--- Log opened Mon Oct 01 00:00:33 2007
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00:31 < wgGuest57> Hi, I tried logging into my account plainblack.com/support but it told me that my permission was denied...
00:31 < wgGuest57> Can someone help me out?
00:32 <@preaction> this isn't really a plainblack help channel, but i can help you
00:32 <@preaction> what's your account name?
00:33 < wgGuest57> cryogas1
00:33 <@preaction> ok, give me a couple minutes to pull it up
00:33 < wgGuest57> well, i tried logging in because i'm trying to set up email accounts on the plainblack server, so i figured the support page would help me out
00:34 <@rizen> you are not in any support group
00:35 <@rizen> if you believe this is an error, you need to contact info@plainblack.com
00:38 < wgGuest57> Oh...
00:39 < wgGuest57> Is there any chance one of you two would be able to help me setting up e-mail accounts on the plainblack server?
00:39 <@preaction> i don't even know how
00:40 <@rizen> i know how, but i have no way to verify who you are or what privileges you have, so until that is verified i can't help you
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00:40 <@rizen> you should be listed as a hoster
00:40 <@rizen> if you are
00:40 <@rizen> but since you're not
00:40 <@rizen> i can't help
00:46 < wgGuest57> I can't provide any information for identification?
00:47 <@rizen> not to us
00:47 <@rizen> only to info@plainblack.com
00:47 < wgGuest57> But the likelihood of getting a response before tomorrow would be pretty low, yes?
00:48 <@rizen> yes
00:48 <@rizen> that doesn't change the fact that we can't help you
00:48 <@rizen> we both want to help you
00:48 <@rizen> we can't
00:48 <@rizen> we don't deal with billing issues
00:48 <@rizen> which is what this is
00:48 < wgGuest57> Well
00:48 < wgGuest57> We signed up, I just seem to have forgotten the account I bought hosting with
00:50 < wgGuest57> And...I tried to retrive a password in hopes of retrieving the username as well, but we just pointed the DNS elsewhere on friday, so I have no access to my email account
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02:17 < wgGuest68> I'm sorry to be such a bother, would one of you be able to provide me with the numerical IP of the plainblack server?
02:20 <@preaction> which plainblack server?
02:20 <@preaction> and there are utilities on your computer that do that for you
02:20 <@preaction> *nix: host or dig; windows: nslookup
02:22 < wgGuest68> uh, cold.plainblack.com
02:22 <@preaction> perlbot host cold.plainblack.com
02:23 <@preaction> oops
02:23 <@preaction> perlbot host a cold.plainblack.com
02:23 < perlbot> cold.plainblack.com has address 67.15.42.44
02:24 < wgGuest68> alright, I just wanted to be sure
02:24 < wgGuest68> thanks
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07:07 <+snapcount> in retrospect... running a script that is going to add 30K assets to a site under one version tag was probably a bad idea
07:08 <+snapcount> spectre is not going to be happy with me
07:10 <@rizen> i'm not sure, but i don't think i accounted for such a version tag
07:10 <+snapcount> lol
07:10 <@rizen> i guess i should have
07:11 <+snapcount> no... I should probably be doing my stuff a little smarter
07:11 <+snapcount> there's no reason I couldn't break the commits up
07:11 <+snapcount> but since it's running... I guess I'll see what happens =)
07:13 <+snapcount> Basically, the script is pulling from an external db with states, cities, facilities in a city and detail about each facility
07:13 <+snapcount> and creating a page for each facility with it's city and state as parent layouts
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07:28 <+snapcount> moment of truth...
07:47 <@rizen> so what is the truth?
07:47 <+snapcount> holy shit
07:47 <+snapcount> it finished
07:47 <+snapcount> let me check the site and see if it still lives
07:47 <@rizen> nice. i guess i'm smarter than i thought
07:50 <+snapcount> it worked
07:50 <+snapcount> all the content is there, at least from random spot checks
07:50 <+snapcount> would take a while to verify each one =)
07:51 <@rizen> congratulations. you have just committed the largest version tag in history. at least that i'm aware of.
07:51 <+snapcount> sweet
07:52 <+snapcount> I'll have to make myself a t-shirt or something
07:52 <+snapcount> "I committed the largest version tag in WebGUI history and all I got was this stupid t-shirt"
07:53 <@rizen> and people would actually like that shirt if you were coming to the wuc
07:53 <@rizen> but i think the general public would be like "huh?"
07:54 <+snapcount> they're like that for most of the shirts I wear now anyway
07:54 <@rizen> i c
08:03 <+snapcount> I guess the commit didn't finish entirely
08:04 <+snapcount> but the tag is showing up so I just clicked commit again
08:04 <+snapcount> see if it gets another chunk
08:37 <+snapcount> I think I'm watching the "Don't tase me bro" special on COPS
08:38 <+snapcount> they've got like 6 people in one episode
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09:25 <+snapcount> cool it finished
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13:04 < xdanger> Shouldn't the getContentLastModified function be overwriten in Collaboration to return ~ select max(revisionDate) from assetData where asset.lineage like '".$self->getLineage."%' ?
13:07 < xdanger> IE is showing "old" version of a layout page that has a news-listing done with collaboration... I've even overwriten the headers to disable caching in the browser, but IE still caches them... Only the last-modified header is something that doesn't change...
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14:14 < AMH_mari> @xdanger:you might try  flushing the WebGUI cache (accessible from admin console).
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18:01 <@rizen> xdanger, you're probably right, it should
18:01 <@rizen> submit a bug report
18:05 < AMH_mari> @rizen: following up last friday's discussion, this weekend took a look at the WebGUI macro parser and think I have a suggestion to improve it: instead of recursing with the whole parameter string and then separating into parameters, first separate parameters and then recurse for each parameter separately. The amended 7.4.8-final Macro.pm source can be found at: http://www.xs4all.nl/~tartarus/cabinet/Macro.pm .Did not have time to test it very 
18:08 <@rizen> please post it as an RFE. I won't have time to review anything until after the WUC.
18:08 <@rizen> why would it be faster to parse each parameter separately?
18:08 < AMH_mari> Not faster but more robust.
18:08 < AMH_mari> (in handling commas and quotes in nested calls).
18:10 <@rizen> more robust is good, but i can't accept more robust without it being at least as fast as it is
18:10 <@rizen> have you performed any time trials?
18:10 < AMH_mari> Will post it as an RFE; forgot the time, have to go home now, regards.
18:10 < AMH_mari> No time trials yet, can have a look this evening.
18:10 <@rizen> ok
18:11 <@rizen> thanks
18:11 < AMH_mari> cu
18:11 <@rizen> bye
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19:14 < danny_mk> Hello everyone!  cap10morgan, I won't be able to make the WUC so it is up to you to build up the hype on OpenId :-)
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19:19 <@rizen> man you really know how to kill a crowd
19:19 <@rizen> just kidding =)
19:19 <+MrHairgrease> so much for the openId hype
19:27 <+MrHairgrease> rizen
19:27 <+MrHairgrease> what is or used to be the group with gid=5
19:30 <@rizen> no idea
19:30 <@rizen> the only ones i keep track of are 1,2,3,7,and12
19:30 <@rizen> the rest are basically irrelevant
19:31 <+MrHairgrease> i ask because somehow in a site i'm working on
19:31 <+MrHairgrease> the admin group is in group 5
19:31 <+MrHairgrease> which does not exist
19:32 <+MrHairgrease> making it impossible to add users to the admin group
19:32 <+MrHairgrease> on the demo site it works fine though
19:33 <@rizen> i have that group grouping on plainblack.com
19:34 <@rizen> but it doesn't seem to affect anything
19:34 <+MrHairgrease> can you do this:
19:35 <+MrHairgrease> admin console -> groups -> admin -> add users to group
19:35 <+MrHairgrease> manage users in group
19:35 <+MrHairgrease> then select some user and click safe
19:36 <@rizen> worked fine
19:36 <+MrHairgrease> ok
19:36 <+MrHairgrease> i'm working with a half patched system here (the one on which i discovered the group->new bug)
19:37 <+MrHairgrease> so it could be that not everything is taken care of
19:37 <+MrHairgrease> i'll check the svn logs
19:37 <+MrHairgrease> still that grouping being there is not correct i it?
19:37 <@Haarg> i think i changed something in addition to your patch that would have effected that
19:38 <+MrHairgrease> or do you actually have a gourp with gid=5
19:38 <+MrHairgrease> haarg: yes
19:38 <+MrHairgrease> i think so too =)
19:38 <@rizen> we don't have a group with an id of 5
19:38 <@rizen> and yes, that orphan should be cleaned up
19:39 <+MrHairgrease>  delete from groupGroupings where inGroup not in (select distinct groupId from groups);
19:39 <+MrHairgrease> that cleans it
19:40 <+MrHairgrease> and fixes my problem
19:41 <@rizen> you shouldn't even need the "distinct" clause in there
19:41 <+MrHairgrease> prolly not
19:42 <+MrHairgrease> just a habit
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22:31 < dj_perl> Hello preaction, where would I find some docs to get started developing an asset to connect with Photo Gallery?
22:32 <@preaction> uhm... an asset? i can give you a UML diagram, though currently subject to change. there's a meeting in 30 minutes with the dev team to lock down the API
22:33 < dj_perl> Well, where do I start developing? There has to be some documentation ( other than the UML diagram ).
22:34 <@rizen> dj_perl, you're going to need to set up your web services to just stand alone as dummies right now
22:34 < dj_perl> I'll be developing a server-side application, to which the iPhoto/Picasa plugin will talk? right?
22:34 <@preaction> like what? currently for documentaton we have the Functional Specification, the UML diagram, the ERD, and a workflow diagram
22:35 <@rizen> i've given you the data / method dictionary, the workflow diagram
22:35 <@rizen> i could also send you the functional spec
22:35 <@preaction> i don't think the funcspec would be of much use really, but the more info the better
22:35 <@rizen> but beyond that, there's nothing built yet. dev starts on it this week
22:35 < dj_perl> I was hoping for a copy of the primer.
22:35 <@rizen> the CM primer?
22:35 <@rizen> that's only for using webgui
22:35 < dj_perl> WebGUI primer
22:35 <@rizen> there's no dev docs there
22:36 <@rizen> the primer is for basic webgui usage
22:36 <@rizen> end user level stuff
22:36 <@preaction> your best bet for developer information is the community wiki
22:36 <@preaction> and the included perldoc
22:38 < dj_perl> ok, thanks.
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23:10 <+MrHairgrease> is it october 17th yet?
23:11 <@preaction> not yet
23:17 <@rizen> it needs to hurry up and get here
23:18 <+MrHairgrease> is it October 17 th yet?
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02:57 < cap10morgan> I'm probably going to be implementing a new concept into WebGUI for our requirements, but I want to see if there's some way to do it such that it would have a more generally useful application:
02:57 < cap10morgan> For our use, I need to be able to associate a "campaign" with every piece of content on the site
02:59 <@preaction> content profiling?
03:04 < cap10morgan> these campaigns come from an external source, and i want to label it w/ the name of the campaign but store the id of the thing
03:04 < cap10morgan> so i want to be able to define an external data source for it
03:04 < cap10morgan> and also make this property inheritable
03:05 < cap10morgan> so it's similar to a custom metadata field
03:05 < cap10morgan> but it needs the inheritance and external data source thing added in
03:05 < cap10morgan> the external thing could just be specifying a snippet that lists the options in some format
03:05 < cap10morgan> since that way you could do a web services client, an sql report, a macro, or whatever
03:06 < cap10morgan> preaction: content profiling == metadata, no?
03:07 <@preaction> yes
03:08 < cap10morgan> does that seem like it would be a generally useful thing?
03:08 < cap10morgan> or a ridiculous over-complication of metadata?
03:16 <@preaction> it sounds interesting, but i dont' know if it will be generally useful
03:16 <@preaction> i mean, most people don't even use the existing metadata / content-profiling system
03:20 <+snapcount> any network nerds present
03:20 <+snapcount> I'm rusty
03:21 <+snapcount> need someone to check me on something
03:22 <+snapcount> the subnet mask for 16 addresses would be 255.255.255.240 right?
03:25 <+snapcount> 2^(32-28) = 16 so 16 addresses... so the first 28 bits in the mask are 1
03:29 < nuba> yeah, 16 addresses, but the first is the network's, the last is the network's broadcast
03:29 <+snapcount> so 14
03:29 <+snapcount> usable
03:31 < nuba> yeah, well, youre using the other two too, in a way
03:31 <+snapcount> indeed
03:31 <+snapcount> thanks
03:31 < nuba> np
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16:57 <+MrHairgrease> hi
16:57 < ascii> hi
16:57 <@rizen> bye
16:58 <+MrHairgrease> does anybody know if it is possible to add a cs to an event in th ecalendar?
16:58 <+MrHairgrease> or at least provide a means for people to add something to that event?
16:58 <+MrHairgrease> like their name
16:59 <@rizen> can't be done currently
16:59 <@rizen> sounds like you want to do an evite sort of thing
16:59 <@rizen> is that correct?
16:59 <@rizen> comments and a yes/no/maybe i'm attending
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> what somebody at th ekoornbeurs wants is this
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> that
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> band X plays there at that time
17:00 <@rizen> that's on the todo list for calendar, but it doesn't exist yet
17:00 <+MrHairgrease> ok
17:00 <+MrHairgrease> maybe I'm willing to make that
17:00 <+MrHairgrease> is there already a spec?
17:01 <@rizen> evite.com
17:01 <@rizen> that's the functional spec
17:01 <@rizen> we don't have a technical spec for it yet
17:01 <+MrHairgrease> ok
17:02 <+MrHairgrease> we'll have a talk about it at the wuc then
17:02 <@rizen> okily dokily neighbor
17:02 <+MrHairgrease> I don't have time to spend on that before anyway
17:02 <+MrHairgrease> doh!
17:02 <@rizen> i'll buy you a beer at the great dane, and you can tell me about your problems
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17:15 < dionak> hey guys. i'm having a permission problem i'm trying to understand. we have a group created in WG and a sqlform that has permissions set that this group can edit, view and submit records. However, a user that isn't an admin and is part of that group is getting a blank form. no data is being populated. 
17:16 < dionak> i checked the template but there's no tmpl_if statement around the completeForm variable that would prevent population
17:16 < dionak> when i search, i get data b/c i'm an admin
17:19 <@rizen> no idea
17:19 <@rizen> describe the problem as best as you can in a bug report
17:19 <@rizen> we're hoping to clean up 100% of the bugs wre/pb.com/webgui by the wuc
17:20 <+MrHairgrease> dionak
17:20 < dionak> ok. i'll review the code a little first to see if i can find what the issue is. 
17:20 <+MrHairgrease> the group with edit rights should be all powerful
17:20 < dionak> that's what i was thinking...
17:21 <+MrHairgrease> the _canAlterTable and _canEditRecord in addition to canEdit and canView
17:21 <+MrHairgrease> are used to detrmine th eprivs
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17:21 <+MrHairgrease> both the private methods return true for sure if canEdit is true
17:21 <+MrHairgrease> did you commit the sqlform?
17:22 < dionak> yes. it's all committed
17:22 <+MrHairgrease> does flushing the cache help?
17:22 < dionak> let me try...
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17:23 < dionak> hm, no. same thing. 
17:24 < dionak> one of those methods must be returning false for some reason. 
17:25 <+MrHairgrease> what's going wrong
17:25 <+MrHairgrease> adding/editing records?
17:25 <+MrHairgrease> or the search?
17:25 < dionak> search
17:25 <+MrHairgrease> that should use canView
17:25 < dionak> the user doesn't have a reason to add/edit so we haven't tried that. 
17:25 <+MrHairgrease> which is fully inherited
17:25 <+MrHairgrease> stupid question maybe
17:26 <+MrHairgrease> is the user in the group?
17:26 < dionak> yes. does the group only need permission for the sqlform in question or is there a hierarchy i'm overlooking?
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> just the asset
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> it's weird though
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> www_search should return the insufficient privs if canView is false
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> but a blank screen is smething different
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> nothing in the webgui.log?
17:27 < dionak> oh, it's just a blank form
17:28 < dionak> not populated with data
17:28 < dionak> the screen has the template and everything as expected. just no data
17:28 <+MrHairgrease> oh
17:28 <+MrHairgrease> but you can search right?
17:29 < dionak> i can as my user. 
17:29 <+MrHairgrease> and you do get the right results
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17:29 < dionak> yes
17:29 <+MrHairgrease> it's just that whatever you typed in the search box disappears from that box after you've submitted the form
17:29 <+MrHairgrease> right?
17:31 < dionak> actually, it's a little more complex but i'm testing by pasting in the correct url for a record in the search results. like recordId=something;viewOnly=0 etc..
17:31 < dionak> i get data and the user doesn't. let me poke around a little more....
17:31 <+MrHairgrease> ok
17:32 < dionak> thanks for chiming in and trying to help. :)
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18:48 < dionak> ok. i found my issue. it wasn't a WG permission issue. 
18:48 < dionak> IE6 is dropping parameters on a meta refresh, which is why the form is blank. there's no recordId to return data form
18:48 < dionak> form = for
18:49 <@rizen> yikes
18:49 < dionak> yea...i'm going to create a quick test case to verify it's a "feature" and test on IE7
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18:55 < dionak> hm. on IE6 it keeps the params if I change the semi-colon param separator to &amp;
18:55 < dionak> can i use &amp; instead of semi-colons in WG?
18:56 <+MrHairgrease> when seperating form params in a post you can either use & or ;
18:56 <+MrHairgrease> i think the ampersand is being deprecated
18:57 < dionak> i think that might make a redirect with multiple params impossible to do in IE6.
18:58 < dionak> i would rather not see that happen. 
19:00 < dionak> on another note, has anyone used HTML::Template::Expr successfully? 
19:01 <@rizen> we aren't the ones deprecating the use of &
19:01 <@rizen> it's the W3C
19:02 < dionak> oh, really? i hadn't read that. 
19:02 < dionak> wow
19:02 <@rizen> WebGUI still supports both, and will continue to do so until the W3C says otherwise
19:02 < dionak> replacing it with what? 
19:02 <@rizen> ;
19:02 < dionak> ok, cool. thanks for clarifying
19:02 <@rizen> HTML::Template::Expr is used by my design staff all the time
19:02 <@rizen> they love it
19:03 < dionak> cool. we're trying to set it up. 
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19:04 <@rizen> just remember that with that all variable names that have a . are changed to use _
19:05 < dionak> ah, a very important detail! :)
19:08 < dionak> i'm hoping IE6 will die before W3C deprecates the &
19:08 < dionak> or just die a very sudden death. :)
19:09 <@rizen> i've read that as of XHTML2 HTML5 it will be deprecated
19:09 <@rizen> or rather removed
19:09 <@rizen> it's already deprecated
19:09 <@rizen> however, i'm guessing that most browsers will continue to support it for a very long time after that
19:11 < dionak> yes, that would make sense. it would break a lot of the internet sites otherwise. I read that part of the HTML5 projects values was to not break too far from convention so as to be backwards compatible. 
19:11 < dionak> i sometimes debate switching back to HTML4
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01:35 < xootom> is anyone familiar with the dashboard? in userProfileData I have three columns, guidcontentPositions, one of which is the guid of the dashboard on my site. Are the other two old deleted dashboards, that I can drop?
01:38 <@preaction> the dashboard's purge method didn't remove them for you?
01:41 < xootom> no but they might have been there since 7.3.20 ish
01:41 < xootom> could they be anything else or are they definitely old dashboards
01:45 < xootom> anyone know where the default dashboard layout is stored, is it the guest user's value for contentPositions?
01:48 < xootom> i think i've hit a limit in the way contentPositions are stored, as varchar 255 characters... that only holds 11 guids, my dashboard is now randomly hiding and positioning things :(
01:53 < MrHairgrease> that should be a text field
01:53 < MrHairgrease> you should file a bug report
01:53 < MrHairgrease> anyway
01:54 < MrHairgrease> time to go to bed
01:54 < MrHairgrease> see ya
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01:55 <@preaction> yes it should be a text field, and yes, currently the Visitor profile stores the default content positions for a dashboard
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02:09 < xootom> many thanks
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15:55 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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17:06 <@rizen> salutations
17:06 <@khenn> greeting
17:07 <@khenn> s
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18:25 <@rizen> bug --
19:28 <@rizen> bug--
19:28 <@rizen> bug--
19:30 < ascii> !
19:31 <@rizen> bang?
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19:34 < ascii> guess that could be appropriate for $bug--, but i use it for hello mostly
19:34 <@rizen> i c
19:34 <@rizen> well hello then
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21:50 <+MrHairgrease> snapcount!
21:50 <+MrHairgrease> you're back!
21:51 <+snapcount> yep
21:51 <+snapcount> I'm revived
21:51 <+MrHairgrease> what happened?
21:51 <+snapcount> I've been traveling far away lands searching for my true self
21:51 <+snapcount> =)
21:51 <+MrHairgrease> sure
21:51 < khenn_> did you find Buddah?
21:51 <+snapcount> lol
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21:51 <+snapcount> nope, not yet
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21:52 <+MrHairgrease> are you coming to the wuc too?
21:52 <+snapcount> no not this year... sold out too fast
21:52 <+snapcount> but that's awesome
21:52 <+MrHairgrease> too bad
21:52 <+MrHairgrease> yeah it is
21:52 <+snapcount> I should just fly up there and stalk the conference
21:53 <+snapcount> be "that guy"
21:53 <+snapcount> hehe
21:53 <+MrHairgrease> you should bring your raincoat
21:53 <+snapcount> I was just thinking that
21:53 <@Khenn> you'll be the guy in the "All your base are belong to us" shirt eh?
21:53 <+MrHairgrease> and a newspaper with a tiny peephole in it
21:53 <+MrHairgrease> hehe
21:53 <+snapcount> Khenn: yep
21:53 <+snapcount> or something even dorkier
21:55 <@rizen> bug --
21:55 <+snapcount> nice
21:55 <+MrHairgrease> where can i buy those?
21:56 <@rizen> thinkgeek.com
21:56 <@Khenn> http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts/gaming/3777/
21:57 <@Khenn> rizen will be the one in this shirt: http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts/frustrations/58f5/
21:57 <+MrHairgrease> khenn
21:58 <+MrHairgrease> stop giving me metal pictures
21:58 <+MrHairgrease> mental*
21:58 <@Khenn> I guess it is sort of close to bedtime for you
21:58 <@Khenn> sweet dreams =p
21:58 <+MrHairgrease> no
21:58 <+MrHairgrease> it's only 9pm
21:59 <+MrHairgrease> but the idea sticks
21:59  * MrHairgrease shudders
22:07 <@rizen> bug --
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22:21 <@rizen> bug --
22:30 <@Haarg> bug--
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15:42 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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17:50 <@rizen> bug--
17:52 < SDuensin> cheer++
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17:54 <@Haarg> bug--
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17:54 < apeiron> Greetings!
17:55 <@rizen> i rescind bug--
17:55 <@rizen> and replace it with 
17:55 <@rizen> $bug--;
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20:18 -!- rizen changed the topic of #webgui to: [ WebGUI 7.4.8-stable | WRE 0.8.0 ]
20:18 <@rizen> $bug--;
20:56 <@rizen> $bug--;
20:57 <@rizen> $graham->decrementBugs(4);
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23:26 <@rizen> $bug--;
23:26 <@preaction> woot
23:27 <@rizen> look at the bug list
23:27 <@preaction> plan tests += 50
23:27 <@rizen> almost clean
23:27 <@rizen> only 50?
23:27 <@preaction> in order to test the photo asset i need to test the file and image assets, i haven't even gotten to the gallery/album yet
23:28 <@rizen> oh
23:28 <@rizen> nice
23:29 <@preaction> and it'll be slow going until i figure out an easy way to test the processPropertiesFromFormPost method, i don't know if Colin perfected his apr mockobject to work with uploads
23:29 <@preaction> but we're almost there
23:29 <@preaction> wait, you fixed the collab system date thing?
23:30 < ckotil> I think i found a bug in how the sql report asset is handled by the nav asset. it seems to be treated like a page layout asset and an article asset at the same time.
23:31 <@preaction> uhm? nearly all assets can have children
23:31 <@preaction> there are some exceptions with assets that don't make sense outside of certain containers, like Posts, Threads, and Events
23:31 < ckotil> yah, it might be my custom nav template... still verifying.
23:32 <@preaction> admittedly the nav asset doesn't get nearly enough information about the assets, but to do so would slow down an already slow operation
23:33 < ckotil> right,  i understand that.
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05:04 < danny_mk> Root cause: Can't use an undefined value as an ARRAY reference at /opt/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Workflow/Activity/CalendarUpdateFeeds.pm line 357.
05:05 <@Haarg> been fixed
05:05 <@Haarg> for 7.4.9
05:05 < danny_mk> ok
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19:03 < xootom> http://www.webgui.org/wg/contribute is broken at the mo
19:03 <+MrHairgrease> here too
19:03 <+MrHairgrease> just a blank page
19:04 <@rizen> i can see it
19:04 <@rizen> what browser are you looking in?
19:04 < xootom> cached?
19:04 < xootom> firefox 2.0.0.6 ubuntu
19:04 <+MrHairgrease> ff 2.0.0.6/lnux
19:04 <@rizen> just refreshed the page
19:05 <@rizen> still works
19:05 <@rizen> trying firefox now
19:05 < xootom> literally blank here
19:05 <+MrHairgrease> cleared my browser cache
19:05 <+MrHairgrease> didn't help
19:05 <@rizen> i get that in firefox too
19:05 <@rizen> i'll look into it
19:06 <@rizen> it works in safari
19:06 <@rizen> checking ie
19:06 <+MrHairgrease> konqueror fails too
19:07 <@rizen> i see the difference now
19:07 <@rizen> has nothing to do with browser
19:07 <@rizen> but whether you are logged in
19:07 <@rizen> or perhaps privs
19:07 <@rizen> on a browser where i'm not logged in i get the white page
19:07 <@rizen> but when i'm logged in it works
19:07 < xootom> yep same here
19:08 <+MrHairgrease> wget http://webgui.org/wg/contribute
19:08 <+MrHairgrease> get an empty file
19:10 <+MrHairgrease> logging in works for me too
19:10 <+MrHairgrease> but the poll is missing
19:10 <+MrHairgrease> maybe that has something to do with it?
19:11 < xootom> i guess the server logs will show the prob
19:12 <@rizen> on phone, will look when i can
19:27 <@rizen> there appears to be a problem drawing the graph
19:27 <@rizen> with graphics magic vs image magick
19:27 <@rizen> http://www.webgui.org/uploads/temp/ng/ngKG_meCXVmarTeXFYM_nw/poll_bUgyoMZc8E6irc3zZZ97Q.png
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19:37 <@rizen> fixed for now by switching back to text graph
19:37 <@rizen> reported a bug which graham and i will work on this week
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22:52 <@preaction> 7 days until the WUC!!!!!1111eleven
22:57 <@rizen> wahooO!!!!!
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23:31 <+MrHairgrease> even better
23:31 <+MrHairgrease> only 6 days till the Dutch invade!
23:32 <@rizen> we've already outfitted all the roads and airports with land mines and artillery
23:32 <+MrHairgrease> that won't help
23:32 <+MrHairgrease> we can walk over water =)
23:32 <@preaction> won't somebody please think of the children?
23:32 <+MrHairgrease> we walk over children too
23:33 <@rizen> i guess we'll need some sea mines, and robotic sentry drones
23:33 <@preaction> don't we have an extradition treaty with Dutchland or whatever?
23:34 <+MrHairgrease> I think we have unfortunately
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23:35 <@preaction> so you'll be on your BEST BEHAVIOR?
23:35 <@preaction> that's boring...
23:35 <@rizen> martin, i'm sick of preparing for the WUC at this point. can't you just come a week early and we'll get it kicked off?
23:36 <+MrHairgrease> no
23:36 <+MrHairgrease> I already have stuff planned for the weekend
23:36 <+MrHairgrease> also
23:37 <+MrHairgrease> a wuc of a week and a half is a bit much
23:37 <@khenn> If you thought it was cheap to drink in Las Vegas, wait till you go out drinking in Madison
23:37 <@khenn> you will not want to go home
23:38 <@khenn> a week and a half may not be enough =p
23:38 <@preaction> <3 wisconsin
23:38 <+MrHairgrease> ok frank
23:38 <@khenn> Wisconsin has to be nearly the cheapest place in the world to drink
23:38 <+MrHairgrease> you're on
23:39 <+MrHairgrease> i'll buy you some drinks
23:39 <@preaction> drinking contest between martin and frank?
23:39 <+MrHairgrease> pb owes me money anyway 
23:39 <@preaction> i will PAY to see this
23:39 <+MrHairgrease> who's talking about contests
23:39 <@preaction> aww...
23:39 <@khenn> I'm not competing against Martin
23:39 <@khenn> are you kidding?
23:39 <@khenn> I tried that in vegas 2 years ago
23:39 <+MrHairgrease> were you competing?
23:40 <@khenn> no
23:40 <@khenn> but I tried to keep up =p
23:40 <+MrHairgrease> I can clearly remember you said 'I'm gonna drink with the dutch guys tonight'
23:40 <+MrHairgrease> and you did well
23:40 <@khenn> I didn't do so well the next morning
23:40 <+MrHairgrease> oh
23:41 <+MrHairgrease> heh
23:41 <@preaction> American puritanism makes us soft :(
23:41 <+MrHairgrease> yeah I remember that
23:41 <@khenn> and Tavis has footage of me that is youtube material
23:41 <+MrHairgrease> more specificly
23:41 <+MrHairgrease> i clearly remember not seeying you at all
23:41 <+MrHairgrease> =)
23:41 <+MrHairgrease> so put it on youtube
23:41 <@rizen> i think len doesn't love us anymore
23:42 <+MrHairgrease> I'll be able to use it in my acme presentation
23:42 <+MrHairgrease> actually
23:42 <+MrHairgrease> len still loves you
23:42 <+MrHairgrease> but he's really busy doing parent stuff
23:43 <+MrHairgrease> i talked to him a couple of days ago
23:43 <+MrHairgrease> and he wanted to come to the wuc
23:43 <+MrHairgrease> but alas
23:43 <+MrHairgrease> no time
23:45 <@rizen> damn the parenting
23:45 <@rizen> i miss len
23:46 <+MrHairgrease> so do I
23:57 <@rizen> i want to build up the wisconsin team
23:58 <@rizen> so i think i might turn off all the mines, artillery, and robots until after you're here
23:58 <@rizen> then i can populate the wisconsin team with the former dutch team
23:58 <@rizen> =)
--- Day changed Tue Oct 09 2007
00:09 <+MrHairgrease> language question
00:09 <+MrHairgrease> i we are talking about my beer
00:09 <+MrHairgrease> should i write
00:09 <+MrHairgrease> martins beer
00:09 <+MrHairgrease> or martins' beer?
00:09 <@khenn> martin's beer
00:10 <+MrHairgrease> ok thanks
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00:24 <@preaction> is there a reason why this channel is +s (secret). it means we won't show up on a /list of channels.
00:24 <@rizen> nope
00:25 <@preaction> k
00:25 -!- mode/#webgui [-s] by preaction
00:26 <+MrHairgrease> hahahaha
00:27 <+MrHairgrease> #perl has 567 users
00:27 <+MrHairgrease> #python only a puny 502
00:28 <@preaction> check out ##Php :( and #ubuntu
00:29 <+MrHairgrease> well channel that need two hashes must uck
00:29 <+MrHairgrease> suck*
00:29 <+MrHairgrease> and what's wrong with ubuntu?
00:30 <@preaction> it's a freenode guideline, "official" project channels get one hash, "unofficial" or "about" channels get two. perl and python should have two
00:30 <@preaction> it's just huge
00:30 <@preaction> 1200 people, on release day i imagine it will grow to twice that
00:31 <+MrHairgrease> all 2400 people using ubuntu =)
00:31 <+MrHairgrease> minus one
00:31 <+MrHairgrease> b/c I don't use that channel
00:31 <+MrHairgrease> still php has only 40 user more than perl
00:32 <@preaction> huh, perl's closed the gap a bit
00:32 <+MrHairgrease> considreing all that php code that barfed around the net
00:32 <@preaction> but then the community in ##php is toxic (and that's an understatement)
00:32 <+MrHairgrease> oh really
00:32 <+MrHairgrease> let's try out that channel then
00:33 <+MrHairgrease> #perl suck anyway
00:33 <+MrHairgrease> noone uses the nick larrywall
00:34 <@preaction> merlyn (Randall L Schwartz) used to hang out in #perl for a while, but he's rather abrasive and I think the chanops finally asked him to leave
00:34 <+MrHairgrease> i guess you're right about php
00:34 <+MrHairgrease> (11:33:36 PM) Alloos2: hi, how do I take specific letters from string, example I want to take the first 6 letters in this string: thisisfoo
00:35 -!- MrHairgrease is now known as larrywall
00:35 <+larrywall> kneel before me
00:35 <+larrywall> for I have the nick!
00:35 <+larrywall> muhahahahah
00:36 -!- larrywall is now known as MrHairgrease
00:36 <+MrHairgrease> wow
00:36 <+MrHairgrease> that felt blasphemous
00:37 <@preaction> 40 Hail Larrys and 10 lashes with a Llama book
00:37 <+MrHairgrease> hmmmm, llama
00:38 <+MrHairgrease> if we can keep up this level of maturity the wuc is bound to be unforgettable
00:38 <+MrHairgrease> for better or worse
00:46  * apeiron peeks in.
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01:18 <@apeiron> yay
01:23 <@khenn> yay?
01:23 <@khenn> oh
01:23 <@khenn> ops
01:23 <@preaction> yay!
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05:00 <+crythia1> hrm
05:01 <+crythia1> anyone play java risk?
05:01 <@preaction> risk? in java?
05:01 <@preaction> ooooOOOOoooh
05:01 <+crythia1> yeah
05:01 <+crythia1> http://jrisk.sourceforge.net/download.shtml
05:01 <+crythia1> best irsk ever
05:02 <+crythia1> risk, even
05:02 <@preaction> like, online and stuffs?
05:02 <+crythia1> yeah multiplayer internet
05:02 <+crythia1> or seat shufle
05:02 <@preaction> accurate to the board game at least?
05:02 <+crythia1> yes.
05:03 <@preaction> i think that this company is going to hate you for the days of lost productivity you're about to inflict on me
05:03 <@preaction> but AWESOME
05:03 <@preaction> always, always, always take Austrailia first
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05:03 <@preaction> the extra two armies per turn quickly adds up to an unstoppable killing force!
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05:04 <+crythia1> yeah but when you hold africa or NA, it's more fun.
05:04 <+crythia1> well, I'm hosting a game right now
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05:04 <@preaction> the idea is to make a stronghold, since there's only one way into australia (through Laos)
05:05 <+crythia1> trying to get more than just the one other guy I play against.
