of everything that's missing
03:43 <+perlDreamer> maybe I should sit down and write some priorities as to what modules are high priority in testing..
03:43 <+patspam> testing test frameworks does your head in a bit
03:44 <+patspam> especially when you have your TAP output mingled in with the test framework test TAP output
03:45 <+perlDreamer> what're you testing, patspam?
03:46 <+patspam> Survey's expression/branching tester
03:46 <+perlDreamer> cool
03:47  * perlDreamer heeds the call to dinner
03:47 <+perlDreamer> otherwise, he could get rung like a bell...
03:47 <+perlDreamer> bbiaw
04:10 <+patspam> dang that's a gotcha..
04:11 <+patspam> I wanted to use more relaxed JSON rules, so I was using 'use JSON -suport_by_pp'
04:11 <+patspam> JSON::XS doesn't support options like allow_barekey so that lets you fall back to pure-perl json for those features
04:12 <+patspam> except that as soon as modperl loads that, it starts using pure-perl JSON everywhere
04:22 <+patspam> kinda sucks though, because writing strict json by hand is almost as painful as writing xml
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10853 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): 
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Some minor Survey bug fixes
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Removed evil "use JSON -support_by_pp"
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: test() and test_mc() now intelligently start at the right place and give better TAP descriptions
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04:41 <+perlDreamer> so, after getting a torrent down, how long is it polite to leave your client on for reciprocity?
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04:43 <@preaction> perlDreamer: until your ratio is 1.00 (100% fed back to the swarm)
04:44 <+perlDreamer> my ratio is 0.0
04:44 <+perlDreamer> that doesn't bode well, does it?
04:45 <@preaction> no, it just means nobody wants to download from you
04:45 <@preaction> what kind of torrent is it? is it well-seeded already?
04:45 <+perlDreamer> CentOS 5.3 DVD image
04:45 <+perlDreamer> not likely to be too popular
04:46 <@preaction> if there's more than 50 seeders, i'd say don't worry about it
04:46 <+perlDreamer> compared to Serenity, and BSG episodes
04:46 <+perlDreamer> how do i check for the number of seeders?
04:47 <+perlDreamer> I'm sending to 3/5 people asking to download
04:48 <@preaction> if you're using Transmission, you have to open the inspector i think
04:48 <@preaction> i haven't used the GTK+ interface, i use the OSX interface
04:49 <+perlDreamer> I'll leave it open another hour or so
04:50  * perlDreamer wants to be a good netizen
04:50 <+perlDreamer> I don't suppose we have WRE torrents?
04:50 <@preaction> not that i'm aware of
04:51 <+perlDreamer> the rhel-5 WRE should install on CentOS?
04:51 <@preaction> yes
04:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10854 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): Fix user profile SMS i18n.
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06:32 <@preaction> okay, so i fixed the test box (in theory, we'll know soon), but how should i publish coverage?
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07:01 <+perlDreamer> there's no way to easily publish, or aggregate coverage
07:01 <+perlDreamer> okay, I've got CentOS and a WRE
07:01 <+perlDreamer> time to make a VM
07:01 <+perlDreamer> tomorrow
07:02 <@preaction> i'm going to scp it into dusk.plainblack.com so that it's available from doug.plainblack.com/uploads/coverage <- easiest i can make it
07:03 <+perlDreamer> the front page is the really important one
07:03 <+perlDreamer> everything after that is detail work
07:04 <@preaction> nah, without the detail work it's pointless ;)
07:04 <+perlDreamer> with the detail work it's larger than a HTTP MAX UPLOAD
07:04 <@preaction> though the real benefit is being able to do coverage easy using wgd test
07:04 <@preaction> that's why i'm scp-ing the directory instead of using http to upload
07:04 <+perlDreamer> how do you do wgd test w/o coverage?
07:05 <@preaction> what do you mean w/o coverage? it doesn't do coverage now, but i made it do coverage
07:05 <@preaction> w/o = without, right?
07:05 <+perlDreamer> yup
07:05 <+perlDreamer> so wgd test always gives coverage?
07:05 <@preaction> no
07:06 <+perlDreamer> oh, okay
07:06 <+perlDreamer> that's goo
07:06 <+perlDreamer> d
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07:06 <@preaction> i added a switch, --cover
07:07 <+perlDreamer> and it does the whole thing for you?  cover --delete; prove with cover, then cover at the end to make HTML?
07:07 <+perlDreamer> nice :)
07:07 <@preaction> yep
07:08 <@preaction> even lets you specify where you want the cover_db to end up, --cover=directory
07:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10855 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/i18n/English/WebGUI.pm: Fix broken i18n with the Admin group for Asset History browsing.
07:12 <+perlDreamer> you know, you're pretty good at this perl stuff
07:12 <+perlDreamer> ever think of doing it for a living?
07:14 <@preaction> nah, once i start doing it for work it becomes a chore
07:28 <+patspam> perlDreamer
07:28 <+patspam> you still awake?
07:28 <+perlDreamer> yup
07:28 <+patspam> i think you'll like this one
07:28  * perlDreamer never sleeps, remember?
07:28  * patspam slaps head.. oh yeah!
07:28 <+patspam> just found a nasty unsafe reference bug in SurveyJSON
07:29 <+perlDreamer> no!
07:29 <+patspam> probably only manifests in test code, but still!
07:30 <+patspam> when you update a question type to a multiChoiceBundle, it doesn't create a copy of the new question structure
07:30 <+patspam> ..so when you update 2 questions to the same type, they both point at the same answer hash
07:30 <+perlDreamer> oh, yeah
07:30 <+patspam> which did a good job of confuddling me for at least an hour!
07:31 <+perlDreamer> actually, it's not just test code, it's any persistent code.
07:31 <+perlDreamer> like tests, and workflows
07:31 <+patspam> yeah good point
07:32 <+patspam> which makes me even more glad i found it
07:33 <+perlDreamer> I'm just happy you were listening during my game show talk last year ;)
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10:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10856 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 3 dirs): 
10:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: SurveyJSON bug fixes
10:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fixed bug in SurveyJSON::update to stop it updating questionType when not asked
10:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fixed unsafe reference bug in SurveyJSON::getMultipleChoiceBundle
10:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added more Survey Test Suite tests
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12:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10857 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Improved Survey test setup
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17:40 < daviddelikat> anybody around?
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17:56 < KlausH> Hi, are there any news regarding WRE 0.9.2?
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19:50 <+perlDreamer> hey, dionak!
19:50 < dionak> hey there pd
19:51 <+perlDreamer> I got to thinking about topsub, and I'm not looking for a contractor right now, but it would be handy to have his contact info
19:51 <+perlDreamer> would you mind emailing it to me, please?
19:51 < dionak> can you send me an email so I'll have your address? diona at knowmad
19:52 < dionak> we still hire him occassionally. things are just slow atm
19:52 < dionak> i've got to run. ttys
19:53 <+perlDreamer> l8r
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21:47 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10858 /translations/German/German/ (8 files): Update from translation server
--- Day changed Sun May 17 2009
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02:04 < daviddelikat> any body know about 'Business/Tax/VAT/Validation.pm'?
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02:34 <+perlDreamer> It was added to work with the new Tax Driver, daviddelikat
02:45 < daviddelikat> perlDreamer: where can i get it?
02:45 <+perlDreamer> cpan
02:45 < daviddelikat> it wasn't listed in the gotchas doc...
02:46 <+perlDreamer> that's been fixed in 7.7.7
02:46 < daviddelikat> when was it put into SVN?
02:46 <+perlDreamer> the gotcha notice?
02:46 < daviddelikat> yup
02:46 <+perlDreamer> within the last day or two
02:47 < daviddelikat> cuz it wasnt there when i looked this afternoon
02:47 < daviddelikat> and i just updated my code this morning
02:48 < daviddelikat> i see it...
02:48 < daviddelikat> its in 7.7.6
02:48 < daviddelikat> sure would be nice if upgrade would get these pacakges automagically.
02:48 <+perlDreamer> rev 10687
02:59 <+perlDreamer> daviddelikat, the WRE may have some script to help with that
02:59 <+perlDreamer> or at least display a list of newly required modules
02:59 <+perlDreamer> if not...
02:59 <+perlDreamer> :)
02:59 <+perlDreamer> patches welcome
03:01 < daviddelikat> I'm always thinking about what would help...
03:02 <+perlDreamer> I know.  It's one of the reasons I always try to answer your questions
03:02 < daviddelikat> thanks
03:03 < daviddelikat> right now im getting a headache from YUI paginator
03:03 <+perlDreamer> still working on that sideways pagination for the EMS?
03:03 < daviddelikat> yup
03:03 < daviddelikat> got it sort of working agin
03:03 < daviddelikat> but the paginator is not cooperating
03:03 < daviddelikat> or is it the data source
03:04 < daviddelikat> its hard to tell right now...