05:06 <@preaction> not a lobby-type game?
05:06 <@preaction> give me a minute to download/install
05:06 <+crythia1> unfortunately, it doesn't have a good lobby.
05:06 <+crythia1> don't use the installer if not using Windows
05:07 <@preaction> crap
05:07 <+crythia1> well, it might work, then again...
05:07 <@apeiron> If it's "100% Pure Java", It Should [tm]
05:07 <@preaction> well i'll get both and see
05:08 <@preaction> i might have to break out my java *cough* skills *cough*
05:09 <+crythia1> we play mission.
05:09 <+crythia1> most of the time.
05:11 <@preaction> installer worked okay, what's the server?
05:12 <+crythia1> crap. it seems I have only a limited number of players.
05:12 <+crythia1> if it were, it'd be www.gwy2.org
05:14 <@khenn> preaction, you have no Java skills =p
05:14 <@preaction> liar! i've written complex game-management software in java
05:14 <+crythia1> you have to wait until all joins before choosing character. please wait until I set it up and everyone connects
05:14 <@preaction> wtf, this thing is weird
05:14 <@preaction> k
05:15 <+crythia1> connect
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05:16 <@preaction> k
05:16 <+crythia1> now we choose
05:17 <@preaction> the pink empire will rule you all!
05:17 <+crythia1> mission?
05:18 <@preaction> i dunno what that means
05:18 <+crythia1> you get a secret --- kill a player, conquer two countries, etc.
05:18 <@preaction> i've only ever played Domination (the old risk)
05:18 <+crythia1> it's faster
05:18 <@preaction> ahh
05:18 <@preaction> sure
05:18 <+crythia1> but apparently, we'll do domination. world conquest
05:18 <@preaction> k
05:19 <+crythia1> I did autoplace, so it speeds things up a bit
05:19 <@preaction> wtf, autoplace gay
05:26 <@preaction> that's the damn AI? crap
05:27 <+crythia1> who?
05:27 <@preaction> dark blue
05:27 <@preaction> who took australia
05:27 <+crythia1> yeah
05:27 <@preaction> and who i now have to defend Siam against
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05:37 <@preaction> unf, asia is MINE
05:38 <@preaction> ... but not for long
05:39 <@preaction> omg yes +7 armies!
05:41 <@preaction> omg
05:41 <+crythia1> yeah
05:42 <+crythia1> guess I'm out. :)
05:42 <@preaction> that jerk
05:42 <@preaction> i'll take most of America next turn probably
05:42 <@preaction> he killed you and basically comitted suicide
05:43 <@preaction> what remains to be seen is how far blue pushes him
05:43 <@preaction> omfg
05:44  * snapcount grabs some popcorn
05:44 <+snapcount> far more interesting than the "bachelor" crap Keri has on TV
05:44 <@preaction> the blue ai just trashed asia
05:44 <+crythia1> yeah... and Europe
05:45 <+crythia1> interesting choice.
05:46 <@preaction> oh come on, he had an easier time taking out Siam with 15 armies... i try to take one with 1 army against my 5 and he kills them all
05:46 <@preaction> CHEAT 
05:47 <+crythia1> it's pretty fair dice rolls.
05:47 <@preaction> CHEAT i say
05:48 <@preaction> black isn't smart at this game are they?
05:48 <@preaction> not one country with more than 1 army
05:49 <+crythia1> meh. it's tough and sometimes you just have to conquer territory to prevent large next load
05:49 <@preaction> just for them to have to leave a conquering army?
05:50 <+crythia1> meh... 
05:50 <+crythia1> it was a bad spread
05:50 <@preaction> and germany defends itself against a wildly superior force
05:50 <+crythia1> and cyan kicked butt in real time.
05:50 <@preaction>  but not twice :(
05:50 <@preaction> surprised cyan hasn't moved against middle east yet
05:51 <@preaction> no. blue is doing it
05:51 <+crythia1> me, too
05:51 <@preaction> where the fuck is blue getting all these armies?
05:51 <@preaction> 14 per turn?
05:51 <+crythia1> cards
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05:51 <@preaction> there's no way, he got like 14 last turn too for turning in cards
05:51 <+crythia1> mebbe he had 5, forced to discard, got a set
05:54 <@preaction> aw hell
05:54 <+crythia1> heh
05:54 <+crythia1> fate is a fickle mistress
05:55 <@preaction> go japan!
05:55 <@preaction> WOOOT
05:55 <@preaction> aw
05:55 <+crythia1> no kidding
05:55 <@preaction> taking out 5 not bad
05:55 <@preaction> HA go China!
05:55 <@preaction> aw
05:56 <@preaction> lot better than i thought
05:56 <+Radix_> leave australia alone! :)
05:56 <@preaction> hell no, it WILL be mine
05:56 <@preaction> that damned AI had better let me have it
05:56 <+Radix_> heh
05:57 <@preaction> it's hard as hell to conquer, i've wasted like 10 armies already trying to get at a continent worth of 1-army countries...
05:57 <@preaction> he rolls natural 6's like a bitch
05:57 <+crythia1> ooh. dum ai
05:57 <@preaction> oh... god.. YES
05:57 <+crythia1> increasing cards. loverly.
05:58 <@preaction> MINE
05:59 <@preaction> now to take out Cyan's africa +3, no more of that jazz. or maybe i'll sweep through asia again
05:59 <+crythia1> too late to hold australia this late in the game.
06:00 <+crythia1> and you can bet nobody's going to help you by killing siam
06:00 <@preaction> i don't want it killed, i has plan
06:00 <@apeiron> does it has a flavour?
06:00 <@preaction> put my new armies on siam, kill india, move indonesia to siam, next turn put new armies on india and start two-pronged (maybe three-) sweep of asia
06:00 <+crythia1> I'm in UR AUS, making dah 2sies.
06:01 <@preaction> no, i've fallen into that inevitable evil genius trap: NEVER explain the plan before it's executed...
06:02 <@preaction> it must be because i've substituted chocolate-covered coffee beans for supper
06:02 <@preaction> cyan should take SA and get it over with. then try to stomp europe and start clashing for asia
06:03 <@preaction> that AI in america has got some fortifications...
06:03 <+crythia1> unfortunately, it appears that disconnected
06:03 <+crythia1> sully
06:04 <+crythia1> crap crap crap
06:04 <@preaction> no graceful handling of that?
06:05 <+crythia1> apparently, not. between movies, ai takes
06:05 <+crythia1> movies: moves
06:06 <@preaction> as the game creator, do you have additional powers?
06:06 <+crythia1> not really.
06:06 <+crythia1> can't /kick
06:07 <@preaction> yeah, that'd be a nice feature, kick the user and replace them with an AI of your choosing
06:07 <@preaction> plus chat. plus a pinging thread to make sure everyone's still there
06:07 <+crythia1> yeah, well, generally it's ok. but this happens rarely.
06:08 <+crythia1> I'll stop it, but I'm tired.
06:08 <+crythia1> perhaps another time.
06:08 <@preaction> indeed
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06:08 <@preaction> i would've won anyway
06:08 <+crythia1> hee
06:08 <@preaction> i suppose back to the photo gallery for a bit
06:09 <@preaction> maybe this weekend i'll take a look at this game. the sync problems with creating a network game is almost inexcusable
06:09 <@preaction> and the not having hosting controls is just as bad
06:10 <@preaction> looks like it's relatively active, so i might have to ask the developer before i just jump in
06:10 <+crythia1> well, there you are :)
06:11 <@preaction> wait, maybe not. 1.0.8.9 was released in January
06:11 <+crythia1> gnite
06:11 <@preaction> nite
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16:41 < SDuensin> Greetings
16:41 <@khenn> morning
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17:07 < AMH_mari> Hi all; has anyone tried upgrading the YUI-library that WebGUI uses to the latest version (i.e. 2.3.1)? We would like to use the color picker beta that's in the latest version.
17:08 < AMH_mari> But we're a bit worried that WebGUI's functioning is affected...
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17:58 <@khenn> What version of WebGUI are you using?
18:09 < AMH_mari> 7.4.8
18:09 < AMH_mari> Alas, I have to catch my bus home now...
18:10 < AMH_mari> I'll revisit this channel tomorrow and retry the question. @khenn: thanks.
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23:01 < sno> How do I get a HTML::TemplateExpr instance in an object?
23:02 <+MrHairgrease> you mean how you can set templates to use html::tmplate::expr?
23:02 < sno> Yes, when both are available, but the default is not Expr
23:02 <+MrHairgrease> you should set that in the template
23:02 <+MrHairgrease> I think it's under the properties tab
23:07 < sno> Yeah, it is set at the template properties level.  I see that now.  Thanks.
23:08 < sno> I guess I want it to be established on upgrade, so I'll have to update the instance after template import.
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--- Day changed Wed Oct 10 2007
00:15 <+MrHairgrease> woohoo
00:15 <+MrHairgrease> I have a concept webgui macro parser in parse::recdescent!!!
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01:00 <+MrHairgrease> any regex guru's in the house?
01:01 <+MrHairgrease> how can I not match a sequence of chracters
01:01 <+MrHairgrease> say
01:01 <+MrHairgrease> I want not to match );
01:01 <+MrHairgrease> how do I do that
01:01 <@rizen> all you have to do is: m/.*/
01:01 <@rizen> that will match all your characters
01:01 <@rizen> =)
01:01 <+MrHairgrease> that I know
01:02 <+MrHairgrease> but I don't want that
01:02 <@rizen> m/![\);]/
01:02 <@rizen> don't know if that would work or not, but it's my first guess
01:03 <+MrHairgrease> I also tried the (?!...) syntax
01:03 <+MrHairgrease> but I'm to dumb to use the (?...) stuff
01:18 <@preaction> why not $m !~ /.../
01:18 <@preaction> perlbot perlre
01:18 < perlbot> Perl regular expressions - http://perldoc.perl.org/perlre.html
01:18 <+MrHairgrease> cannot do that
01:18 <@preaction> or did you need one of the zero-width lookahead/lookbehind assertions so as to not consume parts of the match string?
01:19 <+MrHairgrease> i want to match anything up to 0:
01:19 <+MrHairgrease> );
01:19 <+MrHairgrease> noy 0;
01:19 <+MrHairgrease> not*
01:19 <@apeiron> perl -le '$_ = "foobar"; /foo(?!bar)/ and print "hm\n"; $_ = "foobaz"; /foo(?!bar)/ and print'
01:19 <@preaction> so it's a choice of a single character?
01:20 <+MrHairgrease> what do you mean with that
01:22 <@preaction> so you're matching up to but not including ');'
01:22 <@preaction> like the macro parser?
01:22 <+MrHairgrease> yes
01:23 <@preaction> then what apeiron pasted will work
01:23 <+MrHairgrease> parse::recdescent is not reeally suited for parsing argument lists
01:23 <+MrHairgrease> ok
01:23 <+MrHairgrease> then I must've been screwing up
01:23 <@preaction> it was about 1000x faster when doing nested macros, but i tested against the original (current) algorithm
01:23 <+MrHairgrease> I'll try some more
01:24 <@preaction> against normal macros, however, it was considerably slower
01:24 <+MrHairgrease> what was?
01:24 <@preaction> a PRD gramma
01:24 <@preaction> grammer
01:24 <@preaction> whatever that word is...
01:24 <+MrHairgrease> I'm just messing around
01:25 <+MrHairgrease> I have no idea if it'll be faster
01:25 <@preaction> you're writing a PRD grammar? it's fun and educational, there are some powerful things you can do with them ;)
01:26 <+MrHairgrease> I'm just trying to implement the webgui macro parser in parse::recdescent
01:26 <+MrHairgrease> it's a top down parser thingy
01:26 <+MrHairgrease> if I understod correctly
01:27 <@preaction> yeah, i wrote one back when someone (i think you) posted a particularly nasty bit of code that basically DoSed WebGUI because of the macro parser
01:27 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
01:27 <+MrHairgrease> that was i
01:27 <+MrHairgrease> I found the bug when making the acme presentation
01:28 <@preaction> it was fun to do, but i understand that Haarg came up with a more efficient regex, and I think someone else came up with one too
01:28 <+MrHairgrease> so I guess the acme stuff is good for something after all
01:28 <@preaction> indeed
01:28 <+MrHairgrease> as I said
01:28 <@preaction> but if P::RD ever becomes more efficient like the docs say it can/should, you never know
01:28 <+MrHairgrease> I'm only doing this b/c it's possible
01:28 <@preaction> i know, it's fun to learn
01:29 <@preaction> don't tell JT that i learned HTML::Mason in my spare time a few weeks back ;)
01:29 <@rizen> you told me that yourself moron
01:29 <@preaction> ruined the joke...
01:29 <@rizen> there's no joke, it's just sad
01:29 <@preaction> no sense of comedy...
01:30 <@preaction> gotta learn how the competition does things
01:31 <+MrHairgrease> mason is some sort of a include perl in html thing right?
01:31 <@rizen> in that case teach yourself ruby on rails or Zope
01:31 <@rizen> that's the competition
01:31 <@preaction> it's kinda like embperl, yes
01:31 <@rizen> not mason
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01:31 <@preaction> you mean, use something OTHER than Perl for web development?
01:31 < SDuensin> Good evening.
01:32 <@preaction> that just sounds so wrong
01:32 <@rizen> i'm saying if you want to learn about the competion
01:32 <@rizen> competition
01:32 <@rizen> i'm not suggesting that you should actually use it
01:32  * MrHairgrease cancels his RoR download
01:33 <@preaction> zope is python, no?
01:33 <@rizen> yup
01:36 <@rizen> preaction: i think we should assign apeiron a topic to talk about at the wuc, what do you think?
01:36 <+MrHairgrease> apeiron is a new PB employee?
01:36 <@preaction> the more the merrier
01:36 <@apeiron> MrHairgrease, Indeed.
01:36 <@preaction> NOW somebody tells me...
01:36 <@khenn> I think he should take over your workflow class, rizen
01:37 <@rizen> i think his topic should be converting plone, mambo, and typo3 data to WebGUI
01:37 <@khenn> ew
01:37  * SDuensin votes for Drupal
01:37 < SDuensin> :-P
01:38  * apeiron says goodbye to sleep for the rest of the week.
01:38 <@rizen> SD, sorry to say that apeiron is just learning webgui himself this week, so it isn't going to happen
01:38 <@rizen> i just wanted to give him a quick heart attack
01:39 < SDuensin> :-)
01:40 <+MrHairgrease> rizen must be nominated Employer of the Year without doubt
01:40 <@preaction> he's like a second father
01:41 <+MrHairgrease> the second father you never had =)
01:41 <@rizen> a drunk abusive father
01:41 < SDuensin> hehe
01:41 <@apeiron> "Time to learn to swim, son." [father tosses son into river]
01:41 <@preaction> apparently God didn't think my first one screwed me up enough :p
01:42 <@preaction> "Don't be a wussy!"
01:43 <@rizen> "Stop sucking."
01:45 <@rizen> i've never been accused of being a mentor
01:45 <+MrHairgrease> did you say mental?
01:45 <@rizen> nope, mentor
01:45 <@apeiron> I think all Perl programmers have a prereq of 'mental'. :)
01:46 <@rizen> i've definitely been accused of being mental
01:46 <+MrHairgrease> mine are laziness, impatience and hubris
01:46 <+MrHairgrease> but I consider those virtues
01:53 <@rizen> my least favorite thing about preparing for the wuc is burning all the cds with all the presentations on them
01:54 <+MrHairgrease> so hire extra poeple
01:54 <@rizen> for an hour?
01:54 <@rizen> to burn cds?
01:54 <@rizen> yeah, that would work
01:55 <@rizen> martin, could I hire you for $100,000 per year
01:55 <@rizen> except, that i'm only going to keep you on staff for an afternoon
01:56 <+MrHairgrease> I'll give you $100 if I break 5 eggs on your head
01:56 <@rizen> then you break only 4 on my head
01:56 <@rizen> and you don't have to pay me $100
01:56 <+MrHairgrease> same kind of deal
01:57 <@rizen> the best trick is this one
01:57 <@rizen> you see someone order an expensive drink in a bar
01:57 <@rizen> then you go up to them
01:57 <+MrHairgrease> yeah 
01:57 <+MrHairgrease> i know that one too
01:58 <@rizen> and say i bet you a buck i can drink that drink without touching the glass
01:58 <@rizen> hehe
01:58 <+MrHairgrease> oh
01:58 <+MrHairgrease> my
01:58 <+MrHairgrease> a dollar a drink
01:58 <+MrHairgrease> hehe
02:00 <@rizen> i officially need a new computer
02:01 <@rizen> mine is so slow it won't run my keynote presentation without skipping about 50% of the frames
02:02 <@rizen> apeiron, i'm taking your computer...you can have my old crappy one
02:02 <@rizen> =)
02:02 <@apeiron> :(
02:02 <@apeiron> Ah, well, 's better than nothing, I suppose, eh?
02:03 <@rizen> i'm just kidding
02:03  * apeiron nods, knows.
02:03 <@rizen> i'll buy my own, but i probably will borrow your new laptop to run my presentation
02:03 <@apeiron> hmm. Whose shall I swipe, then?
02:04 <@rizen> it's only for an hour
02:04 <@rizen> you can do without for an hour
02:04 <@apeiron> Was planning on bringing a paper notebook either way.
02:04 <@rizen> i don't think anyone takes notes during my keynote
02:05 <@rizen> it's more like a pep rally
02:05 <@apeiron> Ahh.
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02:22 <+MrHairgrease> http://www.justsayhi.com/bb/keyboard
02:28 <@preaction> i could've swore the original 6th printing of the D&D rules (1976) didn't have holes for a three-ring binder in them... charging highway robbery...
02:30 <@rizen> 1,796,000 germs
02:30 <+MrHairgrease> I have 2.1 million
02:31 <@rizen> you are a dirty girl
02:31 <+MrHairgrease> does that please you?
02:31 <@rizen> hells yes
02:32 <@rizen> btw...do you want your prize money in a crisp clean check
02:32 <@rizen> or cold hard cash
02:32 <+MrHairgrease> cold  hard cash
02:33 <+MrHairgrease> the idea is that I spend most of it when I'm in the us
02:33 <@rizen> i figured
02:33 <+MrHairgrease> dollars not worth a lot in euros
02:33 <@rizen> but now that i know your preference, i'll be sure to do the opposite
02:33 <@rizen> yeah yeah
02:33 <@rizen> i hate our fucking government
02:34 <@rizen> the dollar used to be the second strongest currency in the world
02:34 <@rizen> amazing what 6 years or so can do
02:34 <+MrHairgrease> it is
02:34 <+MrHairgrease> the us used to be expensive when we still had guilders
02:34 <+MrHairgrease> but i'm not complaining
02:34 <@rizen> i bet
02:35 <+MrHairgrease> people who export to th eis do
02:35 <+MrHairgrease> the us*
02:35 <+MrHairgrease> quite understandably
02:38 <+MrHairgrease> anyway
02:38 <+MrHairgrease> i'm gonna sleep
02:38 <+MrHairgrease> bye
02:38 <@rizen> later
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02:38 <@preaction> 2.3 million? how did i beat you two?
02:39 <@apeiron> preaction, You're a disgusting pig.
02:40 <@preaction> b-b-b-but i had all those operations...
02:40 <@rizen> apeiron,02:41 <+snapcount> damn, I'm a farking hobo
02:41 <+snapcount> 4,040,000
02:41 <@apeiron> !
02:42  * snapcount runs to the shower, laptop in hand
02:42 <+snapcount> I think it was the "being around sick people" that did me in
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02:42 <@preaction> just be sure to unplug it, battery won't kill you, make you stronger
02:42 <+snapcount> lol
02:43 <+snapcount> 4,044,600 it was actually
02:43 <+snapcount> 809 toilet seats... oh yeah
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07:36 <+Radix_> 2,561,580 germs
07:37 <@rizen> how long would it take a grasshopper with a wooden leg to kick all of the seeds out of a dill pickle
07:39 <@rizen> that's pretty germy
07:46 <+Radix_> it didn't ask me how old the keyboard was though
07:47 <@rizen> should that matter?
07:47 <@rizen> isn't it more a matter of how often you clean it
07:47 <@rizen> than how old it is
07:48 <+Radix_> Ahh.. but if you never clean it..
07:49 <@rizen> that i suppose is true
07:49 <@rizen> but are there people that never clean their keyboard, ever?
07:49  * Radix_ whistles innocently.
07:50 <@rizen> i admittedly only clean mine once or twice per year, but .....holy crap
07:50 <@rizen> you've got to be kidding me
07:50 <@rizen> really? never?
07:50 <+Radix_> I wipe mine with a tissue occasionally to clean the dust off it
07:50 <+Radix_> I actually just bought a new one to replace this thing as it's so old and is starting to look grimy.
07:51 <@preaction> once in a while i'll take my glasses cleaner (ammonia-free) and wipe down the buttons a bit. but it's rarely powered-off long enough to clean
07:51 <+Radix_> same
07:51 <@rizen> when i clean mine i either use alcohol or clorox bleach and q-tips
07:51 <+Radix_> in that mine is rarely powered off long enough to clean
07:52 <@preaction> i've had to toss a couple old ones in the sink with some soap before, but can't really do that with the lappy
07:53 <@rizen> you can toss your laptop into the sink if you want
07:53 <@rizen> but i won't be buying you a new one
07:53 <@rizen> =)
07:53 <@preaction> not for another two years at least
07:55 <@rizen> the woods are lovely dark and deep
07:55 <+Radix_> I don't use the keyboard on my lappy.. I use a usb one with the laptop raised up
07:56 <@preaction> i seen one of thems once, they work nice?
07:57 <+Radix_> I don't think of them as germs so much as allies in the case of alien attack.
07:57 <+Radix_> work great
07:58 <+Radix_> I have a usb keyboard and mouse.. and the elevated laptop means that the screen is at the proper height
07:58 <@rizen> oh yeah, well i have a street
07:58 <@rizen> so take that
07:58 <+Radix_> ?
07:58 <@rizen> for the past 2 months i have not had a street
07:58 <@rizen> it's been under construction
07:58 <@preaction> they finished the thing in two days?
07:58 <+Radix_> heh
07:59 <@rizen> not two days
07:59 <@rizen> 2 months
07:59 <+Radix_> Always handy if you want to leave your house I guess
07:59 <@rizen> they paved it in 2 days
07:59 <@preaction> they started paving yesterday, it took them like 2 days to rip it up, 2 days to pave, and 56 days of sitting on rump
07:59 <@rizen> but they should have been able to do that in one day
08:00 <@rizen> technically i suppose it's not done, cuz they still have the roadblock signs up
08:00 <@rizen> but i can't imagine what else they have to do
08:00 <@rizen> it looks finished to me
08:00 <@preaction> sit on rump for another 56 days?
08:00 <@preaction> gotta get paid somehow
08:00 <@rizen> if they aren't gone tomorrow, i'm throwing them down
08:00 <@preaction> JT: Civic Hero!
08:01 <@rizen> you don't realize how much you need a street until you don't have one for a couple of months
08:01 <@preaction> i would pay to see you in a Superman costume in front of a gently-waving american flag
08:01 <@preaction> or even a big wG on your chest
08:01 <@preaction> with a cape
08:01 <+Radix_> lol
08:01 <@rizen> um, yeah. that's never going to happen
08:02 <@preaction> so i'd be paying with my life i take it?
08:02 <@rizen> didn't you watch the incredibles? capes are out
08:02 <+Radix_> I'll leave you two in peace with that image I think
08:02 <@preaction> oh, snap. no cape then
08:02 <@rizen> r u going somewhere radix?
08:03 <+Radix_> not really no
08:03 <+Radix_> sick as a dog atm
08:03 <@rizen> we're all very upset that you won't be at the wuc this year
08:03 <+Radix_> I'm sure.. heh
08:03 <@preaction> extremely... upset...
08:04 <+Radix_> not far away now I guess is it
08:04 <@preaction> 5 days
08:04 <@preaction> 8 hours
08:04 <@preaction> 26 minutes
08:04 <@preaction> approximately
08:05 <@preaction> perlbot math 5 * 24 + 8)
08:05 < perlbot> Bad Expression: syntax error
08:05 <+Radix_> drop the )
08:05 <@preaction> perlbot math (5 * 24 + 8) * 60 + 26
08:05 < perlbot> 7706
08:05 <@preaction> minutes! that's like forever
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11:50 < AMH_mari> Hi all. Has anyone tried to upgrade the YUI-library that WebGUI uses to the latest version (2.3.1)? We would like to use the ColorPicker in the new version but are a bit worried that WebGUI's functionality is affected because of the upgrade. Any thoughts anyone? There do not seem to be a lot of changes between the versions and at first sight WebGUI (7.4.8) is functioning normally. Are there problems to expect? What to check to verify WebGUI's f
11:52 <+MrHairgrease> I once copied a newer yui over the one delivered with webgui
11:52 <+MrHairgrease> that worked
11:52 <+MrHairgrease> dunno which version it was anymore
11:52 <+MrHairgrease> your best bet is to try it out on a dev system first
11:53 <+MrHairgrease> and check the yui docs if 2.3.1 is a drop in replacement for the yui that comes with wegui
11:56 < AMH_mari> 2.3.1 appears to work but I will check it further on a dev system first. Thanks.
11:56 <+MrHairgrease> ok
11:56 <+MrHairgrease> good luck
11:56 <+MrHairgrease> please let me know how it works out
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16:34 <@rizen> the things to check are:
16:34 <@rizen> admin bar
16:34 <@rizen> resizable text areas
16:35 <@rizen> site setup wizard
16:35 <@khenn> who are you talking to?
16:35 <@rizen> tool tips
16:35 <@rizen> AMH_mari
16:35 <@rizen> tool tips = hover help
16:39 <+MrHairgrease> I have this friggin problem haunting me all day
16:39 <+MrHairgrease> what I want to do is this
16:39 <+MrHairgrease> Extend WG::A::Post with some stuff
16:39 <+MrHairgrease> that will be called WG::A::Post::Slave
16:40 <+MrHairgrease> that is easy of course
16:40 <+MrHairgrease> the problem is however
16:40 <@khenn> I think I know the punchline
16:40 <@khenn> =)
16:40 <+MrHairgrease> that Threads of that type should use base WG::A::Post::Slave
16:40 <+MrHairgrease> Call such a thread WG::A::Post::Slave::Thread
16:41 <+MrHairgrease> but how do I get the methods of WG::A::P::Thread into that class?
16:41 <+MrHairgrease> I cannot inherit directly
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16:42 <@khenn> the only way to do it is to customize all the way through
16:42 <+MrHairgrease> since use base 'WG::A::P::Thread' would inherit from WG::A::P
16:42 <@khenn> Doug made some fizes
16:42 <@khenn> fixes
16:42 <+MrHairgrease> not my new post
16:42 <@khenn> tot he class
16:42 <+MrHairgrease> If it would only export all its crap i think i would work
16:42 <+MrHairgrease> what fixes?
16:42 <+MrHairgrease> are they in svn?
16:43 <@khenn> I'd have to ask
16:43 <@khenn> we did this for a client earlier this year
16:43 <@khenn> I think the way he did it was:
16:43 <+MrHairgrease> Right now I'm trying out mixin
16:43 < SDuensin> Greetings.
16:43 <@khenn> WG::A::Wobject::CustomCollab
16:43 <@khenn> WG::A::Post::CustomThread
16:43 <@khenn> WG::A::CustomPost
16:44 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
16:44 <@khenn> and you have to change the ref points
16:44 <+MrHairgrease> that's what i do too
16:44 <@khenn> oh, then I misunderstood the issue
16:44 <+MrHairgrease> but how do I get the vanilla thread methods into my new thread
16:44 <+MrHairgrease> without copying all the code
16:45 <@khenn> oh
16:45 <@khenn> you could use the isa method off the object
16:45 <@khenn> isa(WG::A:Post::Thread
16:46 <+MrHairgrease> that doesn't work
16:46 <+MrHairgrease> because it'll bypass my custom post
16:46 <+MrHairgrease> phone
16:46 <+MrHairgrease> brb
16:46 <@khenn> then isa(WG::A::Post)
16:46 <@khenn> since thread inherits from that
16:49 <+MrHairgrease> when I make the new thread isa(WG::A::Thread) defintion will do this
16:50 <+MrHairgrease> def(wg::a::p::slave::thread) -> def(wg::a::p::thread) -> def(wg::a::post)
16:51 <+MrHairgrease> but I want def(wg::a::p::slave::thread) -> def(wg::a::p::thread) -> def(wg::a::p::slave) -> def(wg::a::post)
16:51 <@rizen> MrHairgrease, as far as I know it is not possible to do inheritance in the way you're looking to do it
16:51 <@rizen> to make this work you have to do it this way
16:51 <@khenn> yeah
16:52 <@khenn> you are not doing the inheritance right
16:52 <@rizen> 1) subclass WebGUI::Asset::Post
16:52 <@rizen> as WebGUI::Asset::Post:NewPost
16:52 < AMH_mari> @Rizen: thanks, will check the items from your list specifically.
16:52 <@rizen> 2) subclass WebGUI::Asset::Post::Thread as WebGUI::Asset::Post::Thread::NewThread
16:52 <@rizen> 3) Create a mixin class outside of both subclasses
16:52 <@rizen> for shared methods
16:53 <@rizen> and bring them into your subclasses
16:53 <@rizen> i know that sucks, but i know of no other way to do what you want to do
16:53 <+MrHairgrease> ok
16:54 <+MrHairgrease> so use mixin is the way to go
16:54 <@rizen> and it's very important that your new subclasses include W:A:P and W:A:P:T in their namespace
16:54 <@rizen> if they don't, inheritance won't work correctly
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> ok
16:55 <@rizen> actually, that's true of all assets that you subclass
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> so W:A:P:Slave and W:A:P:T:Slave
16:55 <@rizen> yup
16:57 <+MrHairgrease> and repectively ISA W:A:P and ISA W:A:P:T?
16:57 <+MrHairgrease> man this is some confusing crap
17:02 <@rizen> it gets confusing after a while
17:03 <@rizen> it's not so bad on a single asset
17:03 <@rizen> but when you have a composite asset like the CS
17:03 <@rizen> that is made up of multiple assets
17:03 <@rizen> then you get into some real confusing shit
17:03 <@rizen> =)
17:03 <+MrHairgrease> tell me about it
17:03 <@rizen> hmmm.
17:04 <@rizen> that would make a great talk at the wuc
17:04 <@rizen> the difference between assets, meta assets, and composite assets
17:04 <+MrHairgrease> yeah, in a way that you shwo me =)
17:04 <@rizen> and the inheritance issues with each
17:05 <@rizen> i might have to do that for next year
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17:24 <+MrHairgrease> ok
17:24 <+MrHairgrease> you may call me dumb now
17:24 <+MrHairgrease> i still don't get it to work
17:24 <+MrHairgrease> what's supposed to be in that mixin class?
17:26 <@rizen> you have to use a mixin utility class
17:26 <@rizen> like NEXT
17:26 <@rizen> See RSSCapable
17:26 <+MrHairgrease> ok
17:26 <@rizen> W:A:RSSCapable
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> i was trying to get mixin to work
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> http://search.cpan.org/~mschwern/mixin-0.06/lib/mixin.pm
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> but i'll try next
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> thanks
17:27 <@rizen> mixin might work, never tried that one
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> i'll try the paved roads first
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17:46 <@khenn> unix help:  what is the command to see the size of a folder recursively?
17:47 <+MrHairgrease> du -Sh
17:47 <@khenn> nope
17:47 <@khenn> du:  illegal option -- S
17:47 <+MrHairgrease> huh
17:48 <+MrHairgrease> moment
17:48 <@khenn> must be -s
17:48 <+MrHairgrease> -S works for me
17:48 <@khenn> yeah -s
17:48 <@khenn> thanks
17:48 <+MrHairgrease> yeah you should -s
17:48 <+MrHairgrease> still -S works for me too
17:49 <+MrHairgrease> oh
17:49 <+MrHairgrease> -S will give a wrong result anyway
17:49 <+MrHairgrease> so don't bother=)
17:56 <@apeiron> Looks like -S is GNU, whereas a Mac is probably running BSD du.
17:56 <+MrHairgrease> ah well
17:56 <+MrHairgrease> -s was the right one anyway
17:58  * MrHairgrease is putting th etread thing on the shelf for today
18:01 <+MrHairgrease> I have wre 0.8.0 for ubuntu 7.04 btw
18:01 <+MrHairgrease> do you want me to upload it somewhere?
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18:04 <@rizen> upload.sf.net/incoming
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18:05 <+MrHairgrease> just drop it in that dir?
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18:09 <+MrHairgrease> ok
18:09 <+MrHairgrease> it's up
18:12 <@rizen> it's on sf now
18:13 <+MrHairgrease> ok
18:13 <@rizen> how did the build process go for you? was it smooth as silk?
18:32 <+MrHairgrease> yes
18:32 <+MrHairgrease> I did ./build.sh
18:33 <+MrHairgrease> forgot about it
18:33 <+MrHairgrease> and when I remembered and checked it was finised
18:33 <+MrHairgrease> nice work
18:33 <@rizen> awesome. that's what was intended
18:33 <+MrHairgrease> but i gotta go
18:33 <@rizen> later
18:33 <+MrHairgrease> diner and stuff
18:33 <+MrHairgrease> and beer
18:34 <+MrHairgrease> I can use that afterthis unfruitful day
18:34  * MrHairgrease is gonna mixin some beer
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18:41 <+snapcount> not sure if you guys saw this yet: http://xkcd.com/327/
18:41 <+snapcount> lolz
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20:59 < ckotil> yah, thats a good one.
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21:19 < FireZilla> hi
21:20 < FireZilla> I have a question. I hope you can help me
21:21 < snapcount_> not until we know what the question is =)
21:22 < FireZilla> I read on the wiki, that Modperl port should not be available from outside of the machine.
21:22 <@rizen> and maybe not even them. some of us (like me) are dumber than others of us (like snapcount)
21:22 < FireZilla> Can you explain why
21:23 < snapcount_> rizen: lol
21:23 < snapcount_> it's because the only thing that needs to talk to that instance is modproxy
21:25 < FireZilla> ok, so I just have to block that port with iptables ?
21:25 < snapcount_> or your firewall or even an allow from directive in the apache conf
21:25 < snapcount_> pick your poison
21:25 <@Haarg> or change it to only listen on 127.0.0.1
21:25 < snapcount_> indeed
21:26 <@rizen> that only works if your dns is mapped to 127.0.0.1 or you have only one webgui site
21:31 < FireZilla> ok. Thanks al lot
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22:01 <@rizen> martin's genius sometimes astounds me
22:06 <@preaction> his presentation?