03:04 < daviddelikat> everything oges well until i try to get the second page
03:04 < daviddelikat> it does everything it is supposed to do except to draw the table with the new data
03:04 < daviddelikat> which is kind of important
03:13 <+perlDreamer> have you manually checked the JSON that is being returned to make sure it's okay?
03:14 < daviddelikat> yes, it looks good, it loads the first page just fine.
03:15 < daviddelikat> have you seen this:   http://doublebassblog.org/2007/08/four-guys-play-one-cello.html
03:15 < daviddelikat> just a little distraction ...
03:18 <+perlDreamer> that's crazy!  I love it!
03:18 < daviddelikat> theres another video in the index of a guy who wrote a piece which has 37 parts
03:19 < daviddelikat> all for the cello
03:19 < daviddelikat> and he played them all in the video
03:19 < daviddelikat> just a little bit of video editting...
03:21 < daviddelikat> well, now i can get my second page of data, but it doesn't clear ou the first page...
03:21 < daviddelikat> kinda like the guy with his cello
03:25 < daviddelikat> yeah!! the table updates!!
03:25 < daviddelikat> but the paginator does not...
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03:46 <+perlDreamer> isn't there a way to turn on YUI logging
03:46 <+perlDreamer> where it tells you all sorts of things about what it is trying to do?
03:46 < daviddelikat> YUI logging looks really good, but you have to do 2 things:
03:47 < daviddelikat> 1. add a widget to the page youre working on
03:47 < daviddelikat> 2. load  the js script that have the debug code in them
03:47 < daviddelikat> both are a little prohibitive...
03:48 < daviddelikat> I have enough to learn right now...
03:48 <+perlDreamer> hm.  How 'bout Firebug then?
03:48 < daviddelikat> thats what im doing
03:48 < daviddelikat> setting interupts and looking at data
03:49 < daviddelikat> also looking at how the YUI code works in the non-compressed modules...
03:57 < daviddelikat> fixed
03:57 < daviddelikat> and just in time for dinner
03:57 < daviddelikat> brb
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05:58 <@preaction> daviddelikat: i added a flag to testEnvironment.pl that will install modules without prompting, so if you have cpan set up to not prompt for anything, you could add a call to testEnvironment.pl to upgrade.pl or something
05:59 <@preaction> i'll commit that feature tonight
06:00 <@preaction> anyone else getting failures on t/Macro/a_account.t with Cannot use an undefined value as a HASH reference in WebGUI::PseudoRequest?
06:00 <@preaction> i have one system that IS getting failures like that, and one that isn't
06:02 <@preaction> ah. as usual it's because i'm an idiot, i fixed it, and i didn't commit the fix.
06:08 <+perlDreamer> it's working for me
06:08 <+perlDreamer> what's the issue?
06:09 <+perlDreamer> and you can't be an idiot
06:09 <+perlDreamer> it's my turn
06:09 <+perlDreamer> and this week isn't over for several hours yet
06:09 <@preaction> i fixed it and committed the fix
06:09 <@preaction> so it's fixed now
06:10 <@preaction> trying to repair the test box, it SEEMS to work just fine, but for some reason it isn't submitting the tests
06:10 <@preaction> also i got an idea for coverage: don't show the whole report with the test output, instead show which modules increased and decreased coverage, as well as the bottom 10% of covered modules
06:11 <@preaction> that way we can be alerted if someone added code and did not add tests for it, and which modules really need testing
06:11 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10859 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/PseudoRequest.pm: fixed pseudorequest "Cannot use undefined value as a HASH reference"
06:12 <+perlDreamer> that's a good idea, but it will require some custom coding in the report generator
06:12 <+perlDreamer> as well as keeping a db around
06:12 <+perlDreamer> if it was only the front page, it wouldn't be so big/bad
06:13 <@preaction> i want the whole thing on there, which will happen, but i want to summarize the data so that its easier to use
06:13 <@preaction> even the test data i want to do that for
06:13 <@preaction> the entire report is really useless
06:13 <@preaction> so i'm thinking i want to look at smolder and see what it would take to add this kind of stuff
06:15 <+perlDreamer> really, it's the HTML that's so big.  If it was just data, it would be smaller
06:17 <@preaction> yeah, i'm not worried about the size. i want the whole report so that people can look at the summary, say "oh, WebGUI::User went down", then go into the full report and see where there isn't coverage
06:17 <@preaction> i just want the summary so more people look at it. if it's time-consuming to look at the test output, nobody will look at it
06:17 <@preaction> except you me and haarg
06:17 <@preaction> social engineering, i guess
06:17 <+perlDreamer> ;)
06:18 <@preaction> along with "people are lazy"
06:18 <+perlDreamer> and you said rizen would use it, too
06:18 <@preaction> exactly. the easier i make it, the more apt people around PB will be to use it
06:19 <@preaction> if it's easy to see, we can have people policing each other
06:19 <+perlDreamer> the problem with smolder, is that it's completely built around TAP archives
06:19 <+perlDreamer> adjusting it to handle coverage data could be quite different
06:19 <@preaction> "Oh! User went down! what code isn't covered! svn blame! Doug why aren't you testing your new code!"
06:19 <+perlDreamer> oh, now I see
06:19 <+perlDreamer> you want to put me out of a job :)
06:19 <+perlDreamer> the program should be called "nag"
06:19 <@preaction> hah
06:20 <+perlDreamer> maybe nagDev
06:20 <@preaction> there's no way to put you out of a job, but i can make your job more efficient so you get do to more with less time
06:20 <@preaction> you shouldn't be policing us, that shouldn't be One Person's Responsibility. you should be doing what you want instead of fighting a constant losing battle against the tide of test coverage
06:21 <@preaction> we need to get you a peg-finger, "I lost this in the great test run of aught-three"
06:21 <+perlDreamer> say "Hi" to kathy, she's reading over my shoulder
06:21 <+perlDreamer> she says "should" is often different from reality
06:21 <@preaction> hi kathy! i made cookies!
06:21 <+perlDreamer> "ooh!  What kind?"
06:21 <@preaction> peanut-butter-heath, are quite awesome
06:22 <@preaction> not very healthy though :(
06:22 <+perlDreamer> I'll send you a postage guaranteed return box ;)
06:22 <+perlDreamer> yeah, like Fudge Oat Bars are healthy?
06:22 <+perlDreamer> well, they do have oats in them
06:22 <+perlDreamer> and egg
06:22 <@preaction> touche
06:22 <+perlDreamer> and flour
06:22 <+perlDreamer> and cocoa has antioxidants
06:22 <+perlDreamer> so, yes!
06:22 <+perlDreamer> It's breakfast food
06:22 <@preaction> i could also send some homemade tortellini, provided i learn how to properly dry it
06:22 <@preaction> heh
06:23 <+perlDreamer> I'll slice one for the kids and serve it with grapefruit juice, ala Bill Cosby
06:23 <@preaction> here goes nothin. test box dry run two, this time with submit to forum. 
06:24  * preaction crosses fingers
06:24 <+perlDreamer> it's difficult to type with crossed fingers
06:24  * preaction knocks on wood :p
06:24 <@preaction> Dear Strong Bad, how do you type with boxing gloves on?
06:26 <+perlDreamer> had to wiki that one...
06:27 <@preaction> Strong Bad / Homestar Runner is some of the best cartoons on the intarwebs
06:27 <@preaction> it's hit-or-miss with the comedy sometimes, but just the sheer amount of content they have (all available for free) boggles the mind sometimes
06:28 <+perlDreamer> how long is a test run on da box?
06:28 <@preaction> without coverage? about 20 minutes maybe
06:28 <@preaction> less i think really
06:29 <@preaction> critic_label being the longest one, 10 minutes alone
06:29 <+perlDreamer> that would be surprising
06:29 <+perlDreamer> on my laptop, it takes 40 minutes to run critic_labels
06:29 <@preaction> well, i started it at 22:23, and it's been 7 minutes, and we're almost to critic_label.t, so we'll see
06:29 <+perlDreamer> and about 7 minutes for a total test run
06:30 <+perlDreamer> but, I have to remember the due to Fedora, PPI is heavily penalized for reblessing objects
06:30 <@preaction> ouch
06:30 <@preaction> i'm using Debian. on a 1.5Ghz processor with maybe 3G of ram
06:30 <+perlDreamer> have you tried apt-get webgui yet?
06:31 <@preaction> not yet, no
06:31 <@preaction> and i think the system just died...
06:32 <@preaction> maybe i should get a new mac mini and use my old mac mini to do this.
06:32 <+perlDreamer> critic_labels brings another box to its knees
06:32 <@preaction> nah, didn't make it that far
06:33 <@preaction> it did this last night too, no idea why
06:33 <+perlDreamer> kernel panic?