22:06 <@rizen> no, i'm fixing some graphing bugs
22:07 <@rizen> and the graphing system does a bunch of stuff that i had no idea it was capable of
22:07 <@rizen> i have to come up with some cool asset to build that can take advantage of this stuff
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22:23 < cryolai> Anyone around? I got a question about about WebGUI committing...
22:24 <@preaction> perlbot ask
22:24 < perlbot> Ask forth your question to the all-knowing channel and we shall bestow upon you the answer of correctitude.
22:24 <@preaction> perlbot relearn ask as Don't ask to ask, just ask.
22:24 < perlbot> relearned entry for ask
22:25 < cryolai> Whenever I commit something, it doesn't actually commit. It goes into the "Pending versions" and never shows up...
22:26 < cryolai> Then, a lock shows up on the article or page i just edited, and I have to go back and delete the revisions I just made and the process repeats itself
22:26 < cryolai> ...Am I doing something wrong?
22:26 <@preaction> is spectre running?
22:26 < cryolai> I don't know what that is.
22:26 <@preaction> which explains that
22:27 <@preaction> running under the WRE?
22:27 < cryolai> Eh...?
22:27 <@preaction> are you running the WRE?
22:27 < cryolai> I don't know what that is, either...
22:28 <@preaction> so no
22:28 <@preaction> cd /data/WebGUI/sbin; perl spectre.pl --daemon
22:30 < cryolai> Hmm?
22:31 <@preaction> spectre.pl is located in WebGUI's sbin directory. it is a daemon that must be run with WebGUI
22:35 < cryolai> We have hosting, though.
22:36 <@preaction> with whom?
22:36 <@preaction> ask them for support
22:36 < cryolai> Plainblack, alright.
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07:33 < elnino> hello. How do I give a user the ability to use the redirect asset?
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10:11 < wgGuest54> Can anyone tell me if you need root access or access to system files in order to install webgui?
10:20 < AMH_bob> yes, you do (or superuser rights)
10:20 < wgGuest54> Thanks for that.
10:20 < wgGuest54> researching for a customer. Is it just for the /data dire? That's all I see in the wiki
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15:56 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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16:54 <@apeiron> Hmm?
16:55 <@rizen> deciding whether or not you're cool enough to be op'd
16:55 <@apeiron> Oh.
16:55 <@apeiron> Well, uh..
16:55 <@apeiron> I would say not right now, 'cause my Ipv6 tunnel is giving me trouble.
16:56 <@rizen> the fact that you have an ipv6 tunnel makes you a geek
16:56 <@rizen> but geeks are cool
16:56 <@rizen> so unless you have some other uncool things about you
16:56 <@rizen> i guess you can keep ops
16:56 <@apeiron> phew. Glad to hear that. :)
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17:54 < cap10morgan_> Is anyone loading any RSS feeds from del.icio.us into a syndicated content wobject?
17:54 < cap10morgan_> It doesn't seem to grab the descriptions
17:55 -!- cap10morgan_ is now known as cap10morgan
17:55 <@khenn> my initial thought would be malformed RSS.  Have you looked at the feed?
17:55 < cap10morgan> yeah
17:55 < cap10morgan> it looks basically ok to me
17:56 < cap10morgan> i compared it to slashdot's, which does grab the descriptions
17:57 <@khenn> The structures are the same?
17:58 < cap10morgan> yeah
17:58 < cap10morgan> i can't see any difference
17:58 <@khenn> how about funky characters?
17:58 < cap10morgan> hmm... don't see any. some url-escaped stuff in the url's is the closest thing (but you'd expect that)
17:59 < cap10morgan> there are xml entities in there like &#x26;
17:59 < cap10morgan> but those are in the links, and they show up fine
18:00 <@khenn> those are the only two things I can think of that would screw up the RSS feed
18:03 < cap10morgan> hmm, very weird
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18:30 < knowmad> Hi folks. I'm trying to remember the function that I saw once which can look for a string in an array. Does anyone know the name of that function and what module it's in?
18:33 < knowmad> looks like the Bug reporting is down on webgui.org....
18:34 < knowmad> FWIW, I'm not encouraged to send an email to noreply@plainblack.com :)
18:41 < knowmad> Found it -- Utility.pm -- sub isIn
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19:05 <@rizen> what do you mean bug reporting is down?
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19:52 < knowmad> hi rizen. I was getting an error message when i visited the bugs url
19:53 <@rizen> you're not now though right?
19:53 <@rizen> i think i fixed it
19:53 < knowmad> let me check it
19:54 < knowmad> looks good now
19:54 <@rizen> i forgot to clear the userSessionScratch in the upgrade that i applied yesterday
19:54 <@rizen> so i'll have to put out a new release today that has that fix in it
19:54 < knowmad> Ahh, ok.
20:08 < knowmad> rizen: when are you going to branch to 7.5?
20:09 <@rizen> when you least expect it
20:09 <@rizen> hehe
20:09 < knowmad> last week?
20:09 <@rizen> no, that's when you expected it
20:09 < knowmad> haha. so true!
20:09 <@rizen> you're thinking that it should be any day now
20:09 <@rizen> so i'm going to have to wait until january
20:10 <@rizen> it was going be be branched today
20:10 < knowmad> we're kinda hoping. diona has some edits to add that she's almost forgotten
20:10 <@rizen> but now i have to put out a new release
20:10 <@rizen> so it may be tomorrow
20:10 <@rizen> but it will be today or tomorrow for sure
20:10 < knowmad> ok, we'll try to hold onto those neurons for a couple more days.
20:10 <@rizen> as you might imagine, there's a lot going on right now for us
20:10 < knowmad> yes, i can imagine. 
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23:37 < cap10morgan_> since wre 0.8 requires webgui 7.4, how do you upgrade a 0.7.2 / 7.3.22 site to 0.8 / 7.4?
23:38 <+snapcount> I believe there is a wiki article on how to migrate
23:38 <+snapcount> lemme look
23:39 <+snapcount> http://www.webgui.org/community-wiki/migration-to-wre-0.8
23:39 < cap10morgan_> cool, thanks
23:39 <+snapcount> I think you need to upgrade webgui first
23:40 <+snapcount> then migrate to latest wre
23:40 <+snapcount> but I haven't tried either yet so I may be wrong
23:41 <@rizen> You can upgrade to 7.4 with either 0.7 or 0.8
23:41 <@rizen> you just can't run 7.3 on 0.8
23:41 <@rizen> but you can use 0.8 to upgrade it
23:41 <+snapcount> oh... good to know
23:41 <@rizen> or you can upgrade to 7.4 on 0.7
23:41 <+snapcount> thanks dude
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04:47 <+snapcount> hmm
04:47 <+snapcount> is there a macro that can pull user scratch variables
04:48 <+snapcount> I think there was one at some point
04:50 <+snapcount> well, grep says the answer is no so I guess I'll write it
05:04 <+snapcount> ok, I wrote the macro but I'm at an impass
05:04 <+snapcount> do you think I should allow the user to specify the level of filtering done on the value returned?
05:04 <+snapcount> or just filter all always
05:04 <+snapcount> (this is going to be contributed btw)
05:05 <+snapcount> I don't want people to accidentally open themselves to XSS vulnerabilities and other crap
05:10 <+snapcount> well, I don't suppose scratch vars were ever intended to hold url encoded html and/or js so I'll just filter it always
05:58 <@rizen> yeah, generally scratch variables hold simple strings or json
05:58 <@rizen> so it's safe to filter HTML
05:59 <@rizen> and smart
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06:13 <+snapcount> cool
06:13 <+snapcount> added to contribs
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13:25 < AMH_mari> @MrHairGrease - about replacing WebGUI 7.4.8's YUI-library 2.2.2 with version 2.3.1: preliminary results are that this does not affect WebGUI's functioning, which is good because now we can use 2.3.1's ColorPicker.
13:47 <+MrHairgrease> ok
13:47 <+MrHairgrease> cool
13:47 <+MrHairgrease> thought so already
13:47 <+MrHairgrease> but it's nice to know for sure
13:51 <@preaction> FYI: Vienna is a truly awesome FOSS RSS reader for OSX
13:51 <@preaction> can I have any more acronyms in there?
13:54 <+MrHairgrease> BTW
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15:55 <+MrHairgrease> i remember somebody passing on a link about recognizing which linux distro you're running on
15:55 <+MrHairgrease> either here or on the dev list
15:55 <+MrHairgrease> but i cannot fiond it anymore
15:56 <+MrHairgrease> anybody still knows?
15:56 < AMH_henry> http://search.cpan.org/~kerberus/Linux-Distribution-0.14/lib/Linux/Distribution.pm
15:57 <+MrHairgrease> oh yeah
15:57 <+MrHairgrease> 't was a perl module
15:57 <+MrHairgrease> thanks
15:57 < AMH_henry> yw
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16:10 < SDuensin> Greetings.
16:10 <+MrHairgrease> welcome mr. duensin
16:49 <+MrHairgrease> rizen
16:49 <+MrHairgrease> currently i'm trying to migriate a buch of site from wre 072 to 808
16:49 <@rizen> martin
16:49 <+MrHairgrease> 080
16:49 <@rizen> cool
16:50 <+MrHairgrease> am i supposed to access the wreconsole by makin a ssh tunnel?
16:50 <+MrHairgrease> it's on a remote box
16:51 <@rizen> or with lynx
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16:51 <+MrHairgrease> ok
16:51 <@rizen> or by opening a port in the firewall
16:51 <+MrHairgrease> what firewall?
16:51 <@rizen> well if there's no firewall, then you should be able to just start it up
16:51 <+MrHairgrease> is wreconsole only listening to localhost?
16:51 <@rizen> and use it directly
16:52 <@rizen> no
16:52 <@rizen> it binds to all ips
16:52 <+MrHairgrease> hmm
16:52 <+MrHairgrease> starnge
16:52 <+MrHairgrease> b/c it won't respond when i try to connect to it directly
16:52 <+MrHairgrease> oh wait
16:53 <+MrHairgrease> maybe it is a firewall after all
16:53 <+MrHairgrease> moment
16:54 <+MrHairgrease> is the hostname important?
16:54 <+MrHairgrease> so if it says connect to me via foobar:60834
16:54 <@rizen> nope
16:54 <+MrHairgrease> ok
16:54 <@rizen> only the port is relevant
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> i'll investigate further
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> it works via a ssh tunnel
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> but
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> somehow everything is completely unstyled
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> as if the css is not coming through
16:55 <@rizen> wierd
16:55 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
16:55 <@rizen> did the css file get copied into /data/wre/var
16:56 <@rizen> perhaps you have a permissions problem
16:56 <+MrHairgrease> i'll check
16:56 <+MrHairgrease> oh yeah
16:56 <+MrHairgrease> that could be it
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16:56 <@rizen> steveo, you were great in jackass
16:57 <@rizen> i think in jackass 3 you should light your balls on fire
16:57 <@rizen> just kidding sno
16:57 <@rizen> AMH_bob...i hear you're coming to the WUC
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> hmm
16:59 < AMH_bob> HHHHH
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> stil no workie
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> in the html it says
16:59 < AMH_bob> I just haven't told my wife yet!
16:59 <+MrHairgrease> <link rel="stylesheet" href="/css" type="text/css"     />
17:00 < AMH_bob> eh, I mean: asked my wife yet!
17:00 <+MrHairgrease> is that what it should say?
17:00 <@rizen> hehe
17:00 <@rizen> holy last minute travel plans 
17:00 <@rizen> that plane ticket has to cost you 1500 euros
17:00 <@rizen> or more
17:00 <@rizen> or rather, AMH, not you
17:00 < AMH_bob> or a lot less hehehehe
17:01 <@rizen> yes
17:01 <@rizen> yes mhg
17:01 <@rizen> the console web server translates /css into the file in the var folder
17:01 <+MrHairgrease> but going to http://localhost:60834/css
17:01 <+MrHairgrease> gives a 404
17:02 <@rizen> do you have a file in /data/wre/var?
17:02 <+MrHairgrease> that port i tunneled btw
17:02 <@rizen> wreconsole.css
17:02 < AMH_bob> AMH_henry says: 1075 for two round trip tickets
17:02 <+MrHairgrease> that's in /data/wre/var/setupfiles
17:03 <+MrHairgrease> maybe it is b/c i'm migrating
17:03 <+MrHairgrease> and it sees the siteconfs in webgui/etc
17:03 <+MrHairgrease> so setup is skipped
17:03 <+MrHairgrease> when first starting the wreconsole
17:05 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
17:06 <+MrHairgrease> manually copying it to wre/var works
17:07 <@rizen> you still have to run setup though
17:07 <+MrHairgrease> how do i do that?
17:07 <@rizen> you're supposed to go to http://localhost;60834/setup
17:07 <+MrHairgrease> it's not in the migration wiki =)
17:07 <@rizen> it says that right in the install.txt
17:08 <+MrHairgrease> oh right
17:08 <+MrHairgrease> my bad
17:08 <@rizen> no, the migration wiki says to follow the install instructions
17:08 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
17:08 <+MrHairgrease> it's friday here too
17:08 <@rizen> hehe
17:09 <+MrHairgrease> ok
17:09 <+MrHairgrease> you may belittle me for a couple of minutes at the wuc =)
17:10 <+Radix_> just a couple of minutes?
17:10 <+Radix_> he'd do that normally I'm sure :)
17:11 <+MrHairgrease> hehe
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17:15 <@rizen> mhg, i would never belittle you
17:16 <@rizen> well except that one year at the wuc where i said you sound the same whether your mouth is full or not
17:16 <@rizen> but that was more endearingly funny
17:16 <@rizen> and i wouldn't say that again
17:16 <@rizen> it's been done
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17:17 <@rizen> besides, i owe you a whole lot of beer money for your WCC winnings
17:17 <@rizen> how can i give you a wad of cash and then belittle you
17:17 <@rizen> it just wouldn't be right
17:19 <@rizen> MrHairgrease: so now that you're following the install instructions, how have the migration instructions been
17:20 <@rizen> i wrote them after migrating one of my own servers
17:20 <@rizen> so i hope they are complete
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17:59 <+MrHairgrease> bye guys
17:59 <+MrHairgrease> we are there ready with
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21:18 < AMH_bob> @rizen: The word is out, I'm comming to the WUC!
21:18 <@rizen> sweet
21:18 < AMH_bob> dude
21:18 <@rizen> and the wife isn't killing you or anything
21:19 < AMH_bob> nope, she would rather have me here, but she just loves me too much!
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22:51 < SDuensin> rizen!  Quit working so hard and play with the new ZKD update I pushed today.  New demo and all.  :-)
23:19 < knowmad> What's ZKD?
23:21 <+snapcount> Zore King of Destruction
23:21 <+snapcount> Zebras Kick Donkeys
23:21 <+snapcount> zOMG Kittens Dancing
23:21 <+snapcount> ok I'm out of guesses
23:22 <@rizen> zk desktop
23:22 <@rizen> which uses the zk ajax/java framework
23:22 <@rizen> to build a web based desktop
23:27 <+snapcount> nice... I've seen some of the stuff YUI can do as far as making desktop like interfaces
23:27 <+snapcount> I'll have to check zk out
23:35 < knowmad> ZKD looks like Meebo
23:36 < knowmad> wonder if it's built on zkd...
23:38 <@rizen> SD, the WUC is next week
23:38 <@rizen> you really can't think i'm going to take a break now
23:38 <@rizen> =)
23:38 <@rizen> i haven't even got 7.5 branched yet
23:38 <@rizen> which knowmad...i swear will be done today
23:38 < knowmad> don't forget, you said that would happen today
23:39 <@rizen> we're just having a little trouble with the 7.4.10 release
23:39 < knowmad> ok, i'll be watching for it ;)
23:39 <@rizen> found a last minute bug
23:39 <@rizen> fixing, releasing, then we'll branch
23:39 < knowmad> there's always something...
23:39 <@rizen> this one brought down plainblack.com
23:39 <@rizen> so it's pretty serious
23:39 < knowmad> yeah, that's pretty bad.
23:40 < knowmad> is it safe to migrate from 7.3.13 to 7.4.9 or should i go to 7.4.8 until 7.4.10 is out?
23:40 < knowmad> this is for a test server
23:40 < knowmad> but i don't want to waste time debugging something you're about to fix
23:41 <@rizen> 7.4.10 will be out in 20 minutes
23:41 <@rizen> just wait
23:44 < nuba> hey guys
23:45 <@rizen> straw nuba
23:45  * nuba resuming "normal life"
23:45 <@preaction> normal? sounds boring
23:45 < nuba> heh its not everyday my grandma dies you know
23:45 < nuba> happens only twice
23:46 < nuba> in life
23:46 <@rizen> i have 2 or three die on me a week
23:46 <@rizen> i name all my pet flies grandma
23:46 <@preaction> what features are advertised as Coming in 7.5 (that i could use for potential adopters?)
23:47 <@rizen> none until the speech at the wuc
23:47 <@preaction> ah, k
23:47 < nuba> so a lot of backlog to catch up with in #webgui
23:47 < nuba> did I miss anything? any outstanding event?
23:47 <@preaction> the WUC?
23:48 < nuba> not going
23:48 <@preaction> awww
23:48 <@rizen> we'll miss you
23:48 <@preaction> we'll let you know how it goes
23:48 < nuba> well its been a while since the last WUC i attented, you should be used to it already
23:49 < nuba> attended*
23:49 <@preaction> that just makes us miss you all the more
23:49 < nuba> i considered attending this year, but things got pretty messy here
23:49 < nuba> maybe next year
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23:56 <@rizen> ok new version is out
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00:09 <@rizen> branching done
00:10 <@preaction> darnit, now i have another side-project to do: merge some calendar changes into the 7.5 branch. last time I died from feature creep, this time imma die from side-projects
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00:51 <@preaction> i've noticed a weird problem with the code in assets we currently have: i don't see many assets inheriting the response from processPropertiesFromFormPost
00:51 <@preaction> it can return an array reference of errors
00:52 <@rizen> that's a legacy issue
00:52 <@rizen> the ability to return that response was added only recently
00:52 <@rizen> 7.3 i think
00:52 <@rizen> not saying it shouldnt' be fixed
00:53 <@rizen> just giving history
00:53 <@preaction> imma fix it for File / Image / Photo, but i might not be able to rewrite the parts of File and Image that need it
00:53 <@preaction> eh, i'll just do it. it'll be easier / faster to do it right this time
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01:35 <@preaction> http://www.nytimes.com/2004/12/12/magazine/13EYEBALL.html?_r=2&pagewanted=all&position=&oref=slogin&oref=slogin <- would I get a raise if I put a wG in my eye?
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--- Day changed Mon Oct 15 2007
00:01 < SynQ> jo!
00:01 < SynQ> I'm alive
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00:10 < nuba> SynQ: enjoy. it wont last forever
00:10 < SynQ> hehe
00:10 < nuba> one of the few certain things in life
00:10 < SynQ> when I'm dead I won't know about it probably
00:11 < SynQ> the only thing to hope is that others will still know who you where
00:12 < SynQ> I read you're not coming to the wuc
00:13 < nuba> true
00:13 < SynQ> will you be online though?
00:13 < nuba> maybe the next one tho
00:13 < nuba> probably
00:13 < SynQ> how come?
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00:14 < nuba> how come? no, it's "no going"
00:15 < nuba> as in "staying local"
00:16 < SynQ> how come you are not going to the wuc? what is the reason?
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00:33 < nuba> i took a supersized vacation at work, just returned home last week
00:34 < nuba> it wasnt meant to be so, but i had a family issue arising just after my vacation
00:35 < nuba> if I were to attend to the wuc, I should have been making arrangements for that durint the last weeks
00:35 < nuba> shoulda, didnt
01:27 <+snapcount> heh... watching spectre run in debug with 8 workers and 5000 pending workflows is a lot different than watching it with 3
01:29 <+snapcount> setting maxTimeBetween... to 0 prolly helped too
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04:11 <+snapcount> preaction: you around?
04:11 <@preaction> for a bit, sup?
04:12 <+snapcount> trying to find the best way to generate several columns using css and an un-ordered list
04:12 <+snapcount> do you know of any resources?
04:12 <@preaction> a list apart
04:12 <+snapcount> I've got it working but it's not the best way I'm sure
04:13 <+snapcount> is that a question or an answer =)
04:13 <@preaction> there's an article on A List Apart for multiple column lists
04:13 <+snapcount> oh
04:13 <+snapcount> so this is a website
04:13 <@preaction> but you'll only get an easy method by going left-right top-bottom, not top-bottom left-right
04:14 <+snapcount> yeah I figured that out
04:14 <@preaction> the #css bot is seriously pwn
04:14 <+snapcount> the other ways involve js right?
04:14 <@preaction> CSS3 provides multiple columns rules, but of course, CSS3 multicolumn isn't supported yet
04:14 <@preaction> JS would be a way to do it, yes
04:14 <+snapcount> ok... I'll check out the site
04:14 <+snapcount> get my learn on
04:15 <+snapcount> =P thanks man
04:28 <+Radix-wrk> a list apart is a great site
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12:33 <@preaction> baby-sitting, baby-sitting, baby-sitting servers...
12:33 <@preaction> load average of 10, think that's bad?
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15:26 <@preaction> Bonjourno from the WUC!
15:28 < ckotil> sweet. whens it start?
15:28 <@preaction> 30 minutes i think
15:29 <@preaction> well, the school thingies
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15:36 < xdanger> where's the live webcast?
15:51 <@preaction> live webcast? i can't even get my mail from home
15:51 <@preaction> but i think that's a problem with my home and not this place
15:52 <@preaction> 3mbps downspeed, not bad
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16:01 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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16:23 -!- preaction changed the topic of #webgui to: [ WebGUI 7.4.10-stable | WRE 0.8.0 ] The WUC is HERE! Greetings from Madison!
16:35 <+MrHairgrease> The Dutch will invade Madison by tomorrow around 4 pm or so!
16:38 <@preaction> you sure? i've got one sitting right next to me i thinks
16:38 < AMH_bob> Haha, the dutch will probably be sooner than that!
16:39 <@preaction> he doesn't look like he's been subjugated by a fearmongering society, at least.
16:40 < AMH_bob> We're leaving Amsterdam tomorrow at 10.30am local time
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17:12 <+MrHairgrease> ah
17:12 <+MrHairgrease> prolly the same plane then
17:13 <+MrHairgrease> you fly with klm?
17:13 <+MrHairgrease> to chicago?
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17:17 < AMH_bo1> Yep, KLM
17:17 <+MrHairgrease> cool
17:17 < AMH_bo1> AMS->Chicago
17:17 <+MrHairgrease> how do you travel to madison from chicago?
17:18 <+MrHairgrease> rental car?
17:18 < AMH_bo1> yep
17:18 <+MrHairgrease> cool
17:18 <+MrHairgrease> we can race you then =)
17:18 < AMH_bo1> haha good luck with that!
17:18 < AMH_bo1> O:-)
17:19 <+MrHairgrease> famous last words...
17:19 < AMH_bo1> I bet our car can beat your car
17:19 < AMH_bo1> :P
17:21 < AMH_bo1> We're already checked in - Robert had to get us good seats.
17:22 < AMH_bo1> there are (multiple) sites you can check to get the absolute best seats on the plane (I couldn't believe my eyes!)
17:22 < dapperedodo> We took row 42, the Answer to Life, the Universe, and Everything
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17:27 <+snapcount> somebody needs to blog about the WUC while you're there
17:27 <+snapcount> I'll read it
17:27 <+snapcount> =)
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17:30 <+snapcount> especially the BoF sessions
17:31 <+snapcount> and any little side hacking projects that spawn
17:31 <+snapcount> hell, I might even partake from afar
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17:44 <@preaction> i need a blog again... commctrl.com has been down for AGES
17:46 < SDuensin> I thought about starting one, but I think I'd just bitch.  :-)
17:46 <+crythias> I started one,
17:46 <+crythias> then stopped
17:46 <+crythias> then started again.
17:47 <+crythias> blog.crythias.com
17:47 <+crythias> hee
17:47 < SDuensin> I'm going to need one soon, but it'll be for professional use, not for my personal ranting.
17:48 <+crythias> you can use aboutus.org to attach a wiki to any website :)
17:49 < SDuensin> I have a wiki and blog.  I use WebGUI!  :-P
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18:57 <+snapcount> so who is at the WUC that will post to this thing throughout the day?
18:57 <+snapcount> it could be a new tradition? =)
18:57 <+snapcount> I know today and tomorrow are just classes
18:58 <+snapcount> actually, I could throw a site up for all at the WUC to use
18:58 <+snapcount> sort of WUC Wikiblog
18:59 <+snapcount> if anyone is interested let me know and I'll put the site up... I have like 15 webgui-ish domain names and tons of bandwidth, server resources, etc
18:59 <+snapcount> I could even host a collaborative dev environment for any BoF sessions that are going on
19:00 <+snapcount> damn it, I wish I was freaking there!!!!!!!
19:00 <+snapcount> I'm buying my ticket the day they go on sale next year
19:00 <+snapcount> never imagined it would sell out
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20:10 < steveo> How can I find the content of a macro like ^PickRichEditor?
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20:30 <@preaction> steveo, what do you mean? once it's replaced you won't know where the macro itself was
20:36 < ckotil> might be able to edit the macro to write out current location to std error or webgui error log
20:40 < steveo> I found it.  I need a use statement before processing my template.
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--- Day changed Tue Oct 16 2007
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00:04 < elnino> hi. I have a user that want's to change the url of the collaboration thread.  I can't find the name of the field to make that available in the template. i tried url.form, but the text box didn't appear as expected.
00:05 < xdanger> I think there aren't any simple way to allow that for a regular user
00:05 < xdanger> since the urls are autogenerated
00:06 < elnino> I would think it would be like any other asset. if it's blank, it's autogenerated, otherwise you can provide one.  Is this intended behavior for CS or is it a bug? I
00:06 < elnino> nix the last "I"
00:07 < xdanger> the cs overwrites the url process I think...
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00:07 < elnino> hmm. that's too bad.
00:08 < xdanger> You can use the "Change url" function as an admin, but I'm not sure how you could provide that functionality to the user with unmodified webgui
00:08 < steveo> I thought that if a URL was provided, as long as it was unique it would be used.
00:09 < steveo> If it wasn't WebGUI would modify it slightly so that it was made unique.
00:10 < elnino> yes with all other assets. But I'm just trying to allow the user to enter a url for a *thread* asset, but it's apparantly not available.
00:10 < steveo> But I might be mistaking admin behavior with something else.
00:11 < elnino> I could have sworn I was able to as admin, but I'm not... I'm wondering if it *disabppeared * when I upgrade to 7.3.22 (or whatever the last stable was before 7.4*)
00:13 < SynQ> ok
00:13 < SynQ> leaving home for madison in +6 hours
00:13 < SynQ> later
00:13 < SynQ> ~
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00:40 < dj_perl> Hello preaction, I'm going to use webguidev.navman.com for development. Is that ok?
00:41 <@preaction> development of navman things is probably fine
00:42 < dj_perl> Well, it's for gallery. I need a server where I can install Perl/CGI scripts, and dispatch iPhoto export commands to WebGUI.
00:42 <@preaction> you can't dispatch iphoto export commands to localhost?
00:43 < dj_perl> Sure, but I'd have to install and configure a WRE.
00:44 <@preaction> that would be preferred
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01:42 <+MrHairgrease> so
01:42 <+MrHairgrease> how is the wuc going?
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01:50 < perlDreamer> MrHairGrease: inverted character class : /[^aeiou]/  # do not match vowels
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01:55 < perlDreamer> You should pick up a copy of the Mastering Regular Expressions by Jeffrey Freidl
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17:12 < SDuensin> Greetings.
17:12 <@preaction> bonjourno
17:14 < SDuensin> banjokazooie
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18:49 <@preaction> "Boot Camp Assistant Beta has Expired" wtf?
19:08 <@apeiron> preaction, It doesn't like you, and I don't blame it. :)
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04:45 < AMH_bob> Hi everybody, we're finally in a hotel room in Madison. Hard to believe I was riding my bike to the train station this morning in Roermond, Holland 21 hous ago - boy was this a long day!
04:45 < AMH_bob> I'm looking forward to tomorrow!
04:45 < AMH_bob> Goodnight!
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13:54 < AMH_bob> Good morning
13:58 < xootom> Morning
14:02 < AMH_henry> hey bob!
14:02 < AMH_henry> how was your flight?
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14:11 < AMH_bob> Long
14:11 < AMH_bob> Het is nu 6am hier
14:12 < AMH_bob> It's still early and we're goingto get ready for the WUC soon.
14:13 < AMH_bob> We slept alright - probably shook the jetlay off by now (hopefully).
14:16 < AMH_henry> ic.. have fun at the WUC
14:24 <+Radix_> Have a good WUC!
14:27 < AMH_bob> Thanx! Until later!
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15:20 <+MrHairgrease> are we there yet?
15:21  * MrHairgrease is hungry
15:21 < dapperedodo> plop
15:23 <+MrHairgrease> flop
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16:56 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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18:25 <@Khenn> Greetings from the WUC!!!
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18:26 <+perlDreamer> prepare for a flood of WUC attendees
18:26 <+perlDreamer> we just found a way around the hotel firewall
18:26 <+perlDreamer> ++apeiron
18:27 < nuba> ssh tunneling?
18:27 <+perlDreamer> new port
18:27 <+perlDreamer> 7000 vs 6667
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18:27 <@Khenn> Greetings again from the WUC on port 7000 =)
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18:29 <@apeiron> These nubs don't have a machine at home for SSH, so they had to bypass. :)
18:30 < knowma1> well, not all of us are using command-line clients
18:31 <@apeiron> Could still tunnel SSH,shrug.
18:32 < knowma1> ok, i admit it; i'm being lazy
18:32 <+perlDreamer> amazon just released EC2 for "all developers"
18:32 <+perlDreamer> time to look into moving wG tests over there
18:33 < nuba> heh
18:33 < knowma1> how much do they charge for the service?
18:33 <+perlDreamer> don't know, just reading slashdot headlines
18:33 <+perlDreamer> http://developer.amazonwebservices.com/connect/ann.jspa?annID=241
18:33 < knowma1> i wrote an interface to the AWS ecommerce system
18:33 < knowma1> it was easy to do
18:34  * perlDreamer is WRE ignorant...
18:35 <+perlDreamer> Does the WRE guarantee that uploads directories have the right permissions?
18:35 <@apeiron> perlDreamer, https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/browse/branch/photogallery/WebGUI/t/lib/lib/WebGUI/Test <-- testing system pr[tab][tab] (dammit) er, Doug is working on.
18:35 < knowma1> apeiron: is your webgui.org handle 'fishingfan'?
18:35 <@apeiron> whoops
18:35 <@apeiron> knowma1, Nope.
18:36 <+perlDreamer> time for a new wiki page ;)
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18:36 <@apeiron> https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/browse/branch/photogallery/WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/Test/ <-- working version 'cause I suck at the intarwebs.
18:37 < nuba> knowma1: i think fishingfan was len's handle
18:37 < nuba> iirc
18:37 < knowma1> nuba: is len here?
18:37 <+perlDreamer> how about if everyone adds a name/entry/handle entry to http://www.webgui.org/wuc/wiki/who-are-you
18:37 < knowma1> I mean at the WUC
18:37 <+perlDreamer> haven't seen len
18:37 < nuba> len = Len Kranendonk
18:37 <+perlDreamer> I heard he's being a dad this year
18:38 < nuba> bbiaw
18:38 <@apeiron> I guess labelling myself as "PB noob, IRC addict" wouldn't be too professional, eh?
18:39 <+perlDreamer> eh
18:39 <+perlDreamer> we're geeks
18:42 <@apeiron> Thinking about things more, it seems really silly that they're blocking IRC. wtf's with that?
18:44 <@Khenn> aperion: less chatting on IRC = more learning at WUC!
18:53 <+perlDreamer> does anyone else have a Test::MockObject test failure with t/Asset/File/Image.t?
18:53 <@Khenn> is Graphics::Magick working for you?
18:53 <@Khenn> that could be causing the issue
18:54 <+perlDreamer> I don't think it's getting that far into the code, it's dying when I mock the module.
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18:54 <@Khenn> hmm
18:54 <+perlDreamer> could install G::M and try...
18:54 < preaction> it doesn't realize that irc.freenode.net:6667 = irc.freenode.net:7000 :p
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18:55 <+perlDreamer> Graphics::Magick is not on CPAN?
18:55 <@preaction> it's like Image::Magick, it needs to be installed with GM
18:55 <@preaction> if you're on FreeBSD, you need to muck with the Makefile
18:58 <+perlDreamer> preaction: one downside to multiple test files is that perl has to invoke a separate interpreter for each file, so it may slow testing down.
18:58 <@preaction> understandably, plus all the other loading that each test does, but imho it's easier to understand the tests themselves
18:58 <@preaction> once you get to 500, 1000+ lines, you need to keep a lot of things in your head when reading it
18:59 <+perlDreamer> this is true
18:59 <@preaction> the 7+/-2 magic number of things you can keep in your head or whatevz
18:59 <+perlDreamer> Plus, and it isn't released yet, but there is a TAP::Harness::Parallel, which works like make -j N
18:59 <@preaction> i can send you an example, i also did some reformatting with some lines and sections
18:59 <@preaction> ooooh
18:59 <+perlDreamer> yeah!
18:59 <+perlDreamer> we've been using it in parrot in a branch
19:00 <+perlDreamer> and the new prove will use it by default (prove from TAP::Harness/Test::Harness 2.99_3)
19:00 <@preaction> definately awesomecore
19:00 <+perlDreamer> but you have to take care about temporary files and the like
19:00 <@preaction> well, yeah
19:01 <@preaction> oh, i added some more methods to WebGUI::Test. i added my getPage and some more functions for getCollateralPath (you can pass in a filename now)
19:01 <+perlDreamer> nice
19:01 <+perlDreamer> and it does OS insensitive file joinery?
19:03 <@preaction> i think maybe not. i think i was bad-lazy and just appended a '/'
19:03 <+perlDreamer> well, that does work on modern Windows
19:03 <+perlDreamer> and no one I know runs WebGUI on VMS
19:03 <@preaction> it's in my branch for the photo gallery, https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/branch/photogallery/WebGUI
19:03 <+perlDreamer> 7.5 merge?
19:03 <@preaction> it will when I'm done
19:04 <@preaction> i suppose I can merge some things back into 7.5 this week
19:04 <@preaction> well, WebGUI::Test::Maker is still looking for approval, not one of the devs i emailed it to have even looked at it yet
19:04 <+perlDreamer> how many other volunteer devs are there nowadays?
19:05 <@preaction> martin, yung, arjen was at the perl workshops so he might start, morgan, roy, ... we might be approaching 10 these days
19:05 <@preaction> 6 at least, maybe a dozen
19:06 <+perlDreamer> sweet
19:06 <@Khenn> preaction:  did you merge all the stuff that was in the 7.5 pre-branch folder?