06:34 <@preaction> dunno. i think there is something very wrong with some of my hardware. but i should have enough hardware to make at least ONE useful computer...
06:36 <@preaction> so let's try this again...
06:38 <+perlDreamer> maybe we should bill the test suite as a hardware stress test
06:38 <+perlDreamer> and that's not even running it under Test::Aggregate
06:40 <@preaction> dead again. probably the thermal paste on the CPU i bet
06:59 <+perlDreamer> more paste
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11:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10860 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Refactored Survey test suite diagnostics etc..
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--- Day changed Mon May 18 2009
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00:59 <+perlDreamer> webgui.org is down (from here)
01:00 <+perlDreamer> plainblack.com works, though
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01:32 <+perlDreamer> well, you'll al lbe proud of me
01:32 <+perlDreamer> I'm installing the WRE (in a VM)
01:37 <@preaction> yay!
01:39 <@preaction> i'm committing the Map asset now, and will be writing tests for it later tonight
01:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10861 /WebGUI/ (6 files in 5 dirs): initial checkin of map
01:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10862 /WebGUI/sbin/testEnvironment.pl: added --noprompt for testEnvironment
01:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10863 /WebGUI/ (11 files in 10 dirs): 
01:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added: Google map asset.
01:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added a way for authors to prevent debugging output on page requests
01:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10864 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: updated changelog
01:52 <@preaction> sunnuvabitch THAT's where --noprompt ended up
02:08 <+perlDreamer> well, did you know that if you test the media during an install that you can hang the installer?
02:08 <+perlDreamer> I mounted a DVD ISO image into the virtual dvd drive
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02:48 <+perlDreamer> preaction, when you lose track of code, that's not a good sign
02:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10865 /WebGUI/sbin/testEnvironment.pl: removed testing module
02:48 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10866 /WebGUI/docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt: added changelog entry
02:48 <@preaction> i'm trying to use git and branching, but it's difficult to keep track of all the different branches
02:48 <+perlDreamer> it is
02:48 <+perlDreamer> but git log -p is your friend
02:49 <+perlDreamer> the problem I have with git is that all I can find are instructions on how to use the pieces
02:49 <+perlDreamer> and not how to use it in a flow
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05:33 <+perlDreamer> preaction: Catalyst?
05:36 <@preaction> perlDreamer: i removed it, no?
05:36 <@preaction> it was debugging code, i wanted a module i didn't have installed
05:36 <+perlDreamer> ah, I see
05:36  * perlDreamer thought perhaps you were being lured to the dark side
05:36 <@preaction> more the light-grey side
05:45 <+perlDreamer> preaction, if you have a chance, you should try to see this train as it comes through your area
05:45 <+perlDreamer> http://www.sp4449.com/trainfest.html
05:45 <+perlDreamer> The Shasta Daylight is a big piece of American history
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06:15 < nuba> CIA-23> WebGUI: Added: Google map asset.
06:15 < nuba> cool
06:16 <+perlDreamer> hm Portland to Portage, WI is $366, with room and board on the Amtrak
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06:20 <+perlDreamer> how's the testing box today, preaction?
06:21 <@preaction> haven't even tried it. my laptop is overheating too now
06:21 <+perlDreamer> uh-oh
06:21 <+perlDreamer> could be contagious
06:21  * perlDreamer is going to call it a night early tonight.
06:21 <+perlDreamer> it was so hot last night I didn't get to sleep 'til about 2:00
06:22 <+perlDreamer> see you all tomorrow, hopefully a brighter and less error-prone perlDreamer
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06:39 < nuba> preaction: you are doug, right?
06:41 < nuba> yeah n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net (Doug Bell)
06:41 < nuba> kudos on the google map asset, im glad it was finally done
06:43 < nuba> i wish i had contributed on that one, but when it came to managing time to work on it, it was just a big fail
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06:44 < nuba> so its one unfinished project less in the back burner and in the conscience :)
06:45 < ekennedy> Question:  I want to add a workflow for a Thingy object.  Which section of the workflow section of the config file does it need to be defined in?  The thingy section?
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07:12 < ekennedy> I got it.  Thanks.
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13:05 < carogray> anyone here use prototypes?
13:49 <+Radix_> I have
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14:43 < carogray> sorry radix - didn't see
14:44 < carogray> can you make an article a prototype - "deploy it" and then unmake it a prototype and still have all the articles that you made from it?
14:45 < carogray> radix: - only on the bus for about 10 more minutes then walking to work - will lose you when I turn off computer,but will get back on again when I get into the office
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15:31 < carogray> radix: I am back
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16:38 < zylopfa> Hello All, does anyone know why the "Rich Editor" that you define yourself with the WebGUI::Asset::RichEdit (in the Utilities Menu) wont accept html line breaks or other elements but the img tag?
16:41 < BartJo1> there are some tags that are filtered
16:42 < zylopfa> RTFM. I found out why thanks, you need to set allowed elements also in the metadata
16:42 < zylopfa> Greetings BartJo1 
16:42 < BartJo1> yes
16:42 < BartJo1> hi zylopfa
16:42 < zylopfa> Thanks for help, i found out in the meantime
16:42 < zylopfa> I just need to read the text (manual) in the asset
16:42 < BartJo1> sorry, I was late, was watching sailing movies
16:42 < zylopfa> Sounds awesome
16:42 < BartJo1> yeah, tomorrow I will leave for England
16:43 < zylopfa> Its genious the RichEditor imo
16:43 < zylopfa> It wasn't configurable in earlier versions was it?
16:43 < BartJo1> yeah, it works quite ok, once you know how you have to set it up
16:43 < BartJo1> I think it wasn't in pre 6 versions
16:45 < zylopfa> I dont think it was in 7.20ish
16:45 < zylopfa> I just found it now looking through the menus
16:45 < BartJo1> zylopfa: If you still find stuff that is blocked (html) maybe it is blocked in the code
16:46 < BartJo1> for safety reasons prolly
16:46 < zylopfa> yeah true, it should be ok now i think, it does the <p> and <br /> tags now
16:46 < BartJo1> good
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17:39 < CIA-23> wgdev: Doug Bell master * r3d649fc / lib/WGDev/Command/Test.pm : add coverage option to Test command - http://bit.ly/Tzpun
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18:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10867 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/packages-7.7.7/matrix-default-screenshots-config.wgpkg: matrix template fixes for new ukplayer version
19:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10868 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/docs/upgrades/ (2 files in 2 dirs): matrix template fix for ukplayer upgrade
19:14 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, preaction: tagsToRollback has been added to WebGUI::Test
19:14 <@Haarg> cool
19:15 <@Haarg> i still need to look into the t/Mail/Sent.t failure, but i'm pretty sure it's a leaky test somewhere
19:16 <+perlDreamer> maybe.  When it fails for me I keep getting undef sent back
19:16 <@Haarg> which test was failing for you?
19:17 <@Haarg> i could only get a failure if i did a reset and immediately ran the full test suite
19:17 <+perlDreamer> I get random failures on tests 6,7
19:17 <@Haarg> running the test on its own either before or after going through all the tests passed
19:17 <@Haarg> odd
19:18 <+perlDreamer> http://gist.github.com/113583
19:21 <@Haarg> i was seeing a failure on either 16 or 17, i don't remember
19:21 <+perlDreamer> they seem to come in pairs
19:21 <+perlDreamer> 2,4,6 tests failing
19:22 <+perlDreamer> my first guess is that the test may be asking for STDIO before the daemon is ready
19:22 <+perlDreamer> but reading from the filehandle would block, wouldn't it?
19:23 <@Haarg> it should
19:23 <+perlDreamer> yeah, so that wouldn't explain it
19:25 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10869 /WebGUI/ (16 files in 14 dirs): adding FilePump
19:27 <@Haarg> actually, wait
19:27 <@Haarg> it wouldn't block
19:28 <@Haarg> it checks the file handle to see if it can read from it
19:28 <@Haarg> it's supposed to wait for 5 seconds though
19:30 <+perlDreamer> I'm not seeing pauses that long
19:31 <@Haarg> the sendToServer sub should return an error, but i don't think it gets displayed by anything
19:31 <+perlDreamer> we can fix that :)
19:31 <@preaction> perlDreamer: you're making FilePump?
19:31 <@preaction> or wait, DID you make it already?
19:32 <+perlDreamer> yes, but I've found some bugs that need to be fixed in it
19:32 <@preaction> sweet!
19:32 <+perlDreamer> es ist shoen gemacht
19:32 <+perlDreamer> Ya yo lo hecho
19:32 <@preaction> we've got CDN, FilePump, Packing (i will fix that, I swear), attachments
19:32 <@Haarg> yeah, might be good to just have it diag the errors instead of returning them
19:33 <@preaction> wee have sure packed some nice features into 7.7
19:33 <+perlDreamer> it's a good release
19:33 <@Haarg> i have a couple more things i need to get committed
19:33 <@preaction> i would venture the best yet, again
19:33 <+perlDreamer> except for those basic, ugly StoryManager templates :(
19:33  * perlDreamer needs to study some HTML design
19:34 <@Haarg> but one replaces the email verification so i need to make sure it transitions properly
19:34 <@preaction> perlDreamer:  don't worry about it, we've got real designers
19:37 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, when sendToServer returns that error message, it's in JSON
19:37 <+perlDreamer> so it's already being emitted by the check in like()
19:37 <+perlDreamer> it says what it's getting back is empty
19:38 <+perlDreamer> which says (to me) that the problem is further upstream
19:38 <+perlDreamer> like in Net::SMTP::Server
19:38 <@Haarg> sendToServer is returning a hash though
19:38 <@Haarg> and like is checking a specific element in that hash
19:38 <@Haarg> not the whole thing
19:38 <+perlDreamer> ah, yeah
19:39 <@Haarg> so the error element just gets lost
19:39  * perlDreamer should have used cmp_deeply instead
19:40 <+perlDreamer> the error is "mail not sent"
19:41 <+perlDreamer> and the log says "Couldn't connect to mail server: localhost:port"
19:41 <@Haarg> so it is the can_read check that is failing
19:41 <@Haarg> must be the startup time then
19:41 <+perlDreamer> I don't think so.  $status is 0, so it never does the check
19:42 <+perlDreamer> (check for can_read)
19:42 <@Haarg> oh, yeah
19:42 <@Haarg> read that wrong (and i just wrote it)
19:43 <@Haarg> aside from adding a sleep, can you think of any other reasonable ways to handle that?
19:43 <@Haarg> i may have removed a sleep when i was making those changes
19:43 <+perlDreamer> serial polling?
19:44 <+perlDreamer> sleep is effective, but it's a guess against the race condition
19:45 <+perlDreamer> a sleep 1 makes the test more robust
19:45 <+perlDreamer> I can't make it fail any longer
19:46 <@Haarg> the only option i can think of other than a sleep is having smtpd.pl output something indicating it is ready
19:47 <@Haarg> the startup code for that would be a bit more complex though
19:47 <+perlDreamer> on average though, it would be faster than sleep 1
19:48 <+perlDreamer> and would be more portable across different systems, too
19:48 <@Haarg> except windows, but we abandoned that for a reason
19:50 < zylopfa> I have a real noob question, how do i pass a object to a subrutine, and how do i dereference it in the sub
19:50 <@Haarg> what type of object?
19:51 <@Haarg> you basically just pass it like any scalar
19:51 <@Haarg> and you don't really dereference it in the sub, just use it as an object there
19:51 <+perlDreamer> zylopfa, all objects are references.  All references are scalars.
19:51 < zylopfa> yeah i found out now :/( and use it like this $object->someSuv
19:55 < zylopfa> Haa i forgot a > in s hash assignment =>
19:56 < zylopfa> The Workflow system is really genious in Webgui
19:56 < zylopfa> I am making a workflow activity to create TopLists for my story site
19:57 < zylopfa> its very intense sql queries so i just make a activity and a workflow to run it every night
19:57 < zylopfa> I create a page automagically with the toplist data from this.
19:59 < zylopfa> Its genious that you can create everything in webgui (articles, messageboards, polls, layouts) in code
20:00 < zylopfa> WebGUI never fail to amaze me
20:00 < zylopfa> perlDreamer, do you know if the WebGUI api ever will be drastically changed?
20:01 <+perlDreamer> I suspect (and hope) that it will happen with WebGUI 8
20:01 < zylopfa> Nooo
20:01 <+perlDreamer> and, the rumor is that WebGUI 10 will be done in Perl 6
20:01 < zylopfa> Will it break all modules that has been made?
20:01 <+perlDreamer> maybe
20:01 < zylopfa> Cause i have made a lot of Wobjects and Workflow Activites and stuff for my sites
20:02 < zylopfa> (modules)
20:02 <+perlDreamer> when we went through this in WebGUI 6 -> WebGUI 7, we provided hints and scripts to help people upgrade them
20:02 < zylopfa> ahh ok perlDreamer 
20:02 <+perlDreamer> so we won't leave you out in the cold
20:02 < zylopfa> Still it would set back the community if it gets radically changed?
20:03 < zylopfa> I read that the change from 6 -> 7 made many "quit" webgui
20:03 <+perlDreamer> yes, it was hard for many people
20:03 <+perlDreamer> but it also brought us the API that you use today
20:03 < zylopfa> yeah thats a kick ass api
20:03 <+perlDreamer> which is much stronger and robust than it used to be
20:03 < zylopfa> but if it gets changed again radically in 8.x
20:03 <+perlDreamer> it will get better again, in WebGUI 8
20:04 <+perlDreamer> simpler, more consistent
20:04 < zylopfa> Awesome
20:04 < zylopfa> Will you make a new developer book for it?
20:04 <+perlDreamer> yes, for sure
20:04 < zylopfa> I will buy it for sure
20:04 < zylopfa> Its expensive for a book but its 1000% worth it
20:04 < BartJo1> just call the function doWhatIWant
20:04 <+perlDreamer> me, too :)
20:04 <+perlDreamer> $BartJo1->doWhatIWant('fix house quickly');
20:05 < BartJo1> mmm, first I will have to sail to England and back, remember
20:05 < zylopfa> I am making a directory with toplists for "most read story","highest rated story", "most read category"
20:05 < zylopfa> and its generated automatically
20:05 <+perlDreamer> $BartJo1->queue($BartJo1->doWhatIWant('fix house quickly'));
20:06 < BartJo1> so a $BartJo1->doWhatIWant{'Win therace'}; would be awesome
20:06 <+perlDreamer> you didn't mention it was a race
20:06 < BartJo1> I hope to be done before you visit
20:06 < BartJo1> ah, well it is
20:06  * perlDreamer installs new batteries in his robot shark fleet
20:06 <+perlDreamer> make sure your transponder is pinging at 23 MHz, BartJol
20:07 <+perlDreamer> otherwise, it will be a long, cold swim
20:07 <+perlDreamer> also, keep the transponder frequency a secret, otherwise all the other boats will be protected, too
20:08 < BartJo1> Error perlDreamer->doWhatIwant('***perlDreamer installs new batteries in his robot shark fleet'); generates a conflict with queud commands $BartJo1->queue($BartJo1->doWhatIWant('fix house quickly')); and $BartJo1->doWhatIWant{'Win therace'}; in line x
20:09 <+perlDreamer> oh no, the shark fleet is to guarantee your winning the race, BartJo1
20:09 < BartJo1> don't wanna cheat
20:09 < BartJo1> thanks for the offer
20:09 <+perlDreamer> well, that's very honorable
20:09 <@preaction> if I turn on "Encrypt Login" in settings, do you think that means that if I go to ?op=auth;method=displayLogin it should be in SSL mode? or just the form submit for the login?
20:09 < BartJo1> and it won't get me back sooner
20:10 < BartJo1> preaction: that is a good question
20:11 <+perlDreamer> the important part is the data, yes?
20:11 <+perlDreamer> so sending it should be good enough?
20:11 <@preaction> considering the tens of millions of logins that happen each day, and the infinitesimal number that are "hacked" via piggyback slurp, i would say the more important part is that the person KNOWS they're "safe"
20:12 <@preaction> the feeling of safety being more important to the end-user's experience than any real safety
20:15 < zylopfa> If you run a Workflow/Activity as a scheduled cron job, does it matter much that you dont use $self->WAIT
20:16 <+perlDreamer> yes
20:16 < zylopfa> damn
20:16 <@preaction> $self->WAITING is only if you need to be run again
20:16 <+perlDreamer> All Workflows should check their runtime against the ttl
20:16 < zylopfa> its a single one i need to run every night at 2
20:16 <+perlDreamer> even if you think it won't ever do that
20:16 < zylopfa> to create toplists for my story site
20:16 < zylopfa> but how do i stop a 33 second query?
20:17 <+perlDreamer> you don't, you stop it the statement after it finishes :)
20:18 <+perlDreamer> it's more important for activities that loop internally on data
20:18 < zylopfa> but i have like 5 queries to make these lists (5 lists) and then if it times out on say the first list
20:18 < zylopfa> how do i know which list i am going to resume to query?
20:18 <@preaction> you store your state in $self->scratch
20:19 < zylopfa> ahh awesome, gonna write that down
20:21 < zylopfa> preaction, its a good idea to count the runtime like that so you are 100% sure your activities dont run all night forever by a mistake
20:23 < zylopfa> I was about to be lazy and just let it run unintrupted untill it finished
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21:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10870 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/Macro/FilePump.pm t/Macro/FilePump.t): Fill out FilePump macro tests and fix bugs.