19:06 <@preaction> http://www.ohloh.net/projects/103?p=WebGUI <- a fun little website that tracks SVN commits
19:07 <@preaction> Khenn, no, nor the stuff that opal did for the Calendar/Event stuff
19:07 <@Khenn> ok
19:07 <@Khenn> we have to do that at some point
19:07 <@preaction> sounds like a good project for today
19:07 <@Khenn> and by we, I mean you of course =)
19:07 <@preaction> of course
19:08 <+perlDreamer> the royal "we"
19:08 <@Khenn> what is the best way to commit bug fixes now that we have branched?
19:08 <@preaction> are we sure nobody else has merged that stuff yet?
19:08 <@Khenn> should you fix in 7.4 and patch to 7.5?
19:08 <@Khenn> or the other way around?
19:08 <+perlDreamer> I commit them to trunk, then backport to branch
19:08 <@preaction> Khenn, make the bugfix in 7.4 and svn merge command
19:08 <@Khenn> k
19:08 <+perlDreamer> test in both
19:09 <@Khenn> ha
19:09 <@preaction> trunk is 7.4 still
19:09 <@Khenn> I work out of head
19:09 <@Khenn> should I stop that?
19:09 <@preaction> make sure you restrict the svn merge to a specific revision
19:09 <@preaction> head is a revision
19:09 <@preaction> trunk is a "branch" (just the "main" branch)
19:09 <@Khenn> right
19:09 <@Khenn> but I should probably check out that version
19:09 <@Khenn> and do bug fixing out of there
19:09 <@Khenn> I'll create a local copy of it
19:10 <+perlDreamer> dude, I think head is 7.5
19:10 <@preaction> of the 7.5 branch? you have "trunk" now
19:10 <@preaction> really?
19:10 <+perlDreamer> yeah
19:10 <+perlDreamer> there's a 7.4 branch
19:10 <@Khenn> yeah
19:10 <@Khenn> head is 7.5
19:10 <+perlDreamer> and WebGUI.pm says 7.5
19:10 <@preaction> ah
19:10 <@Khenn> that's what I thought
19:10 <@Khenn> I just upgraded this morning
19:10 <@Khenn> so I need a 7.4 branch
19:10 <@preaction> then i usually end up fixing in trunk (7.5) and then backporting the fix using svn merge
19:10 <@Khenn> and then I can patch it to 7.5
19:10 <@preaction> you don't NEED it, but it will work just as well
19:10 <@Khenn> blech
19:10 <@Khenn> that's going to cause problems
19:10 <@preaction> (svn merge will do the same thing as what you'd do)
19:10 <+perlDreamer> yark!  G::M borked my dev box
19:11 <@preaction> pd: nice
19:11 <@Khenn> ok
19:11 <@Khenn> I'll need to learn how to use svn merge
19:11 <+perlDreamer> if you can do svn diff, you can do merge
19:11 <+perlDreamer> it's pretty simple
19:11 <@Khenn> I'm guessing its not too difficult
19:11 <@Khenn> yeah
19:11 <@Khenn> just something I've never done
19:11 <@preaction> svn help merge, it basically does the same thing as: svn diff > file; mv file mybranch; cd mybranch; patch -p0 < file; svn ci
19:12 <@Khenn> right
19:12 <@preaction> plus, iirc, it will notify you of things it failed to merge, i don't know really though
19:12 <@preaction> dunno how it handles that
19:13 <+perlDreamer> I think it gives you the same status output as svn update
19:13 <+perlDreamer> going to try a reboot to fix the linker
19:13 <+perlDreamer> brb
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19:23 <@Khenn> preaction:  I thought you said you had checked your work on the photo gallery into svn ...
19:23 <@preaction> i have my own branch i made
19:23 <@Khenn> i see
19:23 <@Khenn> what branch?
19:24 <@preaction> https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/branch <- the available branches
19:24 <@preaction> mines' photogallery
19:24 <@preaction> i made it before the 7.4 branch, and its something we should do to have a sandbox for large applications
19:24 <@preaction> "photogallery"
19:24 <@preaction> this way my stuff is backed up
19:24 <@Khenn> thanks
19:24 <@Khenn> I want to take a look at what you are doing with i18n
19:25 <@preaction> it's in the Photo asset iirc, i didn't do all the ideas i had, just the class method
19:25 <@preaction> feel free to comment though
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19:25 <@Khenn> k
19:25 <@preaction> oh, and you'll notice how i end up calling it: $class->SUPER::__PACKAGE__->i18n($session), which is ugly and needs to change
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20:56 < SynQ> jo!
20:57 <+MrHairgrease> Cone!
20:57 < SynQ> Martin!
20:57 <+MrHairgrease> Mr Martin to you!
20:57 < SynQ> my name is not cone
20:58 < SynQ> so I don't know why I respond
20:58 <+MrHairgrease> hehe
20:58 <+MrHairgrease> I was just typing that
20:58 < SynQ> I have to put down some feature requests now
20:58 <+MrHairgrease> you go do that
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21:10 <+perlDreamer> anyone seen Vrby? Jt's looking for him.
21:10 <@Khenn> he's not on the 6th floor
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22:42 <@preaction> rofl there's a "CMS Made Simple" CMS (in PHP, it's almost WebFUI)
22:42 <@preaction> we should sue for infringement
22:42 <@Khenn> url?
22:43 <@preaction> http://cmsmadesimple.org
22:44 <@Khenn> I didn't see anything special?  what were we suing for? 
22:44 <@Khenn> ah, the use of "Made Simple" eh?
22:45 <@Khenn> we are Web Done Right =p
22:45 <@preaction> CMS Made Simple v. Web Made Simple
22:45 <@preaction> ah, of course
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22:46 <+perlDreamer> preaction: ping
22:46 <@preaction> double-ewe tee eff?
22:46 <+perlDreamer> http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/sorting-by-number-of-replies-not-sorting
22:47 <+perlDreamer> should replies be added back in, or template vars taken out?
22:47 <@preaction> i could've swore i copypasta'd the getThreadPaginator thing
22:47 <@preaction> hum...
22:47 <+perlDreamer> I think it predates that
22:48 <+perlDreamer> I'm guessing that this is an _old_ bug.
22:48 <+perlDreamer> Although it did use to work that way
22:48 <@preaction> so the template still exposes a URL for it to be sorted by number of replies?
22:48 <+perlDreamer> yes
22:49 <@preaction> imho, if that is there then it's a bug that should be fixed
22:49 <+perlDreamer> see getViewTemplateVars
22:49 <@Khenn> is it not supposed to ?
22:49 <+perlDreamer> that's the question
22:49 <@Khenn> We don't typically take functionality away
22:49 <@Haarg> i think this is due to what i changed recently
22:49 <@Khenn> my guess is it has to do with the bug fix they just did
22:49 <@Haarg> it used to allow sorting by any field
22:49 <+perlDreamer> Yes
22:50 <@preaction> why not? if it was insecure we could just use DBI->quote_identifier
22:50 <@Khenn> they just fixed that ancient bug which would sometimes not update the number of replies
22:50 <@preaction> that was a little different, and that's serious legacy
22:50 <@Khenn> ancient > serious legacy =)
22:50 <+perlDreamer> How 'bout if I go through the list of sortBy URLs and make sure they all work?
22:51 <@Khenn> It's broke because I don't think replies are stored in the database anymore
22:51 <@Khenn> I remember the column being dropped
22:51 <+perlDreamer> ...checking
22:51 <@Khenn> it's probably counting the lineage
22:51 <@Khenn> that would be my guess
22:51 <@preaction> which is what it should do, really
22:52 <@preaction> but that's slow like turtl
22:52 <@Khenn> yar
22:53 <+perlDreamer> that's what it does do, now
22:53 <+perlDreamer> the CS has a replies field and a threads field
22:53 <+perlDreamer> cached in the DB for speed, probably
22:56 <+perlDreamer> iy
22:56 <+perlDreamer> oy
22:57 <+perlDreamer> that whole sortBy needs to be abstracted into a method
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23:14 <@Khenn> heh
23:14 <@Khenn> port 6667 works down in on the 2nd floor through the other wireless network
23:19 <+perlDreamer> The hotel needs a bug list
23:19 <@Khenn> what bugs have you found?
23:19 <@Khenn> I haven't seen any ants or beetles =))
23:22 <+perlDreamer> Tell JT that his article was published live on CIO.com
23:30 <@apeiron> perlDreamer, Tell Ryan/Tavis to announce CIO article at afternoon plenary per JT.
23:31 <+perlDreamer> message relayed
23:31 <+perlDreamer> just who are these non-IRC slackers, anyway?
23:32 <@preaction> they think they're important to the company i think
23:37 <+perlDreamer> actually, there are 4 CIO articles
23:37 <+perlDreamer> tavis is having kittens
23:37 <@preaction> rofl
23:37 <@preaction> not surprised
23:39 <@apeiron> Wow, four? shit.
23:40 <@preaction> whoa, keep it PC
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23:54 <+perlDreamer> hey, 6th floor guys!
23:54 <+perlDreamer> come on down for closing talk
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00:13 <@apeiron> preaction++ # helpful in meatspace
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00:20 < cryolai> If i have a file for download on WebGUI, how can I make it so that visitors do not have to create an account to access that file??
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01:08 <@apeiron> ick, coffee shop wifi is not the place to download a 600 MB ISO image.
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04:19 <@apeiron> Am reading JT's articles on CIO and they tie in with his keynote really well, IMO.
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16:11 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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16:36 <@preaction> I'm down here on second floor with the COOL PEOPLE
16:40 < SynQ> I'm up here on sixth floor with the NERDS
16:41 <@preaction> yeah, but you get Chris Dolan's lecture, which is undeniably awesome
16:41 <@preaction> Perl::Critic++
16:42 < SynQ> and Chris has exquisite pronounciation :)
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16:43 <@preaction> he's definately good at what he's doing, i'll give him that. i can only hope at 9:30 i can be half as good
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21:42 <+perlDreamer> he's here
21:42 <+perlDreamer> he's gone
21:42 <+perlDreamer> he's back, with a new name
21:42 <+perlDreamer> that one's gone, too
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22:21 <@preaction_> i am empowered!
22:22 <+perlDreamer> I thought you were preaction :)
22:26 -!- preaction_ is now known as empowered
22:26 <@empowered> nono, see?
22:26 <+perlDreamer> ah, yes
22:26 -!- empowered is now known as preaction
22:26 <+perlDreamer> Got time for a bug check?
22:26 <@preaction> surely
22:27 <+perlDreamer> http://www.webgui.org/bugs/tracker/how-to-kill-a-webgui-website
22:27 <@preaction> oh, that's valid, it'll work
22:27 <@preaction> i wouldn't do it, but it'll work
22:27 <@preaction> basically forget to commit your new user login template and then log out
22:28 <@preaction> the fix would be, imho, not allowing uncommitted templates to be chosen there
22:28 <+perlDreamer> That's what I did.
22:28 < khenn_> right
22:28 <@preaction> k, there's that new way to return errors from the settings page
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22:28 <@preaction> oh, wait, that was just for Auth modules
22:28 <+perlDreamer> Actually, I blocked it from the list of templates
22:28 <@preaction> oooooh, better idea
22:29 <+perlDreamer> Yeah, so changes to Asset::Template->getList, Form/Template.pm and Operation/Settings.
22:29 <@preaction> well, i dunno. they might be stuck in "OMG Where's my template!" hell
22:29 <+perlDreamer> How 'bout some additional hoverHelp for that one?
22:30 <@preaction> that would probably work
22:31 <+perlDreamer> added
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22:42 <+perlDreamer> has the changelog policy been changed?
22:42 <+perlDreamer> hm
22:42 <+perlDreamer> I mean, should this fix be against 7.4.11, or 7.5?
22:43 <@preaction> 7.4.11
22:45 <+perlDreamer> there's way too much js in svn
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22:52 <+perlDreamer> no matter "what" the constructor is?
22:53 <+perlDreamer> WebGUI::MyObject->construct ?
22:53 <+perlDreamer> does it use introspection?
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16:50 < SDuensin> Greetings.
16:51 < preaction> morning
16:53 < AMH_henry> afternoon
16:54 < preaction> you're not at the WUC?
16:55 < AMH_henry> me? nope
16:57 < preaction> one of your co-workers / constituents?
16:57 < preaction> i know someone presented some of the work that AMH was doing with webgui
16:57 < AMH_henry> yes, AMH_bob is there along with our boss
16:57 < preaction> ahh
16:58 < preaction> a lot more ppl here than i predicted, so it's hard to keep track of who everyone is, where they're from, etc...
16:59 < AMH_henry> have you seen the presentation?
17:03 < preaction> i dont think i saw the actual presentation, there was a BOF session about "What do you do with WebGUI" and someone from AMH showed off Swifty
17:03 < AMH_henry> ic... who do you think of it?
17:03 < AMH_henry> /who/what/
17:03 < preaction> it's definately interesting, if necessarily a bit hackish
17:04 < preaction> does fix some problems with webgui being hard to use
17:04 < preaction> i like the wizard-like features of it
17:04 < preaction> JT really liked it too, and said he'd like to try to merge some of the ideas (if not some of the code) into WebGUI
17:05 < preaction> JT showed off some screenshots of a potential future admin interface that isn't as wizard-like (which is a drawback), but is easier than the current admin interface
17:08 < AMH_henry> yeah, i've seen those screenshots. more ajax like. that's nice. in the current form, swifty is very limited. i hope we can add some for ajax too.
17:10 < preaction> yeah, there's so much that can be done with improving the admin interface it's hard to know where to start ;)
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17:33  * apeiron push @projects, "module to format code for presentations";
17:59 < nuba> apeiron: long time ago i used to choose a nice colorscheme on vim, then export that as HTML
17:59 < nuba> apeiron: i remember it was easy to touch it up afterwards
18:04 < nuba> those are a teacher's delight: syntax-colored programming assignments
18:05 < nuba> :D
18:05 <@apeiron> e.g. for presentations. :)
18:07 < nuba> yeah imagine how you'd feel when, after reading pages and pages of monotonous monochromatic (and sometimes problematic) code, someone turns a colorful code page for review
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18:11 < nuba> heh
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18:24 < knowma1> what is the url for the online api docs?
18:26 < preaction> http://www.plainblack.com/downloads/builds/7.4.10-stable/api/
18:26 < preaction> replace 7.4.10-stable as you will
18:27 < knowma1> thank you
18:39 < preaction> IT'S SHOWTIME!
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18:50 < nuba> is preaction presenting something at the wuc?
18:51 < Toptyg> Hi all can I run webgui under apache 13 ?
18:53 < nuba> Toptyg: its not supported anymore, you should look for apache2+modperl2
18:54 < nuba> its been like that since the 7.x series..
18:55 < nuba> you can try your luck with older releases, but you'll be missing a lot of stuff
18:55 < nuba> whats your scenario?
18:56 < Toptyg> heh
18:56 < Toptyg> can I use fcgi perl?
18:56 < nuba> if possible, you should go for running webgui with the WRE
18:57 < nuba> you need modperl
18:57 < Toptyg> I woona use Nginx ... 
18:57 < nuba> nginx?
18:57 < nuba> is that edible?
18:57 < Toptyg> yes
18:58 < nuba> oh i remember seeing about it once.. fastmail's imap proxy of choice
18:58 < Toptyg> I may use Nginx+ apache..
18:59 < nuba> well you should know that there's a fine-tuned reverse proxy already being shipped with the WRE
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18:59 < nuba> a slim apache doing mod_proxy stuff
19:00 < Toptyg> Better use Apache 2.2 or 2.0 ?
19:00 < nuba> then a fatty apache doing the webgui magik
19:00 < nuba> better use the WRE
19:00 < Toptyg> Nginx it front-end ...he cool work with static..
19:01 < nuba> all you need to run webgui is in the WRE, you should donwload it and inspect the package, then you'll understand it better
19:02 < Toptyg> what is the wre ? )
19:02 < nuba> of course, youre not obligated to use everything from the WRE, you can just choose not use wre's mod_proxy-enabled apache and use nginx instead
19:03 < nuba> http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=51417&package_id=148913
19:04 < Toptyg> Why does not exist port for freebsd? with webgui 
19:04 < Toptyg> aaa
19:04 < nuba> maybe cause no one made one yet?...
19:05 < Toptyg> I use Freebsd :) 
19:05 < nuba> would be nice to do cd /usr/ports/www/webgui; make install
19:07 < nuba> i use mostly freebsd too
19:07 < Toptyg>  heh no exist in my collection ) try to find in site..
19:09 < nuba> you would need to work a bit on webgui's directory tree to make it work accordingly to freebsd's filesystem layout
19:10 < Toptyg> ugu i all understand..
19:10 < nuba> yeah, man 7 hier
19:11 < Toptyg> I am fron Russia.. I know http://4site.ru CMS on perl.. 
19:12 < Toptyg> but webgui better on first apinion
19:13 < Toptyg> many people say that in 4site many sql selection
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19:14 < Toptyg> and they load server more
19:14 < nuba> i dont quite get what youre saying, would it be "you hear on 4site people saying that webgui does too many sql queries and causes a higher load in the server"?
19:18 < Toptyg> no on site 4site I see warning that for use 4site cms  too more SQL selets..
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19:22 < Toptyg> >50 sql request per script 
19:25 < nuba> well webgui is sql-query-happy too... but webgui's developers are very performance-conscious here as well, so you can kinda assume things arent being dully designed and your resources arent being wasted when youre running it
19:27 < nuba> also theres caching, which usually improves things a lot
19:27 < Toptyg> :) ok
19:28 < Toptyg> U developer webgui? )
19:28 < Toptyg> are
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19:31 < nuba> no, im not an official developer nor associated with plainblack, but yeah, im writing some code which I plan to contribute back to the community
19:32 < nuba> if that turns into an habit I may even become more involved or take on a bigger role, but right now im just a power-user
19:32 < nuba> who hangs in #webgui
19:33 < Toptyg> heh I need go... that is webgui no in ports of bsd is not cool ) many cms add ports for freebsd ) drupal phpbb typa3 ... 
19:34 < nuba> these are on a different league
19:35 < nuba> you should go to demo.plainblack.com and get yourself a running instance of webgui to play with
19:35 < nuba> then look at all the stuff in the WRE
19:36 < nuba> then you'll understand why i say "they're a different league"
19:36 < Toptyg> ) I have done it yet
19:37 < Toptyg> thx for help. bye
19:37 < nuba> it may be that your needs are satisfied with something simpler like frupal or phpbb..if so, then maybe using webgui is overkill for you..
19:37 < nuba> bye
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20:55 <@khenn> Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrgggggg
21:04 <@reaction> wheeeee
21:14 <@reaction> perlbot, 8ball Will people confuse me for preaction?
21:14 < perlbot> Magic 8ball says: Yes
21:21 < nuba> you can try postaction too, its not taken yet i guess..
21:50 < AMH_bob> Hey khenn, you're active in IRC!!!!
21:50 <@khenn> active?  I wouldn't go that far =
21:51 < AMH_bob> :P
21:51 <@khenn> I just recently learned how to make the IRC client on the mac alert me
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22:13 < dionak> in the monthly calendar view, what's the variable to get the url of the previous and next months? i thought it was prevPageUrl and nextPageUrl... but that's sending me back to the previous year and next year. 
22:14 <@khenn> reaction would know that
22:15 < preaction> dionak, currently there is no way. the "page" is named such because of a future consideration of showing multiple months
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22:15 < preaction> perhaps it would make more sense to change it to nextYear and then make nextPage work the way you want it to
22:16 < dionak> that makes sense. thanks.
22:16 <@khenn> there is a way to page through months
22:16 <@khenn> each month should have a URL
22:16 < preaction> its a loop
22:16 <@khenn> does it use a month abbreviation?
22:16 <@khenn> it passes in a dateformat or something right?
22:16 < dionak> yes, a date format
22:16 < preaction> you could write an HTML::Template::Expr template, sure
22:17 < dionak> that's an idea
22:17 <@khenn> you could write a macro to compute the next and previous date formats
22:17 <@khenn> not sure what you'd do with HTML::Template::Expr
22:17 < preaction> using some more evilness, when since you're a comitter all you have to do is submit the RFE, fix it, and it'll be the way you want it
22:18 < dionak> hm...yes. i'm under a tight timeline but i'll see what i can do. 
22:19 <@khenn> the macro should be like 3 lines of code
22:19 < preaction> so would the addition of a prevMonthUrl and nextMonthUrl :p
22:19 < preaction> that would be useful to everyone
22:19 <@khenn> $session->datetime->add($currentmonth,0,1,1);
22:19 <@khenn> or something
22:20 < dionak> cool, thanks. i'll look into it
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23:38 < ckotil> whats the string to append to get the print view?
23:40 <@khenn> print view of what?
23:40 < ckotil> anything, using the fail safe template.
23:40 < ckotil> page layout for instance.
23:40 <@khenn> oh
23:40 <@khenn> to see the raw content of an asset from the url?
23:41 < ckotil> yeah. i thought there was something you could append to the url.
23:42 <@khenn> ?func=ajaxInlineView
23:42 < ckotil> sweet. thanks khenn 
23:43 < ckotil> wow. thats pefect actually. I created a special template at the request of my service desk for organizing a 'playbook'
23:43 < ckotil> they neglected to mention they wanted to print it from their browsers.
23:43 < ckotil> well this solves that ;)
23:44 <@khenn> cool
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05:59 < SDuensin> Why does WebGUI hate me?
05:59 < SDuensin> I have a pending version and Spectre says there are zero workflows to process.
05:59  * SDuensin sighs
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20:32 < dionak> i'm wanting to go through and entire site's article collection, search for a string and replace it. it's a domain name that is prefixing all the links in articles. has anyone done this? not sure if anyone is actually online today either. ;)
20:33 < dionak> frank inspired me to do this with a script and i'm not sure if i should pull the records straight from the db or pull objects for the articles.
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21:15 < cap10morgan> dionak: you can do that w/ a utility script
21:16 < cap10morgan> you can pull all assets of a certain class (in this case, WebGUI::Asset::Wobject::Article)
21:16 < cap10morgan> and then edit them however you want and commit the version tag
21:16 < cap10morgan> (all from the script)
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21:45 < dionak> yes, that's pretty much my plan but i'm trying to see how to pull all the article assets and edit the description. 
21:45 < cap10morgan> well, for pulling the articles, you'd do...
21:47 < cap10morgan> i'm doing something similar in another script, let me pull it up
21:47 < dionak> k
22:13 < dionak> ok, i've got all the articles as article objects and have the search and replace working. should i create a new revision? thinking yes..
22:49 < dionak> i think i've got it but would still love to see your code.
23:15 < cap10morgan> dionak: sorry, lunch called :)
23:15 < cap10morgan> ok, here's what my code does:
23:15 < dionak> np. 
23:16 < cap10morgan> I'm getting collab systems, so I have:
23:16 < cap10morgan> my $root = WebGUI::Asset->getRoot($session);
23:18 < cap10morgan> my $collabSystems = $root->getLineage(['self','descendants'], {returnObjects=>1, includeOnlyClasses=>\@exportClasses});
23:18 < cap10morgan> oops, and @exportClasses is an array w/ one element:
23:19 < cap10morgan> my @exportClasses = ['WebGUI::Asset::Wobject::Article']; (in your case)
23:19 < dionak> interesting...
23:21 < dionak> i ended up doing the following
23:21 < dionak>     select 
23:21 < dionak>         asset.assetId
23:21 < dionak>     from 
23:21 < dionak>         asset
23:21 < dionak>         join assetData on asset.assetId=assetData.assetId
23:21 < dionak>     where 
23:22 < dionak>         asset.className='WebGUI::Asset::Wobject::Article' 
23:22 < dionak>     order by 
23:22 < dionak>         assetData.revisionDate desc 
23:22 < dionak> my @articles = $db->buildArray($sql);
23:22 < dionak> sorry for the paste
23:22 < dionak> then called new on each assetId
23:23 < cap10morgan> it should be fine to do something like that, a couple things to bear in mind:
23:23 < cap10morgan> 1. doing things against the db could break in the future, but if this is strictly a one-off thing, that's ok
23:23 < cap10morgan> 2. this will get you multiple instances of many assets
23:23 < cap10morgan> since there will be multiple revisions in there
23:24 < dionak> it updates every revision doesn't it?
23:24 < cap10morgan> however, when you call new, it should default to returning the newest revision
23:24 < dionak> oh, ok.
23:24 < dionak> i get it
23:24 < dionak> this is a one off mass edit. 
23:24 < cap10morgan> i try to do things w/ the API as much as possible because my "one-off" scripts usually end up being used more often than I intended
23:24 < cap10morgan> :)
23:25 < cap10morgan> but this should work
23:26 < cap10morgan> really, for that query, you shouldn't even need to join w/ assetData
23:26 < dionak> oh yea, you're right. especially since i'm calling new with the assetId to get the object.
23:26 <@khenn> dionak:  you are going to get all of the articles that way
23:27 < dionak> yes, that was my intention. every article on the site. 
23:27 <@khenn> not the latest revision
23:27 <@khenn> right, but you'll get all the revisions of all the articles
23:27 < cap10morgan> not if she calls WebGUI::Asset::new on the assetId's
23:27 < dionak> yes, i see. but then calling new returns the latest revision. i should probably have done a group by to reduce the rows. 
23:27 < cap10morgan> that defaults to just returning her the latest revision for each asset
23:28 <@khenn> what will happen is a bunch of errors
23:28 < dionak> is there a way in the api to return every instance of a particular asset? instead of the db select i used?
23:28 <@khenn> new will not return a valid asset
23:28 <@khenn> yes
23:28 <@khenn> instantiate the root
23:28 <@khenn> or the root url
23:28 < dionak> ok, like cap10morgan's example
23:28 <@khenn> $asset->getLineage
23:29 < cap10morgan> oh, hey Frank :)
23:29 <@khenn> get all the descendants of the root
23:29 < cap10morgan> yeah, listen to khenn, he knows more than me :)
23:29 <@khenn> that are of type article
23:29 <@khenn> the getLineage method will also return you the asset
23:29 <@khenn> the latest revision of the asset too
23:30 < dionak> right on...thanks. 
23:30 <@khenn> then you can loop of the results and do a $asset->update{ description=> ... };
23:30 < dionak> the docs seem to conflict between the update method and the addRevision method, btw.
23:30 < dionak> the POD for update says if you want to create a new revision, use addRevision. 
23:31 < dionak> then addRevision says that programmers don't want to use addRevision directly but rather update()
23:31 < dionak> just fyi
23:31 <@khenn> right
23:31 <@khenn> that's true
23:32 <@khenn> if you want to add a new revision, you should use addRevision
23:32 <@khenn> if you do ->update
23:32 <@khenn> it will update w/o creating a new revision
23:32 < dionak> ok. makes a little more sense. 
23:33 < dionak> khenn, are you frank?
23:33 <@khenn> yep
23:33 <@khenn> how was the flight home?
23:33 <@khenn> =)
23:33 < dionak> cool. thanks again for the presentation. i used it today to massively import 130+ articles. :)
23:33 <@khenn> great!
23:34 < dionak> the flight was very easy, both of them. have another tomorrow to Montreal. 
23:34 < dionak> so i'm trying to knock some stuff out today. :)
23:34 <@khenn> I'm just hanging out.  Fooling around with YUI
23:35 < dionak> YUI's cool. i've been doing a lot with it lately. i learned a lot writing an article about it recently. 
23:35 < dionak> i've got a lightbox prototype in YUI.
23:36 <@khenn> I'm going to be adding ajax to some of the form fields
23:38 < dionak> would love to see it when you get it...
23:40 < dionak> quick question. macros should work in calendar templates right?
23:41 < dionak> oh, nvrmind
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04:01 < SDuensin> Anybody alive tonight?
04:02 <@preaction> of courses
04:03 < SDuensin> I have a problem with Spectre that I can't find.  :-(
04:03 < SDuensin> I committed some changes and they show as "Pending".  Spectre doesn't see them.
04:04 < SDuensin> spectre.pl --test passes just fine.
04:04 < SDuensin> And a --status shows zero for everything.
04:05 <@preaction> commit with or without approval? 
04:05 <@preaction> perlbot step 1
04:05 < perlbot> No matter what, step 1 is always "Check the Error Log"
04:05 < SDuensin> I did step 1.  :-P
04:05 <@preaction> yes, but you did not tell me that you did
04:05 < SDuensin> Hey, if it was easy, I'd have fixed it.  :-P
04:06 <@preaction> this is tech support, unfortunately i have to start at the basics. when you assume you make an ass out of... you know
04:06 <@preaction> next step: check the WorkflowInstance table, pastebin it somewhere
04:06 < SDuensin> I know.  I've done my fair share of support.  Users suck.
04:07 <@preaction> more importantly: make sure the tagId => "blah" matches up with the right tagId
04:07 <@preaction> did you stop spectre and then run it with --run --debug ?
04:08 < SDuensin> There's a lot of nulls in that table.  That's bad, isn't it?
04:08 <@preaction> let me see the pastebin
04:08 < SDuensin> Working on it.
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04:09 < SDuensin> http://pastebin.com/m60563432
04:11 <@preaction> it just means that none of them have run yet
04:11 < SDuensin> Ah, ok.
04:11 < SDuensin> Lemme do --run --debug.
04:12 <@preaction> the null object with the null parameters is a little weird, probaly means it was made incorrectly but not erroneously
04:12 <@preaction> (there's no problem there at all, i mean)
04:13 < SDuensin> Ut oh.  I have a few sites that say:
04:13 < SDuensin> ADMIN: [Error] Couldn't fetch Spectre configuration data for www.cloudcircle.com.conf
04:14 < SDuensin> Where is it trying to fetch from?
04:16 <@preaction> the first sitename in your configuration
04:16 <@preaction> and the port specified in spectre.conf
04:17 <@preaction> the usual fix for this is to add that sitename to your /etc/hosts file
04:17 < SDuensin> How do I know what is the first site name?  Alphabetical?  Random?
04:17 <@preaction> it's a list.
04:17 <@preaction> the first one in the list
04:18 <@preaction> "sitename" : ['a','list','of','sitenames'],
04:18 <@preaction> "a" would be the one spectre tries to connect to
04:18 < SDuensin> Looking for that.
04:20 < SDuensin> Wonder why it can't find it?  Pings fine.
04:20 <@preaction> from where?
04:20 < SDuensin> The box WebGUI runs on.
04:20 <@preaction> is that the box spectre runs on?
04:20 < SDuensin> Yes.
04:21 <@preaction> can you run "wget <sitename>/?op=spectreGetSiteData" and pastebin the output?
04:21 <@preaction> i think that's what it is
04:21 < SDuensin> Checking.
04:23 < SDuensin> It returns the home page of the site (currently the WebGUI default page).
04:23 < SDuensin> That's not right, yea?
04:23 <@preaction> there should be something in the error log then
04:24 < SDuensin> 2007/10/21 04:39:48 - ERROR - www.cloudcircle.com.conf - main::[[undef]] - Couldn't execute operation : WebGUI::Operation::Spectre::www_spectreGetSiteData. Root cause: Can't call method "get" on an undefined value at /data/WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Operation/Spectre.pm line 53.
04:25 <@preaction> now we're getting somewhere
04:25 < SDuensin> :-)
04:25 < SDuensin> Really.  I looked in the log before.  :-)
04:25 <@preaction> suuuuure
04:25 < SDuensin> :-P
04:25 <@preaction> it was probably a ways up there (since spectre tries only once to connect to a site)
04:25 < SDuensin> <preaction> Damn users.
04:26 <@preaction> unfortunately, my line 53 is probably very different, since i see no "get" on there at all
04:26 <@preaction> you're gonna have to let me know what line 53 is
04:26 < SDuensin> Pastebin coming.
04:26 <@preaction> i imagine it's $instance->getWorkflow->get("enabled");
04:27 <@preaction> which i think means that the workflow is gone
04:27 <@preaction> did you delete a workflow recently?
04:27 < SDuensin> Nope.  Pretty much a brand new site.
04:27 < SDuensin> I'd just delete it and make a new one, except it's not the only site doing this.
04:28 <@preaction> then on any of those sites have you deleted workflows?
04:28 <@preaction> have you run testEnvironment.pl recently?
04:28 < SDuensin> testEnvironment.pl passes with flying colors.
04:28 < SDuensin> And you're correct about what line 53 is.
04:28 <@preaction> any mention in the modperl error log about use/import errors?
04:28 < SDuensin> I don't know if anything has been deleted.  I'm not the webmaster on all these sites.
04:28 <@preaction> hell...
04:28 < SDuensin> Looking.
04:30 < SDuensin> A crapload of "Apache2::SizeLimit httpd process too big" lines
04:30 <@preaction> eh, it can't be what i thought since deleting a workflow deletes all the instances of that workflow
04:30 <@preaction> that's not good...
04:30 <@preaction> i forget how to configure that, i believe it's something in preload.perl
04:30 < SDuensin> Nothing with me ever is.
04:31 <@preaction> but, that shouldn't be related to what the problem is
04:31 < SDuensin> You guys need to inform WebGUI that I'm it's greatest fan and that it needs to quit screwing with me.
04:31 <@preaction> any custom code running on here?
04:31 < SDuensin> None.
04:31 <@preaction> curiouser and curiouser
04:31 < SDuensin> I'm at 7.4.8 (I think) and am scared to upgrade until this is resolved.
04:32 <@preaction> oh, uhm... you might want to do it anyway, since there's at least one bug in 7.4.8 that could cause something like this
04:32 < SDuensin> Ok.  Going to check my backup real fast.  If it's current, I'll do it right now.
04:33 <@preaction> plus, we can be sure that it isn't an old bug before we start a new bug report here
04:33 <@preaction> at the very least, we have the problem with an object not being checked before a method is called on it
04:34 <@preaction> one of the problems with being optimistic about object constructors: something always goes wrong
04:37 < SDuensin> Upgrading.
04:41 < SDuensin> Ok, I'm scared.
04:42 < SDuensin> It thinks I have 7.3.22.  Database upgrades seem to be going fine though.
04:42 <@preaction> uhm.
04:42 <@preaction> uhhhmm.....
04:43 < SDuensin> rc.webgui restart(ing)
04:45 < SDuensin> Well, sites seem to work.  Dunno WTF that was about.
04:46 < SDuensin> Same crap with Spectre though.
04:47 <@preaction> i'd post a bug about it
04:47 <@preaction> i assume the line number changed
04:47 < SDuensin> #68 now
04:48 <@preaction> which matches to what one i have
04:48 < SDuensin> How do I even file this?  I don't even know what's wrong.  "Spectre is broken" isn't a very good bug report.
04:48 < SDuensin> And can it be hacked around to fix it?
04:48 <@preaction> for some reason there's a workflow instance that doesn't seem to have a valid workflow
04:49 <@preaction> valid workflow meaning that either the workflow can't be instanciated or it just doesn't exist anymore
04:50 < SDuensin> So how's that relate to the version tag?  I can see it in the admin panel.
04:50 <@preaction> it might, it might not
04:50 <@preaction> i don't know what workflow it is
04:50 <@preaction> might want to match up the workflowId in the workflow table with the ones in the workflowInstance table and see if there are any descrepencies
04:51 <@preaction> otherwise i dunno
04:51  * SDuensin wishes he had a better MySQL tool on that box.
04:55 < SDuensin> The only valid ones I see are a "Commit without approval" and "Send email".  The others are null.  That's (still) odd.
04:58  * SDuensin fears for his server.
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05:00 < SDuensin> Hey, preaction - the sites that don't work all seem to have nulls in the database.
05:06 < SDuensin> Removing the nulls from one of them made Spectre happier.
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05:22  * SDuensin is sad.
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10:20 < dj_perl> Hello, anyone home?
10:22 < dj_perl> I'm looking for a way to log all HTTP traffic between my browser and my web server. Wireshark is too low level. Apache mod_tee is not usable. Any suggestions?
11:01 < nuba> tcpdump? ethereal?
11:02 < nuba> ethereal is very conversation-tracking-friendly
11:04 <+Radix-wrk> iptraf
11:04 < nuba> it'll collect the payload, filter, and decode to present it to you in a very human-friendly way
11:05 < nuba> and it supports lots of protocols
11:07 < dj_perl> Yep, ethreal is now Wireshark. I haven't figured out how to get a human-readable http conversation out of it.
11:08 < dj_perl> But if you say it can, I'll investigate further with wireshark.
11:08 < dj_perl> Thanks!
11:08 < nuba> whoa its been almost an year since it was renamed
11:09 < nuba> i never needed to update the install I had, so I didnt even notice
11:10 < nuba> you want HTTP only, or HTTPS too?
11:11 <+Radix-wrk> heh.. from Wireshark's trademarks list - "...Rooty Tooty Fresh 'N Fruity is a registered trademark of IHOP Corporation..."
11:11 < nuba> cause you may want to look into firefox's livehttpheaders extension if you need HTTPS too
11:12 < dj_perl> I'm happy with http for my purpose at hand.
11:12 <+Radix-wrk> What's wrong with apache's normal logging functionality?
11:12 <+Radix-wrk> Something being lost in the middle?
11:13 < dj_perl> Yes, cookie headers.
11:13 < nuba> well are you being able to capture with ethereal and see captured packets lists?
11:13 < dj_perl> I have an Objective-C client that gets cookies fine from the PHP gallery web service, but not from my reverse-engineered web service.
11:14 < dj_perl> Yes, I can see the packet lists, but they're not very human-readable.
11:14 < nuba> ok, so, right click in a HTTP conversation (i suppose they' re hilighted as green in wireshark as well)
11:15 < dj_perl> Since I'm using a custom http client, livehttpheaders is of limited use.
11:15 < nuba> and select "follow conversation"
11:15 < nuba> it'll then present you the entire talk between the server and the client
11:15 < dj_perl> Excellent, I'll try it and let you know.
11:15 < nuba> now im telling this from memory, i dont have ethereal in this box right now
11:16 < nuba> so look for something in these lines, shouldn't be to different from what ive said
11:17 < nuba> too*
11:17 < nuba> its a lovely piece of software :)
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17:07 <@apeiron> Good morning, #webgui!
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17:15 < MrHairgreas1> Khenn
17:15 < MrHairgreas1> how did you survive last saturday?
17:15 < MrHairgreas1> was it as expected?
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17:25 <@khenn> how did I survive?
17:25 <@khenn> =)
17:25 <+MrHairgrease> well
17:26 <+MrHairgrease> you still seem to be able to write
17:26 <+MrHairgrease> which is a good sign i think
17:26 <@khenn> I slept most of Saturday
17:26 <+MrHairgrease> ah
17:26 <+MrHairgrease> I think that would've been for the best
17:26 <+MrHairgrease> =)
17:27 <@khenn> I woke up around  6pm feeling great in fact
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> Koen and I were not feeling all that well too
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> at around 6 i was feeling good agin too
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> So
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> when are you comming to the netherlands
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> so we can do it all over again
17:27 <+MrHairgrease> but with dutch beers
17:28 <+MrHairgrease> =)
17:28 <@khenn> Have a European WUC and I can expense it =)
17:29 <+MrHairgrease> hehe
17:29 <@khenn> with the 5000 Euros per dollar conversion rate, it is too expensive for me to drink there
17:29 <+MrHairgrease> hmmm
17:29 <+MrHairgrease> that's something i hadn't considred yet...
17:29 <+MrHairgrease> you could ask jt to pay your salary in euro though
17:30 <@khenn> actually, my wife and I have been talking about going to Europe.  She wants to go to England but I could convince her to visit Holland instead =)
17:30 <@khenn> maybe in a year or two
17:30 <@khenn> and JT is too smart for that
17:31 <+MrHairgrease> if you go to england anyway you should visit some countries on the continent as well
17:31 <+MrHairgrease> you should ask jesse
17:31 <+MrHairgrease> he's done a complete eurotour/
17:31 <+MrHairgrease> he could probably tell you about the highlights
17:31 <+MrHairgrease> delft is obviously one of those =)
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17:33 <+MrHairgrease> so where are all the other wuc foto's
17:34 <+MrHairgrease> i know tavis took more than are on the site right now
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18:17 < Radix__> delft was definitely one of the highlights for me, I enjoyed my time there immensely :)
18:17 < Radix__> and the lovely beer helped :)
18:17 < Radix__> and with that, I'm off to bed :)
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18:23 < wgGuest99> What do I do after downloading WRE 0.8.0 ?
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> create a /data directory
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> cd to that directory
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> untar the archive there
18:26 < wgGuest99> ok, did that
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> cd to /data/wre/docs
18:26 <+MrHairgrease> read install.txt
18:27 <+MrHairgrease> and follow the instructions
18:28 <+MrHairgrease> i take it you downloaded a pre compiled binary btw right?
18:28 < wgGuest99> yes
18:28 <+MrHairgrease> ok
18:28 < wgGuest99> the instructions are kind of hard to read in notepad
18:29 <@apeiron> eep
18:29 <@apeiron> Well, at least you don't have to build it on Windows. :)
18:29 <+MrHairgrease> i dunno anything about the windows wre
18:30 <+MrHairgrease> it looks screwed in notepad b/c notepad cannot cope with unix linebreaks
18:30 <+MrHairgrease> try open it in another editor in stead
18:30 < wgGuest99> ok
18:30 <+MrHairgrease> i think word must be able to display it correctly
18:30 <+MrHairgrease> other than that
18:30 < wgGuest99> ok, muck better in Internet Explorer
18:30 <+MrHairgrease> i hav no experience with the windows wre whatsoever
18:31 <@khenn> wordpad
18:33 < wgGuest99> Are all of the commands in install.txt document done in linux?
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18:44 < knowmad> has anyone exported Root as a package for doing a site migration? did you have problems with timeouts when importing to the new server?
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18:44 <+MrHairgrease> knowmad: never tried that
18:45 <+MrHairgrease> but i can right now
18:45 <+MrHairgrease> hold on
18:45 < knowmad> yeah, me either. i don't recommend it.
18:46 <+MrHairgrease> does it bork the system?
18:46 < knowmad> fortunately, no; it just doesn't load up the pkg
18:47 <+MrHairgrease> i'm not sure you'll want to export the root anyway
18:47 <+MrHairgrease> there's an enormous amount of duplicated data
18:47 <+MrHairgrease> in th eimport node
18:47 < knowmad> yeah
18:48 <+MrHairgrease> well
18:48 <+MrHairgrease> just tried it
18:49 <+MrHairgrease> and it does output a wgpgk file
18:49 <+MrHairgrease> it's only 5 MB
18:49 < knowmad> mine is 8mb
18:49 <+MrHairgrease> so I'm not sure if that's correct
18:49 <+MrHairgrease> ok
18:49 <+MrHairgrease> mine is on a pretty much vanilla site
18:49 <+MrHairgrease> so that would explain the differenece
18:50 < knowmad> yeah
18:50 <@Haarg> package import is another thing that should probably be able to be done via workflow
18:50 <+MrHairgrease> haarg: indeed
18:50 <+MrHairgrease> trying importing it now
18:51 < knowmad> ok
18:52 <+MrHairgrease> i get a problem with request
18:52 <+MrHairgrease> oh crap
18:52 < knowmad> when you imported?
18:53 <+MrHairgrease> that's because I don't have the memory wobject installed on that site
18:53 <+MrHairgrease> so it couldn't import that asset
18:54 < knowmad> so when the pkg was being it died?
18:54 <+MrHairgrease> but up until that moment
18:54 <+MrHairgrease> it did import stuff
18:55 < knowmad> so if you add the memory wobject, it will prob. import successfully
18:55 <+MrHairgrease> think so
18:55 <+MrHairgrease> the cool thing is
18:55 < knowmad> is there a way to fire off the package load from command line?
18:55 < knowmad> that way i could upload to server then import via command line
18:56 <+MrHairgrease> that the root node isn't imported below the place where you import
18:56 < knowmad> are you asking or telling?
18:56 <+MrHairgrease> b/c the root node's assetid is the same on all sits
18:56 <+MrHairgrease> telling
18:56 <+MrHairgrease> so
18:56 < knowmad> so it will always import to root
18:56 < knowmad> ?
18:56 <+MrHairgrease> if you use this approach
18:57 <+MrHairgrease> then it'll prolly always import under root
18:57 < knowmad> that's a good thing
18:57 <+MrHairgrease> and make new revisions for all overlapping assets
18:57 <+MrHairgrease> those with identical assetids
18:57 <+MrHairgrease> which are only those that ship with webgui 
18:58 <+MrHairgrease> in order to do it commandline
18:58 <+MrHairgrease> you should make a utility script
18:58 <+MrHairgrease> it's not that hard
18:59 <+MrHairgrease> all the code is in WebGUI::AssetPackage
18:59 <+MrHairgrease> you should do something like
18:59 <+MrHairgrease> create a temp storage location
19:00 <+MrHairgrease> addFromFileSystem the package to that storage
19:00 <+MrHairgrease> call $root->importPackage($storage)
19:00 <+MrHairgrease> backup first ofcourse =)
19:02 < knowmad> thanks MHG
19:02 <+MrHairgrease> np
19:08 < knowmad> i think i'm going to do this the old-fashioned way and dump db and restore on server
19:08 <+MrHairgrease> ok
19:09 <+MrHairgrease> i can imagine importing's not the best way to copy sites anyway
19:42 < knowmad> ok, so now i'm running into upgrade problems (sigh).....
19:43 < knowmad> has anyone who has upgraded from 7.3.22 to 7.4.0 hit the following error ---- DBD::mysql::st execute failed: Table 'assetKeyword' already exists
19:43 < knowmad> oh, sh**, nevermind. i forgot to dump the tables before importing from 7.3.22
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19:49 < wgGuest57> I'm trying to install WebGUI Runtime Environment
19:51 < wgGuest57> its asking me to put in password when I put in wreconsole.pl
19:52 < wgGuest57> sudo wreconsole.pl
19:52 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
19:52 <+MrHairgrease> you have to enter your pw if you sudo stuff
19:54 < wgGuest57> when I just type in .setenvironment.sh and wreconsole.pl on the linux system it doesn't do anything
19:55 <+MrHairgrease> you'll have to execute those from /data/wre/sbin
19:55 <+MrHairgrease> and you should use sudo ./wreconsole.pl
19:56 <+MrHairgrease> to start everything the best thing you could do is this
19:56 <+MrHairgrease> sudo -i
19:56 <+MrHairgrease> cd /data/wre/sbin
19:56 < wgGuest57> it asking for a password ?
19:56 <+MrHairgrease> yes 
19:57 <+MrHairgrease> you must enter your password
19:57 <+MrHairgrease> that of your own account
19:57 < wgGuest57> it says my account is not in the sudoers file
19:57 <+MrHairgrease> in that case you can do two things
19:58 <+MrHairgrease> - add your account to the sudoer file
19:58 <+MrHairgrease> of use su
19:58 <+MrHairgrease> do you have the root pw of your box?
19:58 < wgGuest57> yes
19:58 <+MrHairgrease> ok
19:58 <+MrHairgrease> than do this
19:58 <+MrHairgrease> su -
19:58 <+MrHairgrease> <enter root pw
19:59 <+MrHairgrease> cd /data/wre/sbin
19:59 <+MrHairgrease> . ./setenvironmet.sh (mind the space bewteen the dots)
19:59 <+MrHairgrease> ./wreconsole.pl
19:59 <+MrHairgrease> then open your browser
19:59 < wgGuest57> i don't think i'm authorized to do that its a student acct
20:00 <+MrHairgrease> if you don't have root access you cannot install the wre
20:00 <@Haarg> well, techincally you can
20:00 <+MrHairgrease> you'll need root access to start the servers
20:01 <@Haarg> but the binaries need to be in /data/
20:01 <@Haarg> if you build from source you can put it elsewhere
20:02 <@Haarg> and you need root access to run on port 80
20:02 < wgGuest57> ok, thanks
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20:42 <@preaction> if someone creates that utility script to add a package from the command line, i'll put my vote in for putting it into 7.5
20:43 <+MrHairgrease> preaction
20:43 <+MrHairgrease> it already sort of exists
20:44 <+MrHairgrease> check the install script of the acme presentation
20:44 <+MrHairgrease> it's in WebGUI/docs/AcmePresentation after untarring
20:44 <@preaction> oooh
21:00 <@Haarg> it would be easy to have it able to export packages on the command line as well
21:01 <@preaction> well that's just a URL really: <sitename>/path?op=exportPackage (or something)
21:01 <@preaction> so a wget would work
21:02 <@Haarg> i was thinking for arbitrary assets
21:02 <@preaction> the idea being we could make a small shell script to keep packages between different sites synced
21:02 <@Haarg> for the operation they have to be marked as a package
21:02 <@preaction> of course
21:03 <@Haarg> but importing/exporting would be useful without having to mark the assets as packages
21:04 <@preaction> indeed, there's an RFE near the top to add something to the More menu on the asset manager
21:04 <@preaction> a one-time deal thingy
21:29 <@preaction> i hate merging code from outside a VCS to inside the VCS...
21:30 <@preaction> hopefully in the future we'll branch earlier, like we branched for 7.5 already, and when we're done adding features to 7.5 we branch for 7.6
21:31 <@preaction> or JT could do it the way he did it and make it excellently easy for me
22:40 <@preaction> btw, this new Friends Network thing I'm about to commit is completely pwn
--- Day changed Tue Oct 23 2007
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00:28 <@khenn> you committed the stuff JT and I added?
00:30 <@preaction> what stuff did you add?
00:32 <@apeiron> khenn, You didn't seem to make it back on AIM.
00:32 <@khenn> the friends network stuff
00:32 <@khenn> and it shows me as being back online
00:33 <@khenn> crap
00:33 <@apeiron> There we go.
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00:48 <@preaction> yes, i committed the friends network stuff
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11:00 < AMH_bob> Good morning, we're back in The Netherlands and it is COLD here. Started the day by getting the ice off the car window, driving to work in a small european car on narrow european roads with overcrowded cars driving bumper-to-bumper thinking they have a chance of braking in time if something goes wrong.
11:01 < AMH_bob> Thanks everybody for a good WUC last week!
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15:49 -!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
15:55 -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@131.sub-75-207-18.myvzw.com] has joined #WebGUI
16:14 < SDuensin> Hello.  Computers suck.  :-)
16:44 -!- FireZilla [n=4sdq4f64@AMontsouris-152-1-53-9.w83-202.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #webgui
16:55 < FireZilla> Hi,
16:55 < FireZilla> my hoster has informed me that I may have been infected by a backdoor (Threat 3/10)
16:55 < FireZilla> The command line is
16:56 < FireZilla> "/data/wre/prereqs/apache/bin/httpd -f /data/wre/prereqs/apache/conf/httpd.modperl.conf -D WRE-modperl -E  /data/wre/prereqs/apache/logs/modperl.error.l"
16:56 < FireZilla> I open the file modperl.error.log,
16:56 < FireZilla> And there is written :
16:56 < FireZilla> Apache2::SizeLimit httpd process too big, exiting at SIZE=78200 KB  SHARE=2976 KB  REQUESTS=2206 LIFETIME=464082 seconds
16:56 < FireZilla> I think there's no problem, but I'm not sure...
16:57 < FireZilla> could you help me to know what happend ?
16:57 < FireZilla> Thanks
17:02 -!- khenn_ [n=khenn@66-190-54-175.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #WebGUI
17:02 < FireZilla> nobody ?
17:04 -!- AMH_bob [n=bob@alphamega-dmp.xs4all.nl] has joined #webgui
17:14 < SDuensin> Infected?
17:15 < FireZilla> I don't know that's why I'm posting
17:16 < SDuensin> I don't see anything wrong with what you posted, other than maybe your ISP is confused.
17:17 < FireZilla> OK, I feel better...
17:17 < FireZilla> Do you know why there was a problem with Apache2::SizeLimit
17:18 < SDuensin> I get that all the time.  It's got something to do with mod_perl not releasing memory.  I think.
17:18  * SDuensin has other problems.  <sigh>
17:18 -!- khenn [n=khenn@66-190-54-175.dhcp.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
17:25 -!- dapperedodo [n=joeri@62-177-223-166.dsl.bbeyond.nl] has left #webgui []
17:26 < FireZilla> thanks
17:29  * SDuensin needs serious PB help.  Something is ascrew.
17:33 -!- khenn_ is now known as khenn
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18:09 -!- cap10morgan [n=cap10mor@vc1-868-3.adsl.indra.com] has joined #webgui
18:10 -!- FireZilla [n=4sdq4f64@AMontsouris-152-1-53-9.w83-202.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit []
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18:19 -!- dionak [n=dkidd@modemcable243.66-70-69.static.videotron.ca] has joined #webgui
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18:23 < dionak> I'm getting an error in webgui.log about database corruption and template instantiation errors. i ran mysqlcheck. is there something else i should do? not sure how to find this template given i only have the id.
18:23 < dionak> Asset B1bNjWVtzSjsvGZh9lPz_A WebGUI::Asset::Template 1131418441 is missing properties. Consult your database tables for corruption.
18:23 < cap10morgan> dionak: is this on a site that was upgraded from a previous version?
18:24 < dionak> yes. it's our site actually
18:24 < SDuensin> Hi dionak & cap10morgan 
18:24  * SDuensin has horrible DB issues, too.  He fears for his server.
18:24 < cap10morgan> mornin'
18:24 < dionak> that's a little dramatic ;)
18:25 < cap10morgan> dionak: i've noticed that upgrades sometimes fail in the database upgrade step
18:25 < cap10morgan> so then the db schema doesn't match what the code is expecting
18:25 < SDuensin> I hope so, dionak.  I've got a bunch of sites that won't talk to Spectre.  Or something.
18:25 < cap10morgan> can you select * from webguiVersion ?
18:25 < dionak> sure
18:25 < cap10morgan> that will show you the latest version the db has been upgraded to
18:25 < cap10morgan> (in theory) :)
18:26 < dionak> 7.3.22
18:26 < cap10morgan> is that what the codebase is too?
18:26 < dionak> SDuensin, you might want to check your spectre settings. 
18:26 < SDuensin> dionak - I think it's worse than that.
18:27 < dionak> i believe so. that is my understanding. can i double check somewhere?
18:27 < cap10morgan> yeah, i think it says what version it is at the top of lib/WebGUI.pm
18:27 < dionak> k.
18:27 < SDuensin> I'll pastebin my spectre debug stuff.
18:27 < cap10morgan> also it says when it starts up (but WRE 0.8.0 seems to hide that)
18:28 < dionak> yes, 7.3.22
18:28 < cap10morgan> ok
18:28 < SDuensin> http://pastebin.com/m29b75427
18:28 < SDuensin> That output frightens me greatly.
18:28 < cap10morgan> well, one quick n' dirty check you can do is deploy a new site and compare the template, asset, and assetData table schemas in the two DBs
18:30 < dionak> true. i'll give that a shot and see if there are differences.
18:30 < SDuensin> preaction was helping me before, but I think I scared him off.
18:30 -!- MrHairgrease [n=Martin@wlan-145-94-216-81.wlan.tudelft.nl] has joined #webgui
18:30 -!- mode/#webgui [+v MrHairgrease] by ChanServ
18:30 < dionak> SDuensin - it looks like your sites are somehow not configured for Spectre. 
18:30 < dionak> I'm not an expert in that area. 
18:31 < SDuensin> dionak - if I look inside WorkflowInstance, there are null records.  Deleting them allows Spectre to find the site, but then you get the errors displayed further down the log.
18:31 < dionak> this is what concerns me in your log. [Error] Couldn't fetch Spectre configuration data for www.kevinmhuntfoundation.org.conf
18:32 < SDuensin> dionak - if I look in the database, there will be nulls in there.  If I remove the nulls, it'll load the configuration.  It'll also fail later.  I did that for the "cloudcircle" site.  (See line 240.)
18:33 < dionak> hm. idk. I wonder what's causing the 500's. is there anything in mod_perl's log?
18:33 < SDuensin> Looking for it now. 
18:33  * SDuensin has too many terminals open.
18:34 < SDuensin> No errors for today in either mod_perl or mod_proxy logs.
18:36 < SDuensin> if I do a "curl http://www.cloudcircle.com:81/", it answers.  
18:40 <+MrHairgrease> sduensin
18:40 < SDuensin> MrHairgrease 
18:40 <+MrHairgrease> set your log level to info
18:40 <+MrHairgrease> and make spectre error again
18:40 < SDuensin> Working.
18:40 <+MrHairgrease> that'l give more verbose information in your webgui.log than just 500 something bad happened
18:42 < dionak> cap10morgan - article is definitely different
18:42 < cap10morgan> oh yeah? interesting...
18:42 < cap10morgan> how so?
18:43 < dionak> oh, wait. i take that back
18:44 < SDuensin> Spectre output looks the same.  Checking the log.
18:44 < dionak> they are the same. 
18:45 < SDuensin> OK, I'm being stupid.  There are no new entries in /data/wre/var/webgui.log for today.
18:45 < SDuensin> Or my clock is wrong.  Derf.
18:48 < SDuensin> http://pastebin.com/m15e7addc
18:49 < SDuensin> That config path is really not right.  WTF?
18:49 < SDuensin> (Line 8)
18:55 < SDuensin> Cleaned up the databases.  Confs all load now.
18:55 < SDuensin> http://pastebin.com/d23148e69
18:56 < SDuensin> spectre.pl --test passes
18:57 -!- Klaus_2351 [n=Miranda@p5B071FA6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #webgui
18:59 < SDuensin> OK, tried a testEnvironment.pl.  It tells me:
18:59 < SDuensin> '1.0.3' is installed, but we need at least 1.1.0, do you want to upgrade it now? {y|n} [y] 
18:59 < SDuensin> Even though I already answered "y" to that.
18:59 < cap10morgan> SDuensin: is that for Config::JSON?
18:59 < SDuensin> Oh yea - sorry.  Missed that part of the copy.
19:00 < cap10morgan> i seem to recall from the gotchas that you have to force install that from CPAN
19:00 < cap10morgan> which testEnvironment.pl probably doesn't do
19:00  * SDuensin read the gotchas!   Reading again!
19:00 < cap10morgan> :)
19:01  * cap10morgan is setting up the ultimate Eclipse dev / debug environment
19:01 < SDuensin> Oh yea?
19:01 < cap10morgan> it's true
19:01 < cap10morgan> for php currently
19:01 < cap10morgan> since it's such an annoying language to code in
19:01 < cap10morgan> i need all the help i can get :)
19:01 < SDuensin> I'm using Aptana for PHP work.
19:01 < cap10morgan> what's that?
19:02 < SDuensin> Eclipse-based IDE for "Web 2.0" crap.  It's nice.
19:02 < cap10morgan> interesting...
19:03 < cap10morgan> looks like it maybe doesn't support 3.3 yet?
19:04 < SDuensin> Nope.  Mine says 3.2.2r322.
19:04 < cap10morgan> well, i'll have to give it a try once it does 3.3
19:07 < SDuensin> First WebGUI hates me.  Now CPAN hates me.
19:07 < SDuensin> "Error in server greeting." it says.  <sigh>
19:08 < SDuensin> Ah HA!  Found it.
19:08 <+MrHairgrease> real men use vim
19:08 < SDuensin> joe for teh winnar!
19:09 < SDuensin> KICK A$$ - JSON upgrade fixed *most* the Spectre errors!
19:10  * cap10morgan high fives SDuensin
19:10 < SDuensin> Gonna let it chunk for a bit and then see about the 500 error on the one site.
19:10  * SDuensin breathes a HUGE sigh of relief.
19:11 < SDuensin> Egads.  192 pending workflows.
19:11 < SDuensin> I don't understand that communications error.  If I "curl" the URL it complains about, Apache answers.
19:12 < cap10morgan> i see that a lot w/ spectre
19:12 < SDuensin> How do we fix it a lot?  :-)
19:12 < cap10morgan> good question!
19:13 < SDuensin> And why just one site?
19:15 < SDuensin> What else can I look at?  I don't see squat in the logs.
19:15 < cap10morgan> is spectre allowed to connect to that site from the ip it's connecting from?
19:15 < cap10morgan> in that site's config?
19:17 < SDuensin> I don't see why not.  Double-checking.  (I added that site using the WRE just like all the other sites.)
19:19 < SDuensin> Looks OK to me.
19:19 < SDuensin> Any idea exactly what it's trying to load so I can feed it to curl?
19:20 <+MrHairgrease> the 500 message should show up in your wg log
19:20 < SDuensin> It does, but with no more info than in the spectre output.
19:20 <+MrHairgrease> if it even doesn't do that somethin is wrong 
19:20 <+MrHairgrease> ah
19:20 <+MrHairgrease> in that case
19:21 <+MrHairgrease> set the log level to info
19:21 < SDuensin> I did!
19:21 <+MrHairgrease> and did you restart the server afterwards?
19:21 < SDuensin> Yep.
19:21 < SDuensin> Lemme double check everything.
19:22 < SDuensin> log.conf has log4perl.logger = INFO, mainlog 
19:22 <+MrHairgrease> that is not a correct path
19:22 <+MrHairgrease>  /data/WebGUI/etc//data/WebGUI/etc/www.jaegertech.net.conf at
19:23 < SDuensin> Yea, no kidding.
19:23 < SDuensin> That site is working now though.
19:23 <+MrHairgrease> I\m not =)
19:23 <+MrHairgrease> ok
19:23 < SDuensin> Only www.cloudcircle.com is 500ing on me.
19:23 <+MrHairgrease> before the 500
19:23 <+MrHairgrease> there should be something in the log
19:24 <+MrHairgrease> one thing
19:24 <+MrHairgrease> is the first entry of sitename the same as the webgui instance of that site?
19:24 < SDuensin> http://pastebin.com/d53103f41
19:25 < SDuensin> Pretty sure, but checking.
19:26 < SDuensin> Sitename is correct in www.cloudcircle.com.conf.  Where else do I need to check it?
19:26 <+MrHairgrease> nowhere as far as i know
19:27 < SDuensin> Is Spectre trying to do an ?op=someCrapHere URL?
19:28 <+MrHairgrease> yes
19:28 <+MrHairgrease> dunno which one exactly
19:28 < SDuensin> :-/
19:28 <+MrHairgrease> btw
19:29 <+MrHairgrease> that errorafk
19:30 < SDuensin> They're pestering me to go get lunch...
19:31 < SDuensin> I ***REALLY*** appreciate the help, MrHairgrease.
19:31 < SDuensin> I'll be back after I get food to carry on the battle!
19:43 -!- MrHairgrease [n=Martin@wlan-145-94-216-81.wlan.tudelft.nl] has left #webgui []
20:24 <@apeiron> khenn++ # didactic
20:25 <@khenn> huh?
20:27 <@apeiron> You taught me something. That's karma-worthy to me.
20:31 <@khenn> are you saying I'm a good teacher because you are a difficult learner?  or that you know so much already that you didn't think there was anything else to learn =p
20:32 -!- preaction [n=doug@static-72-1-4-143.ntd.net] has joined #webgui
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20:34 <@apeiron> khenn, Just that I appreciate any and all learning. :)
20:35 <@khenn> in that case, I have all sorts of goofy mathematical facts that could earn me karma all day!!!
20:35 <@khenn> =)
20:37 <@apeiron> Doesn't count if you're trying.
20:38 <@khenn> i see
20:51 -!- knowmad [n=william@adsl-072-149-129-114.sip.clt.bellsouth.net] has joined #webgui
21:04 < SDuensin> Hello again!
21:04  * SDuensin is back - and full of White Castles.
21:58 <@preaction> that doesn't sound healthy
21:58 < SDuensin> OK, now I'm really confused.  I deleted the site giving me the 500 errors and recreated it.
21:58 < SDuensin> (Hey preaction!)
21:58 < SDuensin> I *still* get errors.
21:58 <@preaction> it doesn't like you
21:58 < SDuensin> Checked my DNS.  Seems fine.
21:58 < SDuensin> I can tell.
21:58 <@preaction> 500 error is in the modperl error log
21:58 <@preaction> you just watch yourself, we're wanted men
21:59 <@preaction> i have the death sentence on twelve systems!
21:59 < SDuensin> I'll be careful.
21:59 < SDuensin> No error in that log.
22:00 <@preaction> hum... modproxy error log then?
22:00 < SDuensin> Negative.
22:00 <@preaction> 500 is "I can't even get far enough to open the webgui error log, so you've really mucked something up"
22:00 <@preaction> testEnvironment.pl? 
22:00  * SDuensin didn't do doodie!
22:01 <@preaction> httpd -X -Edebug perhaps? (i don't know if the -E switch changes the log level though)
22:02 < SDuensin> testEnvironment passes.  Only crabbing about Graphics::Magick.
22:02 < SDuensin> spectre.pl --test passes, too.
22:03 <@preaction> so there are other sites on this system that do not 500 error?
22:03 < SDuensin> Yea.  Lots of 'em.
22:03 <@preaction> are you absolutely sure you're actually getting to the right site?
22:03 < SDuensin> If I curl the URL, I get the index page.
22:04 <@preaction> okay, so what's different about the pages that give 500 errors?
22:04 < SDuensin> Other than the others don't give 500 errors?  No idea.
22:04 < SDuensin> Possibly the DNS host, but DNS seems to work.
22:05 < SDuensin> I take that back.  Another site uses the same DNS server and it's fine.
22:06 <@preaction> okay, we're on completely different pages here, so let's start from the beginning
22:07 < SDuensin> OK, I just did a removesite and then addsite on www.cloudcircle.com...
22:08 < SDuensin> Then so I could see what was going on, I did "./rc.spectre stop" and then "perl spectre.pl --run --debug"...
22:08 < SDuensin> It tries to do something and gives me a 500.
22:08 < SDuensin> I was able to connect to the site and complete the setup.
22:08 < SDuensin> Spectre continues to give 500s.
22:09 < SDuensin> Latest output:  http://pastebin.com/m2e92248b
22:09 <@preaction> so it's just spectre that gives a 500 error? are you sure spectre is getting to the right site? can you curl <sitename>?op=spectreGetSiteData and/or run a workflow from inside WebGUI using the admin console?
22:10 <@Haarg> i was just going to suggest that.  those 500 errors may not be coming from WebGUI.
22:10 <@Haarg> LWP will generate that stuff in some circumstances.
22:11 < SDuensin> curl returns nice JSON info on the site.
22:11 < SDuensin> Hi Haarg 
22:11 < SDuensin> (Specifically,  curl http://www.cloudcircle.com/?op=spectreGetSiteData )
22:12 <@Haarg> what port is spectre set to connect to?
22:12 -!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat050.mxim.com] has joined #webgui
22:12 < SDuensin> 32133
22:13 <@Haarg> connect to, not run on
22:13 <@preaction> you could also use the database to figure out what workflow / activity is running when it gets the 500 errors
22:13 < SDuensin> There are a lot of other sites here that work fine.
22:13 < SDuensin> webguiPort, Haarg ?  81
22:13 < SDuensin> curl to 81 works, too.
22:14 <@Haarg> and you've already checked sitename i take it?
22:14 < SDuensin> Only thing is "www.cloudcircle.com".
22:14 < SDuensin> All this was set up by the WRE.  Same way I did the other sites.
22:15 <@preaction> it's connecting just fine, as evidenced by the fact that it is running workflow activities
22:15 <@preaction> you'll need to find out which activity it is that is throwing these errors before we can go anywhere else
22:16 < SDuensin> It's trying to run "Do Nothing on Deletion" with a null parameter.
22:16 < steveo_aam> preaction: extjs && utils on alumni, where can I find the JSON encoding functions?
22:16 < SDuensin> There are two instances of that queued, priority 2, className/methodName/parameters are all null.
22:17 <@preaction> steveo_aam, for the moment, they're in www/extras/yui-ext/tools i believe, i don't remember
22:17 <@preaction> is there even a way to configure what workflow gets run when an asset is deleted?
22:17 <@preaction> why is that in there?
22:17 < steveo_aam> preaction: no such directoyr
22:18 <@preaction> steveo_aam, then it must be www/extras/ext or something
22:18  * SDuensin has no idea.
22:19 < steveo_aam> preaction: www/extras/extjs exists, but has no util(s) dir
22:20 <@preaction> under build
22:20 < steveo_aam> Thanks.
22:21 <@preaction> or: ` find . | grep -i "JSON"`
22:23  * SDuensin wonders if he should just nuke these two workflows?
22:23 < steveo_aam> I had been looking in the YUI tree, and the code said yui-ext.  Lots of changes with that upgrade.
22:24 <@preaction> yeah, there was a discussion today with the devs to move away from using Ext and find other solutions to the problems it solves
22:24 < SDuensin> What's wrong with Ext?
22:24  * SDuensin is just curious.
22:25 < steveo_aam> Funny that another team wishes they had gone the extjs direction.
22:25 <@preaction> it seems to be moving away from an F/OSS license, it seems to be trying to become its own all-in-one solution (instead of just an extention to Yui)
22:25 < steveo_aam> Not related to WebGUI
22:26 <@preaction> Yui's hired on Dav Glass, who wrote the YUI Rich Text Editor, his site has a couple things for Yui that I'll be adding to 7.5 momentarily
22:26  * SDuensin is planning on using Ext in his next project.
22:26 <@preaction> it was decided that the future possibilities look more stable for YUI than it does for Ext
22:26 < SDuensin> And, yea, they don't rely on Yui anymore.