21:21  * perlDreamer is running
21:31  * BartJo1 wonders from what
21:31 <@preaction> i thought he was running the test suite or something
21:32 < BartJo1> I think the running is literal
21:33 <@preaction> ohh, maybe he made his wife mad
21:34 < BartJo1> I thought he did it voluntary, like, forgive me the word, "sports"
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21:35 <@preaction> yes, he "works out" (a weird phrase), or exercises regularly
21:36 <@preaction> workout, work out... English is weird...
21:36 < BartJo1> here, we carry cheese as sports
21:36 <@preaction> i could never do that. my cheese wouldn't make it to the finish line
21:37 < BartJo1> it's a law that you have to carry at least 100 kg of cheese each week from the farm to the cheese chop
21:38 <@preaction> yes, but if I start with 120kg and end up with 100kg there, is there any penalty?
21:38 < BartJo1> hey, that might be a hole, but mostly it is weigthed before
21:40 <@preaction> they got me coming and going...
21:41 < BartJo1> yeah, but they check what you take and bring both
21:41 < BartJo1> so after a week they'll be on to you
21:42 <@preaction> one week of all the cheese i can eat... i dunno if it will be worth it or not
21:42 < BartJo1> I also guess it's the reason why MrHairgrease doesn't like cheese
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22:58 <+MrHairgrease> howdy everyone!
22:59 < BartJo1> hi
22:59 < BartJo1> not at the belgium beernight?
23:01 <+MrHairgrease> where?
23:01 < BartJo1> koornbeurs
23:01 <+MrHairgrease> oh
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23:01 <+MrHairgrease> I'd love to go
23:01 < BartJo1> but...
23:01 <+MrHairgrease> but it wouldn't be a good idea
23:02 < BartJo1> working people....
23:02 <+MrHairgrease> I have a meeting tomorrow morning
23:08 <+perlDreamer> just one or two small beers won't hurt MrHairgrease
23:08 <+perlDreamer> it's only when you are Bartesque that the problems occur
23:09 < BartJo1> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bartesque
23:09 < BartJo1> cool
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23:21 <+perlDreamer> BartJo1: when exactly do you set sail?
23:22 < BartJo1> around 6 pm we will leave the harbour
23:22 < BartJo1> 7 is the start of the race'
23:22 < BartJo1> so around lunchtime for you
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23:27 <+MrHairgrease> hey bart, you're leaving tomorrow?
23:27 <+BartJol> i sure will
23:27 <+MrHairgrease> nou, behouden vaart dan maar
23:28 <+BartJol> merci
23:28 <+MrHairgrease> and bring back a Pint of Guinness for me
23:28 <+BartJol> that will be hard
23:28 <+MrHairgrease> just put a lid on the pint
23:29 <+BartJol> well, the foam will  be gone
23:29 <+MrHairgrease> or you mean you've drunk it by the time you're back in the Netherlands?
23:29 <+BartJol> that is not verwaarloosbaar
23:29 <+MrHairgrease> significant even
23:29 <+BartJol> :)
23:33 <+perlDreamer> kick butt, take names, and drink their beer, BartJol
23:34 <+BartJol> take names of chicks?
23:35 <+MrHairgrease> just take the chicks =)
23:35 <+BartJol> sex for the race, I'm not sure whether that is allowed by my team leader
23:35 <+BartJol> I should ask Wijnand whether I may
23:36 <+MrHairgrease> sex for the race: that almost has a supremacist  scent over it =)
23:39 <+BartJol> well, even I can have some luck
--- Day changed Tue May 19 2009
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00:08 <+perlDreamer> bopbop, you're back?
00:08 <+perlDreamer> don't you have kids coming home?
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00:16 <@preaction> hm..
00:17 <+perlDreamer> preaction, what are you up to...?
00:17 <+perlDreamer> And why didn't you tell me that I forgot to add the FilePump admin console icons?
00:17 <@preaction> nothing. trying to figure out who morphbot is and why i should not ban them
00:17 <@preaction> OH GOD FORGIVE ME I DIDN'T KNOW!!!!1 I DIDN'T KNOWWWWWW
00:18  * perlDreamer was thinking that morphbot was one of yours
00:18 <+perlDreamer> so that we could say: morphbot: coverage User.pm
00:18 <+perlDreamer> oh
00:18 <+perlDreamer> oh
00:18 <+perlDreamer> One more thing, preaction
00:18 <+perlDreamer> you don't ever want to run coverage on the Perl::Critic critic_labels test
00:19 <@preaction> because it runs every bit of code?
00:19 <@preaction> why?
00:19 <+perlDreamer> because coverage slows things down, and PPI is already quite slow
00:19 <+perlDreamer> actually, if we tuned coverage carefully, we could tell it not to track stuff outside of WebGUI and it wouldn't matter too much
00:20 <@Haarg> also, it doesn't actually run any code at all, so it would be pointless
00:20 <@preaction> yeah, you could add exceptions. i added exceptions so Devel::Cover doesn't report coverage on the test scripts themselves (i think)
00:21 <@preaction> so you could focus only on WebGUI::*
00:22 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, has the magic for Config::JSON been added to make $config->addToArrayAfter() work yet?
00:23 <@Haarg> looks like i never committed that
00:23 <@Haarg> and a new release would be needed as well
00:23 <@Haarg> i should probably get on that :)
00:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10871 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: Remove duplicate sub that crept in there.
00:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10872 /WebGUI/www/extras/adminConsole/ (small/filePump.png filePump.png): Adding in the FilePump admin console icons.
00:23  * perlDreamer had better open up an account at the Great Dane for future Haarg encouragements...
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00:30 <@preaction> okay, that's enough of that
00:30 <@Haarg> pre-7.5 character sets continue to haunt me
00:31 <+perlDreamer> still popping up?
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00:31 <@Haarg> yeah, still have people running old versions
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00:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10873 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.7.6-7.7.7.pl: Add the FilePump content handler in the right place in the config file.
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00:41 <+perlDreamer> preaction: did I send you instructions on how to get a USPS account?
00:41 <@preaction> no, do i need one?
00:41 <+perlDreamer> perhaps
00:41 <+perlDreamer> the USPS driver has live testing built in :)
00:42 <+perlDreamer> so you can check it from end to end
00:42 <@preaction> perhaps they should be put in the wiki?
00:42 <@preaction> hell. now we're relying on two different HTML/CSS minifier/packers?
00:43 <+perlDreamer> *::Minifier::XS are very fast
00:43 <+perlDreamer> bundle times can be as long as 3 minutes for packing, even with the XS
00:43 <+perlDreamer> it would be better to use the XS ones
00:44 <@preaction> eh, the HTML packer one doesn't even work, so tomorrow i'm gonna try to figure out why
00:44 <+perlDreamer> maybe it pukes on HTML::Template syntax?
00:44 <@preaction> no, JT tried it on an HTML snippet
00:44 <@Haarg> but it does puke on html::template, yes
00:44 <@preaction> well yeah
00:45 <@preaction> if HTML::Minifier does better, that'd be wonderful. if it could be enhanced to interface with JS and CSS and min them inline, that'd be even better
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00:48 <@preaction> where is the file pump thing located?
00:49 <+perlDreamer> lib/WebGUI/FilePump
00:49 <+perlDreamer> Admin interface is FilePump/Admin
00:49 <+perlDreamer> Bundle objects managed by FilePump/Bundle
00:49 <@preaction> but how do i get there?
00:49 <+perlDreamer> in the GUI?
00:49 <@preaction> yes
00:49 <+perlDreamer> I just fixed a bug with that
00:49 <+perlDreamer> it's in the admin console
00:50 <@preaction> r10872?
00:50 <@preaction> i did a wgd reset -d and it doesn't show up
00:50 <+perlDreamer> 10874 would be best
00:50 <+perlDreamer> and you may have to reset the config file, as well
00:50 <@preaction> ok
00:51 <+perlDreamer> the content handler was added to the end of the config file, in the contentHandlers section
00:52 <@preaction> ah, now i see why, i didn't restart modperl after the reset
00:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10874 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Fix bugs in adding other (CSS, sprite) files to bundles.
00:53 <@preaction> you killed my content handlers!
00:53 <+perlDreamer> !!
00:53 <@preaction> also, add your content handler to WebGUI.conf.original
00:56 <+perlDreamer> thanks :)
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00:59 <@preaction> uh... so i have to specify Full URLs? i can't make them absolute?
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01:02 <+perlDreamer> you need to specify URIs
01:02 <+perlDreamer> file:/data/domains/domainname/www/uploads/static/somefile.js
01:02 <+perlDreamer> asset://assetUrl
01:02 <+perlDreamer> http://somesite/someurl
01:03 <@preaction> so no extras://something?
01:03 <@preaction> or uploads://?
01:03 <+perlDreamer> that would be a file url
01:04 <+perlDreamer> no uploads or extras shortcuts
01:04 <@preaction> but i don't know where it will be. so i can't distribute FilePump bundles using the templates they're attached to yet
01:04 <+perlDreamer> there's no way to distribute FilePump bundles
01:05 <@preaction> i mean, i'm ecstatic that we got this (and all the other) improvement in, and now we get to improve on the improvements ;)
01:05 <@preaction> like making the damn packing actually WORK
01:06 <@preaction> but anyway, now i gots to go to JTs for madmongers tomorrow
01:06 <+perlDreamer> patspam knows a lot more about FilePump theory than I do
01:07 <@preaction> yeah, he and I talked about it for a bit
01:07 <@preaction> so i suspect he might have a couple additions to make based on our talk
01:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10875 /WebGUI/etc/WebGUI.conf.original: Add FilePump to the default WebGUI.conf file
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01:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10876 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.7.6-7.7.7.pl: Don't kill preaction's contentHandlers.
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02:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10877 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): ITransact requires that money amounts in XML have 2 decimal places.
02:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10878 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Backporting ITransact XML formatting fix for currency.
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04:24 <+perlDreamer> we're celebrating 6 months of perlDreamer Consulting today.  Be back later
04:32 <+cap10morgan> any objection to my committing a small change to Group.pm on trunk that looks for LDAP groups where the member property just contains the uid rather than the full DN?
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05:03 <+perlDreamer> cap10morgan, with tests?
05:03 <+perlDreamer> is it a bug, or an RFE?
05:03 <+perlDreamer> we're in feature freeze now
05:03 <+perlDreamer> so technically only bugs go in from this point forwrad
05:04 <+cap10morgan> hmm, it's borderline i guess
05:04 <+perlDreamer> then zip rizen a quick email and ask him.
05:05 <+cap10morgan> ok, will do
05:05 <+cap10morgan> are there ldap tests in there now?
05:05 <+cap10morgan> that seems tricky
05:05 <+perlDreamer> there are no existing LDAP tests, so it will definitely be tricky
05:06 <+perlDreamer> I have this on my long term goals, though: http://search.cpan.org/~karman/Net-LDAP-Server-Test-0.07/lib/Net/LDAP/Server/Test.pm
05:06 <+cap10morgan> oh? is that like a Net::LDAP mock object?
05:07 <+cap10morgan> oh, it's a whole test server huh?
05:07 <+cap10morgan> interesting
05:07 <+perlDreamer> yeah, it has a lot of promise
05:08 <+perlDreamer> if I wasn't LDAP-phobic, I'd look into it sooner
05:08 <+perlDreamer> but it's something we need in the core, real LDAP tests
05:08 <+perlDreamer> so that bugs like that spaces in password thing can be fixed
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05:26 <+cap10morgan> yeah, would be good
05:26 <+cap10morgan> emailed the patch and context info to JT
05:26 <+cap10morgan> we'll see what he says
05:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10879 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): Survey: Let them eat sort
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06:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10880 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 2 dirs): 
06:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Survey tweaks
06:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Added Survey 'Tagged' question type, which builds its answers dynamically from tagged data
06:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Made Survey test suite more forgiving about JSON parsing
06:09 <+perlDreamer> hack on, patspam!
06:10  * perlDreamer is calling it a night
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10:50 < CIA-23> webgui: Patrick Donelan flux_7.7.7 * rdf1f83c / (2 files in 2 dirs): Fixed Survey bug in handling of logical sections - http://bit.ly/15CWBP
11:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10881 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (5 files): Update from translation server
11:40 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10882 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/Asset_Carousel.pm: Update from translation server
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12:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10883 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/WebGUI.pm: Update from translation server
13:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10884 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (6 files): Update from translation server
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14:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10885 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (10 files): Update from translation server
14:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10886 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fixed #10332: Matrix: last updated fields = today
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15:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: yung * r10887 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fixed #10332: Matrix: last updated fields = today
15:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10888 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (3 files): Update from translation server
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16:12 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10889 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (PayDriver_PayPalStd.pm Account_Inbox.pm Account_Shop.pm): Update from translation server
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16:30 < daviddelikat> yet another new package not listed in gotcha.txt: CSS-Minifier-XS
16:30 < daviddelikat> worse yet, this one doesn't have a redhat package and it requires a compiler...
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16:41 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10890 /translations/Dutch/Dutch/ (2 files): Update from translation server
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18:31 <@tavisto> preaction, you awake
18:32 <@preaction> tavisto: yessir
18:32 <@tavisto> hey good morning
18:32 <@tavisto> question for you about the gallery
18:32 <@preaction> okay, shoot
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18:33 <@tavisto> if someone copies an album and wants to then paste it into another album... Would you expect it to copy both the album and the image assets inside of it?
18:33 <@tavisto> er sorry paste it into another gallery
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18:34 <@preaction> RFE it, but there is a way to Copy + sub assets
18:35 <@tavisto> yep, I know of that menu, although I think it's only present on in-line editing view
18:35 <@preaction> yeah
18:35 <@tavisto> and when exposed.
18:36 <@tavisto> I can definitely RFE it... although I was wondering if this was something that should be done. I can tell you when I just rearranged our sightings on webgui.org, it was quite a headache because of that
18:37 <@tavisto> I also have to post a bug because some of the albums I copied over into another gallery kept their album thumbnail and some did not. (keep in mind, none of the images in the album were moved over when I copied.. so that was interesting that some of the thumbnails would and some would not)
18:37 <@preaction> i would RFE the "Copy with children" into the Asset Manager
18:38 <@tavisto> alright, will do. I better check on that because I would be surprised if it wasn't already requested
18:44 <@tavisto> preaction, that is already a pending RFE by aewhale (9594). Good to go there
18:47 < ryuu_ro> hi guys, i'm working on the dutch translations and I don't know what to do with the word 'bucket' in passive analytics
18:47 < ryuu_ro> is this a common word for analytics?
18:47 < ryuu_ro> or should a I just see it as a container?
18:50 <@preaction> ryuu_ro: i would say container
18:50 < ryuu_ro> ok thanks
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19:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10891 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/Mail/Send.t: Add 1 second delay to allow for smtp server startup.
19:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10892 /WebGUI/t/Mail/Send.t: Forward porting t/Mail/Send.t delay for server startup
20:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10893 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/ (hardcodedExtras.t templateChecker.t): Remove CODE_COP gating for templateChecker and hardcodedExtras tests
20:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10894 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (3 files in 2 dirs): fixed: tries to reject friend invitations for deleted users
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20:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10895 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/docs/create.sql: preparing for 7.6.23 release
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20:50 < juan> i have a mistake with the surveys
20:51 < juan> i created a survey a used it 
20:51 < juan> then i duplicate it
20:51 < juan> the old one had 13 questions
20:52 < juan> now i edited the duplicated survey
20:52 < juan> i deleted some questions and added another ones
20:52 < juan> the total of questions that i have is 16
20:53 < juan> and the survey has a counter of 23
20:53 < juan> so when a person tries to do the survey, he or she answers the 16 questions but the botton next continuous
20:54 < juan> becuase the progress is 16 of 23
20:54 < juan> as the rest of questions dont exists
20:54 < juan> the survey doesnt finish
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23:00 <@plainhao> someone used svn-git and svn-clone to migrate svn history to git?
23:00 <@Haarg> yes
23:00 <@plainhao> how'd you do it? did you do what sci.nti.st blogged?
23:01  * preaction finds the clue-by-four. crossposting is baaad
23:01  * plainhao apologizes to preaction.
23:01 <@Haarg> a number of ways depending on what i wanted
23:01 <@Haarg> what do you want to use it on?
23:01 <@plainhao> i want to move a client project to gitosis
23:02 <@plainhao> fresh repo
23:03 <@plainhao> oops, found this, actually: http://www.ruby-forum.com/topic/154892
23:03 <@plainhao> so i'll clone and use an authors file, basically?
23:03 <@Haarg> if you want accurate author info
23:04 <@Haarg> you would want to use --no-metadata if you aren't going to use the svn repo anymore
23:04 <@Haarg> and you probably only have one branch, so it's pretty simple
23:04 <@plainhao> ok
23:05 <@plainhao> those instructions i found complicate it a bit with submodules
23:05 <@plainhao> thanks, Haarg
23:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10896 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Post.pm: Remove my old Post debug code.
23:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: doug * r10897 /WebGUI/etc/WebGUI.conf.original: fixed JSON's stupidity
23:54 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10898 /releases/WebGUI_7.6.23-stable: Release 7.6.23-stable
--- Day changed Wed May 20 2009
00:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10899 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Preparing for 7.6.24 dev
00:34 < SDuensin> Man, going from 7.6.21 to 7.6.23 is not going well.  Lots of missing Perl modules.
00:34 <+perlDreamer> check the gotchas, and testEnvironment.pl, SDuensin
00:34 < SDuensin> I checked Gotchas, but until it's upgraded, I won't have a new testEnvironment.
00:35 < SDuensin> I'm running webguiupdate from the WRE.
00:35 <+perlDreamer> well, there's yer first problem
00:36 < SDuensin> So far, I've needed to add Module::File and Exception::Class.
00:36 < SDuensin> Doh!  I'm doing like the docs say!
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00:37 <+perlDreamer> someone was talking with preaction about that the other day, a switch to automatically try and install missing cpan modules
00:38 < SDuensin> Shouldn't be too hard.  testEnvironment does it.
00:41 <+perlDreamer> you should have needed Exception::Class a long time ago
00:41 <+perlDreamer> it's used by the Shop
00:41 < SDuensin> Um.  Oops?  Dunno about that.
00:44 < SDuensin> This is f'ed up.
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01:22 < tavisto_> perlDreamer, I went ahead and added the link to downloading the native packages on the webgui download page
01:23 <+perlDreamer> thank you, tavisto!
01:23 <+perlDreamer> I'll add that to my todo list
01:23 < tavisto_> I haven't heard from Jmarsden lately... But I do have the Debian link up on there now.
01:23 <+perlDreamer> me, either.  Nor SquOnk
01:23 < tavisto_> If you see him on here.. could you ask him how he's coming along with the Ubuntu Packages
01:23 <+perlDreamer> I will
01:23 <+perlDreamer> might be easier to track down his email address on the dev list and ask there
01:24 < tavisto_> yeah if you see anything you want me to add/change on the download page (in re: to the new Native Package section), definitely let me know. I think I used the correct lingo for everything. :)
01:24 < tavisto_> should be all set with squOnk
01:26 <+perlDreamer> I will have a look at the Native Package section
01:27  * perlDreamer has to run to meet with an HTML designer
01:27 <+perlDreamer> bbl
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01:29 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10900 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.7.5-7.7.6.pl: Fix code placement in upgrade script.
01:29 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10901 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Survey/Test.pm: Fix syntax warning with multiple my's.
01:29 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10902 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/FilePump/Admin.pm: Fix bad POD in FilePump/Admin.pm
01:29 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10903 /WebGUI/t/Shop/Pay.t: Update this test to account for the new driver.
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02:52 <+perlDreamer> SynQ!
02:52 <+perlDreamer> How are you?
03:10 <+perlDreamer> Haarg: I've tracked down the tests that are leaking email info in 7.7
03:11 <+perlDreamer> there are two so far
04:00 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10904 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: Add mailQueue tracking to WEBGUI_TEST_DEBUG
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10905 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Post/permission.t: Prevent emails from being sent out during the creation of assets.
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10906 /WebGUI/t/Asset/Post/Thread/permission.t: In Thread tests, too.
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10907 /WebGUI/t/Inbox.t: Prevent Inbox from making emails during testing.
04:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10908 /WebGUI/t/Workflow/Activity/NotifyAboutLowStock.t: Clean up queued email created when the inbox message is added.
04:24 <+perlDreamer> make that 4 leaky tests
04:24  * perlDreamer is starting to see the need for a session level set of testing variables to prevent side-effect behavior
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04:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10909 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: Always delete fresh copies of cached objects...
04:52 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10910 /WebGUI/t/Asset/File/GalleryFile/Photo/permissions.t: Clean up changes to admin user, who has no friends.
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05:25 <+perlDreamer> you can type some very odd things while trying to squash an ant on your keyboard
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05:36 <+perlDreamer> whoa!
05:36 <+perlDreamer> howdy, PB-type people?
05:36 <+perlDreamer> do any of you happen to know why the Thread does not clean up its subscriptionGroup when it is purged?
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06:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: daviddelikat * r10911 /WebGUI/ (7 files in 6 dirs): added EMS Schedule table
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06:23 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10912 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/Test.pm: Make sure that we don't delete things that have already been deleted.
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06:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10913 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/Asset/Post/Thread.pm docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt): Cleanup thread subscription groups during purge.
06:37 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10914 /WebGUI/t/Asset/ (Post/permission.t Post.t): Cleanup in Post tests. Set skipNotification to prevent emails from being queued during the tests.
06:38 -!- Radix_ changed the topic of #webgui to:  [ 7.6.23-stable | 7.7.6-beta | WRE 0.9.1 ] Before you ask, check the wiki: http://wiki.webgui.org | Pastebin: http://webgui.pastebin.com/
06:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10915 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/ (lib/WebGUI/Asset/Post/Thread.pm docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt): Backport Thread subscriptionGroup cleanup
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07:09 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10916 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/ (7 files in 7 dirs): Backporting test clean-up for groups, mails and versionTags from HEAD.
07:12 < perlDreamer1> whoa!
07:12 < perlDreamer1> prove -j 2
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07:17 < perlDreamer1> Haarg: prove -j 2 cuts the test time in half
07:17 < perlDreamer1> no changes to anything in the tests
07:17 < perlDreamer1> however, one test is failing that used to pass
07:17 < perlDreamer1> t/AdSpace/Ad.t
07:22 < perlDreamer1> aha, it's failing because I reused the name of the AdSpace in both Ad.t and AdSpace.t
07:34 < perlDreamer1> easily fixed
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07:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10917 /WebGUI/t/AdSpace/Ad.t: Use different names so there is no clash when running tests in parallel.
07:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10918 /branch/WebGUI_7.6/t/AdSpace/Ad.t: Backport parallelization support.
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13:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: translation * r10919 /translations/French/French/ (WebGUI.pm WebGUIProfile.pm): Update from translation server
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13:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10920 /WebGUI/ (2 files in 2 dirs): 
13:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Made Survey upgrades conditional in upgrade script because my 7.7.6 upgrades got
13:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: committed halfway through the release process.
13:38 < CIA-23> WebGUI: patspam * r10921 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/ (Survey/ResponseJSON.pm Survey.pm): Fixed Survey bug in handling of logical sections
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16:09 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10922 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (i18n/English/TaxDriver_EU.pm Shop/TaxDriver/EU.pm): Fixed missing i18n and some POD and a bug in the javascript for the admin screen of the EU tax plugin.
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17:39 < CIA-23> WebGUI: martin * r10923 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/ (i18n/English/TaxDriver_EU.pm Shop/TaxDriver/EU.pm): Fixed usability issue in vat number manager.
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18:03 <+perlDreamer> Morning, folks
18:04 <+MrHairgrease> howdy perldreamer
18:04 <+perlDreamer> Any news from Bart yet?
18:04 <+perlDreamer> by now, I figured he's raided 3 other boats looking for beer
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18:09 <+MrHairgrease> rumours are that piracy has spreaded from Somalian wters to the North Sea
18:09 <+MrHairgrease> aparently the ransom demands are on the order of 10 cases of beer
18:16 <+perlDreamer> I offered to loan him my fleet of robot sharks, but he declined
18:17 <+perlDreamer> muttered something about traditional values
18:19 <+MrHairgrease> yeah, he only like sharks w/o lasers
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18:22 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, is we add App::Prove to the WRE, we can get access to the magical -j switch
18:22 <+perlDreamer> which will let you run tests in parallel
18:26 <@Haarg> hmm
18:27 <@Haarg> i guess i was thinking that was already in there
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18:27 <@Haarg> where are we getting prove from without it?  or does is it not included?