22:27 < SDuensin> Yui is cool, but Ext gives me more of what I want for "free".  I've got enough to code as is.  :-)
22:27 <@preaction> which is the argument that khenn gave
22:27 <@preaction> and i do agree with, but i also think it would be worth it to contribute back to Yui
22:28 <@khenn> no reason you can't continue to use Ext, we just won't be distributing it with the core any longer
22:28 <@preaction> i feel that allowing people to purchase a "commercial" license for your software sullies the idea of F/OSS software
22:28 <@khenn> to avoid licensing issues in the future
22:28 < SDuensin> Lots of things use that kind of "dual license".
22:29 < steveo_aam> Your pointer to the new location set me up, and the code now works with the library change.
22:29 < SDuensin> I'm using it to build a service, not a product, so it doesn't really matter to me.
22:31 < SDuensin> So about these rogue workflow instances...   :-)
22:32 <@preaction> SDuensin, you can probably delete them, since they're just Do Nothing On Deletion. but you might want to figure out why a workflow activity that does nothing is throwing a 500 error. you may also want to find out if new instances of that activity throw the same error
22:33 < SDuensin> I don't even know why they're there.  This is a brand new site.  Hell, I'm going to delete it again and see if the database gets deleted correctly.
22:36 < SDuensin> Ok.  Site deleted.  Database went with it.  Making a new one.
22:38 < SDuensin> (I love the new "Site Starter", BTW.)
22:42 < SDuensin> Same two workflows after I recreated the site.
22:43 <@preaction> did you do anything in the Site Starter? did it have to delete assets?
22:44 < SynQ> here I am
22:44 <@preaction> and here I remain!
22:44 < SDuensin> It may have.  I removed a forum and the wiki and maybe another thing.
22:45 < SDuensin> I'm going to delete some of the sample content and see what happens.
22:50 < SynQ> is PlainBlack up and running again?
22:50 <@preaction> SynQ, as far as i know
22:50 < SynQ> after all that early waking prev. week
22:54 < SDuensin> Egads!  I now have 20+ delete workflow instances!
22:55 <@preaction> all of them giving 500s?
22:55 < SDuensin> Yep.
22:56 <@preaction> all of them with NULL in their parameters?
22:56 < SDuensin> Yep.
22:56 <@preaction> what version are you running?
22:56 < SDuensin> 7.4.10
22:58 <@preaction> i might post a bug, is that the latest stable?
22:58 < SDuensin> Yes.
22:58 < SDuensin> Here - http://pastebin.com/m637a155c
22:59 < SynQ> how do I troubleshoot something like this:
22:59 < SynQ> WORKFLOW: [Error] Something bad happened on the return of 7oOG47V5mOE5Ny0H2I41RQ. <HTML>
22:59 < SynQ> <HEAD><TITLE>An Error Occurred</TITLE></HEAD>
22:59 < SynQ> <BODY>
22:59 < SynQ> <H1>An Error Occurred</H1>
22:59 < SynQ> 200 OK
22:59 < SynQ> </BODY>
22:59 < SynQ> </HTML>
23:00 < SDuensin> It's not committing that version tag either.  :-(
23:00 <@preaction> SynQ, the first thing you do is never paste to the channel again
23:00 <@preaction> perlbot paste
23:00 < perlbot> Paste your code to http://sial.org/pbot/perl http://erxz.com/pb or http://p3m.org/paste/fn/perl and #Perl will be able to view it.
23:00 < SynQ> ok
23:00 < SynQ> sorry
23:00 < SDuensin> Gee, SynQ, that looks horribly familiar.  :-)
23:00 < SynQ> even if it's 4 or 5 lines?
23:00 <@preaction> SDuensin, subtle difference: he's getting 200 OK
23:00 <@preaction> SynQ, yes
23:00 < SynQ> ok
23:00 < SynQ> it won't happen again
23:00 <@preaction> looks like 7 to me, but we don't count. 
23:01 < SynQ> :)
23:01 <@preaction> check your WorkflowInstance table to see what activity is being run
23:01 < SynQ> ok
23:01 < SDuensin> Yea, I had 200s before, too.  Upgrading Config::JSON fixed it.
23:01 < SynQ> It's version 7.3.22
23:02 <@preaction> SynQ, if you can reproduce on 7.4.10-stable, you can probably post a bug report about it
23:03 < SynQ> I'd rather first find what's causing that
23:03 <@preaction> why try to debug something that may already be fixed?
23:03 < SDuensin> My "Commit Without Approval" says "comm error" in the Workflow admin panel.
23:03 -!- preaction changed the topic of #webgui to: WebGUI Help / Developer Discussion [ WebGUI 7.4.10-stable | WRE 0.8.0 ] Before you ask, check the wiki: http://wiki.webgui.org | No Pasting in channel: http://webgui.pastebin.com/
23:04 < SynQ> preaction since I want to learn more about spectre
23:07 < SynQ> hmm
23:07 < SynQ> I just spent like 5 minutes looking for the 'search' on the webgui.org site
23:07 < SynQ> after looking at plainblack.com i noticed it was in the same location on the webgui.org site
23:07 < SDuensin> Yea.  No idea why you gotta click something to make it show up.  Weird UI choice.
23:08 < SynQ> I agree
23:08 < SynQ> Doug, in your opinion should I submit an rfe for that?
23:10 <@preaction> if you want, i would think that's where it would be noticed
23:10 < SDuensin> Man, there's just no information on what "comm error" is mad about.  Nothing in the logs.
23:13 < SDuensin> At this point, I'm scared to do anything on any of my sites.  :-(
23:18 < SynQ> ok
23:18 < SynQ> something else
23:18 < SynQ> I don't seem to be having the admin password
23:20 < SynQ> I don't want to reset it and I don't want to login as admin
23:20 < SynQ> so I think I'm going to create an 'addAdmin' utilityscript
23:27  * SDuensin wants a fixSpectre script.
23:37 < SDuensin> preaction - handy?  I have some more information on this that is kind of interesting.
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23:50 < SDuensin> Well, I'll be back later.  See ya!   Thanks again for the help!
23:50 -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@131.sub-75-207-18.myvzw.com] has quit ["Leaving"]
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00:01 < SynQ> hmm
00:01 < SynQ> I wonder what feels better
00:02 < SynQ> learning how to create a utilityscript or playing 'The Godfather Blackhand edition' on the wii
00:07 < knowmad> i think that depends on whether you're talking about now or later
00:07 < knowmad> might feel good to play wii and avoid the pain of writing utility script until the deadline hits and your script is not done; then you won't be feeling too good 
00:09 < SynQ> hmm
00:09 < SynQ> true
00:09 <@preaction> i say do the util script now, hold out on the Wii until Guitar Hero 3 comes out
00:10 < SynQ> but actually the script is more about later too
00:10 < SynQ> hehe
00:10 < knowmad> tis the fate for those of us confined to the space-time continuum
00:10 < SynQ> I asked my wife if I could buy a wii but she'd rather we have someone paint the windows on the outside before winter
00:10 < knowmad> bummer
00:11 < SynQ> the utility script would allow you to add an extra Admin account to a webgui site
00:11 <@khenn> paint the windows yourself and buy the wii
00:11 <@khenn> everyone is happy
00:11 <@khenn> sandpaper + paint = $26.00
00:11 < SynQ> for debugging problems that arrise in the logfiles while someone else is editing and maintaining the site
00:12 < SynQ> khenn: my time is about EUR 55.00 per hour
00:12 < SynQ> so that is probably a really expensive option
00:12 < SynQ> besides, if I paint the windows myself I won't have time to play the wii and buying it would have no use
00:13 <@khenn> well if you were billing out 24 hrs / day, you should have enough money to pay for both =p
00:13 <@khenn> 24 x 55 x 7 = you are rich
00:13 < SynQ> I think the price of the wii is probably not even the issue to
00:15 < SynQ> I can work max 10 hours a day about 5 days a week
00:15 < SynQ> I'd still make about 150K per year if all my hours would be bookable 
00:16 < SynQ> but it's more the other way around thoug
00:16 < SynQ> if I spend an extra hour on painting the house that will cost me about 55 euro
00:17 < SynQ> since I'm not spending that on my company and that will go off the profit
00:24 <@apeiron> khenn, You poofed on AIM.
00:26 <@khenn> I hate charter
00:26 <@apeiron> Sure it's not something else?
00:26 <@khenn> SynQ:  I've seen this debate before
00:27 <@khenn> and if you spent an hour painting during a time you would otherwise *not* be working, then you incur zero loss
00:27 <@khenn> rizen was trying to tell me that I should pay someone to clean my house
00:27 <@khenn> based on that same logic
00:27 <@khenn> but it doesn't pan out
00:27 <@khenn> cause I don't bill out every hour of every day
00:28 <@khenn> so if I clean my house on Saturday between 7-9am when I would otherwise not be working, I save myself money!
00:28 <@khenn> =)
00:28 <@khenn> so paint your windows at 3am on Monday night.  You save money and annoy the neighbors!  Double bonus =)
00:28 <@khenn> er Tuesday morning
00:28 <@khenn> tuesday morning is best
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00:31 < SynQ> uh
00:31 < SynQ> 3am in the morning?
00:31 <@khenn> hehe
00:31 < SynQ> it will be completely dark outside
00:32 < perlDreamer> that makes sure that the paint doesn't dry too quickly
00:33 < SynQ> uh yeah
00:33 <@khenn> hence the need for the incredibly annoying spotlights =)
00:33 < SynQ> and it also makes sure that afterwards I will still have to hire a professional painter
00:34 <@khenn> heh
00:34 <@khenn> that's my problem too
00:36 < SynQ> you have to hire a professional cleaner?
00:36 < SynQ> on the other hand you don't have to bill out every hour
00:37 < SynQ> to be able to pay for a cleaner
00:38 <@khenn> I'm just saying the logic is flawed since nobody bills out 24/7 anyway
00:39 <@khenn> so paying someone $90 a week would cost me more than cleaning the house myself during non-billing hours
00:40 <@khenn> by that logic I waste all sorts of time sleeping
00:40 <@khenn> and drinking of course
00:40 < SynQ> that is true
00:40 <@khenn> =)
00:40 < SynQ> >:)
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01:01 < perlDreamer> SynQ: No one that I know about has written a script like that.
01:01 < perlDreamer> I think it sounds great
01:01 < perlDreamer> hack on!
01:02 <@khenn> I think it should be ACME and require the admin password to work =)
01:02 <@khenn> so the file can really be one line of code
01:03 < perlDreamer> how about if it connected to the WebGUI irc channel and then allowed you to submit a password?
01:03 <@khenn> print "Please enter the admin password: ";
01:03 <@khenn> my $pwd = <STDIN>;
01:07 <@apeiron> chomp(my $pwd = <STDIN>); # *cough*
01:07 < SynQ> hehe
01:08 <@apeiron> Parens require, there.
01:08 <@apeiron> er, required.
01:08 < SynQ> ACME :)
01:08 <@khenn> doesn't matter really
01:08 <@khenn> it's ACME
01:08 <@khenn> =p
01:08 <@apeiron> Well, it won't parse without the ()
01:08 -!- rizen [n=rizen@71-86-227-90.static.mdsn.wi.charter.com] has joined #webgui
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01:08 <@khenn> you can't remember the admin password anyway
01:08 <@khenn> which is why you would be using the script in the first place
01:09 < SynQ> I think that creating just ACME programs, scripts and utilities would make me a rogue developer wouldn't it?
01:09 <@khenn> so requiring the admin password to use it makes it so incredibly funny that it doesn't really matter what it does after you ask for the password
01:10 < SynQ> but actually it isn't a resetAdminPassword.pl
01:10 < SynQ> but a createBackdoorAdminAccount.pl
01:10 <@rizen> you can do both with the existing userImport.pl script
01:10 < SynQ> ok
01:11 < SynQ> hi JT
01:11 <@rizen> granted, not as easily as you're describing
01:11 < SynQ> if you can tell me in one line how to I'll skip the whole thing
01:11 < SynQ> ah
01:11 < SynQ> that's a pitty
01:11 <@rizen> you can't do it in one line, because userImport.pl requires a file containing the user data
01:12 <@rizen> but other than that you can do it in one line
01:12 < SynQ> I could also create a very hacky way that just creates a line in some mysql table :)
01:12 -!- SDuensin [n=Scott@12-217-75-184.client.mchsi.com] has joined #WebGUI
01:12 <@rizen> you could also fly back to the states and make me some panakookin for dinner
01:13 < SDuensin> rizen !
01:13 <@rizen> or however you spell that
01:13 < perlDreamer> will hack for pannen kuchen?
01:13 <@rizen> indeed i would
01:13 < SynQ> pannekoeken in the old spelling, pannenkoeken in the new dutch spelling
01:13 < perlDreamer> actually, I think you can do it with one line, just by specifying STDIN as the usersfile
01:14 < SynQ> and right now it would be more like a midnight snack
01:14 < perlDreamer> it should be a small bash script
01:14  * rizen holds out a sign "Will code for pannenkoeken!"
01:14 < SynQ> perlDreamer: shouldn't it be a full webgui utility script?
01:15 < perlDreamer> it could be, but if you can utilize an existing script, no sense in reinventing the wheel
01:15 < perlDreamer> it would be like
01:15 < perlDreamer> #!bash
01:15 < SDuensin> rizen, like Obi-Wan, you're my only hope.
01:15 <@rizen> what's up SD
01:15 < perlDreamer> echo "head line\ndata line" | userImport.pl --usersFile - --configFile webgui.conf
01:16 < SDuensin> Why, oh WHY, do I get "500 Internal Server Error" running workflows on a brand new site?
01:16 < SynQ> hmm
01:16 < SDuensin> I can't get any kind of details in any of my logs.  :-(
01:16 < perlDreamer> bad spectre.conf ?
01:16 < perlDreamer> wrong IP
01:16 < perlDreamer> wrong subnet?
01:16 < SDuensin> Not that I can see, perlDreamer.  Everything is set up like my other sites.
01:16 <@rizen> it's impossible for you to get 500 errors and no info in any logs
01:17 < SDuensin> Ok, let's change that to "useful info".
01:17 <@rizen> so i'm inclined to agree with pd that you have a dns problem
01:17 <@rizen> ok, so you are seeing info then?
01:17 <@rizen> which log file are you seeing it in?
01:17 < SynQ> perlDreamer: I've noted your suggestion on the bash script
01:17 < SDuensin> This is all I get:  http://pastebin.com/m6e81e046
01:17 < SDuensin> From webgui.log.
01:17 < SynQ> I'll use it for creating a script that should be just this:
01:18 <@rizen> SynQ, i was just going to post back to the dev mailing list with some code that would do exactly what you want
01:18 <@rizen> cuz i can write it in under 10 lines
01:18 < perlDreamer> SynQ, once my coverage tests stop running, I'll see if the idea actually works :)
01:18 <@rizen> but then i decided you wanted to do it for the karma
01:18 <@rizen> so i stopped
01:18 < SynQ> addAdmin.pl --username Backdoor --password H@XX0R --configFile webgui.conf
01:18 < SynQ> which looks a lot cleaner to me
01:19 <@rizen> SD: you should also get some info in your modperl.error.log with this
01:19 < SynQ> rizen: hehe
01:19 < SDuensin> rizen - Nope.  Not even if I change the log level to INFO.
01:19 <@rizen> ok if you're not
01:19 <@rizen> then it 's not even making it to modperl
01:19 <@rizen> so do this
01:19 <@rizen> from the command line on your server
01:19 < SynQ> rizen: e-mail the 10 lines to perlDreamer so he can post them as a reference implementation to mine later
01:20 < SynQ> it would be great to compare the two
01:20 <@rizen> type "ping www.cloudcircle.com"
01:20 <@rizen> and see if the IP address matches what you think it should
01:20 < SDuensin> 64 bytes from u15262483.onlinehome-server.com (74.208.75.207): icmp_seq=0 ttl=64 time=0.050 ms
01:20 < SDuensin> That's correct.
01:20 <@rizen> also check both your modproxy and modperl configs for the site and make sure they're both going to the same place
01:21 < SynQ> and check if your disk is full and there is enough memory available
01:22 < perlDreamer> you hardware guys...
01:22 < SynQ> hardware?
01:22 < SynQ> OS you mean
01:22 < SDuensin> Confs are fine.  Memory and disk space are fine.
01:22 < perlDreamer> disk and RAM
01:22 <@rizen> if you can verify that your configs are correct, then type this on the command line:
01:22 < SDuensin> There are seven other sites running on this WRE.  They seem to be fine.
01:22 <@rizen> curl http://www.cloudcircle.com/?op=runWorkflow\;instanceId=EbPG8D2T4r8Mt5pJeeeAnQ
01:23 < SynQ> sure, both can give your OS headaces
01:23 < SDuensin> It says "done".
01:23 <@rizen> ok, so you can run the command directly 
01:23 <@rizen> but you can't run it through spectre
01:23 < SDuensin> Seems that way.
01:24 <@rizen> so now you know it's a comm problem between spectre and webgui
01:24 <@rizen> check the web port number in the spectre conf
01:24 < SDuensin> It's 81.
01:24 < SynQ> I'd say it's a routing problem
01:24 < SynQ> check route -n too
01:25 < SDuensin> Why just one site though?  The other 7 work fine.  And they were all created the same way!
01:27 < SynQ> I almost gotta go
01:27 < SynQ> I't half past midnight allready
01:27 < SDuensin> 5:30p here.
01:27 < perlDreamer> 8 sites overflows a 3 bit binary register...
01:27 < perlDreamer> starting to smell like a netmask
01:27 < SDuensin> Huh?
01:28 < perlDreamer> in binary, with 3 bits, you can count from 0 to 7
01:28 < perlDreamer> 000, 001, 010, 011, 100, 101, 110, 111 <- 7
01:28 < SynQ> what does a netmask smell like? pannekoeken or pumpkinsoup?
01:28 < SynQ> I agree though
01:28 < SynQ> netmask might be it
01:28 < perlDreamer> it smells like bad baby diapers
01:28 < SynQ> yuk
01:28 < SDuensin> What does the number of virtual sites have to do with a netmask?  They're all on one IP.
01:29 < SynQ> hmm
01:29 < SynQ> in that case
01:29 < SDuensin> That interface is 255.255.255.0 anyway.
01:29 < SynQ> are the WebGUI.conf files all alike?
01:29 < SDuensin> Best I can tell they are.  I used /data/wre/sbin/addsite to create them all.
01:31 < SynQ> "spectreSubnets" : [ "127.0.0.1/32" ],
01:31 <@rizen> spectreSubnets should include your real ip
01:31 < SynQ> it should?
01:31 <@rizen> also, turn on debug mode in spectre
01:31 <@rizen> it will give you more detailed info
01:32 < SDuensin> It contains 74.208.75.207/32 and 127.0.0.1/32.
01:32 < SynQ> funny I'm pretty sure I saw a presentation at the WUC from Doug that showed 127.0.0.1/32 as an example
01:32 < SDuensin> rizen, I was using "perl spectre.pl --run --debug".  No additional info.
01:33 < SDuensin> So far, I've baffled preaction, cap10morgan, Haarg, and MrHairgrease.  :-(
01:33 < SynQ> hmm
01:33 < SynQ> that's quite an impressive track record
01:34  * SDuensin might have to add SynQ to that list.  :-)
01:34 < SynQ> did you rebuildlineage yet?
01:34 < SDuensin> I know!  WebGUI has something against me.  Wish I knew what I did to upset it.
01:34 < SynQ> rebuildLineage.pl
01:34 < SDuensin> SynQ - No, but I kinda did the bigger version of that.  I've "removesite" that site and added it back twice now.
01:35 < SynQ> ok
01:35 < SynQ> did you re-create the WebGUI.conf file too?
01:35 < SynQ> clean the cache?
01:35 < SDuensin> testEnvironment.pl passes, spectre.pl --test passes.
01:35 < SDuensin> SynQ - Removing it deletes the conf, right?
01:35 < SynQ> offer a goat (or guinnea pig) to the gods?
01:35 < SDuensin> I checked it deleted the database.
01:35 < SDuensin> No idea about the cache.  That's voodoo I've not played with yet.
01:36 < SynQ> ok
01:36 < perlDreamer> SDuensin: can you nopaste the relevant configs with sensitive info removed?
01:36 < SDuensin> Sure.
01:36 < SDuensin> give me a sec - the confs are on a remote box
01:37 < SynQ> stop the apache, remove the site and database completely, remove all the cache (rm -r /tmp/FileCache or something), re-create the site, try again
01:37 < SDuensin> What all would you like to see?
01:38 <@rizen> SD did you turn on INFO level in your webgui log file?
01:38 <@rizen> and don't bother removing the site
01:38 < SDuensin> Did that earlier.  No additional info.  :-(
01:38 <@rizen> that's a waste of time
01:38 <@rizen> SD, you're either lying to me or your doing it wrong
01:38 <@rizen> there will definitely be additional info from both --debug on spectre
01:38 <@rizen> and INFO mode
01:38 < SDuensin> It added a lot of info for the sites that work.  :-P
01:38 <@rizen> in the log file
01:39 < SynQ> perhaps there are strange control characters in the config file
01:39 < SynQ> like ^M
01:39 <@rizen> the site wouldn't even start if there was a problem with the config file
01:39 < SDuensin> I don't see any.  I even looked.
01:39 <@rizen> cuz they are preloaded by modperl
01:39 < SynQ> or a quote is missing somewhere
01:39 <@preaction> i'm beginning to believe it's a job for professionals with access to the box
01:39 <@rizen> i disagree
01:39 < SynQ> i agree
01:40 < SynQ> JT should fix it for pannekoeken
01:40 < SynQ> SDuensin do you know how to make pannekoeken?
01:40  * SDuensin doesn't even know WTF pannekoeken is.
01:40 <@rizen> i'm quite certain this is something ordinary or bland
01:40 < SynQ> SDuensin too bad, I know for a fact that JT does almost everything for pannekoeken
01:40 < SDuensin> I hope so, rizen.  At the moment, I'm scared to commit anything to any site.
01:41 <@rizen> you certainly shouldn't be doing anyting on the site
01:41 <@rizen> nor should you bother deleting it
01:41 <@rizen> that's just bs
01:41 < SDuensin> What config files would you all like posted?
01:41 <@rizen> that's like restarting your computer cuz you don't know what's wrong with it
01:41 < SDuensin> rizen - That fixes Windows!
01:41 <@rizen> i don't want any config files posted
01:41 <@rizen> i just want you to enable INFO
01:41 <@rizen> restart modperl
01:41 <@rizen> tail -f it in one window
01:41 < SDuensin> Ok.
01:42 <@rizen> and then run the curl command that i gave you earlier
01:42 <@rizen> in another window
01:42 < SynQ> in the mean time I'll offer a small mouse
01:42 < SDuensin> To be sure I do it right, I've now got "log4perl.logger = INFO, mainlog" in /data/WebGUI/etc/log.conf.  Right?
01:42 <@rizen> yup
01:43 <@rizen> you could do it better if you came to the wuc
01:43 <@rizen> or had the webgui admin guide
01:43 <@rizen> but that will work
01:43 < SynQ> :)
01:43 < SDuensin> I'd love to go to the WUC.  Just can't swing it right now.
01:43 < SynQ> I'm glad the admin guide has a black cover
01:43 < SDuensin> Is the admin guide out?  Did I miss that?
01:43 <@rizen> i wrote it. it has to have a black cover
01:43 < SynQ> hehe
01:43 <@rizen> yeah, it's been out for a few weeks
01:44 < SynQ> rizen: I'll flood your mailbox with additions to the admin guide once we recieve it over the mail. >:)
01:44 < cap10morgan> rizen: i implemented your example log4perl config that emails fatals, but strangely when i add a site-specific log to log.conf (in addition to mainlog), it starts emailing everything from that site-specific log (i.e. not just fatals). have you seen that?
01:46 < SDuensin> rizen - curl says "done", log didn't do crap.  All I see is the Apache startup message.
01:47 < SDuensin> WHOA!
01:47 < SynQ> whoa?
01:47 < SDuensin> My 25 suspended workflows are now gone.
01:47 < SDuensin> WTF?
01:47  * SDuensin thinks it might be scared of rizen.
01:48 <@rizen> cap10morgan no, but post a bug report and we'll get some errata released
01:48 < cap10morgan> ok
01:49 <@rizen> SD, you're looking at the wrong log
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01:49 < SDuensin> modperl.error.log?
01:49 <@rizen> you changed the INFO for the webgui.log
01:50 < SDuensin> Oh.
01:50 <@rizen> and then didn't look at the webgui.log
01:50 < SynQ> JT: do you know what a red lantern is?
01:50  * SDuensin grumbles something about dumb users.
01:50 <@rizen> i do if it refers to prostitutes
01:50 < SynQ> it doesn't
01:50 <@rizen> then no
01:50 < SynQ> it refers to cycling games
01:51 < SynQ> the red lantern is awarded to the last runner in the race
01:51 < SDuensin> Seriously dude.  Nothing.  And I see INFO entries from other sites, so I know I have INFO turned on.
01:51 < SynQ> 60 karma points to go and I will be the last entry in the karma list on http://www.plainblack.com/wg/karma
01:52  * SDuensin needs Page 241 from the Admin Guide...  "Don't Panic".
01:52 < SynQ> I think the last entry on that list should be displayed in red :)
01:56 <@rizen> submit an RFE
01:56  * SDuensin has now run rizen into hiding
01:56 <@rizen> man, did no one listen in colin's talk
01:57 < SynQ> hmm
02:00 < SDuensin> rizen, all I get in my webgui.log are things like this:  http://pastebin.com/m6e81e046
02:01 <@rizen> look at the time on that log
02:01 <@rizen> are you sure it's even writing out new log data?
02:01 < SDuensin> This just happened:  http://pastebin.com/d3349b418
02:01 < SDuensin> (And my clock is wrong.  One problem at a time.)
02:01 < SynQ> ok
02:01 < SynQ> now I'm gonna lobby for it
02:02 <@rizen> SynQ
02:02 < SynQ> on the IRC channel
02:02 < SynQ> http://www.plainblack.com/rfe/request-for-enhancement/red-lantern-on-the-karma-list
02:02 < SynQ> :P
02:02 <@rizen> the ass kicking addUser.pl script is emailed to colin
02:02 < SynQ> great
02:02 <@rizen> i made it nice so that it has help and everything
02:02 < SynQ> I am now even more motivated to create my version
02:03  * SDuensin doesn't even know what pbcron0000000000000004
02:03 < SDuensin> +is
02:03 < perlDreamer> that is the GUID for a unique workflow instance
02:03 < perlDreamer> since it is 22 characters long
02:03 < SynQ> perlDreamer ... wil you put karma on my feature request please, please please :)
02:03 <@preaction> probably the run hourly one
02:04 < SynQ> btw, did you like the stroopwafels? have you tried them yet?
02:04 < perlDreamer> we haven't opened them yet
02:04 < SDuensin> WorkflowInstance is empty.
02:04 <@rizen> the stroopwafels are awesome
02:04 < perlDreamer> We struck out on cheese and cheese curds.
02:04 < SynQ> thanks to my sister
02:04 < SDuensin> No FRICKIN clue when it decided to run those.  Or why.
02:04 < perlDreamer> cow pies are a big winner
02:05 < perlDreamer> It will run the cron with it thinks it is the correct time
02:05 < perlDreamer> We have high hopes for the stroopwafels and the teriyaki jerky
02:05 < SynQ> rizen: I've allready created a webgui page for my new nephew
02:05  * SDuensin is really stressed out about this.
02:06 < SynQ> its http://www.tooncornelis.nl
02:06 <@rizen> SD read page 241
02:06 < SDuensin> Yea.  In large, friendly, red letters.
02:06 < SynQ> nothing on there yet though
02:07 < perlDreamer> SynQ: which RFE do you want karma added to?
02:07  * SDuensin wants the new books.  They look spiffy.
02:07 < SynQ> the red-lantern-on-the-karma-list rfe
02:08 < perlDreamer> after it is rated, I'll add some to it.
02:08 < SynQ> hmm
02:09 < SynQ> did your presentation say to push JT to rate the rfe's or didn't it?
02:09 < SDuensin> So weird that all the other sites work fine.
02:09 < SynQ> that is weird
02:09 < SynQ> I agree
02:09 < perlDreamer> I have the feeling that pushing JT may influence the Difficulty in a negative way :)
02:10 <@rizen> SD, you just said it was working
02:10 <@rizen> publish something and see if it works
02:10 < SDuensin> The pbcron* things are still 500ing.
02:11 <@rizen> surey they are
02:11 <@rizen> you haven't proven to me that they are, you can't seem to get the log file correct
02:11 < SDuensin> This just happened:  http://pastebin.com/d3349b418
02:11 <@rizen> why does it say 2:18
02:12 < SDuensin> (And my clock is wrong.  One problem at a time.)
02:12 <@rizen> fix the problems that y ou can
02:12 < SDuensin> Added an article - http://pastebin.com/d5de61c43
02:12 < SynQ> perlDreamer I guess I won't push then :)
02:13 <@rizen> curl http://www.cloudcircle.com/?op=runCronJob;taskId=pbcron0000000000000004
02:13 < SynQ> do you know if you get karma if a rfe you requested is being implemented?
02:13 <@rizen> escape the ;
02:13 < perlDreamer> No.
02:13 < perlDreamer> You also don't get the karma from the RFE if you implement it.
02:13 <@rizen> SynQ gets negative karma for asking so many questions
02:13 <@rizen> and sending me pictures of children
02:13 < SynQ> No, you don't know, or no you know it doesn't
02:14 < perlDreamer> I know that it does not.
02:14 < SynQ> gee
02:14 < SDuensin> "done" - but I didn't see anything get logged.
02:14 < SynQ> I didn't send them to you
02:14 < SynQ> I sent them to sarah
02:14 < SynQ> by proxy
02:14 < SDuensin> It just tried to run pbcron*04 again.  500
02:16 < SynQ> here's a picture of Gooey: http://www.marij.net/uploads/FY/CY/FYCYHmnr_L-5aRAdKdUBMA/02-Octopus.jpg
02:16 < SDuensin> hahahaha
02:16 < SDuensin> That's great!
02:16 <@rizen> but it's got a kid attached to it
02:16 <@rizen> so it's invalid
02:16 < SynQ> it's Marij
02:17 <@rizen> it doesnt' matter who it is
02:17 <@rizen> also, you can't all "it" a "who"
02:17  * SDuensin refers back to page 241.
02:17 <@rizen> it doesn't get a "who" status until it can speak in complete sentences
02:18 <@rizen> sd, run spectre in debug mode in a new window
02:18 < SynQ> that picture is old, Marij can now speak in complete 6 word sentences
02:18 < SynQ> :)
02:18 < SDuensin> Do an ./rc.spectre stop first?
02:19 <@rizen> yes
02:19 < SDuensin> k
02:19 < SynQ> I gotta go to the toilet and I want some more cheese please
02:19 < SynQ> for example
02:19 <@rizen> SynQ, has anyone told you that you're baby crazy?
02:19 < SynQ> uh
02:20 < SDuensin> spectre.pl --run --debug is running
02:20 < SynQ> most of the time they skip the word baby
02:20 <@rizen> let it run for a few minutes
02:20 < SynQ> and just call me crazy
02:20 <@rizen> then pastebin the output
02:20 < SynQ> whoahahahaha
02:20  * SynQ dances on his head
02:21 < SynQ> but now I't time to go and walk the dog and sleep off the last few hours of my jetlag
02:21 < SynQ> nite all
02:21 < SynQ> I'll bug you again tomorrow :)
02:21 < SDuensin> rizen - http://pastebin.com/m76c8dbd7
02:22 <@rizen> a FEW MINUTES
02:22 <@rizen> it hasn't even been a few minutes since i told you to do it
02:22 < SDuensin> Well, it showed the error right away.  :-P
02:22 < SDuensin> I don't know if I can capture *minutes* with this terminal.
02:24 < SDuensin> Here's a piece out of the middle.   http://pastebin.com/m20322acb
02:24 <@rizen> remember those two curl commands i gave you
02:24 <@rizen> run them with a :81
02:24 <@rizen> in the url
02:24 <@rizen> at the end of the domain
02:25 < SDuensin> k
02:28 < SDuensin> "done" and "complete"
02:33 < SDuensin> This is all very odd.
02:33 <@rizen> ok then, i'm going to side with preaction and haarg that you need professional help
02:33 < SDuensin> More professional than you?  :-P
02:34 <@rizen> no i mean login support
02:34 <@rizen> cuz either you're leaving stuff out or i don't know what else to ask
02:34 < SDuensin> Wish I had $5000.
02:34 <@preaction> probably be able to get to the answer right quick with access to the box
02:34 <@rizen> ad hoc login support is only $500
02:36 < SDuensin> I'd rather you took a digit off the other side of that number.  :-P
02:37 <@rizen> sorry man, i've asked what i can ask and you're giving me unparsable answers
02:37 < SDuensin> I wish I had better answers.  All I can give is what the box tells me.
02:37 <@rizen> so you're either experiencing something completely new
02:37 <@rizen> or you're misdirecting me
02:37 <@rizen> which i can't believe you'd do
02:37  * SDuensin votes for "completely new".
02:38 < SDuensin> So weird it works from everywhere but Spectre.
02:39 <@rizen> is your sitename specified correctly in your webgui config file?
02:40 <@rizen> the only thing that i can tell you to do at this point is add some debug code to WebGUI::Operation::Workflow at www_runWorkflow
02:40 < SDuensin> Yea, it's correct.
02:40 <@rizen> and WebGUI::Operation::Cron www_runCronJob
02:40 <@rizen> so you can try to figure out what's going on
02:40 <@rizen> eval each line and spit out the $@ results
02:41 < SDuensin> I wish this was my real job.  I've certainly pissed away more than $500 in time fighting it.  <sigh>
02:46 < SDuensin> Those seem to work.  I think Spectre is to blame.
02:47 <@rizen> i think it's your mom
02:48 < SDuensin> Na.  Can't be her.  She can't even send email.
02:48 <@khenn> I think it's preaction's mom
02:48 <@preaction> then why did you give her a commit bit?
02:48 < perlDreamer> Nepotism
02:48 <@preaction> not my fault she's hotter than your wife :(
02:49 <@khenn> don't talk about Kathy that way!
02:56  * SDuensin is starting to miss WebGUI 5.x.
02:57 <@rizen> don't even go there
02:57 < SDuensin> It loved me.  :-)
02:58 <@rizen> yeah, but if i hear you say that again i'm going to pull out my nine and gat some motherf*ckers
02:58 <@preaction> OH NOES!
02:58 < SDuensin> 7.x - for some odd reason - has a problem with me being WebGUI's Biggest Fan.
02:59 <@rizen> it really doesn't
02:59 < SDuensin> Says you!  It LIKES you!
02:59 <@rizen> it loves me
03:02 <@apeiron> ... probably because he *told* it to... /me coughs...