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18:28 <+perlDreamer> there's a default prove that comes with Test::More, I believe
18:28 <+perlDreamer> prove --help will display the available switches
18:28 <+perlDreamer> it recommends -j 9
18:28 <@Haarg> Test::More doesn't come with prove
18:28 <+perlDreamer> hm
18:29 <@Haarg> must be in core
18:29 <+perlDreamer> it comes with Test::Harness
18:29 <@Haarg> the other thing though is that running tests in parallel probably won't work most of the time
18:29 <+perlDreamer> it did last night
18:29 <@Haarg> for the same reason we have problems with leaky tests
18:30 <+perlDreamer> there are far fewer leaky tests today, but you're right
18:30 <@Haarg> well, maybe most of the time isn't the right thing to say
18:30 <+perlDreamer> no, but I understand what you mean
18:30 <+perlDreamer> clashes/leaks will be random, depending on which tests run at the same time
18:31 <+perlDreamer> anyway, last night I tried -j2, and it cut the test time in half
18:31 <@Haarg> yeah
18:31 <+perlDreamer> came across one test with clashes Ad/AdSpace and fixed that one
18:31 <+perlDreamer> we'll find more with --random -j2
18:31 <@Haarg> yeah
18:32 <@Haarg> we could probably eliminate a lot of the cases where tests would clash, but i'm not sure we could get rid of all of them
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18:54 <+perlDreamer> Haarg, maybe we're better off using Test::Aggregate then for test acceleration, and make reducing test clashes a low priority background task
18:55 <@Haarg> seems like that would be a simpler way to go
18:55 <@Haarg> i haven't tried, but i should do a run through with test::aggregate
18:55 <@Haarg> i'm sure there would be plenty of failures, but it would probably show what kind of speed difference we were looking at
19:00 <+perlDreamer> yeah, there's going to be a lot of failures at first
19:00 <+perlDreamer> but as we pull code out
19:00 <+perlDreamer> from END blocks into auto cleaners
19:00 <+perlDreamer> or use the teardown methods provided by Test::Aggregate
19:00 <+perlDreamer> it'll get better
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19:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10924 /WebGUI/ (3 files in 3 dirs): 
19:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Fix bugs in the default story archive template (pagination bar) and
19:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI: the subtitle in the Story.
19:58 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10925 /WebGUI/t/supporting_collateral/ShawshankRedemptionMoviePoster.jpg: More testing collateral.
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21:23 <+perlDreamer> can anyone think of a good reason that Storage should not have a getHexId method?
21:23 <+perlDreamer> that caches
21:26 <@Haarg> what would the purpose of it be?
21:27 <+perlDreamer> it would get rid of the hexId being calculated time and time again through out Storage.pm
21:27 <@Haarg> it only gets calculated on create though doesn't it?
21:27 <+perlDreamer> not anymore :)
21:28 <+perlDreamer> You should review the new CDN code
21:28 <@Haarg> probably
21:28 <@rizen> yeah, we should probably do that
21:28 <@Haarg> was looking at 7.6 code
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21:36 <@Haarg> so yes i would agree it should have a method for that
21:36 <@Haarg> especially since it generates the hex id when you create the storage location anyway
21:36 <@Haarg> for new sites at least
21:40 <+perlDreamer> yup, built and almost tested
21:44 <+perlDreamer> committed
21:44 <+perlDreamer> 10926
21:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10926 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Storage.pm t/Storage.t): 
21:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Add a method to Storage to return the hex value of the storageId.
21:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Add a test for it.
21:53 < CIA-23> WebGUI: Convert Storage to use that everywhere, instead of calculating and recalculating it.
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22:10 < CIA-23> WebGUI: colin * r10927 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): Fix a FilePump bug in handling file URIs that are directories.
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23:08 < CIA-23> WebGUI: graham * r10928 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/User.pm: don't query the database for profile field existance on every access
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23:26 <+perlDreamer> stoopid wifi connection
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04:07 <+patspam> word
04:08 <+patspam> you in da house jt?
04:08 <@rizen> i'm in my house
04:08 <@rizen> not your house
04:08 <+patspam> I'm not either, I'm at my parents' house
04:08 <@rizen> hehe
04:09 <@rizen> then it would be really funny if i was in your house
04:09 <@rizen> and you aren't
04:09 <@rizen> what's up?
04:09 <+patspam> my housemates would be confused :)
04:09 <+patspam> but as long as you said webgui lots of times they'd feel re-assured
04:09 <@rizen> hehe
04:10 <+patspam> crud_createTable and upgrade scripts
04:10 <+patspam> is problematic, yes?
04:11 <@rizen> why is it problematic?
04:11 <+patspam> because upgrade-7.7.5-7.7.6.pl could do different things depending on whether it is run on 7.7.6 codebase or 7.7.7 codebase
04:12 <@rizen> nope
04:12 <@rizen> you're wrong and you don't even know it
04:12 <@rizen> how does it feel to be so wrong?
04:13 <+patspam> surprisingly enjoyable!
04:13 <+patspam> because I'm about to learn something :)
04:13 <@rizen> ok, here's the deal
04:13 <@rizen> in 7.x so far
04:13 <@rizen> sorry
04:13 <@rizen> i mean 7.7.x
04:13 <@rizen> every upgrade
04:13 <@rizen> must be applied one after the other
04:13 <@rizen> not ina  big lump
04:13 <@rizen> you can't go from 7.7.1 to 7.7.7
04:14 <@rizen> you must do 7.7.1 => 7.7.2 => 7.7.3 => 7.7.4 and os on
04:14 <@rizen> so on
04:14 <@rizen> this isn't just because of WebGUI::Crud
04:14 <@rizen> there are all sorts of API additions that will go kablooey
04:14 <@rizen> if you don't
04:14 <@rizen> this should have been in the gotcha's file
04:14 <@rizen> but it wasn't
04:14 <@rizen> recently i added it
04:14 <@rizen> so if you're working on subversion
04:15 <@rizen> then you should see it in the gotcha's file
04:15 <+patspam> yeah i guess any api access from the upgrade script has that potential
04:15 <+patspam> but it is a bit of a pain in the bum
04:15 <@rizen> so while you're technically correct that it does cause a problem
04:15 <@rizen> it's only a problem if you don't do the upgrades as directed
04:15 <@rizen> and
04:15 <@rizen> once we do the migration script from 7.6 to 7.7, it won't be a problem
04:16 <@rizen> because it will work just like any other webgui upgrade
04:16 <@rizen> upgrade to the latest 7.6 version
04:16 <@rizen> and then upgrade to 7.7.x
04:16 <@rizen> all in one go
04:17 <@rizen> we have an idea on how to prevent this from being a problem in the future
04:17 <@rizen> we've just never had time to implement it
04:17 <+patspam> i was hoping you'd say that
04:17 <+patspam> LIFT?
04:17 <@rizen> the idea is a side project we call LIFT
04:17 <@rizen> yes
04:17 <@rizen> what it does is upgrade the code one step at a time with the upgrade scripts
04:18 <@rizen> so we release our upgrades as a series of patch files
04:18 <@rizen> rather than a whole release
04:19 <+patspam> nice.. a git backend might work well there
04:20 <@rizen> nothing works well there
04:20 <@rizen> that's why it hasn't been done yet
04:20 <@rizen> there are too many ways for it to go terribly terribly wrong
04:20 <@rizen> and we need it to be nasa safe
04:20 <@rizen> we need it to be safer than nasa safe
04:20 <+patspam> yup, which is why i suggested git
04:20 <@rizen> no
04:21 <@rizen> git doesn't give us anything
04:21 <@rizen> i'm sorry, i should say, it doesn't give us anything to solve the problem
04:22 <+patspam> a git repo is a collection of patches, distributed in a very economical fashion, with some machinery wrapped around it that knows how to handle most of the different ways you want to apply those patches
04:22 <+patspam> and it knows most failure situations, and is very hard to break
04:23 <@rizen> dude, i know wtf git is
04:23 <@rizen> the problem isn't distributing patches
04:23 <@rizen> any idiot can do that
04:23 <@rizen> and maybe git does it better than most
04:24 <@rizen> we identified a list of like 20 problems with this sytem
04:24 <@rizen> the biggest is that users fuck stuff up
04:24 <@rizen> users like to apply their own patches
04:24 <@rizen> that will break the patching system
04:24 <@rizen> it will create a conflict
04:24 <@rizen> and then the user will be sitting there with a site that can't go backward
04:24 <@rizen> or forward
04:25 <@rizen> without some real technical expertise
04:25 <@rizen> no offense, but you are sitting over there working in a nearly idealic environment
04:25 <+patspam> yeah, and ok i don't know the design of LIFT, but again that's why i was thinking git.. custom patches can be branches, or even commits on the same branch, you could use git to merge at that point
04:26 <@rizen> you are the only one who has access to your servers
04:26 <@rizen> and your code
04:26 <@rizen> or i should say your company is
04:26 <@rizen> your clients don't get in there and muck with stuff
04:26 <@rizen> ours do
04:26 <@rizen> and they break stuff
04:27 <@rizen> git isn't some magic pill that solves world hunger man
04:27 <+patspam> sure it is!
04:27 <@rizen> it's a version control system that's all
04:27 <@rizen> another thing our clients do is a hell of a lot of backporting
04:28 <@rizen> which makes the upgrade process break like crazy
04:28 <@rizen> git's not going to solve that
04:28 <@rizen> even if it's capable of resolving the code problems
04:28 <+patspam> yeah, that's one thing i do too on my own servers
04:28 <@rizen> it's not going to resolve the fact that the database already has certain tables and fields that the upgrade isn't expecting it to have
04:29 <+patspam> yeah, it won't help with the db
04:29 <@rizen> git certainly can be "part" of the solution
04:29 <@ri