03:03 < SDuensin> hehe
03:09 < perlDreamer> perl 5.10 just went into code freeze
03:10  * perlDreamer wants //=
03:10 <@preaction> mmmmmmmmm 5.10
03:10 < SDuensin> Are they still making any progress on 6 / Parrot?
03:10 < perlDreamer> that's not a straight forward question
03:10 < SDuensin> hehe
03:10 < perlDreamer> The language design is going well
03:11 < perlDreamer> Of the 5 perl 6 implementations...
03:11 < SDuensin> The WHAT?!
03:11 < SDuensin> FIVE?
03:11 < perlDreamer> pugs is languishing since the lead programmer has been sick for a long time
03:11 < SDuensin> WTF is Pugs?
03:11 < perlDreamer> Parrot is proceeding, but slowly.  It suffered from too many changes in lead programmers
03:11 < SDuensin> And that sucks about the programmer.
03:12 < perlDreamer> mp6 (mostly perl 6) has been dead a long time
03:12 < perlDreamer> kp6 (kinda perl 6) has a new backend, where it compiles perl 6 code using a perl 5 based parser and an AST transformer
03:12 < perlDreamer> hm
03:12 < perlDreamer> I seem to be short one implementation
03:12 < perlDreamer> or two
03:12 < SDuensin> "Mostly" and "Kinda"?  Hehehe
03:13 < perlDreamer> Pugs is the Haskell based perl 6 prototyping system
03:13 < perlDreamer> it is the most complete perl 6 implementation in existence
03:13 < SDuensin> Ah, ok.  I've heard of that - just didn't know it was called Pugs.
03:16 < perlDreamer> a lot of perl6-isms are being backported to perl 5
03:16 < perlDreamer> like //=
03:16  * SDuensin has no idea what that is.
03:16 <@preaction> the new given/when
03:16 < perlDreamer> do you know what ||= is ?
03:17 < SDuensin> No.  Perl scares me.
03:17 < perlDreamer> well, //= is very similar, only it is defined-or instead of logical-or
03:17  * SDuensin can read Perl, but writing is a bit rough.
03:17 < perlDreamer> hm, ||= is a shortcut for $var = $var || 'something' else
03:18 < perlDreamer> $var ||= 'something'
03:18 < SDuensin> Makes sense.
03:18 < perlDreamer> now, //= is a shortcut for
03:18 < perlDreamer> $var = (defined $var ? $var : 'something');
03:18 < perlDreamer> it works on definedness instead of truth
03:19 < SDuensin> I can see where that'd be handy.
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03:41 < perlDreamer> SDuensin: Do you really find Java easier/different from Perl?
03:42 <@rizen> java is pretty damn easy
03:42 <@rizen> but i think perl is easier
03:43 < SDuensin> I'm sure it's what you're used to.  For me, Java is easier.
03:44 < perlDreamer> home is always more comfortable
03:44 <@preaction> casting primitives frustrates me to no end
03:45 < SDuensin> I learned Java just to work with that ZK toolkit.  I plan on buffing up my Perl for WebGUI.
03:45 <@apeiron> SDuensin, Get yourself hence to Learning Perl. Best way, IMO.
03:46 < SDuensin> That one of the animal books?
03:46 < perlDreamer> Llama
03:46 <@preaction> the llama book
03:46 <@preaction> perlbot learn perl
03:46 < perlbot> http://learn.perl.org/library/beginning_perl/
03:46 <@preaction> hum... that's not the right one
03:46 < perlDreamer> actually, if you're a programmer, I'd recommend just going straight to Programming Perl, the camel book instead
03:47 < SDuensin> I had both of those at one of my previous jobs.  Didn't steal them when I left.  :-(
03:47 <@preaction> beginning perl is for non-programmers. learning perl is for non-Perlers
03:47 <@rizen> and i have an even better recommendation that supersedes what all these yahoos have told you. get a copy of the perl black book. it's out of print, but worth every penny
03:48 <@apeiron> Hey, I'm not a yahoo, dammit. I'm just a run of the mill nutjob. :)
03:48 <@rizen> the little black book is pretty good too, but the full perl black book is even better if you can find it
03:48 <@rizen> lots more examples
03:49 < SDuensin> Found both of them.
03:49 <@preaction> you just like it because it's "black"
03:49 <@apeiron> And 'little'
03:49 <@rizen> $apeiron->castAs("dickwad");
03:49 < SDuensin> If any of you guys are after books, check www.abebooks.com - they have some GREAT prices!
03:49 <@apeiron> tee hee
03:49 <@preaction> to be quite honest, perldoc is about the best resource for learning perl there ever will be
03:49 <@apeiron> rizen++ # comical
03:49 <@preaction> perlbot karma for rizen
03:49 < perlbot> Karma for rizen: 1
03:49 <@preaction> he's on the board!
03:50 <@rizen> actually it's not just cuz it's black. ask frank. it really is the best perl book ever
03:50 < SDuensin> http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?isbn=1576104656&sts=t&x=24&y=9
03:51 <@rizen> yup that's it
03:52 <@rizen> i wish corilis didn't go out of business
03:52 < perlDreamer> why not find the author and see if he can release the work?
03:52 <@rizen> the black book series were the best tech books ever made
03:53 <@rizen> i believe that o'reilly bought the rights
03:53 <@rizen> wow, i never knew about this abe books store
03:53 <@rizen> it's awesome
03:54 < perlDreamer> http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/1932111107/
03:54 < perlDreamer> It's still available
03:56 <@rizen> oh sweet: http://www.paraglyphpress.com/about.php
03:56 <@rizen> it lives again
03:56 <@rizen> they're rebulding from the ashes
03:56 <@rizen> here's to hoping they can get holzner to update the PBB to 5.10
03:57  * perlDreamer goes home
03:57 -!- perlDreamer [n=ckuskie@nat050.mxim.com] has quit ["Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/"]
03:58 < SDuensin> Yea, I love Abe.
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05:09 < khenn_> yep, the Black Book > all other Perl books
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06:35 <+perlDreamer> is the 7.5 release imminent?
06:35 <@preaction> nowhere near
06:36 <+perlDreamer> good
06:36 <@preaction> weren't you listening during the keynote?
06:36 <+Radix-wrk> What's new in 7.5?
06:36 <+perlDreamer> You won't believe it!
06:36 <@preaction> Radix-wrk, not finalized yet, but there's the Gallery asset at least
06:36 <+Radix-wrk> What was said in the keynote?
06:36 <+perlDreamer> WebGUI is going to be rewritten in befunge!
06:36 <@preaction> i thought he said brainf*ck
06:36 <+perlDreamer> too verbose
06:36 <+Radix-wrk> awesome
06:36 <+perlDreamer> Lots of AJAX on the horizon
06:37 <+perlDreamer> A brand new, dedicated photo gallery
06:37 <@preaction> Gallery will, out of the box, provide Flickr-like collaborative photo gallerys
06:37 <+Radix-wrk> cool
06:37 <+perlDreamer> Video sharing (WebGUI Video) will be like YouTube
06:37 <@apeiron> And it'll even pluralize 'gallery' correctly!
06:38 <@preaction> the Video thing is being implemented via the Gallery, the Gallery is going to be awesomecore
06:38 <+perlDreamer> Lots of social application kinds of things
06:38 <+Radix-wrk> this using JT's thingy?
06:38 <@preaction> the Friends Network thing has been committed already
06:38 <@preaction> nope, the Thingy is different, and that should be in 7.5 too
06:38 <+perlDreamer> The Things will be out, too
06:39 <+perlDreamer> Is Commerce in 7.5?
06:39 <@preaction> a new release cycle of 6 months for feature releases, keeping one-week bugfix releases until the new Patch-based release system gets finished
06:39 <+perlDreamer> yeah, patches!
06:40 <@preaction> i think Commerce may make it into 7.5 if not i Know JT's been doing the design already, so it might be 7.6
06:40 <@preaction> but iirc that's the 8.0 milestone, actually
06:41  * perlDreamer goes to check the roadmap
06:41 <+Radix-wrk> Sounds like a number of interesting things are ahead then
06:41 <@preaction> oh yes
06:41 <@preaction> we're at the cusp of a great evolution of WebGUI
06:41 <+perlDreamer> what happened to the roadmap?
06:42 <@preaction> durno
06:43 <@preaction> i know the EMS is going to be redone sooner rather than later, but that's contingent on the Commerce rewrite
06:43 <@preaction> i was thinking about making it a subclass of the Calendar, since a few people have expressed interest in getting Calendar views for their EMS
06:44 <+perlDreamer> mixin
06:44 <+perlDreamer> preaction: have you pursued your MasterContainer Wobject idea?
06:44 <@preaction> oh, and the biggest development: code in the core is no longer allowed without full test suites
06:45 <@preaction> no, unfortunately. the DumbContainer has taken a backseat to the AssetReport
06:45 <+Radix-wrk> Someone needs to post a review of the WUC somewhere so those of us who could not attend could at least catch up on the main points :)
06:45 <+perlDreamer> http://use.perl.org/~colink
06:45 <+perlDreamer> AssetReport?
06:45 <@preaction> cap10morgan gave one on the contribs page, but it has too much Navigation and not enough SQLReport power
06:45 <@preaction> it's basically a replacement for using SQLReports to get Assets
06:45 <+perlDreamer> oh, yeah
06:46 <@preaction> i've got everything done except a Constraints tab (to provide a "where" clause) and the test suite
06:46 <+perlDreamer> preaction: I won't forget to read through the WebGUI::Test options
06:46 <+perlDreamer> but I just found a Help bug that I want to quash
06:47 <@preaction> maybe i should merge the WebGUI::Test::Maker from my photogallery branch
06:47 <+perlDreamer> Yes!
06:47 <+Radix-wrk> cheers pd - just looking at your journal entries now
06:47 <+Radix-wrk> should write it up for slashdot or something I reckon.. get some news out there about webgui
06:48 <+perlDreamer> Do we still make release announcements to LWN.net?
06:49 <+Radix-wrk> congrats on contributor of the year award too :)
06:49 <+perlDreamer> Thank you.
06:49 <+perlDreamer> It doesn't hurt that I get 2-3 months per year of downtime at $dayJob
06:49 <+perlDreamer> Those guys are just nuts.
06:51 <+Radix-wrk> don't think releases are made on LWN - though it looks like the 2007 WebGUI users conference was
06:51 <@preaction> WebGUI::Test::Maker committed to trunk
06:52 <@preaction> isn't there a bot that will track revisions to SVN and post them in the channel?
06:53 <@preaction> got... i need more free time... there's a SQL::Translator thing that would be awesome for WebGUI releases (use GraphViz to include a visual ERD for each release of WebGUI)
06:53 <@preaction> the smoke tests haven't been posted to a WebGUI forum in forever and a day
06:53 <@apeiron> preaction, CIA.
06:54 <@preaction> Caffiene Injector Action?
06:54 <@preaction> Crack Ingestion Assumed?
06:55 <@apeiron> uh
06:55 <+Radix-wrk> Cheers In Advance
06:55 <@apeiron> I'm not sure to what the acronym expands.
06:55 <@apeiron> Or even if it is an acronym.
06:55 <+Radix-wrk> Christians in April
06:55 <@apeiron> Anywho, cia.vc
06:55 <@preaction> that svn thing i was talking about?
06:55 <@apeiron> Yeah.
06:59 <+perlDreamer> smoke tests are back online already
06:59 <@preaction> we should change the +v that WebGUI Contributers get into a +h, so they have power to keep some order in the channel
06:59 <@preaction> orly?
06:59 <+perlDreamer> orly?
06:59 <@preaction> yarly
06:59 <@preaction> perlbot orly
07:00 <+perlDreamer> ah
07:00 <@preaction> perlbot orly is yarly
07:00 < perlbot> added orly to the database
07:00 <@apeiron> preaction, We can do that after you submit a patch to dancer to allow for +h. :)
07:00 <@preaction> this isn't dancer, this is hyperion. i could've swore they had halfop
07:01 <@preaction> nope, guess not
07:01 <@preaction> they killed dancer for some reason and are now calling it hyperion
07:01 <@apeiron> eh, whatev. I just know it doesn't have +h. :)
07:01 <@preaction> nope, just ov
07:01 <@preaction> PREFIX=(ov)@+
07:02 <@preaction> interesting: the IRC server refers to itself as "dancer", but the welcome message says "hyperion-1.0.2b"
07:02 <@preaction> s/interesting/boring/
07:02 <+perlDreamer> s/boring/schizo-aliased/
07:03 <@apeiron> I shall add that to my defence of believing why this was dancer and not hyperion. :)
07:04 -!- CIA-39 [i=cia@208.69.182.149] has joined #WebGUI
07:04 <@preaction> CIA-39, botsnack?
07:04 <@preaction> lame.
07:06 <+perlDreamer> what's the commit check interval?
07:06 <@preaction> 15 minutes
07:06 <@preaction> we don't have anything to ping it, so it has to wait
07:06 <+perlDreamer> does it limit message rates so it won't rate a killfile entry?
07:06 <@preaction> but you may want to go to cia.vc and add yourself as an Author on the WebGUI project
07:07 <@preaction> i would hope so
07:07 <@preaction> it's on like a dozen other channels
07:07 <@preaction> i imagine they only spawn new bots when the existing ones reach the channel limit
07:08 <+perlDreamer> there were lots of problems with the svnbotl on #parrot, it almost got banned.
07:08 <@preaction> nice
07:09 <@preaction> looks like CIA.vc also provides an RSS feed for commits
07:10 <@preaction> doesn't SVN::Web do the same thing?
07:10 <+perlDreamer> I think so
07:10 <@apeiron> Maybe not for projects not using SVN.
07:10 <+perlDreamer> yup
07:10 <+perlDreamer> https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/rss/WebGUI/
07:11 <@preaction> of course, i just don't believe in unnecessary obfuscation of using CIA's servers when I can use the native one
07:11 <+perlDreamer> you can basically get an RSS feed for any level in SVN
07:11 <@preaction> it's been a month since I started using an RSS reader, and I'm wondering why the heck i waited this long ;)
07:12 <@apeiron> RSS: all the information you never knew you cared about until it became hip.
07:13 <@preaction> unfair: i use it so i don't have to check my webcomics and Worse Than Failure 5 times a day for updates
07:13 <+perlDreamer> reminds me, I have to check xkcd
07:14 <@apeiron> baha, the caption (not the image caption) on the newest one is great.
07:16 <@preaction> are you saying that wikipedia's a bad resource to learn about foreplay?
07:16 <+perlDreamer> isa relationships got broke in the Help somewhere
07:16 <@preaction> that's not good
07:17 <+perlDreamer> maybe I should build a test for it :)
07:17 <@preaction> sounds like a good idea!
07:18 <@preaction> rofl i did a --dry-run and thought it committed...
07:18 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4879 /WebGUI/t/i18n/help.t: don't need no stinking lib
07:18 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4880 /WebGUI/t/i18n/help.t: don't need no stinking File::Find
07:19 <+perlDreamer> I really need to have fewer online identies
07:19 <@preaction> okay, that was totally not the bot's fault, COLIN
07:19 <+perlDreamer> 2/second is usually okay
07:21 <@apeiron> perlDreamer, Sometimes I wish I had more.
07:22 <+perlDreamer> why for?
07:22 <@apeiron> Anonymity is sometimes a good thing. :)
07:22 <@preaction> i've got a legacy with old ones, i keep changing to more PC names
07:23 <@apeiron> Let's hear the non-PC ones!
07:23 <@preaction> Hawkaloogie was about the least PC as I got
07:23 <@preaction> everyone just HAD to comment on it
07:23  * apeiron notes that he hasn't.
07:24 <@apeiron> Although all those hours in MMOs might have desensitised me a smidgeon...
07:24 <@preaction> mayhaps
07:25 <@preaction> 16-yr-olds with P3n15ma5t3r just doesn't seem as clever anymore
07:25 <+perlDreamer> ye're getting old
07:25 <@apeiron> Oh, yeah, now you have d4rkp3n15m5t3r.
07:25 <@preaction> oh GOD YES
07:26 <@preaction> i'm 24, i can't be old yet
07:26 <@apeiron> I saw several names with 'dark' in them when I was WoWing last night.
07:30  * perlDreamer grieves
07:30 <+perlDreamer> a test has been obsoleted
07:32 <+perlDreamer> time to crash out
07:32 <+perlDreamer> we old folk need our rest
07:32 <+perlDreamer> night, all
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07:33 < CIA-39> WebGUI: doug * r4881 /WebGUI/t/lib/WebGUI/ (6 files in 3 dirs): Added WebGUI::Test::Maker
07:33 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4882 /WebGUI/t/Help/setHelp.t: setHelp.t is not needed since all help icons point to the wiki
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10:10 <@preaction> morning people from across the pond
10:26 < AMH_bob> Goodmorning Doug!
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16:41 < SDuensin> Greetings!
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17:08 <+MrHairgrease> hey frank
17:08 <+MrHairgrease> do you know when tavis will be posting his remaining wuc photos?
17:09 < SDuensin> Morning, MrHairgrease 
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17:13 <+MrHairgrease> greetings sduensin
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17:14 <@khenn> I don't know
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19:05 < perlDreamer> be forewarned, there may be a problem with one of the tests
19:06 < perlDreamer> I ran a test coverage suite last night, and my config file got corrupted
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23:51 <@khenn> quiet today =p
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23:51 < MrHairgreas2> now look what you've done khenn!
23:51 <@khenn> what is that?
23:52 <@khenn> disturbed the peace?
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23:53 <+MrHairgrease> your complaining made sduensin leave =)
23:54 <@khenn> I wasn't complaining.  I merely noted that it was quiet today
23:55 <+MrHairgrease> why do you have to be so negative?
23:55 <@khenn> why are you always reading between the lines? =p
23:55 <+MrHairgrease> you could've also said. People sure are busy today hacking webgui!
23:55 <@apeiron> Yes, he could've said that.
23:55 <+MrHairgrease> That's the spirit
23:56 <+MrHairgrease> YES
23:56 <+MrHairgrease> say it with me
23:56 <@apeiron> People sure are busy hacking webgui today!
23:56 <+MrHairgrease> and become a better positive person
23:56 <+MrHairgrease> YES!!!
23:56 <@apeiron> (me, I'm testing a workflow, waiting for a long-running process to complete before I know if I got it right)
23:57 <@khenn> I could also just issue random positive statments
23:57  * MrHairgrease is watching a very quiet channel waiting for people to finally say something
23:57 <@khenn> people sure are busy fixing WebGUI bugs today
23:58 <+MrHairgrease> frank's seen the light =)
23:58 <@khenn> especially MrHairgrease who claims he will have them all fixed by end of business tomorrow!
23:59 <+MrHairgrease> you keep using those drugs boy
23:59 <@khenn> who also said he's be finished with a full test suite for all of WebGUI by the end of October
23:59 <@khenn> =)
23:59 <+MrHairgrease> AND the alcohol
23:59 <+MrHairgrease> =)
--- Day changed Thu Oct 25 2007
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01:00  * perlDreamer hears snapcount's crickets again
01:00 < perlDreamer> Where is everybody?
01:00 <+MrHairgrease> in the netherlands of course
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01:05 < perlDreamer> Offhand, do you know how big a compiled and installed WRE is?
01:06 < perlDreamer> I'm thinking about a thumbdrive based install of the WRE.
01:11 < perlDreamer> Actually, on a separate topic, I think I know the secret of WebGUI's popularity problem.
01:11 < perlDreamer> It's the name
01:11 < perlDreamer> Everyone seems to have settled on Nuke as a required part of a CMS
01:11 < perlDreamer> PHPNuke
01:11 < perlDreamer> PostNuke
01:11 < perlDreamer> DotNetNuke
01:11 < perlDreamer> So we'll need to rename WebGUI
01:11 < perlDreamer> WebNuke
01:11 < perlDreamer> NukeGUI
01:11 < perlDreamer> WebGUINuke
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01:33 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4883 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/User.pm: remove extra whitespace that was interfering with POD parsing.
01:33 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4884 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Friends.pm: fix broken POD command in Friends
01:36 < knowmad> perlDreamer: "I'm thinking about a thumbdrive based install of the WRE." -- how about a vmware image?
01:36 < knowmad> i've got a project to build a bootable linux cd; maybe we can use it to figure out how to create a bootable iso that would startup wG on a local workstation
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01:37  * MrHairgrease concurs with perldreamer that joomla, mambo, plone, wordpress and drupal all sound exactly like nuke =)
01:37 < knowmad> both of those options would save install headaches
01:37 < knowmad> MrHairgrease: In what language?
01:37 <+MrHairgrease> none that i know off
01:38 < knowmad> :)
01:38 <+MrHairgrease> maybe garbled crap
01:38 <+MrHairgrease> but that's more rizen's forte
01:38 < knowmad> isn't that the language they were all written in?
01:38 <+MrHairgrease> =)
01:38 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
01:38 <+MrHairgrease> by the pointy haired programmers
01:38 < knowmad> that's a scary image
01:39 <+MrHairgrease> or maybe point headed programmers
01:39 <+MrHairgrease> it doesn't matter
01:39 < knowmad> i've got to go home; my dogs are hungry
01:39 <+MrHairgrease> webgui is  programmed in a language that allows ascii art beer bottles to actually be valid cod
01:39 <+MrHairgrease> ok
01:40 <+MrHairgrease> well goodbye i guess
01:40 < knowmad> and don't we all need that!
01:40 < knowmad> goodbye
01:40 <+MrHairgrease> yes we do
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01:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4885 /WebGUI/t/i18n/label.t: make sure that no files are accidently skipped, and emit comments via diag, not warn
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02:00 < perlDreamer> preaction: your editor leaks spaces
02:00 <@preaction> how so?
02:01 < perlDreamer> well, you made a commit (and I'm assuming that it's your code, perhaps wrongly) where there was a whole bunch of extra white space
02:01 < perlDreamer> https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/revision/?rev=4874
02:01 < perlDreamer> and it caused the Whitespace.t test to fail (which does POD syntax checking for strict parsers)
02:02 <@preaction> nope, that was Frank/JTs code
02:02 < perlDreamer> https://svn.webgui.org/svnweb/plainblack/revision/?rev=4883
02:02 < perlDreamer> ah, okay
02:02 <@preaction> i only had to fix a minor conflict and test
02:02 < perlDreamer> my bad
02:02 <@preaction> oh, i see. the lines with only whitespace on them
02:03 <@preaction> yeah, that's kinda ugly. i imagine it's Frank's HomeSite that's doing it
02:03 <@preaction> vim is what I use, and iirc that's what JT uses
02:03 <@preaction> and iirc vim clears out lines that only have whitespace on them
02:04 < perlDreamer> unless you have autoindent set up strangely, yes
02:04 <@preaction> i dunno, i did change my vimrc file recently, but hope that didn't munge anything up
02:05 <@preaction> it helps me see glaring problems with indenting (since tab chars are still 8 wide, but my tabs are 4 spaces)
02:05 <+MrHairgrease> hear hear
02:05 <+MrHairgrease> http://www.cs.bgu.ac.il/~orlovm/code/emacs/viman.gif
02:05 <@preaction> lol
02:10 <@preaction> KFC "Famous Bowls" are quite possibly the most ugly collection of awesome-tasting goodness ever constructed: http://www.theimpulsivebuy.com/?p=408
02:10 <@preaction> Mashed Potatoes + Brown Gravy + Corn + Fried Chicken Bites + Cheese + Bowl = FAMOUS
02:12 <@rizen> WRE is about 250 mb before you add any sites
02:16 < perlDreamer> gotta go
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02:56 <@apeiron> preaction, Look up Wikipedia's entry for scrapple. 
02:57 <@apeiron> preaction, I've declared it as veritably ambrosia. But anyone who reads about it is utterly disgusted.
02:57 <@apeiron> hmm. They probably don't have that out in WI. =\
02:57 <@rizen> somebody needs to write all kinds of cool stuff about plain black and webgui in wikipedia
02:57 <@apeiron> We can't.
02:57 <@preaction> doesn't look any worse than meatloaf
02:57 <@apeiron> Someone *else* can, though.
02:58 <@preaction> we could, sure, we just can't lie
02:58 <@preaction> there's no real "plainblack IP block" they could detect ;)
02:58 <@rizen> are you saying that there is no "cool stuff" to write about us
02:58 <@rizen> cuz i think there's all kinds of cool stuff
02:59 <@apeiron> I'm saying that Wikipedia has policies against employees writing about their employers.
02:59 <@preaction> it's more of a wikipedia policy of "original research"
02:59 <@apeiron> That too.
02:59 <@preaction> as in "no original research"
02:59 <@apeiron> And it probably also violates the neutral point of view policy, too.
02:59 <@rizen> ok, apeiron, you're fired
02:59 < Radix__> i can
03:00 <@rizen> now go write about us on wikipedia
03:00 <@rizen> hehe
03:00 <@apeiron> Damn.
03:00 <@rizen> then when you're done, let me know and i'll rehire you
03:01 <@apeiron> uhm, what would I go write?
03:01 <@apeiron> "gee, these guys suck, they hired me for two weeks and then fired me"
03:01 <@rizen> no, you'd write cool stuff
03:01 <@rizen> cuz you know i'm going to hire you again when you're done
03:02 <@rizen> actually i should go see what it says about us on wikipedia, cuz we've been getting quite a bit of traffic from there
03:02 <@apeiron> Wow, interesting.
03:03 <@apeiron> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_content_management_systems 
03:03 <@apeiron> That's probably why.
03:03 <@apeiron> We're one of the few FOSS CMSs listed for Perl.
03:04 <@rizen> we are one of the only perl ones in existence
03:04 <@rizen> not just listed, but just plain available
03:04 <@apeiron> That too. :)
03:04 <@rizen> there are only 4 that i know of
03:04 <@rizen> tiki (wiki)
03:04 <@rizen> bricolage (new oriented sites)
03:04 <@rizen> metadot (intranets)
03:05 <@rizen> webgui (general purpose)
03:05 <@rizen> s/new/news/
03:05 <@apeiron> The listing there has Scoop and Slashcode listed.
03:05 <@apeiron> But they're closer to Bric, right?
03:05 <@rizen> oh i forgot about slashcode
03:05 <@rizen> slash is a blog, it runs slashdot
03:05 <@rizen> i don't know what scoop is
03:05 <@rizen> i'll have to see
03:06 <@apeiron> They also list Cyclone3, which apparently runs on a morass of Perl, XUL, JS, C, and Java (*shudder*)
03:06 < Radix__> I attended a talk about one while I was at the YAPC::Europe which was written in perl also
03:06 < Radix__> it's much like webgui actually.. but much cruder
03:06 < Radix__> written by one guy who had heard of webgui, but never tried it
03:06 <+MrHairgrease> yeah
03:07 <+MrHairgrease> that guy was on the channel a couple of weeks back
03:07 <@apeiron> Was it WebFUI? :)
03:07 < Radix__> yeah, I told him to drop in and say hi
03:07 <+MrHairgrease> webphooey
03:07 <@rizen> Radix, that guy came on the IRC channel after you talked to him
03:07 <@rizen> i looked at his project
03:07 <@apeiron> Ah, I missed the 'written in perl' part.
03:07 < Radix__> I wore my webgui t-shirt the first day at the conference
03:07 <+MrHairgrease> which is based on php
03:07 <@rizen> it's where webgui was about 4 years ago
03:07 <@rizen> he said he really just writes it for therapy
03:08 < Radix__> rizen: yup, that's what I thought
03:08 < Radix__> we should get him to start working on webgui instead - he'll need more therapy if he does that tho
03:08 <+MrHairgrease> speak for yourself
03:08 <@rizen> i tried to get him to do that
03:08 <+MrHairgrease> some people run fine on liquor
03:09 <+MrHairgrease> =)
03:09 <@rizen> but he said he has too much invested in his
03:09 < Radix__> heh
03:09 <@rizen> scoop looks like slashcode
03:09 < Radix__> Well.. off to work.. afk
03:09 <+MrHairgrease> ok time to go to sleep
03:09 <+MrHairgrease> later
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03:23 <@apeiron> Cyclone's UI looks nice, but I personally think the four / five different implementation languages would make it a nightmare.
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03:58 <@rizen> cyclone is a publishing only system, not a dynamic system like webgui
03:59 <@apeiron> ah.
04:01 < SDuensin> Hey gang.
04:01 < SDuensin> rizen - Thanks again, man.  I owe you.
04:02 <@rizen> yeah you do
04:02 <@rizen> hehe
04:03 <@rizen> you need to write some articles about webgui and get them published somewhere
04:03 <@rizen> we need press
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04:05 <+SDuensin> Press is good.
04:05 <+SDuensin> I've not written anything, but short of holding a WebGUI parade, I do a pretty good job in person.  :-)
04:06 <@preaction> personal blog?
04:06 <+SDuensin> Nope.  But a professional one soon.  :-)
04:06 <+SDuensin> (Running on WebGUI, of course!)
04:08 <@preaction> i need to add an RFE for a "Blog" collab system variant that interfaces with the new Friends system and allows LiveJournal-type sites
04:08 <@apeiron> So then people can use WebGUI to talk about how awful their lives are?
04:08 <+SDuensin> Friends system?
04:09 <@preaction> apeiron, i was thinking more of having a staff blog where we can talk about Public stuff and Private stuff
04:09 <@preaction> SDuensin, new in 7.5
04:09 <@apeiron> preaction, Ahh.
04:09 <+SDuensin> preaction - Oooo!  Color me excited!
04:09 <@preaction> SDuensin, the new Gallery asset makes use of it to form a type of "Flickr"-like site
04:10 <+SDuensin> Even more excited!
04:10 <@rizen> and the blog variant should also use the blogger api so that third party blog tools work with it
04:10 <@rizen> what?
04:10 <@rizen> really the gallery uses the friends system?
04:12 <+Radix-wrk> Sounds awesome
04:12 <@preaction> rizen, yes, "public" and "private" photos in albums
04:13 <+SDuensin> Well, preaction, quit chattin' and get that sucker released!   :-P
04:14 <@preaction> laugh, i'm looking at 5000+ lines of code for this one
04:14 <@preaction> without templates
04:14 <+SDuensin> :-)
04:14 <@preaction> i'm probably about 1/4 of the way there, which is not a good measure of my completion since much of it so far has been skeletons that i'm filling in
04:15 <@rizen> preaction, the tests are all written then?
04:15 <@preaction> for the photo asset, which i'm filling in now, yes
04:16 <+SDuensin> rizen, you ever think about getting interviewed on FOSS Weekly or some other podcast?
04:18 <@rizen> sd you must not have read my blog post this week
04:18 <+SDuensin> No.  I haven't.  I'm bad.
04:18 <+SDuensin> Whoa.  It's black.
04:18 <@preaction> it's JT :p
04:19 <@rizen> wait...you've never seen the black blog before?
04:19 <+SDuensin> You need the shirt my sister has.  It's a black T that says, "I'll only wear black until I find something darker."
04:19 <@rizen> heh, i do need that
04:20 <@apeiron> Sign me up for one, too.
04:22 <+SDuensin> I'll have to find out where she got it.
04:35 <+SDuensin> FLOSS Weekly show about WebGUI has been requested.  :-)
04:36 <@rizen> what?
04:36 <@rizen> my article said you were supposed to promote webgui
04:36 <@rizen> cuz you're more credible than me
04:37 <+SDuensin> Well *I* requested it.  And I'll provide them more info if they ask.  However, they like to talk to the people who actually know WTF they're talking about.  :-)
04:38 <@rizen> ok well i'll do the interview
04:38 <@rizen> but you still owe me an article or two
04:38 <+SDuensin> I'll see what I can do.  :-D
04:39 <+SDuensin> We use WebGUI for some sites that get traffic/news (like that www.kevinmhuntfoundation.org site).  Might be able to put something together about how WebGUI made those sites possible.
04:39 <+SDuensin> We threw that KMH Foundation site up *FAST*.  No way it could have been done with "traditional" tools.
04:40 <@rizen> that's what i want to see
04:40 <+Radix-wrk> I built this site: www.tenpartinvention.com in about 10 hours from scratch.
04:40 <@rizen> that would be a great story
04:42 <@preaction> Radix-wrk, would there be a way to get a Gravatar into a user profile? would it be as simple as making a field for the user's gravatar ID and then using the macro you wrote where appropriate?
04:42 <+Radix-wrk> all you need to know is their gravatar id yeah
04:43 <@rizen> sd, i'm speaking at http://www.acm.org/ next month
04:43 <@rizen> and in houston next week
04:43 <+SDuensin> Sweet.  Put it on Google Video.   :-)
04:43 <@rizen> and somwhere else at the end of november
04:44 <@rizen> i'm getting killed with all this media stuff these days
04:44 <@rizen> that's why i need you to write articles
04:44 <+Radix-wrk> it'll be worth it tho :)
04:44 <@preaction> rizen, it's all your fault for hiring Tavis... i knew he was bad news from the beginning
04:45 <@rizen> yup..it was a terrible decision
04:45 <+Radix-wrk> Who's tavis?
04:45 <@preaction> Director of Media Relations at plainblack
04:45 <@rizen> pb's director of media relations
04:45 <+Radix-wrk> Ahh.. I see :)
04:45 <@preaction> and imho damn good at his job
04:46 <+Radix-wrk> sounds like it :)
04:46 <@rizen> what makes your opinion honest?
04:46 <@rizen> i understand when people say imo
04:46 <@preaction> today at Walmart I had someone ask me who I was
04:46 <@rizen> but imho makes no sense
04:46 <@preaction> humble
04:46 <@rizen> oh
04:46 <+Radix-wrk> only liars think it means 'honest'
04:46 <@rizen> i must be a liar then
04:47 <+Radix-wrk> heh
04:47 <@rizen> cuz i always thought it meant honest
04:47 <@preaction> seriously. there was that big thing about "Do you know who this is?" at the restaurant monday night, and now more than a week later and 150 miles away, people are asking me who i am
04:47 <@rizen> but i never used it cuz i thought it was pompas
04:47 <@rizen> hehe
04:47 <@rizen> your reputation precedes you
04:47 <@preaction> it's messed up
04:47 <@rizen> tavis' influence is greater than you imagined
04:47 <@preaction> it's starting to scare me a bit
04:48 <@apeiron> preaction, Dude, I don't know who you are any more!
04:48 <+Radix-wrk> who are you preaction ?
04:48 <@preaction> Funny joke along those same lines: http://humour.200ok.com.au/popular_kev.html
04:48  * preaction looks incredulous
04:50 <+Radix-wrk> heh
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09:18 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4886 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): profile field and dashbaord fixes
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09:33 < CIA-39> WebGUI: doug * r4887 /branch/photogallery/WebGUI/ (15 files in 8 dirs): more tests, started Photo development, changed some naming
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09:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4888 /branch/WebGUI_7.4/ (7 files in 6 dirs): merging 7.5 fixes
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10:28 < AMH_bob> Hi preaction, running the midnight oil? Or are you in Europe?
10:29 <@preaction> midnight movies
10:29 < AMH_bob> Sweet!
10:29 < AMH_bob> Not for me, I still shaking off the jetlag.
10:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4889 /branch/WebGUI_7.4/docs/create.sql: preparing for 7.4.11 release
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11:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4890 /branch/WebGUI_7.4/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Collaboration.pm: fix collaboration system sorting
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11:18 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4891 /branch/WebGUI_7.4/lib/WebGUI/Asset/Wobject/Collaboration.pm: typo
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14:33 < CIA-39> WebGUI: jt * r4892 /releases/WebGUI_7.4.11-stable: Release 7.4.11-stable
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15:35 < SynQ> hi there
15:41 < SynQ> we are trying to get some kind of 'register and reply to your e-mail before your account can be activated' way of authentication done
15:41 < SynQ> I recall this being just a part of WebGUI
15:41 < SynQ> but I can't seem to find it now
15:41 < SynQ> I guess if something like this were possible it would be in the WebGUI Administration Guide
15:42 < SynQ> but snailmail is soooo slooooow
15:42 < SynQ> it's not yet here
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15:45 < SynQ> ah
15:45 < SynQ> hi rory
15:45 < roryzweistra> hi!
15:46 < SynQ> do you know a way to  'register and reply to your e-mail before your account can be activated' way of authentication done
15:46 < SynQ> or something
15:46 < roryzweistra> hmmm......... not really
15:47 < SynQ> k
15:47 < AMH_mari> Isn't this under site settings -> authentication -> Validate email addresses ?
15:48 < AMH_mari> Validate email addresses
15:48 < AMH_mari> Before a user's account is activated, require that they click on a link sent to their email account.
15:48 < SynQ> that's it
15:48 < SynQ> :)
15:48 < AMH_mari> :-)
15:48 < SynQ> lets see if that works
15:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4893 /branch/WebGUI_7.4/ (4 files in 4 dirs): preparing for 7.4.12 dev
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15:53 < SynQ> hi bart
15:53 < BartJol> hopi
15:57 < BartJol> wel the validation seems to work
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15:57 < SynQ> sweet
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15:59 < SynQ> hi frank
15:59 < SynQ> I now got a great cold
15:59 < SDuensin> Greetings.
16:00 < SynQ> hi scott
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16:02 < SynQ> huh
16:02 < SynQ> BartJo1
16:02 <@khenn> hey
16:02 < BartJol> two times laladiedada
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16:02 < SynQ> hehe
16:02 < SynQ> we should do an irc training hour
16:03 < BartJol> sorry, just checking
16:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4894 /WebGUI/docs/ (5 files in 2 dirs): merging 7.4.11 changes
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16:30 < AMH_mari> @SynQ: and? Does it work?
16:40 < xootom> hi all, what's the plan for upgrading to 7.5, is/will it be maintained in parallel to 7.4.11?
16:40 < xootom> or will it come as an upgrade after the final 7.4
16:43 < SynQ> it does
16:43 < SynQ> thanks
16:51 < SynQ> Bart, that photo gallery you have on webgui.bartjol.nl
16:52 < SynQ> where did you get the example?
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16:59 < SynQ>  Bart, that photo gallery you have on webgui.bartjol.nl
16:59 < SynQ> where did you get the example?
16:59 < AMH_mari> wlc
17:00 < BartJo1> it's a package from jesse on the webgui.org site
17:00 < BartJo1> it's called lightbox
17:00 < SynQ> ah ok
17:00 < SynQ> I did look at that, but didn't get it to work yet
17:02 < BartJo1> it's in my import node
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17:02 < BartJo1> don't forget to put it in the right namespace
17:04 < BartJo1> then you have to select it in your image wobject template
17:10 -!- rizen changed the topic of #webgui to: [ WebGUI 7.4.11-stable | WRE 0.8.0 ] Before you ask, check the wiki: http://wiki.webgui.org | No Pasting in channel: http://webgui.pastebin.com/
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17:56 < SynQ> hey mister dodo
17:56 < SynQ> how do you
17:56 < dapperedodo> I'm great. Busy WebGUI hacking:)
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18:19 <@khenn> having brain problems this morning
18:19 <@khenn> does qw count new line characters as whitespace characters?
18:19 <@khenn> I'm pretty sure it does
18:20 < SynQ> uh
18:20 <@khenn> I can't remember
18:20 <@khenn> don't feel like testing it
18:20 <@khenn> =)
18:20 < SynQ> ask google
18:21 < SynQ> You can use any non-alphanumeric, non-whitespace delimeter to surround the qw() string argument.
18:22 < SynQ> so I'd say no
18:22 < SynQ> unless you use all new line characters
18:22 <@khenn> answer is yes
18:22 < SynQ> but you shouldn't mix spaces and new line characters
18:22 <@khenn> =)
18:22 < SynQ> that would at least get you ugly code
18:23 < SynQ> qw( some thing with spaces in between);
18:23 <@khenn> it doesn't care
18:23 <@khenn> qw (
18:23 <@khenn>     my mother told me
18:23 <@khenn>     to pick the very best one
18:23 <@khenn>      and you are not it
18:23 <@khenn> );
18:24 <@khenn> works fine
18:24 < SynQ> hmm
18:24 < SynQ> but it is ugly
18:24 < SynQ> it should be..
18:24 <@khenn> well yeah
18:24 <@khenn> I was just wondering if it worked
18:24 < SynQ> qw (  my mother told me to pick the very best one and you are not it );
18:25 < SynQ> ok
18:25 < SynQ> my working day is over
18:25 < SynQ> I'm going home
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18:48 <@rizen> name three things you love: sarah, perl, and webgui
18:49 <@rizen> name three things you hate: joomla, plone, and postnuke
18:49  * SDuensin hasn't met Sarah yet.  :-)
18:49 < SDuensin> Eww.  Nuke.
18:49  * SDuensin never figured out Plone.
18:49  * SDuensin is ridding himself of Joomla.
18:49 <@rizen> i found plone to be much easier than joomla and postnuke
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18:50 <@rizen> actually, joomla took me and another geek i know over an hour to publish just one page
18:50 < SDuensin> Yea.  It's odd.
18:50 < SDuensin> I really don't like how the admin tools are in their own little corner of the world away from the content.
18:55 <@rizen> i understand that people like joomla because it's super easy to install
18:56 <@rizen> i don't understand why they like the UI
18:56 <@rizen> i've played with it for hours trying to figure out what's so good about the UI
18:56 <@rizen> i just don't see it
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19:04 < xdanger> is there still a "Report user registrations to a group" function or something like that... I remember that there might have been one...
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21:44 < cap10morgan_> does WebGUI Done Right still live on the web anywhere?
21:44 < cap10morgan_> I'm not sure if my subscription is current...
21:52 < cap10morgan_> specifically i'm hoping to find some documentation on setting up database caching
21:52 < cap10morgan_> which i don't seem to find on webgui.org
21:52 <@rizen> admin guide
21:53 < cap10morgan_> so that's not in webgui done right (assuming it still exists)?
21:53 <@rizen> don't think it was ever there
21:54 <@rizen> and wdr doesn't exist
21:55 < SDuensin> Hey rizen - remember some time ago I was trying to explain how WebGUI was rendering the admin page without a style?  I figured out why!  Bug report coming soon!
21:56 < cap10morgan_> ok, thanks
21:57 < cap10morgan_> any plans to release electronic versions of your publications?
22:01 <@rizen> not that i'm wijlling to talk about at this time
22:01 < cap10morgan_> fair enough :)
22:02 < SDuensin> Oooo!  Nice non-commital, yet affirmative, answer!
22:03  * cap10morgan_ would love it if WebGUI books were in Safari
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22:42 <@rizen> not going to be in safari
22:42 <@rizen> however, if someone writes a utility script that will parse the contents of an open office document and turn the chapters into webgui articles
22:43 <@rizen> then getting the content in an online format might actually come about
22:43 <@rizen> until then, it will have to wait for me
22:43 <@rizen> which basically means not likely
22:58 <+crythias> do the chapters have regular tags?
22:58 <@rizen> i don't know what that means
22:59 <@rizen> all chapters start after a page break and have a consistent style associated with the header called "Heading 1"
22:59 <+crythias> I mean, if the chapters have significantly different tagging than simply bold
22:59 <+crythias> yeah.
22:59 <+crythias> that sounds like something I could do.
22:59 <@rizen> i'll commit this to you. 
22:59 <+crythias> I'm in ur odf, parsing ur xml
23:00 <@rizen> whomever comes up with a mechanism to make it easy for us to publish that content as webgui assets
23:00 <@rizen> has free access to that content for life
23:00 <+crythias> I think I'd need import structure API
23:00 < SDuensin> Don't tease me.  :-P
23:01 <+crythias> but open office should be nice, b/c it's zipped up content
23:01 <@rizen> to be useful it also has to do images, because all of our books have images that are critical to the content
23:02 <+crythias> so printing to PDF is out of the question, huh? :)
23:02 < SDuensin> hehe
23:02 <@rizen> yes
23:02 <@rizen> too easily pirated
23:02 <+crythias> but a WebGUI package?
23:03 <@rizen> when we used to do "Ruling WebGUI" as PDF we kept finding it pop up in people's sites as a free download that the whole internet had access to
23:03 <+crythias> hee :) hardware keys :)
23:03 < SDuensin> You can protect PDFs, but man, those are annoying.
23:04 <@rizen> it will take someone a lot more work to take all the content off the site, especially if it's broken into chapters
23:04 <@rizen> even if we password protected PDFs, you can hack it
23:04 < SDuensin> Best "protected" PDF I've seen is the book for Drupal I bought (yea, yea - sue me).  It has my name and email address on every page.
23:04 <@rizen> or worse yet, you can just publish your password or key to your web site
23:05 <@rizen> that's a pretty good idea, so at least we know who did the damage, but at that point the damage is already done
23:06 <+crythias> I was feeling generous, so I shared karma.
23:06 < SDuensin> Yea, but then you can go all statutory on their ass.  Like that Jammie chick who's paying $260k for 22 $0.99 songs.
23:07 <+crythias> you should make it printed in blue and red so people have to use 3d glasses to read it.
23:08 <+crythias> come to think about it, I wonder if that isn't too far off from the future.
23:08 <+crythias> lens-encrypted text
23:08 <@rizen> suing someone isn't worth it
23:08 <@preaction> nono, we'll have 3d EYES
23:08 <@rizen> it will cost us more to file than it is worth
23:08 < SDuensin> We did one of my buddy's resumes like that back when personal color printing was a fantasy.  His credentials literally leapt right off the page!  He got the job, too.  (It was for a game company - they thought it was cool.)
23:09 <@rizen> not to mention that's just not my style
23:09 <+crythias> must use polarized glasses to read the text. fun :)
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23:35 < xdanger> why am I finding so many error in wre-0.8's build.sh? wrong paths, and wrong args for confgures, or wrong build scripts for perl modules?
23:35 < xdanger> do I have some wrong version, or something...
23:36 < xdanger> Downloaded the one from sf.net...
23:36  * SDuensin hasn't been brave enough to try 0.8 yet.
23:37  * SDuensin also doesn't appear to be smart enough to use the Advertising features of WebGUI.
23:37 < xdanger> I'm trying it on a different server... I'm trying to clean my old install, that has been around from the first 6.0 beta, or gamma...
23:37 < xdanger> was it 5.99 or something then, but anyways..
23:38 <@rizen> don't know
23:38 <@rizen> it builds cleanly on all 8 operating systems that we support
23:39 <@rizen> and i'm told a number of oses we don't support
23:39 < xdanger> It's a debian etch
23:39 < SDuensin> DOH!  Ads work if I learn to read my screen.
23:40 < xdanger> but for exampla the build.sh uses installPerlModule for Temlate-Plugin-Clicable-Email, when the script has Build.pl
23:40 < xdanger> so it should use buildPerlModule function..
23:41 <@rizen> then report a bug
23:41 <@rizen> it throws no errors on our builds 
23:41 <@rizen> so it may be wrong, but it's also throwing no errors
23:41 <@rizen> so we wouldn't know that it wasn't working
23:42 <@rizen> i'm not even sure what that module is for
23:42 < xdanger> I'll do that, when I get it to build and I'll take a diff of the changes...
23:42 < xdanger> I'm building the --wdk
23:43 < xdanger> that does include some modules more...
23:43 < xdanger> rizen: can I ask why you aren't supporting debian?
23:45 <@rizen> don't build the wdk
23:45 <@rizen> it's not ready for prime time yet
23:45 <@rizen> only the WRE portion is ready
23:45 <@rizen> as for debian, we put up a poll a while back to see who wanted what OS's to be supported
23:46 <@rizen> debian was on the list be received hardly any votes
23:46 <@rizen> ubuntu was first
23:46 <@rizen> freebsd was second
23:46 <@rizen> rhel5 was third
23:46 <@rizen> and suse was fourth
23:47 <@rizen> i think debian tied with NetBSD
23:47 <@rizen> oh, and fedora was before debian also
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00:01 < xdanger> I'm building with the wdk because I want the documentation and the man pages of the stuff
00:09 <@rizen> well i'm telling you that the wdk won't build
00:09 <@rizen> it hasn't been tested
00:09 <@rizen> you're going to have to dink around with it
00:09 <@rizen> and it still might not work
00:11 < xdanger> ok =)
00:11 < xdanger> I'll just comment the deletes out then...
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01:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: jt * r4895 /tools/makerelease.pl: 
01:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: fixed version tag problem
01:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: enabled coverage tests
01:04 <@apeiron> khenn, You went poof on AIM.
01:04 <@rizen> is CIA a bot?
01:04 <@apeiron> 't is.
01:06 <@rizen> and it's purpose is to just spew out what is committed?
01:07 <@apeiron> It may do other stuff, but that's the most visible thing. 
01:08 <@apeiron> I didn't summon it, but you can read about them at cia.vc
01:09 <@apeiron> http://blog.freenode.net/?p=50 for important information about getting rid of them (i.e., banning won't work, they're persistent)
01:10 <@rizen> someone is trigger happy
01:10 <@rizen> one user with 100 commits in a single day
01:10 <@rizen> that's too many commits
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01:21 <@preaction> or you could just ask me to get rid of it
01:21 <@preaction> since i'm the one who put it here
01:22 <@preaction> i just notice that people are rarely on-the-ball on what's being committed, despite the RSS feed and otherwise. this is just one less excuse to not know what's going on
01:22 <@rizen> i don't want you to get rid of it
01:23 <@rizen> i just went to cia.vc and saw that someone did 100 commits
01:23 <@rizen> to some project
01:23 <@rizen> in a single day
01:23 <@preaction> nice
01:35 < xdanger> how can I reley information about the new user registration to NotifyAboutUser activity?
01:35 < xdanger> If I put macros like ^User; will the use the admin user, or the new user that has registered?
01:36 <@rizen> the user that is attached to the workflow
01:37 <@rizen> and int he case of new user registration
01:37 <@rizen> that's the user that registered
01:38 < xdanger> coolio
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01:54 < xootom> hi all, has anything changed with the user session table in 7.4.11, it doesn't seem to clear up expired sessions any more
01:59 <@rizen> not that i'm aware of
01:59 <@rizen> but i didn't contribute to the last round of bug fixes
01:59 <@rizen> Haarg would be the one to ask if he was around, but he went home for the day
02:00 < xootom> ok thanks 
02:01 <@rizen> report a bug if you can't figure it out
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04:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: doug * r4896 /branch/photogallery/WebGUI/ (85 files in 31 dirs): merged with SVN to get friends stuff
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06:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4897 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/User.pm t/User.t): 
06:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: Add more coverage tests for methods added to User.pm
06:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: for Friends.
06:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: Fix a bug in the isOnline method, which was looking sessions
06:03 < CIA-39> WebGUI: exactly 600 seconds old.
06:18 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4898 /WebGUI/t/i18n/help.t: fix a stupid typo that I put into i18n/help.t
06:35 <+Radix-wrk> hehe
06:35  * Radix-wrk likes the new CIA bot and the funny comments ppl write on checkin ;)
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15:58 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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16:29 <@rizen> Why would you say such a thing?
16:31 <@rizen> it makes the channel seem all warm and inviting
16:31 <@rizen> the next thing you know people might actually start to hang out here
16:31 <@rizen> and be friendly and comfortable
16:32  * SDuensin tells rizen to piss off.
16:32 < SDuensin> Better?
16:32 <@rizen> much better =)
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16:32 < SDuensin> :-)
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16:33 < SDuensin> Dude, I *CRANKED* out a site last night with WebGUI.  In two hours I redid what took months in Drupal.
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18:56 < xootom> I'm just making a 'users online' panel using an sql report, bringing out users from userSession. I'm joining it to users and userProfileData and want to show the photo/avatar next to the username, with a send message to user link too. All is fine but the photo is stored as a guid, how do I translate that to the actual file? how does it find the filename from that guid, it doesn't appear to be elsewhere in the database.
18:57 <@rizen> you'll have to write a macro that will turn the guid into an image tag
18:58 <@rizen> using the guid you instanciate a WebGUI::Storage::Image object
18:58 <@rizen> then you can use the getFiles method and just use the first file in the list
18:58 <@rizen> then call the getUrl method to get the url to put in the image tag
18:58 < xootom> is it getting that from the filesystem, i.e. in the asset's upload dir
18:58 <@rizen> yes
18:59 < xootom> ok, many thanks
18:59 <@rizen> np
19:16 < SDuensin> xootom - that sounds cool.  :-)
19:16 <+Radix_> i agree
19:17 < xootom> :)
19:18 < xootom> Are avatars a set size, I might have to put img width and height to make them look neat :S
19:19  * SDuensin hopes xootom shares with the class.
19:19 < xootom> yeah i'll upload the report and macro later :)
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19:46 < knowmad> Hi, I'm getting an error in my logs that I've never seen. Has anyone come across this message -- " Pass in object came back undefined for activity (pbwfactivity0000000006) using WebGUI::VersionTag, new, cYzduzhFBCu_vCUPF_UXCw."
19:47 < knowmad> There are 5 Commit Without Approval workflows that are in error state b/c of that
19:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: graham * r4899 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt lib/WebGUI/Asset/Event.pm): event end time not tz adjusted properly
19:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: jt * r4900 /WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): rfe: Search Asset returns URLs
19:57 <+Radix_> Woot!
20:00 < ckotil> neat. how new is the svn bot?
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20:07 < knowmad> that's the first i've seen it
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22:45 <@rizen> hmmm...lingerd sounds interesting for the wre: http://www.iagora.com/about/software/lingerd/
22:48 <@preaction> it does indeed
22:48 <@preaction> AMH is hiring a full-time Perl dev to work on swifty
22:48 <@apeiron> Handing over an open connection from one process to
22:48 <@apeiron> another is done using a rather esoteric feature called "file
22:48 <@apeiron> descriptor passing on Unix-domain sockets", and, as the name
22:48 <@apeiron> implies, is not very portable outside of Unix systems.
22:49 <@apeiron> (from the README.txt)
22:50 <@apeiron> Hmm, the readme also mentions that you can use mod_proxy to accomplish the same goal.
22:51 <@rizen> yes you can use modproxy to do it, and we do
22:51 <@rizen> i'm just wondering if lingerd might be faster
22:51 <@rizen> AMH already has a couple of full time devs doing swifty
22:51 <@rizen> 3 i believe
22:52 < SDuensin> Interesting.
22:52 < knowmad> but don't you want to keep modproxy for static file handling?
22:53 <@rizen> we still could...im just saying that i like to exlpore
22:53 < SDuensin> Go crazy and write your own HTTP daemon.  :-)
22:54 <@rizen> it might even be interesting to put up pound, squid, or some other reverse proxy in front of the wre, and then keep a separate non-modproxy instance for serving static content
22:54 <@rizen> that's on the table too sd
22:54 <@rizen> and is not as crazy as you might think
22:54 < SDuensin> No, I did it once.  :-)
22:54 <@rizen> i blogged about it a month or so ago
22:54 < SDuensin> Funny thing was, I used WebGUI as my test "CGI" when I was debugging it.  :-D
22:55 <@apeiron> perlbot, ws
22:55 < perlbot> Rick's tiny 34 line web server: http://home.pacbell.net/rklement/ws description is here: http://home.pacbell.net/rklement/wsdesc.html
22:57 <@rizen> mostly reading that thing about slashdot made me feel good that i had made a lot of very good decisions in designing the wre
22:57  * SDuensin thinks rick is insane.
22:58 <@preaction> rick doesn't use IO::All, so he's not insane enough
22:59 <@preaction> there's a one-line HTTP daemon using IO::All
22:59 < SDuensin> hehe
23:00 <@preaction> not sure if it handles CGI execution though, i think rick's does
23:01 < SDuensin> Rick's does.
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01:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4901 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt sbin/testCodebase.pl): fix for Devel::Cover warnings that clutter up the smoke test report. Also, fix the --help switch to testCodebase.pl
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01:48 < CIA-39> WebGUI: colin * r4902 /WebGUI/docs/upgrades/upgrade_7.4.11-7.5.0.pl: fix a typo in the upgrade script, s/Search/search/;
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15:16 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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17:42 < ckotil> is cross site sign on implemented yet?
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19:13 <@rizen> ckotil: yes has been since 7.4.0
19:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: graham * r4903 /branch/WebGUI_7.4: 
19:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Initialized merge tracking via "svnmerge" with revisions "1-4843" from
19:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/WebGUI
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20:03 < CIA-18> WebGUI: graham * r4904 /WebGUI/ (docs/changelog/7.x.x.txt www/extras/hoverhelp.css): fix grey areas on the bottom of pages
20:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: graham * r4905 /branch/ (3 files in 3 dirs): 
20:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Merged revisions 4904 via svnmerge from
20:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/WebGUI
20:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
20:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  r4904 | graham | 2007-10-29 12:48:58 -0500 (Mon, 29 Oct 2007) | 2 lines
20:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  fix grey areas on the bottom of pages
20:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
20:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: graham * r4906 /branch/ (3 files in 3 dirs): 
20:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Merged revisions 4899 via svnmerge from
20:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/WebGUI
20:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
20:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  r4899 | graham | 2007-10-26 11:27:54 -0500 (Fri, 26 Oct 2007) | 2 lines
20:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  event end time not tz adjusted properly
20:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
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21:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: graham * r4907 /branch/ (3 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed)
21:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Merged revisions 4856-4857 via svnmerge from
21:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/WebGUI
21:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
21:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  r4856 | graham | 2007-10-16 09:30:04 -0500 (Tue, 16 Oct 2007) | 2 lines
21:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  doc fixes
21:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
21:44 < wgGuest67> I am trying to set up a Navigation element that excludes the "Home" link Right now i have it set up for  "Specific URL"  with the start point "/home" including  descendants. But the home link still shows and i can't figure out why. Any Ideas or suggestions?
22:17 <+MrHairgrease> why don't you set the homepage to hide from navigation?
22:19 < wgGuest67> Hide from navigation is set to yes
22:19 <+MrHairgrease> that's just weird
22:19 <+MrHairgrease> it shoudl not show then
22:19 < wgGuest67> ya :-/
22:19 <+MrHairgrease> check your nav
22:20 < wgGuest67> and its not hard coded in the template
22:20 <+MrHairgrease> in the display tab
22:20 <+MrHairgrease> is the option Include hidden pages set to yes?
22:20 < wgGuest67> let me check
22:21 < wgGuest67> "Show hidden pages" is set to no
22:21 <+MrHairgrease> that's ok
22:21 <+MrHairgrease> does it also show the home page in your nav when the admin mode is on?
22:22 <+MrHairgrease> also is the home page either in your current version tag or in no tag at all?
22:23 <+MrHairgrease> or is it locked?
22:23 < wgGuest67> the homepage isn't locked
22:23 < wgGuest67> seems to always show home no matter if i am logged in, admin is on or off
22:23 <+MrHairgrease> hmm
22:24 < wgGuest67> i am confused by it also
22:24 <+MrHairgrease> are you sure the url in the specific root is exactly the url of the page?
22:25 < wgGuest67> the "Start Point" is "/home"
22:25 < wgGuest67> which i thought would bring it in the home directory and not include it
22:26 < wgGuest67> i tell it to only grab "Descendants"
22:26 <+MrHairgrease> and if you go to http://yoursite.com/home?func=edit the hide from nav option is still set to yes?
22:26 < wgGuest67> correct
22:26 < wgGuest67> swear it is.. lol
22:26 < wgGuest67> its werid
22:26 <+MrHairgrease> i dunno then
22:26 <+MrHairgrease> let me check it out
22:27 <+MrHairgrease> btw what version are you running
22:27 < wgGuest67> 7.3.22
22:29 <+MrHairgrease> you did not chcek the 'self' checkbox in the relatives form in the nav right?
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22:34 < wgGuest45> i am going to try and recreate at the demo site
22:35 <+MrHairgrease> wgGuest45 are you knowmad?
22:37 < wgGuest45> i work for em
22:37 <+MrHairgrease> ah i see
22:38 <+MrHairgrease> you are the same person asking about the nav issue right?
22:38 <+MrHairgrease> that is, wgGuest67
22:38 < wgGuest45> correct, they restarted the router and kicked me
22:38 <+MrHairgrease> ah
22:39 <+MrHairgrease> if you can reproduce on demo.plainblack.com please let me know and paste the url to the nav
22:39 < wgGuest45> will do. setting me up a demo now to see if i can
22:40 <+MrHairgrease> ok
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23:15 < wgGuest76> Hey mrhairgrease  http://demo.webgui.org/demo1193690406_735/home
23:15 < wgGuest76> admin // admin
23:16 < wgGuest76> Only the homepage is set up ATM
23:17 <+MrHairgrease> no problem
23:18 < wgGuest76> Believe i am about to take off home, I have a forum post if you would like to post your findings there
23:18 < wgGuest76> http://www.webgui.org/etcetera/global-nav-without-home-link#h_aJVU0KYFbn284681UgVw
23:21 <+MrHairgrease> it's a problem in the unordered list template
23:21 <+MrHairgrease> if you select vertical menu it works as is expected
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23:32 < knowma1> Thanks MrHairgrease. Josh has left but I'll be sure to tell him.
23:32 < knowma1> I think he and Diona were working on a custom nav template
23:32 <+MrHairgrease> ok
23:32 <+MrHairgrease> np
23:33 < knowma1> i hadn't yet considered using another nav template for testing. good idea 8-)
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23:35 < dj_perl> Hello preaction, I'm just about ready with the iPhoto plugin to server communication. Is there existing gallery code that I can start dispatching methods to?
23:36 <@preaction> dj_perl, https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/branch/photogallery/WebGUI <- my branch
23:37 <@preaction> the methods you'd be interested in probably are: Wobject::Gallery->addChild, Wobject::GalleryAlbum->addChild, File::Image::Photo->setFile
23:38 <+MrHairgrease> preaction is that the new photo gallery asset jt was talking about in his keynote?
23:39 < dj_perl> Any calls to get existing albums?
23:39 <@preaction> standard getLineage calls
23:39 <@preaction> addChild is part of AssetLineage as well
23:40 <@preaction> setFile is a part of WebGUI::Asset::File (added for the photo gallery)
23:40 < dj_perl> Thanks. Any tips on setting up a dev environment from this build? Does it have the same install procedure as the release?
23:41 <@preaction> basically it should be WebGUI, except for the minor addition of docs/upgrades/installPhotoGallery.pl
23:41 <@preaction> you realize there isn't enough to test anything, right?
23:43 < dj_perl> Hmm. Yes. I'm wondering whether to write stubs to accept uploads tentatively.
23:44 < dj_perl> The alternative is to suspend development here, and wait till the underlying calls are implemented.
23:44 <@preaction> or you could verify that the photo is added via the database, since i'm fairly sure that works
23:45 < dj_perl> The client does some querying on albums as part of the Gallery2 protocol.
23:46 < dj_perl> It'll be tricky to simulate. I should switch to the Windows/Picasa client till this is implemented.
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00:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: colin * r4908 /WebGUI/t/User.t: coverage test for the case of an un-cached profile field fetch in User.t
01:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: colin * r4912 /WebGUI/t/User.t: coverage tests for identifier method
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11:42 <+Radix_> http://www.xkcd.com/256/
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15:08 < SDuensin> Greetings.
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22:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: colin * r4913 /WebGUI/lib/WebGUI/Group.pm: Group does not use Tie::CPHash (via the dead %group variable) nor WebGUI::Auth
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23:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: doug * r4914 /branch/photogallery/WebGUI/ (4 files in 4 dirs): makeShortcut done, EXIF done
23:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: jt * r4915 /wrebuild/wre/ (3 files in 3 dirs): mysql uses 2 instead of 4 characters for the search index
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01:05 < xootom> hi all, is anyone else having problems with the data form? mine won't send emails
01:05 < xootom> testing on webgui.org demo site and no emails at all, are demo sites blocked on smtp?
01:06 <@preaction> demo sites don't get e-mail, no
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12:38 < roryzweistra> Hi bartjol,   images are assets right? So does that mean that when I develop a template in the image namespace which i.e. centers the pic on the page, visitors that click on the thumbnail of that pic will see the pic open up centered?
12:45 < dapperedodo> If you use the url of the image asset you will get the image itself (ie: /media/pic.gif), not the template around it. The template of the asset is used to display the asset on a container asset like a page.
12:48 < roryzweistra> ok tnx!
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13:25 < bartjol> indeed
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17:03 < CIA-18> WebGUI: jt * r4916 /wrebuild/ (build.sh wre/docs/changelog.txt readme.txt): fix: if syntax not correct ofr slackware and debian WRE_OSTYPE
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18:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: graham * r4917 /WebGUI/www/extras/ (hoverhelp.js hoverhelp.css): Proper hoverhelp grey area fix
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21:01 < wgGuest63> Anyone here added Thumbnails to the RSS Templates for the Collaboration Systems?
21:02 < khenn_> even if they aren't there you should be able to get it via a macro and the storage location
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21:02 <@rizen> you can do it
21:02 <@rizen> several sites do this in order to make podcasts from collaboration systems
21:03 <@rizen> you don't need any custom macros ether
21:03 < wgGuest63> I must have my template wrong because i am trying to add it
21:03 <@rizen> it's in the default template variables
21:03 < wgGuest63> I looked at the help but must doing it wrong
21:03 < wgGuest63> http://webgui.pastebin.com/d9b25af8
21:03 < wgGuest63> thats the code i added
21:03 < wgGuest63> well for the attachemnts
21:04 < wgGuest63> I added the loop to the template
21:04 < wgGuest63> I really just need 1 to show
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21:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: graham * r4918 /branch/ (3 files in 2 dirs): 
21:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Merged revisions 4917 via svnmerge from
21:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: https://svn.webgui.org/plainblack/WebGUI
21:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
21:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  r4917 | graham | 2007-10-31 11:26:02 -0500 (Wed, 31 Oct 2007) | 2 lines
21:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI:  Proper hoverhelp grey area fix
21:48 < CIA-18> WebGUI: ........
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22:02 < perlDreamer> Any recommendations for a good javascript book to learn from?
22:03 <+MrHairgrease> pd: if you find one let me know
22:03 < perlDreamer> will do, MrHairGrease
22:03 < perlDreamer> I trust your flight home went well?
22:04 <+MrHairgrease> apart from the missing arm I'm fine =)
22:04 <+MrHairgrease> the movie was worse than the flight to the us though
22:04 <+MrHairgrease> fantastic 4
22:05 <@rizen> i like these two: http://www.amazon.com/JavaScript-Definitive-Guide-David-Flanagan/dp/0596101996/ref=pd_sim_b_shvl_img_1/002-1310577-8494467
22:05 <+MrHairgrease> never watch it unless you need to throw up for some reason
22:05 < perlDreamer> I don't know, Jessica Alba.....
22:05 <@rizen> http://www.amazon.com/Dynamic-HTML-Definitive-Reference-Html/dp/0596527403/ref=pd_sim_b_shvl_img_4/002-1310577-8494467
22:05 <+MrHairgrease> the only plus in the movie
22:05 <@rizen> they aren't tutorial books, but they work well for me
22:06 < perlDreamer> I have the first one, but I'm looking for something a little more pedantic to start with
22:06 <+MrHairgrease> Im' mostly interseted in a good source that explains how to write nice js objects
22:06 < perlDreamer> Isn't that an oxymoron? -> nice js objects :)
22:07 <+MrHairgrease> well
22:07 <+MrHairgrease> phone
22:10 <+MrHairgrease> ok back
22:10 <+MrHairgrease> what i'm lookin for is how to do js objects the the yui does it for instance
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22:11 <+MrHairgrease> but no book i've seen so far covers that.
22:11 <+MrHairgrease> usually when i do js it's just some simple stuff
22:12 <+MrHairgrease> but with these whizzbang buzzword 2.0 stuff
22:12 <+MrHairgrease> things are bound to get more complex
22:12 < perlDreamer> yeah, I can't even do the simple stuff yet.
22:12 <+MrHairgrease> and thus some structure and (gasp) reusability wishful
22:12 <+MrHairgrease> pd
22:13 <+MrHairgrease> check out the yui examples
22:13 <+MrHairgrease> they are quite simple
22:13 <+MrHairgrease> some at least
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22:14 <+MrHairgrease> perldreamer
22:14 <+MrHairgrease> check out the yahoo dev videos
22:14 <+MrHairgrease> http://developer.yahoo.com/yui/theater/
22:14 <+MrHairgrease> especially Douglas Crockford -- "The JavaScript Programming Language"
22:14 <+MrHairgrease> and
22:15 <@khenn> unfortunately the best way to learn JavaScript is to write it
22:15 <@khenn> IMO
22:15 <+MrHairgrease> Douglas Crockford -- "Advanced JavaScript"
22:15 <@khenn> I haven't found a good book
22:15 <+MrHairgrease> never saw those videos
22:15 <+MrHairgrease> but they might be good
22:15 < perlDreamer> will do, MrHairGrease
22:16 < perlDreamer> gotta go, might be back later today.
22:16 <+MrHairgrease> ok
22:16 <+MrHairgrease> later
22:16 < perlDreamer> stupid corporate rules...
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23:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: colin * r4919 /WebGUI/ (lib/WebGUI/Group.pm lib/WebGUI/User.pm t/User.t): 
23:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Fixed broken friends method caching. The cache was never populated, so it
23:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: would fail every time.
23:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Added a missing DESTROY method to Group.pm. That way it won't puke when trying
23:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: to call an undefined method when the User object is cleaned up.
23:18 < CIA-18> WebGUI: Added coverage tests for friends method in User.pm
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23:33 < CIA-18> WebGUI: colin * r4920 /WebGUI/t/User.t: final coverage tests to bring User.pm up to 100%
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--- Log closed Thu Nov 01 00:00:08 2007